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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
143
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Posted - 2012.09.28 08:25:00 -
[61] - Quote
OP,
CCP will be shocked to hear that they earn more money. Quick send the troops in. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
3871
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 08:58:00 -
[62] - Quote
James 315 wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up? I'm not at CCP, and I am a nullsec zealot screaming "nerf high sec!", but I'll answer anyway: Highsec PLEX'ers driving up the price with easy AFK mining isk.
I hope you're not this boring, predictable and repetitive in real life. |
Callduron
136
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 09:15:00 -
[63] - Quote
Generals4 wrote:Rengerel en Distel wrote:Deryk Kyeld wrote:PLEX prices are fine, if anything they're valued too low. ISK is so easy to get right now, not counting FW farming. It's kind of interesting how the plex prices spike after a T5 cashout ... I'm sure FW had nothing to do with it though, and it's all a nullsec conspiracy backed by CCP. The thing is. FW doesn't create any isks at all. So that isk has to come from somewhere else and as such other people should have less isks for plex's or need to sell more plex's. As such FW can't be an explanation on its own.
The isk is already in the economy. Many Eve players are sitting on large amounts of isk.
What FW does is MOVE the isk. (Same with mining for that matter). When someone who was once poor now becomes isk rich they are quite likely to invest the isk in more accounts.
I think what we're seeing is a lot of isk movement between players. If player A has 5 accounts and earns 2.5b per month and player B has 1 account and suddenly makes 80b, player B may open more accounts but player A is very likely to try to keep all his accounts going even if it means altering his play. He might play longer, switch to a more profitable activity or inject some real world money. So essentially social mobility causes plex inflation, as isk-poor people become isk-rich people more accounts will get financed by plex even if the total amount of isk in the economy doesn't rise. It's an increase in consumer spending without an increase in the money supply. |
Jim Hazard
Scrubfleet
6
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Posted - 2012.09.28 09:24:00 -
[64] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:So what exactly does it take now a days to make enough isk to plex a single account with only one character?
Or have we reached a point where the price of plex has rendered that impossible.
It really depends on what you do..... but if you think about grinding the ISK.... 6 hours max.. unless you are really bad at making ISK (and thats even in high sec) |
Jojo Booties
8
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Posted - 2012.09.28 09:45:00 -
[65] - Quote
Well I'm not going to pay real money stuff, to play a game, so they best keep those plex things reasonable. |
Piugattuk
CLOROFLORFILAPLANKTONPLATES
66
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Posted - 2012.09.28 09:59:00 -
[66] - Quote
What CCP could do is put in a bunch of gimmicky ships so people spend isk on them instead of having pockets lined with gold pressed latinum....oh wait wrong currency, isk'es just burning a hole in their space trousers, or how bout this fix, make people pay for game time with AUR seeing as AUR is expensive compared to isk, 7500 AUR or even 10,000 AUR for game time and isk to be for game ships, mods and such, you people sitting on but t loads of plex are gonna get upset and bomb jita monument again when CCP realizes this....hehe. |
Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
33
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Posted - 2012.09.28 10:00:00 -
[67] - Quote
Problem is, not for everyone reasonable means what it means to you. When rich speculators buy PLEX for profit in future, its reasonable for them to pay even 550m ISK, when for new player this price is too big. The same proces as in real world. All hope for lower prices for PLEX lies in less demand, and that will not happen, certainly. About WIS |
Mai Khumm
Omen Industries -Entropy-
252
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Posted - 2012.09.28 10:44:00 -
[68] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre
I lol'd...
-Edit- I blame FW more then High sec miners.
My main is in FW, and every corp/faction has the same doctrine "Roll a Minnie/Gal alt, keep systems vulernable, and start farming" (I'd post on my main, but she's having a "time out" from the forums.) "Being drunk is a good disguise. I drink so I can talk to a**holes. This includes me." |
The Forum Alt
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.09.28 11:00:00 -
[69] - Quote
Kryss Darkdust wrote:Gogela wrote:I'll say one more thing about PLEX... and it's often lost in this debate but I think it's an important point. What is your time worth? If it takes more than 3 hours to make enough for a PLEX it's not worth it even if you are on minimum wage. I got the PLEX I needed to advance my sub a couple of years, but really looking back I'm almost sorry I did. I made a ton of isk doing market scams, and because zero effort was involved it seemed like an easy choice. But really... if I had to actually earn my ISK I'd just pay for the sub. I make more than minimum wage. It's not worth the time to grind. Str8 up yo. I'm here to have fun, and grinding to pay for my account doesn't sound like much fun. Yeah I'm in the same boat. 15 bucks to me isn't even something I consider money, its nothing. I make that in roughly 10 minutes of work. When I poop at work in the morning, I make a PLEX. So spending a couple of hours grinding something in Eve to earn ISK for a PLEX is silly. I would be more likely to buy PLEX for real cash but I don't have economic problem in game any more than I have out of game so for the most part PLEX is irrelevant to me. One thing I do like about PLEX is that it sets a real world value for ISK. If nothing else its interesting to do the math when you get blown up or blow someone up.
Do you wear a monocle in RL? |
Inquisitor Kitchner
Galaxy Punks Executive Outcomes
94
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Posted - 2012.09.28 12:07:00 -
[70] - Quote
Callduron wrote:
The isk is already in the economy. Many Eve players are sitting on large amounts of isk.
What FW does is MOVE the isk. (Same with mining for that matter). When someone who was once poor now becomes isk rich they are quite likely to invest the isk in more accounts.
Wot m8?
Have you ever studied economics? Or looked at why people who have studied economics study video game MMOs?
ANY activity in a game that people do for money is creating money. Ratting creates isk out of thin air, mining creates money out of thin air (as resources don't diminish and they don't pay for the right to mine), FW creates money out of thin air, PI creates money out of thin air (though there is a start up cost).
In fact the only money making ways that don't make money out of thin air are:
- Scamming
- Hostage taking/ransoms
- Taking advantage of buying goods and then selling them on
- Buying materials and then using them to make goods to sell
They are the only activities that move money around. The rest of balancing the EVE economy is done by making sure PvPers are blowing up enough isk worth of ships at the same speed as all those methods that create money out of thin air create it.
Why?
Because if people are spending their money then it reduces inflation. When people have more money they are more willing to spend higher amounts, meaning people can raise the price.
Then of course you need to make sure industry works in such a way that enough players can produce enough goods to meet the demand of the above ship explosions or that raises prices too.
Learning is fun. |
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9591
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Posted - 2012.09.28 12:18:00 -
[71] - Quote
Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:Wot m8?
Have you ever studied economics? Or looked at why people who have studied economics study video game MMOs?
ANY activity in a game that people do for money is creating money. Eh, no. Maybe you should read up on those topics before telling others to do so.
No activity in a game that people do for money creates money unlessGǪ wellGǪ it actually does. Ratting creates ISK; mining does not; FW removes ISK; PI removes ISK as well.
The problem is that you're confusing GÇ£moneyGÇ¥ with GÇ£valueGÇ¥ or GÇ£wealthGÇ¥ GÇö they're not the same thing, even though they're usually measured using the same unit (ISK).
Quote:In fact the only money making ways that don't make money out of thin air are:
- Scamming
- Hostage taking/ransoms
- Taking advantage of buying goods and then selling them on
- Buying materials and then using them to make goods to sell
They are the only activities that move money around. Not quite right either. The only activity that moves money around is trading (yes, ransoms are trades as well GÇö you trade the continuing ownership of your stuff and SP for your ISK), and even then, the way EVE is set up, the most commonly used forms of trading actually remove money as well.
That said, since trade is the end use for a large portion of the producers of items, any kind of production is for the purpose of moving money around GÇö not for creating it (because, again, the production itself actually removes money).
Indeed it is. So let's post this old copy-pasta so everyone can learn:
Faucets:- NPC bounties
- NPC buy orders
- Agent rewards: Mission rewards, Mission time bonuses, Incursion rewards, Deposit repayment
- Insurance payout
- GM actions: Reimbursement for lost pods
- Character creation
Sinks:- Market taxes & fees: Broker fees, Sales tax
- NPC sell orders
- NPC station services: Repairs, Jump clone installation, Medical clone installation/upgrade/station change, Science and industry slot rental, Ship insurance
- NPC station office fees: Rent, Impound penalties
- Wardecs
- Sovereignty fees
- PI fees: Building PI structures, Import/export tax (from NPC-owned customs offices)
- Corp & alliance fees: Corp creation, Alliance creation, Alliance upkeep, Creating/awarding medals, Corp registry ads
- Agent fees: (Certain) LP store items, Locator agent services, Courier missions w/ deposits
- CSPA Charges
- Smuggling fines
- GM Actions: Removal of bought ISK, Removal of insurance after ship reimbursement
- Character deletion
GǪin particular, let's read and learn that faucet list, and take note of how few activities in the game actually qualify as money generators. Neither mining nor FW create any money. They produce items (in the case of FW through the removal of money) that go onto the market and ensure that money is moved around (while once more removing some of that money in the process). GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
268
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Posted - 2012.09.28 12:30:00 -
[72] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up?
That chip on your shoulder about null sec is getting really tired.
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War Kitten
Panda McLegion
1229
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Posted - 2012.09.28 12:38:00 -
[73] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up?
How many more paranoid and irrational rants are you going to post before you finally snap and go play Hello Kitty Online?
HTFU or GTFO
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all. |
Muul Udonii
THORN Syndicate THORN Alliance
117
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Posted - 2012.09.28 12:46:00 -
[74] - Quote
Sarmea Moon wrote:James 315 wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up? I'm not at CCP, and I am a nullsec zealot screaming "nerf high sec!", but I'll answer anyway: Highsec PLEX'ers driving up the price with easy AFK mining isk. It's totally NOT the faction warfare people exploiting at all. It MUST be the miners. Obviously, CCP has already done something about it, they ran a special on plex prices. I have no doubt they'll do it again, and soon.
I looked at that special. It was terrible, buying smaller non sale numbers of plex actually worked out to be -ú0.01 cheaper. Thorn Alliance:-á The worst alliance you ever heard of.
But you have heard of us. |
Tragedy
The Creepshow
26
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Posted - 2012.09.28 13:54:00 -
[75] - Quote
I'm always amazed when I see absolutely full on re**rd threads like this. I like to think that if you play eve you have just a bit of smarts and would take interest in how the game works. As in terms like, player driven economy.
I'd better stop reading these forums soon. |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
1229
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 14:10:00 -
[76] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:... Frankly, I have no real clue ...
No truer words were ever recorded in your posting history.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all. |
Warde Guildencrantz
TunDraGon
74
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 15:01:00 -
[77] - Quote
Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:
Hostage taking/ransoms
this is why they should make implant scanner modules and BUFF pirating instead of continuously nerfing it...pirating should be the same importance (happens the same amount) as FW in lowsec, especially in non FW systems |
Elinarien
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
10
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Posted - 2012.09.28 15:21:00 -
[78] - Quote
This entire thread is pisspoor. It's about time that us cash-rich / time poor high-sec carebears got a better deal through plex sales.
edit - can't spell |
flakeys
Angels of Anarchy Interstellar Confederation
377
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 15:28:00 -
[79] - Quote
Gogela wrote:Touval Lysander wrote:Gogela wrote: My advice? If you need PLEX to run your account... buy now. It's going to get crazy.
I reckon I bought more after reading this than you did Yah I PLEXed out both of my accounts to late 2014 a few months ago anticipating this.
I did that a few years back when price averaged 400 and indicated to only go up up , subbed my acc till june 2014 at one go then
The surest way to remain poor is to be an honest man ...-á |
stoicfaux
1690
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 15:38:00 -
[80] - Quote
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:
Hostage taking/ransoms this is why they should make implant scanner modules and BUFF pirating instead of continuously nerfing it...pirating should be the same importance (happens the same amount) as FW in lowsec, especially in non FW systems Buffing pirates is like buffing the Ebola virus. Yes, in the short term you make it really awesome, but you wind up killing it in the long term (due to a lack of victims/hosts.)
You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head. Feature Request: -áDamnation Ship Codpiece-áfor the NeX store.
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Warde Guildencrantz
TunDraGon
75
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Posted - 2012.09.28 16:05:00 -
[81] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote:Warde Guildencrantz wrote:Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:
Hostage taking/ransoms this is why they should make implant scanner modules and BUFF pirating instead of continuously nerfing it...pirating should be the same importance (happens the same amount) as FW in lowsec, especially in non FW systems Buffing pirates is like buffing the Ebola virus. Yes, in the short term you make it really awesome, but you wind up killing it in the long term (due to a lack of victims/hosts.)
I didn't say make it easier to pirate, i meant provide the things that pirating sorely needs to do what it is meant to do. People keep getting podded because ransomers have to ballpark implant values instead of taking a look, seeing their implants in real-time, and ransoming accordingly so everyone is happy.
Also, cloak trick needs to not work. Should not be able to jump a vindicator into a camped gate and get out using the cloak trick before a group can land from 1000km
In the end CCP is making more reasons to come to lowsec anyhow, so fixing up pirating as a playstyle really should happen. They even advertise it on the "what's your persona?" quiz on the main site, but really neglect it in development. |
Cyprus Black
359
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 16:40:00 -
[82] - Quote
PLEX prices out of control by whos definition? Who deems when PLEX prices are out of control?
They are subject to the same supply/demand rules as all other items ingame. _________________________________________________________________
Too busy playing The Secret World to log in EvE and play spaceships. |
March rabbit
R.I.P. Revenge
254
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Posted - 2012.09.28 16:55:00 -
[83] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:I put a few contracts up with plex for 350m isk. You should grab them quick though, at that price they'll go fast. never understand how it can do the job at all. To complete this contract people need to already have PLEX. But if you have 1+ PLEX and buy another you are most likely rich experienced player so you won't fall to this scam. And poor unexperienced player doesn't have free PLEXes to complete such contract....
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baltec1
Bat Country
2295
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 16:56:00 -
[84] - Quote
High sec mining bots.
Seriously theres hundreds of them. |
Din Chao
112
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 17:24:00 -
[85] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:I put a few contracts up with plex for 350m isk. You should grab them quick though, at that price they'll go fast. never understand how it can do the job at all. To complete this contract people need to already have PLEX. But if you have 1+ PLEX and buy another you are most likely rich experienced player so you won't fall to this scam. And poor unexperienced player doesn't have free PLEXes to complete such contract.... And yet, it still works. |
flakeys
Angels of Anarchy Interstellar Confederation
377
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 17:51:00 -
[86] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:I put a few contracts up with plex for 350m isk. You should grab them quick though, at that price they'll go fast. never understand how it can do the job at all. To complete this contract people need to already have PLEX. But if you have 1+ PLEX and buy another you are most likely rich experienced player so you won't fall to this scam. And poor unexperienced player doesn't have free PLEXes to complete such contract....
You do NOT need a plex , the one you buy is the one that get's thrown back out.So the contract mechanic can make a purchase and sale of an identical item at one go. The surest way to remain poor is to be an honest man ...-á |
Riedle
Paradox Collective Choke Point
170
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 17:54:00 -
[87] - Quote
Why M3 wrote:CCP Official Statement: No comment at this time, CCP is dedicated to contining enhancing and improving game play,with providing a free market economy without regulation.
You say that like it's a bad thing. |
La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
147
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Posted - 2012.09.28 18:04:00 -
[88] - Quote
Sarmea Moon wrote:James 315 wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up? I'm not at CCP, and I am a nullsec zealot screaming "nerf high sec!", but I'll answer anyway: Highsec PLEX'ers driving up the price with easy AFK mining isk. It's totally NOT the faction warfare people exploiting at all. It MUST be the miners. Obviously, CCP has already done something about it, they ran a special on plex prices. I have no doubt they'll do it again, and soon.
It is the miner's fault. Goonwaffe is now recruiting feel free to message me in game for information about joining! |
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
567
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 18:22:00 -
[89] - Quote
ISquishWorms wrote:Supply and Demand.
Less players supplying, more players demanding.
This is so easy. Next question?
Just wait for the server experts to come into this thread and explain why there is no co-relation between empty server and inflation. They do such a good job proving things like this.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled **** poast. |
Kestutis Fujika
Critical Mass ltd.
3
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 18:51:00 -
[90] - Quote
Probably most come from summer vacation re subbed there alts and some people decited make quick isk by reselling plex and low income of new players and here you go. So in short demand>supply how it was repeated many times before. And as far i know miner and fw are least to they dont generate isk incursia ,missioning and wornholes (blue loot) does |
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