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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 32 post(s) |
Nexus Day
Lustrevik Trade and Travel Bureau
596
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Posted - 2013.05.04 14:36:00 -
[421] - Quote
Viceran Phaedra wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:So lets break it on down:
EVE Players: Give us new stuff in the game
(CCP gives new "never before seen in EVE" stuffs)
EVE Players: Noooooooo, we've never seen this before but we already know we don't like it, give us stuff that looks exactly like stuff we've seen a million times!!!
(CCP gives stuff seen millions of times before)
EVE Players: CCP is bad because they never give new stuff.
Conclusion: you couldn't pay me enough to work for ccp in any capacity where i had to look at any forum ever. Oh god. This thread. My sides. "It's different! I'm scared! I hate it! I have less than half the information but more than a whole opinion!" You precious little creatures. I'm looking forward to it. It's new content. It's something different. Now I can bring my Corp newbies along to help me catch cans while we chat on TS. They can have a cut of the lootz and do something inbetween having no SP and mining in a Venture. Win-win. Those of you who don't like it, get out of my sites. There is a difference between new content and new good content. Seems like you don't care but that doesn't mean others shouldn't.
I don't think the complaint is that it is different. The complaint is on the surface the idea sounds really bad. This thread has so much content it may be 'Thread of the Year' and it is only January.
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Manacubus
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.05.28 01:18:00 -
[422] - Quote
Have I wasted my time training this 30 day rangefinding skill?!?
Also, the idea that I train these skills for months only to scan down a site as easily as someone with far less investment in skills and then have the shiny loot disappear at the end is ******* DISGUSTING, and churns my stomach :( |
Manacubus
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.05.28 01:44:00 -
[423] - Quote
Andrea Griffin wrote:I'm sure that it will be balanced in a way that a solo explorer - which is the vast, vast majority of explorers - won't see their income drop in a significant way.
Can I please have some of whatever it is you're smoking? |
Vexidious
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
4
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Posted - 2013.05.28 02:48:00 -
[424] - Quote
Eve really doesn't seem like the right kind of game for a mechanic that can be described as "loot spew". DNF called. They said they want their devs back...
The worst part is that there doesn't seem to be any real point to the mechanic aside from giving players a reason to bring an alt along. I mean, it isn't like you're making any meaningful decisions aside from clicking on the shiny. There aren't good cans and bad cans; its just click, wait, click, wait. There is no thought, no skill, no decisions. That doesn't sound like a good mechanic to me.
Really, it doesn't even encourage group play, since the person tagging along can't even help with the hack - which is really the only part that seems to be even slightly interesting. This would need to be wildly profitable to make we want to tag along for this type of thing.
Really, I don't see any way to describe this change as anything other than utter failure. |
Dian Voken
Womp Rat Slayers United
0
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Posted - 2013.06.04 10:15:00 -
[425] - Quote
Viceran Phaedra wrote:
Those of you who don't like it, get out of my sites.
I couldn't agree more with this right here. If you don't like the changes that CCP is making to exploring then then simply don't explore.
No one is forcing you to be an explorer and if you feel that exploring is detracting from the core values of the game then don't support it by not participating in it (CCP knows how many people participate in the different professions and you better believe they'll be keeping a close eye on how many people participate in the revamped exploration profession).
As for the rest of us, we'll be better off because when TQ comes back up in a few hours there will be less competition for sites if you just back away from the new thing you don't agree with. |
Lea Severy
Squad Severy
2
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Posted - 2013.06.07 14:54:00 -
[426] - Quote
So much negativity in this thread.
The new mini-game mechanic for relic/data sites is absolutely awesome in my opinion. It creates a very real "link" to the actual skills that affect hacking/analyzing, since you really need some decent virus strength to not blow up every site you find. You can improve your own virus in several ways and even a strength of +10 can mean the difference between blowing it up or unlocking it.
But, logically considered, the scatter mechanic for the loot seems kind of unfitting. It's obvious that the idea behind this was getting more than one player into exploration sites, but the rest of the feature seems quite solo-style to me. If you implement a scatter mechanic then you should implement a coop hacking feature aswell. What is the guy with the lower hacking skills going to do the whole time? Just follow around the hacker and steal him some loot? If scanning the site itself was a little harder, or as hard as it was pre-odyssey, teaming up would still make sense - one guy scans, the other one hacks. But it really feels extremely solo-able in general except for the scattering mechanic.
Change this. The aim was to make exploration a valid profession from the beginning on. Exploration will be absolutely awesome if this gets fixed.
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Haulie Berry
946
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Posted - 2013.06.07 15:02:00 -
[427] - Quote
So I've spent the last two nights doing a lot of exploration in low and null sec.
When I first heard about the minigame in the FF presentation, I thought it was a thematically poor choice for Eve, but wasn't particularly upset about it otherwise.
Having spent a lot of time doing sites on both sisi and TQ now, though, I really quite like it.
First of all, the scatter mechanic is really not a problem. It basically provides a way to make it potentially valuable, but not necessary, to bring a friend along. I routinely get everything of value from the sites I hack, only losing an item here or there from the very richest (relic sites with 8+ salvage stacks, for instance). i'm pretty sure the people who dislike this mechanic are still cluelessly trying to grab every last can at random.
On average, I'm making significantly more from data sites and VASTLY more from relic sites. My run in low sec exceeded 100m isk per hour by a wide margin. Performance in null has been slightly lower (mainly due to a shortage of sites, and bugged sites) but still very high.
The minigame adds a mechanism that forces the explorer to be both exposed and distracted, which adds an element of risk that just wasn't present in the previous system, and the amount of time it takes is based on player interaction rather than whether or not the RNG favors your analyzer on this particular cycle. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
1155
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Posted - 2013.06.07 15:06:00 -
[428] - Quote
Haulie Berry wrote: On average, I'm making significantly more from data sites and VASTLY more from relic sites.
Per site or per hour? In w-space the time sink has increased 3 fold.
HTFU!...for the children! |
Haulie Berry
947
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Posted - 2013.06.07 15:11:00 -
[429] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Haulie Berry wrote: On average, I'm making significantly more from data sites and VASTLY more from relic sites.
Per site or per hour? In w-space the time sink has increased 3 fold.
Both per site and per hour. Previously, in low-sec, I completely ignored data and relic sites in favor of pursuing potential PHAT LEWT in DED sites. Now I'm doing the complete opposite, because the data and relic sites have had such consistently high output.
I can't comment on w-space. A friend of mine mentioned to me that the sleeper spawns have gotten much more difficult, but he also said that the loot they're getting from the sites is vastly better as well (which makes sense, since the loot tables were made MUCH more generous). |
AndromacheDarkstar
Zebra Corp Gentlemen's Agreement
772
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Posted - 2013.06.07 15:20:00 -
[430] - Quote
The new system is amazing.
The skills required are almost perfectly balanced allowing you to run null sites with skills at 4 without rigs but taking a bit more time, The mini game is allot of fun but very easy to understand. The loot income is fantastic and very well balanced for the work and risk. The Scatter mechanic adds an active challenge to the process and being able to see the names of cans allows you to pick and choose after cargo scanning. The whole process is involved and i have never enjoyed earning isk as much as i have from exploration since the changes. Join the ZC Pub chat channel today and talk about joining-áZebra corp, hands down the best PVP corp in EVE keeping CFC killboards in the green singlehandedly |
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cheese monkey
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
150
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Posted - 2013.06.07 16:51:00 -
[431] - Quote
Totally agree.
Hate the idea of chasing cans down and hate the new mini game.
This is internet spaceships.... not candy crush!! |
Gorgoth24
Sickology
5
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Posted - 2013.06.07 17:29:00 -
[432] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Hi everyone, thanks for the reams of feedback. We'll be releasing a devblog/devblogs over the next few days detailing exactly whats coming and how it works so you'll have a lot more information in your hands. I'm going to answer a few specific points that have come up a lot here though:
Colourblind People We're absolutely aware that we need to make the interface work for the colourblind. All the visuals at the moment are WIP. We have software internally that lets us simulate how the interface would look to you and are using that during development.
Soloing We are doing nothing to prevent people from soloing. We obviously cannot predict exactly how players will end up using this feature but there is no intention of making it impossible to solo explore and successfully make money from it. CCP RedDawn is a solo explorer and he'd be most upset if we took away his favourite activity!
Twitch Gameplay We totally understand your concerns about how the scattered can collection will work as it is a departure from how the rest of EVE works. The mechanic itself comes from a mining prototype developed by CCP Veritas and does work well within EVE as far as we can ascertain from our user testing of it. It's not a crazy clickfest as it will take several seconds to pull each can in. We are in a phase of playtesting and refining how long, how fast and how many cans will scatter. The 'twitch' side of it is no more than exists in EVE interacting with the UI now, the main difference is that you are interacting within the space scene itself.
I, for one, think this is a great way of allowing solo play while incentivizing group play. Tweaks are welcome, but I love this Idea.
Most of the hate seems to come from first-time explorers that don't like the system in relation with the rest of EVE. The feedback I've been getting from people who actively explored pre and post Odyssey is overwhelmingly positive, minus the crowding factor in high sec (which is also a good push factor into lowsec and good for EVE imo) |
Armtoe
Shadowland Rangers Eternal Syndicate
260
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Posted - 2013.06.07 17:56:00 -
[433] - Quote
cheese monkey wrote:Totally agree.
Hate the idea of chasing cans down and hate the new mini game.
This is internet spaceships.... not candy crush!!
I agree - I hate the new minigame. Eve is supposed to be about you against the other players in a sandbox. Hacking used to be just that - you would get to the can start hacking and spam ds while hoping that some other player is not sitting cloaked in the room with you. You had to keep one eye on the system and the other on the rats. You could even do it in a combat ship trying to bait folk to come on at you. Now the minigame pops up and places a large screen (which I cant figure out how to resize) across your monitor effectively disconnecting you from the rest of the game. Where you should be keeping an eye on your fellow players, now your playing whack a mole. Furthermore, given the nature of the minigame, you are effectively forced to use exploration ships, thus making the game more cookiecutter while rendering any attempt at baiting in a nonconventional ship obvious. |
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1575
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Posted - 2013.06.07 18:08:00 -
[434] - Quote
Gorgoth24 wrote:
I, for one, think this is a great way of allowing solo play while incentivizing group play. Tweaks are welcome, but I love this Idea.
Most of the hate seems to come from first-time explorers that don't like the system in relation with the rest of EVE. The feedback I've been getting from people who actively explored pre and post Odyssey is overwhelmingly positive, minus the crowding factor in high sec (which is also a good push factor into lowsec and good for EVE imo)
I've seen the exact opposite. CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE-á/ Dynamic New Eden |
Dokten Ral
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Get Off My Lawn
5
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Posted - 2013.06.07 18:19:00 -
[435] - Quote
Here's what I'll tell you mighty DevTeam: while I find the hacking minigame kinda frustrating, I no longer ignore Data sites immediately on finding them because of their lack of profit and the fact the the gameplay used to be shining my red flashlight at the can and alt-tabbing until it opened 10m later. |
Haulie Berry
953
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Posted - 2013.06.07 18:22:00 -
[436] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Gorgoth24 wrote:
I, for one, think this is a great way of allowing solo play while incentivizing group play. Tweaks are welcome, but I love this Idea.
Most of the hate seems to come from first-time explorers that don't like the system in relation with the rest of EVE. The feedback I've been getting from people who actively explored pre and post Odyssey is overwhelmingly positive, minus the crowding factor in high sec (which is also a good push factor into lowsec and good for EVE imo)
I've seen the exact opposite.
I was an avid explorer before, and I really like the new system, but I actually took the time to learn how it worked and spent a few hours using it before heading to the forum to ragequit.
They were obviously looking for a mechanism intended to make a system where solo explorers aren't penalized, but it isn't completely idiotic to bring a friend. So, they increased the loot, and gave us scatter containers. Since a solo explorer can grab most of the valuable loot most of the time, on average, they should be making more. Meanwhile, getting all of the loot all of the time requires two people.
It's still more efficient to explore solo, but it's not completely pants-on-head idiotic to bring a friend along. |
Killian Redbeard
Mindhead Cosmic Conditioning SoulWing Alliance
15
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Posted - 2013.06.07 18:29:00 -
[437] - Quote
Haulie Berry wrote: The minigame adds a mechanism that forces the explorer to be both exposed and distracted, which adds an element of risk that just wasn't present in the previous system, and the amount of time it takes is based on player interaction rather than whether or not the RNG favors your analyzer on this particular cycle.
In that case, should they change salvaging to be a mini game also? Eliminate the RNG in salvaging. Come up with a schematic of the ship you are salvaging and play Operation. Instead of the big red nose beeping when you touch the side, the ship blows up damaging yours.
Not impressed with the mini-game right now. Maybe they will improve it but don't care for it right now. I would have preferred, instead of putting a flat board game on my screen and you just click, that each of those nodes was a gate you had to unlock using the hacker/codebreaker. Kinda of like a maze. Multiple paths to get to the final room. Turn the firewalls into encounters with Sleeper AI.
Kinda of like in incursions where you have contest between fleets to get the site down, You would have multiple paths so fleets could take different directions to reach the reward. |
Haulie Berry
955
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Posted - 2013.06.07 18:32:00 -
[438] - Quote
Killian Redbeard wrote:Haulie Berry wrote: The minigame adds a mechanism that forces the explorer to be both exposed and distracted, which adds an element of risk that just wasn't present in the previous system, and the amount of time it takes is based on player interaction rather than whether or not the RNG favors your analyzer on this particular cycle.
In that case, should they change salvaging to be a mini game also? Eliminate the RNG in salvaging. Come up with a schematic of the ship you are salvaging and play Operation. Instead of the big red nose beeping when you touch the side, the ship blows up damaging yours. Not impressed with the mini-game right now. Maybe they will improve it but don't care for it right now. I would have preferred, instead of putting a flat board game on my screen and you just click, that each of those nodes was a gate you had to unlock using the hacker/codebreaker. Kinda of like a maze. Multiple paths to get to the final room. Turn the firewalls into encounters with Sleeper AI. Kinda of like in incursions where you have contest between fleets to get the site down, You would have multiple paths so fleets could take different directions to reach the reward.
Yeah, that's a great idea, if you ignore the painfully obvious fact that they were trying to add some non-combat-oriented content to exploration. |
Orpheus Sin
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.06.07 20:08:00 -
[439] - Quote
Two ideas
1. Relic Sites>> Mini-game where you actually get out of your ship and enter the structure/abandoned ship and have to scan and such throughout the ship. Perhaps have a FPS mini-game in exploration sites.
2. Hacking Sites>> I like the mini-game...perhaps get out of your ship and enter the structure/abandoned ship and hook up to a computer terminal or something.
Just ideas... |
Haulie Berry
966
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Posted - 2013.06.07 20:12:00 -
[440] - Quote
Orpheus Sin wrote:Two ideas
1. Relic Sites>> Mini-game where you actually get out of your ship and enter the structure/abandoned ship and have to scan and such throughout the ship. Perhaps have a FPS mini-game in exploration sites.
2. Hacking Sites>> I like the mini-game...perhaps get out of your ship and enter the structure/abandoned ship and hook up to a computer terminal or something.
Just ideas...
Yeah, they prototyped a get-out-of-your-ship thing, and they posted about it, and the tl;dr version of the post was, "Yeah, it's kinda cool. It's also not happening any time soon, if ever."
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2023395 |
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Staten Island
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2013.06.08 01:45:00 -
[441] - Quote
Anybody know whether sleepers were overlooked when npc were removed from hacking sites - or is it intentional for them to still be there? |
Elliavir
Miskatonic Mercantile
1
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Posted - 2013.06.08 05:05:00 -
[442] - Quote
New mini-game to actually hack into the system is fine. I'd rather see 2 different mini-games, because it's kind of non-immersive to be digging up artifacts by exactly the same mechanism used to break into computer systems, but maybe that is planned for later.
New loot pinata is not - to the point that it turns me off from hacking altogether. I've spent 2 days doing the training tutorials and doing some sites to see if I just was missing the point, and no... I just really don't want to play Super Mario Galaxy.
I'll check back in a few weeks to see if the system changes. If not, I have an alt with level 5 skills that is going to be very permanently unemployed. |
Iszi
Martyr's Vengence Test Alliance Please Ignore
18
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Posted - 2013.06.08 05:46:00 -
[443] - Quote
When I saw this on the fanfest twitch stream, I thought:
Well there's one thing I have NO interest in.
And I felt a little disappointed that I would never get the chance to perfect scanning/hacking/archaeology before it was dumbed down.
Ah well. I hope CCP doesn't disregard it's long term players for the fickle big money crowd. |
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CCP Bayesian
847
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:49:00 -
[444] - Quote
Staten Island wrote:Anybody know whether sleepers were overlooked when npc were removed from hacking sites - or is it intentional for them to still be there?
Intentional. :) EVE Software Engineer Team Prototyping Rocks |
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The Shadowman
The Xyndicate
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 11:18:00 -
[445] - Quote
How about some drones to collect the loot for us? |
Bubanni
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
699
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Posted - 2013.06.08 12:43:00 -
[446] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Staten Island wrote:Anybody know whether sleepers were overlooked when npc were removed from hacking sites - or is it intentional for them to still be there? Intentional. :)
Digital Circuitry - Data Site... is this intentional that it hasn't been changed? it still has rats, gates and everything... it's in sansha space... I filled a bug report. Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934 |
Bubanni
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
699
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Posted - 2013.06.08 12:44:00 -
[447] - Quote
Bubanni wrote:CCP Bayesian wrote:Staten Island wrote:Anybody know whether sleepers were overlooked when npc were removed from hacking sites - or is it intentional for them to still be there? Intentional. :) Digital Circuitry - Data Site... is this intentional that it hasn't been changed? it still has rats, gates and everything... it's in sansha space... I filled a bug report.
also, you should really consider seeding some data/relic sites in drone space. Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934 |
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CCP Bayesian
847
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Posted - 2013.06.08 13:08:00 -
[448] - Quote
Thanks for any and all bug reports it makes tracking problems down much easier. We're actually going to do a pass on the distribution and loot for the next release. EVE Software Engineer Team Prototyping Rocks |
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Salpun
Paramount Commerce
506
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Posted - 2013.06.08 13:17:00 -
[449] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Thanks for any and all bug reports it makes tracking problems down much easier. We're actually going to do a pass on the distribution and loot for the next release. Release as in 1.1 or 1.0.4? |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
1156
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Posted - 2013.06.08 13:24:00 -
[450] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Staten Island wrote:Anybody know whether sleepers were overlooked when npc were removed from hacking sites - or is it intentional for them to still be there? Intentional. :)
Would have been nice for the FF presentation to allude to that. We could have stocked up on relics, datacores and decryptors due to shortages because frankly the time sink is too big in the same way our k-space counterparts dumped their stockpiles due to the ease of access and soon to be overabundance. HTFU!...for the children! |
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