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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:40:00 -
[1]
Lacking access to subscription numbers for the last year and a half or so, I can't tell if EVE is growing anymore. I can tell that the number of active players on Tranquility has flattened out and actually started to trend downwards over the last two years. Clearly, EVE is not growing at a rate that suits CCP's taste nor their financial forecasts.
So, I ask for the number of subscribers to EVE Online up to at least when Incursion 1.1 came out. The current number would be even better. I have concluded based on the leaked documents (those made some of you at CCP look like complete jerks, if for some reason you hadn't noticed that already) that those who work in the upper levels feel that Incarna was a success. I do not share that view. I think it was a bad expansion that followed several bad expansions. But I do not have the subscriber numbers to prove my point. CCP has so far not released them with recent QENs as they normally do, and this deliberate (or even worse, accidental) withholding of information does not inspire confidence.
Do you consider Incarna a success, CCP?
Fix Lag! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:44:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Akita T on 27/07/2011 02:46:53
Originally by: Fix Lag flattened out and actually started to trend downwards over the last two years
Flattened out, yes. Trending downwards, not quite yet... but a definite possiblity. http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/8852/evesubsvsonlinemergedun.png NOTE : graph DOES NOT contain data from the last month. It has passed the post-patch peak already.
Also... http://jestertrek.blogspot.com/2011/07/not-all-curves-are-pretty.html _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:45:00 -
[3]
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Fix Lag! |
Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:46:00 -
[4]
Also, some fancy-schmancy chart thingymabobber.
Fix Lag! |
Indy Rider
Amarr Firebird Squadron Terra-Incognita
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:50:00 -
[5]
Just learned they cancelled the QEN.
Thats certainly interesting...
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:52:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Indy Rider Just learned they cancelled the QEN.
Thats certainly interesting...
WHAT?!
Fix Lag! |
Indy Rider
Amarr Firebird Squadron Terra-Incognita
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:53:00 -
[7]
Relevant.
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:55:00 -
[8]
Thanks for telling us, CCP. Yet another great example of your amazing communication with the playerbase.
Fix Lag! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:56:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Akita T on 27/07/2011 02:57:54
Originally by: Indy Rider Just learned they cancelled the QEN. Thats certainly interesting...
Not exactly "canceled"...
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1556620&page=1#20
Originally by: CCP Dr.EyjoG
Originally by: Gripen Is this blog a replacement for the QEN?
We will change the format of the QEN but this devblog and the data that comes along with it is an addition to other economic information available to the players. This is a part of a larger plan to give more data directly to players so that they can do their own analysis. And yes, this will continue in the future.
We have not published QENs for 2010 and will most likely not publish them in the previous format but rather moving the Economic Newsletters to more of an annual report. The frequency of the publication is though still being discussed.
P.S. Raw data more frequently >>> low-res graphs plus barely-relevant faffle on a nice background. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 02:58:00 -
[10]
So instead of giving us detailed information about the state of the game we now get a graph that has less value than a square of toilet paper. At least I could use the toilet paper for something.
Fix Lag! |
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:00:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Akita T on 27/07/2011 03:02:44
Originally by: Fix Lag So instead of giving us detailed information about the state of the game we now get a graph that has less value than a square of toilet paper.
Actually, the QENs so far have been little more than very pretty toilet paper, and the most interesting thing in them was almost always ONLY the data, data which was not available in even remotely enough detail. This is actually PROGRESS.
P.S. Assuming much more data than ONLY the indexes will be released in detailed CSV/XLS formats, at least as much as used to be disclosed (with far less granularity) in the QENs. If not, it's a case on one step forward, two steps back. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:03:00 -
[12]
Akita, I hate to say it, but you sound like some kind of CCP shill here.
Also, graphs that have been adjusted to show rolling averages for things such as the server population are better to use because they display trends more easily than the raw data from eve-offline.net.
Progress is not when we get one graph instead of a large powerpoint filled with information. Progress is when CCP is more open with their players ("Hey guys, remember that really sweet monocle we wrote a devblog about? Well, it's going to cost you 70 bucks." I don't see them saying that). Progress is when CCP stops making dumb expansions. Progress is when EVE is fun.
Fix Lag! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:06:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Akita T on 27/07/2011 03:07:32
Progress is when the raw data is released in great detail so WE, THE PLAYERS can analyze it in whatever way we see fit, NOT just the way the people putting up the QEN would. PLENTY OF PEOPLE IN MD HAVE BEEN ASKING FOR EXACTLY THAT FOR ALMOST AS LONG AS THE QENs HAVE STARTED BEING PUBLISHED. Expect far more detailed analyses to come up in the MD subforum not that long after each individual piece of raw data is released.
I assume you're familiar with that magical program called "Excel" (or any of the other open-source alternatives) and with what it can do if you just feed it enough raw data ? Besides, you're still getting a YEN (lol) to spoon-feed you the data you're incapable or unwilling to analyze yourself or don't trust other player's analysis of. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:09:00 -
[14]
They gave us price indices. EVE does not consist solely of price indices. There are some other important things that were in the QEN, such as shiptypes flown and destroyed, and subscriber numbers. That kind of information has magically disappeared.
Fix Lag! |
Jon Taggart
State War Academy
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:11:00 -
[15]
This is a trap. CCP says yes, the players will say they're full of it, CCP says no, players will say "Ha! Told you so."
I'm not an alt |
Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:12:00 -
[16]
CCP's shields can't repel questions of that magnitude.
Fix Lag! |
Indy Rider
Amarr Firebird Squadron Terra-Incognita
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:12:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Fix Lag They gave us price indices. EVE does not consist solely of price indices. There are some other important things that were in the QEN, such as shiptypes flown and destroyed, and subscriber numbers. That kind of information has magically disappeared.
Which leads me to the assumption, that Q1 QEN has something in it which CCP doesn't want to share.
Why change it in the first place?
The graph they let out is useless, it has everything in one single bar, it includes supers destroyed and shuttles, the numbers don't tell you anything because everything is jumbled together.
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:13:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Jon Taggart This is a trap. CCP says yes, the players will say they're full of it, CCP says no, players will say "Ha! Told you so."
"'Fearless' is our corporate motto"
Fix Lag! |
Jonas Xiamon
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:16:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Jonas Xiamon on 27/07/2011 03:17:35 Post removed for lack of content.
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Jon Taggart
State War Academy
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:23:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Fix Lag
Originally by: Jon Taggart This is a trap. CCP says yes, the players will say they're full of it, CCP says no, players will say "Ha! Told you so."
"'Fearless' is our corporate motto"
Or they won't respond at all and people automatically think it's an admission of guilt.
I'm not an alt |
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Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.07.27 03:24:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Jon Taggart Or they won't respond at all and people automatically think it's an admission of guilt.
"Dear Players,
Your item store protest were ineffectual; our subscription numbers have never been higher. Incarna is clearly a raging success.
Also, we won't be releasing our subscriber numbers anymore. These two pieces of information are in no way related. Really.
Yours truly, CCP"
Fix Lag! |
Lara Sun
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Posted - 2011.07.27 04:03:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Lara Sun on 27/07/2011 04:03:10 Linkage to a good blog on it.
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Written Word
Written Word's Tax Haven
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Posted - 2011.07.27 04:05:00 -
[23]
I'm sure they view it as a resounding success as its a proof of concept their vampire game engine (somewhat) works.
This expansion isn't for EVE so the subscription numbers/server population is irrelevant. Every single one of its features is here to test the new game out.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.07.27 08:12:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Fix Lag They gave us price indices. EVE does not consist solely of price indices. There are some other important things that were in the QEN, such as shiptypes flown and destroyed, and subscriber numbers. That kind of information has magically disappeared.
That kind of information has not yet been released. If it continues not being released for a much longer period of time, and if it will also be absent from the yearly-QEN-replacement document, you'd have a point. As for subscriber counts, that one can already (to a certain degree) be inferred from the eve-offline data. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Black Dranzer
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.07.27 08:46:00 -
[25]
I don't know about CCP, but I'd almost go so far as to call this one of the worst expansions they've released, possibly worse than Tyrannis. Horrendous PR, Incarna as a paper-thin front for a cash shop, and besides that.. not a lot else. New turrets are nice, I suppose.
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Tippia
Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.07.27 08:50:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Black Dranzer New turrets are nice, I suppose.
Too bad they had to ruin remove the iconsà ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP |
Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
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Posted - 2011.07.27 11:31:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Black Dranzer New turrets are nice, I suppose.
Too bad they had to ruin remove the iconsà
Yep... I wonder why it takes so long to roll back old icons as the new ones are definately epic - in not so good way :) --- This is one of the moments where we look at what CCP does and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change |
Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2011.07.27 12:17:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Sturmwolke on 27/07/2011 12:28:03
Eh they sorta cancelled the QEN? Interesting.
- the obvious would be having to avoid officially publishing the subs graph to the masses (as only a small number of people would bother to dig and find that info). They could still omit it from QEN, but they may have a lot of folks asking about it and will be hard pressed to come up with a reasonable reason for not publishing it. Bottomline motto : Don't volunteeer information if you don't have to
- the less obvious would be the value of QEN and the resources they have. Pulling the plug and re-assigning the resources available could mean they're busy doing something else or they're runnning the purse tight(er).
- the other bit that's somewhat useful in the QEN are the PLEX data that shows how much is being consumed. You'd have to wonder if they're putting this back under wraps.
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Pr1ncess Alia
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Posted - 2011.07.27 12:36:00 -
[29]
boy that sure is a funny looking graph
what could have happened in the last year or so that would change the steadily increasing playerbase that ccp has enjoyed for the last 8 years???
:18months:
/i'm sure the suits tell themselves "this is exactly what we expected, we've reached market saturation for a niche scifi mmo. this not only supports our argument for microtransactions, it proves it's our only sensible business model moving forward"
sucks when you think what eve could have been. mold breaker for 8 years is a good run though.
--- Players are losing faith and loyalty in CCP due previous expansions not living up to player expectations. The CSM and CCP agreed that expectation management can be improved |
Mr Kidd
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Posted - 2011.07.27 12:39:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Akita T
That kind of information has not yet been released. If it continues not being released for a much longer period of time, and if it will also be absent from the yearly-QEN-replacement document, you'd have a point. As for subscriber counts, that one can already (to a certain degree) be inferred from the eve-offline data.
Not really. Here's an example: 12 people logged in the day before yesterday. 9 people logged in yesterday. 10 people logged in today.
How many are new subscribers?
The only information you can infer is the number of people logging into the system are slightly lower now than they were previously. Eve-offline is a useful site to take the pulse of the game periodically.
The exclusion of subscriber data from the QEN may or may not be significant. Experience, on the other hand, would tell me that a corp is eager to advertise good news especially when such news is an indication of a "success" of some sort, can satisfy investors, can entice more investment.
Then again, if our concerns of F2P and P2W are true, then subscriber information may not be as an important indicator as it was in the past. The number of plexes used to renew accounts may, in fact, be a much more relevant indicator of the health of the game.
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