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Waut
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Posted - 2005.10.12 09:45:00 -
[1]
When the battlecruiser came out, it was supposed to be the link between the cruiser and the battleship; being a poor man's battleship. But lets be honest, the battlecruiser is more of a heavy cruiser than a light battleship. How about adding the Heavy Battlecruiser as a new shipclass? (and I mean a completely new shipclass, NOT a tech 2 version of the battlecruiser).
The Heavy Battlecruiser will be the true link between cruiser and battleship. With a powergrid of around 3000-4000MW it will be able to mount one battleship sized weapon, while the rest of the slots can be fitted with cruiser sized weapons.
Again, I don't want to see this ship become a tech 2 version of the battlecruiser. I want this ship becoming an affordable ship (both in skillpoints and isk) for the newer player rather than what the HAC is compared to the cruiser
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Missle Rider
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Posted - 2005.10.12 10:11:00 -
[2]
Have you trained up and used a Battle Cruiser???
A Battle cruiser is designed to be easy to fly for newer players that can't afford a Battleship.
The BC can be a very effective ship if your trained right. Tech 2 weapons and Items make them great mid-level ships while working for them HAC's :)
If they added a heavy cruiser the price would end up like the HAC's and only the well trained/wealth players would have them.
If you are not tech 2 trained for medium weapons and items to out fit the BC, try it... I did and my view of them changed and I fly one almost all the time now.
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Waut
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Posted - 2005.10.12 10:36:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Waut on 12/10/2005 10:39:28
Originally by: Missle Rider Have you trained up and used a Battle Cruiser???
Yes, I've flown a ferox for a long time with battlecruiser skill IV before I could afford my first battleship.
I was having a ball with it at level 3 missions but when I moved to 0.0, assuming I had something of a poor man's battleship, I was very dissapointed that I couldnt even kill the cheapest (500k) NPC battleship there (ok, it was a blood raider, so if you shieldtank you're rather gimped anyway altough I think all BC will have a hard time). It simply lacked that extra punch to kill it.
So as much as I liked the ferox, its just more of a heavy cruiser than the light battleship it should have been
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El'jonson
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Posted - 2005.10.12 10:40:00 -
[4]
I have been saying that Bcs are more like heavy cruisers 4 ages, a proper battlecruiser should fit 2 or 3 bs sized weapons and b nearly as fast as a cruiser. And why the hell they have given the bcs 'command abilities' I have no idea, whats the point in having a command bc in any decent sized fight its not going 2 last v long at all.
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NattyDreadlock
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Posted - 2005.10.12 11:11:00 -
[5]
So maybe the problem ies in that there is no BC class of weapons. A class that has additional damage potential over normal cruisers(I havent looked into how much more, maybe 33-50%...maybe)and would force normal cruisers to sacrifice the number of available turrets online due to its cpu/power requirements if they attempted to use them(maybe a special BC bonus to cpu/powergride for these weapons). These BC weapons would still have lower damage output compared to BS weapons. Battlecruiser already benefit from additional armor, as they should, but they certainly shouldnt be as fast or as nimble as cruisers. They have to sacrifice that for the extra mass/armor to be more survivable.
_____________________________ You hit "insert pirate" with a frozen turd right in the eye from your 150mm railgun for 0.0 damage. |
Resin Kadir
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Posted - 2005.10.12 11:23:00 -
[6]
The thing is you get more turrets to fit and more high slots. Don't know how good you are at pvp but the battlecruisers are very effective if used correctly. They get higher resistances, a ton more cap and a lot better fittings than cruisers and you can generally fit them to exceed BS armor or shields with higher resistances. Not to mention the are smaller than a BS and a little harder to hit for a battleship. _________________________________________
Shoot Squelch first, it was his idea! |
Waut
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Posted - 2005.10.12 11:38:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Resin Kadir The thing is you get more turrets to fit and more high slots. Don't know how good you are at pvp but the battlecruisers are very effective if used correctly. They get higher resistances, a ton more cap and a lot better fittings than cruisers and you can generally fit them to exceed BS armor or shields with higher resistances. Not to mention the are smaller than a BS and a little harder to hit for a battleship.
What about simply a new battlecruiser for every race? Current battlecruisers have a good defence for their size but are still lacking in the damage compartment. So why not add a second battlecruiser that can deal more damage but has a not quite as good defence?
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TuRtLe HeAd
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Posted - 2005.10.12 11:49:00 -
[8]
A New Battlecruiser Per RACE is an EXCELLENT Idea !
Make it require Battlecruiser Level 3 or 4.
But Yeah Battlecruisers area Perfect in between For cruisers to Battleships.
They got half the Armour/Shield and Hull.
The Ferox and Prophecy are Awesome ships. Never flown a Cyclone.
And Brutixs well, the less said about them the better |
Fester Addams
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Posted - 2005.10.12 11:54:00 -
[9]
Personally I would like to see higher tier battlecruisers for all the races, I would also like to see higher tier destroyers.
The ships are great at what they do bu**** a tad sad that there is only one each of them.
A prefered setup would be 3 destroyer types (tier 1, 2 and 4) and 2 battlecruisers (tier 1 and 3).
for the destroyers I would like to see the tier 4 as a poor mans logistics ship, it could have range bonuses for remote repairers and/or remote shield boosters only 5 offensive high slots (turret/missile hardpoints) allowing for the additional ones to fit the suport modules. The tier 2 I would like to see as an E-war ship, again downgraded firepower as oposed to the current ship but have the stats needed to fit a good e-war setup.
The new battlecruiser could also be made into an E-war ship for all exept for caldari, theirs could be a gunship as they already have the scorp as an E-war.
------------ 20. Is it true all pvpers have carebear alts? Yes, of course. I have so much fun looking up who's alt is who's
kieron Community Manager, EVE Online |
babylonstew
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Posted - 2005.10.12 11:59:00 -
[10]
a new caldari battlecruiser mounting 8 heavy launchers with caracal type bonus would do me
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mirel yirrin
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Posted - 2005.10.12 16:13:00 -
[11]
Originally by: babylonstew a new caldari battlecruiser mounting 8 heavy launchers with caracal type bonus would do me
Can you also give it say 6 midslots so I can use it as a omgwtfpwn Smartbomb ship. I wanna stick 5 CPR II and 1 Cap injector in the meds ^^ --------------------------------- KORKY Is Recruiting now!
Convo me for More Details. |
Atma Darkwolf
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Posted - 2005.10.12 17:50:00 -
[12]
if I was to request anything at all, it would be only that BC's got a agility closer to what cruisers are... nothing else. Honestly, that is the only setback IMO to BC's
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Derron Bel
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Posted - 2005.10.12 17:54:00 -
[13]
Well they could either get heavier weapons than cruisers or more weapons than cruisers. THey got more weapons than cruisers. I think they're fine the way they are.
Incidentally I plan to mount a Cruise Missile launcher on my Prophecy ;) -==- Holy-Jim> as you know, surprise is the key to victory.....surprise! LooseCannoN> ahh! LooseCannoN> my plans have been foiled! |
Fusa Iyuki
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Posted - 2005.10.12 19:18:00 -
[14]
The battlecruiser is like the destroyer. It's designed to be a cruiser killer like a destroyer is a frigate killer, not a light cruiser. ----- Fifteen blows to the back of your head // Fifteen blows to your mind |
Clowdancer
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Posted - 2005.10.12 21:22:00 -
[15]
why new class? why make things complicated...
just add some cpu,pg & armor and you have much better ship.
dont make things complicated as ccp does not have recources to deal with it, keep it simple.
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Jigglepants
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Posted - 2005.10.12 22:04:00 -
[16]
Call it a Pocket Battleship.
Then I could name mine the Graf Spee.
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NattyDreadlock
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Posted - 2005.10.13 02:08:00 -
[17]
Thats right, thats the class name! I knew there were ships made that were considered affordable stop gaps. Though I thought they were just considered basically battlecruisers...though I guess thats the point of the post :) I always thought dreadnoughts were basically battleships of a specific type design.
Anyway, yeah, the pocket battleship seems like a nice unoffical term.
_____________________________ You hit "insert pirate" with a frozen turd right in the eye from your 150mm railgun for 0.0 damage. |
Studd Beefpile
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Posted - 2005.10.13 03:15:00 -
[18]
The battleships we have now are currently excellent ships, but they are not battlecruisers. Historically, battlecruisers were ships that were armored and engined like cruisers, but armed with battleship weapons. The ships we currently have are armored close to battleships, but gunned like cruisers. The way I see it, battlecruisers should be set up with similar stats to what they have, but with substantial bonus's to using large guns and cruiser/siege missiles
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Waut
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Posted - 2005.10.13 08:00:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Jigglepants Call it a Pocket Battleship.
Yeah, that's exactly what I meant
Altough I also liked the idea of higher tier battlecruisers
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DutchGunner
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Posted - 2005.10.13 09:17:00 -
[20]
Most people just want to have more guns and firepower in a BC. BC will play a big role when using the Gang Assist Modules. Imagine the increased efficency at EW or the lower signature radius on Assault Ships and Heavy assault ships.
The potential of the BC is great, not as a frontline fighter but as support and leading a battle. A group of BC can increase the effectiveness of a group of ships greatly. Being outnumberd 2 to 1 doesnt matter anymore. When outnumberd 4 to 1 will start to become a problem then.
So it all comes down to how u use what is available.
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Leandro Salazar
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Posted - 2005.10.13 14:18:00 -
[21]
Since I have a high interest in historical navies and started flying BCs in EVE not too long ago, I gotta say that the BCs here disappoint me. Like someone else already mentioned, the usual Battlecruisers were ships of Battleship size with a low barrel count of low end Battleship weapons, cruiser speed and somewhere between cruiser and Battleship protection. Designed to outrun anything they cant outfight and outfight anything that could run them down. In EVE the current battlecruisers are pretty much just historical heavy cruisers as they can mount the heaviest cruiser weapons in large quantities, but none of the low end BB weaps. To address that, they should get a CPU/PG increase that will allow them to mount a few (2-3) of the low end rails/arties, but nowhere near as many as BBs and not ever more than 1 of the really heavy ones. And the gang module bonus should maybe replaced with a large gun bonus in addition to the med gun bonus they already got. Battlecruisers due to their fragile nature are just not very suitable for flagships imho. And many if not most players, especially the newer ones that are the most likely to use BCs because of the low skill reqs, have little to no interest in PvP, so the gang module bonus really is totally useless to them. These bonuses really should come to bear in a higher skill ship class only.
Cheers Krait
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elFarto
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Posted - 2005.10.13 16:16:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Waut I was very dissapointed that I couldnt even kill the cheapest (500k) NPC battleship there (ok, it was a blood raider, so if you shieldtank you're rather gimped anyway altough I think all BC will have a hard time). It simply lacked that extra punch to kill it.
The ferox sucks for this, I tried in mined. I could take the damage for a while, but nowhere near enough damage output.
I've recently trained up to use a Prophecy, and remembering I have ~400k in gunnery, I have successfully taken down a 750k Blood Dark Priest and a 500k Blood Shadow Sage.
Regards elFarto
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NattyDreadlock
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Posted - 2005.10.13 17:48:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar Since I have a high interest in historical navies and started flying BCs in EVE not too long ago, I gotta say that the BCs here disappoint me. Like someone else already mentioned, the usual Battlecruisers were ships of Battleship size with a low barrel count of low end Battleship weapons, cruiser speed and somewhere between cruiser and Battleship protection. Designed to outrun anything they cant outfight and outfight anything that could run them down. In EVE the current battlecruisers are pretty much just historical heavy cruisers as they can mount the heaviest cruiser weapons in large quantities, but none of the low end BB weaps. To address that, they should get a CPU/PG increase that will allow them to mount a few (2-3) of the low end rails/arties, but nowhere near as many as BBs and not ever more than 1 of the really heavy ones. And the gang module bonus should maybe replaced with a large gun bonus in addition to the med gun bonus they already got. Battlecruisers due to their fragile nature are just not very suitable for flagships imho. And many if not most players, especially the newer ones that are the most likely to use BCs because of the low skill reqs, have little to no interest in PvP, so the gang module bonus really is totally useless to them. These bonuses really should come to bear in a higher skill ship class only.
Cheers Krait
I think this post addresses the issue of the current Battlecruiser.
_____________________________ You hit "insert pirate" with a frozen turd right in the eye from your 150mm railgun for 0.0 damage. |
Fester Addams
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Posted - 2005.10.13 19:23:00 -
[24]
Giving battlecruisers a Power and CPU bonus for large weapons much like the Stealth Bomber have to be able to fit siege launchers could be a nice touch, if the devs tweak it right it would be possible to allow a BC to fit one or two large weapon modules as well as filling upp their repmaining slots with med weapons.
I am however still more inclined to seeing additional ships in the class as oposed to altering the ships already ingame.
Battlecruisers do deserve to have more than a tier 1 ship for each faction as do destroyers.
------------ 20. Is it true all pvpers have carebear alts? Yes, of course. I have so much fun looking up who's alt is who's
kieron Community Manager, EVE Online |
Derron Bel
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Posted - 2005.10.13 23:20:00 -
[25]
You'd need to make the bonuses weapon-class based, (like large energy turret / large hybrid rather than just large) IMHO.
It'd be one way to desuckify the Cyclone... give it bonuses to mounting battleship missile launchers, and it would have a nice combo for sure. -==- Holy-Jim> as you know, surprise is the key to victory.....surprise! LooseCannoN> ahh! LooseCannoN> my plans have been foiled! |
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