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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 81 post(s) |
Hoarr
RPS holdings
51
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:41:00 -
[541] - Quote
I made a thing about CCP Masterplan: |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
1205
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:49:00 -
[542] - Quote
That's really the only reason people are complaining about the new crimewatch imho. It's not that CW2 isn't awesome (it is) it's simply that CCP does a really bad job of articulating in practical terms what some of the potential effects will be.
crimewatch vid at 22:00. 'Nuff said.
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ugh zug
80
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:51:00 -
[543] - Quote
It works.
yay for optimized code, and low resource demand~!
please be sure to continue optimization of code after launch. Want me to shut up?-á Send me ISK and i'll stop giving suggestions to CCP that make sense. Remove content from my post, 15 bil. Remove my content from a thread I have started 30bil. |
Tanaka Aiko
ICE is Coming to EVE Goonswarm Federation
118
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:51:00 -
[544] - Quote
what happen when you loot a yellow wreck ? is it the same flags as can flipping ? cause I did it by mistake on my first day on EVE, and I wouldn't be surprised lots of others noobs also do it, and it could become a blood bath if anyone can shoot them while they weren't understanding their acts... |
Dirael Papier
Nevermined Inc
15
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:55:00 -
[545] - Quote
Tanaka Aiko wrote:what happen when you loot a yellow wreck ? is it the same flags as can flipping ? cause I did it by mistake on my first day on EVE, and I wouldn't be surprised lots of others noobs also do it, and it could become a blood bath if anyone can shoot them while they weren't understanding their acts... Well, the noobs will have a safety switch turned on by default, so they won't be able to loot yellow wrecks unless they decide to turn the safety switch off. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9749
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:57:00 -
[546] - Quote
Ulair Memmet wrote:Nalha Saldana wrote:Yes that is correct, you get weapons but not pvp flag. Kinda makes sense because you (in most cases) were obviously trying to do something. But i didn't GǪand you're also not really punished for it. You're just given a bit of time to think things over and calm down. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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Kethry Avenger
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
46
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:58:00 -
[547] - Quote
CCP Masterplan
What about pilots in lowsec, with neg sec status, shooting other people with neg sec status, not incurring a sec hit, and therefore, able to shoot each other on gates without pesky gate guns getting involved? Just in lowsec. |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
319
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Posted - 2012.10.05 00:59:00 -
[548] - Quote
Challenge Accepted. |
Iam Widdershins
Project Nemesis
737
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:05:00 -
[549] - Quote
CCP MasterPlan:
I am really liking the outline you've laid out so far, but woefully absent is any mention of the interaction between wars and these mechanics. What is the effect of repairing or otherwise assisting someone who is at war in empire? Is it different depending on whether they have a PVP timer? For that matter, what timers are given for engaging a war target in empire space? Lobbying for your right to delete your signature |
Reticle
Sight Picture
33
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:20:00 -
[550] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:Challenge Accepted. lol |
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Reticle
Sight Picture
33
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:21:00 -
[551] - Quote
Is in corp ganking still a retribution-less action? |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2491
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:21:00 -
[552] - Quote
Gogela wrote:That's really the only reason people are complaining about the new crimewatch imho. It's not that CW2 isn't awesome (it is) it's simply that CCP does a really bad job of articulating in practical terms what some of the potential effects will be. crimewatch vid at 22:00. 'Nuff said.
I think that is why they put an emphasis on having those big, primary colored icons pop up at the top of your screen. There should be no doubt as to what repercussions your actions are about to have.
Frankly, this system is much, much easier to figure out. The only thing that is making this thread complicated are the dozens of what-if scenarios being thrown about, all of which have the same somewhat simple answers. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Reticle
Sight Picture
33
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:24:00 -
[553] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Gogela wrote:That's really the only reason people are complaining about the new crimewatch imho. It's not that CW2 isn't awesome (it is) it's simply that CCP does a really bad job of articulating in practical terms what some of the potential effects will be. crimewatch vid at 22:00. 'Nuff said. I think that is why they put an emphasis on having those big, primary colored icons pop up at the top of your screen. There should be no doubt as to what repercussions your actions are about to have. Frankly, this system is much, much easier to figure out. The only thing that is making this thread complicated are the dozens of what-if scenarios being thrown about, all of which have the same somewhat simple answers. the inmates are testing the bars. its a natural process |
Matuk Grymwal
Bite Me inc Elysian Empire
4
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:28:00 -
[554] - Quote
Sorry if this has been asked already, but I'd like to see some extra detail around how flag propagation works when you are logged off. So it should describe the possible flags you have when you are logged off, and how/if they can be propagated and by what actions. The current comments only describe whether the current flag can be extended once logged off. E.g. if a player logs off with the NPC flag, can they get shot and be given the PVP flag?
Looks good, the new NPC flag is awesome |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
1205
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:30:00 -
[555] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Gogela wrote:That's really the only reason people are complaining about the new crimewatch imho. It's not that CW2 isn't awesome (it is) it's simply that CCP does a really bad job of articulating in practical terms what some of the potential effects will be. crimewatch vid at 22:00. 'Nuff said. I think that is why they put an emphasis on having those big, primary colored icons pop up at the top of your screen. There should be no doubt as to what repercussions your actions are about to have. Frankly, this system is much, much easier to figure out. The only thing that is making this thread complicated are the dozens of what-if scenarios being thrown about, all of which have the same somewhat simple answers. That's true, but I was talking more about the decisions of a pirate cloaked off a null sec gate trying to decide weather or or not to attack. The new crimewatch is actually going to require that cloaked ship to do a bit more in the way of variable reduction when making that decision than the former system. For example, if there are 6 otherwise unrelated ships on a gate and you are thinking about diving in, the differences between attacking someone with a suspect flag or no flag could be the difference between you facing off against one target or all the ships on that gate. This is relevant because while in practice we kind of have the suspect flag now, it's limited to the owner of the wreck you took from and corp or whatever. I think seeing someone with a suspect flag is going to get a LOT more common around eve. ...and that's just one example.
I don't think any blog is going to impress upon the community how much this will affect the playstyle of those of us who do stuff in lowsec. Other-sec's I don't know... but in low it'll be pretty cool...
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Dirael Papier
Nevermined Inc
15
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:42:00 -
[556] - Quote
Matuk Grymwal wrote:Sorry if this has been asked already, but I'd like to see some extra detail around how flag propagation works when you are logged off. So it should describe the possible flags you have when you are logged off, and how/if they can be propagated and by what actions. The current comments only describe whether the current flag can be extended once logged off. E.g. if a player logs off with the NPC flag, can they get shot and be given the PVP flag? Looks good, the new NPC flag is awesome You don't get any new flags at all while you're logged off.
If you already have the PvP flag before you log out, the PvP flag can be extended. If you don't have the PvP flag before you log off, then you won't get it while you're logged off. |
captain foivos
State War Academy Caldari State
37
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:48:00 -
[557] - Quote
Hey Masterplan, if players are the new police, why the hell do we still need CONCORD to be so strong? |
Reticle
Sight Picture
36
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Posted - 2012.10.05 01:53:00 -
[558] - Quote
captain foivos wrote:Hey Masterplan, if players are the new police, why the hell do we still need CONCORD to be so strong? excellent question |
Haas Tabris
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
29
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:07:00 -
[559] - Quote
So, you're taking a system that doesn't make much sense in its present form and making it more complicated and convoluted? I think there's a word for that in software development: ********.
How about we leave well enough alone and go fix some of the real problems in this game. Like the technetium mess, FW exploits, high-sec griefing, the POS system, some UI glitches, the fact the goons still exist... You know, real problems with EVE online.
But if that's too hard, and you just HAVE to change the aggression system, how about this: Just make the sec status penalties in lowsec a lot smaller. Really small. It will encourage more PvP and reduce grinding for a lot of players. Just a thought.
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Vladimir Norkoff
Income Redistribution Service
63
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:12:00 -
[560] - Quote
Ok, can-flipping question here.... When you incur your Suspect flag, does it retro-actively affect every can/wreck you have in space? Or does it only affect cans/wrecks that are jettisoned AFTER you get the flag?
Because the way a "professional can-flipper" (ie. griefer) works, is you fly up to the can, jettison your own can, then move everything from their can to yours. Depending on how the flags are handled determines whether or not you can effectively steal from another player solo. Cuz if the flag is retro-actively applied, then they can just take back their items with no problems at all. That effectively negates thievery from the game... which ain't very "sandbox". Cuz you should be able to steal other kids toys.
Note this is easily overcome if you steal as a duo. Form a fleet, one player drops a can, other player does the can-flipping. But that is far too much effort for something as lame as can-flipping. |
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
321
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:12:00 -
[561] - Quote
Reticle wrote:captain foivos wrote:Hey Masterplan, if players are the new police, why the hell do we still need CONCORD to be so strong? excellent question A better question might be "Is this actually intended as a shift toward player policing?" It still leaves concord as the consequence for acts that would create a GCC under the current system and provides no incentive for people to engage suspects. Really all it does as far as behaviors is allow people who might have wanted to involve themselves in a non-concord invoking conflict but weren't able to before to be able to now and also be able to retaliate against assisting parties considered neutral and protected prior. |
Havegun Willtravel
Mobile Alcohol Processing Units
54
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:13:00 -
[562] - Quote
I'll reserve judgement unitl Super Friends blog comes out, but atm it's being implied that just the simple act of shooting first results in Kill Rights.
So if someone who's -4.9 charges me in a low sec belt and I do the intelligent thing and shoot, no matter the outcome they get kill rights ?
Thus, even in low sec, the only way i can avoid looking over my sholder for a month is to flip a can ? Or put myself at a distinct disadvantage by always having to wait for someone else to shoot first ?
Sorry, but if left unchanged you've very severly damaged low sec pvp.
The existing system, quite frankly, works perfectly. If you never get a chance to defend yourself ( ie: you get blobbed ) you can get payback 1 v 1. These proposed changed completely inbalance that.
I can see a great many people who principaly live in high sec, but who do random roams into LS, stopping under these circumstances. The risk to their main activities would be to great to warrant giving out kill rights to every target.
Low sec doesn't need fewer people pvp'ing it needs more, and this is a recipe for to kill that. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9754
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:16:00 -
[563] - Quote
Vladimir Norkoff wrote:Ok, can-flipping question here.... When you incur your Suspect flag, does it retro-actively affect every can/wreck you have in space? Or does it only affect cans/wrecks that are jettisoned AFTER you get the flag? By the sounds of it, it will will be retroactive, yes. A can is a can is a can, and I seriously doubt that they're going to individually track each and every one of them GÇö they'll just look at your current flagging and see if you're a legal target or not. If at any point in time you are, your cans are free game at that point in time as well.
The new trick will lie in making people pick up cans they don't own, thereby S-flagging themselves so you can shoot them. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
321
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:19:00 -
[564] - Quote
Havegun Willtravel wrote:So if someone who's -4.9 charges me in a low sec belt and I do the intelligent thing and shoot, no matter the outcome they get kill rights ? Seems the best option would simply be letting them take the first shot and retaliating accordingly. that way you get killrights and if all goes well a killmail at the end of the fight as well.
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Dirael Papier
Nevermined Inc
16
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:21:00 -
[565] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Vladimir Norkoff wrote:Ok, can-flipping question here.... When you incur your Suspect flag, does it retro-actively affect every can/wreck you have in space? Or does it only affect cans/wrecks that are jettisoned AFTER you get the flag? By the sounds of it, it will will be retroactive, yes. A can is a can is a can, and I seriously doubt that they're going to individually track each and every one of them GÇö they'll just look at your current flagging and see if you're a legal target or not. If at any point in time you are, your cans are free game at that point in time as well. The new trick will lie in making people pick up cans they don't own, thereby S-flagging themselves so you can shoot them. I thought I remember someone saying it'll actually abandon all of your cans once you're flagged, but I can't find any of the dev posts saying that in this thread and have no clue where else I would've seen it. So I could just be delusional. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
333
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:29:00 -
[566] - Quote
Okay, couple things.
ECM and ECM burst against a pod = who cares. Why would you get an upgraded flag from firing one off, to hitting a pod vs. a ship. It doesn't kill or damage, it just blocks them from targeting. ECM penalties are maybe necessary as it is 'technically' an aggressive module, but it has no bearing on a pod, (or even a shuttle), as it doesn't have weapons or modules. It just grants a lock to look function.
Wipe that penalty. Anything that does nothing to something and incurs a penalty is kind of rediculous.
Move ECM and EWAR, (with exception to Warp Disruption), to an assisting module rather than a weapons module. It is more like Logistics than weapons, and should be treated as such. Just because it is used, doesn't mean it is used with criminal intent or for aggressive purposes, just like logistics.
ECM and EWAR, (Not including Jamming or Disrupting Warp), are primarily passive-aggressive modules and function more in a defensive role than an attack role in my opinion. They should be treated as such.
Example of use:
Webbed targeted ship, no other players involved - Ship is webbed; it aligns faster. Helpful action, and not likely to be used before an attack as it gives the target the ability to escape faster. Still results in Weapons Flag, but no PvP flag.
Webbed Targeted ship, NPCs involved - Action causes ship to become vulnerable to NPC attacks; should be considered Criminal in Highsec or Suspect in Lowsec.
Webbed Targeted ship, players involved - Remote assistance penalties apply as you are aiding the attackers.
ECM can't be helpful, but aside from use to prevent a target defending itself, can't be considered particularly harmful either. Weapon Disruption also fall into this category.
Target Painting would fall into the webbing category, with the unique exception that it can be used to increase a targets sig for the purpose of logistics locking time reduction, which would result in assistance.
..anyway, whatever. I'm just thinking. I got Concorded once for dropping ECM, (only), on a Brutix that was ganking my friends Orca in a Wardec. I was in fleet I believe, but not in Corp at the time, and the action was a legal one under the Wardec system for the attacker, but I wasn't able to help without losing my ship. Kinda felt that was a bit extreme under the circumstances, and I'd like to see that changed.
I do understand that, but at the same time, that person could have used Neutral logistics without penalty if they thought they neded it. Old system, I know, but something to consider for the current one. Not all actions are black and white, and there should be some consideration for that.
Maybe something to save for a later iteration of Crimewatch, or maybe not. Up to you ultimately, and the players who read this of course.
Ultimately, I'd still drop a Scorp on a ship attacking a friends ship, even in a Wardec I wasn't part of, only next time I'd probably bring guns if the situation called for the same action. ..and a Web. Maybe I was actually sleeping in front of my computer and dreamed I posted. Certainly, it's not there now. |
Cpt Gobla
No Bullshit Jokers Wild.
129
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:31:00 -
[567] - Quote
Just one question,
Having either a PvP or PvE flag and crashing does your ship still warp off?
Which happens?
Situation A: Pilot with flag crashes, warps off 100.000km (if not scrammed), sits in space for 15min.
Or
Situation B: Pilot with flag crashes, sits in space for 15min.
I'm suspecting it's B but I'm hoping it's A as this would allow careful pilots to focus-fire on scrambling frigates first and then engage in PvE without worry of disconnections.
Furthermore, when crashing and remaining in space will your drones still be automatically recalled as they currently are? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9754
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:35:00 -
[568] - Quote
Cpt Gobla wrote:Just one question,
Having either a PvP or PvE flag and crashing does your ship still warp off? Yes. The only change they've mentioned so far is that they're separating the flags into coherent units rather than have everything fall under a single flag with tons of special rules and exceptions, and that the PvE flag actually has some effects (viz. making you stay in space). The rest is pretty much business as usual: you e-warp off if you can; after the timer runs out (if you're not a pile of debris at that point), the ship disappears. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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Chitsa Jason
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD Exhale.
150
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Posted - 2012.10.05 02:38:00 -
[569] - Quote
CCP Masterplan wrote:Absocold wrote:Giving light interdictors a 'W' flag just for activating an interdiction sphere launcher will make them unable to jump through a gate after doing so. Dics are supposed to be able to jump after launching a bubble as long as no one tries to warp in it, this was broken for a while and was only recently fixed, you're about to break it again. Nope. It was always intended to work this way, but never did. Then it got fixed so that it would prevent you from jumping after launching. Then it got broken again recently.
This is **** then. You need more pilots to bubble both sides of the gate. Nerf to small gang pvp.
Also SP loss for loosing T3 is stupid in the first place.
Other changes seem good.
Now that rage is out.. i can go to sleep o/ |
Cloora
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
106
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Posted - 2012.10.05 03:03:00 -
[570] - Quote
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:CCP Masterplan wrote: This is not just oddly intentional, it is very intentional. If we didn't want to penalise T3 death, we simply wouldn't have the skillpoint-loss mechanic in the first place
I really don't get why losing an 800mil ship is not enough of a penalization. Also, what is the point of ejecting if you can't do it when there is an emergency. Isn't that what an "escape pod" is for? Perhaps you should just make T3s not have this penalty, their cost is already huge, losing them is already penalty enough when you pop.
HA HA HA HA HA HA HAAA!!!!!
TDG tears because they can't engage in thier riskless PvP anymore. Boo hoo hoo! CEO and Major ShareholderAPEX ConglomerateMaker of Starsi softdrinks and Torped-Os! Cereal http://www.altaholics.blogspot.com
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