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Tom K'rathma
Quantum Reality R n D The Orion-Syndicate
0
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Posted - 2013.01.01 07:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am currently piloting a Vigilant, nasty little bugger isn't it ^-^
I'm going to want to use it on small gang roams and MAYBE the odd bit of 1v1, and I just really would like to know what to watch out for, I've run it against a Tempest Fleet, got under its guns and grounded away at the tank, and I seems like it can tank well.
(Sarcastic/humerous/witty replies are welcome) |
chris elliot
EG CORP Talocan United
85
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Posted - 2013.01.01 08:21:00 -
[2] - Quote
Tom K'rathma wrote:I am currently piloting a Vigilant, nasty little bugger isn't it ^-^ I'm going to want to use it on small gang roams and MAYBE the odd bit of 1v1, and I just really would like to know what to watch out for, I've run it against a Tempest Fleet, got under its guns and grounded away at the tank, and I seems like it can tank well. (Sarcastic/humerous/witty replies are welcome)
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Alticus C Bear
University of Caille Gallente Federation
128
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Posted - 2013.01.01 08:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
Deimos and Ishtar will have comparable stats but a resist profile you may struggle with. You should still be able to disengage with a faction web if you need to. |
bubble trout
Sky Fighters Talocan United
53
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Posted - 2013.01.01 10:05:00 -
[4] - Quote
I have heard laser brutix pwn vigilants. I might have hear wrong though. |
To mare
Advanced Technology
153
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Posted - 2013.01.01 11:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
pretty much every BS fitted for brawling will kill a vigilant, some HACs probably will as well sacrilege ishtar deimos eagle (yes eagle). |
Tom K'rathma
Quantum Reality R n D The Orion-Syndicate
0
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Posted - 2013.01.01 15:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ah, cool, cheers guys |
sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
530
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Posted - 2013.01.01 15:57:00 -
[7] - Quote
Any 2 of anything cruiser/bc sized. Your overpriced cruiser is like one and a third regular cruiser. Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Maeltstome
Mentally Assured Destruction
226
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Posted - 2013.01.01 17:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
chris elliot wrote:Any of the rebranded T1 combat cruisers, if flown and fit properly can easily kill you or give you a run for your money.
Shouldn't stop you from enjoying the ship though. :)
Wow, that is pretty much the funniest thing i've read this week. Any T1 ship will struggle with a vigilant 1v1 due to it's ability to dictate range.
@OP - There are lot's of fun fits you can do with the vigilant. I would reocmmend getting a 14KM web however, not for offensive purpsoes (as most people only thinkg blaster ships have web bonuses to rush people down) but instead to give you a GTFO Option. If you can web overheated to 20km, you can escape point range much more easily.
Something i haven't tried on a vigilant is a Dual-pro XL-ASB fit with lots of damage/tracking in the lows and resist rigs. If you are going to brawl you need an AB... but it doesnt have the slots for ab/mwd/web/scram/asb - perhaps a 100mn fit might do well for you? |
Liam Inkuras
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
113
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Posted - 2013.01.01 18:36:00 -
[9] - Quote
Maybe a 100mn armour fit like this:
Highs: Heavy Electron Blaster II x5 (Caldari Navy Anrimatter M)
Mids: 100mn Afterburner II Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Federation Navy Stasis Webifier x2
Lows: Damage Control II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II x2 Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II x2 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Rigs: Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Trimark Armour Pump I x2 |
Liang Nuren
Heretic Army Heretic Nation
2517
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Posted - 2013.01.01 18:39:00 -
[10] - Quote
I'm confused why you'd try to roll with a 9km scram and 2 14km 90% webs...
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Liam Inkuras
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
115
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Posted - 2013.01.01 19:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:I'm confused why you'd try to roll with a 9km scram and 2 14km 90% webs...
-Liang The webs are more for GTFO ability than holding a target. Keeping them at bay while trying to escape is their main point besides snatching someone who is about to escape. |
Tom K'rathma
Quantum Reality R n D The Orion-Syndicate
0
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Posted - 2013.01.01 21:04:00 -
[12] - Quote
Maeltstome wrote:chris elliot wrote:Any of the rebranded T1 combat cruisers, if flown and fit properly can easily kill you or give you a run for your money.
Shouldn't stop you from enjoying the ship though. :) Wow, that is pretty much the funniest thing i've read this week. Any T1 ship will struggle with a vigilant 1v1 due to it's ability to dictate range. @OP - There are lot's of fun fits you can do with the vigilant. I would reocmmend getting a 14KM web however, not for offensive purpsoes (as most people only thinkg blaster ships have web bonuses to rush people down) but instead to give you a GTFO Option. If you can web overheated to 20km, you can escape point range much more easily. Something i haven't tried on a vigilant is a Dual-pro XL-ASB fit with lots of damage/tracking in the lows and resist rigs. If you are going to brawl you need an AB... but it doesnt have the slots for ab/mwd/web/scram/asb - perhaps a 100mn fit might do well for you?
I do run the 14km web, I'm working on my Hybrids at the moment then I want to grind up the cruiser skills, each is at 4 I believe
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Liang Nuren
Heretic Army Heretic Nation
2521
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Posted - 2013.01.01 21:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
Liam Inkuras wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:I'm confused why you'd try to roll with a 9km scram and 2 14km 90% webs...
-Liang The webs are more for GTFO ability than holding a target. Keeping them at bay while trying to escape is their main point besides snatching someone who is about to escape.
Suit yourself, but a long point would be better IMO. The scram isn't going to do a lot that the dual bonused webs doesn't already accomplish.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Kirkwood Ross
AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing
28
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Posted - 2013.01.01 21:40:00 -
[14] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:Liam Inkuras wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:I'm confused why you'd try to roll with a 9km scram and 2 14km 90% webs...
-Liang The webs are more for GTFO ability than holding a target. Keeping them at bay while trying to escape is their main point besides snatching someone who is about to escape. Suit yourself, but a long point would be better IMO. The scram isn't going to do a lot that the dual bonused webs doesn't already accomplish. -Liang
Liang has a point and heres why. If you have a disruptor and 2x -90% webs on them they still wont be going very fast even with the MWD on plus they'll have the sig bloom because of the MWD. |
Liam Inkuras
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
116
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Posted - 2013.01.01 22:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
Kirkwood Ross wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:Liam Inkuras wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:I'm confused why you'd try to roll with a 9km scram and 2 14km 90% webs...
-Liang The webs are more for GTFO ability than holding a target. Keeping them at bay while trying to escape is their main point besides snatching someone who is about to escape. Suit yourself, but a long point would be better IMO. The scram isn't going to do a lot that the dual bonused webs doesn't already accomplish. -Liang Liang has a point and heres why. If you have a disruptor and 2x -90% webs on them they still wont be going very fast even with the MWD on plus they'll have the sig bloom because of the MWD. I see both of your points, and Kirk, I did not think of that. That is a really good thought. |
Songbird
71
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Posted - 2013.01.02 01:19:00 -
[16] - Quote
a loki, it will hold you at 30 and shoot at you with artillery :P |
Batelle
Aliastra
101
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Posted - 2013.01.02 06:52:00 -
[17] - Quote
The main point of the vigiliant is that it combines some of the best strengths of brawlers in the cruiser-class with its punishing webs. People compare it to the abilities of the deimos or other brawlers but it really is a class above in terms of performance. A great example is if you put similar plated/neutron fits on both ships with 2x MFS and tanking rigs, you'll find that a vigilant with a 1600mm plate is more agile than a deimos with a 800mm plate. The vigilant will also have significantly more EHP, significantly more damage, a longer tackle range (long point vs scram), stronger tackle (90% webs are gg vs a ship that can easily put out 850 dps from blasters alone), and last but not least, the vigilant gets a full free midslot for ECCM or other utility.
My point is, while faction cruisers die just as well as any other ship, they simply have superior performance in a number of areas. They're far enough ahead of HACs that the t1 cruiser rebalance doesn't really threaten their place. In some situations that performance is worth the extra price tag. The Golem - The "Meh" of Marauders |
Xuixien
Rifterlings Damu'Khonde
216
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Posted - 2013.01.05 11:08:00 -
[18] - Quote
Another Vigilant. Everyone vs Everyone Xuixien - Space Cat, Queen of Rens |
Christine Peeveepeeski
The Imperial Fedaykin
216
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Posted - 2013.01.05 11:25:00 -
[19] - Quote
Nano vigilants, they still give me nightmares....... |
Verity Sovereign
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
348
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Posted - 2013.01.05 11:46:00 -
[20] - Quote
How does the Ashimmu counter? They've got equal webbing power, so the speed difference is going to be miniscule.
The vigilant's equivalent of 8.75 blaster turrets (with 50% increased falloff) is going to easily out DPS the Ashimmu's 6x pulse turrets.
However, the Vigilant needs cap to fire, and the ashimmu has 3 utility slots, allowing it to fit 3 neuts/nos, that have the neuting/nos power of 5.25 neut/nos.
It should easily be able to cap out the vigilant, and then the vigilant's DPS falls to just its drones
Each medium neut will neutralize 180*1.75 = 315 cap It costs 150* .75 (energy emissions means a 25% reduction at lvl 5)= 112.5 cap Neutralizes 202.5 more cap than it costs each cycle, or nearly 3x as much cap as it cost to activate.
Ashimmu cap = 1830 *1.25=2287.5 the vigi's cap is 1545*1.25 (skills)= 1931.25
1931.25/315= 6.13 cycles of a medium neut to cap it out. Basically, after 2 cycles of 3 neuts, the vigilant's cap is gone
While the ashimmu has only used 6*112.5= 675 of 2287.5 cap
It seems viable to me. The given the better cap/second on the ashimmu, and that each neut kills 2.8x as much cap as it costs to use... it seems that the ashimmu should be able to put the vigilant dead in the water pretty quickly |
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Maeltstome
Mentally Assured Destruction
246
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Posted - 2013.01.05 14:31:00 -
[21] - Quote
Songbird wrote:a loki, it will hold you at 30 and shoot at you with artillery :P Also - vs a passive fit every active tanker pretty much if I'm not mistaken, ASB's are a ***** , or you're theirs , not sure which one hehehe
Load null. |
Wacktopia
Noir. Black Legion.
404
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Posted - 2013.01.05 23:31:00 -
[22] - Quote
Tom K'rathma wrote:I am currently piloting a Vigilant, nasty little bugger isn't it ^-^ I'm going to want to use it on small gang roams and MAYBE the odd bit of 1v1, and I just really would like to know what to watch out for, I've run it against a Tempest Fleet, got under its guns and grounded away at the tank, and I seems like it can tank well. (Sarcastic/humerous/witty replies are welcome)
Two vigilants? :) The bottom line is that now I have one of those annoying signatures. |
Songbird
76
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Posted - 2013.01.06 00:47:00 -
[23] - Quote
Maeltstome wrote:Songbird wrote:a loki, it will hold you at 30 and shoot at you with artillery :P Also - vs a passive fit every active tanker pretty much if I'm not mistaken, ASB's are a ***** , or you're theirs , not sure which one hehehe Load null.
The fit he had posted has no TE or TC. Null without these gives you about 19(with neutrons) km range at the end of falloff. At 30 you might get a glancing might not.
With 2 TE 30 will be the end of your falloff. But you know , I don't even need to spend freaking 500 mil to counter a vigilant. I'm thinking a cyclone as a brawler or a talos(if you don't get caught in an over heated web) .... yeah you should be able to kill it with a ship that's 1/5th it's price. |
Batelle
Aliastra
110
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Posted - 2013.01.06 00:52:00 -
[24] - Quote
Verity Sovereign wrote:How does the Ashimmu counter?
Simple, if the Vigilant has a cap booster then the Ashimmu will die horribly, but might be able to temporarily neut out the vigilant long enough to break tackle.
If the vigilant doesn't have a cap booster, it will die if it gets caught, but a Vigilant w/o a cap booster will avoid engaging the ashimmu at all costs in the first place because it is such a weakness.
However, if you're facing a Vigilant, you should just assume it has a cap booster (if you don't see eccm, sebo, or shield-fit). [url]https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=65340[/url] |
Verity Sovereign
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
350
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Posted - 2013.01.06 01:14:00 -
[25] - Quote
Since the Ashimmu has the same number of mids, it could fit a cap booster as well, and since for every unit of cap it boosts, it can neut 3 units of cap from the vigilant... meta 4 medium cap boosters cycle at the same rate as medium cap neuts... And of course, its cap reserve is larger and its recharge rate is better
The vigilant should basically only be getting 1 shot off every 12 seconds... and should be taking hits with its hardeners off fairly often. Its prop mod and web will be off, so the Ashimmu will dictate range, and the vigi's shots it does get off will be in falloff.
I don't see the vigilant being able to beat it 1v1, the ashimmu should easily be able to turn the point off and get away, worst case 1v1 scenario. So the vigi dies or drives it off, but doesn't get the kill if he's solo |
Solotta Erquilenne
1
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Posted - 2013.01.06 05:50:00 -
[26] - Quote
Good point, the ashimmu would quickly overwhelm the cap booster of the vigilant and kill it. That said, hardeners won't have any effect, since if he has a hardener at all it'll only be explosive. ECM drones could ruin your day. |
Jerick Ludhowe
The Nyan Cat Pirates
335
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Posted - 2013.01.06 13:30:00 -
[27] - Quote
chris elliot wrote:Any of the rebranded T1 combat cruisers, if flown and fit properly can easily kill you or give you a run for your money.
Shouldn't stop you from enjoying the ship though. :)
To the eve-o forum community... Please excuse the quoted poster above as he is experiencing severe delusions.
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Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
439
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Posted - 2013.01.06 14:29:00 -
[28] - Quote
Maeltstome wrote:Something i haven't tried on a vigilant is a Dual-pro XL-ASB fit with lots of damage/tracking in the lows and resist rigs. If you are going to brawl you need an AB... but it doesnt have the slots for ab/mwd/web/scram/asb - perhaps a 100mn fit might do well for you?
Shield blaster ship, best blaster ship. But you can try it with lol Reactive hardener, you'll be a demi god using that one |
Denuo Secus
131
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Posted - 2013.01.06 16:12:00 -
[29] - Quote
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:...Shield blaster ship, best blaster ship....
I never understood this argumentation, care to elaborate? Maybe I'm missing something here...but if a shield blaster ship wants to fit said modules it has to sacrifice tank. Granted, Caldari blaster ships have an inbuilt hardener which gives them one additional slot...but I still cannot imagine how to fit dual prop and/or web + tackle without gimping the tank way to much.
A blaster ship needs to get close. Tank is important here. But tanked, a shield blaster ships gives up some of its ability to dictate range. This isn't a problem in gangs maybe...
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Verity Sovereign
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
353
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Posted - 2013.01.08 09:18:00 -
[30] - Quote
Solotta Erquilenne wrote:Good point, the ashimmu would quickly overwhelm the cap booster of the vigilant and kill it. That said, hardeners won't have any effect, since if he has a hardener at all it'll only be explosive. ECM drones could ruin your day.
Meh, I just realize the Ashimmu has a really tiny drone bay... 2x Warrior IIs hitting its explosive hole wont be doing much, you are right.
I wonder how often the Ashimmu would be jammed, that is a good point |
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