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Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
0
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:01:00 -
[1] - Quote
Not so long ago, CCP stated quite unambiguously that they intended to start putting content for all playstyles into their expansions - including content for solo/casual players, who whether you like them or loathe them make up a significant percentage of the playerbase (and hence CCP's income).
Now fanfest is done presumably we've had most if not all the Odyssey content announcements, and I just wanted to review to see where the new content for solo/casual players actually is.
Resource redistribution: no ring mining, no ninja stealing of other people's moon goo, just the same old mechanic but with a bit of a change to what you can get, what you can do with it, and where the bottlenecks are. Nothing NEW here, nothing valuable to solo/casual players.
POS improvements: no modular POS (not even a start on this), just cleaning up some of the more glaring issues with the existing system. Again, nothing NEW, and very limited value to solo/casual players.
New ships: Well sure, we're getting new ships. But sh!t, how many ships do we already have? I know I haven't flown even a fraction of them, so adding more, and with no new features to them (no new T3's, just combat ships)? Adds very little value in my opinion. The Gnosis might be a cool addition, but if it's a one-time free gift it will just end up left in hangar gathering dust.
Scanning changes: whoopy-do, we no longer have to press a button to see what anoms are in system. And we get a flashy line going across the screen when we undock. Saving probe formations and multiple probe launch is nice for sure, but this is just very small quality of life tweaks ("little things") not significant new content.
Ore/Ice Site Changes: moving to anomalies, ice depletion, changes to ore mineral content: iteration, balance, good for null industry sure, but nothing new.
Exploration Mini-Games: Whether this adds content for solo players or not depends on what CCP are going to do to loot drops from the new exploration sites with this mini-game. If loot drops remain the same as they were, but spread out between dozens of dropped cans that a solo player can't possibly gather all of, then it's a nerf to solo/casual gameplay. If loot drops change radically, with chances of finding nice goodies that couldn't be found in these sites before, then it's adding value to all players (including solo/casual). I'll wait and see on this one, but still it's not NEW - it's an iteration on an existing element of the game. Could be good, could be cr@p.
Stargate Changes: Cosmetic. Nice eye candy, but adds nothing new in terms of gameplay, for anyone.
New Exploration Modules: When you take these in conjunction with the Astrometrics skill changes, this is actually a NERF to exploration. To get the same scan strength now as before you HAVE TO fit some of these new mods to your scanning ship. So now choose: weaker scan strength (i.e. longer to scan stuff down) or compromise on what else your ship can do? So new exploration modules in my opinion detract from exploration for everyone (not just solo/casual players)
Ship Rebalancing: as the name suggests, this is balance work, nothing NEW.
Null Industry Changes: excellent changes and I hope they revitalise null industry; but again, it's not new, it's balance/iteration. I'm not a developer, but I can't imagine it takes much time to change the number of manufacturing slots in an outpost. And for solo/casual players, well how many of them are null industrialists anyway?
Now don't get me (completely) wrong, I can see that a lot of these changes are needed (balance, iteration, eye candy) in a 10-year-old game; but I'm just surprised and disappointed at the lack of new content in EVE's 10-year anniversary expansion - I was expecting at least one of the big ideas to get at least started (ring mining & removal of moon goo to facilitate bottom-up alliance income generation; beginning the modular POS work; new scanning system etc)
Have I missed something obvious? Is there more to come from Odyssey? Or have CCP already given up on providing content for solo/casual players?
We have hints of new stuff to come: opening up Jove space (only good if what we find in Jove space is somehow different to what we already have in K-space and W-space); player built stargates. Could be cool. But Incarna could have been cool too.
TL:DR: Odyssey for solo/casual players = yet another underwhelming expansion. Still hopeful for the future. |
Alexa Coates
Federation Navy Assembly Group LLC
431
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
"hey guys how do i play this mmo solo?"
Missing the point of the WHOLE GAME 101. That's a Templar, an Amarr fighter used by carriers. |
Dave Stark
2954
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. |
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
1498
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:11:00 -
[4] - Quote
"I wanted Orange. It gave me Lemon Lime." Sovereignty and Population Moulds and water for the sandbox. |
Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
732
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:13:00 -
[5] - Quote
not ccp's fault you keep paying for a game that doesn't cater to you
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
1556
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Posted - 2013.04.28 20:15:00 -
[6] - Quote
+1, you summarized it all pretty well.
It totally looks like a bunch of features which back in February were determined that could be put together by June and call them a expansion, but all in all DUST is taking the lion's share of dev focus and there's nothing for the silent majority of hiseccers, soloers, casuals and PvErs. We're not cool and so we get no cookies... again. The Greater Fool Bar-áis now open for business, 24/7. Come and have drinks and fun somewhere between RL and New Eden!-áIngame chat channel: The Greater Fool Bar |
Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
3
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
So far most everyone's missing the point. Not that I'm surprised much.
CCP said they were going to include content for solo/casual players in future expansions. I can't see it in Odyssey so far, so where is it?
I don't give a f*ck if you don't like the solo playstyle, CCP recognise they need our cash and committed to providing content for us - so where is it? |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
1668
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:20:00 -
[8] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:
TL:DR: Odyssey for solo/casual players = yet another underwhelming expansion. Still hopeful for the future.
What exactly do you want? EVe is already too "solo friendly", you can litterally do everything in game except take sov or jump a capital ship solo (I was about to add incursions, but you can "solo" those with ISBoxer lol). Missions are pure solo content as is most shooting-involved PVE, hell you can solo all but 1 or 2 of the highest difficult DED plexes.
There is enough solo content. EVE needs ore group content like incusions, wormholes and now Data/Relic sites. |
Dave Stark
2956
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:24:00 -
[9] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:So far most everyone's missing the point. Not that I'm surprised much.
CCP said they were going to include content for solo/casual players in future expansions. I can't see it in Odyssey so far, so where is it?
I don't give a f*ck if you don't like the solo playstyle, CCP recognise they need our cash and committed to providing content for us - so where is it?
where is it?
did you miss all of the mining changes? |
Riot Girl
RADIO RAMPAGE Initiative Mercenaries
719
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:24:00 -
[10] - Quote
It's in Rancer. Oh god. |
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Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
4981
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:27:00 -
[11] - Quote
The Odyssey changes actually are rather interesting, because they swing in both directions of solo and group playstyles.
The last time they added a solo activity, CQ, it didn't go over too well. Once burnt.......... There is much to be said in favour of modern journalism. By giving us the opinions of the uneducated, it keeps us in touch with the ignorance of the community.-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13932
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:28:00 -
[12] - Quote
Promised where? If it was GÇ£not so long agoGÇ¥, then it sounds rather likely that it's far too early to want to see it in this patch.
Even so, exploration being made less horrible gives soloers more to do, so there you go. POS improvements and tiercide provides more content for everyone, including soloers. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.-á |
0wl
Pocket Pirates
30
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:29:00 -
[13] - Quote
Seriously? Didn't you pay attention to the exploration changes? * Facepalm * |
Sarmatiko
1060
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:30:00 -
[14] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:CCP said they were going to include content for solo/casual players in future expansions. Link to the actual post/interview where "CCP said this", can we have it? Without quotes this is just another thread full of bitter tears and false expectations from the product.
Also "future expansions" not necessarily means "we promise this for Odyssey". If you want your special snowflake solo gameplay now - freeze subscription and play X3, Elite or whatever.
|
Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
3
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:30:00 -
[15] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:
TL:DR: Odyssey for solo/casual players = yet another underwhelming expansion. Still hopeful for the future.
What exactly do you want? EVe is already too "solo friendly", you can litterally do everything in game except take sov or jump a capital ship solo (I was about to add incursions, but you can "solo" those with ISBoxer lol). Missions are pure solo content as is most shooting-involved PVE, hell you can solo all but 1 or 2 of the highest difficult DED plexes. There is enough solo content. EVE needs ore group content like incusions, wormholes and now Data/Relic sites.
What I want is more new content that can be done solo. Very happy if it can only be done solo at a disadvantage to groups, or with less reward than in groups. I love w-space, taken several (solo) long trips through w-space, even to C6s. Incursions annoy me, why shouldn't there be some minor incursion sites that can be soloed, I don't expect to be able to run an entire incursion on my own. Data/relic sites are not new, they're an iteration on existing exploration sites, and my OP clearly states I'm waiting to see what they're like before deciding if they're good or not for my playstyle.
What I want is for CCP to keep its promise. |
Sobach
Fourth Circle
126
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:30:00 -
[16] - Quote
0wl wrote:Seriously? Didn't you pay attention to the exploration changes? * Facepalm *
Things that the OP doesn't like to do naturally doesn't count. |
Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
3
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:31:00 -
[17] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:So far most everyone's missing the point. Not that I'm surprised much.
CCP said they were going to include content for solo/casual players in future expansions. I can't see it in Odyssey so far, so where is it?
I don't give a f*ck if you don't like the solo playstyle, CCP recognise they need our cash and committed to providing content for us - so where is it? where is it? did you miss all of the mining changes?
Did you miss my OP? What's NEW in the mining changes? Nada. |
Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
3
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:34:00 -
[18] - Quote
Sobach wrote:0wl wrote:Seriously? Didn't you pay attention to the exploration changes? * Facepalm * Things that the OP doesn't like to do naturally doesn't count.
Wrong, and wrong again. I do exploration, and I like it. I did pay attention to the exploration changes, and apart from the new minigame (which I did say I was going to wait and see if they're good or bad), the changes are cosmetic (new system scan on undock) or just bad (nerfed scanning skills and new scanning mods).
Did you even read the OP? |
Dave Stark
2961
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:36:00 -
[19] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:So far most everyone's missing the point. Not that I'm surprised much.
CCP said they were going to include content for solo/casual players in future expansions. I can't see it in Odyssey so far, so where is it?
I don't give a f*ck if you don't like the solo playstyle, CCP recognise they need our cash and committed to providing content for us - so where is it? where is it? did you miss all of the mining changes? Did you miss my OP? What's NEW in the mining changes? Nada.
ice. grav sites. mineral composition.
did you miss the dev blogs, and fanfest keynotes? |
Jantunen the Infernal
O C C U P Y
108
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:36:00 -
[20] - Quote
Just buy more alts if you want to play solo. |
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13932
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:43:00 -
[21] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:What I want is more new content that can be done solo. GǪand you're getting it. Hell, even Retribution delivered a bunch.
I have this sneaking suspicion that you think of GÇ£contentGÇ¥ in the themepark way: more GÇ£dungeonsGÇ¥ to grind, which is not something that will never get any dev attention GÇö especially not for soloistsGǪ What they give is us is tools. A whole pile of them. And then we create our own content. Very little given to us in the last year has not been usable for the purpose of creating content for yourself. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.-á |
Setaceous
Nexus Prima
42
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:46:00 -
[22] - Quote
Alexa Coates wrote:"hey guys how do i play this mmo solo?"
Missing the point of the WHOLE GAME 101. MMO refers to the game model (many players online in the same environment) rather than the playstyle (social gameplay). |
Lipbite
Express Hauler
647
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:52:00 -
[23] - Quote
I bet huge part of those $8.000.000 Star Citizen gathered from crowdfunding are from present EVE subscribers who want WiS and more solo content. I think SC will get even more money from EVE player base after Odyssey. |
Rhivre
TarNec
69
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 20:53:00 -
[24] - Quote
There is plenty that can be done solo, including the stuff in odyssey... I am a solo player, and I am crazy excited about Odyssey
50% of players "usually" play solo...so they seem to find stuff to do somehow.
Although, many people mix up "Playing solo" with "Never interacting with anyone in game, even via chatting" |
Skorpynekomimi
501
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:03:00 -
[25] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:"I wanted Orange. It gave me Lemon Lime."
It is ze maintenance man. He knows I like orange! **** |
Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
4
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:04:00 -
[26] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:So far most everyone's missing the point. Not that I'm surprised much.
CCP said they were going to include content for solo/casual players in future expansions. I can't see it in Odyssey so far, so where is it?
I don't give a f*ck if you don't like the solo playstyle, CCP recognise they need our cash and committed to providing content for us - so where is it? where is it? did you miss all of the mining changes? Did you miss my OP? What's NEW in the mining changes? Nada. ice. grav sites. mineral composition. did you miss the dev blogs, and fanfest keynotes?
Do you understand the difference between *new content* and *iteration on / balancing of existing content*? Because ice, and ore, both already exist in game. In case you missed them. These change's aren't introducing anything new; they're not even changing the mining or ice gathering mechanism, just where the ice/ore is and what mins you get from them.
No new content. |
Indahmawar Fazmarai
1559
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:04:00 -
[27] - Quote
Lipbite wrote:I bet huge part of those $8.000.000 Star Citizen gathered from crowdfunding are from present EVE subscribers who want WiS and more solo content. I think SC will get even more money from EVE player base after Odyssey.
Them at SC are pushing a second campaing for getting up to 10 million so they can do their mocap inhouse and keep expanding content easily after release. It's more expensive than just rent the mocap facilities, but beyond certain threshold it's cheaper to run your own mocap than rent it.
And yes, mocap stands for "motion capture" and it's the foundation for avatar animation in games. The Greater Fool Bar-áis now open for business, 24/7. Come and have drinks and fun somewhere between RL and New Eden!-áIngame chat channel: The Greater Fool Bar |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
1668
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:09:00 -
[28] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:
TL:DR: Odyssey for solo/casual players = yet another underwhelming expansion. Still hopeful for the future.
What exactly do you want? EVe is already too "solo friendly", you can litterally do everything in game except take sov or jump a capital ship solo (I was about to add incursions, but you can "solo" those with ISBoxer lol). Missions are pure solo content as is most shooting-involved PVE, hell you can solo all but 1 or 2 of the highest difficult DED plexes. There is enough solo content. EVE needs ore group content like incusions, wormholes and now Data/Relic sites. What I want is more new content that can be done solo. Very happy if it can only be done solo at a disadvantage to groups, or with less reward than in groups. I love w-space, taken several (solo) long trips through w-space, even to C6s. Incursions annoy me, why shouldn't there be some minor incursion sites that can be soloed, I don't expect to be able to run an entire incursion on my own. Data/relic sites are not new, they're an iteration on existing exploration sites, and my OP clearly states I'm waiting to see what they're like before deciding if they're good or not for my playstyle. What I want is for CCP to keep its promise.
Then this demonstrats that you are simply bored, what yo want already exists. Or are you going to tell me you've done every single 10/10 solo, every null sec and low sec COSMOS complex, every low sec lvl 5, every single high sec exploration room, every single epic arc missions at least twice, mined every kind of ore everywhere etc etc etc.
The ONLY non solo content EVE has is taking sov, jumping a capital ship (just jumping, it only takes one tooon to FLY the damn ship), top end wormholes and Incursions without ISBoxer.
You're literally saying "The whole game isn't enough, i want more". That a personal issue dude, not something wrong with the game or CCP's content addition schedule. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
595
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:11:00 -
[29] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:Not so long ago, CCP stated quite unambiguously that they intended to start putting content for all playstyles into their expansions - including content for solo/casual players, who whether you like them or loathe them make up a significant percentage of the playerbase (and hence CCP's income).
Odyssey has, basically, NO new content. Okay, okay, faction BC... but that is pretty small. This release is clearly focused on fixing what is already here.
Radar and mag become more "multi-play", so I guess that is a hit to solo play content.
If you watched the keynote speech, they again called out solo/casual as a valid play style. They also put forth a pretty opaque, highly generalized possible vision of the EVE future.
I think the message is that high sec mining and missioning ain't goin' no where... even if the new content is going to be focused at group play. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
484
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:12:00 -
[30] - Quote
Solo has a place in Eve absolutely, but not risk free and not without the risk of other player interaction either |
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Dave Stark
2964
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:14:00 -
[31] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:No new content.
confirming ice anoms have already been in the game.
(that was sarcasm, by the way) |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
595
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:14:00 -
[32] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote: Then this demonstrats that you are simply bored, what yo want already exists.
I agree that this is a good summary of his OP.
That said, I don't think it would take to many CCP assets to rework some of the missions, shake things up a little. Try to create a little more variety between them. |
Masuka Taredi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
20
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:18:00 -
[33] - Quote
I rarely see the words "Eve" and 'Casual" near one another. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13934
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:19:00 -
[34] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:Do you understand the difference between *new content* and *iteration on / balancing of existing content*? Yes: in a sandbox MMO, it's pretty much nil. Iterations and rebalancing means stuff that was useless before becomes useful, because we're no longer talking about GÇ£gear progressionGÇ¥ or GÇ£content consumptionGÇ¥.
Retribution was one of the largest content additions this game has ever seen. The industry alterations in Odyssey stands a reasonable chance of being about as big, especially when combined with the next wave of ship rebalancing.
LHA Tarawa wrote:Odyssey has, basically, NO new content. GǪaside from exploration, the potential for proper mining wars, and a decent amount of ships being added to the GÇ£usefulGÇ¥-pool. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.-á |
Seven Koskanaiken
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
149
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:21:00 -
[35] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:
Do you understand the difference between *new content* and *iteration on / balancing of existing content*? Because ice, and ore, both already exist in game. In case you missed them. These change's aren't introducing anything new; they're not even changing the mining or ice gathering mechanism, just where the ice/ore is and what mins you get from them.
No new content.
Yeh, but, that's because ccp release patches and call them expansions. |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2651
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:23:00 -
[36] - Quote
Well, while I don't really see EVE as a solo game, and that it's nearly impossible to design any kind of exclusively solo content that couldn't be exploited by groups more efficiently without breaking the open world sandbox, OP is in fact right.
CCP did very clearly acknowledge the solo casuals (CCP Seagull in her first dev blog, and CSM 7 December summit minutes), and Odyssey doesn't seem to deliver much on that front, unless you count the exploration tweaks as solo/casual stuff.
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
5
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:25:00 -
[37] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:What I want is more new content that can be done solo. GǪand you're getting it. Hell, even Retribution delivered a bunch. I have this sneaking suspicion that you think of GÇ£contentGÇ¥ in the themepark way: more GÇ£dungeonsGÇ¥ to grind, which is not something that will never get any dev attention GÇö especially not for soloistsGǪ What they give is us is tools. A whole pile of them. And then we create our own content. Very little given to us in the last year has not been usable for the purpose of creating content for yourself.
Well I'm not looking for more missions or other "dungeons" if that's what you mean. I like being part of a multiplayer game, even if I'm mostly running away :o) Staying alive is part of the challenge.
I guess what I'm looking for is the ways I can do more (i.e. more variety of) stuff in game given limitations on how long I can spend online (RL > game). I like the new crimewatch and duelling systems - as you say, tools to let me find my own content. I'd love more variety of things to do in EVE - orbital flying, ring mining, hacking someone else's POS, deep space exploration - and more tools for explorers and nomads too (because to me that's the essence of any ultimate scifi simulator wannabe, not the blobfest ganking shoot you in the face sh!t a lot of players seem to crave).
I don't see much in the way of new tools, or new content, in Odyssey. Please explain what I'm missing.
Yes I interact with other players every time I play. I just don't see why I should have to interact with them as part of a blob or as part of someone else's corp.
Oh and where was the commitmen from CCP to solo players? CSM December minutes, Next Decade section; and in the forum topic around those minutes. The commitment is there, but it's not as clearly stated as I (mis)remembered.
Flame away for that :o) |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13934
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:32:00 -
[38] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:I guess what I'm looking for is the ways I can do more (i.e. more variety of) stuff in game given limitations on how long I can spend online (RL > game). I like the new crimewatch and duelling systems - as you say, tools to let me find my own content. I'd love more variety of things to do in EVE - orbital flying, ring mining, hacking someone else's POS, deep space exploration - and more tools for explorers and nomads too (because to me that's the essence of any ultimate scifi simulator wannabe, not the blobfest ganking shoot you in the face sh!t a lot of players seem to crave). Well, then I don't quite see any cause for complaint. Retribution gave you bounty hunting and CW2.0. Odyssey will give you exploration and mining wars. And no, they're not just visual updates GÇö they're new sources of competition either by design or by virtue of working completely differently than their previous incarnations did.
If you were into arm-wrestling, and they suddenly change it to include duelling pistols while running a marathon, you'd probably say that it's a new game sport altogetherGǪ
Quote:Oh and where was the commitmen from CCP to solo players? CSM December minutes, Next Decade section; and in the forum topic around those minutes. So really, anything before the winter patch is just icing on the cake since this dedication to make content solo-able hasn't even begun yet. vOv
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.-á |
Nex apparatu5
Friendship is Podding Test Alliance Please Ignore
496
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:32:00 -
[39] - Quote
Let's go through one by one
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:orbital flying what
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:ring mining They need to fix the T2 production process first, which by all accounts is what they're doing this patch, so that's coming.
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:hacking someone else's POS Horribly abusable
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:deep space exploration WH space
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:and more tools for explorers and nomads too Such as? |
March rabbit
epTa Team Inc.
655
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:34:00 -
[40] - Quote
Tippia wrote:LHA Tarawa wrote:Odyssey has, basically, NO new content. GǪaside from exploration, the potential for proper mining wars, and a decent amount of ships being added to the GǣusefulGǥ-pool. - exploration got new minigame + some sugar on scanning - "potential for mining wars" - well, we'll see. Right now i don't see an difference between warping to belt and warping to new anomaly. Maybe depletable asteroids make a difference here. We'll see - decent amount of ships added to the "useful" -pool.
Outside of "mining wars" there is no new content. Unless "using Atron" or "using Navitas" for you is two separate "contents".
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Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
6
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:38:00 -
[41] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:
TL:DR: Odyssey for solo/casual players = yet another underwhelming expansion. Still hopeful for the future.
What exactly do you want? EVe is already too "solo friendly", you can litterally do everything in game except take sov or jump a capital ship solo (I was about to add incursions, but you can "solo" those with ISBoxer lol). Missions are pure solo content as is most shooting-involved PVE, hell you can solo all but 1 or 2 of the highest difficult DED plexes. There is enough solo content. EVE needs ore group content like incusions, wormholes and now Data/Relic sites. What I want is more new content that can be done solo. Very happy if it can only be done solo at a disadvantage to groups, or with less reward than in groups. I love w-space, taken several (solo) long trips through w-space, even to C6s. Incursions annoy me, why shouldn't there be some minor incursion sites that can be soloed, I don't expect to be able to run an entire incursion on my own. Data/relic sites are not new, they're an iteration on existing exploration sites, and my OP clearly states I'm waiting to see what they're like before deciding if they're good or not for my playstyle. What I want is for CCP to keep its promise. Then this demonstrats that you are simply bored, what yo want already exists. Or are you going to tell me you've done every single 10/10 solo, every null sec and low sec COSMOS complex, every low sec lvl 5, every single high sec exploration room, every single epic arc missions at least twice, mined every kind of ore everywhere etc etc etc. The ONLY non solo content EVE has is taking sov, jumping a capital ship (just jumping, it only takes one tooon to FLY the damn ship), top end wormholes and Incursions without ISBoxer. You're literally saying "The whole game isn't enough, i want more". That a personal issue dude, not something wrong with the game or CCP's content addition schedule.
This one I need to think about and reflect on. Yes I absolutely do want more from what was envisioned as the "ultimate scifi simulator". Have I done all EVE's current PVE content already? No, you're right there, and I am working to make more of it accessible to me. Am I bored with the PVE content? You might be right, which may be why I just started training for a SB (mid term goal: solo PVP kill in w-space).
Thank you for making me think about my own motivations. |
Arronicus
Shadows of Vorlon The Marmite Collective
589
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:53:00 -
[42] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time.
GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. |
Dave Stark
2968
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:55:00 -
[43] - Quote
Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks.
i didn't say it didn't.
i just pointed out it's the most antisocial activity in eve. you don't want other players with you. i didn't say you didn't want your own personal fleet of 30 accounts.
miners don't want to join corps, it's detrimental. miners don't want to share their belts with you, it's detrimental. all miners want are alts.
it's an antisocial activity. |
Indahmawar Fazmarai
1561
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:57:00 -
[44] - Quote
Roime wrote:Well, while I don't really see EVE as a solo game, and that it's nearly impossible to design any kind of exclusively solo content that couldn't be exploited by groups more efficiently without breaking the open world sandbox, OP is in fact right.
CCP did very clearly acknowledge the solo casuals (CCP Seagull in her first dev blog, and CSM 7 December summit minutes), and Odyssey doesn't seem to deliver much on that front, unless you count the exploration tweaks as solo/casual stuff.
In a way, expecting anything new from Odyssey was unreal. So it's OK that Odyssey is just a glorified patch (the fourth in a row) and so we better wait until winter to call out CCP and ask them to stop calling us stupid .
But then, i've seen most of Fanfest and not only the future content is severely lacking, but the few that's been hinted plain isn't of use to solo/casuals.
And yet solo/casuals are naturally the single largest demographic in EVE.
Look around the game and think what the average guy in EVE would answer to these questions:
- Do you have many friends in RL? - Do you have RL responsabilities you can't bypass to spend more time ingame? - Do your RL responsabilities have a potential to interfere with a ongoing long-winded activity?
If you answered "No", congratulations, you have the potential to enjoy EVE at its maximum. But a single "yes" means that you're out of luck and this is not your game, really, even if you find something you enjoy doing like forever. Becasue that "somethign" will not be the best the game can offer (and too often will tstnk after a short while), and you will be a second rate citizen compared to the guys who can take the game seriously enough and commit their RL to it. The Greater Fool Bar-áis now open for business, 24/7. Come and have drinks and fun somewhere between RL and New Eden!-áIngame chat channel: The Greater Fool Bar |
Reuben Johnson
Gal-Min Industries
77
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 21:59:00 -
[45] - Quote
Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. Except that's not how it works. Mining in a "group" often just means a solo player with 5 accounts...cause no miner wants to share his profits with everyone else. |
Josef Djugashvilis
Acme Mining Corporation
1170
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:00:00 -
[46] - Quote
Alexa Coates wrote:"hey guys how do i play this mmo solo?"
Missing the point of the WHOLE GAME 101.
50% of players do solo... official quote from fan-fest. This is not a signature. |
Ginger Barbarella
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1274
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:01:00 -
[47] - Quote
I'm curious why some of you get such a hard-on for people who want to play solo. And no, I don't give a crap what "MMO" stands for: I do what I choose however I chose with whomever I choose, and (chances are) I make more isk at it than you gong-bangers that can only perform in a blob... "Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac |
Valari Nala Zena
Perkone Caldari State
62
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:01:00 -
[48] - Quote
This expansion seems to be built on promoting teamplay, which is fine imo. For example catching the loot after hacking is hard solo, and top tier ratting with scramming rats.
Occasionally i like ice mining even for the convenience, but i'm fine with the changes.
Exploration - people will have a hard time catching the loot after hacking solo. Ratting - top tier hubs have rats that scram, promotes more team-play.
The only thing i find unfortunate is that there are no "astounding" game changing updates.
Odyssey: Some eyecandy - always very good. The scanning changes - very good. Ice belts nerfed - good. POS changes - good. Tags for sec = isk for sec? Hmmm, debatable but better than grindfest - ok. Capital rigs - meh. Redesigned & navy ships - meh.
The only thing that i found astounding: Building your own stargates, now that is in my eyes the kind of change i look for. But it's not for this expansion, but i wish there was something like this every expansion.
If you do add ships, just add an entire new class. For example a mobile outpost that can be piloted and people can dock in, that is the kind of change i'm speaking of. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13936
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:03:00 -
[49] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:- Do you have many friends in RL? - Do you have RL responsabilities you can't bypass to spend more time ingame? - Do your RL responsabilities have a potential to interfere with a ongoing long-winded activity?
If you answered "No", congratulations, you have the potential to enjoy EVE at its maximum. But a single "yes" means that you're out of luck and this is not your game GǪand yet, people who answer yes to all of them really enjoy the game at its maximum and even manage to become e-famous for it. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.-á |
Valari Nala Zena
Perkone Caldari State
62
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:04:00 -
[50] - Quote
- double post |
|
Valari Nala Zena
Perkone Caldari State
62
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:04:00 -
[51] - Quote
This expansion seems to be built on promoting teamplay, which is fine imo. Some examples: Exploration - people will have a hard time catching the loot after hacking solo. Ratting - top tier hubs have rats that scram, promotes more teamplay.
Occasionally i like ice mining even for the convenience, but i'm fine with the changes.
The only thing i find unfortunate is that there are no "astounding" game changing updates.
Odyssey: Some eyecandy - always very good. The scanning changes - very good. Ice belts nerfed - good. POS changes - good. Tags for sec = isk for sec? Hmmm, debatable but better than grindfest - ok. Capital rigs - meh. Redesigned & navy ships - meh.
The only thing that i found astounding: Building your own stargates, now that is in my eyes the kind of change i look for. But it's not for this expansion, but i wish there was something like this every expansion.
Another example, if you do want to adds ships, why not think of an entire new class. For example a mobile outpost that can be piloted and people can dock in, that is the kind of change i'm speaking of.
|
Indahmawar Fazmarai
1561
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:08:00 -
[52] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. i didn't say it didn't. i just pointed out it's the most antisocial activity in eve. you don't want other players with you. i didn't say you didn't want your own personal fleet of 30 accounts. miners don't want to join corps, it's detrimental. miners don't want to share their belts with you, it's detrimental. all miners want are alts. it's an antisocial activity.
Well, i guess that chatting on two channels at once whiIe I mine it's the definition of an antisocial activity... The Greater Fool Bar-áis now open for business, 24/7. Come and have drinks and fun somewhere between RL and New Eden!-áIngame chat channel: The Greater Fool Bar |
Dave Stark
2968
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:09:00 -
[53] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. i didn't say it didn't. i just pointed out it's the most antisocial activity in eve. you don't want other players with you. i didn't say you didn't want your own personal fleet of 30 accounts. miners don't want to join corps, it's detrimental. miners don't want to share their belts with you, it's detrimental. all miners want are alts. it's an antisocial activity. Well, i guess that chatting on two channels at once whiIe I mine it's the definition of an antisocial activity...
i chat in chat channels too. i do that BECAUSE mining is so antisocial. it's also why i post on the forum. |
Seven Koskanaiken
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
149
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:09:00 -
[54] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Alexa Coates wrote:"hey guys how do i play this mmo solo?"
Missing the point of the WHOLE GAME 101. 50% of players do solo... official quote from fan-fest.
Doesn't 100% of everyone "do" solo at some point. I mean solo is doing you "do", it isn't something you "are". Sometimes you are in the mood for interaction, sometimes you are in the mood for solo. I can't see why a game would actually reduce a huge portion of its content. IF it is actually doing that, which i have no idea whether it is. |
Indahmawar Fazmarai
1561
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 22:21:00 -
[55] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. i didn't say it didn't. i just pointed out it's the most antisocial activity in eve. you don't want other players with you. i didn't say you didn't want your own personal fleet of 30 accounts. miners don't want to join corps, it's detrimental. miners don't want to share their belts with you, it's detrimental. all miners want are alts. it's an antisocial activity. Well, i guess that chatting on two channels at once whiIe I mine it's the definition of an antisocial activity... i chat in chat channels too. i do that BECAUSE mining is so antisocial. it's also why i post on the forum.
Yay, talking to people is SO antisocial... The Greater Fool Bar-áis now open for business, 24/7. Come and have drinks and fun somewhere between RL and New Eden!-áIngame chat channel: The Greater Fool Bar |
Steveir
Hagukure Disturbed Acquaintance
49
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 23:22:00 -
[56] - Quote
While I admit that I have not read all the details, in details, the headlines of the Expansions - don't exactly sound like an expansion. Don't get me wrong, a lot of the work they have done over the last year has been very good; moved the interface in a good direction. Just fix the overview and drones and I think that would get the last bit of that.
However, the stuff that attracts new players, and keeps old players playing, is new stuff - and I agree with the OP, its a bit thin on the ground at the moment.
Still early days, but if CCP doesn't add new stuff - then there will be a decline in subs, and no one wants that :) |
Dave Stark
2976
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 23:22:00 -
[57] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:Yay, talking to people is SO antisocial...
talking to people isn't mining, though. |
Skeln Thargensen
Filthy Carebear Tax Avoidance Shell Corp
128
|
Posted - 2013.04.28 23:27:00 -
[58] - Quote
did the people complaining miss the fact that they're taking rats out of the exploration sites? that's a pretty big bonus to solo players as you can run them in your bonused scan ship. freelance space bum |
Mina Sebiestar
Mactabilis Simplex Cursus
324
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 00:04:00 -
[59] - Quote
Tbh this is gas expansion re balancing and changes.
Glorified patch not that i complain but i have different view of what expansion should be. http://i.imgur.com/1N37t.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/KTjFEt6.jpg I dont always fly stabber but when i do...
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
4782
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 00:07:00 -
[60] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:Sobach wrote:0wl wrote:Seriously? Didn't you pay attention to the exploration changes? * Facepalm * Things that the OP doesn't like to do naturally doesn't count. Wrong, and wrong again. I do exploration, and I like it. I did pay attention to the exploration changes, and apart from the new minigame (which I did say I was going to wait and see if they're good or bad), the changes are cosmetic (new system scan on undock) or just bad (nerfed scanning skills and new scanning mods). Did you even read the OP? The system scan is not simply cosmetic. I think you're seriously underestimating how functionally different having scan results show as physical locations in space really is. It would make ratter hunting in 0.0 a lot easier, for example. |
|
Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics K162
1727
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 00:14:00 -
[61] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote:So far most everyone's missing the point. Not that I'm surprised much no... it is infact you who is missing the point. complaining about the solo play aspects of an MMO is like complaining solitaire has no multiplayer, or that your horse doesnt do well in formula 1, or that you can't swim very well while playing football.
seriously, think about what MMO stands for and then consider that a game that has 'multiplayer' IN THE TITLE, probably doesnt play solo very well. |
Sabriz Adoudel
AWOXalypse
270
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 00:15:00 -
[62] - Quote
Solo content is made by players.
Join a corporation (think of them as 'the NPCs'). Shoot the corporation members. Your 'score' is the ransom you extract from them and the value of any loot drops and bounty payments. AWOXalypse is coming! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2898431 Buy shares: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=226618 An enemy is a friend you stab in the front. |
Raven Solaris
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
41
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 00:22:00 -
[63] - Quote
Quote:New Exploration Modules: When you take these in conjunction with the Astrometrics skill changes, this is actually a NERF to exploration. To get the same scan strength now as before you HAVE TO fit some of these new mods to your scanning ship. So now choose: weaker scan strength (i.e. longer to scan stuff down) or compromise on what else your ship can do? So new exploration modules in my opinion detract from exploration for everyone (not just solo/casual players)
You are so wrong that it hurts.
The skill changes were as follows:
Astrometrics Rangefinding/Acquisition/Pinpointing lose 5% bonus per level. Astrometrics loses +1 probe per level (speculation on my part.) Astrometrics gain the lost 5% bonuses per level.
So if you currently have all Astro skills at 5, you gain the following bonuses: 8 Probes launchable (+5 from Astrometrics) 50% Reduced Scan Deviation (50% from Pinpointing) 50% Increased Scan Probe Strength (50% from Rangefinding) 50% Reduced Scan Probe Scan Time (50% from Acquisition)
Post-Odyssey, with all Astro skills at 5, you gain the following bonuses: 7 Probes launchable (This is my guess based on the new probe formation launching and what Soundwave said during the Eve Keynote, to paraphrase, "We're letting you launch 7 probes because it's mathematically the best.) 50% Reduced Scan Deviation (25% from Astrometrics, 25% from Pinpointing) 50% Increased Scan Probe Strength (25% from Astrometrics, 25% from Rangefinding) 50% Reduced Scan Probe Scan Time (25% from Astrometrics, 25% from Acquisition)
So as you can see, same bonuses with all level 5 skills, in fact, if your skills AREN'T all at 5, you'll actually benefit from this change, for example with 5 in Astrometrics and 4 in the Astrometrics support skills, you'd get 8 probes and 40% bonuses. Post-Odyssey, you'll have 7 probes with 45% bonuses.
This is actually better for casual players as they only miss out on 5% instead of 10% bonuses from not spending over 3 months training the Astrometric support skills to 5.
Coupled this with the new modules and probing efficiency will be at an all time high.
Please learn to read before you make yourself look stupid for the sake of exploration players, I love exploring and I'm positively giddy about Odyssey. |
Garresh
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
145
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 01:31:00 -
[64] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:"I wanted Orange. It gave me Lemon Lime."
I actually lol'd irl. Good job. This Space Intentionally Left Blank |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
2668
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 02:25:00 -
[65] - Quote
If CCP should fail at solo content in this game, I would consider it a real failure to have attempted it in the first place and a good thing if the attempt fails.
If it could be said there are any solo players in this game, I can say I am one of them.
And the real challenge of solo play is not the content available for solo players, of which there is little beyond missions, but in taking the existing content and managing it solo.
This requires a heightened challenge in everything from travel tactics to fittings. Indeed there are limits to how far you can go, there's no doubt about that, but that's the challenge: making it work at all. Even without coming away with loot, escaping the situations (like that 9/10 nullsec drone site in a Cyclone escaping with an overloaded 100MB AB and half structure...) you find yourself getting into, is fun and excitement itself.
And yes, the solo players who take up exploration and solo PVP instead of mindless ISK-snatching bean-counting grinding are not into this for the ISK. They are deaf to those who say "I got (insert trillions of amount of ISK here) so I am winning Eve". No, you are showing that mind-numbing grinding is some kind of norm for you and that does not speak well for your character or mental state overall. What's the drug making this possible, Ritalin?
But that CCP has been hard on solo play, Incursions for example where dead mission drakes littered the space lanes for the first day, is always a good thing, and managing to work and survive around that has always been fun.
The fact that exploration is getting a boost and exploration is a form of solo play that just about everybody from ganker to missioner likes (hence why I always wonder why we never see a "exploration CSM" being more popular) does not mean CCP is giving on up for solo play, but I think they have figured out that it's time to address exploration as a career choice.
From the looks of it, the truly phat rewards of exploration are still going to require a team effort. So the 9/10, 10/10, nullsec and lowsec escalations, wormholes beyond class 3 - though I've heard of C5 solo command ships - etc., are not really going to change much. If they make more exploration options and content available to the high sec explorer, it's not changing much there since lower skilled players need to get their time in and skill up for their capabilities and high sec is the best place for them before taking those lowsec escalations or going to null for the top rewards.
So just because it's not going to be a WoW-ish "it's all about you here's your epic set" kind of result (good God, no please no) does not mean that Odyssey is going to fail. Since everybody enjoys a little exploration even once in a while, the improvements to the mechanics and hopefully more so the interface will be good for everybody. Long have I argued that boosts to exploration is content for the entire player base, and it's good to see that come around. |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
1259
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 02:33:00 -
[66] - Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X_%28computer_game_series%29 |
dark heartt
I Own Four Sheep The Methodical Alliance
138
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 02:34:00 -
[67] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time.
I'm a solo player in a player corp with 20+ members that interacts with the community. I do solo activities like hauling and mining to provide for the PvPers. I rarely fleet up (although I enjoy it when I do). I rarely PVP (in the pew pew sense of the word).
However I am not anti social, I just prefer to do activities that don't rely on having others there because my timezone (and available time) don't work well with that. There should be content for solo players, who enjoy the game and community, but for other reasons cannot take part in organised fleet ops with other players. |
Tasha Saisima
State War Academy Caldari State
17
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 02:59:00 -
[68] - Quote
I kinda agree with the OP. They keep saying how they want to "bring back the unknown into Eve, the sense of wonder" but what have they given us? There is nothing new to explore. Just a new scanner and hacking/looting process
I was expecting something totally new, similar to sites and anoms to run but different. Something like wormholes. But we didn't get anything, lol |
Raiz Nhell
Kangaroo Ate my baby Orchestrated Alliance
256
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 03:20:00 -
[69] - Quote
Players generate content in Eve... we don't get it handed to us on a theme park tray...
As a solo player you are generating content for others... mostly by providing something to stop their rounds with...
If you haul or mine or do anything solo then you are having the content of your game generated by others...
That's the best thing about Eve; CCP provides us with a universe and a set of mechanics... We, the Players, set about creating content to go in the universe.
There is no such thing as a fair fight...
If your fighting fair you have automatically put yourself at a disadvantage. |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
649
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 03:39:00 -
[70] - Quote
Raiz Nhell wrote:Players generate content in Eve... we don't get it handed to us on a theme park tray...
As a solo player you are generating content for others... mostly by providing something to stop their rounds with...
If you haul or mine or do anything solo then you are having the content of your game generated by others...
That's the best thing about Eve; CCP provides us with a universe and a set of mechanics... We, the Players, set about creating content to go in the universe.
This ignores the fact that there are ways built into the game to interact with the environment itself. Some of us prefer this kind of play at times and as part of the game it could probably do with some maintenance or updates from time to time.
Edit: responded to the wrong post... |
|
Nitrogen Isotopes
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
18
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 03:47:00 -
[71] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:"I wanted Orange. It gave me Lemon Lime."
I wanted something orange! |
Dave Stark
2989
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 05:53:00 -
[72] - Quote
dark heartt wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. I'm a solo player in a player corp with 20+ members that interacts with the community. I do solo activities like hauling and mining to provide for the PvPers. I rarely fleet up (although I enjoy it when I do). I rarely PVP (in the pew pew sense of the word). However I am not anti social, I just prefer to do activities that don't rely on having others there because my timezone (and available time) don't work well with that. There should be content for solo players, who enjoy the game and community, but for other reasons cannot take part in organised fleet ops with other players.
hi, i don't really care about you.
mining still promotes being antiscocial to get the most out of it. |
Josef Djugashvilis
Acme Mining Corporation
1173
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 06:09:00 -
[73] - Quote
Dear Mr Stark.
I have not mined for some considerable time, once in the last 5 years.
However, I must take you to task for stating that mining promotes being anti-social in game.
For me, and I am sure many others, mining is one of the most social forms of game play Eve can offer.
My old corp used to organize and run what we called Mining Mondays, which were not compulsory in any way.
All corp members would turn up and take part for at least some of the time, either mining or standing guard, depending on their time-zone.
We chatted, talked about corp matters, how to fit ships, Eve in general, we were all new players and could share what little knowledge we had, and talked about any other nonsense we felt like.
All the ore mined was donated to our corp.
Still think mining is anti-social? This is not a signature. |
Ludi Burek
Toilet Emergency JIHADASQUAD
236
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 06:16:00 -
[74] - Quote
Wtf, does an activity have to be explicitly named as "solo"?
There's plenty of things in eve solo friendly and "solo with alts". |
Dave Stark
2989
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 06:22:00 -
[75] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Dear Mr Stark.
I have not mined for some considerable time, once in the last 5 years.
However, I must take you to task for stating that mining promotes being anti-social in game.
For me, and I am sure many others, mining is one of the most social forms of game play Eve can offer.
My old corp used to organize and run what we called Mining Mondays, which were not compulsory in any way.
All corp members would turn up and take part for at least some of the time, either mining or standing guard, depending on their time-zone.
We chatted, talked about corp matters, how to fit ships, Eve in general, we were all new players and could share what little knowledge we had, and talked about any other nonsense we felt like.
All the ore mined was donated to our corp.
Still think mining is anti-social?
your old corp? let's look at that, corps. you join, they offer you nothing, and in return you get wardecs and awoxers. ore buyback programs tend to give you less than you'd get if you sold at jita (essentially cutting in to your profits for no reason what so ever, but if you're lazy and don't care i guess that's fine). mining ops? great you get 8 other guys mining your asteroids so you have to increase your non mining time finding new belts etc. orca boosts so your orca can mine instead! well, no, he can't because some one still has to haul so he's still not an extra miner.
the very simple fact is corps have no way of offering you anything other than a chat channel (which, you don't need to be in a corp to use a chat channel). and in return you just have the constant risk of war decs and awoxes. there's no incentive to this drawback.
and that's pretty much your whole argument; I HAZ A CORP!
so yes, i think mining is very antisocial. that's why i spend so much time posting on the forum and in 1-2 of my favourite chat channels. so i can get the social interaction mining doesn't promote. |
Josef Djugashvilis
Acme Mining Corporation
1173
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 06:56:00 -
[76] - Quote
Dear Mr Stark, you seem to be confusing being profitable with being sociable.
We all enjoyed the mining ops, not to make a profit, but to take part in an in-game social activity.
Orca? In those days the only Orca we were aware of was the killer whale variety.
Eve is not always, nor should it always be about isk per hour.
Fun, and I would suggest multi-person mining ops as but one example, are far more important for many in Eve.
Good day to you sir. This is not a signature. |
l0rd carlos
Friends Of Harassment
403
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 07:01:00 -
[77] - Quote
I think you can still launch 8 probes, so the scan strength increases because of math
base * 1.25 * 125 is higher compared to the old base * 1.5
And now you can do those Ladar / Radar / foo / bar sites with one Ship/fitting without guns. German blog about smallscale lowsec pvp: http://friendsofharassment.wordpress.com |
Angang Ostus
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
47
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 07:02:00 -
[78] - Quote
Raiz Nhell wrote:Players generate content in Eve... we don't get it handed to us on a theme park tray...
As a solo player you are generating content for others... mostly by providing something to stop their rounds with...
If you haul or mine or do anything solo then you are having the content of your game generated by others...
That's the best thing about Eve; CCP provides us with a universe and a set of mechanics... We, the Players, set about creating content to go in the universe.
The player generated content that you are referring to is a wonder of the world, yes, but it has limitations. There are only so many things currently that we can do within those mechanics. Those of us who like to imagine, who like a good story (not just about this battle, that heist--though those are cool), who want to find interesting surprises (in addition to being shot at) as we move around in the game world, who long for "a sense of wonder" (where did I hear that...?)....we need more. We love EVE and we want emergent content to grow as far and fast as possible. We want to be part of it each in our own way. We also want to be able to have some fun with pure fantasy in this fictional science fiction world that we're in because imagination and story are awesome and they have a place....if that's alright with you. |
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
3334
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 07:28:00 -
[79] - Quote
And again ... the famous quote nobody seems to understand ...
Most of the players have solo playing characters ... ... which is different from most players being solo players.
This doesn't mean the majority of people are *casual* OR solo players, it means that the majority of people have at least *one* solo playing *character* in their account. I've read the quote. I can read it, without reading what i want to read.
I felt ashamed for having no clue about currency exchange, but you people really make me feel much better.
Anyhow ... CCP is the law. CCP makes the game. You don't like it ? Guess nobody cares.
The content you want is for babies, compared to what can be pulled off in EvE on a daily basis. Nobody really cares about people who need easy stuff to boost their fake self esteem, except you babies.
Yes, i accept that you babies are in the millions, but CCP wants more *real* players, who *create* content and not dumb *consumers* who rely on others to make the game fun for them.
If that wasn't true, the last three expansions would have been different and much less of a success than they were.
This game isn't for babies. And that's what you are.
And that's all there is to it.
You are *accepted* in EvE, because you fulfill the usefull roles of the victims !
Accept the new tools and you can realize that there is lots to do for solo playing characters.
Don't accept them, okay, then cry all day about it ... who *really* cares, except the babies ?
Most of you are just *victims* ... and that's all you are there for. |
Josilin du Guesclin
University of Caille Gallente Federation
12
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 07:28:00 -
[80] - Quote
Dark Cloud Dancing wrote: New Exploration Modules: When you take these in conjunction with the Astrometrics skill changes, this is actually a NERF to exploration. To get the same scan strength now as before you HAVE TO fit some of these new mods to your scanning ship. So now choose: weaker scan strength (i.e. longer to scan stuff down) or compromise on what else your ship can do? So new exploration modules in my opinion detract from exploration for everyone (not just solo/casual players)
IT makes it easier for young characters to get into it, though. Assuming that the modules don't have high skill requirements (and I expect that they won't), they'll be a buff for pilots new to scanning, and a nerf to those with perfect skills. As the difference is currently incredible, I'm okay with this.
Quote: TL:DR: Odyssey for solo/casual players = yet another underwhelming expansion. Still hopeful for the future.
'Solo' and 'casual' are not the same, and I suspect that for the casual much of that which you have written off as 'eye candy' and 'minor QoL' will be quite important, because they make the game more fun to look at and less annoying to interact with.
|
|
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
3334
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 07:36:00 -
[81] - Quote
Josilin du Guesclin wrote:'Solo' and 'casual' are not the same, and I suspect that for the casual much of that which you have written off as 'eye candy' and 'minor QoL' will be quite important, because they make the game more fun to look at and less annoying to interact with. Nah ... The casual babies want new "content" in form of dumb NPCs to shoot at and other stuff to look at, because feeling powerfull in a videogame makes them feel better about their crappy lives.
Don't believe me ? Next time you see somebody rage about how he got attacked from a player, ask yourself how people can behave that way. He will insult that other guy like there's no tomorrow and will keep demanding things he has no power of getting. Where does that attitude come from ? Why would he believe he has the power to demand anything ? Why does he cry so much if a *player* kills him ? A bloated ego coming from being the "hero" by doing silly missions shooting NPCs ...
... and then, when a player kills him, suddenly reality hits him like a black, steel bat. (ingame, obviously)
That's the cancer of the industry: Feeding people easy content which makes them feel bigger, better, more powerfull, more important, makes them feel they've accomplished something, which is the number one drive that manipulates them into buying more of these crappy games with easy content.
The cure?
A black, steel bat. In the face. |
Josef Djugashvilis
Acme Mining Corporation
1173
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 07:44:00 -
[82] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:And again ... the famous quote nobody seems to understand ...
Most of the players have solo playing characters ... ... which is different from most players being solo players.
This doesn't mean the majority of people are *casual* OR solo players, it means that the majority of people have at least *one* solo playing *character* in their account. I've read the quote. I can read it, without reading what i want to read.
I felt ashamed for having no clue about currency exchange, but you people really make me feel much better.
Anyhow ... CCP is the law. CCP makes the game. You don't like it ? Guess nobody cares.
The content you want is for babies, compared to what can be pulled off in EvE on a daily basis. Nobody really cares about people who need easy stuff to boost their fake self esteem, except you babies.
Yes, i accept that you babies are in the millions, but CCP wants more *real* players, who *create* content and not dumb *consumers* who rely on others to make the game fun for them.
If that wasn't true, the last three expansions would have been different and much less of a success than they were.
This game isn't for babies. And that's what you are.
And that's all there is to it.
You are *accepted* in EvE, because you fulfill the usefull roles of the victims !
Accept the new tools and you can realize that there is lots to do for solo playing characters.
Don't accept them, okay, then cry all day about it ... who *really* cares, except the babies ?
Most of you are just *victims* ... and that's all you are there for.
So much anger, so little sense.
This is not a signature. |
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
3334
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 07:48:00 -
[83] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:So much anger, so little sense. This is called projection.
edit: actually ... would have to seek out that specific post of yours to support that claim, but i won't, because it's irrelevant.
You suckers lose and nobody really cares. Get over it. |
Yanarix Blitz
Black Scare
2
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 08:59:00 -
[84] - Quote
Need moar HEAVY NEUT TOWERS and webs in all DED plexes from 5/10 onwards so those solo ninja tengu fags cant run em anymore and stay in highsec where they belong. |
March rabbit
epTa Team Inc.
656
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 09:08:00 -
[85] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote: You suckers lose and nobody really cares. Get over it.
it would be good if you actually understand what do you write.
|
Angang Ostus
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
49
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 09:14:00 -
[86] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:Josilin du Guesclin wrote:'Solo' and 'casual' are not the same, and I suspect that for the casual much of that which you have written off as 'eye candy' and 'minor QoL' will be quite important, because they make the game more fun to look at and less annoying to interact with. Nah ... The casual babies want new "content" in form of dumb NPCs to shoot at and other stuff to look at, because feeling powerfull in a videogame makes them feel better about their crappy lives. Don't believe me ? Next time you see somebody rage about how he got attacked from a player, ask yourself how people can behave that way. He will insult that other guy like there's no tomorrow and will keep demanding things he has no power of getting. Where does that attitude come from ? Why would he believe he has the power to demand anything ? Why does he cry so much if a *player* kills him ? A bloated ego coming from being the "hero" by doing silly missions shooting NPCs ... ... and then, when a player kills him, suddenly reality hits him like a black, steel bat. (ingame, obviously)That's the cancer of the industry: Feeding people easy content which makes them feel bigger, better, more powerfull, more important, makes them feel they've accomplished something, which is the number one drive that manipulates them into buying more of these crappy games with easy content. The cure? A black, steel bat. In the face.
LOL That's pretty funny because those guys are feeling powerful in a videogame so they can feel better about their crappy lives. They should really do what you do instead so they can feel powerful in a video game and feel better about their crappy lives. |
Galega Ori
Universal Mining And Manufactoring
48
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 09:22:00 -
[87] - Quote
Alexa Coates wrote:"hey guys how do i play this mmo solo?"
Missing the point of the WHOLE GAME 101.
Missing the point of SOLO 101
just to explain this to the idiots in the crowd. Solo is when you go to do an activity by yourself with no other players in your immediate group. This dose not however mean that you are free from random interactions with other people when playing in a MMO.
just a side note, OP tldr. If op specifically said he wanted to play solo with no possible interaction with other players then yes he should play a different game, otherwise.
CCP Eterne: Silly Player, ALL devs are evil. |
Dark Cloud Dancing
Goldcrest Enterprises
19
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 09:37:00 -
[88] - Quote
Raven Solaris wrote:Quote:New Exploration Modules: When you take these in conjunction with the Astrometrics skill changes, this is actually a NERF to exploration. To get the same scan strength now as before you HAVE TO fit some of these new mods to your scanning ship. So now choose: weaker scan strength (i.e. longer to scan stuff down) or compromise on what else your ship can do? So new exploration modules in my opinion detract from exploration for everyone (not just solo/casual players) You are so wrong that it hurts. The skill changes were as follows: Astrometrics Rangefinding/Acquisition/Pinpointing lose 5% bonus per level. Astrometrics loses +1 probe per level (speculation on my part.) Astrometrics gain the lost 5% bonuses per level. snip So as you can see, same bonuses with all level 5 skills, in fact, if your skills AREN'T all at 5, you'll actually benefit from this change, for example with 5 in Astrometrics and 4 in the Astrometrics support skills, you'd get 8 probes and 40% bonuses. Post-Odyssey, you'll have 7 probes with 45% bonuses. This is actually better for casual players as they only miss out on 5% instead of 10% bonuses from not spending over 3 months training the Astrometric support skills to 5.
Ah, I see I missed the changes to Astrometrics skill itself - thank you for clarifying that for me, my bad, with that clarification the new mods do give more options and do add value to the game. |
Dave Stark
2998
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 09:39:00 -
[89] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Dear Mr Stark, you seem to be confusing being profitable with being sociable.
We all enjoyed the mining ops, not to make a profit, but to take part in an in-game social activity.
Orca? In those days the only Orca we were aware of was the killer whale variety.
Eve is not always, nor should it always be about isk per hour.
Fun, and I would suggest multi-person mining ops as but one example, are far more important for many in Eve.
Good day to you sir.
no i'm not. i'm pointing out the two contradict each other.
why should players be forced to be less good at what they're doing, just to be social? surely being social should make you better at what you're doing, not worse? the entire fact that you have to decide between the two is a serious game flaw?
no orca? well congratulations for using an out of date example.
i agree it shouldn't always be about isk per hour, completely right. however go back to my first point, why should you sacrifice one for the other? surely they should go hand in hand. |
Manny Moons
New Order Logistics CODE.
63
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 12:35:00 -
[90] - Quote
At the risk of being pedantic, there is a difference between anti-social and asocial. Mining is not something I would expect an anti-social player to choose. Ganking miners, maybe.
|
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Regis Solo
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
16
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 13:30:00 -
[91] - Quote
Solstice arsehat. If more solo content is created it won't even concern you, you'll still have victims. |
Danni stark
0
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 13:32:00 -
[92] - Quote
Manny Moons wrote:At the risk of being pedantic, there is a difference between anti-social and asocial. Mining is not something I would expect an anti-social player to choose. Ganking miners, maybe.
i actively don't want other players to come and interact with me in the asteroid belt, because any form of interaction is detrimental to my mining.
i'm antisocial as ****, as are most miners who actually want to get as much out of the activity. Yay, this account hasn't had it's signature banned. or it's account, if you're reading this. |
Totalrx
NA No Assholes
94
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 13:46:00 -
[93] - Quote
There does seem to be one misconception that gets overlooked much of the time:
A solo player, while not in a low/nullcorp or alliance, is still making an impact on the universe. Albeit a very small one. By running missions, mining, exploration and such, they have an impact on the market. That impact, no mater how small it may be, affects others in the game. So, just because they are not flying in a fleet, squatting a gate shooting shiny things, or operating in a corporate mining fleet doesn't mean that they are separate from the MMO part of the game. If they are ganked, then they become part of the MMO that way as well.
In every society, you have independents.
People who run a business with no other employee except themselves. Then there are the people who aren't socialites and just prefer to spend their time alone after a day of being around people.
The risk of interaction is always there for the solo player and, for the most part, the solo players accept this risk. There are the care bears who don't accept it and whine profusely, but they provide our comic relief here and there.
So the whole "solo players need to learn how to play an MMO" mindset really is an empty statement.
I prefer communal game play with a collective purpose myself, but I'm not going to force that view on the single account mission runner simply because I feel their effort is a waste since they cold be in a fleet at a gate instead. They're making their contribution, again a small one, to the MMO market environment.
Now, as far as solo/casual content, there's an endless supply of it. WH's, exploration, missions, mining, etc We do not need new NPC's to shoot at. At most, maybe some of the older missions replaced with missions that aren't the smae thing over and over. Missions that could not be written out step by step in missions guides. Other than that, I don't see a need for additiona;l solo content or new high sec systems in which to house it. Low sec needs love and Null mechanics still need work. |
Brainless Bimbo
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
17
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 14:15:00 -
[94] - Quote
Solo Players...
You mean those who multi client/box and play with them selves or the genuine solo player?
I sometimes think CCP has forgotten the effects of power of two etc as regards what is actual solo play. Is one man and five accounts all on the same grid being thought of as a single solo player or as a group of players working together?
Its all smoke and mirors when its all said and done with meta games in eve |
Jubal Longstreet
State War Academy Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 15:53:00 -
[95] - Quote
I'm a solo player, fairly new-ish (I did play for about 2 months about 4 years ago, which doesn't really counts since "OMG WTF HAPPENED SO MUCH NEW STUFF" since then)
I am super excited about the new content to be added with odyssey! The scanning changes with be an astronomical buff to my solo career *Rim shot*!
I scan, ALOT, in my casual game play (maybe 8 - 16 hrs a week), and the need for grind scanning just took a back burner to combat skills, since the new mods will allow me to tweak my scanners far better than they are now.
Is this 100% "new Content"... i guess not, but that will come when I reship from the scanning ship to the combat ship and get solo bears on the end of my rockets/charges/other munitions instead of just having to salvage behind your semi-afk Navy Raven...
Being able to move from a solo loot pirate to a solo pvp option is a BIG addition (this assuming I can set up a T1 scan frigate to scan at a strength greater than I can now, which can only pull a battleship, battlecruiser up to 100% in any reliable amount of time. Being able to pull a Dessie or Frigate to 100% quickly opens targets that are now within my combat level, therefore, new game content options. )
As has been said, CCP gives you tools, the content YOU create is then in your hands. |
Krax As
Silent Tears in Space
20
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 18:19:00 -
[96] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. i didn't say it didn't. i just pointed out it's the most antisocial activity in eve. you don't want other players with you. i didn't say you didn't want your own personal fleet of 30 accounts. miners don't want to join corps, it's detrimental. miners don't want to share their belts with you, it's detrimental. all miners want are alts. it's an antisocial activity. you sir, are either very good troll, or in fact , have never mined much less mined with the right people. I am taking abreak from pvp and null and all that right now and in the area I am in I have met some of the most friendly, talkative an social people I have yet to encounter in eve.
Only because you are not #46 in that l33t killmail doesnt mean you are antisocial. you might want to look that one up. its a concept hard to grasp it seems.
Now if we are talking those 23 mining alt-fleets orbiting ice fields.. then you might have a point..
|
Krax As
Silent Tears in Space
20
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 18:29:00 -
[97] - Quote
Brainless Bimbo wrote:Solo Players...
You mean those who multi client/box and play with them selves or the genuine solo player?
I sometimes think CCP has forgotten the effects of power of two etc as regards what is actual solo play. Is one man and five accounts all on the same grid being thought of as a single solo player or as a group of players working together?
Its all smoke and mirors when its all said and done with meta games in eve
also a very good and valid point.
social / antisocial.. what some seem to misunderstabnd: its a sandbox, dum dum. and there will always be the kid with hs own shovel int he one corner and wants to remain there. just let him be.
but dont think he doesnt belong in the same sandbox.
also, some people in this game do their very best every single day when they log on to make this kid feel even more lonely and separated from the rest of the bunch. those players call it "harvesting tears" ad such. but in fact, in like 99% of the time, its more of bullying. they do it not becaus they can really gain anyhting from it (i would love to see freighters get blown up and people actually looting those 800.000 m-¦ trit when it drops for profit. real piracy. for loot, bounty and ransom.. but those days seem to be over. now its all about epeenis KB ratings.
those players actually pretend to be l33t, but in fact they only show off their purple armor in wow... same baseheads to me.
some large entities enforce their way of playing. JF is / are a great example. nice toy, great logistics boon. but more content ? honestly, wouldnt it be more "content" when people have to band to escort a caravan of freighters to their destination rather than chaining their alts to cyno the stuff in ??
selfrighteous, condescending people everywhere. |
Danni stark
2
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 18:34:00 -
[98] - Quote
Krax As wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. i didn't say it didn't. i just pointed out it's the most antisocial activity in eve. you don't want other players with you. i didn't say you didn't want your own personal fleet of 30 accounts. miners don't want to join corps, it's detrimental. miners don't want to share their belts with you, it's detrimental. all miners want are alts. it's an antisocial activity. you sir, are either very good troll, or in fact , have never mined much less mined with the right people. I am taking abreak from pvp and null and all that right now and in the area I am in I have met some of the most friendly, talkative an social people I have yet to encounter in eve. Only because you are not #46 in that l33t killmail doesnt mean you are antisocial. you might want to look that one up. its a concept hard to grasp it seems. Now if we are talking those 23 mining alt-fleets orbiting ice fields.. then you might have a point..
all i do in eve is mine, so i guess i'm a troll.
i'm friendly and talkative, i also want you to **** off and not warp in to my asteroid belt. there's a difference between friendly, talkative, and social. social would generally imply some level of interaction beyond a chat box.
you know why those 23 mining alt-fleets exist? because game mechanics mean they get more out of mining by not being in a player corp, by not fleeting with other real people, etc.
being in a fleet with, and being social generally hinders mining. chatting in local/chat channels not so much, however being part of a community as anything other than "a guy to chat to" won't really happen unless you sacrifice gain from mining. it's why i'm in an npc corp because my alternative is potential war decs and awoxing for no reward. if i wanted to chat to the people in a corp, just create our own chat channel. there's no reason for me to actually join their corp, or have them in my fleet, or on my grid.
see?
i'm not saying the people doing mining are antisocial, i'm saying the activity promotes an antisocial playstyle. Yay, this account hasn't had it's signature banned. or it's account, if you're reading this. |
Krax As
Silent Tears in Space
22
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 20:17:00 -
[99] - Quote
Danni stark wrote:Krax As wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Arronicus wrote:Dave Stark wrote:hi, i hear you're a solo player.
let me introduce you to the most antisocial activity in eve, in order to match your highly antisocial personality. it's called mining.
thanks for your time. GTFO. Mining actually works much better as a group, with haulers, and ganglinks. i didn't say it didn't. i just pointed out it's the most antisocial activity in eve. you don't want other players with you. i didn't say you didn't want your own personal fleet of 30 accounts. miners don't want to join corps, it's detrimental. miners don't want to share their belts with you, it's detrimental. all miners want are alts. it's an antisocial activity. you sir, are either very good troll, or in fact , have never mined much less mined with the right people. I am taking abreak from pvp and null and all that right now and in the area I am in I have met some of the most friendly, talkative an social people I have yet to encounter in eve. Only because you are not #46 in that l33t killmail doesnt mean you are antisocial. you might want to look that one up. its a concept hard to grasp it seems. Now if we are talking those 23 mining alt-fleets orbiting ice fields.. then you might have a point.. all i do in eve is mine, so i guess i'm a troll. i'm friendly and talkative, i also want you to **** off and not warp in to my asteroid belt. there's a difference between friendly, talkative, and social. social would generally imply some level of interaction beyond a chat box. you know why those 23 mining alt-fleets exist? because game mechanics mean they get more out of mining by not being in a player corp, by not fleeting with other real people, etc. being in a fleet with, and being social generally hinders mining. chatting in local/chat channels not so much, however being part of a community as anything other than "a guy to chat to" won't really happen unless you sacrifice gain from mining. it's why i'm in an npc corp because my alternative is potential war decs and awoxing for no reward. if i wanted to chat to the people in a corp, just create our own chat channel. there's no reason for me to actually join their corp, or have them in my fleet, or on my grid. see? i'm not saying the people doing mining are antisocial, i'm saying the activity promotes an antisocial playstyle.
again, look it up. I just did so I dont make an idiot out of myself. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-social_behaviour
in fact one could argue that those 23 alt mining fleets are more social by providing an abundance of materials which keeps preices down to a more "reasonable" level. they interact with other players. whats anti-social in their behavior ? they dont force others to play the way they seem right. not as others do who claim their way of playing is better, more woth or whatnot.
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Danni stark
3
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 20:42:00 -
[100] - Quote
Krax As wrote:again, look it up. I just did so I dont make an idiot out of myself. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-social_behaviourin fact one could argue that those 23 alt mining fleets are more social by providing an abundance of materials which keeps preices down to a more "reasonable" level. they interact with other players. whats anti-social in their behavior ? they dont force others to play the way they seem right. not as others do who claim their way of playing is better, more woth or whatnot.
*shrug* perhaps anti social isn't the best word for it, but you know what i'm getting at regardless.
interacting with players in the game world is something miners avoid, for the reasons i listed. they actively avoid interacting with other players because it's nothing but detrimental to their activity. they log in, and spend their time avoiding player interaction.
i don't know any other activity where interaction is always detrimental. Yay, this account hasn't had it's signature banned. or it's account, if you're reading this. |
|
Thorian Crystal
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
16
|
Posted - 2013.04.29 21:21:00 -
[101] - Quote
Random encounters would support many things - Exploration - Solo-players - Fleets (harder encounters) - Etc
Random encounters would be always more or less new. Current missions and incursions are pretty much fixed content. In space where you don't have to draw the ground but can pull stuff together and call it a site, generating random encounters is easy, even. Just decide encounter types and create some lists to roll from.
Eg.
Small site: - 4 to 7 frigs - 1 to 3 cruisers
- from faction x - and 3 to 5 space buildings
- theme: Rogue miners / Pirates / Other criminals / Mad scientists
Also give some strength points and special ability points to the mobs that limits the abilities. Sometimes there could be 1 bs or 15 frigs, but not both.
Bigger site: - more / more strong mobs - more buildings - from stronger faction
Then new content could be new factions etc.
Otherwise missions and incursions are pretty much the same all the time.
I like group content, but the main reason is often the trouble that it takes to find a fleet. So any tools for improving fleet finding / forming would be good. If there were random anomaly finder and you could trust the fleet members, solo people could just find a random fleet and do group content. But in Eve this is more problematic as you have to trust the group members. Still CCP could improve the fleet system so that certain "parties" could have a list of their fleet adverts up somewhere so that people see what fleets there is for them instead of having to ask in a public chat channel is there any fleets up. I mean, not all group activity form up around corporation / alliance. Incursions is an example of this. People don't have to join a corp to run sites with other people .... but currently mostly used mechanism is just "join a chat channel and x up". |
Mardris Fol
Den Sorte Loge
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Posted - 2013.04.29 21:56:00 -
[102] - Quote
0wl wrote:Seriously? Didn't you pay attention to the exploration changes? * Facepalm *
What's good about them for the experienced solo (single account) explorer?
We need to wait to see what they eventually settle on but based on the proposals:
They've trashed 3 months of training, if you've maxed out your skills, by transferring 50% of the value of those high ranked skills to astrometrics.. They've added new scanning modules that will compete for space with your analyser and code breaker. They've simplified the system a lot which means it'll reduce the performance gap between a good scanner and a poor one. And they've changed mining sites from signatures to anomalies, which means you no longer need exploration to find them.
All of this is detrimental.
It's not clear yet whether the new mini-games will be any fun or not but again it's hinted that a solo player won't be able to collect all the loot from these sites any more.
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