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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 82 post(s) |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4102
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Posted - 2013.05.23 19:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
Since this has been an appreciated suggestion on the other thread, I am going to repost it here.
It deals with an idea about how to greatly streamline the users experience including multi-accounters and comes with screenshots of mock up screens.
Super extra constructive usability suggestion with screenshots!
With reference to this anticipation:
Considering the passwords will be stored in the cloud, the following IS possible to do and will provide easy transition from the current log in scheme to the future "master account" implementation.
Phase 1: current mechanic.
One easy to use check box list with the account names. The choices are only done once, then they are saved so the users will always presented with the saved checkboxes selection already made.
One button to start all the selected accounts (and thus clients).
Screenshot
Phase 2: master account / single sign on.
It's an extension of the above.
Now when you check an account name, it automatically expands and shows the 3 characters in that account. The user chooses which character to play with a simple checkbox.
One button to start all the selected characters, no hassle, no need to select characters in game any more => usability.
This hierarchical selection is more difficult to code, but you can implement it well past Odyssey.
Screenshot. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4105
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Posted - 2013.05.23 20:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Phase 2: master account / single sign on.It's an extension of the above. Now when you check an account name, it automatically expands and shows the 3 characters in that account. The user chooses which character to play with a simple checkbox. One button to start all the selected characters, no hassle, no need to select characters in game any more => usability. This hierarchical selection is more difficult to code, but you can implement it well past Odyssey. Screenshot. Or simply have each account represented by a drop-down box displaying the 1-3 characters on that account with a checkbox to launch a client for that account. Or with amalgamated accounts, simply have two columns: one for number of paid login slots (aka "subscriptions"), the other with all the characters associated with this account. Player drags characters into login slots, clicks "Play", launcher spawns the required clients, connected to the selected character(s).
Drop boxes are good for occasional, not repeating data entry. We are talking about gamers that want a smooth experience, not office workers. What I propose does not cause issue with people using keyboard, those who like to TAB through controls, those who like to "point and click" without rolling in and out stuff and even - for the future - those who will use a touch screen to select the characters.
Anyway, almost any approach including yours is going to be quicker and more practical than the current implementation. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4105
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 20:29:00 -
[3] - Quote
MaRU2760 133 wrote: The question remains, though, "If a significant percentage of the playerbase is still having problems after three days, why didn't you roll it back?" That really seems strange to me.
Making software ready for a possible rollback is a task with challenges and cost and also requires a specific, conservative corporate attitude.
I.e. I developed such kind of software for the military. Their budgets were not tight, their delivery schedule was not super-tight, they knew that things *can* go wrong.
CCP budget is not of such size, they timed this delivery with a very small window (right before Odyssey, it HAS to be pushed out before it, as Odyssey prolly don't even have a log in screen coded at all) and CCP management are very, VERY overconfident and prone to these incidents.
Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4105
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Posted - 2013.05.23 20:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
MaRU2760 133 wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:MaRU2760 133 wrote: The question remains, though, "If a significant percentage of the playerbase is still having problems after three days, why didn't you roll it back?" That really seems strange to me.
Making software ready for a possible rollback is a task with challenges and cost and also requires a specific, conservative corporate attitude. I.e. I developed such kind of software for the military. Their budgets were not tight, their delivery schedule was not super-tight, they knew that things *can* go wrong. CCP budget is not of such size, they timed this delivery with a very small window (right before Odyssey, it HAS to be pushed out before it, as Odyssey prolly don't even have a log in screen coded at all) and CCP management are very, VERY overconfident and prone to these incidents. You're saying it isn't as simple as just going back to the previous version of the Login screen? I didn't know that. TY
Well I can't know the exact details but reverting the change is probably not just about giving back the old patcher executable.
You'd have to "de-patch" bits of EvE (easy enough) but also to revert database structure changes, move database rows back to where they used to be, undo changes to files (it's delicate, you have seen how one of the glitches was exactly apparently losing the settings) and who knows what else back end operations to revert to the previous status.
If you plan a complex system to be "transactional" and basically support "undos" then you can indeed roll back, but I assure you it's VERY time and personnel expensive to do that. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4107
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Posted - 2013.05.23 22:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
CCP Atropos wrote:Could you tell me your reasons for having more than one installation (either physical or via junctions/symlinks) if you are able to start a client with a given set of settings.
It's FUNDAMENTAL that there's a mechanism to store per computer unique settings.
Feasibility: you can do it, because you already fingerprint the clients and you can use it as "hash code" / index to look up for sets of settings.
Why do it: because many, MANY of us have these super common use cases:
Use case 1:
Computer at home, computer at work / school / relatives.
Use case 2:
Multiple computers at home and the same accounts sometimes need to run on one computer, other times on another(s).
Typically, whereas a majority will only play 1-2 accounts on the same computer forever, many multi-accounters (read: those who pay CCP more) have a variety of computers to run EvE on.
I have 5 computers at home, all with EvE installed. I also have one notebook at the office to play EvE during lunch break (here they last hours ) and a netbook for the same task.
At home I may play 4 clients on my main rig (very powerful) at high graphics settings for "top level" EvE game play but also to do refresh Planetary Interaction on 106 planets (one hundred six) and this is best done in a computer that is fast and detailed graphics.
Some days I will play 2 clients on that computer and 4 on another.
Other days I need to play 1 account (say PvE / PVP) + 1 Orca booster character and on another computer 2 mining alts and on another computer another 2-3.
Other days I need to trade the EvE markets and I fire up the clients on less power expensive laptops maybe while doing PvE on the powerful computer and mining on less powerful computers.
Other days I play another MMO plus Orca booster on main computer and miners on laptops or another less powerful computer.
In any case, limit my freedom once again by removing many years old intelligent and versatile features and my 6 subs will be immediately gone. As obvious consequence I'll also have to abandon my open source EvE softwares and offcial EvE fan website.
It's not a treat or anything, it'll be just an obvious consequence at having been made impossible to play EvE in a moving and shifting world we live in.
In fact I can't configure a one-size-fits-all when one computer is a MONSTER, another is average, a powerful notebook has its different screen size, transparencies etc. etc, the nebook obviously has baseline settings tuned for memory saving and performance.
Edit:
If you will ignore this unexpected users need (we see you missed this possibility and it's worrysome to see so) then get ready for a beating and sh!tstorm that WILL make these days threadnoughs look sweet and educate in comparison.
MANY advanced users including many null sec players with lots of accounts are in my same situation.
I see somehow you guys did not "get" this and this WILL cost a lot to implement since it appears you had no plans to address multi-config. But ignoring it and blindly going ahead will.... ehm.... put you in a situation I don't envy the least. Really. Really. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4112
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Posted - 2013.05.24 07:15:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cevin North wrote:Atropos,
i know you do not support Linux (anymore) and that CCP only loves the bigger brands being Apple and Windows. That is not my problem, your client works fine for what i want to play in EVE and i do not mind not having to walk in stations, as that was a part of the game i did not like anyways because it is not usefull to my gameplay.
Actually - and this shows how CCP's mentality is part of the problem - CCP employees should NEVER dare to say that CCP "does not support XYZ", because they should show respect to those feeding their meals.
The day EvE won't work in Linux any more, it won't be CCP who don't support Linux users, but it will be Linux Customers who stop supporting CCP.
Let's get the fact straight. The one financially on the receiving end of their own failures here, are not the Linux players, but CCP and their choices.
"I cut my needed arms to stop giving you guys your optional entertrainment!" shows the ridicolousness of their statements. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4117
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Posted - 2013.05.24 08:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Actually - and this shows how CCP's mentality is part of the problem - CCP employees should NEVER dare to say that CCP "does not support XYZ", because they should show respect to those feeding their meals.
So if I were to complain that I couldn't get Eve working on my graphic calculator, someone working for CCP can't say 'we don't support that'? "does not support" - You're on your own.
It worked. It works. They made money out of it. For years and years. It's not a NEW request or some novel "we made a tentative new game alpha version, if it won't work, no big deal".
Pray tell me, any specific reason why to spit in those users face after years, when what breaks is an asinine, little and (for now) even optional piece of software that the users themselves have shown they can re-implement in an afternoon?
Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4119
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Posted - 2013.05.24 11:07:00 -
[8] - Quote
Pavaroti wrote:This new launcher is just crap.. say it how it IS! I used to launch Eve, get a Cup of Coffee and listen the awesome music with the epic screen of which update we ever were (Retribution, etc.). And now? Now we got a Crap Launcher with the same **** we got in other MMOs. THIS Way Eve will summon to the mainstream **** the other MMos are. It WAS Epic, it WAS unique... but now? BIG FAIL ON THIS ONE !
What they don't get, is that we play with EvE for its unique and often amazing features.
They keep removing uniqueness (and also features), streamline it down to some low 2 digits IQ loluser.
Dear CCP, once EvE is like any other average MMO, will we keep bearing with the outdated graphics? With the most terrible PvE? With the low skill, mediocre "lol mouse clicker" ships control system? With horrors-just-above-draft-status like PI?
With things like the "user" (AH AH AH) POS / corporation / invention / manufacturing interfaces?
Once EvE will be brought down to be just another Korean thingie, with its mediocre bloatware launcher and no log in screen graphics to save on costs, will PvP alone keep EvE afloat?
I sincerely hope so, but I am not so sure.
People, some or later, get TIRED of this never ending bullcrap. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4125
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Posted - 2013.05.25 08:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
Kangaax wrote: Because obviously, for cost reasons, they can't allocate 20 000 people to test a launcher on every single configuration on earth, and the issue might be on steam or even your connection.
They get free hundreds of people on the SiSi server and they tell the software is not OK and not ready and yet they push it anyway.
How are you going to spin about this, then?
Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4125
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Posted - 2013.05.25 08:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
Balder Verdandi wrote:
Oh, and for CCP Atropos ...... you don't understand why we have multiple clients on a single computer?
Some folks like to play around on SiSi testing various fits that cost 1 ISK versus 40 million ISK.
Some folks like to play pirate without it costing them security status or tons of ISK.
Some folks do beta testing .... like the ones you don't listen to.
What should REALLY worry you and the other players (it worries me a lot!) is that CCP Atropos talks like he/she's been hired from another company 3 days ago and has never witnessed the typical EvE player use-cases.
So, he/she could code some amazing piece of software but it'd still be an unusable piece of junk for what regards me and my accounts.
I need executive, practical game play including streamlined logging in, not some bloatware.
Speaking of bloatware, it's terrible design to make an updater so super heavy weight.
Are we going to need a splash screen and maybe a pre-updater next, so we can wait the updater to load in a whole web browser, access web services, RSS and who knows how much more stuff that HAS to be put in the started application and not in an updater? Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4131
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Posted - 2013.05.27 00:43:00 -
[11] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:It wouldn't be the Summer expansion without CCP causing a ruckus I'm looking forward to the new launcher having the ability to coordinate the simultaneous launch of characters from all my accounts, along with the animated WebGL background with theme music.
Considering they could not even manage to keep the jukebox, I have some doubts about WebGL and theme music. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4132
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Posted - 2013.05.27 10:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
CCP TheRambler wrote:Hi, the autoplay feature has been released this Friday actually. If you don't see the checkbox in the right bottom corner or if it doesn't seem to work, please clear the cache and try again :)
I'd love to read a cogent reasonment about why an updater should embed a whole web browser and of course bring in its slow startup and problems (like clearing cache). Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4132
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Posted - 2013.05.27 16:38:00 -
[13] - Quote
@Above
In the future I don't want some crapola game log in that fiddles with the forums. I want to post on this character while I log in with at least 12 different characters per day. I also use the forums a lot to see if I got in game mail. If they start switching it'll be just the umpteenth loss in functionality they impose on us. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4132
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Posted - 2013.05.28 07:56:00 -
[14] - Quote
Alphea Abbra wrote:CCP Atropos wrote:Just updated my post with the known issues; there are more fixes in testing on Singularity. I find it cute that you're still fixing bugs when the design of the launcher makes itself a bug, in need of workarounds. Could you please address the design flaw/bug in your OPs?
QFT. Besides giving a temporary respite to all those unable to log in, the fixes should just be an ad-interim solution before a real launcher is made.
Real as in, doing what's it supposed to do: patching and making it easy to play. All the rest is junk, bloatware and bad usability in a nutshell. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4145
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Posted - 2013.05.30 12:21:00 -
[15] - Quote
CCP Atropos wrote:I'll consider the matter closed when people start posting "I ran the new EVE Launcher today, and it was awesome!" or threads/posts/EVEMail to that effect.
Then please implement my suggestion + mock screenshots I posted at the beginning of the thread. Or similar other suggestions, which invariably lead to a vastly more streamlined and user friendly clients launch experience. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4146
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Posted - 2013.06.01 08:11:00 -
[16] - Quote
Repeatable bug spotted
1) (I typoed a password) 2) I unadvertedly tabbed till the edit boxes lost focus 3) I pressed backspace believing to still be in the password edit box, to fix the typo 4) Backspace, as focus was not in an edit box, caused the whole left side of the log in window to go away and become blank. That is, the log in window acted like a web browser (which it is) and went back one page in the browser history, which was an empty page. Result: empty log in screen. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4146
|
Posted - 2013.06.01 08:13:00 -
[17] - Quote
Also, if I may add a personal consideration:
after seeing some MMOs moving away from a web based log in (as it causes endless issues) I am surprised seeing CCP jumping in it. You are going for a world of hurt. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4147
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Posted - 2013.06.01 16:40:00 -
[18] - Quote
StevieTopSiders wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Also, if I may add a personal consideration:
after seeing some MMOs moving away from a web based log in (as it causes endless issues) I am surprised seeing CCP jumping in it. You are going for a world of hurt. Thanks pubbie game designer #49680; I'm sure CCP is happy to have an expert like you on their side!
Considering I program computers since 1980 and have played MMOs for the last 12 years, I am sure you have totally hit the score. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4148
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Posted - 2013.06.02 10:14:00 -
[19] - Quote
StevieTopSiders wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:StevieTopSiders wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Also, if I may add a personal consideration:
after seeing some MMOs moving away from a web based log in (as it causes endless issues) I am surprised seeing CCP jumping in it. You are going for a world of hurt. Thanks pubbie game designer #49680; I'm sure CCP is happy to have an expert like you on their side! Considering I program computers since 1980 and have played MMOs for the last 12 years, I am sure you have totally hit the score. :astonishedface: YOU'VE PLAYED MMO'S FOR A LONG TIME OH MY GOD YOU MUST BE UNIQUE
I hope you are just playing dumb. Besides I also DO software, all those years playing MMOs made me see countless types of log in and web based ones were the most problematic (even just for silly things like suddenly expiring certificates, new releases messing up unless players emptied browser cache and so on). On a software for the thousands, every stumbling block has to be removed or made minimal, which is the opposite direction where this whole "launcher-patcher-ads-ridden-heavy-weight-thing-with-Python-and everything-else-embedded" is going. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
4150
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Posted - 2013.06.02 12:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
Colonel Goatbanger wrote: ** Edit: After having read the underlying reasons for the change to the launcher I can only say that I disagree with them. You wish to create a "facebook-esque" platform/experience for users with access to all things possible, evemail, voice etc. Are there any number of reasons supporting this move or is this again some whim or fancy on CCPs part that can divulged to us as to why you would consider this half-of-a-move rather than a complete re-vamp of not only the eve-client (moving from 32-bit to 64-bit architecture) but all integrated services as whole? If you want to bring us a richer experience why do you give us such half-measures?
For those who want Facebook and whatever other "aggregation" feature, why can't CCP just make that an optional feature?
The best feature of Incarna has been the button to disable it, this launcher is the next best candidate.
But no, CCP won't make it optional, because they KNOW that 99% will just disable this umpteenth piece of crap. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
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