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Separate all 4 empires and make hauling/true piracy fun.

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Arkenai Wyrnspire Turalyon Plus 1774	Posted - 2013.06.16 22:17:00 - [571] - Quote +1. Sig'd.-áGallente FW best FW.
Lacun Motabilum Peoples Capitalist Liberation Front Virtue of Selfishness 0	Posted - 2013.06.16 22:31:00 - [572] - Quote I think with some tweaks this idea has real merit. If you have a need to get goods through low sec there is a way, and this idea wouldn't change that. That said, in keeping with ccp's praise worthy "decisions have consequences" mantra, I think the consequences for being a pirate would need to be increased. I believe an interesting way to do that would be to regionalize sec status, then tie sec status to docking rights. What this would mean in practice is if you actively pirate on the gallente side of the gallente/caldari low sec border you would not be able to dock in any stations in gallente space once your gallente security status got low enough. You would have to travel a few jumps to caldari space for a safe haven station to dock in, giving any law abiding people in the area a slight home field advantage. I also think it would be interesting to tie security status into all forms of trade and commerce. If you supply pirates that operate in gallente space buy filling market orders or contracts or even trading, it would only be natural for the gallente to resent you for that. But if you supply said pirates in caldari space what could the gallente do but lower your sec status with them and wait for you to enter their borders. I realize lore wise this might be hard to justify and that it might make faction standing indistinguishable from sec status, but I was just trying to think of ways to create an environment similar to the one in which historical pirates operated. In which they essentially sided with one empire or another for access to supplies, markets for their stolen goods and friendly, or at least non-hostile ports. Overall I like the idea of low sec between empires.
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 720	Posted - 2013.06.17 01:14:00 - [573] - Quote Bibosikus wrote: Haven't read more than the first page: Nice idea if it had been implemented from 2003. As it is, this would be too disruptive to the present economy. Any suggestion which would seriously affect Eve's monetary turnover in an impossible-to-foresee manner is simply a no-no. Like removing ice belts, changing moons, Dominion Sov system, the changes to barges, adding plex, removing drone minerals, removing the super gates, jump freighters, and faction warfare e-z money printing? I really don't see how it is that massive and game breaking a change to not have everything be connected to a central hub, we already have 4 established trade hubs of decent quality that could quickly pick up the slack from jita. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Klymer Hedion University Amarr Empire 273	Posted - 2013.06.17 01:32:00 - [574] - Quote Drake Doe wrote: I don't exactly see what would be wrong with people staying in their ponds by choice, hasn't there always been an element of risk vs reward in mist mmos? Also, the risk udverse are more likely to get alts for anything from orca boosts to lvl 4 mission salvaging. People making the choice where they want to be isn't wrong. Sorry if I came across as implying that it was a bad thing in my previous post. Fracturing hisec would just exacerbate the problem of one region being more populated than the rest, something we already see with Jita and The Forge to a certain extent, and more of the trouble we see with that situation. Now one might say that people being forced out of that region due to overpopulation would be good for the rest, but then you just removed the players choice of where they want to be by imposing an artificial restriction, namely the region being a small pond. It could also be argued that we could see a return to a time when one race is chosen based on it's location rather than the players choice, similar to the situation that came about when bloodlines had different attributes. You actually remove risk in these cases as people avoid it by creating their account to start off in one of the small, shallow ponds rather than being dumped into a large, deep one. As for alt's, the game needs more people, not more alts. People bring new ideas and fresh perspectives whereas alt's just bring more of what we already have, a stagnant player base that simply maintains the status quo. Suppose I should mention I have 8 accounts, Mr Stagnation checking in
Douglas Whyte WhyteKream 12	Posted - 2013.06.17 05:10:00 - [575] - Quote The problem isn't with the idea, but the perspective of low-sec. I'll admit myself I get worried when entering low-sec. However most time's i'm not discouraged. I go in knowing that nothing can distract me, and that I must be hyper-vigilant. I've lost ships in low-sec for sure, however each time it wasn't a depressing experience. I went in knowing that there was the chance, and instead of over-panicking, i was still worried, i aligned and timed an ejection just in time for the last volley and got out with my pod everytime. Low-sec is fun every time i go through it. I wouldn't ever do something complacently within. I would imagine that forcing players to have to go through in their travel's would be good for their over-all experience. The real only ships, and gameplay, that would be greatly affected would be freighter's and hauler's. Other then that most other ships could navigate through much easier with enough experience.
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 720	Posted - 2013.06.17 05:57:00 - [576] - Quote Klymer wrote: Fracturing hisec would just exacerbate the problem of one region being more populated than the rest, something we already see with Jita and The Forge to a certain extent, and more of the trouble we see with that situation. Now one might say that people being forced out of that region due to overpopulation would be good for the rest, but then you just removed the players choice of where they want to be by imposing an artificial restriction, namely the region being a small pond. It could also be argued that we could see a return to a time when one race is chosen based on it's location rather than the players choice, similar to the situation that came about when bloodlines had different attributes. You actually remove risk in these cases as people avoid it by creating their account to start off in one of the small, shallow ponds rather than being dumped into a large, deep one. We already had this discussion, Hi-Sec is already running out of space and homogenizing on its own. CCP's in house economist said so himself at 2012's fanfest. Crowding in one region would not work because all the ore, ices, exploration loot, LP Rewards, and station slots would tank in value, making the other regions more attractive and making them all homogenous. The only reason Jita is more populated is because its more populated. The fact that it is so trivial to move goods to Jita means that it doesn't matter where you put your industrial setup in hisec, as long as you have a freighter and an autopilot button you can sell your items in Jita just as competitively as someone nearby. This means lower prices which means more people come to jita to buy things which means that is has more demand which means your stuff sells faster which means moar isk. By cutting off players from other empires from Jita, it will quickly shrivel and die leaving Caldari space without any advantage over any of the other empires, encouraging homgenization. Being kept out of your preferred space might be a problem if we were dealing with a young player base, but we have a mature player base capable and willing to homogenize. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Mildew Wolf 82	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:17:00 - [577] - Quote i like this idea in general. i would also prefer to put some more limits on things like jump freighters, jump bridges, titan bridge etc. its become too easy to move things around and force project imo
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 722	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:21:00 - [578] - Quote Mildew Wolf wrote: i like this idea in general. i would also prefer to put some more limits on things like jump freighters, jump bridges, titan bridge etc. its become too easy to move things around and force project imo Tbh I always thought jump drives were a dumb idea in the first place. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Mildew Wolf 82	Posted - 2013.06.17 09:07:00 - [579] - Quote Commander Ted wrote: Mildew Wolf wrote: i like this idea in general. i would also prefer to put some more limits on things like jump freighters, jump bridges, titan bridge etc. its become too easy to move things around and force project imo Tbh I always thought jump drives were a dumb idea in the first place. i assume since theyve gone to the trouble of adding these things over time (and because of the potential outcry from some players) they probably wont ever be completely removed but i hope they are lessened somewhat. its makes the game effectively much smaller. being able to move large groups across the entire known universe in a matter of minutes with a handful of mids seems wrong to me but ofc thats just my opinion. i dont expect changes any time soonGäó
Trajan Al'Thor Trajan Al'Thor Corporation 2	Posted - 2013.06.18 19:28:00 - [580] - Quote I want this.
Onomerous Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking 125	Posted - 2013.06.18 20:13:00 - [581] - Quote tldr: they want more opportunities for easy kills at their gate camps.
Liam Inkuras Chaotic Tranquility Casoff 308	Posted - 2013.06.18 20:30:00 - [582] - Quote Can't remember if I've signed this already, but here, have another +1 I wear my goggles at night. Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Quazal Atreides StarTrucks 3	Posted - 2013.06.18 20:58:00 - [583] - Quote This is something i have been an advocate of before. Whilst your idea i would support, I would prefer a non permanent version of yours. My version involved the low sec between factions not being static, so it moved. The movement of said system would be based indirectly on FW - Something along lines of Faction Warfare can capture certain 0.5 systems between the areas So Caldari space > Neutral zone > Minmatar space When minnie take System X it would go from 0.5 to a 0.4 for a period of not less than 1month, then would convert to a minmatar 0.5 this would then mean Caldari have to take it. This would then make the universe fluid, not static, of course the bridge between caldari and minnie would only be low for 1month, before it went back 0.5 thus allowing opening traffic but giving that month where it can be camped, the prices of goods would be more fluid based on traffic restrictions In terms of the 'friendly factions' there is a permanent route of highsec, because in war the allies would keep open the route for supplies etc. Merely between Caldari > Minnie / Caldari > Gallente / Amarr > Minnie & Amarr > Galente Whilst your idea i would support, I would prefer a non permanent version of yours. Still the only person to offer corp creation free of charge. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=35634#post35634 Created over 200 was 3rd on the all time corporation job history on eve-board. This service is in stasis due to personal game time...
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 727	Posted - 2013.06.19 02:46:00 - [584] - Quote 100 likes https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Erutpar Ambient Real Nice And Laidback Corporation Black Core Alliance 33	Posted - 2013.06.19 03:01:00 - [585] - Quote Onomerous wrote: tldr: they want more opportunities for easy kills at their gate camps. It's really frustrating that people don't understand the implications. Sure there will be more targets for pirates, but there will also be a lot more stuff for people to do in general. There also adds a bit of risk in trade, and with risk comes reward. It would be a very fun place but of course the personal security rating mechanics would have to change in my oppinion.
Mara Rinn Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium 3751	Posted - 2013.06.19 03:35:00 - [586] - Quote What incentive would there be for players to risk lugging bulky freight through the Caldari/Gallente border zone? What will stop everyone simply crowding into the Caldari State hisec and leaving the other three empires to be empty ghost towns? Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players
Mara Rinn Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium 3751	Posted - 2013.06.19 03:43:00 - [587] - Quote Commander Ted wrote: GizzyBoy wrote: join test concord's not getting in the way of them hitting freighters 300 + so far? Sounds like extremely boring emergent gameplay. Wouldn't you rather be a pirate in a armada of warships trying to take down the caravan of cargo haulers? Or maybe you and a small band of frigates are cruising the space lanes looking for a lone trader who has stuffed his cargo hold with the federation navy stasis webs that are in short supply in jita. Instead of filling the freighter, setting destination, clicking autopilot, then halfway their you get your massive ship bumped like a tennis ball underwater while a group of ships 1 shot you which interrupts you watching tv. I wanna be a pirate, not some guy who runs around looking for asshats running missions to gank or to play grabass with other so called "pirates". I wanna be a adventurous trader looking to make my fortune using my wits to navigate dangerous deep space without pouring over data tables and spread sheets trying to manipulate prices by moving **** from homogenous trade hub to trade hub. Why would there be a caravan of haulers? Why would they hang around when there is even the faintest whiff of pirates nearby? Why can't you be the guy patrolling lowsec looking for the freighter pilot who thinks it is safe to haul a load of faction loot unescorted through lowsec? If it is not happening now, why would it happen with lowsec border zones? If you want to be a pirate, what is stopping you being a pirate today? Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 727	Posted - 2013.06.19 04:03:00 - [588] - Quote Mara Rinn wrote: What incentive would there be for players to risk lugging bulky freight through the Caldari/Gallente border zone? What will stop everyone simply crowding into the Caldari State hisec and leaving the other three empires to be empty ghost towns? It is extremely obvious why people won't crowd caldari space. Caldari LP rewards will flood the market making them less valuable. Caldari Ores will be less valuable. Caldari Ices will be the only ones mined. Caldari Station slots will never ever open up. Now with the supplies for things you can only get in the other empires people will obviously want to mine those, those people need modules, those people will be war deced. Already Caldari Space is running out of room and people are starting to homogenize through hisec, but Jita remains the biggest hub. CCP's economist said so himself in the 2012 fanfest. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 727	Posted - 2013.06.19 04:04:00 - [589] - Quote Mara Rinn wrote: If you want to be a pirate, what is stopping you being a pirate today? There is nothing to shoot but other pirates. You don't make isk pirating, you make isk doing merc contracts or something completely unrelated to pvp. The reason that nobody cross low sec in freighters except for the very rare extra stupid idiot is that you can do it afk with 0 risk through hi-sec. It isn't even a question worth asking really it is so obvious. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Trajan Al'Thor Trajan Al'Thor Corporation 3	Posted - 2013.06.19 15:54:00 - [590] - Quote I believe shifting space would be even more interesting. It might make some carebears rage when their pos end up in lowsec, but I think it would be more interesting.
Quazal Atreides StarTrucks 4	Posted - 2013.06.19 16:09:00 - [591] - Quote Trajan Al'Thor wrote: I believe shifting space would be even more interesting. It might make some carebears rage when their pos end up in lowsec, but I think it would be more interesting. As a carebear who used to go to them naughty placesin lowsec, would be interesting to see hwo them players adapt, but as the 'mobile' space high/low would be a predefined group of system (only the 0.5s) between the factions then unless you some cahoones you wouldn't put a pos up in case your system got flipped... But meh, would be fun also for AFK pirates to log in one day to find themselves in a 0.5 with only big shinny ships :) Still the only person to offer corp creation free of charge. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=35634#post35634 Created over 200 was 3rd on the all time corporation job history on eve-board. This service is in stasis due to personal game time...
Johnson 1044 Johnson Organic Produce 18	Posted - 2013.06.19 16:18:00 - [592] - Quote I like the idea. I spend very little time in Caldari space/Jita now so why would new borders change that?
Daniel Plain Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 1214	Posted - 2013.06.19 16:34:00 - [593] - Quote i support the idea in general, but your answer to the jump freighter issue is a little flaky. with the current game mechanics, there is virtually no way to kill a JF unless the pilot screws up. this does not mean that this would not change anything though. not everyone is willing to risk a JF for hauling ore and other high volume commodities, thus the markets would probably diverge in some ways. "I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF
Vincent Gaines Cold Moon Destruction. Transmission Lost 550	Posted - 2013.06.19 17:14:00 - [594] - Quote Onomerous wrote: tldr: they want more opportunities for easy kills at their gate camps. 1) With 50 or so connections, not every gate will be camped. Far from it, actually. 2) Wormholes are awesome. Not a diplo.-á The above post was edited for spelling.
Evei Shard 186	Posted - 2013.06.19 17:54:00 - [595] - Quote How about this as an alternative: Leave the system security as is, but CONCORD no longer considers web/scram/disruption to be an attack in 0.5 systems, and loot drop from industrial cargo-holds is decreased substantially, making it more profitable to do something like pin them down, and demand they jettison their cargo. This also gives an edge to campers because it allows them to pin someone down and get their alpha ships in range. Personally I don't mind the idea of low-sec separating the empires. Make Niarja 0.3, and make Kaaputenen and Madilmilire 0.4. I think it would encourage some independence among the empires, and create business opportunities for various corps/alliances within those empires as there will be higher demand for.. everything.. in each empire. Live in Amarr? Only seeing BPC's for Drakes in Jita? Buy a BPO, set up a POS, and start making copies to sell in your region and make some isk. The idea of changing CONCORDS responses in 0.5 is simply a compromise. Profit favors the prepared
Corine Noas Russian Thunder Squad Darkness of Despair 19	Posted - 2013.06.19 19:17:00 - [596] - Quote Quote: Separate the four empires with low security space No, make it nullsec And also make it so different type of resources (ore, moon materials, salvage, gas etc) can only be extracted in certain places of the universe. So in order to build any ship or mod - you're gonna need materials from different regions separated by outlaw space :) But I know that's too hardcore for our "90% of players are highsec carebears" sandbox
Johnson 1044 Johnson Organic Produce 18	Posted - 2013.06.19 19:41:00 - [597] - Quote Bold moves like this are what will keep this game interesting for years to come.
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 733	Posted - 2013.06.19 19:43:00 - [598] - Quote Corine Noas wrote: No, make it nullsec Maybe, actually nah. unavoidable bubble hell camps where 1 cruiser can cover an entire regional gate and catch cloakies. Jump bridges to easily flank you. Titans with DDDs. Maybe if they took hisec and put each empire at the furthest corners of the map leaving the middle null. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 733	Posted - 2013.06.19 19:45:00 - [599] - Quote Evei Shard wrote: How about this as an alternative: Leave the system security as is, but CONCORD no longer considers web/scram/disruption to be an attack in 0.5 systems. Oh god no. You would never ever leave a .5 system again. Heavy dictors with lots of logi just sitting there for ***** and giggles all day. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Tikktokk Tokkzikk Blackjack and Exotic Dancers 146	Posted - 2013.06.19 19:56:00 - [600] - Quote I've always wanted this but been too lazy to actually suggest it (because CCP never read this subforum, right?). +1 I'd also suggest having very few stations to discourage jump freighters (and because enemies of the station owner will surely blow it up).

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