Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 [30] 40 .. 40 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Tesal
234
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 20:43:00 -
[871] - Quote
The nullsec agenda is groupthink in action. |
Primary Me
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
35
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 20:51:00 -
[872] - Quote
flakeys wrote:What i am trying to point out is that ... it allways has been this way.Yet now the complaints are drasticly increasing in a time where income in null is higher then before.OW yes and i am talking about other alliances then goons , the small boohoo we haz no techmoons.I had a half year in syndicate recently as i like to enjoy high/low and null at times .. i can tell you i made a SHITLOAD more then in the ''yearly years'' doing plexing and that's with allmost exclusively neuts passing every few minutes .More then enough to cover any ''jumpfreightercost'' to get my **** up.And i was so happy to get my jumpfreighter jumping in , it made me think of the times i was in ASCN and had to fly my freighter 20 jumps through low-sec with no or hardly any escort.
In short there has been stufff added specifically for this , jumpfreighters and jumpbridges.So yes sure let's get industry in null up ... and immediatly get rid of jumpbridges and jumpfreighters.Ow no yes that's right , we want it all in our own pocket.Some of you guys should really try living solo in npc null again it might open your eyes to the luxury and ease you have there.
You lot remind me of a rich person complaining about the airco beyond a tad too loud when they are eating in their fancy restaurant while homeless jack outside is having the night of the week because he got a 1 dollar given to him from someone passing by.
You forgot how the game was or have never experienced it, your nothing different from a miner complaining that if he fits a tank his mined ore will go down per hour wich makes me want to shove a bantam under his ass and say ''hey dude this is how we did it and if you are lucky one day you can mine in the apoc ... ''.
It's not actually about the isk. Those asking for an industry rebalance are only asking to be able to earn the same amount of isk in null that their alts are currently earning in hi-sec; unfortunately it appears that to do this the isk earning potential of hi-sec will need to be lowered but that is a side issue to this.
What is hoped for is that an industry rebalance, together with sov and pos mechanic change will enable more conflict drivers to exist in null; larger populations doing more non-combat related activities will need more escorting/guarding which in turn will provide more targets, which will start the PvP food chain allowing PvP at all levels rather than just the huge fleet actions and sov grind that we currently have.
Imagine the effect of having various pieces of industry infrastructure that can be put out of action by a small roaming gang for a number of hours; losing a few hours of production occasionally is no big deal, but if it happens constantly the industrialists will demand action from the alliance PvPers, who will in turn have to start interdicting these roaming gangs, all of which is providing much needed content to null.
Null should be the place to make great riches, but at great risk. It should be where those that dare go to make, and possibly lose, their fortunes, with an emphasis on 'possibly lose'.
James 315 for CSM 8. A voice for hi-sec, a voice for reason. |
Tesal
234
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 20:59:00 -
[873] - Quote
Primary Me wrote:
It's not actually about the isk. Those asking for an industry rebalance are only asking to be able to earn the same amount of isk in null that their alts are currently earning in hi-sec; unfortunately it appears that to do this the isk earning potential of hi-sec will need to be lowered but that is a side issue to this.
What is hoped for is that an industry rebalance, together with sov and pos mechanic change will enable more conflict drivers to exist in null; larger populations doing more non-combat related activities will need more escorting/guarding which in turn will provide more targets, which will start the PvP food chain allowing PvP at all levels rather than just the huge fleet actions and sov grind that we currently have.
Imagine the effect of having various pieces of industry infrastructure that can be put out of action by a small roaming gang for a number of hours; losing a few hours of production occasionally is no big deal, but if it happens constantly the industrialists will demand action from the alliance PvPers, who will in turn have to start interdicting these roaming gangs, all of which is providing much needed content to null.
Null should be the place to make great riches, but at great risk. It should be where those that dare go to make, and possibly lose, their fortunes, with an emphasis on 'possibly lose'.
You are living in a fantasy world. The changes that are usually prescribed by the nullsec agenda people won't deliver what you are talking about.
|
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1203
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 21:01:00 -
[874] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Many of the issues regarding null industry could be eliminated with updating POSs. Really that should be more of a priority then fixing Dominion at this point. Since it could allow corps/alliances in npc null/WH to build up in preparation for sov null. Also I feel POSs are in worse shape then Sov is.
So I take it you are in favor of massively increased costs for using the high sec slots then.
Actually I'm but on a tiered scale.
Don't Vote for Malcanis
New Eden Training Simulation. -áIdea to improve NPE. |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1786
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 21:32:00 -
[875] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:baltec1 wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Many of the issues regarding null industry could be eliminated with updating POSs. Really that should be more of a priority then fixing Dominion at this point. Since it could allow corps/alliances in npc null/WH to build up in preparation for sov null. Also I feel POSs are in worse shape then Sov is.
So I take it you are in favor of massively increased costs for using the high sec slots then. Actually I'm but on a tiered scale. Please define
"tiered scale" We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1203
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 21:44:00 -
[876] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:baltec1 wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Many of the issues regarding null industry could be eliminated with updating POSs. Really that should be more of a priority then fixing Dominion at this point. Since it could allow corps/alliances in npc null/WH to build up in preparation for sov null. Also I feel POSs are in worse shape then Sov is.
So I take it you are in favor of massively increased costs for using the high sec slots then. Actually I'm but on a tiered scale. Please define "tiered scale"
Pretty much as its stated. Installation Cost and price per hour goes up based off of tier level and depending on the item type(mods cost less to build then ships).
Don't Vote for Malcanis
New Eden Training Simulation. -áIdea to improve NPE. |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1786
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 21:54:00 -
[877] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:baltec1 wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Many of the issues regarding null industry could be eliminated with updating POSs. Really that should be more of a priority then fixing Dominion at this point. Since it could allow corps/alliances in npc null/WH to build up in preparation for sov null. Also I feel POSs are in worse shape then Sov is.
So I take it you are in favor of massively increased costs for using the high sec slots then. Actually I'm but on a tiered scale. Please define "tiered scale" Pretty much as its stated. Installation Cost and price per hour goes up based off of tier level and depending on the item type(mods cost less to build then ships). So the cost per hour would be less for example to build a shuttle, than to build a battleship for instance? We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1203
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 21:59:00 -
[878] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:
So the cost per hour would be less for example to build a shuttle, than to build a battleship for instance?
If you want to break it down that far sure. Don't Vote for Malcanis
New Eden Training Simulation. -áIdea to improve NPE. |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1786
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 22:09:00 -
[879] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Frying Doom wrote:
So the cost per hour would be less for example to build a shuttle, than to build a battleship for instance?
If you want to break it down that far sure. I like to be clear and I do like to hear new ideas. We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
baltec1
Bat Country
5576
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 22:10:00 -
[880] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Frying Doom wrote:
So the cost per hour would be less for example to build a shuttle, than to build a battleship for instance?
If you want to break it down that far sure.
So we would have the same issues as we do now with most things. |
|
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1203
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 22:34:00 -
[881] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Frying Doom wrote:
So the cost per hour would be less for example to build a shuttle, than to build a battleship for instance?
If you want to break it down that far sure. So we would have the same issues as we do now with most things.
That would depend on how much the values are set. You can't expect it to work on all items without killing off new players ability to produce.
Though I would like to hear what you would want, since any idea you seem to shoot down as not good enough.
Don't Vote for Malcanis
New Eden Training Simulation. -áIdea to improve NPE. |
baltec1
Bat Country
5577
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 00:19:00 -
[882] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:
Though I would like to hear what you would want, since any idea you seem to shoot down as not good enough.
Simply more slots in null. The station owner can set the charge to run them, much like the repair services. |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1788
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 00:23:00 -
[883] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:
Though I would like to hear what you would want, since any idea you seem to shoot down as not good enough.
Simply more slots in null. The station owner can set the charge to run them, much like the repair services. I myself would prefer the charge to act as an isk sink and subsequently preventing outpost owners with no running costs from charging little for the slots and being able to massively undercut POS owners and NPC station users.
With that ability the whole system would just collapse and we would have exactly what we have now but favouring outpost owners instead of NPC facility users. We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
baltec1
Bat Country
5577
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 00:26:00 -
[884] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:
With that ability the whole system would just collapse and we would have exactly what we have now but favouring outpost owners instead of NPC facility users.
We are literally talking about saving a few thousand per run if the outpost owners chose to charge nothing. You seriously think that will lead to a collape of NPC station use? |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1792
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 01:21:00 -
[885] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Frying Doom wrote:
With that ability the whole system would just collapse and we would have exactly what we have now but favouring outpost owners instead of NPC facility users.
We are literally talking about saving a few thousand per run if the outpost owners chose to charge nothing. You seriously think that will lead to a collape of NPC station use? In comparison to the expense of POS facilities? We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
893
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 03:25:00 -
[886] - Quote
Kane Alvo wrote:I know I'm right, along with a great many others. Null bears are calling for CCP intervention to fix their industry woes, when they should be doing it themselves. Instead, you're all content to roam your sovereign space, blue your neighbors, and whine about what you don't have. There's nothing stopping you from setting up trade agreements with other alliances, creating trade hubs, or any number of things....including going to war and expanding your territory for access to more industry options.
Yes, POSs need to be fixed. Yes, corp roles need fixed. Yes, you probably do need more industry slots. But the calls to be fully independent of high sec T1 production are ludicrous. The calls for "we should have access to everything without logistics" are equally stupid. And there's no reason to nerf other areas of space just so you can all feel like special snowflakes for 5 minutes until you find something else to whine about.
yes i agree completely. also faction war should never have been "fixed" by ccp. all the people in it were just whining for fixes and what they didn't have. there are no problems whatsoever with eve online and anyone who points one out is just trying for a handout.
hahaha this whole time those stupid nullseccers could have been 'setting up trade agreements with neighbors', 'expanding their territory' and 'creating trade hubs' which would have solved all their problems in some nebulous fashion because of the emergent gameplay |
Tesal
235
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 03:35:00 -
[887] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:Kane Alvo wrote:I know I'm right, along with a great many others. Null bears are calling for CCP intervention to fix their industry woes, when they should be doing it themselves. Instead, you're all content to roam your sovereign space, blue your neighbors, and whine about what you don't have. There's nothing stopping you from setting up trade agreements with other alliances, creating trade hubs, or any number of things....including going to war and expanding your territory for access to more industry options.
Yes, POSs need to be fixed. Yes, corp roles need fixed. Yes, you probably do need more industry slots. But the calls to be fully independent of high sec T1 production are ludicrous. The calls for "we should have access to everything without logistics" are equally stupid. And there's no reason to nerf other areas of space just so you can all feel like special snowflakes for 5 minutes until you find something else to whine about.
yes i agree completely. also faction war should never have been "fixed" by ccp. all the people in it were just whining for fixes and what they didn't have. there are no problems whatsoever with eve online and anyone who points one out is just trying for a handout. hahaha this whole time those stupid nullseccers could have been 'setting up trade agreements with neighbors', 'expanding their territory' and 'creating trade hubs' which would have solved all their problems in some nebulous fashion because of the emergent gameplay
Hi-sec industry isn't factional warfare, its been around for 10 years. It was designed to have a low barrier to entry easy accessibility so that anyone could do it, much like PI has a low barrier to entry. It's "working as intendedGäó".
|
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
893
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 03:39:00 -
[888] - Quote
Factional warfare is also a low barrier to entry. |
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
893
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 03:40:00 -
[889] - Quote
actually i can't tell what's going on with your post i'll just assume it's rubbish |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
1203
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 03:43:00 -
[890] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:baltec1 wrote:Frying Doom wrote:
With that ability the whole system would just collapse and we would have exactly what we have now but favouring outpost owners instead of NPC facility users.
We are literally talking about saving a few thousand per run if the outpost owners chose to charge nothing. You seriously think that will lead to a collape of NPC station use? In comparison to the expense of POS facilities?
POS expenses aren't that high, really. Not when you break it down. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
|
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3546
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 03:45:00 -
[891] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:Kane Alvo wrote:I know I'm right, along with a great many others. Null bears are calling for CCP intervention to fix their industry woes, when they should be doing it themselves. Instead, you're all content to roam your sovereign space, blue your neighbors, and whine about what you don't have. There's nothing stopping you from setting up trade agreements with other alliances, creating trade hubs, or any number of things....including going to war and expanding your territory for access to more industry options.
Yes, POSs need to be fixed. Yes, corp roles need fixed. Yes, you probably do need more industry slots. But the calls to be fully independent of high sec T1 production are ludicrous. The calls for "we should have access to everything without logistics" are equally stupid. And there's no reason to nerf other areas of space just so you can all feel like special snowflakes for 5 minutes until you find something else to whine about.
yes i agree completely. also faction war should never have been "fixed" by ccp. all the people in it were just whining for fixes and what they didn't have. there are no problems whatsoever with eve online and anyone who points one out is just trying for a handout. hahaha this whole time those stupid nullseccers could have been 'setting up trade agreements with neighbors', 'expanding their territory' and 'creating trade hubs' which would have solved all their problems in some nebulous fashion because of the emergent gameplay Nerf emergent gameplay. Unless it's emerging from NPCs or better yet actors with QA shield extenders to quadruply make sure nothing ever goes off track.
And then bugs occur. Sometimes players occur, but you can stomp on those more easily. I am a nullsec zealot. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
4288
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 05:32:00 -
[892] - Quote
Kane Alvo wrote:of all the CSM candidates, he is the only one advocating for emergent, aka player-generated content. Which in my opinion, is something those of you in null sec should be doing...creating your own content instead of asking for handouts. No, we're asking to be able to create our own content. Clearly you haven't actually read anything we're saying...
Malcanis for CSM 8 Module activation timers are buggy - CCP please fix |
Kane Alvo
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry Templis Dragonaors
60
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 05:38:00 -
[893] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:Factional warfare is also a low barrier to entry.
Apparently null sec's barrier to entry is too high for most of you? Caldari Militia -áGÿ£GÿàGÿP Psychotic Monk for CSM8 |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
4288
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 05:44:00 -
[894] - Quote
It's not so much a barrier as "wow this is completely pointless, what reason would anyone ever have to do this". Malcanis for CSM 8 Module activation timers are buggy - CCP please fix |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1796
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 06:21:00 -
[895] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Frying Doom wrote:baltec1 wrote:Frying Doom wrote:
With that ability the whole system would just collapse and we would have exactly what we have now but favouring outpost owners instead of NPC facility users.
We are literally talking about saving a few thousand per run if the outpost owners chose to charge nothing. You seriously think that will lead to a collape of NPC station use? In comparison to the expense of POS facilities? POS expenses aren't that high, really. Not when you break it down. Compared to the cost of NPC slots? We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1796
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 06:27:00 -
[896] - Quote
Tesal wrote:Benny Ohu wrote:Kane Alvo wrote:I know I'm right, along with a great many others. Null bears are calling for CCP intervention to fix their industry woes, when they should be doing it themselves. Instead, you're all content to roam your sovereign space, blue your neighbors, and whine about what you don't have. There's nothing stopping you from setting up trade agreements with other alliances, creating trade hubs, or any number of things....including going to war and expanding your territory for access to more industry options.
Yes, POSs need to be fixed. Yes, corp roles need fixed. Yes, you probably do need more industry slots. But the calls to be fully independent of high sec T1 production are ludicrous. The calls for "we should have access to everything without logistics" are equally stupid. And there's no reason to nerf other areas of space just so you can all feel like special snowflakes for 5 minutes until you find something else to whine about.
yes i agree completely. also faction war should never have been "fixed" by ccp. all the people in it were just whining for fixes and what they didn't have. there are no problems whatsoever with eve online and anyone who points one out is just trying for a handout. hahaha this whole time those stupid nullseccers could have been 'setting up trade agreements with neighbors', 'expanding their territory' and 'creating trade hubs' which would have solved all their problems in some nebulous fashion because of the emergent gameplay Hi-sec industry isn't factional warfare, its been around for 10 years. It was designed to have a low barrier to entry easy accessibility so that anyone could do it, much like PI has a low barrier to entry. It's " working as intendedGäó". Yes Pi is a great example, It costs more to do when you use an NPC POCO than it does when you use your own. With NPC taxes just like NPC station slots should.
Maybe that is the answer a Tax similar to the PI tax on the cost of the finished product. We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
baltec1
Bat Country
5578
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 10:25:00 -
[897] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote: In comparison to the expense of POS facilities?
POS need an utter rework, but thats not going to happen untill at least all the ships have been teircided. Keeping the fix as simple as possible would mean a much quicker fix for null sec industry as far as slots go. |
Felicity Love
STARKRAFT
317
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 10:30:00 -
[898] - Quote
Double the numbers of slots in Null... maybe even buff the slot's production speed, too.... less "red tape", fewer "middle management"... call it what you will, just frikkin' do it.
March Break, best break... ciao.
Proud Beta Tester for "Bumping Uglies for Dummies" |
baltec1
Bat Country
5578
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 10:43:00 -
[899] - Quote
Felicity Love wrote:Double the numbers of slots in Null... maybe even buff the slot's production speed, too.... less "red tape", fewer "middle management"... call it what you will, just frikkin' do it.
March Break, best break... ciao.
That wouldn't be enough. To give you an idea of how bad it is there are 5 systems in high sec with more slots than all of null sec combined.
Right now I would settle for 50% of highsecs number of slots and see how it goes from there. |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1809
|
Posted - 2013.03.11 12:01:00 -
[900] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Frying Doom wrote: In comparison to the expense of POS facilities?
POS need an utter rework, but thats not going to happen untill at least all the ships have been teircided. Keeping the fix as simple as possible would mean a much quicker fix for null sec industry as far as slots go. Actually the alterations to POS are mostly altering some percentages and fixing a couple of security holes. Not much is really needed to make them less of a torture device.
No it is unlikely CCP will ever actually bother fixing them properly so there is not much need to ask for that.
So a cost per usage for outposts and NPC facilities An increase in Outpost slots An alteration to POS refinery numbers A pos security fix A Pos hanger fix
And done
Bugger all really. We all thought CSM 6 was a war crime with it's massive Null Presence CSM7 topped it by selling out our Council to CCP, don't let it happen again. Vote or next time Incarna is your fault Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 [30] 40 .. 40 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |