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Danni stark
393
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Posted - 2013.05.26 15:29:00 -
[31] - Quote
Silvetica Dian wrote:TL:DR If null sec needs it they have the manpower and the organisation to get it.
even more so when you can get a max yield retriever pilot for exactly 1 plex after the expansion when dual training becomes a thing. 1 plex for a character that can earn 50m/hour and help your alliance. it's a steal! Ice Mining Skill Plan. |
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
1073
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Posted - 2013.05.26 16:54:00 -
[32] - Quote
Danni stark wrote:
is there really still an argument for having a shortage?
Yep no one (less then 2%) mines ice currently in non HI sec. Thi is mostly due to **** tanks of barges. So even with the announced changes how many now are mining ICE in NULL/lo sec An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |
Danni stark
395
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Posted - 2013.05.26 20:15:00 -
[33] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Danni stark wrote:
is there really still an argument for having a shortage?
Yep almost no one (less then 6% of those that mine ice) mines ice currently in non HI sec. This is mostly due to **** tanks of barges. Skiff's & procurors will rise in price in NULL sec soon I bet. So even with the announced changes how many new miners are there now are mining ICE in lo sec
you say that like the number of people that mine ice now in non-high sec is relevant. due to the fact that ice mining is changing, what is happening currently is largely irrelevant.
nobody will mine anything in low sec. it's low sec, and it's bad.
also the tank of barges is irrelevant, even in null sec. just drop one ratting ship in the belt with you and nuke the rats before they do any damage to anything. Ice Mining Skill Plan. |
Felicity Love
STARKRAFT Joint Venture Conglomerate
636
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Posted - 2013.05.26 20:20:00 -
[34] - Quote
... wonders if an ice "interdiction" during Odyssey might set the stage for the emergence of an ice cartel, given the changes to both valuable moon resources and ice dynamics.
Proud Beta Tester for "Bumping Uglies for Dummies" |
Danni stark
396
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Posted - 2013.05.26 20:47:00 -
[35] - Quote
Felicity Love wrote:... wonders if an ice "interdiction" during Odyssey might set the stage for the emergence of an ice cartel, given the changes to both valuable moon resources and ice dynamics.
probably but would it be worth it? could you raise the prices of ice enough with this kind of method to make it more lucrative than just mining the **** out of everything and dumping it to the market? i mean. look at notec. from what i gather that was "hoard it all and get rich" yet the only people that got rich were the people not in notec as they sold their stockpiles on the following price spike... (or i could be talking ****, i didn't really understand notec) Ice Mining Skill Plan. |
Felicity Love
STARKRAFT Joint Venture Conglomerate
636
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Posted - 2013.05.26 22:27:00 -
[36] - Quote
Indeed, but if it's worth it then it will be done. Such an effort would not only spike the costs of running POS but also put increasing constraints on large cap ship operations. So, that kind of economic warfare becomes not only lucrative but strategic.
All of which would also fulfill CCP's desire to see ice products become a major conflict driver.
I guess we'll see when the time comes.
Proud Beta Tester for "Bumping Uglies for Dummies" |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
648
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Posted - 2013.05.27 14:23:00 -
[37] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Danni stark wrote:
is there really still an argument for having a shortage?
Yep almost no one (less then 6% of those that mine ice) mines ice currently in non HI sec. This is mostly due to **** tanks of barges. Skiff's & procurors will rise in price in NULL sec soon I bet. So even with the announced changes how many new miners are there now are mining ICE in lo sec Explain to me please what makes a Skiff better than a Mack in null sec? The Tank? What good does a tank do on a ship that can not fight back? If you are in Null sec in a situation where you need your tank it better just be for rats. If a PVPer or small gang gets you in a situation where they are eating through your tank you have already lost. If you are tackled and being attacked what is going to happen? You are not going anywhere, you are going to get popped. Will a larger tank prevent this? No, you are tackled and not going anywhere. An 80K ehp tank will only mean the attackers need a few extra seconds to kill you, that tank will not save you.
In high sec tank saves you, when they attack they only have 20-30 seconds to kill you before CONCORD shows up. Extra tank means they need to bring more DPS to kill you in that 20 second window. In null sec there is no window, no limit to the time they have to kill you. All they have to do is tackle you and you are dead, tank only affects how many seconds it takes to kill you, it does not allow you to get away.
What happens if you are lucky enough to have a friendly gang in the area that can come to your aid? Well chances are from the time you call for help until the cavalry arrives will be a couple minutes. Even a solo BC can kill a skiff in a couple minutes. Best case scenario is the friendly fleet catches the attackers and kills them, but chances are you are still dead before they get there.
So what does help you survive in null sec in a mining ship. The answer is speed. Being able to align and warp before they land on grid will do you much more good than having a large tank, normally once you start taking damage the fight is already decided. A skiff does have better speed and agility than the other mining ships, except the Venture. A venture can mine some what safely anywhere. It is very fast to warp out and has a +2 warp strength, So if they do get a lock on you they need 3 points to lock you down. A skiff, while much better than a Mack in this regard is still not near fast enough to escape. Maybe restoring the skiffs +2 warp strength would make it the ultimate null sec miner.
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Styth spiting
Ion Corp. NightSong Directorate
315
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Posted - 2013.05.28 05:45:00 -
[38] - Quote
igot theteef wrote:is it just me or does it seem like there is going to be a massive Liquid ozone shortage with the new changes? From what i can find there are approx 145 ice belts currently in high sec each getting 2500 blocks each respawning every 4 hours. So basicly if i am understanding what the devs are saying each ice belt will become an ice anom so 145x 2500x 25lo= a little over 9 mil liquid ozone. now if it is minned like clockwork in all of high sec 5 times a day you get what 45 mil lo? At that rate if they are mined out at that rate they can only supply enough ozone to fuel 10 large pos's a day. I mean correct me if i am wrong but it seems like lo will fing skyrocket after the new expansion and after the glut of liquid ozone
145 belts x 2500 blocks x 4 (assuming 1 hour to mine, 1 hour to respawn) is about the max spawn rate (it would take nearly 21 exhumers to mine out a belt in less then 1 hour). 1,450,000 blocks per day.
25 liquid ozone per block = 36,250,000 liquid ozone.
150 liquid ozone per run of 40 fuel blocks = 241,666 runs, or 9,666,640 fuel blocks.
40 fuel blocks per hour, 24 hours per day = enough fuel blocks to fuel 10,069 large POS for 1 day, or 335 POS for 1 month, or 27 POS for 1 year.
Total ice mined per month could fuel 10,050 large POS for 1 month, or 837 large POS for 1 year.
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3457
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Posted - 2013.05.28 06:37:00 -
[39] - Quote
Silvetica Dian wrote:If null sec needs it they have the manpower and the organisation to get it.
I look forward to seeing the result of nullsec alliances putting out CTA for ice harvesting operations. Will they end up harvesting ice or will people stop logging in and responding to Jabber pings?
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Danni stark
405
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Posted - 2013.05.28 07:26:00 -
[40] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Silvetica Dian wrote:If null sec needs it they have the manpower and the organisation to get it.
I look forward to seeing the result of nullsec alliances putting out CTA for ice harvesting operations. Will they end up harvesting ice or will people stop logging in and responding to Jabber pings?
give a new player a plex and he can play for 30 days. give a new player a plex after odyssey and he can train a 25 day hero retriever and play for free if he gives the alliance 10-11 hours of his time each month mining ice. Ice Mining Skill Plan. |
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