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Large Collidable Object
morons.
405
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Posted - 2011.10.23 09:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
Nerfing the dramiel was agreed upon by CCP ages ago and it ruined frig PvP for years now, yet with all the other (great) news about changes and new additions to eve, it seems to have been forgotten.
Any update on impending changes and a time table of how many more years it will take to change 1-2 values in a database? morons-áare recruiting. We're good at breeding! |
seany1212
Mind Games. 0ccupational Hazzard
17
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Posted - 2011.10.23 09:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:Nerfing the dramiel was agreed upon by CCP ages ago and it has ruined frig PvP for years now, yet with all the other (great) news about changes and new additions to eve, it seems to have been forgotten.
Any update on impending changes and a time table of how many more years it will take to change 1-2 values in a database?
As with hybrids; soon(TM)
I've flown one for a bit, not my favourite ship tbh, and I have to agree in comparison to the other pirate frigates they are pretty OP. |
Louis deGuerre
Malevolence. Void Alliance
48
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Posted - 2011.10.23 10:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
Every time I encounter YAD (yet another Dramiel) I die a little of boredom. FIRE FRIENDSHIP TORPEDOES ! |
Mirima Thurander
Deventer Exploration An Acquisition
28
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Posted - 2011.10.23 10:10:00 -
[4] - Quote
Louis deGuerre wrote:Every time I encounter YAD (yet another Dramiel) I die a little of boredom.
man EvEs not about PvP its about kill mail farming I love the the smell of victory in the morning. It smells like... Blood, vomit and burning flesh. |
Cpt Fina
The Tuskers
50
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Posted - 2011.10.23 10:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
In accordance with the prevailing logic that rules these forums we should not nerf the dramiel but rather make a complete overhaul of every other ship in the game to compensate. |
Sinnek
CTRL-Q
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 10:24:00 -
[6] - Quote
1. remove drones 2. make Firetail slightly faster (than Dramiel)
balance achieved? *awesome spaceship image* |
Hisomi
Suicidal Trainingscamp Thukker Tribe Mercenaries
0
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Posted - 2011.10.23 10:25:00 -
[7] - Quote
Cpt Fina wrote:In accordance with the prevailing logic that rules these forums we should not nerf the dramiel but rather make a complete overhaul of every other ship in the game to compensate.
nah we should shoot the jita monument and unsub to make ccp remove the dramiel entirely. it worked SO good before |
Cpt Fina
The Tuskers
50
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Posted - 2011.10.23 10:33:00 -
[8] - Quote
Hisomi wrote:nah we should shoot the jita monument and unsub to make ccp remove the dramiel entirely. it worked SO good before
Or simply nerf a select few ships to make a bunch of old ships viable again. |
Kengutsi Akira
82
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Posted - 2011.10.23 13:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
sssshhhhh dont remind them, theyre busy We should really stop calling it FiS
Dammit there is no FiS its Called EVE. Especially now that WiS is "back burnere"ed |
Jerick Ludhowe
Shadow Legion Industries Dark Phoenix Rising.
2
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Posted - 2011.10.23 13:56:00 -
[10] - Quote
it's not just the dram, the entire angel lineup is pretty damn op'd. |
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Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
61
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Posted - 2011.10.23 14:04:00 -
[11] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:...and it has ruined frig PvP for years now
Ahem. The Dramiel gained is present OP status with the faction ship changes in Dominion. So 1 year, 10 months :)
As for the question, an alternative to nerfing a ship is to buff others. Lets see whats going to happen with the AFs. |
Bo Bojangles
Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.
3
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Posted - 2011.10.23 14:21:00 -
[12] - Quote
Reilly Duvolle wrote:Large Collidable Object wrote:...and it has ruined frig PvP for years now Ahem. The Dramiel gained is present OP status with the faction ship changes in Dominion. So 1 year, 10 months :) As for the question, an alternative to nerfing a ship is to buff others. Lets see whats going to happen with the AFs.
So he's rounding off.
Sure buffing other stuff is an alternative, but it's just alot easier to ask ccp to nerf an op ship to be in line with the other pirate frigates. That way, we might actually see the other pirate frigates. Just makes sense.
It's pretty easy to demonstrate just how OP the Dram is. While most of us are carnally familiar with the Dram, the same group might be hard pressed to even recite the names of all the other pirate frigs. This means you have an accute imbalance w/in it's own ship rank. The appropriate thing to do would be to balance that out before seeking a counter from another class.
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Nex apparatu5
Not a Shell Corp
13
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Posted - 2011.10.23 14:26:00 -
[13] - Quote
Hisomi wrote:Cpt Fina wrote:In accordance with the prevailing logic that rules these forums we should not nerf the dramiel but rather make a complete overhaul of every other ship in the game to compensate. nah we should shoot the jita monument and unsub to make ccp remove the dramiel entirely. it worked SO good before Because clearly CCP just happened to decide to shift their work back to FiS on a whim. It was totally unrelated to any protests amirite? |
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
61
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Posted - 2011.10.23 14:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Bo Bojangles wrote: The appropriate thing to do would be to balance that out before seeking a counter from another class.
I'd take on a Dram any day in my Hookbill |
Solstice Project
Cult of Personality
79
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Posted - 2011.10.23 14:46:00 -
[15] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:... it has ruined frig PvP for years now
*LOL*
Hilarious !!
Thanks for putting up so stupid posts ! :D |
Alara IonStorm
Caldari State
143
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Posted - 2011.10.23 14:52:00 -
[16] - Quote
Between the Hybrid Buff and the Dramiel Nerf the Daredevil is gonna be crazy. |
Killstealing
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
61
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Posted - 2011.10.23 15:15:00 -
[17] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:Between the Hybrid Buff and the Dramiel Nerf the Daredevil is gonna be crazy. This. The daredevil is already a close contender with the Dramiel for best (pirate) frigate and is its hard counter as well. Just because 'everyone' uses a dram doesn't mean just nerfing that will make frigate PvP magically better. What needs to happen:
- AF 4th bonus
- Dramiel/Daredevil rebalance
- Cruor and Succubus are pretty niche nowadays because honestly, neut/nos on frigs is not always useful
- Worm needs to be watched very carefully, it's not the powerhouse the DDD brothers are but with those 2 rebalanced it might
become really really strong.
To the guy saying the entire angel lineup is OP, angels are all about speed and that is one of the most important things in frig/cruiser PvP (the Dram is called OP mostly because it can disengage at will, go at 6km/s and hit at 20km out. The DD counters it because of web bonus). The Bhaalgorn/Vindi/Nightmare are not weak at all compared to the Mach considered you use them well (incursion fleets, capping out supers ). The issue there is not that 'angels are OP' but that speed is really ******* important and angels just so happen to focus on that. Plus falloff is cool, yo. Hitting people from 20km out in a frig, yo. |
Alara IonStorm
Caldari State
143
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Posted - 2011.10.23 15:32:00 -
[18] - Quote
Killstealing wrote:Alara IonStorm wrote:Between the Hybrid Buff and the Dramiel Nerf the Daredevil is gonna be crazy. This. The daredevil is already a close contender with the Dramiel for best (pirate) frigate and is its hard counter as well. Just because 'everyone' uses a dram doesn't mean just nerfing that will make frigate PvP magically better. What needs to happen: No it does not but it's main weapons system getting a buff does.
Since Assault Frigs Bonuses does not help with there Agility Problems and no other Frig Changes that your talking about have been announced.
As of Current the Daredevil is on the rise. Not that I have any issue with that. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
316
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Posted - 2011.10.24 01:00:00 -
[19] - Quote
I disagree that the Dramiel has "killed" frigate combat other than solo work (a mixed gang of frigates including keres, hyena, etc can make piecemeal even of multiple dramiels, once you slow them down they dont stack up great against other combat frigates in a straight brawl.) I think the biggest threat from the Dramiel is psychological - if everyone assumes that nothing can beat a dramiel, no one brings anything else out, and combat overall gets stale. For those tenacious enough, dramiels can still be caught and killed easily, especially since the flavor of the month factor means theres a lot of underqualified pilots buzzing around in them too.
That being said - I wanted to offer up something that may help the situation. Over in our Faction Warfare thread, one of the popular "fixes" to the FW mechanics is to banish pirate ships from any of the plexes that banish tech 2 ships. If you can't bring a wolf into a plex, you shouldn't be able to bring a dramiel. This is an easy fix, and very popular amongst FW enthusiasts.
If this change takes place, and I hope the developers take it into consideration, than this will provide a Dramiel/cynabal-free zone where pilots can PvP the old school way. So, taking care of the FW plexes in this fashion also serves as a de facto Dramiel nerf, and if it is implemented I hope it draws in a group of players who want to roam and fight in cheaper, smaller ships and enjoy gang warfare without the overpowered pirate ships getting in the way.
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Metal Icarus
xHELLonEARTHx Rookie Empire
14
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Posted - 2011.10.24 01:36:00 -
[20] - Quote
For every ship there is one that can easily defeat it. For every dramiel, there is a hookbill |
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Diomedes Calypso
Aetolian Armada
21
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Posted - 2011.10.24 02:40:00 -
[21] - Quote
Sinnek wrote:1. remove drones 2. make Firetail slightly faster (than Dramiel)
balance achieved?
Remove the dramiel and all the existing intercepters are back in business.. with 4 different flavors and different advantages |
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
193
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Posted - 2011.10.24 02:56:00 -
[22] - Quote
I've seen dramiels die more to webbing ishkurs and rifters than any other ship. |
RandomFlame
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.24 17:49:00 -
[23] - Quote
So the big boys are afraid of the Dramiel eh? Same old same old. Grow up fellas and do it fast. As for revolting character photos-suits you Sir. |
Morganta
Peripheral Madness The Midget Mafia
104
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Posted - 2011.10.24 17:52:00 -
[24] - Quote
perhaps if LCO's signature radius wasn't so... um... BROAD The American public's reaction to the change was poor and the new cola was a major marketing failure. The subsequent reintroduction of Coke's original formula, re-branded as "Coca-Cola Classic", resulted in a significant gain in sales, leading to speculation that the introduction of the New Coke formula was just a marketing ploy |
Demon View
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
4
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Posted - 2011.10.25 01:25:00 -
[25] - Quote
Aside, I used to hate, hate, hate the Dramiel, and then I discovered their perfect counter in solo lowsec combat: the directional scanner. Now, flying a Dramiel just means that you never land on grid to find that I'm still there. When I see it demonstrated that even a plated Punisher can decide to only engage ships that aren't Dramiels (or Hookbills, or Crows, or Slicers, or...), a lot of emotion goes out of the picture.
Instead of being an 'I win' button, Dramiels feel more like a "the guy I might've fought just buggered off to another constellation" button, or a "others gain extra satisfaction for killing me no matter how underhanded their means because I totally deserve all of it" button.
Doubly aside, how much of a boost to non-Dramiels would it be if certain T2 ships' MWDs weren't deactivated by a scram - or if overheating countered this effect of scramblers? |
Flyinghotpocket
Amarrian Retribution
5
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Posted - 2011.10.25 03:07:00 -
[26] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote: I disagree that the Dramiel has "killed" frigate combat other than solo work (a mixed gang of frigates including keres, hyena, etc can make piecemeal even of multiple dramiels, once you slow them down they dont stack up great against other combat frigates in a straight brawl.) I think the biggest threat from the Dramiel is psychological - if everyone assumes that nothing can beat a dramiel, no one brings anything else out, and combat overall gets stale. For those tenacious enough, dramiels can still be caught and killed easily, especially since the flavor of the month factor means theres a lot of underqualified pilots buzzing around in them too.
That being said - I wanted to offer up something that may help the situation. Over in our Faction Warfare thread, one of the popular "fixes" to the FW mechanics is to banish pirate ships from any of the plexes that banish tech 2 ships. If you can't bring a wolf into a plex, you shouldn't be able to bring a dramiel. This is an easy fix, and very popular amongst FW enthusiasts.
If this change takes place, and I hope the developers take it into consideration, than this will provide a Dramiel/cynabal-free zone where pilots can PvP the old school way. So, taking care of the FW plexes in this fashion also serves as a de facto Dramiel nerf, and if it is implemented I hope it draws in a group of players who want to roam and fight in cheaper, smaller ships and enjoy gang warfare without the overpowered pirate ships getting in the way.
agreed. needs more types of plexs to. 3 types is not enough. more plexs would nerf the dram in it self. perhaps certain pockets at like wormholes int he sense that you speed would be lowered or your resistance would be lowered, or your smart bomb range increased. perhaps a mining plex? for LOLZ |
Berendas
Clandestine Vector THE SPACE P0LICE
4
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Posted - 2011.10.25 03:15:00 -
[27] - Quote
The Dramiel nerf has been a long time coming. Don't let it slip by, CCP! |
Lyrrashae
Crushed Ambitions Reckless Ambition
67
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Posted - 2011.12.19 12:30:00 -
[28] - Quote
Flyinghotpocket wrote: [...] perhaps a mining plex? for LOLZ
Bring back teh Battle-Hulk of win!
I A/F/K cloak in Jita. Does that count? |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
493
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Posted - 2011.12.19 12:41:00 -
[29] - Quote
Reilly Duvolle wrote:Bo Bojangles wrote: The appropriate thing to do would be to balance that out before seeking a counter from another class.
I'd take on a Dram any day in my Hookbill
It's a dam good frig for sure. People just don't spec light missiles enough to see how much dmg you can put out with those on small stuff. Caracals, Navy caracals, Hookbils are incredible GOD mode with those vs small ships. |
Skydell
Space Mermaids
16
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Posted - 2011.12.19 12:44:00 -
[30] - Quote
Oddly enough the only reason I ever thought about getting a Dramiel was to kill annoying Dramiels. |
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