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Nicholai Crendraven
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.01.09 18:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
Running into a couple ice fields full of around 30+ Mackinaws that I'm 99.9% sure were all bots peaked my curiosity about ganking them. I haven't had much experience in PvP though so I was looking for some suggestions.
Whats the best ship / setup to get into for 1 or 2 alts to be able to suicide gank Macks that only takes 2-3 days to train into? I'm really looking for like 2 ships that could alpha a Mack. This way you wouldn't have to worry about Concord response / system sec status. Or if this isn't possible for just a couple days of training, how long would it take for 1 or 2 alts to be in a fit to alpha a Mack?
Thanks in advance!
Edited with additional question:
I was looking for something with a high alpha to take out fast if concord was already in the system from a gank. I read another post about just taking a rookie ship to the other side of the system to cause trouble just to drag concord over there. After they are gone from the gank site does it take the same amount of time to get there as if they weren't in the system at all? Or are they going to get there faster until you wait long enough for them to completely leave / despawn or whatever? |
Capt Starfox
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
254
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Posted - 2013.01.09 18:33:00 -
[2] - Quote
I think you're talking BS which takes ..months, right? I don't think people Alpha Macks, could be wrong, but I haven't heard of it. Now Alpha Retrievers ...pre Miner Buff Patch is another story; probably more of Covetors now, you could definitely Alpha a Covetor. There are a lot of discussions on how to train and successfully gank a Mack all over the internets. |
Nicholai Crendraven
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.01.09 19:06:00 -
[3] - Quote
Well I may have been mistaken by asking for alpha... I was just unsure of the Concord mechanics when they are in the system, but upon further reading I don't think this will be an issue. I've seen several posts about Thorax or Catalyst solo ganking Macks.
Also I've seen several posts about Tornados tearing up multiple Macks before concordokken, they only take 4 days to get into. |
Capt Starfox
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
254
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Posted - 2013.01.09 20:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
Nice, good luck on your gank-fest |
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade Lost Obsession
434
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Posted - 2013.01.09 21:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
you're an idiot.
99.9% sure.
Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head. |
Nicholai Crendraven
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.01.09 22:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
sYnc Vir wrote:you're an idiot.
99.9% sure.
you're a bi*ch.
100% sure. |
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery Swift Angels Alliance
862
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Posted - 2013.01.09 22:51:00 -
[7] - Quote
Faeces given: 0%. Taking submissions for "Trinkets friendly Advice Column" via evemail or private convo in-game. Anonymity sorta guaranteed. http://www.localectomy.blogspot.com.au
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Aria Ta'Rohk
Chosen of New Eden
108
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Posted - 2013.01.09 23:17:00 -
[8] - Quote
Now everyone lets be civil. OP, I suggest 2 gank fit Catalysts. Magstabs in the lows and the biggest blasters you can fit up top. Should be enough to take out a Mack before concordokken is brought down upon you I'll take 2 carebears to go, with extra tears |
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ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1917
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Posted - 2013.01.10 00:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
Removed an off topic post.
Also, please do not attempt to bypass the word filter. Thank you. ISD Dorrim Barstorlode Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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Capt Starfox
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
254
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Posted - 2013.01.10 02:50:00 -
[10] - Quote
Aria Ta'Rohk wrote:Now everyone lets be civil. OP, I suggest 2 gank fit Catalysts. Magstabs in the lows and the biggest blasters you can fit up top. Should be enough to take out a Mack before concordokken is brought down upon you We're dealing with Crybears who feel entitled to not be bothered with stuff like pushing buttons or watching a screen... they wont be civil if threatened of losing their special little entitlement as the posts above yours suggests. |
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Ares Desideratus
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
87
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Posted - 2013.01.10 04:49:00 -
[11] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:Faeces given: 0%. You clearly gave enough faeces to make a post about it. I'm an ignorant non-believer and I live in my grandma's garage. When people see things differently, misunderstandings happen. Everybody wins when you blob PvP! |
Ohishi
Apocalypse Reign
4
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Posted - 2013.01.10 05:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
Smart bomb the whole lot of them
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Cynthia Nezmor
Nezmor's Golden Griffins
106
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Posted - 2013.01.10 07:03:00 -
[13] - Quote
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode wrote:Removed an off topic post.
Also, please do not attempt to bypass the word filter. Thank you.
And posts like this are OK?
Trinkets friend wrote:Faeces given: 0%.
sYnc Vir wrote:you're an idiot.
99.9% sure.
Really?! |
Cynthia Nezmor
Nezmor's Golden Griffins
106
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Posted - 2013.01.10 07:03:00 -
[14] - Quote
Cynthia Nezmor wrote:ISD Dorrim Barstorlode wrote:Removed an off topic post.
Also, please do not attempt to bypass the word filter. Thank you. And posts like this are OK? Trinkets friend wrote:Faeces given: 0%. sYnc Vir wrote:you're an idiot.
99.9% sure.
Really?!
|
Styth spiting
Ion Corp. NightSong Directorate
278
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Posted - 2013.01.10 07:10:00 -
[15] - Quote
Nicholai Crendraven wrote: Whats the best ship / setup to get into for 1 or 2 alts to be able to suicide gank Macks that only takes 2-3 days to train into?
You do know that deleting characters because of low sec status, aka training characters for 1 - 2 days to gank with that you then delete is against CCP rules right? |
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade Lost Obsession
434
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Posted - 2013.01.10 14:14:00 -
[16] - Quote
Cynthia Nezmor wrote:ISD Dorrim Barstorlode wrote:Removed an off topic post.
Also, please do not attempt to bypass the word filter. Thank you. And posts like this are OK? Trinkets friend wrote:Faeces given: 0%. sYnc Vir wrote:you're an idiot.
99.9% sure.
Really?!
What a stupid question. If they weren't they would have been removed. Some people.
Cynthia at some point you'll have to stop being mad at us for not helping you or help SOTF or whatever idiotic reason us used to ***** about us. Time moves on, try doing the same.
I called him an idiot because anyone thats actually stupid enough to think all miners are bots, is clearly an idiot. Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head. |
jjohnpaul xvii
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
81
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Posted - 2013.01.10 15:41:00 -
[17] - Quote
Cant believe i'm actually saying this but I think Cynthia has a point. Seems a bit double standards. (Soz Trinket!)
OP you have an answer, give this a go. Im not 100% sure 2 gank cats will do it but have fun trying! Get as close as you can to the target before firing, overheat from the off, make sure you switch your safety settings off before you warp in. Good luck!
Aria Ta'Rohk wrote:Now everyone lets be civil. OP, I suggest 2 gank fit Catalysts. Magstabs in the lows and the biggest blasters you can fit up top. Should be enough to take out a Mack before concordokken is brought down upon you
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Batelle
Aliastra
113
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Posted - 2013.01.10 17:32:00 -
[18] - Quote
OP, you better scan those ships and calculate their EHP and exact resist profile, or you'll be losing isk and sec status for nothing. A Mack can be tanked out pretty easily.
In a high-sec highsec system, you'll have to alpha. In a low-sec highsec system (0.5-0.6) you'll want blaster dps. Fighting is Magic |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
409
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Posted - 2013.01.10 21:26:00 -
[19] - Quote
Nicholai Crendraven wrote:Well I may have been mistaken by asking for alpha... I was just unsure of the Concord mechanics when they are in the system, but upon further reading I don't think this will be an issue. I've seen several posts about Thorax or Catalyst solo ganking Macks, or at least easily in 2's.
Also I've seen several posts about Tornados tearing up multiple Macks before concordokken, they only take 4 days to get into. Ganknados are good, a rack of 8 1400mm guns is huge alfa but you will generally only fire once before concord shows up. Blaster fit Talos however can get two shoots off before Concord shows up. With the right fit a Talos will do more damage in its two shoots than a tornado will with its big alfa.
A properly fit max yield Mack can easily still have 20k ehp to burn through. A tanked Mack can have much more.
Using battlecruisers you will be over 100m per ship for the hull and fittings. You no longer get insurance payout if you get Concordokken. So yes two tornado's or Talos should have no problem ganking a Mack but will cost you well over 200m for each gank. The mack is probably worth more but you will not recoup you losses. Catalyst are much much much cheaper but fit a full rack of small guns not large guns like the tornado and talos. I think you need 4-5 catalsyts to match the DPS of one Talos but you can buy and fit them for only a couple mil. 5 cataysts with full T2 DPS fits would probably only cost 6-8mil. Catalysts were very popular for ganking miners before the mining ships got buffed. Now even a retriever will usually have over 10k ehp, close to 20 with a max tank fit.
A successful gank is not just killing the ship. At the vey least the kill mail needs to show a bigger loss for the one you ganked than what it cost you to gank them. It is all about the kill board. If you lost more isk in ship and fitting than you target was worth it will have a negative impact on your kill board. For example, you can gank any T1 mining barge with a Ganknado or Talos but you are lossing a +120M to gank a 30M ship you have a big net loss on the kill board. Most PVPers work hard to have their kill board positive as in they destroy more isk than they lose. As far as most PVPers are concerned any killmail that results in a net loss is a fail. Even if it is a gank. You need to destroy more assets than you lose.
When the GOONS were ganking miners they did it in a way that not only gave them a positive net balance on the killmail, but actually found a way so the loot and salvage dropped from the ships they used for the gank, combined with the loot and salvage of the target, added up to more than what they lost in the gank. As in they actually made a profit. The loot was worth more than they lost. After the changes to mining ships this was no longer possible. No miners are only ganked for luls not profit.
This is why the GOONS have moved on to ganking haulers and freighters. Last I read it cost the goons about 680 mil worth of ships and fittings to gank a freighter. I assume that is after accounting for the loot and salvage for their own lost ships and the salvage of the freighter. So if the loot that drops from the freighter is worth more than 680 mil they make a profit from gankng it. A good rule of thumb is that what ever a freighter has in its cargo you can expect 50% of that value in loot, often more than that. So any freighter with over 1.4 billion worth of stuff in its cargo is profitable to gank. Hense the rule of not hauling more than 1 bil of stuff in a freighter load. You would be surprised at how many freighters still undock from jita with 4 bil or more worth of stuff in their cargo. And they still wonder why they get ganked.
Anyways I have digressed enough. Ganking miners can no longer be done for profit. But it can still be done for luls. According to GOONS last I heard the blaster fit Talos was the best single ship ganker, while a fleet of Cataysts is the cheapest. Keep in mind you will only fire a couple shots at best. Faction ammo is cheap if you only need 16 rounds per ship. I doubt 2 cataysts will be enough to gank any exhumer, but maybe a poorly fit retriever or covetor. |
Mai Khumm
Carbon Circle Tactical Narcotics Team
409
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Posted - 2013.01.11 17:21:00 -
[20] - Quote
The best tool to learn how to gank...anything..is the test server...
You can learn everything you need to know through trial and error, and it won't cost anything at all...
My fav ship for ~untanked~ Mack ganking is the Moa, and in .5 systems you have 10secs to kill it... *insert witty saying here* |
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