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Zlake
Happpy Fun times
10
|
Posted - 2013.04.20 08:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
The game is expanding, there is more players than ever before.
Low seec missions They are almost useless in terms of risk vs reward compared to their HS counter parts. FW are nice since they can be blitz in a stealth bomber and yield about 14k LP per mission with high LP to isk. Missions are other words ulseless in terms of risk vs reward. I don't see a way to fix this issue without removing lvl 4 missios from HS. No one really wants that so Ill leave it at that. Adding more isk for the low sec counterpart would be more of an issue than a fix. Low sec exploration Its mmeh. Terms of isk per hour its maybe maybe on par with lvl 3s. You make get lucky and get a pirate cruiser hull, a faction medium mod or medium faction tower. You can't really fix this without buffing null sec exploration so another stand still
Low sec mining Isk is ok. There is a lot of high yield ore in the belts. Only issue is you can't control the space as well as 0.0 Some fixes. Add more low sec space. This will allow more miners to have belts. Allow temp anchored warp bubbles. These can't be in line with a star gate or station. They should be unstable. So lasting about 1-3 hours before they need to be replaced. Boosters They need to be looked at again. Yeah they are good and all for what they do atm but there should be rare sites that offer the null sec gas. Maybe look into having them effect more systems than what they do now. Remove the High sec net between all regions This making it you must go through 1 to a few jumps of low sec to get between regions. The effects of this change There will be larger trade margins with region trading as not all traders would want to take the risk of traveling through low sec. People can use blockcade runners to preform trades To move larger loads it would require more team work (in a lot of cases more alts lol) Would make eve a more rough environment as it once was. Maybe even add some lvl 1,2 and maybe lvl 3 pirate faction agents. Not in stations. The ones sitting in space. This would make risk doing the agents as you can get ganked as you are talking to the agent. LP pay outs should only take in 0.0 [*] I'm not a fan of gate camping. There should be more than 1 route between empires. Some direct ones but there should be a GOOD number of indirect ways between empires. I hate gate camping and it is not real pvp. 30vs1 is not really a fight. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
8749
|
Posted - 2013.04.20 10:10:00 -
[2] - Quote
Zlake wrote:The game is expanding, there is more players than ever before.
Low seec missions
They are almost useless in terms of risk vs reward compared to their HS counter parts. Almost useless to you, maybe. Please vote for me for CSM8-áhere
My recommended voting list |
Litair
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
12
|
Posted - 2013.04.20 22:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Zlake wrote:The game is expanding, there is more players than ever before.
Low seec missions
They are almost useless in terms of risk vs reward compared to their HS counter parts. Almost useless to you, maybe.
He does have some valid points though, I think. Low sec really tends to be quite dead as soon you get a few jumps away from high sec, apart from your occasional -10 pirate cruising through, desperately looking for something to fight.
I'm guessing there's a reason why so few bother going there. Could be the things OP listed. |
Zlake
Happpy Fun times
11
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Posted - 2013.04.22 07:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
Not a lot of people do the low sec exploration as you can make about the same in HS missions. WHs need groups of people and you can find those in high sec and null. People that really do them tend to live in there |
Dark Drifter
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
69
|
Posted - 2013.05.28 10:11:00 -
[5] - Quote
OP has some good points:
LOWSEC missions need a good hike in LP payouts at least say about 20-30k per mission (L5s currently pay arounf 30-50k LP per mission)
Exploration LS specifically RADAR sites need need to drop small quantity's of bottle neck comps (serpentis is internal bulkheads) currently only found in null sec (null sec drop rates would also increase to compensate) |
Syreniac
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
10
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Posted - 2013.05.28 18:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
Personally, I think that the game should dynamically balance the rewards from all types of PVE content. If lots of people are missioning in Highsec, the game should increase the reward from missioning in low and null. If lots of people are ratting one type of rat, the game should decrease their bounties and boost those of other types.
It's always seemed strange to me that PVE exists in a sort of vacuum, where the actions of other players have reduced effects compared to more market driven methods of making ISK. If nothing else, the rewards from missioning for one corp should be reduced if there are lots of people missioning for that specific corp, even if the relative profitability is kept constant between high and low sec space. |
Laura Dexx
Fractional Warfare
28
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Posted - 2013.05.28 18:57:00 -
[7] - Quote
Dark Drifter wrote:OP has some good points:
LOWSEC missions need a good hike in LP payouts at least say about 20-30k per mission (L5s currently pay arounf 30-50k LP per mission)
Exploration LS specifically RADAR sites need need to drop small quantity's of bottle neck comps (serpentis is internal bulkheads) currently only found in null sec (null sec drop rates would also increase to compensate)
You seem to be talking out of your ass with these figures, but I'll concede that level 5s currently are pretty ****. You get ****** missions, you'll be making less than highsec level 4s at times. I'm looking at you, rogue drones and angel cartel. Right now, there's no real reason to do level 5s over just sitting in FW plexes, since they'll make you more money and you can do them with a stabbed / cloaky t1 frigate compared to the minimum triple box requirements of most level 5s if you want to clear them in any reasonable timeframe.
Never mind the ******* fact that there's an actual LIMIT to the amount of LP I can score per mission. Seriously, 97k for what could be up to 45 minutes of hard work? Have you seen this ******* LP store? Maybe I should just join the minmatar FW and sit in a triple stabbed cloaky breacher in the plentiful med plexes here. |
Dark Drifter
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
69
|
Posted - 2013.05.28 19:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
Laura Dexx wrote:Dark Drifter wrote:OP has some good points:
LOWSEC missions need a good hike in LP payouts at least say about 20-30k per mission (L5s currently pay arounf 30-50k LP per mission)
Exploration LS specifically RADAR sites need need to drop small quantity's of bottle neck comps (serpentis is internal bulkheads) currently only found in null sec (null sec drop rates would also increase to compensate) You seem to be talking out of your ass with these figures, but I'll concede that level 5s currently are pretty ****. You get ****** missions, you'll be making less than highsec level 4s at times. I'm looking at you, rogue drones and angel cartel. Right now, there's no real reason to do level 5s over just sitting in FW plexes, since they'll make you more money and you can do them with a stabbed / cloaky t1 frigate compared to the minimum triple box requirements of most level 5s if you want to clear them in any reasonable timeframe. Never mind the ******* fact that there's an actual LIMIT to the amount of LP I can score per mission. Seriously, 97k for what could be up to 45 minutes of hard work? Have you seen this ******* LP store? Maybe I should just join the minmatar FW and sit in a triple stabbed cloaky breacher in the plentiful med plexes here.
admitadly the last time i wan a L5 was over 2 expansions ago. and my lp payout for the mission was 42k lp took me ages to compleat. i was more getting at the fact that there is a big gap between current L4 pl payouts and L5s sticking low sec L4s somewhere inbetween thoe 2 figures mite be more inticing to mission runners. after all if 10-20 missions in low sec can get you the lp for that faction BS BPC you want then i would say that the risk to reward ratio is becoming more ballanced |
Uronksur Suth
Viziam Amarr Empire
30
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 00:14:00 -
[9] - Quote
Zlake wrote:The game is expanding, there is more players than ever before.
Low seec missions
They are almost useless in terms of risk vs reward compared to their HS counter parts. FW are nice since they can be blitz in a stealth bomber and yield about 14k LP per mission with high LP to isk. Missions are other words ulseless in terms of risk vs reward. I don't see a way to fix this issue without removing lvl 4 missios from HS. No one really wants that so Ill leave it at that. Adding more isk for the low sec counterpart would be more of an issue than a fix. Low sec exploration Its mmeh. Terms of isk per hour its maybe maybe on par with lvl 3s. You make get lucky and get a pirate cruiser hull, a faction medium mod or medium faction tower. You can't really fix this without buffing null sec exploration so another stand still
Low sec mining Isk is ok. There is a lot of high yield ore in the belts. Only issue is you can't control the space as well as 0.0 Some fixes. Add more low sec space. This will allow more miners to have belts. Allow temp anchored warp bubbles. These can't be in line with a star gate or station. They should be unstable. So lasting about 1-3 hours before they need to be replaced. Boosters They need to be looked at again. Yeah they are good and all for what they do atm but there should be rare sites that offer the null sec gas. Maybe look into having them effect more systems than what they do now. Remove the High sec net between all regions This making it you must go through 1 to a few jumps of low sec to get between regions. The effects of this change There will be larger trade margins with region trading as not all traders would want to take the risk of traveling through low sec. People can use blockcade runners to preform trades To move larger loads it would require more team work (in a lot of cases more alts lol) Would make eve a more rough environment as it once was. Maybe even add some lvl 1,2 and maybe lvl 3 pirate faction agents. Not in stations. The ones sitting in space. This would make risk doing the agents as you can get ganked as you are talking to the agent. LP pay outs should only take in 0.0 I'm not a fan of gate camping. There should be more than 1 route between empires. Some direct ones but there should be a GOOD number of indirect ways between empires. I hate gate camping and it is not real pvp. 30vs1 is not really a fight. That's absolutely insane. Why would the various empires ever, ever allow their trade routes to become unprotected criminal regions? It makes no sense at all. Even during wartime, trade has to continue to flow. There is no rational justification for this other than the fact that you don't like that some of us prefer high-sec. |
Mocam
EVE University Ivy League
276
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 06:19:00 -
[10] - Quote
It's tricky but your suggestions are weak in some areas.
The single biggest problem with PvE in the game is that it mostly rewards solo play better than group play and rewards doing things in safer space high enough that more dangerous places are unattractive on a cost-to-earnings sheet.
With a "penalties" model of loss, that distills down to "don't fly what you can't afford to lose" which naturally extends to having/earning more is better so you CAN afford more.
You need to convert risks to costs then apply the costs to earnings - this is "risk assessment" and a more comprehensive model shows that increasing traffic through lowsec will cost more than even doing level 2 missions out of highsec -- forcing losses or removal of content/rewards won't do anything but remove accounts from the game.
PvP is mostly groups bashing on smaller groups down to soloists. To balance it out, you need your earnings side to be more rewarding in groups operating in dangerous space so people travel in teams.
As for your other suggestions - blockade runners? Think on this a bit. No it won't work - PvP players are not morons and if you push them to change, they will change how they operate.
I knew someone who did this. They were on voice chat for their last successful run - they ran the same camp 3 times a day for 3 days and then that camp had a HIC out there. After the HIC was added, they didn't bother going back to their old stock methods - it worked *MUCH* better and that ended the hauling.
In a discussion on the topic, I asked a guy "can you build me a gate camp that *NOBODY* can get through?" - he replied; "Well yes, but it's not worth the effort..." -- that answer is both correct and incorrect but it did beg one question.
Q: WHEN is it worth the effort? A: When too many are getting through.
Increase traffic and you'll increase camps. Increase success of the camps and the traffic stops. Whereas it looks a bit like a catch-22, it's not but that took me a bit of thinking on "other ways of enabling..."
The only way traffic can flow is in groups large enough to actually stomp the hell out of camps by fitting and flying stuff capable of doing so and that means to reward teamwork more than you reward soloing -- *IN DANGEROUS SPACE* (and that sure as hell is *NOT* SOV lands nor "Incursions" in highsec -- reality check; putting people outside their safety zones is putting them at risk and few find operating in NPC low and null to be their "comfort zones" -- buff earnings there.).
BTW - the reason his answer was correct and incorrect... Yes, you can build an impassable gate camp to stop a soloist from getting through. You sure as hell can't build one to stop an equal or larger force from fighting through. So based upon how our conversation went - he was right. Based upon looking at it further - not quite.
Design it so that groups are needed and travel together and you eliminate a lot of valid concerns -- this means group earnings in dangerous space need a buff. F*** the soloists there. |
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Gritz1
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
176
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 15:31:00 -
[11] - Quote
Don't tell anyone, but I have been doing low sec missions in a quiet area. They are not useless, and shockingly, you have to pay attention a little bit, yet they pay off just like high sec. Get outta that comfort zone a little bit. |
Grarr Dexx
Snuff Box Urine Alliance
168
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 20:25:00 -
[12] - Quote
Gritz1 wrote:Don't tell anyone, but I have been doing low sec missions in a quiet area. They are not useless, and shockingly, you have to pay attention a little bit, yet they pay off just like high sec. Get outta that comfort zone a little bit.
For the amount of players or the quality of the ships they require, and the danger often involved, I'd like them to pay a little bit more than fuckin highsec level 4s. |
Oliver Stoned
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
10
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 22:41:00 -
[13] - Quote
Zlake wrote:The game is expanding, there is more players than ever before.
Low seec missions
They are almost useless in terms of risk vs reward compared to their HS counter parts. FW are nice since they can be blitz in a stealth bomber and yield about 14k LP per mission with high LP to isk. Missions are other words ulseless in terms of risk vs reward. I don't see a way to fix this issue without removing lvl 4 missios from HS. No one really wants that so Ill leave it at that. Adding more isk for the low sec counterpart would be more of an issue than a fix. Low sec exploration Its mmeh. Terms of isk per hour its maybe maybe on par with lvl 3s. You make get lucky and get a pirate cruiser hull, a faction medium mod or medium faction tower. You can't really fix this without buffing null sec exploration so another stand still
Pirates and griefers are going to love you!
Low sec mining Isk is ok. There is a lot of high yield ore in the belts. Only issue is you can't control the space as well as 0.0 Some fixes. Add more low sec space. This will allow more miners to have belts. Allow temp anchored warp bubbles. These can't be in line with a star gate or station. They should be unstable. So lasting about 1-3 hours before they need to be replaced. Boosters They need to be looked at again. Yeah they are good and all for what they do atm but there should be rare sites that offer the null sec gas. Maybe look into having them effect more systems than what they do now. Remove the High sec net between all regions This making it you must go through 1 to a few jumps of low sec to get between regions. The effects of this change There will be larger trade margins with region trading as not all traders would want to take the risk of traveling through low sec. People can use blockcade runners to preform trades To move larger loads it would require more team work (in a lot of cases more alts lol) Would make eve a more rough environment as it once was. Maybe even add some lvl 1,2 and maybe lvl 3 pirate faction agents. Not in stations. The ones sitting in space. This would make risk doing the agents as you can get ganked as you are talking to the agent. LP pay outs should only take in 0.0 I'm not a fan of gate camping. There should be more than 1 route between empires. Some direct ones but there should be a GOOD number of indirect ways between empires. I hate gate camping and it is not real pvp. 30vs1 is not really a fight.
============= Low seec missions Move level 5 missions to level 6 Insert level 5 missions to Low Sec versions of Level 4's. Higher payout.
Low sec exploration Pirates and griefers are going to love you!
Low sec mining Pirates and griefers are going to love you! EVEN MORE!!! |
yodayblack
Klima Technology Nyratic
10
|
Posted - 2013.06.01 22:07:00 -
[14] - Quote
I have run several low sec missions and i do agree they mosty suck the pay out isnt worth the risk. But making trade routes go through low sec would never work. The empires patrol those areas and they arent going to give them up anytime soon because that would be a loss of territory. What low sec needs is a reason to be there. FW has plexs that only show up in FW low sec, it gives people a reason to be there. Giving some missions for pirate factions would be somthing that could bring people into low sec to run missions to get enough LP for that pirate hull. But low sec as it is its not worth the risk when you can just run missions in high sec then buy the hull.
Low sec ore is a joke. Jaspet is pretty much worthless. Its huge, comes in limited amounts and you can make more in the same time mining veld. Now if jaspet was the only ore that gave zydrine.... there would be a huge reason to go into low. but you would have to take ore from null and everyone knows you cant touch anything in null sec because its "end game" blah blah blah. etc
Unless ccp is willing to make changes low sec will always be pirate havens and ghost towns.
Maybe let alliances stick up sov beacons in low. I know its a crazy idea but if you can claim the space your more likely to defend it. FW low sec has tons of fights because people are fighting to hold on to it. It means something to them. |
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