For some reason the words intel and scouting sprang to mind while reading this post. Best defence against insta-lock gate camps is not to be there in the first place.

Before I begin, I am an avid hardcore PVP player, and I am not a carebear, but there is genuinly a problem that needs to be looked at..... Insta lock gate camps. It is just too easy to set up a 10 to 20 man insta lock gate camp in low sec to which a person has no defense whatsoever, and are pretty much assured to lose whatever ship they are flying AND their pod. Other then avoid low sec all together there is really nothing to do to defend yourself. Which eliminates many of eve's more fun elements like faction war. Its at the point where I am afraid to undock and do any faction war gameplay, in fear of some pirate griefing camp at a gate poding me. I have lost over 2 billion isk worth of ships and implants to gate camps in two weeks. I just flew through tama, and I kid you not, there were 31 frozen corpses at the gate from a gate camp. 31.... That's f'ing ridiculous.

We are not talking about pilot error, or strategy, there really genuinly is no defense when u have 20 insta lock thrashers sitting off a gate. Intel is not always good, or available, and it is not exactly reasonable to wait for intel before every jump in low sec. This is not some regular gate camp in which if u fly properly u can burn back to the gate, or align and warp off, we are talking about gate camps that can lock you and your pod instantly while eating dinner and sucking a lolly pop, then ruining your night. Come on guys, this is not pvp, this is pure griefing. Its one thing to set up a genuine gate camp, it's another to be able to exploit ships so easily so as to turn that gate camp into an impenetrable gate of doom for every ship who wonders by. This is not null sec where all bets are off, this is low sec, its ridiculous. Milita are the ones who are getting hit the most because pirates are having a field day griefing every ship that passes by in faction space. Its truly broken gameplay. Please fix this

Then you didnt bother to read my post because I covered both of those and how intel is not always accurate or available.

Hit the map button.

Select show pods killed last hour.

It's low sec if there's more than 1 or 2 thats a gatecamp.

But than you already know that being hardcore and all.

Before I begin, I am an avid hardcore PVP player, and I am not a carebear, but there is genuinly a problem that needs to be looked at..... Insta lock gate camps. It is just too easy to set up a 10 to 20 man insta lock gate camp in low sec to which a person has no defense whatsoever, and are pretty much assured to lose whatever ship they are flying AND their pod. Other then avoid low sec all together there is really nothing to do to defend yourself. Which eliminates many of eve's more fun elements like faction war. Its at the point where I am afraid to undock and do any faction war gameplay, in fear of some pirate griefing camp at a gate poding me. I have lost over 2 billion isk worth of ships and implants to gate camps in two weeks. I just flew through tama, and I kid you not, there were 31 frozen corpses at the gate from a gate camp. 31.... That's f'ing ridiculous.

We are not talking about pilot error, or strategy, there really genuinly is no defense when u have 20 insta lock thrashers sitting off a gate. Intel is not always good, or available, and it is not exactly reasonable to wait for intel before every jump in low sec. This is not some regular gate camp in which if u fly properly u can burn back to the gate, or align and warp off, we are talking about gate camps that can lock you and your pod instantly while eating dinner and sucking a lolly pop, then ruining your night. Come on guys, this is not pvp, this is pure griefing. Its one thing to set up a genuine gate camp, it's another to be able to exploit ships so easily so as to turn that gate camp into an impenetrable gate of doom for every ship who wonders by. This is not null sec where all bets are off, this is low sec, its ridiculous. Milita are the ones who are getting hit the most because pirates are having a field day griefing every ship that passes by in faction space. Its truly broken gameplay. Please fix this

Yep. And if jumping into Rancer, Tama, Amamake, [insert others] then just assume there is a camp on the other side no matter what the maps says.

Then you didnt bother to read my post because I covered both of those and how intel is not always accurate or available. Not to mention waiting for intel before every jump in low sec will take a loooong time to get anywhere.

Before I begin, I am an avid hardcore PVP player, and I am not a carebear, but there is genuinly a problem that needs to be looked at..... Insta lock gate camps.

For some reason the words intel and scouting sprang to mind while reading this post. Best defence against insta-lock gate camps is not to be there in the first place.

Solutions are: watch intel channels, scout, take a different route even if its 3x longer.

Working as intended. You can't be expected to play EVE without at least one true alt. Due to nature of instalocking camps it is however preferable to use noob alt on your alt so you don't lose anything when they exterminate the "scout".

Solutions are: watch intel channels, scout, take a different route even if its 3x longer.

Other then avoid low sec all together there is really nothing to do to defend yourself.

Then you didnt bother to read my post because I covered both of those and how intel is not always accurate or available. Not to mention waiting for intel before every jump in low sec will take a loooong time to get anywhere.

Tips hat to insta-locking gate-camping pirates that cull the herd of ******** squids.

Part of the problem is that you're looking at this as a problem rather than an opportunity. The type of gate camp you've described is basically begging for you and 30 or 40 of your closest friends to hop into cheap T1 frigs, jump into the camped gate, burn point blank at the most expensive thing you can, and kill it. If you're really lucky, your gate campers will cry in local about what a bunch of horrible, terrible blobbers you are, thus completing the cycle of elite pvp.

Gate camps need to be looked at...by a scout.

Actually we **are** talking about pilot error and poor strategy. It is an error to jump through a gate into a powerful gate camp. It is very poor strategy to not use all of the intel tools available to you GǪ e.g. DOTLAN and the ingame map tools do not require people to be reporting intelligence info to a chat channel..

All the talk about being "intelligent" boils down to the above, or having an alt scout. Unfortunately neither is a really good option.

The ingame map is buggy and causes eve to crash. Moreover the lack of detail and delay in both this and dotlan make them pretty useless. Camps often don't stay in one place for hours. Unless you just want to avoid all active systems then you can't really avoid gate camps with this system.

I travel a lot thoughout nullsec, lowsec, w-space, and even GÇô shudder GÇô the most dangerous of all, hisec. I use DOTLAN often to get an idea off the pros and cons of the route I am looking at, and to devise alternatives if it seems sensible. DOTLAN data *is* delayed, and no API-type data is perfect, but that does not stop it from being hugely useful. Being imperfect is not an excuse to not make use of it GǪ every intelligence source is imperfect.

Similarly I use the ingame map functions extensively and have not found them to be at all GÇÿbuggyGÇÖ. They are especially useful when I am working in areas where I do not have realtime int-channel access GǪ which is not a lot of empire space nowadays nüè Using the various different ingame-map parameters allows you to build a mental model of the activity in the systems along your route, do not limit yourself to just the one statistic.

I agree that using those tools takes time but, in the long run, itGÇÖs usually quicker overall to get there the first time round using the available intelligence than having to make several attempts because you do not use the resources out there and get yourself killed en route. Still, being able to plan for the future and to delay the receipt of gratification are fundamental elements of intelligence.

Good points. I guess there are quite large differences in how people approach risk and how willing / able they are to utilise the intel information that is available. As I said earlier intel is never perfect, it does not spawn a big idiot-proof flashy-red Gǣgate campGǥ warning on your screen, but it is not terribly difficult to realise that there is a likely gate camp in a particular system GǪ experience, intelligence, and imperfect information.

I guess I am mainly taking issue with your wording about "idiot proof" The maps just tell you what pvp has been in a system.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. IMHO the map tool, along with DOTLAN, tells you a helluva lot more than that there has simply GÇ£been PvP in the systemGÇ¥.

The number and nature of the kills, the number of people active, last hour v. 24-hours, the number of people docked, the long-term history of the system (e.g. GÇÿalwaysGÇÖ camped), the presence of cynos, etc etc etc. All that info, when filtered through a little experience and some deductive reasoning, paints a very credible, detailed, and reliable picture of what is happening in the system.

Sure, the gate camping gang may have disbanded three minutes ago, but even that is often apparent when you watch GǪ and even, god forbid, talk to GǪ the other people who are also travelling.

A good thread.
I haven been absent for a long time and never had much experience in lowsec so I'm at a loss reading contradictory info.

What does instalock mean? How much time 'insta' takes?

How do people lose pods in lowsec? Seen a gatecamp the other day, watched them for a while waiting for them to go away and they had pod kills constantly for hours. I thought pods "insta"-warp? Maybe I don't know game mechanics anymore that's why I am extra careful but I was puzzled seeing regular pod kills. Is there really some way to target and shoot pods in lowsec (and I don't mean when they just stand there)?

Oh and one more thing - can gate cloak be removed if you jump and land on top of someone, or you're still safe until you move or the 30ish seconds pass?

While we're at it, I always had a problem trusting mwd/cloak - apparently after you move you need to wait a bit before succesfully activating modules... on the other side I been wondering, when you move others will see you immediately or appearing on overview has a similar small delay (in other words, how long should I wait for activating cloak after moving, and how much risk that poses in case I don't really lag)? I don't feel like taking blockade runners into camps to test it out. :)

I don't think the gate cloak goes away if you are close to someone else.

Before I begin, I am an avid hardcore PVP player, and I am not a carebear, but there is genuinly a problem that needs to be looked at..... Insta lock gate camps. It is just too easy to set up a 10 to 20 man insta lock gate camp in low sec to which a person has no defense whatsoever, and are pretty much assured to lose whatever ship they are flying AND their pod. Other then avoid low sec all together there is really nothing to do to defend yourself. Which eliminates many of eve's more fun elements like faction war. Its at the point where I am afraid to undock and do any faction war gameplay, in fear of some pirate griefing camp at a gate poding me. I have lost over 2 billion isk worth of ships and implants to gate camps in two weeks. I just flew through tama, and I kid you not, there were 31 frozen corpses at the gate from a gate camp. 31.... That's f'ing ridiculous.

We are not talking about pilot error, or strategy, there really genuinly is no defense when u have 20 insta lock thrashers sitting off a gate. Intel is not always good, or available, and it is not exactly reasonable to wait for intel before every jump in low sec. This is not some regular gate camp in which if u fly properly u can burn back to the gate, or align and warp off, we are talking about gate camps that can lock you and your pod instantly while eating dinner and sucking a lolly pop, then ruining your night. Come on guys, this is not pvp, this is pure griefing. Its one thing to set up a genuine gate camp, it's another to be able to exploit ships so easily so as to turn that gate camp into an impenetrable gate of doom for every ship who wonders by. This is not null sec where all bets are off, this is low sec, its ridiculous. Milita are the ones who are getting hit the most because pirates are having a field day griefing every ship that passes by in faction space. Its truly broken gameplay. Please fix this

Gate camps are bad and those taking part in them should feel bad. They are lame and the people that like doing it are morally corrupt. It's not fair. I shouldn't have to go out of my way to stop dying to camps. I should be able to move freely through all systems, without experiencing any boat violence. I don't want to use any of the current mechanics to avoid such death.

I think that covers all the bases.

Yep we all ready covered the "mechanics" to avoid gate camps.

Gate camps are an essential part of day to day life in FW. Most efficient way to deal with farmers and send a clear message they are not welcome near my home system.

You're the reason I posted. Your posts make me smile.

Oh and since our rancer campers are posting theres another one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtPROl9YIuc

We did kinda blob them but my god, they run fast, the only way to catch them is to fill up their overview so they cant find a celestial to warp to!

I don't doubt that is what fw has come to. It's clear faction war pilots rarely stay to fight in plexes anymore. Luckily the non fw pilots are filling the gap.

[ doesn't work, just thought I'd give you a heads up.

I was joking about the overview.

[
It all boils down to ISK. We are there to make it and avoid losing it.

I know! Thank goodness!

It's good for those who like plex fights

Yes, its good for everyone in faction war..

Since you arnt in FW and everyone appears as neutral or pie to you, i can see why you might think militia dont fight in plexes.

Its good for everyone except farmers.

Nope, seems ok for them too. That means, as per usual, its just you.

Anyway, didnt you run from me the last time i saw you? I know you had your reasons, reshipping is a pita and all that. But why question other peoples motivations for running as though they were less justified than yours?.

Well, tbh i get it. The way you play the game is the correct one.

It wasn't you I was running from it was prismn in the t3. It may seem like I am running from you because he just happens to be every system you are in! It's like he is your shadow or your blanky.

Like i said, you are correct as always. The reasons you run from fights are all good reasons. The reasons other people run from fights are all bad reasons.

Ahh my bad. Just tapped my joke radar and sure enough it wasn't switched on.
(It's late and I've been decorating all day )

Don't worry you're not alone. I'm also a coward AND a space Ninja. So, I also like to sneak around and run away. I leave bravery to Heroes and other professionals who die a lot (firemen, police officers, soldiers etc). Nope, not for me! I prefer being a coward.

the good news is that gate campers are terrible at pvp and run from pretty much every single fight.

if you disagree you're probably offended at the truth. it stings.

Gate camps aren't ruining PvP, they ARE PvP. Eve PvP isn't about being fair and balanced, it's about using whatever trick you can to screw over the other guy.

We do enjoy 'good fights' when they come around, but most of the time we get blobbed.

It's interesting. After reading the first several pages of this thread I can recall more clearly why I grew sick and tired of the utter lack of strategy in Blob Online the last time I quit, 2 years ago. It's not the OPs post that reminded me necessarily, but the numerous replies that followed.

The fact that instalock gatecamp blobs are still regarded as a 'good mechanic' by the majority of players tells me all I need to know about my consideration of returning to the game after my 5 free days are up. There are better things to do in life than play (and spend my money on) a game that utterly disregards ship-building strategy and personal flying skills in favor of blobbing numbers and ******** mechanics.

It's interesting. After reading the first several pages of this thread I can recall more clearly why I grew sick and tired of the utter lack of strategy in Blob Online the last time I quit, 2 years ago. It's not the OPs post that reminded me necessarily, but the numerous replies that followed.

The fact that instalock gatecamp blobs are still regarded as a 'good mechanic' by the majority of players tells me all I need to know about my consideration of returning to the game after my 5 free days are up. There are better things to do in life than play (and spend my money on) a game that utterly disregards ship-building strategy and personal flying skills in favor of blobbing numbers and ******** mechanics.

Oh, thats something new. Better get that in my bio