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Gibbo3771
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Posted - 2011.06.20 10:58:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Gibbo3771 on 20/06/2011 10:58:17
So they are nerfing the dram.
ok about time, its well overdue but if CCP EVER fix blasters in particular, will the fed navy comet not become the next OP frigate? Meaning that will get nerfed too?
Fed navy comet does taranis dps (thats 250-300) has a beasty hull tank with an armor rep, field 3 drones (like a dram) and can be duo propped (like a dram/ranis)
What ya think? suppose its what they do to blasters/blaster boats, if its anything to do with range/t2 ammo or speed, then I think comet will become OP
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Lugalzagezi666
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Posted - 2011.06.20 12:00:00 -
[2]
Isnt that what all these ******ed whiners wanted? Lets overboost one race, ccp could always fix it after 3 years or so...
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Buzzmong
Aliastra
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Posted - 2011.06.20 12:59:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Buzzmong on 20/06/2011 13:00:46
No, the Comet won't become OP. It might vie for top spot amongst the frigates, but it does have its limitations compared to the Dram so it won't outright be the best, notably:
1) It's 103 m/s slower than the current Dram's base speed. The Dram also has a quite a bit smaller sig radius.
The reasons why they're nerfing the Dram is because it's hard to catch, can kite while dealing a high amount of damage, and can also GTFO when it wants to. No ship should do all three like it does, and it does it with ease.
2) Blasters are ranged limited. Want to apply that 200-300 dps with a Comet? Gotta get in close which comes with it's own dangers. Notably blaster philosophy is do-or-die for a reason.
A further note regarding blasters is that small ones work quite well. This is due to a number of things, notably fitting and the fact frigates are fast and maneuverable. It's only really medium and large blasters on cruisers and above that need looking at, and even then, some of the problems are down to the ships and other weapons eating their niche. In short, I'll be surprised if CCP do much if anything to small blasters.
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Go Web! Go! |
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2011.06.20 13:25:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Gibbo3771
So they are balancing the dram...
Fixed it for you, no charge.
Navy frigates are pretty damn well balanced, each with their strengths and weaknesses. Neither of them will be OP any time soon.
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Makko Gray
Nexus Aerospace Corporation
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Posted - 2011.06.20 14:01:00 -
[5]
Ooo missed that change - does that mean we'll see a more even use of daredevils as well as drams in future? *dusts off the daredevil* 
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Dorian Tormak
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Posted - 2011.06.20 14:22:00 -
[6]
I think it will be the DD which will be total OP, especially after the hybrid fix.
But you play in Null and I play in Low, so not being able to dual prop a DD might effect it's OPness in your eyes.
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Batelle
-Mostly Harmless-
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Posted - 2011.06.20 14:36:00 -
[7]
link to devpost ?
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EC-P8R... You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. |
Alara IonStorm
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Posted - 2011.06.20 14:59:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Batelle
link to devpost ?
It is stickied in Fetures and Idea's.
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2011.06.20 15:45:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Dorian Tormak
I think it will be the DD which will be total OP, especially after the hybrid fix...
I fail to see why the DD suddenly becomes OP if Dram speed is cut down .. what it does is make the choice of ship less of a no-brainer 
Even with hybrid changes it is hard to do anything that would make it OP proper, it is already absolute dps overkill against frigs/dessies but very vulnerable to cruisers (without having to resort to tricksy fits mind you).
Only thing that would make it OP in my opinion would be if hybrids lost the cap requirement, but don't see that happening so 'meh'.
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Grimpak
Gallente
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
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Posted - 2011.06.20 18:11:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Dorian Tormak
I think it will be the DD which will be total OP, especially after the hybrid fix.
it is of general knowledge that many (including I) think that any hybrid boost that might happen, shouldn't affect the small blasters and rails, simply because atm they are good enough.
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Quote:
The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
achoura
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Posted - 2011.06.20 20:04:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Buzzmong
The reasons why they're nerfing the Dram is because it's hard to catch, can kite while dealing a high amount of damage, and can also GTFO when it wants to. No ship should do all three like it does, and it does it with ease.
1. It's being balanced, not nerfed.
2. It's being balanced because it's stats are off percentage wise. It will still be the fastest frig, dual prop zoom zoom (amazingly easy to kill if you use your brain) but will be a hundred m/s slower, and something like 0.02 sec slower into warp.
***The EVE servers and their patches***
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Mocam
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Posted - 2011.06.20 20:45:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Mocam on 20/06/2011 20:45:24
I know where the dram adjustment thread is - where the hell do you see even recognizing problems as such by CCP about hybrids?!?!?!!!
The posts I've seen from CCP on the subject pretty much boil down to "we don't see any problem" on over to "we haven't even looked at them and are a bit busy right now".
They've known about this dram issue for a year. With that kind of recognition to changes rate, I figure it'll be 2015 or so before anything would be seen with respect to hybrids.
As far as the comet being over powered if they ever do fix them - I doubt it. Few find a lot to gripe about with SMALL blasters. It's the mediums and large guns, and even here mostly about rails, that show issues and comments.
IMO - an equivalent would be "if they put doomsdays on transports, won't that make them OP?" It's about as likely as CCP addressing hybrids in such a way as to make the smallest of them overpowered.
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Ranita Drell
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Posted - 2011.06.20 21:05:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Ranita Drell on 20/06/2011 21:08:16
Originally by: Mocam
Edited by: Mocam on 20/06/2011 20:45:24
I know where the dram adjustment thread is - where the hell do you see even recognizing problems as such by CCP about hybrids?!?!?!!!
Devs answer your every question thread.
Originally by: CCP Greyscale
We don't have a schedule for this right now, because we generally don't schedule balance work very far in advance. That said, we're of course aware of the concerns players have about Gallente ships and it's a concern that we share. We discussed exactly this issue with the CSM last time they were over, both in terms of the specific issue of Gallente balance (the discussion ended up spending some time looking at the ability of blaster platforms to get into range, for example), and the wider issue of how and when we schedule balance stuff, and why we tend not to comment on balance issues ahead of time (broadly, that we don't want to have an official position on what's broken until we've taken the time to sit down and really look at the problem, and we don't tend to do that until we're actually working on it).
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Mocam
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Posted - 2011.06.20 23:45:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ranita Drell
Edited by: Ranita Drell on 20/06/2011 21:08:16
Originally by: Mocam
Edited by: Mocam on 20/06/2011 20:45:24
I know where the dram adjustment thread is - where the hell do you see even recognizing problems as such by CCP about hybrids?!?!?!!!
Devs answer your every question thread.
Originally by: CCP Greyscale
We don't have a schedule for this right now, because we generally don't schedule balance work very far in advance. That said, we're of course aware of the concerns players have about Gallente ships and it's a concern that we share. We discussed exactly this issue with the CSM last time they were over, both in terms of the specific issue of Gallente balance (the discussion ended up spending some time looking at the ability of blaster platforms to get into range, for example), and the wider issue of how and when we schedule balance stuff, and why we tend not to comment on balance issues ahead of time (broadly, that we don't want to have an official position on what's broken until we've taken the time to sit down and really look at the problem, and we don't tend to do that until we're actually working on it).
You read that a bit differently than I did. It happens and is understandable - also pretty cool IMO. All of us get hit with the "sure, when pigs fly" attitude at times so it is cool to see a more positive take on such things (albeit rather optimistic in my view - nice to see none the less).
I read Gallente ships, Not hybrids.
The discussion with the CSM ended up about blasters and getting in range to use them. Blasters being the best/most useful of the hybrid line of guns and, again "ships" vs issues with the weapons.
Again - not hybrids but ships as focus will not address Caldari gunship concerns (Rokh style).
Also "timeline" wise:
Quote:
... broadly, that we don't want to have an official position on what's broken until we've taken the time to sit down and really look at the problem ...
That portion read to me as "we don't have any idea yet on what may be wrong". Shared concerns -- PC style comment. Couple with "2014" comments elsewhere in there, with statements on where their focus will be for roughly the next year...
Again, it might be I'm reading it too pessimistically. honestly, I would like to see your view of it come to fruition vs my "probably 2015 time frame" view. 
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Ranita Drell
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Posted - 2011.06.21 06:56:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Mocam
You read that a bit differently than I did. It happens and is understandable - also pretty cool IMO. All of us get hit with the "sure, when pigs fly" attitude at times so it is cool to see a more positive take on such things (albeit rather optimistic in my view - nice to see none the less).
I read Gallente ships, Not hybrids.
I suppose, but any half-serious look at Gallente balance is going to touch on hybrids as well in all likelihood, especially given that blasters were specifically mentioned as a point of concern by CSM, which was acknowledged in at least a token way by CCP. This doesn't guarantee that they'll give a serious look at rails or non-Gallente hybrid platforms, but it's better than nothing.
Also, there's this (CCP Tallest saying that hybrids are on his list of things that need balancing), albeit again in connection with Gallente ships.
Quote:
That portion read to me as "we don't have any idea yet on what may be wrong". Shared concerns -- PC style comment. Couple with "2014" comments elsewhere in there, with statements on where their focus will be for roughly the next year...
Again, it might be I'm reading it too pessimistically. honestly, I would like to see your view of it come to fruition vs my "probably 2015 time frame" view.
Well, I'm not super optimistic either. I'd just heard a few things which seemed to suggest to me that it was at least on CCP's radar as something that deserves attention, if not necessarily something that will get fixed soon.
As you say, they've got a lot of other things on their plate right now. They've talked about balancing they want to do around Winter, but it seemed focused on other things -- super-caps/sov, electronics attack frigates, some other things I don't remember. I don't think we'll have to wait until 2014 for hybrids to get a good look (what comments have you thinking that?), but wouldn't be surprised at it taking 10+ months.
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Templar Dane
Amarrian Retribution
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Posted - 2011.06.21 07:12:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Grimpak
Originally by: Dorian Tormak
I think it will be the DD which will be total OP, especially after the hybrid fix.
it is of general knowledge that many (including I) think that any hybrid boost that might happen, shouldn't affect the small blasters and rails, simply because atm they are good enough.
Agreed, we don't need a blanket buff like what happened last time.
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