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Hungry Eyes
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
Just wondering, what will be the role of HACs when the tier 3 BC's come out? already, HACs dont have a role because BCs have more EHP and DPS at close/mid range. sniper gangs have a tiny niche, but the new BC's will easily surpass them with large artys, hybrids and pulses.
what do? already there is little reason to get into a HAC. |
DarkAegix
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
138
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:33:00 -
[2] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:already there is little reason to get into a HAC.
Furthermore, ARMOUR HACS! ARMOUR HACS! AARRRMMOOOURRRR HAAACCSSSSS!!! |
Khors
El Barco Pirata
1
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:36:00 -
[3] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:Just wondering, what will be the role of HACs when the tier 3 BC's come out? already, HACs dont have a role because BCs have more EHP and DPS at close/mid range. sniper gangs have a tiny niche, but the new BC's will easily surpass them with large artys, hybrids and pulses.
what do? already there is little reason to get into a HAC.
A shieldtanked battlecrusier have the sig of a dread when they MWD. Large turret have **** tracking. Armor tanked, afterburning HACs have a very small sig and makes for a good tactic against battleships. HACs are a lot faster than battlecruisers.
Besides, T2 is more of a niche ship to begin with.
And finally. Stop coming up with all these stupid **** ideas of how the tier 3 bc's will be so awesome and great in every way when the only thing known for sure is that they will use oversized guns. |
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
12
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:39:00 -
[4] - Quote
Im hoping they limit the Tornado to just Auto Cannons. As much fun as it would be to have 20 guys in 50m isk Alpha fleet ganking a frieghter, people might see that as somewhat overpowered given they get most of that back in insurance.
Or if they are allowed Arties then I guess I should spend the first week in said ganking fleets before it gets nerfed and I miss out on a frieghter drop of about 10Billion. I would be a sad panda seeing that KM without my name on it.
Won't someone please think of the afk frighter pilots..... sry but I can foresee the massive ***** thread incoming. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
80
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
I'll see your large artillery Tornado and raise you a afterburner pulse Zealot at close range. To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
non judgement
Without Fear Flying Burning Ships Alliance
104
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:48:00 -
[6] - Quote
is that like how destroyers are better than assault frigates?? |
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
12
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:50:00 -
[7] - Quote
non judgement wrote:is that like how destroyers are better than assault frigates??
Are they? No Idea frig pvp is for poor people. |
Khors
El Barco Pirata
1
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:51:00 -
[8] - Quote
sYnc Vir wrote:Im hoping they limit the Tornado to just Auto Cannons. As much fun as it would be to have 20 guys in 50m isk Alpha fleet ganking a frieghter, people might see that as somewhat overpowered given they get most of that back in insurance.
Or if they are allowed Arties then I guess I should spend the first week in said ganking fleets before it gets nerfed and I miss out on a frieghter drop of about 10Billion. I would be a sad panda seeing that KM without my name on it.
Won't someone please think of the afk frighter pilots..... sry but I can foresee the massive ***** thread incoming.
Do you think these battlecruisers will have 8 turret hardpoints? lol I doubt they'll be doing much better than a phoon |
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
12
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
Khors wrote:sYnc Vir wrote:Im hoping they limit the Tornado to just Auto Cannons. As much fun as it would be to have 20 guys in 50m isk Alpha fleet ganking a frieghter, people might see that as somewhat overpowered given they get most of that back in insurance.
Or if they are allowed Arties then I guess I should spend the first week in said ganking fleets before it gets nerfed and I miss out on a frieghter drop of about 10Billion. I would be a sad panda seeing that KM without my name on it.
Won't someone please think of the afk frighter pilots..... sry but I can foresee the massive ***** thread incoming. Do you think these battlecruisers will have 8 turret hardpoints? lol I doubt they'll be doing much better than a phoon
Phoons are awesome. You don't like 1000Dps on an armor phoon or 1500dps on a gank one?
And I suspect they will likely have 4 Turrent slots. |
non judgement
Without Fear Flying Burning Ships Alliance
104
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Posted - 2011.10.23 07:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
sYnc Vir wrote:non judgement wrote:is that like how destroyers are better than assault frigates?? Are they? No Idea frig pvp is for poor people. A strange question, and strange comment.
Destroyers are paper thin. They might be okay against some frigates, but they aren't used much at all. Slower than frigates, crusiers normally kill them. People use Interdictors (T2 destroyers) a lot more and that'd be mostly (if not all) nullsec use.
I like your use of italics. |
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sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
12
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Posted - 2011.10.23 08:09:00 -
[11] - Quote
non judgement wrote:sYnc Vir wrote:non judgement wrote:is that like how destroyers are better than assault frigates?? Are they? No Idea frig pvp is for poor people. A strange question, and strange comment. Destroyers are paper thin. They might be okay against some frigates, but they aren't used much at all. Slower than frigates, crusiers normally kill them. People use Interdictors (T2 destroyers) a lot more and that'd be mostly (if not all) nullsec use. I like your use of italics.
Ty, corpies troll because I do the same on our own forum. All be it with smaller text and a somewhat pinkish colour. |
ACE McFACE
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
34
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Posted - 2011.10.23 08:16:00 -
[12] - Quote
sYnc Vir wrote:Im hoping they limit the Tornado to just Auto Cannons. As much fun as it would be to have 20 guys in 50m isk Alpha fleet ganking a frieghter, people might see that as somewhat overpowered given they get most of that back in insurance.
Or if they are allowed Arties then I guess I should spend the first week in said ganking fleets before it gets nerfed and I miss out on a frieghter drop of about 10Billion. I would be a sad panda seeing that KM without my name on it.
Won't someone please think of the afk frighter pilots..... sry but I can foresee the massive ***** thread incoming. I didn't realise Miila was back and using italics instead of colours to trick people into thinking thier point is more valid than anyone elses. ZE GOGGLES, ZEY DO NOTHING! (Not wearing them so don't waste your time reading this sig) |
DarkAegix
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
143
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Posted - 2011.10.23 08:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
Albeit.
Please don't tell me you also say irregardless, point in case, be more pacific, could care less, for all intensive purposes and escape goat.
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Hungry Eyes
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:10:00 -
[14] - Quote
afterburning armor HACs? this some kind of joke? the only saving graces of HACs are their speed and agility, and you cant get either with this philosophy. if youre armor tanking a HAC, you might as well fly a BC.
BCs totally **** HACs in medium/short range scenarios. as i stated, due to vastly more EHP, and more DPS. sniper zealot gangs dont cut it now, and certainly wont cut it when tier 3 BC's snipe them from 150km.
can we have some actual PVP'ers comment please? |
Rocky Deadshot
In The Goo EVE Trade Alliance
19
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:11:00 -
[15] - Quote
Next time just cut to the point and ask for a buff to HACs OP... |
Hungry Eyes
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:12:00 -
[16] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:I'll see your large artillery Tornado and raise you a afterburner pulse Zealot at close range.
right. might as well use a harbie for more dps. besides, how will you waddle over to the Tornado? with an AB?
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Hungry Eyes
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:13:00 -
[17] - Quote
Rocky Deadshot wrote:Next time just cut to the point and ask for a buff to HACs OP...
just asking: what is HAC role now, and what will it be in the winter expansion? i thought that was quite clear.
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Alara IonStorm
Caldari State
151
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:20:00 -
[18] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:right. might as well use a harbie for more dps. besides, how will you waddle over to the Tornado? with an AB? You use Tacklers and Bubbles while hovering around 30 hitting them with Heavy Pulse. The Arty will miss because there Sig Tanking with sig of 125 and a speed of over 500. 1400mm Guns won't hit that. They will hit a Harbinger with over double the Sig.
You want to complain about HAC's pick a worse off Bird then the Zealot. that sits at 13 on the Top 20 EVEkill list. 13 Zealot 12038. The Zealot suffers more from Drake which will be the Primary Prey of the Tornado.
If you want to complain about HAC's there is the Eagle, Deimos and the Sacrilege. The others are well used. |
Berendas
Clandestine Vector THE SPACE P0LICE
1
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:25:00 -
[19] - Quote
I wish I had an excuse to dust off my Zealot. The Vagabond is the only HAC that actually does something in PVP that a BC can't do easily. |
Trusty Jutspezic
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
19
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:40:00 -
[20] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:afterburning armor HACs? this some kind of joke? the only saving graces of HACs are their speed and agility, and you cant get either with this philosophy. if youre armor tanking a HAC, you might as well fly a BC. BCs totally **** HACs in medium/short range scenarios. as i stated, due to vastly more EHP, and more DPS. sniper zealot gangs dont cut it now, and certainly wont cut it when tier 3 BC's snipe them from 150km. can we have some actual PVP'ers comment please? I'm an actual PVPer, you're pretty ******* ignorant dude. |
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Hungry Eyes
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:40:00 -
[21] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:Hungry Eyes wrote:right. might as well use a harbie for more dps. besides, how will you waddle over to the Tornado? with an AB? You use Tacklers and Bubbles while hovering around 30 hitting them with Heavy Pulse. The Arty will miss because there Sig Tanking with sig of 125 and a speed of over 500. 1400mm Guns won't hit that. They will hit a Harbinger with over double the Sig.
this is pure fantasy from your mind. zealot sits at the top of HAC list in kills because of sniper gangs. zealot belongs at 100km+, otherwise you bring a harbie. snipe HAC gangs are more or less obsolete now, and will completely cease to exist with the new BCs that will easily be able to alpha cruiser+ ships from 150km. apocs and rokhs can already do this. tier 3 BCs will be able to do this as well, but with more mobility.
im not complaining about individual HACs, im saying they have no role.
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Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
63
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:Just wondering, what will be the role of HACs when the tier 3 BC's come out? already, HACs dont have a role because BCs have more EHP and DPS at close/mid range. sniper gangs have a tiny niche, but the new BC's will easily surpass them with large artys, hybrids and pulses.
what do? already there is little reason to get into a HAC.
HACs are indeed outperformed by the t1 battlecruisers in terms of damage output and tank as a stand alone platform. What HACs do offer is significantly better speed and range, and it is with these properties you will find the role better suitded for the HAC than the BC. HACs also offer increased resists, which makes them more effective than BCs in gangs employing logistics ships.
In a solo or small gang environment, the advantage of the HAC is generally in control - they're excellent at dictating when and where the engagement occurs, they are better at forcing you into a fight where you don't want it, and they are better at escaping unfavorable encounters. |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
93
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:46:00 -
[23] - Quote
what the hell is wrong with the forums this weekend? [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Leiv Dzienovich
Tax Is Bad
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 17:47:00 -
[24] - Quote
You're complaining about hacs having no roles, yet you then dispute the viability of a widely used, and widely known to be effective, role for hacs in pvp.... Maybe its time you lern2play? |
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
82
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Posted - 2011.10.23 18:13:00 -
[25] - Quote
HAC's will be exactly where they are now as the proposed tier3 BCs won't compete with them in the same way that the tier2 do.
What the stupidity called tier3 BCs will do is make the lower tier BS a thing of the past except in rare cases .. BC mobility with BS damage/range .. why should anyone ever want to use tier1 BS? The only ways that can be prevented is if some harsh anti-blob measures are put in place (chances of that are slim to none) or they start out so pre-nerfed as to make them useless.
Roaming alpha/gank tier3 BC blobs and defensive tier3 BS (90% Abbaddons) blobs .. add in a smattering of capitals and you have space as it will look for the next two years.
Gallente are the only ones who get to go free as the new BC will probably not be a drone platform so the Dominix will still have a place in Eve .. but Tempests, Armageddons and Scorpion/Ravens will becomes newb vehicles only used in missions and as disposable ratters. |
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
63
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Posted - 2011.10.23 18:22:00 -
[26] - Quote
Hirana Yoshida wrote: What the stupidity called tier3 BCs will do is make the lower tier BS a thing of the past except in rare cases .. BC mobility with BS damage/range .. why should anyone ever want to use tier1 BS?
The ones that want tank and not only gank. Sure the Tier 3 BCs should push BS firepower, but they will be glass cannons compared to a properly fitted battleship. Tank is more important than gank in medium size fleet PVP. A fleet of Tier 1 BS should have no problem pwning a similary sized fleet of Tier 3 BCs, all other factors beeing equal. |
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
82
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Posted - 2011.10.23 18:37:00 -
[27] - Quote
If tank is a concern, then why use tier1/2 BS when the tier3's offer both more dps and tank than the lower tiers?
Introducing a platform that does the same damage at the same ranges but has 3-4 times better mobility at the expense of what will probably be very close to tier1 BS EHP (can get dangerously close with tier2's as it is now).
It is my hope that CCP sees the folly of adding yet another generic gank/tank BC (with bigguns!) and instead make them BC sized destroyers: sluggish with zero tank and scary tracking/range .. should put those damn T3's in their place.
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JamesCLK
Lone Star Exploration Narwhals Ate My Duck
17
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Posted - 2011.10.23 20:23:00 -
[28] - Quote
Hungry Eyes wrote:this is pure fantasy from your mind. zealot sits at the top of HAC list in kills because of sniper gangs. zealot belongs at 100km+, otherwise you bring a harbie. snipe HAC gangs are more or less obsolete now, and will completely cease to exist with the new BCs that will easily be able to alpha cruiser+ ships from 150km. apocs and rokhs can already do this. tier 3 BCs will be able to do this as well, but with more mobility.
im not complaining about individual HACs, im saying they have no role.
Somehow, I doubt you've experienced the level of grape a PL Fist gang can inflict on a fleet of large turret based ships...
Seriously, do not diss the Zealot - or sigrad tanking for that matter. HACs (you know, the good ones, not the Diemost &co.) have a role: that is to provide BC level dammage output in a much more compact format than say, a BC or BS - they're also fast, even with an AB, which makes them lethal against Battleships and Capitals. Obviously there are variations on this (read: Vagabond and the like), but overall the roles are there.
You're exaggerating the effect of penalties beyond what they really are. AHACs are a proven concept too, like it or not.
Now, wouldn't it be nice if the couple of HACs that actually need some love (Sacri, Diemost, Eagle) were brought up to par?
Just sayin' |
DarkAegix
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
152
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Posted - 2011.10.23 20:30:00 -
[29] - Quote
Move along, everyone. It's either a troll, or someone so dense that all hope is lost. |
Roosterton
Eternal Frontier
112
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Posted - 2011.10.23 21:09:00 -
[30] - Quote
Quote:right. might as well use a harbie for more dps. besides, how will you waddle over to the Tornado? with an AB?
Like this, obviously. |
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