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Davis TetrisKing
Turtle Enterprises
15
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
Recently I've noticed a bit more emphasis on the forums about players who play eve 'solo'. From my impression from the forums people tend to dislike soloers (I've read 'eve is a multiplayer game, go back to...' quite a few times lately) so I'm interested to get a bit of a feedback as to what people do and don't like about soloers or solo activities in the game.
*Skip to below for tl;dr*
I'll start off by saying that I definitely have a vested interest in the topic. I am what I think most people would consider a solo player in eve. I pretty rarely group up with other people to accomplish things and having recently moved out to low sec spend most of my time running sites, ratting and generally managing PI on my own.
To me this doesn't mean I have no interaction with other players. I'm not playing a single player game. I'm duking it out on my own in a world full of other pilots that might be able to help me, that I might be able to benefit from or (more likely) are out to get me if I give them a chance. This makes my 'solo' experience far more exciting than anything any single player game could ever give me.
I'm a bit too much of a risk averse carebear at the moment to really get into PvP, but I love the excitement of getting chased around lowsec trying to dodge pirates etc. The way I'm on edge when hauling stuff the few jumps back to high sec. I love raiding WHs knowing that there's a good chance I could die to another enterprising pilot who knows their dscan well enough to drop probes right on me and land on me before I know whats going on. To me the 'solo' experience is so much enriched by the fact that other people are out there.
*tl;dr*
I understand that 'eve is a multiplayer game', and the best way to thrive is to join forces with others. But I like that even if it might not be the 'best' way to go, I can carve out my own piece of eve on my own if I want in a world that is affected by others.
So what are people's main objections to people like myself playing solo? |
Riot Girl
RADIO RAMPAGE Initiative Mercenaries
736
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
Eve is a multiplayer game but it's also a sandbox game, and one which reflects real world society quite closely. People choose to work on their own in the game just as people choose to work alone in the real world. I see no problem with that. Oh god. |
dark heartt
I Own Four Sheep The Methodical Alliance
151
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:12:00 -
[3] - Quote
It's not so much the solo gameplay that people dislike, it's the mindset that people generally get from playing solo. I do a lot of solo activities in game as my time permits, but I also involve myself in the community. I would say that the vast majority of solo players are the miners and industrialists out there and they tend to complain about being killed by gankers and use the 'highsec should be safe argument'.
The other major thing is that they feel solo players don't bring any emergent gameplay to the sandbox, so they don't contribute anything to the game.
That and some people just like to hate on other peoples gameplay styles just because it isn't their own. Bienator II: "You can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose."
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Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
484
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
Davis TetrisKing wrote:
*tl;dr*
I understand that 'eve is a multiplayer game', and the best way to thrive is to join forces with others. But I like that even if it might not be the 'best' way to go, I can carve out my own piece of eve on my own if I want in a world that is affected by others.
So what are people's main objections to people like myself playing solo?
I mainly play solo, and and accept the drawbacks.
I don't feel that the non-solo crowd is that hostile, it's more of solo players complaining that they get shafted, in a multi-player game.
So if you want to play solo, then play solo accept the fact that you are playing solo in a multi-player game, and for some of us, quit moaning about it. CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil. CCP (aka Judge) Peligro: I will find your main.
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Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
2432
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:13:00 -
[5] - Quote
Davis TetrisKing wrote:
I understand that 'eve is a multiplayer game', and the best way to thrive is to join forces with others. But I like that even if it might not be the 'best' way to go, I can carve out my own piece of eve on my own if I want in a world that is affected by others.
So what are people's main objections to people like myself playing solo?
I have no objections whatsoever to people playing solo. It's a viable, if somewhat limiting, play style. I have characters that run solo as well as corp characters and I have equal amounts of fun with either one.
Sandbox right? Play the way you like.
Mr Epeen
There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass! |
dark heartt
I Own Four Sheep The Methodical Alliance
151
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:15:00 -
[6] - Quote
Lors Dornick wrote: So if you want to play solo, then play solo accept the fact that you are playing solo in a multi-player game, and for some of us, quit moaning about it.
That's pretty much the crux of the matter. People don't care about solo players until they complain and unfortunately when they complain they then to do so in a whiny manner that doesn't gel well with Eve's core player base.
Bienator II: "You can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose."
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
2347
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:20:00 -
[7] - Quote
I don't have an issue with solo play per se...
What pisses me off is when solo players expect to be competitive with groups of players and/or feel that they deserve special consideration/mechanics/ships over others who put the effort into dealing with other mouth breathers (which is no small feat).
People always seem to forget that groups like TEST and Goons are composed of "solo players" who have simply decided to pool their individual resources with that of others. Anything done to aid a "true solo player" will always be to the greater advantage of those willing to work together. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Davis TetrisKing
Turtle Enterprises
15
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Makes sense. Must just be all the election/fanfest/Odyssey change speculation has brought out a few complainers.
Looking forward to new exploration stuff... whatever it ends up actually being. |
Erik Dalvon
Dalvon's Drones
0
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:23:00 -
[9] - Quote
dark heartt wrote: I would say that the vast majority of solo players are the miners and industrialists out there and they tend to complain about being killed by gankers and use the 'highsec should be safe argument'.
Though still a newcomer to the game, I currently have very similar attitudes to the game as the OP (if less ambitious, from lack of skills and money). So, I want to have to worry about other players ganking me, but just at the moment I'm not after joining a corporation.
On the quote - if anything, I'd like Hi-Sec to be a little less safe for me, to make it more interesting. This should not a game for people who want safe by default, though "pretty much safe with continuous care and attention in Hi-Sec" is nice. The step down in security from Hi-Sec to Low-Sec in terms of safety feels too great at the moment.
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dark heartt
I Own Four Sheep The Methodical Alliance
151
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:27:00 -
[10] - Quote
You will do well in Eve with that mindset.
There was a time when highsec was a lot less safe and I miss those times. Bienator II: "You can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose."
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Jarod Garamonde
Action Bastards
74
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:28:00 -
[11] - Quote
I enjoy fleet ops as much as the next guy, but there's something to be said for taking some time to yourself. Solo PvP can be quite satisfying, actually. So far, I've got 18 solo kills under my belt, and I'd like to have a lot more in the future. PvE can be tedious and mind-numbing, especially when you're on your own, but many times, it's worth the grind if you do it right.
I don't understand players who completely avoid the social aspect of the game, though. "you can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose."-á --áBienator II |
Riot Girl
RADIO RAMPAGE Initiative Mercenaries
736
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:29:00 -
[12] - Quote
Erik Dalvon wrote: The step down in security from Hi-Sec to Low-Sec in terms of safety feels too great at the moment. Some parts of lowsec are extremely quiet. I know one area where you can make about 10 jumps without seeing another player, so the safety issue just depends on how far you're willing to explore to find somewhere you feel comfortable. Oh god. |
Lost True
Paradise project
2164
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:36:00 -
[13] - Quote
+1
As much as i like that there is a lot of real people that i can interact with. I'd like to do things on my own - when and how i want, maybe sometimes with a others i'm in a mood for it, and leave them if they'll happen to be some unenteresting chodes. in 2007 i've thought it's a sci-fi simulator, not an "e-sports" game. I'm not a teenager, how would i like it much? [-á-¦-¦-Ç-â-é-+-+-¦] -£-¦-¦-+-+-+-¦ -¦-+-Ç-+-+-Ç-¦-å-+-Å Transtellar |
Xavier Quo
Ashfell Celestial Corporation POD-SQUAD
49
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:37:00 -
[14] - Quote
Me too. Solo exploration, avoid pirates, interacting with random people on your journey, that is what eve is for me.
I think sometimes CCP doesn't get that for a lot of people it's a time thing. Sometimes I can only play for an hour or two a week due to work and RL interests. Waiting around for fleets etc is simply not an option for me 90% of the time and I'm guessing for a lot of others as well.
Incentivising group play simply won't work on me, no matter how big the incentive, and making it obvious that you are losing out for being solo in certain situations is a huge mistake in game design. |
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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire
7913
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:37:00 -
[15] - Quote
Main objective, do what I find interesting and appealing.
/c
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3341
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Some parts of lowsec are extremely quiet. I know one area where you can make about 10 jumps without seeing another player, so the safety issue just depends on how far you're willing to explore to find somewhere you feel comfortable.
That's great for people who are already exploring lowsec. Pity about the people whose only experience with lowsec is picking the wrong gates at the wrong times, arriving to find a gatecamp or a titan smartbombing the gate.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Davis TetrisKing
Turtle Enterprises
17
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:49:00 -
[17] - Quote
Xavier Quo wrote:Me too. Solo exploration, avoid pirates, interacting with random people on your journey, that is what eve is for me.
I think sometimes CCP doesn't get that for a lot of people it's a time thing. Sometimes I can only play for an hour or two a week due to work and RL interests. Waiting around for fleets etc is simply not an option for me 90% of the time and I'm guessing for a lot of others as well.
Incentivising group play simply won't work on me, no matter how big the incentive, and making it obvious that you are losing out for being solo in certain situations is a huge mistake in game design.
Yeah the bit about time management is a big one for me. I have pretty sporadic playing times depending on what's going on in life. One week I'll be on every night for 4-5 hours, then I might be away for a week, or only on 4 or 5 times in a month if I'm away for work etc. so I found it hard in the past to stay active in corps. The part of eve that makes it hard to trust people too much makes the stereotypical MMO 'PUG' pretty much a non-option, but I'm ok with all of that, it's part of the charm of eve.
I'm more than happy for CCP to 'incentivise' group play, but yeah when its made really obvious that you're losing out because you're solo it doesn't feel great. The new *not being able to loot all the cans from hacking* seems a bit like a dangling candy in front of a baby and then snatching it away, but I spose I'll work with what CCP give me, as long as I get at least some of the candy. |
Davis TetrisKing
Turtle Enterprises
17
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:56:00 -
[18] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Riot Girl wrote:Some parts of lowsec are extremely quiet. I know one area where you can make about 10 jumps without seeing another player, so the safety issue just depends on how far you're willing to explore to find somewhere you feel comfortable. That's great for people who are already exploring lowsec. Pity about the people whose only experience with lowsec is picking the wrong gates at the wrong times, arriving to find a gatecamp or a titan smartbombing the gate.
Haha, still remember years ago my first trip to Ammamake (somewhat notorious low sec system in Minmatar space). I had just bought myself a shiny new Ferox (lololol fail ship etc, at the time I thought it was the coolest thing ever) and thought I might just duck into Ammamake to pick up a skill book instead of taking a few more jumps to a safer place. Ship didn't last long at all to the gatecamp on the other side. Good learning experience and for the next while I didn't go into low in anything bigger than a frigate.
I was lucky though and not long after had a few good people in a corp I joined run me through how to survive flying around in low sec, using dscan and making safe spots/undocks etc. That's one of the areas where you lose out on when flying solo, there's so much other players can teach you. |
Tuttomenui II
Aliastra Gallente Federation
59
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Posted - 2013.05.01 07:59:00 -
[19] - Quote
I solo to earn isk, but I will band together with others to have fun doing pvp or helping others do some pve. Not possible to avoid solo play completely. And your really missing out if you only do solo. |
Josef Djugashvilis
Acme Mining Corporation
1184
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Posted - 2013.05.01 08:08:00 -
[20] - Quote
Unfortunately, there are many folk in Eve with the mind set, 'you are not playing the way I want you to, so you are not playing properly' This is not a signature. |
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Algarion Getz
Aideron Corp
2
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Posted - 2013.05.01 08:23:00 -
[21] - Quote
Davis TetrisKing wrote:Haha, still remember years ago my first trip to Ammamake (somewhat notorious low sec system in Minmatar space). I had just bought myself a shiny new Ferox (lololol fail ship etc, at the time I thought it was the coolest thing ever) and thought I might just duck into Ammamake to pick up a skill book instead of taking a few more jumps to a safer place. Ship didn't last long at all to the gatecamp on the other side. Good learning experience and for the next while I didn't go into low in anything bigger than a frigate. lol, exactly the same happened to me when i was new, except that i was flying a rupture.
Xavier Quo wrote:I think sometimes CCP doesn't get that for a lot of people it's a time thing. Sometimes I can only play for an hour or two a week due to work and RL interests. Waiting around for fleets etc is simply not an option for me 90% of the time and I'm guessing for a lot of others as well.
Incentivising group play simply won't work on me, no matter how big the incentive, and making it obvious that you are losing out for being solo in certain situations is a huge mistake in game design. signed
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Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
485
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Posted - 2013.05.01 08:49:00 -
[22] - Quote
Before anyone posts the obvious "we are solo and we fund eve and CCP are stupid because they listen to forum trolls".
CCP knows exactly who's paying their bills, they have a section of their staff dedicated to knowing who pays their bills.
You can post random data from eve, but CCP has all the data, they don't need you and your data is irrelevant.
If CCP decides to kill off solo play than it's based on data that is superior to your random guess.
I'll be here, learning, adapting and making more isk.
CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil. CCP (aka Judge) Peligro: I will find your main.
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Ihazcheez Hashur
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.05.01 08:56:00 -
[23] - Quote
To the OP - I kinda feel strongly about this, and I know some of this will come out wrong but I wear my heart on my sleeve :) - I like solo play and the game very nicely caters for everything I want to do. I do otherwise band together with friends and we have a great deal of fun running level 3 and 4 PVE missions. Actually high sec for us is the perfect place to be, and none of us are interested in direct PvP - as it just doesn't appeal at all. It's just the way we are, a reflection of what we're like as people in the real world.
I do hear a lot of mention to 'emergent story'. Actually emergent story is in the eye of the beholder. For me what happens in <0.5 is inconsequential, whatever happens "out there" really is irrelevant, we're a self sustaining unit can mine and manufacture our own ships and fittings. EvE caters perfectly for it, in fact I'll go as far as to say it almost feels 'designed' for this kind of self sufficient nomadic life style. lol I can almost feel the temperature rise as I typed that! Please don't cross-examine :)
We're exploring now the possibility of setting up in a wormhole, certainly with new up and coming changes it does sound interesting; but we're kinda tangled of going against our philosophy of stepping out of high sec safety for the probable fact that someone will attack our stuff whilst we're not in game and waste the countless amount of time we pour into the 'adventure'. I work in the city, and cannot guarantee I'll get home before midnight sometimes - the thought of folks playing 24/7 and 'killing' our stuff whilst at work or away on business just feels like a major achilles heel.
I digress, in any case, in our own little metagame of eve we have 'emergent story' flooding out in waves, but interesting others think we add no value. I guess it's because the risk averse players like to stick to places of safety, and in my mind 100% nothing wrong with that.. I do find that those that like to PVP and prey on others are just sitting in the middle of their "spider webs" waiting hours for that odd industrial to stray through, or whatever.. I personally think they HATE it because IT IS possible to remain in high sec 100% of the time and have an infinite amount of fun without losing your stuff in otherwise pointless ganks or NULL SEC blobs. I does feel like there's a campaign to stranglehold high sec more and more to force risk averse out and into the spider webs to appease the <0.5 bored.
There we go! A guided tour of my thoughts and a glimpse of our corner of this awesome sandbox.
TLDR; EvE caters perfectly to a variety of play styles, including the risk averse. It's what you make it that counts, not getting forced to stick your toes into piranha infested waters against your will. |
Trevellian Pendragon
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.05.01 09:06:00 -
[24] - Quote
I am almost exclusively a solo player in EvE.
With a bit of navel-gazing I surmise this is down to two reasons, one environmental and one internal. The environmental reason os that I have very erratic and limited time to play (2 children under the age of 3 and a full-time job in an Ops environment), so it is very hard for me to be online at specific times and contribute much to a corps. Whilst many corps are actually OK with that, it is something that irks me personally and I don't like being somewhere where I cannot contribute.
The internal reason is that sometimes I am just an anti-social hermit and I want to be on my own, doing my own thing. This has led me to (both here and other mmorpgs) actually make alternate characters that are *not* in a corps/guild just so I can go somewhere an not be bugged by other people in the corps/guild.
As far as gameplay goes, I have to accept that my choice of gameplay does limit the experience I will have in the game, and I accept that, although with some of the more modern changes to the game solo play has expanded somewhat (faction warfare etc). |
Just Lilly
68
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Posted - 2013.05.01 09:41:00 -
[25] - Quote
Whenever I want solo gameplay in EvE, I log onto the Singularity server. Powered by Nvidia GTX 690 |
Davis TetrisKing
Turtle Enterprises
20
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Posted - 2013.05.01 09:54:00 -
[26] - Quote
Lors Dornick wrote:Before anyone posts the obvious "we are solo and we fund eve and CCP are stupid because they listen to forum trolls".
CCP knows exactly who's paying their bills, they have a section of their staff dedicated to knowing who pays their bills.
You can post random data from eve, but CCP has all the data, they don't need you and your data is irrelevant.
If CCP decides to kill off solo play than it's based on data that is superior to your random guess.
I'll be here, learning, adapting and making more isk.
Not exactly sure what your post is in response to (I don't think people have been posting data?), but yeah, you're definitely right about CCP having the data and that it's their call to 'kill off solo play' and all that.
I'm just not sure where you're coming from with this post or what exactly you're trying to point out. I don't think solo play is at risk or anything like that, I'm just curious about the community's thoughts on solo pilots. |
Davis TetrisKing
Turtle Enterprises
20
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Posted - 2013.05.01 10:05:00 -
[27] - Quote
Ihazcheez Hashur wrote:To the OP - I kinda feel strongly about this, and I know some of this will come out wrong but I wear my heart on my sleeve :) - I like solo play and the game very nicely caters for everything I want to do. I do otherwise band together with friends and we have a great deal of fun running level 3 and 4 PVE missions. Actually high sec for us is the perfect place to be, and none of us are interested in direct PvP - as it just doesn't appeal at all. It's just the way we are, a reflection of what we're like as people in the real world.
shortened just for readability
TLDR; EvE caters perfectly to a variety of play styles, including the risk averse. It's what you make it that counts, not getting forced to stick your toes into piranha infested waters against your will.
Yep, I have a pretty similar view point. I do think there should be some extra rewards for heading out into dangerous space, but I'm more than happy for people to chill in High Sec. I dislike the PvP camper attitude that seems to be 'make them come to my trap, they shouldn't be allowed to stay away from my trap', but I'm not too concerned that CCP will ever do that.
All the best for moving out into WH, it can be pretty exciting at times. It's definitely a lot of work, and quite different to the safe 'do whatever I feel like doing today' feel of high sec, but if it's something you want to do go for it! I did a small stint for a while in WH and burnt myself out from the commitment to the game, but that was as much my own fault as anything. Starting a WH from scratch (we only had 1 person with any WH experience) led to many many late nights and quite a few lost ships, but pretty glad I did it looking back. Good luck! |
Danni stark
56
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Posted - 2013.05.01 10:07:00 -
[28] - Quote
there's nothing wrong with solo players.
there is however, a problem with people who think they should be able to play this like a single player game and never have to interact with others, and cry like a baby with a slapped arse when they do have to. Yay, this account hasn't had it's signature banned. or it's account, if you're reading this. |
Jake Tzestu
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.05.01 10:19:00 -
[29] - Quote
i've never thought of EVE as a MMO, i see it as a sandbox game that has the option of MMO or Solo play.
I think a lot of ppl dislike the gamers who complain with no really point to the moan. CCP offer a game and you get the choice to play or not to play. Moaning doesnt really help and thats what ppl seem to react too.
so what i have just done (sort of) is moan about the moaners. Hmmmm |
Davis TetrisKing
Turtle Enterprises
20
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Posted - 2013.05.01 10:27:00 -
[30] - Quote
Jake Tzestu wrote:so what i have just done (sort of) is moan about the moaners. Hmmmm
Haha, dont we all... |
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