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Much Ado About AFK Cloaking

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Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 316	Posted - 2013.06.14 14:32:00 - [1] - Quote Mahpiya Luta wrote: There is this thing called 'afk camping' and two sides to the coin. First things first, it's within the rules of the game, it isn't cheating nor bug-using or what so ever. Cloaky modules are part of this game and have a right to exist. They make sense! So what's all the fuss about anyways? Well, being a system owner/renter in this game is also part of this game. You invest time, money and manpower to raise the military and industrial level and make this game running by producing, ratting, mining. Ahh yes, the boiler plate language.... Quote: It's astounding that all someone (jerk) has to do, in order to destroy other players gameplay, is to sit in a cloaky ship at a savespot and leave his computer for good without even bothering about getting caught. This can't be the idea of this game. You might say: 'Well why dont you kill them when entering the system?' Because, there is a time for the game and there is a tme for real life and you can't have a guarded system 24/7. What is astounding to me is that you can't alter your game play to handle this issue. 1. Rat in a group. Yeah not as efficient, but safer and on the up side a fleet with four guys will burn through anomalies faster...will help keep up that military index. 2. Be on comms in the same channel, that way if someone gets in trouble he can yell for help and people will hear him and can respond. 3. Recon the area (after using dotlan) in the surrounding systems that could host a BLOPs, if all clear it may just be a single cloaky camper, less of a threat. 4. I know you have worked to get the index in that system up, but if you can move over a system. Granted like number 1 not as efficient, but you can still earn isk. 5. Check your rental agreement. Quote: Let's see what we got so far. Cloaky modules make sense and should definitly provide a high amount of savety to a cloaked pilot. Especially bombers, cover-ops and black-ops. On the other hand, having a computer running an alt in a cloaky ship with a cyno field gen fitted and nobody taking care of that alt. After days of not even looking how your cloaky alt is doing, you then suddenly decide to just hotdrop a whole fleet. See...this is due to local. Local tells you a potentially hostile ship(s) has(have) entered system. You see it before he (tehy) even load grid and scoot to safety. Every time this is what you do. So, in response the roaming gangs stop and the AFK cloaking commences. Local, the tool you were using to decrease your risk has been turned against you. To be quite clear, no local, no reason to AFK camp. None at all. Quote: The way I see it, the problem isn't the cloak camping but the 'away from keyboard' claok camping. The solution therefore would be a game feature that doesnt destroy the savtey aspect of cloak modules but forces people to continously watch out for their cloaked alts in order for not getting caught and killed. If you dont watch for your alt, you then lose your ship and pod. Been discussed to death. No really. Your moment of brilliance isn't all that unique or brilliant. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=216699 Quote: The newly added hacking minigame and a vague memory of a star trek sequal from many years ago when I used to watch those things, brought this idea of an scanning minigame to my mind. When scanning for cloaked ships in star trek you still had some fuzzy signatures which when reajusting your probe settings became more clear the more you ajusted them. [snipped the rest]. Yes, yes, yes...a change to probes. The real issue is local. Without local nobody would ever afk cloak camp. They migh AFK to go tinkle, grab a drink, or answer the door, but that is a convenience not a strategic type of game play. Local is what makes it so safe in null. As a result, people hostile to you are using that to make you feel less safe. If they are lucky you begin to feel safe even though they are in local and you provide a hot drop opportunity when they do come back to the keyboard.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 316	Posted - 2013.06.14 14:35:00 - [2] - Quote Mahpiya Luta wrote: You guys life by it. Try buying a ship and having fun in small scale pvp, .... I have, and guess what when ever our fun little gang enters system every one, POSes up, docks up, safes up and cloaks.... How fun is it going 20+ jumps looking for a fight and not getting anything? Not very. So people get bored with the "fun small scale pvp" and switch to BLOPs where the hunters AFK cloak. It is all due to local. Local gives the people in system infallible intel 100% of the time and before the hostiles even load grid let alone hit dscan or rush to a belt.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 317	Posted - 2013.06.14 14:38:00 - [3] - Quote Jint Hikaru wrote: How about if someone in a station/outpost/POS does not perform some mini-game every 15 mins then they get ejected into space in whatever ship they are currently in....!!!!!! I'm not. If you are going to make such a change to cloaks it seems reasonable to me to impose it on other people who are AFK with 100% safety in the game. So, if you go AFK in a station, miss your shot at a mini-game out you go...and to be fair you should be ejected out of docking range.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 317	Posted - 2013.06.14 14:39:00 - [4] - Quote Mahpiya Luta wrote: Robert Caldera wrote: Mahpiya Luta wrote: Well, being a system owner/renter in this game is also part of this game. You invest time, money and manpower to raise the military and industrial level and make this game running by producing, ratting, mining. It's astounding that all someone (jerk) has to do, in order to destroy other players gameplay here I identified your problem, didnt read the rest Your problem is not cloaking its a poor gameplay choice based on lazyness and unwillingness to contribute to the entire spectrum of 0.0 gameplay (rat and dont give a fck about everything else) - this being easily disturbed is a good thing. Cloak is fine, move on. [snipped] Try being a little more constructiv the next time. Ironic coming from a guy who called AFK cloakers jerks.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 322	Posted - 2013.06.14 18:29:00 - [5] - Quote Mahpiya Luta wrote: Because in contrast to you we dont fly phukkin drakes. The worth of our ships go into multiple billions. Really, your not helping your situation with ships like these. Try the following: Train WU 5 AWU 5 The cap skills to 5 The various tanking skills to 5 Fit a T1 or T2 even a T3 ship properly (i.e. with T2 modules). This way if you die you are not out several billion. Worst case scenario a few hundred million. BTW, not a great idea to post that on an open forum....with people having access to locator agents, and can look up what systems your alliance owns etc. Just begging for trouble. If I were your CEO I'd be more than a tad upset.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 330	Posted - 2013.06.15 04:40:00 - [6] - Quote Quote: GÇ£Point out to me a person who has been harmed by an AFK cloaker and I will point out a person who has no business playing this game.GÇ¥ - CCP Soundwave While I agree with the sentiment expressed in the above quote, it is unfortunately, apocraphal.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 338	Posted - 2013.06.16 19:14:00 - [7] - Quote Kraal Utrecht wrote: I have heard from experienced players that everything in EVE can be countered either with proper fit or players experience or mix of both... except cloak-campers. Wrong. Your lack of imagination is the problem. Here is a hint: rat with 3-5 friends. That cloaky will remain cloaked even if he is not AFK. You can also scout surrounding systems in range of a BLOPs or a Titan to ensure the possibility of a hot drop is minimal. It is your problem you are either lazy or not thinking up these counters on your own.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 349	Posted - 2013.06.17 01:26:00 - [8] - Quote Black Dranzer wrote: Somebody in this thread probably wrote: An AFK cloaker is completely harmless. So is a pilot in a pod or a shuttle, but we're still allowed to hunt and kill them. You can't hunt the pilot docked in station or inside a POS. So your argument is not very good.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 354	Posted - 2013.06.17 15:00:00 - [9] - Quote Tchulen wrote: How about when someone who's flying a cloaked ship comes into your system and goes AFK the local chat channel disappears from everyone in system's clients? This would solve your issue of AFK cloakers as you'd know darned well that there was actually an AFK cloaker in your system whilst also removing the free intel you get from local at the same time. I believe this would balance the situation. You gain intel and lose intel. Balance. What do you guys think? What, and face unacceptable risk? You sir are just being totally outlandish!
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 355	Posted - 2013.06.17 16:13:00 - [10] - Quote Gizznitt Malikite wrote: To summarize my points: 1.) AFK cloaking itself is not an issue. It's the ability to hotdrop an unscoutable fleet right on top of you that is unbalancing. 2.) AFK cloaking is the counter-action to the imbalanced intel tool known as local. Inhibiting afk cloaking without addressing the elephant (local chat) in the room is inappropriate and wrong! Technically you could scout the surrounding systems that are in bridge range. For example, if I were ratting in DBRN in Fountain I'd look in a subset of systems in Aridia and Solitude (I doubt somebody would bring in a hostile titan into Fountain). I'd also check the in-game map to see if there are pilots building up in those systems. You could do the same for BLOPs, but the number of systems does get larger and they can move around. So technically such a fleet is scoutable. One could argue it is unreasonable to be looking for a BLOPs gang, but I'd argue if you have one in your space, finding them and trying to evict them is part and parcel of owning sov. Or you could opt to forgo such a tactic, but then complaining about it is rather absurd. You've made a choice, now live with it.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 355	Posted - 2013.06.17 16:56:00 - [11] - Quote Gizznitt Malikite wrote: While you are "technically" right, this is anything but pragmatic! The number of systems in bridge range of just about any system in EvE is 100-200 systems in total. While there are certain "areas" that far more likely, especially if you are deep within sov territory, it's tedious and unrealistic to monitor even the 10 most likely systems while you are out and about. True, but for a Titan, I don't think it will be moving around from system to system. The more likely case, it will have a POS and use that system. For regions with Sov, the Titan will most likely be outside the Sov systems (using the Fountain example, that limits the systems to some in Aridia, Solitude and Fountain core). So that puts it at 25ish or so systems. Much more doable than 100-200. The BLOPs gang is considerably more difficul in that they can move around much more easily. This is where reporting hostiles in intel channels come in. Which is not unlike what Nikk, Mags and others have been talking about; intel you have to work for. And to some extent this is beside the point since if you have an active BLOPs gang, you most likely have an active hunter and not an AFK cloaky. Granted, the hunter may have been AFK cloaking before the BLOPs gang goes active, but as others have pointed out this is due to the nature of local.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 357	Posted - 2013.06.18 23:07:00 - [12] - Quote Bill Saisima wrote: The truth is you never know which 5 minutes out of the 23 hours is there a full gang on a titan - even with cap backup. So the beautiful advices of being 'careful' don't really apply, the advantage is with the cloaker, they engage when they're sure. And I never understood the phobia with local - I assume people just like to troll, I really don't believe people would actually prefer to press d-scan 5000 times in a 4-5 hour gaming session just to farm a half ship's worth of isk one can loose several times in that time frame (not that d-scan actually helps against cyno anyway). Afk camping is not ok. Maybe local isn't ok, but with current game mechanics I don't know what would people do without it. For the same reason I never understood people living in wormholes either, do people use bots to prevent tendinitis from clicking dscan or they just do whatever they do and lose average of 5 ships every day? Your ignorance on this issue is noted.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 358	Posted - 2013.06.19 06:37:00 - [13] - Quote Nikk Narrel wrote: Shhh, don't spoil the bear's belief that cloaks are all powerful... Why just the other day I nearly destroyed all of Eve with my cloaking device.

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