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Spr09
Purdue Engineering and Technology Talocan United
14
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Posted - 2011.10.25 23:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
ive never seen anyone fly a EAF anywhere, how bad are these things and how could they be balanced? if im wrong about them, please tell me. i just havent seen ANY of them anywhere. |
Dirk Magnum
Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan
32
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:25:00 -
[2] - Quote
Sentinel is one of the best frigates in circulation. Kitsune is a wonderful small gang ship that combines jamming, speed, tackle, and rocket damage. Hyena with dual web fit is also outstanding in a small gang. You can even pair the Hyena with a cap-stable 2x laser turret and 2x web setup protected by an MSE. Keres is the most maligned of the EAFs, but with level 5 your tackle, buffer, and dampening ability makes you a nice addition to small gangs.
These are not fleet ships, by intent or by design. For small gangs though they are some of the most entertaining things in Eve IMHO. |
Headerman
Quovis Shadow of xXDEATHXx
280
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
They always explode when entering warp cause they have as much HP as a wet paper bag The Apostle : I want a kangeroo Captain Kirk : Silly Austrians Sarmatiko : Let me guess: you're from US? Captain Kirk : Yeah Riverside IA - why? |
Kitty McKitty
In Praise Of Shadows
516
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:28:00 -
[4] - Quote
Problem: They don't have much greater performance than their tech I cruiser counterparts if even on a par with them. Combined with their cost and poor agility people don't tend to bother with them.
Having said that the Sentinel is pretty cool, I just wish I could eke out a little more DPS for soloing in it and neuts dont work so effectively on Minmatar/Dramiel which everyone flies.
Solution?: Not entirely sure but I really think they need agility improving. GÖÑ Haviing your portrait painted here helps INTAKI Disabled Children GÖÑ |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
347
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:31:00 -
[5] - Quote
Both responders above me are correct :) The paper tank means it takes bravery to fly it, which is sadly a declining attribute of pilots these days....
I particularly enjoy the Hyena - with two webs and a long point, it can very quickly immobilize anything that jumps through the gate if you're parked at zero. You may lose the ship frequently, but if you are snagging much more valuable ships or significant war targets than it is completely worth the cost.
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Large Collidable Object
morons.
439
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dirk Magnum wrote:Sentinel is one of the best frigates in circulation.
I've flown a sentinel a few times, but didn't particularily like it. I liked its offensive capabilities, but the combination of a paper-thin tank, mediocre speed and a terribly huge sig radius for a frig were quite a letdown.
Granted I only have EAF IV and didn't fly it enough to really get experienced with it...
morons-áare recruiting. We're good at breeding! |
Kitty McKitty
In Praise Of Shadows
516
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
400 plate and lg-slaved Sentinel is fun. GÖÑ Haviing your portrait painted here helps INTAKI Disabled Children GÖÑ |
Niffo
Defenders of Order
4
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:48:00 -
[8] - Quote
If you have never had one in your fleets, you're flying with the wrong people - especially when it comes to small skirmish battles. |
Jiska Ensa
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
18
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:54:00 -
[9] - Quote
I see them all the time but only with younger players. And those players usually only lose one (rather quickly) and then switch to something stronger.
That being said they are very useful in small gangs - hence why they get primaried all the time. |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
102
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Posted - 2011.10.26 00:56:00 -
[10] - Quote
Dirk Magnum wrote:Hyena with dual web fit is also outstanding in a small gang. You can even pair the Hyena with a cap-stable 2x laser turret and 2x web setup protected by an MSE. Keres is the most maligned of the EAFs, but with level 5 your tackle, buffer, and dampening ability makes you a nice addition to small gangs.
These are not fleet ships, by intent or by design. For small gangs though they are some of the most entertaining things in Eve IMHO.
Hyena's too frail to be of use in this after-nano age era, and tackling interceptors are faster, cheaper, and much more survivable than the keres, even considering damps and the shorter point range. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
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Large Collidable Object
morons.
439
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Posted - 2011.10.26 01:00:00 -
[11] - Quote
Kitty McKitty wrote:400 plate and lg-slaved Sentinel is fun.
Never tried that - IIRC the only time when I tried them was pre-QR, so I think I tried to nano it which didn't work out that well.
My main gripe was the huge sig radius (at least that was what stuck with me after my experiments) and my guess/suggestion would be that their sig radius gets reduced when buffing them.
Given the preliminary changes to destroyers, EAFs except the Hyena would be closer to destroyers rather than frigs in regards to sig radius, so it would be a good place to start.
I didn't feel their agility to be much of a problem - it's better than e.g. that of a Vengeance and the sentinel is faster. Yet I never had a problem using that - but the far better resists/base EHP in combination with the smaller sigradius made it far more viable. morons-áare recruiting. We're good at breeding! |
Spr09
Purdue Engineering and Technology Talocan United
14
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Posted - 2011.10.26 02:54:00 -
[12] - Quote
good suggestions, one more question: do EAFs have a purpose or are they just there to be there? |
Flyinghotpocket
Amarrian Retribution
5
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Posted - 2011.10.26 03:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
Spr09 wrote:ive never seen anyone fly a EAF anywhere, how bad are these things and how could they be balanced? if im wrong about them, please tell me. i just havent seen ANY of them anywhere. garbage, fix needs to be lower sig more hitpoints. then you will see them right now its litterly 2 shot form a destroyer and its gone. and the sig the size of a smaller cruiser. a battlecruiser and easily hit these. |
Bomberlocks
CTRL-Q
9
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Posted - 2011.10.26 03:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
EAFs don't offer much over regular inties; a Keres isn't really better than an Ares in lock times or point range. Same goes for the others with the exception of the Kitsune, which you do see in combat now and again, usually just before it dies, and Sentinels, usually in your rearview mirror as they're pretty OP to most other frigs in 1v1. In gangs they usually die quickly because of their lack of tank. The Hyena also sees some use in combat, but also dies rather often.
The best thing about the Keres is actually its 5 mid slots. Dual web+Scram+TD+AB and rails in the highs make for a better Battle Helios than the Helios itself. |
non judgement
Without Fear Flying Burning Ships Alliance
120
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Posted - 2011.10.26 03:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
They can keep up with frigate gangs. So if you want an ecm ship in your frigate fleet you don't have to wait for a slower cruiser.
Is that the purpose you mean? |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
7
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Posted - 2011.10.26 03:21:00 -
[16] - Quote
I can't fly the Sentinel... as with the Crucifier, something was wrong when they designed the hull. |
non judgement
Without Fear Flying Burning Ships Alliance
120
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Posted - 2011.10.26 03:31:00 -
[17] - Quote
You can't fly it cause you think the hull doesn't look right?
I think it looks pretty good. |
Lithalnas
Privateers Privateer Alliance
3
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Posted - 2011.10.26 03:41:00 -
[18] - Quote
the sentinel is ok if you pick your fights. Right now the only thing a sentinel can win against is someone not fielding a full flight of light drones or any sort of missiles. With EAF 5 its a good ship to fight taranis, crusaders even stilettos. The big problem is that a hawk (missiles) will eat it in 10 seconds flat and a harpy(turrets) will die to a sentinel sometime in the next 5 minutes. How to build a PC for EVE thread (by Akira T) http://eve-search.com/thread/1559734-0/page/1
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Soldarius
Peek-A-Boo Bombers
48
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Posted - 2011.10.26 04:03:00 -
[19] - Quote
I trained EAF a while ago because of Kitsune. But I wasn't too pleased with it due to rather short engagement range and only room enough for 3 ECM mods after prop mods, etc.
Later on, when I trained Gallente frigate 5 for Nemesis, I realized I could now fly the Keres as well. 2-3 range scripted damps plus a range boosted long point and cap stable w/o MWD running means perma-tackle for anything with a locking range of less than 100km.
Unfortunately, it's dps is abysmal. So it's not suitable for solo PvP. But it's great for getting that initial tackle.
I actually took it out on a BC roam as semi-fast tackle. Lock time wasn't so good. But when we leroyed into a FW BS gang twice our size, guess who was the only pilot to get out with his ship? I also flew that silly thing from Fountain to Deklein, back to Outer Ring, and out to Black Rise without getting ganked. Its a fun little ship. Just remember to keep range. "How do you kill that which has no life?" |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
49
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Posted - 2011.10.26 04:40:00 -
[20] - Quote
They aren't very useful and the training for them is a dead end. I'm amazed people even train the skill to fly them at all. |
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Rocky Deadshot
In The Goo EVE Trade Alliance
39
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Posted - 2011.10.26 04:42:00 -
[21] - Quote
Just saying: Working as intended.
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CCP Spitfire
C C P C C P Alliance
362
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Posted - 2011.10.26 14:25:00 -
[22] - Quote
Moved from "EVE General Discussion".
CCP Spitfire | Russian Community Coordinator @ccp_spitfire |
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Zeek Tarlox
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.26 15:29:00 -
[23] - Quote
Any other input on this?
I thought about training for a Keres, but the 2 high slots has me worried about being able to do damage. It would take forever to kill anything with it. |
Kitty McKitty
In Praise Of Shadows
528
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Posted - 2011.10.26 17:47:00 -
[24] - Quote
I might have fun in them on rare occasions but I don't advise training for them over inties or AF's. If you have the skillpoint investment to spare then sure but they sound far more appealing in concept than they are in practice. GÖÑ Haviing your portrait painted here helps INTAKI Disabled Children GÖÑ |
Nimrod Nemesis
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2011.10.26 17:54:00 -
[25] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Both responders above me are correct :) The paper tank means it takes bravery to fly it, which is sadly a declining attribute of pilots these days....
I particularly enjoy the Hyena - with two webs and a long point, it can very quickly immobilize anything that jumps through the gate if you're parked at zero. You may lose the ship frequently, but if you are snagging much more valuable ships or significant war targets than it is completely worth the cost.
I'd just like to point out this can be done nearly as well by a vigil for a fraction of the cost. I would like a compelling reason to fly the hyena, but realistically it's just throwing money down the toilet, especially for a role like that. |
Nezumiiro Noneko
Alternative Enterprises
6
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Posted - 2011.10.27 05:19:00 -
[26] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:They aren't very useful and the training for them is a dead end. I'm amazed people even train the skill to fly them at all.
not so much they shoot for it.....they probably have ocd and say lets fly all frigates lol. Only oddballs would be your caldari who learn ecm skills jsut for this ship. ECM in my opinion a longer path over your TD's and such since chance based. If you want to do it right.....you need to get them odds in your favor. Other races its not too much out of your way to use these imo. In range that td is gonna hit rain or shine.
Now if someone took this ship class to 5, they either are bored or confused lol. That motivated to e-war, save that spare time you seem to have for recon 5 what I'd do. Pita train that is at least worth it. |
Dro Nee
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.27 06:51:00 -
[27] - Quote
Senti- most flown EAF and a nice little ship. But good luck getting fights from anyone who knows its capabilities.
Kitsune- probably 2nd most common EAF (from my experience). Does the jamming job well so long as there are limited numbers.
Hyena - not nearly as common as it was pre- nano nerf but you still see them. After the senti its probably the one most people try to solo in.
Keres - Struggles to find a place to shine given that its scram range bonus can be done by an inty and RSD got the snot nerfed out of it long ago (for good reason, even if the nerf was slightly over done). Its a ship I want to love until I try fitting it.
The biggest problem they all face is that the type of engagements in which they shine (frig gangs vs. frig gangs OR frig gang vs. solo cruisers) make up a very small percentage of fights. Thus they mainly show up in FW or 1/10-2/10 plexes where ship size is limited. In more conventional PVP settings EAF's do not have the range/EHP that thier larger cousins do, and so naturally are passed up.
Another key issue is that being frigs they are really only flown by frig fanatics, which tend to be solo or very small gang type people. As gang size decreases DPS needs increase. EAF's have wet noodle DPS, so they dont get flown much. |
Skarned
Inroads
9
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Posted - 2011.10.27 14:02:00 -
[28] - Quote
As I recall, when they were introduced one of CCP's purposes for them was to allow newer players to get a feel for flying a recon without requiring the higher SP investment of recons. Unfortunately, for newer players getting good in an EAF is nothing but a 2-3 week training side-track from pursuing Recons. |
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