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Victoria Sin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
332
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Posted - 2013.06.27 05:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Yea, another thread about this. Not wishing to get into a deep discussion, but reading past threads, it's apparently not worth it and might even be detrimental to your shield. Has anything changed recently (since the last thread I read, which was around 2009 I think)?
Still not worth training? Or worth training for specific circumstances? |
Mister Tuggles
Faceless Men
42
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Posted - 2013.06.27 09:39:00 -
[2] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:Yea, another thread about this. Not wishing to get into a deep discussion, but reading past threads, it's apparently not worth it and might even be detrimental to your shield. Has anything changed recently (since the last thread I read, which was around 2009 I think)?
Still not worth training? Or worth training for specific circumstances?
Definitely not worth training. If it didn't unlock t2 tank at rank 4 I wouldn't even have taken it there. If you are shield tanking you WANT some bleed through into your armor. Just gives you that much more tanking ability. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10386
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Posted - 2013.06.27 09:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
AFAIK there has never been a satisfactory confirmation of exactly what TSM does.
Even if it does work like one would hope, then the additional benefit is so incredibly tiny that your skillpoints would be better spent elsewhere.
TSM V used to be a pre-requisite for Capital Shield Boosters. That was the only valid reason to train it.
1 Kings 12:11
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Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics K162
2063
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Posted - 2013.06.27 13:05:00 -
[4] - Quote
it's a total waste of time to train to 5. even if you do, its effect is generally undesirable. |
Hyku P'tiboo
Interstellar Geographic Society
4
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Posted - 2013.06.27 17:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
So if I get this right, the idea is to take it to max level IV right ? |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
1332
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Posted - 2013.06.27 17:27:00 -
[6] - Quote
Hyku P'tiboo wrote:So if I get this right, the idea is to take it to max level IV right ?
Yes, and do so as soon as possible. You need 4 for T2 shield hardeners -- which of course you want. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
1966
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Posted - 2013.06.27 17:34:00 -
[7] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:AFAIK there has never been a satisfactory confirmation of exactly what TSM does. There has been enough test data posted, and I can confirm it from my own experience.
* TSM lowers the threshold for damage to begin bleeding through the shield by 5% per level, starting at 25% at level 0. * The chance to bleed remains the same (low). * The amount of bleed remains the same (small). * No additional damage is received by bleeding. * TSM is slightly detrimental to EHP, but not significantly, as it is hard to remain below the threshold for long in actual combat.
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Hyku P'tiboo
Interstellar Geographic Society
4
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Posted - 2013.06.27 17:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
Zhilia Mann wrote:Yes, and do so as soon as possible. You need 4 for T2 shield hardeners -- which of course you want. Thank you.
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Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
416
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Posted - 2013.06.27 17:55:00 -
[9] - Quote
Zhilia Mann wrote:Hyku P'tiboo wrote:So if I get this right, the idea is to take it to max level IV right ? Yes, and do so as soon as possible. You need 4 for T2 shield hardeners -- which of course you want.
werent you the one telling me that TSM 5 actually improves active shield tanking or was that someone else. |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
1332
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Posted - 2013.06.27 17:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tsukino Stareine wrote:Zhilia Mann wrote:Hyku P'tiboo wrote:So if I get this right, the idea is to take it to max level IV right ? Yes, and do so as soon as possible. You need 4 for T2 shield hardeners -- which of course you want. werent you the one telling me that TSM 5 actually improves active shield tanking or was that someone else.
That was Liang Nuren. I don't have a mouth nearly that dirty. |
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Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
416
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Posted - 2013.06.27 18:27:00 -
[11] - Quote
Right, my bad. I never really felt that discussion had any closure, I'm still convinced TSM V is a waste of sp but Liang did put across some interesting points. |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
1332
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Posted - 2013.06.27 18:47:00 -
[12] - Quote
This thread is the one under discussion if anyone else is curious. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
1966
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Posted - 2013.06.27 20:59:00 -
[13] - Quote
Zhilia Mann wrote:This thread is the one under discussion if anyone else is curious. Thanks.
His position in that seems a little contradictory to me. I don't disagree with him, but I'm not as in favour of TSM 5 as he appears to be, for exactly the example he gave: with so little shield remaining, it just doesn't make enough difference. For a capital where 5% shield is significant, then TSM 5 being the former prerequisite to using a Capital Shield Booster makes sense.
All that aside, I don't think it is worth training for two additional weeks for a questionable benefit, unless you are OCD about certificates or have nothing else to train. |
Zenst
Tsunami Cartel Gank for Profit
60
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Posted - 2013.06.28 12:12:00 -
[14] - Quote
AS it stands for sheild and armour tankers the lower it is the better as you gain more sheild from passive recharge (bleeding at 25% keeps your sheild higher and gains on the passive recharge amount better, for armour tankers the same applies and more so by having it hang around 25% more and gain extra passive recharge, though very little it still ways in yoru favour having that skill lower).
For sheild, unless your active tanking would be the only exception, possibly.
Have it at level 4 myself. |
Markku Laaksonen
EVE University Ivy League
148
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Posted - 2013.06.28 16:52:00 -
[15] - Quote
Could this possibly be something our CSM brings up as being reworked to actually be a benefit? Either reworking the skill or the entire mechanic around shield bleed through and low shields in general.
(Does damage bleed through armor into structure?) |
Skelee VI
Wraithguard. BricK sQuAD.
29
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Posted - 2013.06.28 18:33:00 -
[16] - Quote
5 is better than 4. Just like my guitar amp goes to 11! Is it worth the train when you are mid to low skill, probably not. But if you are active tanking it does help in your nice shiny faction boats or capitals!
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Xander Det89
ROC Academy The ROC
10
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Posted - 2013.07.01 13:47:00 -
[17] - Quote
Never seen any bleed through really happen with it at lvl4 anyway. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
1973
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Posted - 2013.07.02 15:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
Xander Det89 wrote:Never seen any bleed through really happen with it at lvl4 anyway. You have to be below 5% shield at level 4 for that to happen.
I've seen it, but it wasn't in normal situation (tanking Sleepers in an old Drake, and bouncing around between 1% and 5% shield between missiles, for about 10 minutes or so until I had to disengage and repair armor). |
Hamatitio
Aperture Harmonics K162
118
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Posted - 2013.07.03 03:03:00 -
[19] - Quote
It used to be a requirement for capital shield boosters.
I'm sad i trained it to use those :(. |
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