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Fal Dara
The Scope Gallente Federation
64
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 23:33:00 -
[1] - Quote
Now, i suppose i should have seen this coming, right?
it appears that many (not all, not most) t2 rigs, especially the large, are in middle of a price crash.
narrowed one down to the market history of things like the Single-crystal superalloy I-beam. price drop of some 500%.
... anyone else notice this?
CCP?
did i NOT see a patch note? |
Johan Toralen
IIIJIIIITIIII
198
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Posted - 2013.07.21 01:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Fal Dara wrote:did i NOT see a patch note?
It appears you didn't just miss a patch note but the whole Odyssey expansion. The price drop is caused by the large influx of new explorers running profession sites.
That said i feel your pain being affected by the price crashes myself. |
mechtech
Ice Liberation Army
469
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 01:28:00 -
[3] - Quote
From the patch notes:
"To compensate for salvaging sites no longer appearing, archaeology sites drop more salvaging materials now than before (there was no special salvaging-only loot in salvage sites)"
Salvage is also included in the loot spew minigame rewards:
"- Parts Container (datacores, decryptors, electronic parts, salvage) - Materials Container (carbon, production materials, salvage)"
In addition, this dev blog shows the massive increase in people doing exploration.
Ultimately, there is a massively increased supply for salvage. |
Fal Dara
The Scope Gallente Federation
64
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Posted - 2013.07.21 02:31:00 -
[4] - Quote
ah, i sppose it it most those things effecting it..
but some t2 salvage doesnt seem effected much at all, others are at 15% of their pre-patch value.
I guess, once it settles, we'll have a new baseline to work with.
just seems rather random, which components are effeced the most.
thanks for putting my mind to rest... even if my wallet is unsettled! |
Brewlar Kuvakei
Adeptio Gloriae
229
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Posted - 2013.07.21 10:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Fal Dara wrote:ah, i sppose it it most those things effecting it..
No need to suppose, it is those things effecting it. |
Johan Toralen
IIIJIIIITIIII
198
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 14:20:00 -
[6] - Quote
Fal Dara wrote: just seems rather random, which components are effeced the most.
High value t2 salvage is effected most because that's what people cherrypick and farm.
I notice a slight recovery tho. Volume in market has steadily gone down over the last couple days for instance Intact Armor Plates. Price hit bottom at 5m in Jita, now it's back to 6.8m. Don't know if its because people get bored of the new sites (which would be nice) or just because we are in the summer holiday season. Could also be that more people now realised that the price tags on their loot was from before Odyssey and that in reality they made way less then they thought. |
Caleb Ayrania
TarNec Invisible Exchequer
201
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Posted - 2013.07.22 01:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
Maybe its about time ccp looked into fixing these things..
The price gradients have been ******** for ages. The whole drop rates and loot tables needs a huge tweaking..
The salvage in particular have always been a problem, mainly because value per time made it totally not worth it.
What they did with the combat mission mineral "mining" now needs to be done in a broader way, to balance all drop rates ingame.. Picking some arbitrary number of of the air guessing and hoping it will fit with gameplay is how we got to these levels..
It does not help that marketing these items are very lacking, because of the lack of excess market orders and/or traders willing to invest into these markets..
I would expect this price drop turns around and becomes a profit maker on the universal scale. So the loss short term on profits might just turn around soon, especially is some more thought on these balances gets on the table for the next period of patches.
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mechtech
Ice Liberation Army
470
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 02:15:00 -
[8] - Quote
Caleb Ayrania wrote:Maybe its about time ccp looked into fixing these things.. The price gradients have been ******** for ages. The whole drop rates and loot tables needs a huge tweaking..
It's impossible to predict player behavior perfectly.
Exploration player numbers won't stabilize until the next new feature comes out in the next expansion. CCP, as always, will wait for everything to settle down before pushing more patches with unpredictable results.
I don't think salvaging was ever meant to be a high value profession though, so I wouldn't hold your breath. After all, it's basically picking up left behind trash... |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E. Aegis Solaris
2044
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Posted - 2013.07.22 16:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
mechtech wrote:Caleb Ayrania wrote:Maybe its about time ccp looked into fixing these things.. The price gradients have been ******** for ages. The whole drop rates and loot tables needs a huge tweaking..
It's impossible to predict player behavior perfectly. Exploration player numbers won't stabilize until the next new feature comes out in the next expansion. CCP, as always, will wait for everything to settle down before pushing more patches with unpredictable results. I don't think salvaging was ever meant to be a high value profession though, so I wouldn't hold your breath. After all, it's basically picking up left behind trash... As we cannot predict player behavior the current salvage mechanic will always have an odd "bottleneck": One or two items will be in short supply while all the rest will be in oversupply. The issue here is the supply cannot adjust to the demand. I cannot decide to salvage more armor plates instead of salvaging other stuff. Right now as I get armor plates I accumulate far more of the other stuff than the producers need, given that they are limited by the number of armor plates (or some other rare item).
So maybe we should let the players have some control over what salvage is produced. For example, let me set my weapons to avoid targeting defensive systems. The result is I get more armor plates and less of everything else, and it takes a bit longer to get through the hull points of the enemy ship.
Several different areas could be designated to be avoided: defensive, offensive, propulsion, power, electronics. Setting my weapons to avoid one or two increases the associated salvage items of that area while reducing all else (with a net total reduction). http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
751
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Posted - 2013.07.22 20:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
Brewlar Kuvakei wrote:Fal Dara wrote:ah, i sppose it it most those things effecting it..
No need to suppose, it is those things effecting it. I agree 100% that this has had a large effect. But I would not be surprised in the loot tables have also been adjusted to reduce the bottle necks of many T2 salvage items.
The thing is we do not just have a massive increase in explorers bringing in the salvage, but demand has also gone way up with the new capital rigs. In order for T2 capital rigs to be even remotely affordable the supply of the salvage going into them needs to be increased 10 or even 20 fold. It would be irresponsible to rely on the increased activity to make up this supply, i am sure the loot tables have been adjusted, just not mentioned in the notes. |
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Johan Toralen
IIIJIIIITIIII
200
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 21:12:00 -
[11] - Quote
Bugsy VanHalen wrote:The thing is we do not just have a massive increase in explorers bringing in the salvage, but demand has also gone way up with the new capital rigs. In order for T2 capital rigs to be even remotely affordable the supply of the salvage going into them needs to be increased 10 or even 20 fold. It would be irresponsible to rely on the increased activity to make up this supply, i am sure the loot tables have been adjusted, just not mentioned in the notes.
Demand hasn't gone way up otherwise markets would not have crashed. Obviously it was CCP's intention with the t2 cap rigs but that didn't work out (worked as intended for t1 cap rigs tho). Only a small number are useful at all which turned out to be a niche market with minimal impact.
Possibly you are correct that way lower t2 salvage price would change that but that can't be the solution as it basicly makes exploration useless. Better solution would be to decrease the amount of salvage thats needed to build t2 cap rigs and at the same time creating more demand for small, medium and large rigs by fixing the fitting requirements. That would make everybody happy, people who use t2 rigs, traders, producers and explorers. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
10945
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 08:31:00 -
[12] - Quote
Fal Dara wrote:Now, i suppose i should have seen this coming, right?
it appears that many (not all, not most) t2 rigs, especially the large, are in middle of a price crash.
narrowed one down to the market history of things like the Single-crystal superalloy I-beam. price drop of some 500%.
... anyone else notice this?
CCP?
did i NOT see a patch note?
500% price drop?
1 Kings 12:11
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Myriad Blaze
60
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 09:29:00 -
[13] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Fal Dara wrote:Now, i suppose i should have seen this coming, right?
it appears that many (not all, not most) t2 rigs, especially the large, are in middle of a price crash.
narrowed one down to the market history of things like the Single-crystal superalloy I-beam. price drop of some 500%.
... anyone else notice this?
CCP?
did i NOT see a patch note? 500% price drop?
They are so desperate to get rid of those items, that they pay you to get rid of the stuff.
SCNR |
Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
299
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 13:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
The real solution would be for CCP to properly look into making more T2 rigs useful, adjusting the calibration points porperly and the benefits vs. drawbacks appropriately.
Right now very few T2 rigs are actually useful or in any sort of demand except for the obvious ones, hence having massive supply/demand imbalances for certain types of T2 salvage. Altering drop rates (via new sites etc) to drop more of the in demand stuff is just lowering the overall value of the stuff without really attempting a proper solution. |
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
370
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 13:34:00 -
[15] - Quote
Fal Dara wrote:narrowed one down to the market history of things like the Single-crystal superalloy I-beam. price drop of some 500%.
Please explain to me how a price can drop by 500%. |
Fal Dara
The Scope Gallente Federation
64
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 19:43:00 -
[16] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Fal Dara wrote:Now, i suppose i should have seen this coming, right?
it appears that many (not all, not most) t2 rigs, especially the large, are in middle of a price crash.
narrowed one down to the market history of things like the Single-crystal superalloy I-beam. price drop of some 500%.
... anyone else notice this?
CCP?
did i NOT see a patch note? 500% price drop?
at the time, what i was trying to say, was that their current price is low. their current price would buy 5 of the old ones...
now, i put that as 500%... (ie, to get to the old price, the current one would have to be 500% more)... maybe that's not the straight line you would like, but it works for me.
suppose it could be said as 1/5th as expensive as they were..
1/5th as cheap..
20% of their previous price...
you want to haggle over the term used to express the drop, mr csm? fine.
point is that the drop rate got borked. i would be happy with a change in materials needed in the print, but, no, they changed drop rates. some of the items seem virtually unchanged--within a few hundred k of pre-patch levels (when dealing with 3+m items), others, that were like this single-crystal thing, 3.5m, are now 500k or so... reflecting, to me, atleast a selective change to drop rates, at worst, a random change... OR, something they were not even aware they did (by adding new sites, combining salvage with other sites, etc)
but no... you had to sink to that 500% thing... nice. |
Zos Tarkross
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 20:23:00 -
[17] - Quote
If price went from 100 to 90 we would say the item had experienced a 10% price drop: [(90 / 100) - 1] = -10%.
Therefore, when price goes from 100 to 20 then the price drop is 80%: [(20/100) - 1] = -80%.
Please note - I appreciate that when writing forum posts quickly the math is sometimes glossed over and most people would have known what is meant by "price drop of 500%". |
GreasyCarl Semah
A Game as Old as Empire
28
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 03:04:00 -
[18] - Quote
The crash in t2 salvage is just another opportunity to get filthy rich in the long term. |
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