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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion Mildly Sober
137
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Posted - 2013.06.26 10:53:00 -
[151] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:You don't need a specialist T2 combat ship to be competitive. T1 cruisers with maybe two weeks of support skills will be much better for a new player than a HAC, what with the whole 'not breaking the bank when you die in a fire' thing. A couple of weeks will put you into a T1 gunned, T2 tanked cruiser, and I'd like you to tell me why that is somehow a problem. Hell, haven't you ever heard goonswarm or test newbie recruitment spiel? Ten minutes of training, a free frigate and they'll love you.
The new 13yo baby nerd most likely don't even know what goonswarm is or for that matter any one else who tries to get into the game without help.
And when we know that in numbers the tech 1 ships can be fun and all that the new players don' t know that and usualy they want to spacialize also right away to something.
I picked my first ship (brutix) by the looks when I started the game and also took qutie abit of time to get into it and I tried to shield tank it not even knowing how tank worked. Turned out to be a horrible idea cause I did mainly PVE in amarr space. Anyhow what I'm trying to say is that for some people starting this game might have same or equal horrible ideas that I had and then it realy is time consuming. |
Kyt Thrace
Lightspeed Enterprises Fidelas Constans
160
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 11:23:00 -
[152] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:
The last guy I had this argument with claimed that it took 3 years to be "competitive" and then spent 20 pages refusing to admit that he meant getting into a Black Ops with all skills to V.
Damn, I am coming up on 5 years of playing & I can not even sit in a Black Ops BS, much less have skills to fly it to level 5. Someone tell me what I am doing wrong. R.I.P. Vile Rat |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10353
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Posted - 2013.06.26 11:48:00 -
[153] - Quote
Azrael Dinn wrote:
Also when a new player starts the game he wont know anything about any skill plans like we do. He will train something what might be useless and that also consumes time alot...
In which case, advising him to spend extra money for even more skillpoints he won't know how to properly apply seems rather cruel.
1 Kings 12:11
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
169
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Posted - 2013.06.26 11:53:00 -
[154] - Quote
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris wrote:Harry Forever wrote:StoneCold wrote:Only read the 1st post.
The idea was there like 1000 times allready. It-¦s bad. Nope, its even terrible. Maybe even terribad. NO.
If you want plex-for-skilltime -> char bazaar this way. when it was there a 1000 times, then maybe because there is an issue, no? NO, its because there are many new players that dont understand the game and want instant gratification as they used to get in other games.
I'm gamer since over 30 years, I understand more of games like you ever will, trust me that OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
Anna Djan
Banana Corp
17
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Posted - 2013.06.26 12:14:00 -
[155] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote:
I'm gamer since over 30 years, I understand more about games like you ever will, trust me that
The **** measuring has begun....
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Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion Mildly Sober
137
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 12:39:00 -
[156] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Azrael Dinn wrote:
Also when a new player starts the game he wont know anything about any skill plans like we do. He will train something what might be useless and that also consumes time alot...
In which case, advising him to spend extra money for even more skillpoints he won't know how to properly apply seems rather cruel.
Well it might be abit cruel yes but the option is there and it might be that after few months of senseless training he has found a friend that tells him what to train and then he can catch up faster and he would need to wait months again to get to the point where he wanted to be. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
146
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 13:34:00 -
[157] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote:Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris wrote:Harry Forever wrote:StoneCold wrote:Only read the 1st post.
The idea was there like 1000 times allready. It-¦s bad. Nope, its even terrible. Maybe even terribad. NO.
If you want plex-for-skilltime -> char bazaar this way. when it was there a 1000 times, then maybe because there is an issue, no? NO, its because there are many new players that dont understand the game and want instant gratification as they used to get in other games. I'm gamer since over 30 years, I understand more about games like you ever will, trust me that when the game started the skill time was there to keep the game motivated and stay longer the more the game lasts the bigger problem and hurdle this becomes for new entrys thats why this needs some adjustemnt like I mentioned adding a possibility to buy 1 month of skillpoints with plex every 6 month in addition to the normal skillplan would help a lot and would not damage the mechanic at all Not true. If you have been gaming for 30 years you probably have played EQ, WoW type leveling games. In those games it takes a significant amount of time to level and gear out a max class (example enchanter). EvE is similiar in that it takes a significant amount of time to train a specialized class (example: ECM specialist in Falcon).
Ironically in EvE its quicker than in EQ.
What you are not getting is EvE like those games is full of classes (logi, dps frig, tackler inty, cap pilot- theyre just not as clearly defined and they have lots of crossover skills that wont need to be retrained for a new class unlike other games.
Its no harder to become an expert in EvE than those other games and while youre becoming specialized in one ship / role youre fullfilling requirements for others (engineering is needed for all ship roles / classes )
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
169
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Posted - 2013.06.26 13:55:00 -
[158] - Quote
Infinity Ziona wrote:Harry Forever wrote:Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris wrote:Harry Forever wrote:StoneCold wrote:Only read the 1st post.
The idea was there like 1000 times allready. It-¦s bad. Nope, its even terrible. Maybe even terribad. NO.
If you want plex-for-skilltime -> char bazaar this way. when it was there a 1000 times, then maybe because there is an issue, no? NO, its because there are many new players that dont understand the game and want instant gratification as they used to get in other games. I'm gamer since over 30 years, I understand more about games like you ever will, trust me that when the game started the skill time was there to keep the game motivated and stay longer the more the game lasts the bigger problem and hurdle this becomes for new entrys thats why this needs some adjustemnt like I mentioned adding a possibility to buy 1 month of skillpoints with plex every 6 month in addition to the normal skillplan would help a lot and would not damage the mechanic at all Not true. If you have been gaming for 30 years you probably have played EQ, WoW type leveling games. In those games it takes a significant amount of time to level and gear out a max class (example enchanter). EvE is similiar in that it takes a significant amount of time to train a specialized class (example: ECM specialist in Falcon). Ironically in EvE its quicker than in EQ. What you are not getting is EvE like those games is full of classes (logi, dps frig, tackler inty, cap pilot- theyre just not as clearly defined and they have lots of crossover skills that wont need to be retrained for a new class unlike other games. Its no harder to become an expert in EvE than those other games and while youre becoming specialized in one ship / role youre fullfilling requirements for others (engineering is needed for all ship roles / classes )
I do not take other games as measurment, as each game has its own logic, in eve more skilltime is needed for the early player, therefore the possibility to purchase more skilltime as an option and again limited maybe between 1-3 month of SP per year would be a good addition to the game, and would not harm anybody
I agree to everybody that the possibility to purchase unlimited skilltime might not be a good idea OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
146
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 14:12:00 -
[159] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote:
I do not take other games as measurment, as each game has its own logic, in eve more skilltime is needed for the early player, therefore the possibility to purchase more skilltime as an option and again limited maybe between 1-3 month of SP per year would be a good addition to the game, and would not harm anybody
I agree to everybody that the possibility to purchase unlimited skilltime might not be a good idea
You missed the point. Its no harder to train into most specialized ship roles than it was 10 years ago. Its easier now in most cases than it was in the past. There are a few exceptions (black ops, cap ships) but generally theres no need to worry about being 10 years behind because youre not unless you want to be good at everything.
Just like you cant expect to play WoW and be max level max geared in all classes / races quickly you cant expect that in EvE either.
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
169
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 14:18:00 -
[160] - Quote
Infinity Ziona wrote:Harry Forever wrote:
I do not take other games as measurment, as each game has its own logic, in eve more skilltime is needed for the early player, therefore the possibility to purchase more skilltime as an option and again limited maybe between 1-3 month of SP per year would be a good addition to the game, and would not harm anybody
I agree to everybody that the possibility to purchase unlimited skilltime might not be a good idea
You missed the point. Its no harder to train into most specialized ship roles than it was 10 years ago. Its easier now in most cases than it was in the past. There are a few exceptions (black ops, cap ships) but generally theres no need to worry about being 10 years behind because youre not unless you want to be good at everything. Just like you cant expect to play WoW and be max level max geared in all classes / races quickly you cant expect that in EvE either.
my suggestion should just be used as additional boost and motivation ever few month, don't worry, everybody will be fine with that OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
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De'Veldrin
East India Ore Trade The East India Co.
1644
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 15:47:00 -
[161] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote:Infinity Ziona wrote:Harry Forever wrote:
I do not take other games as measurment, as each game has its own logic, in eve more skilltime is needed for the early player, therefore the possibility to purchase more skilltime as an option and again limited maybe between 1-3 month of SP per year would be a good addition to the game, and would not harm anybody
I agree to everybody that the possibility to purchase unlimited skilltime might not be a good idea
You missed the point. Its no harder to train into most specialized ship roles than it was 10 years ago. Its easier now in most cases than it was in the past. There are a few exceptions (black ops, cap ships) but generally theres no need to worry about being 10 years behind because youre not unless you want to be good at everything. Just like you cant expect to play WoW and be max level max geared in all classes / races quickly you cant expect that in EvE either. my suggestion should just be used as additional boost and motivation ever few month, don't worry, everybody will be fine with that
We sure will Captain Misplaced Assumption!
Oh wait, no we're not, as we repeatedly tell people just like you who think that this is somehow a magic bullet that will cure all that is wrong with Eve.
Honestly Malcanis, it's time you put your law back in your signature. People seem to be forgetting it again. Eve Online: The full-contact sport for your brain. |
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
307
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 17:28:00 -
[162] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote: my suggestion should just be used as additional boost and motivation ever few month, don't worry, everybody will be fine with that
This is exactly like suggesting people should be able to buy one max level WoW character directly from Blizzard per expansion. All you end up doing is running out of content faster. |
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
176
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 19:22:00 -
[163] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Harry Forever wrote: my suggestion should just be used as additional boost and motivation ever few month, don't worry, everybody will be fine with that
All you end up doing is running out of content faster... ...get bored and leave game faster. Instant gratification at its best. Opinions are like assholes. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks. |
Maldiro Selkurk
CHEMO IMMUNO RESISTANT VIRUS strain SELKURK
4
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 20:33:00 -
[164] - Quote
Dear OP,
first about 50% of the respondents are doing the standard knee-jerk "No!" response with zero thought behind their responses, there are always a cluster of such respondents to any idea no matter how good or logically consistent that idea is, so just ignore them.
Your idea is 100% consistent with the sellout that CCP has made of EVE. You can PLEX your way to infinity wealth no issues, you can buy a pilot with a bazillion SPs, again no problem.
For those that are proposing he simply buy a bazaar pilot, that is fine if that suits him but why should this be his only option for instantly grabbing a bunch of SPs, there is no valid argument that this should be the only avenue available to him other than 'it already exists' and this is insufficient reasoning.
OP,
Your method of skill point acceleration is just an extension of logic CCP has already put into place and supported and I will add my own support of your idea as well not because i personally like the idea but because it is a consistent policy and there can be no valid justification why it should not be allowed.
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Maldiro Selkurk
CHEMO IMMUNO RESISTANT VIRUS strain SELKURK
4
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 21:01:00 -
[165] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Azrael Dinn wrote:
Also when a new player starts the game he wont know anything about any skill plans like we do. He will train something what might be useless and that also consumes time alot...
In which case, advising him to spend extra money for even more skillpoints he won't know how to properly apply seems rather cruel.
CSM Malcanis,
If he decides to buy 1000 PLEX and then gets scammed out of them two days later a game mechanic that CCP already supports is this not more cruel?
If he misappropriates SPs he still has them even if they lead to a messed up piloting skill plan; however, if he gets scammed out of billions worth of PLEX he ends up with nothing. |
Maldiro Selkurk
CHEMO IMMUNO RESISTANT VIRUS strain SELKURK
5
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 21:09:00 -
[166] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Harry Forever wrote: my suggestion should just be used as additional boost and motivation ever few month, don't worry, everybody will be fine with that
This is exactly like suggesting people should be able to buy one max level WoW character directly from Blizzard per expansion. All you end up doing is running out of content faster.
You can max a WOW toon in a couple weeks the best guilds clear all new Xpac content sometimes in as little as 3 days, yet these people have been playing WOW for years, your implication that playing at max level in a game leads to burn out does not hold up, I played WOW for 8 years and during that time i spent probably 99.9% of the time at max level, If you do a character scan of a WOW server you will find almost the entire online player base at that particular moment in time is Max level and yet they still play year after year. |
Alexila Quant
Strategic Acquisitions Group Tactical Research Lab
89
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 21:46:00 -
[167] - Quote
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:Dear OP,
first about 50% of the respondents are doing the standard knee-jerk "No!" response with zero thought behind their responses, there are always a cluster of such respondents to any idea no matter how good or logically consistent that idea is, so just ignore them.
Your idea is 100% consistent with the sellout that CCP has made of EVE. You can PLEX your way to infinity wealth no issues, you can buy a pilot with a bazillion SPs, again no problem.
For those that are proposing he simply buy a bazaar pilot, that is fine if that suits him but why should this be his only option for instantly grabbing a bunch of SPs, there is no valid argument that this should be the only avenue available to him other than 'it already exists' and this is insufficient reasoning.
OP,
Your method of skill point acceleration is just an extension of logic CCP has already put into place and supported and I will add my own support of your idea as well not because i personally like the idea but because it is a consistent policy and there can be no valid justification why it should not be allowed.
Please kindly contract all of your assets to the account of Alexila Quant and be on your merry way.
Also, No. |
Maldiro Selkurk
CHEMO IMMUNO RESISTANT VIRUS strain SELKURK
5
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 21:50:00 -
[168] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:See also:
-Removing L4 missions from hi-sec -Adding a PvE only EVE server -Making PvE occur in locked instances -PvP flags -A hundred other incredibly bad ideas that boil down to 'I should get free stuff and more skills and then claim that this is a good thing because it will "benefit new players"'
Artificially linking the OPs suggestion to suggestions that he never said he supports is unfair argumentation and in the end amounts to nothing more than a show of malice and belittlement on your part towards the OP.
Had this comment come from a regular forum poster i would not have bothered to respond to it but as a CSM i feel you must be held to the highest possible forum posting decorum. |
Gorgoth24
Sickology
32
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 21:54:00 -
[169] - Quote
-Enter Rage Here-
NO |
Maldiro Selkurk
CHEMO IMMUNO RESISTANT VIRUS strain SELKURK
5
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 21:54:00 -
[170] - Quote
Quote:
Please kindly contract all of your assets to the account of Alexila Quant and be on your merry way.
this part i dont get, went over my head i guess.
You honestly made me laugh ! |
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
170
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 06:47:00 -
[171] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Harry Forever wrote:StoneCold wrote:Only read the 1st post.
The idea was there like 1000 times allready. It-¦s bad. Nope, its even terrible. Maybe even terribad. NO.
If you want plex-for-skilltime -> char bazaar this way. when it was there a 1000 times, then maybe because there is an issue, no? The issue is that the kind of person who thinks that it's a good idea tends to be the kind of person who thinks that they're the first to have thought of it and that they shouldn't bother to look to see if has already been raised and shown to be terrible.
like many others you just ignore the issue because it only is an issue for newer players, as CSM you should however have a ear also for newbs
as CSM you may also rethink how you talk to people, I blocked you some time ago because you get personal pretty often to people, and you like giving new people the feeling that they feel stupid, not sure why you need that but as a CSM you might rethink that tactic
I also mentiond already that it could be added with certain restrictions, so just 1-3 month of additional skill-time via plex per year
I hardly believe plexing 1 or 2 month of additional skill-time would be a big problem for the game
the additional cash flow could be used by CCP to invest in bigger expansions
they even could make it possible to just plex skillpoints right after the expansion is launched, so it would be an additional motivation for players who left to come back to the game
there are many advantages if it is used wisely OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
Elizabeth Aideron
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
41
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 07:35:00 -
[172] - Quote
The new expansion has buffed laser ships a lot. Please use the piles of PLEX we have from botting and moons to get the SP for them at once, so we can have even more of an advantage.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored *** |
Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
170
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 09:16:00 -
[173] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:nosentence substitute 1.= not at all, certainly not, of course not, absolutely not, never, no way, nay GÇó `Any problems?' - `No, everything's fine.' opposites: yes, of course, certainly noun 2.= refusal, rejection, denial, negation, veto GÇó My answer to that is an emphatic no.opposites: acceptance, consent, assent
thanks for your thoughtful explanation by the way, always good to have CSMs with keen insight
you might consider not trolling in your comments though, you have extreme tendency to do it all the time OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10383
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 09:24:00 -
[174] - Quote
I see that you're using "trolling" in the modern sense of "disagreeing with me in a way I can't effectively argue against so I'll claim you hurt my feelings".
I feel no obligation whatsoever, either moral or professional, to give bad, self-serving, destructive ideas any respect whatsoever. No doubt you're a perfectly fine person, and I have no doubt I'd be happy to meet you in real life, but a rejection of your bad idea (and it's a terrible horrible bad idea) need not be construed as an attack on you personally. Unless you want it to be, in which case have at it.
I don't want you to feel bad. I am not interested in making you "mad". I just want your proposal to be discredited and rejected.
1 Kings 12:11
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
170
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 09:45:00 -
[175] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:I see that you're using "trolling" in the modern sense of "disagreeing with me in a way I can't effectively argue against so I'll claim you hurt my feelings".
I feel no obligation whatsoever, either moral or professional, to give bad, self-serving, destructive ideas any respect whatsoever. No doubt you're a perfectly fine person, and I have no doubt I'd be happy to meet you in real life, but a rejection of your bad idea (and it's a terrible horrible bad idea) need not be construed as an attack on you personally. Unless you want it to be, in which case have at it.
I don't want you to feel bad. I am not interested in making you "mad". I just want your proposal to be discredited and rejected.
look at your comments, you basically said "NO", that was your only argument, no content nothing behind it, you just talk without giving any explanation why it is a bad idea
so please give us more insight, why and be precise, why would it damage the game to be able to purchase 1-3 month of additional skilltime a year with plex
you might did notice already to buy unlimited skilltime is from the table
I'm unable to disagree with you at this point simply because you did not bring up your opinion yet, instead of comparing the idea with others or just saying "NO"
please when you put together your argument stick to the restriction 1-3 month plexable skilltime per year
thanks OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10389
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 10:14:00 -
[176] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote:Malcanis wrote:I see that you're using "trolling" in the modern sense of "disagreeing with me in a way I can't effectively argue against so I'll claim you hurt my feelings".
I feel no obligation whatsoever, either moral or professional, to give bad, self-serving, destructive ideas any respect whatsoever. No doubt you're a perfectly fine person, and I have no doubt I'd be happy to meet you in real life, but a rejection of your bad idea (and it's a terrible horrible bad idea) need not be construed as an attack on you personally. Unless you want it to be, in which case have at it.
I don't want you to feel bad. I am not interested in making you "mad". I just want your proposal to be discredited and rejected. look at your comments, you basically said "NO", that was your only argument, no content nothing behind it, you just talk without giving any explanation why it is a bad idea
You'll note that I made a second post that explained why.
In short, it's a great deal less effort for someone to spew out a terrible idea than it is to comprehensively explain why it's terrible. Rather than spend hours rehashing exactly the same arguments, it's much more efficient to say "No way, and look at similar threads posted previously on the same topic to see why I'm saying No way".
That's all the response this dreadful proposal deserves.
1 Kings 12:11
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
171
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:33:00 -
[177] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Harry Forever wrote:Malcanis wrote:I see that you're using "trolling" in the modern sense of "disagreeing with me in a way I can't effectively argue against so I'll claim you hurt my feelings".
I feel no obligation whatsoever, either moral or professional, to give bad, self-serving, destructive ideas any respect whatsoever. No doubt you're a perfectly fine person, and I have no doubt I'd be happy to meet you in real life, but a rejection of your bad idea (and it's a terrible horrible bad idea) need not be construed as an attack on you personally. Unless you want it to be, in which case have at it.
I don't want you to feel bad. I am not interested in making you "mad". I just want your proposal to be discredited and rejected. look at your comments, you basically said "NO", that was your only argument, no content nothing behind it, you just talk without giving any explanation why it is a bad idea You'll note that I made a second post that explained why. In short, it's a great deal less effort for someone to spew out a terrible idea than it is to comprehensively explain why it's terrible. Rather than spend hours rehashing exactly the same arguments, it's much more efficient to say "No way, and look at similar threads posted previously on the same topic to see why I'm saying No way".
That's all the response this dreadful proposal deserves.
you explain nothing, and you are not looking at the details in my suggestion, you just brought up other issues where you said "NO" as well, you even prefer to write another 4 lines of nothing instead of 1 line of explanation, I'm sure you understand why I put you on my blocklist again, you do not put any effort into the discussion therefore I will not put any effort into reading through your trolllish comments anymore
at the end I'm sure those threads will not stop until you come up with a solution which works for everybody and not just for you, at some point you will get that, however I'm pretty sure with your attitude you will not be the one coming up with the right idea
ciao OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
xxBLACK SKULLxx 929
NEW ORDER DEATH DEALERS CODE.
8
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 12:20:00 -
[178] - Quote
If your just going to buy your skills don't for get to buy your Permit from the New Order.................
CareBears these days *Shakes Head*
Hail James315 Erotica 1 is my GF irl
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suid0
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
5
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Posted - 2013.06.27 12:56:00 -
[179] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote: at the end I'm sure those threads will not stop until CCP comes up with a solution which works for everybody and not just for a few
Pretty sure the current system works for everyone... the same for everyone..
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
171
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 13:31:00 -
[180] - Quote
suid0 wrote:Harry Forever wrote: at the end I'm sure those threads will not stop until CCP comes up with a solution which works for everybody and not just for a few
Pretty sure the current system works for everyone... the same for everyone..
why do those threads pop up then so often? don't you think thats because people have an issue with the current system? OMG! the asteroid is depleted! |
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