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Zoe Panala
Blobcats
0
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Posted - 2012.12.06 11:42:00 -
[31] - Quote
As CEO of the leading Minmatar Militia corporation I can not endorse this thread. |
Foxstar Damaskeenus
Order of the Black Dagger
3
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Posted - 2012.12.06 11:48:00 -
[32] - Quote
Zoe Panala wrote:As CEO of the leading Minmatar Militia corporation I can not endorse this thread.
delete |
Esh Slyyn
Robian Yabus Mato Zhipping 24eme Legion Etrangere
6
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Posted - 2012.12.06 13:53:00 -
[33] - Quote
Sorry but I don't understand your post goal : how a 3 members corporation could manage to annoy a 31 members one ?
Also from your own corporation descriptionn :
Quote:What we expect of our pilots: - Willing to learn to lead fleets. - Moving frequently: we are nomads who travel light with a wallet full of ISK. - Training to be the best at a specific role in fleet combat. - Fighting against tough odds in expensive ships. - Fighting against impossible odds in cheap ships. - Getting lost (and then unlost) in obscure corners of EVE. - No drama.
Case of impossible odds maybe :)
While I can understand your frustration, there is nothing new under the sun. Amarr spies and alts were pretty frequent in Amarr militia during the Inferno Plexers Invasion. To a point we had to shoot them, even being in the same militia. Spying and metagame are part of the game. There is plenty of smart answers to your matter, just rethink about it.
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Abyssum Invocat
Justified Chaos
44
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Posted - 2012.12.06 15:58:00 -
[34] - Quote
Maeltstome wrote:X Gallentius wrote:Foxstar Damaskeenus wrote:Again, let me repeat myself and Milton. They HAVEN'T been kicked from militia.
I liked Milton's answer. Remove faction hits for attacking friendly. We wouldn't do it anyway just because faction warfare is fun due to the feel of 2 huge groups fighting each other.
Diplomats tend to keep things cohesive.
Horrible idea. Faction hits should be retained. You don't like blobcats? War dec them. Problem solved. war dec NPC corps? If it's an NPC corp then the problem will deal with itself very quickly as the awoxers have no corp members to buoy their standings. |
Perkin Warbeck
Amarrian Space Poodles 24eme Legion Etrangere
87
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Posted - 2012.12.06 20:42:00 -
[35] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:The irony of Perkin Warbeck giving advice on how to deal with his alt is quite lost on me.
Meh. What's more ironic is that a major alliance in Faction Warfare did not understand how this mechanic works. |
Sean Parisi
Project Cerberus Caldari State Capturing
54
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Posted - 2012.12.06 21:17:00 -
[36] - Quote
What they should do is create an AWOXER list internally. Keep the penalty - If someone engages you, you can fire back without taking penalty yourself (not sure if this is already implemented).
But after someone awoxes for a while within their own militia, they are added to a list for say a month or so. Which makes them an open target to their own militia. This would mean they can still be involved in many militia activities, but engaging them would not be an issue.
To add, regardless of whether they change corp, militia, etc. The character will still be on the 'list'. |
Pulgy
Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly
71
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Posted - 2012.12.06 22:07:00 -
[37] - Quote
Tekitha wrote:On a side note, a militia toon using smartbombs in a large scale engagement (which is sometimes a required tactic to win certain fights) also destroys faction standings due to the same broken mechanic, this is also plain dumb.
Tell me about it.
No range? No problem!Join the Church of the Holy BlasterGäó . A Hybrid religion. |
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide.
278
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Posted - 2012.12.07 07:53:00 -
[38] - Quote
How the hell is this anything like pay to win? |
jjohnpaul xvii
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
43
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Posted - 2012.12.07 16:50:00 -
[39] - Quote
This is EXACTLY like pay to win > and you g*d damn know it Candy.
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Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery Swift Angels Alliance
647
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Posted - 2012.12.08 04:47:00 -
[40] - Quote
Veshta Yoshida wrote:No.
You shoot something/someone that is not a legitimate target you should get slammed with tickets, subpoenas and short men in the shower called 'Big Earl' .
Since the characters in question are themselves shooting allies they will soon find themselves kicked from militia (at least I think that is how it works now), so take down their names and when they are removed check periodically if they have been biomassed .. when that happens petition them and get the controller banned (biomassing to avoid consequences is a NoNo).
The lame duck will soon find his accounts filled with useless alts, aka. you win.
As for sec: Do what was suggested years ago. Move all sec gain to low-sec, where the crimes are committed and slap an extra modifier on rats in FW space to sweeten the deal .. perps (hopefully armed) roaming the countryside to appease Concord can only improve the lives of the pew'ers.
In short: CCP recently (2 years ago = yesterday with regards to FW changes) changed when/how people are ejected from FW due to standings so work within that system to discourage the described behaviour.
You really do not understand faction warfare at all, do you?
The tactic in question relies on the 7 day escrow period on including the standings of a toon joining a player corporation (and alliance) towards the overall corporation's standings toward the militia and faction. ie; for 7 days, your -8.0 vs Minmatar doesn't count toward the faction standings for Blobcats.
This 7 day period before their negative standings affect corporation standings is gameable, if you leave your corporation before the 7 day period is up, it's as if you were never in that corporation. While in that corporation, you go around AWOXing as many of your fellow militia members as you possibly can; anyone who shoots back or assists their friend loses faction standings. Eventually, their corporation standings drop too low, and then their whole Alliance drops too low, and gets booted from the Militia.
As Cynthia aka Perkin says, it is pretty sad that ushra'Khan couldn't figure out how to math properly. But either way, the maths are strongly against U'K in this fight between Cynthia and her alts and Dan Carter Murray and his alts, who get to knock massive faction standings off U'K for no penalty to the Caerise toon or the Blobcats corporation at all.
This is essentially similar to, eg, gaming the price of items in your ship's hold to ridiculous levels, and blowing up ships to recieve ridiculous LP payouts. Or somehow figuring out how to fly around highsec unmolested by the faction popo ganking people in your alliance without being CONCORDOKKENED.
It is an abuse of a game rule or system.
The game rule is there to allow militia corporations to pick up members in good faith now that recruiters cannot check the personal standings of recruits to militia and factions, and gives them 7 days to straighten up their standings as much as possible. It is not there, as far as I am aware, to allow people to freely and without consequences AWOX militia members, roll out of a corp every 6 days (in this case, directly to the opposing militia) in some cases in between docking and undocking.
So. I would like to hear from Veshta how the Caerise toon will be kicked from Minmatar militia from the consequences of the controlling player's action. Why would the person controlling the Caerise toon biomass that toon when it can be recycled indefinitely between Amarr militia, and Minmatar militia?
The asymmetry of the maths in this equation are basically infinite, and once Caerise has neutered U'K the controlling player can move up to Kourm and start on whomever. The only defence is a wardec, which has consequences for highsec transits by players, as now Blobcats can accept allies or members to assist in the war.
Clearly CCP has a bit of work to do. Taking submissions for "Trinkets friendly Advice Column" via evemail or private convo in-game. Anonymity sorta guaranteed. http://www.localectomy.blogspot.com.au
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Perkin Warbeck
Amarrian Space Poodles 24eme Legion Etrangere
88
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Posted - 2012.12.08 05:35:00 -
[41] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote: While in that corporation, you go around AWOXing as many of your fellow militia members as you possibly can; anyone who is stupid enough to shoot back or assists their friend loses faction standings. Eventually, their corporation standings drop too low, and then their whole Alliance drops too low, and gets booted from the Militia. This because under no circumstances can you warp off to get away from, get a neutral alt to kill, or get an Amarr/Caldari alt to kill, the known and obvious Awoxer.
Clearly CCP has a bit of work to do to make this game completely idiot proof.
Fixed it for you. |
Zoe Panala
Blobcats
8
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Posted - 2012.12.08 05:58:00 -
[42] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:Veshta Yoshida wrote:No.
You shoot something/someone that is not a legitimate target you should get slammed with tickets, subpoenas and short men in the shower called 'Big Earl' .
Since the characters in question are themselves shooting allies they will soon find themselves kicked from militia (at least I think that is how it works now), so take down their names and when they are removed check periodically if they have been biomassed .. when that happens petition them and get the controller banned (biomassing to avoid consequences is a NoNo).
The lame duck will soon find his accounts filled with useless alts, aka. you win.
As for sec: Do what was suggested years ago. Move all sec gain to low-sec, where the crimes are committed and slap an extra modifier on rats in FW space to sweeten the deal .. perps (hopefully armed) roaming the countryside to appease Concord can only improve the lives of the pew'ers.
In short: CCP recently (2 years ago = yesterday with regards to FW changes) changed when/how people are ejected from FW due to standings so work within that system to discourage the described behaviour. You really do not understand faction warfare at all, do you? The tactic in question relies on the 7 day escrow period on including the standings of a toon joining a player corporation (and alliance) towards the overall corporation's standings toward the militia and faction. ie; for 7 days, your -8.0 vs Minmatar doesn't count toward the faction standings for Blobcats. This 7 day period before their negative standings affect corporation standings is gameable, if you leave your corporation before the 7 day period is up, it's as if you were never in that corporation. While in that corporation, you go around AWOXing as many of your fellow militia members as you possibly can; anyone who shoots back or assists their friend loses faction standings. Eventually, their corporation standings drop too low, and then their whole Alliance drops too low, and gets booted from the Militia. As Cynthia aka Perkin says, it is pretty sad that ushra'Khan couldn't figure out how to math properly. But either way, the maths are strongly against U'K in this fight between Cynthia and her alts and Dan Carter Murray and his alts, who get to knock massive faction standings off U'K for no penalty to the Caerise toon or the Blobcats corporation at all. This is essentially similar to, eg, gaming the price of items in your ship's hold to ridiculous levels, and blowing up ships to recieve ridiculous LP payouts. Or somehow figuring out how to fly around highsec unmolested by the faction popo ganking people in your alliance without being CONCORDOKKENED. It is an abuse of a game rule or system. The game rule is there to allow militia corporations to pick up members in good faith now that recruiters cannot check the personal standings of recruits to militia and factions, and gives them 7 days to straighten up their standings as much as possible. It is not there, as far as I am aware, to allow people to freely and without consequences AWOX militia members, roll out of a corp every 6 days (in this case, directly to the opposing militia) in some cases in between docking and undocking. So. I would like to hear from Veshta how the Caerise toon will be kicked from Minmatar militia from the consequences of the controlling player's action. Why would the person controlling the Caerise toon biomass that toon when it can be recycled indefinitely between Amarr militia, and Minmatar militia? The asymmetry of the maths in this equation are basically infinite, and once Caerise has neutered U'K the controlling player can move up to Kourm and start on whomever. The only defence is a wardec, which has consequences for highsec transits by players, as now Blobcats can accept allies or members to assist in the war. Clearly CCP has a bit of work to do.
You are a pathological liar, that is all I will say. |
Mich Farmer
Nasranite Watch Liandri Covenant
4
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Posted - 2012.12.08 08:02:00 -
[43] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:It is an abuse of a game rule or system.
Again, your militias (GalMatar) started this kind of awoxing way back. And it was not a problem then or you would have been in forums, loudly condemming your own militia.
So whine more. Karma is a B.
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Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery Swift Angels Alliance
650
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Posted - 2012.12.08 09:01:00 -
[44] - Quote
I don't give a crap if you think I'm a pathological liar. Such accusations mean you cannot refute anything I say with rationality or evidence, because of truthifying, so QED, suck on my hairy man cherries.
I also don't particularly care if Adolf or anyone else does it or did it.
I do care about making the game logically consistent. It is utterly illogical that you should be able to game the system this way, and this only exists because CCP allows it to - which is a result of tradeoffs made due to other design limitations in the game. This is all fixable and preventable, just like the magnetar haxx was. Taking submissions for "Trinkets friendly Advice Column" via evemail or private convo in-game. Anonymity sorta guaranteed. http://www.localectomy.blogspot.com.au
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Mich Farmer
Nasranite Watch Liandri Covenant
5
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Posted - 2012.12.08 09:11:00 -
[45] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:I do care about making the game logically consistent. It is utterly illogical that you should be able to game the system this way, and this only exists because CCP allows it to.
I'm sure they will eventually fix it so you cannot Awox Gal/Matar but can keep awoxing Amarr/Caldari if their previous design logic is any indication. I mean, how many more advantages can they hand out to you? |
Zoe Panala
Blobcats
8
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Posted - 2012.12.08 10:23:00 -
[46] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:...suck on my hairy man cherries. ...
I will give you some evidence: today I tried to have 5 fights with members of your alliance. Every single time your guy ran away and came back with a fleet of at least 5 to gank me, or they just docked. You and your whole alliance do nothing in this game other than bad attempts at griefing. Like the wise man said just above your post "karma is a B".
I could refute every single one of your "points", but as you do in ingame channels, "suck on my hairy man cherries." - what is to refute here?
Trinkets friend wrote:The only defence is a wardec, which has consequences for highsec transits by players, as now Blobcats can accept allies or members to assist in the war.
War is mutual now of course, could you please stop lying just for a moment? You are afraid of the consequences, you already started to move your high sec operations into neutral corps, talking about gaming the system? Yes, I would be afraid too if I were just another risk averse, inexperienced player with more "likes" than kills in a year.
http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=84744 |
Antares 04
Eleutherian Guard Villore Accords
17
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Posted - 2012.12.08 20:30:00 -
[47] - Quote
Mich Farmer wrote:Trinkets friend wrote:I do care about making the game logically consistent. It is utterly illogical that you should be able to game the system this way, and this only exists because CCP allows it to. I'm sure they will eventually fix it so you cannot Awox Gal/Matar but can keep awoxing Amarr/Caldari if their previous design logic is any indication. I mean, how many more advantages can they hand out to you? I mean, CCP itself brought a whole fleet yesterday to hamper our defensive plexing efforts to Old Man star. Oh sure, they can say "live event, giving people something to do, etc." but causing time dilation and other aspects which cause havoc with FW mechanics is downright irresponsible, especially in system which is considered someones home.
I can *taste* your bitterness all the way over here. You are yet another in a long list of people who feel entitled to your whining over factors you don't fully know anything about. The Republican/Federal militias have used these exploits for a long time? Yes, I'm sure they have - show me the treads detailing their efforts - I want names, methods, proff.
I am sure they will, eventually, fix this so that AWOXING anyone anywhere in FW is no longer such a simply and risk-free endeavor, and I'm sure then that you will find something else to ***** on the Fed/Rep militias about.
As for CCP's events, yet another example of how you will find any excuse to complain about your 'enemy' militia - I'm sure if they landed in Tama they would be there to hamper the Cal-mil's efforts in some way, it's all a grand conspiricy against you, isn't it?
This is a game, hater. If you can't treat it like one or calm down you should quit it. |
Zoe Panala
Blobcats
10
|
Posted - 2012.12.09 06:59:00 -
[48] - Quote
Antares 04 wrote:The Republican/Federal militias have used these exploits for a long time? Yes, I'm sure they have - show me the treads detailing their efforts - I want names, methods, proff.
Are you really expect the man to waste his time by finding his own posts from YEARS AGO? |
Luscar Seneca
Dark Circle Enforcement Templis Dragonaors
0
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Posted - 2012.12.09 08:00:00 -
[49] - Quote
I'm sure they are annoying but you should solve the problem in game with the mechanics available. We've all dealt with before and you won't be getting any sympathy here.
But good luck out there ;) |
Antares 04
Eleutherian Guard Villore Accords
18
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Posted - 2012.12.09 08:27:00 -
[50] - Quote
Zoe Panala wrote:Antares 04 wrote:The Republican/Federal militias have used these exploits for a long time? Yes, I'm sure they have - show me the treads detailing their efforts - I want names, methods, proff.
Are you really expect the man to waste his time by finding his own posts from YEARS AGO?
If he wants people to take his claims seriously without writing him off as a baseless liar offering complaints, as opposed to credible arguments?
Yes.
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Mich Farmer
Nasranite Watch Liandri Covenant
7
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Posted - 2012.12.09 08:52:00 -
[51] - Quote
Antares 04 wrote:This is a game, hater. If you can't treat it like one or calm down you should quit it.
Says a person whose corpie and CEO send death threats over internet pixels. You do know it was EL-G, Seriph and Ankh who started this whole thing?
And yes, I accuse CCP of serving favors. Time dilation makes it slower to cap the plex timer so if we had fought in OMS plex and killed frogs, they would have received a time advantage to reship next door. As CCP has already served only the gallente interest over the years, this is just one more signal for Caldari players that "We dont like your money, unsub now so we can remove FW entirely".
Of course that is small peanuts compared to farming travesty they just reintroduced, quess again those whose benefit. |
Antares 04
Eleutherian Guard Villore Accords
18
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Posted - 2012.12.09 21:13:00 -
[52] - Quote
Mich Farmer wrote:Antares 04 wrote:This is a game, hater. If you can't treat it like one or calm down you should quit it. Says a person whose corpie and CEO send death threats over internet pixels. You do know it was EL-G, Seriph and Ankh who started this whole thing and where all the hatred comes from. (1)And yes, I accuse CCP of serving favors. Time dilation makes it slower to cap the plex timer so if we had fought in OMS plex and killed frogs, they would have received a time advantage to reship next door. As CCP has already served only the gallente interest over the years, this is just one more signal for Caldari players that "We dont like your money, unsub now so we can remove FW entirely". Of course that is small peanuts compared to farming travesty they just reintroduced, quess again those whose benefit. As for Awoxers, it was started first by Rancer people then continued by likes of Adolf E. and others and always against Caldari militia first. I dont see need to go into details over things which should be obvious to anyone with a grasp of FW history.
(1) Loggs, copies of mails, some proof? This may be old history and I care little for 'who started it' but if you want to make claims like this, I'm assuming you have anything but your word alone - that won't suffice. Spreading baseless lander and libel is easy - digging up your proven facts is a little bit harder.
As for your accusations about CCP bias, they are about as bland and hollow as Damar's claims. What militia was it that took all the 10 systems in our theater again? What did CCP assumably do to stop that? anything at all?
Who was it that wa rewarded Gallente ships during all this time, ships using hybrid weapons, provenly inferior to the other weapon systems thanks to years of small buff and nerfs that rendered them near obsolete for a period? I recall that period well, do you?
Tell me again who it was that built a de-facto alliance among corporations before alliances were allowed into FW, while the Caldari were pillaging Minmatar FW with standings exploits?
That the Cadlari FW groups are unable to do something simmilar now that alliances are allowed and form a unified front agaisnt us is not our fault - that is due Caldari ineptitude and your inability to get along and cooperate. We have not had nearly as many problems with this. Perhaps, if we take all your space, you will be able to band together out of need, much like we did? Who knows, could be interestign to see.
As for the 'farming traverst' that disgusting period was caused by other factors - the decline of the Caldari, the power the Fed held at the time (and still do) the power of the Minmatar, an the decline of the Amarr - that the system could be farmed like that was made possible for all factions - you are jsut bitter that yours were not on top. I don't think we would hear any complaints form you were the situation reversed...
As for AWOXING, again, you have not provided me anything solid to back your claims up, and Adolf Ehrnrooth had standing-boosted corporation in ALL the militias, AWOXING them all on rotation - a habit he seems to have started after he left PERVS, paused only for a few stints in Draketrain. Ergo, if he was not fighting for the Caldari/Amarr, wa was AWOXING everyone in turn.
Your "I don't see the need to get into details on history" is a cope-out - Assume that I don't know and prove to me your accusations are correct and more than just accusation, or forever STFU your baseless slandering. I have little patience for your kind of bitter haters, so if you can't bring anything substantial to back up your claims I've no choice but to assume your just here to cast blame and spread lies.
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Mich Farmer
Nasranite Watch Liandri Covenant
8
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Posted - 2012.12.09 21:56:00 -
[53] - Quote
Antares 04 wrote:As for your accusations about CCP bias, they are about as bland and hollow as Damar's claims. What militia was it that took all the 10 systems in our theater again? What did CCP assumably do to stop that? anything at all?
- Nerfed Caldari NPC's without announcement - Changed plex spawn mechanics to favor original owner - Allowed you to stop plex despawning without deeming it exploit
Those are something on top of my list.
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Antares 04
Eleutherian Guard Villore Accords
18
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Posted - 2012.12.09 22:55:00 -
[54] - Quote
Mich Farmer wrote:Antares 04 wrote:As for your accusations about CCP bias, they are about as bland and hollow as Damar's claims. What militia was it that took all the 10 systems in our theater again? What did CCP assumably do to stop that? anything at all? - Nerfed Caldari NPC's without announcement(1) - Changed plex spawn mechanics to favor original owner(2) - Allowed you to stop plex despawning without deeming it exploit(3) Those are something on top of my list.(4)
(1) IIRC the removal of EWAR in navy rats was announced long before it happened. Unless ofc you think of another event. Clarify?
(2) Clarify? How exactly was this done and how does it favor the original owner? Furthermore, if it benefits the original owner, you enjoy this benefit as well.
(3) If you reffer to the old exploits that let you stop the timer without beign there, this was done by pretty much everyone.
(4) Your list is sorely lacking in any meaningful content - show me the rest of it, and then perhaps answer my other questions or provide any proof of your accusations, as I've asked?
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Bengal Bob
Angry Mustellid Iron Oxide.
95
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Posted - 2012.12.10 10:17:00 -
[55] - Quote
It is like Dan Carter Murray was cloned multiple times and moved to both caldari and gallente. |
jjohnpaul xvii
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
43
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Posted - 2012.12.10 11:00:00 -
[56] - Quote
Ummm.....
http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=1474261
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Mich Farmer
Nasranite Watch Liandri Covenant
8
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Posted - 2012.12.10 11:07:00 -
[57] - Quote
Antares 04 wrote:(1) IIRC the removal of EWAR in navy rats was announced long before it happened. Unless ofc you think of another event. Clarify?
The fact they removed ewar from all caldari minor/med plexes and left only two rats capable of it to major plexes before nerfing any other races NPC (Damps stayed on pre-nerf levels the whole time and worked 100% of the time) and did not announce this.
I am sure Val Erian would be happy to link his forum post where he comfirms there is no caldari ewar in said plexes. I believe it was even briefly mentioned in one dev blog, months after the nerf, where they talked about FW plex npcs.
But being clueless about this shows you have no grasp of actual events occurring in FW. |
Dztrgovac
36
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Posted - 2012.12.10 11:17:00 -
[58] - Quote
Removing standing hit from attacking your own militia would only further support this behavior, they could do it forever with same characters since they to would no longer lose standings.
Also, removing faction standings hit would allow "true manly man" (read, most sperging of spergers) to go full pie on their own militia. |
Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1383
|
Posted - 2012.12.10 17:00:00 -
[59] - Quote
Working as intended. It's about time CCP stops catering to the lazy players with this sense of entitlement for fear of losing money. These aren't the people making the game better, these are the people wanting you to turn EVE in to a game that is like most other MMO's. |
jjohnpaul xvii
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
45
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Posted - 2012.12.10 17:30:00 -
[60] - Quote
I'm waiting on a response here junior..... |
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