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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
DOARota
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Posted - 2005.12.20 15:23:00 -
[451]
This is a major blow to races who get a bonus to these 2 forms of EW. Don't panic? Devise new fits? Read the thread and do the math, and Bump.
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Balazs Simon
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Posted - 2005.12.20 15:59:00 -
[452]
Bumpadge in hope of DEV Repply...
Tracking comps totaly discard tracking disruptor effect ,and same with the sensor booster and dampener..
The + modul on your ship penalise the - modul used on you.
This is WRONG! Fix it plz. -
This post is my personal opinion. It does not represent the standpoint of the HUN Corporation in any way. - |
Goberth Ludwig
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Posted - 2005.12.20 16:07:00 -
[453]
Edited by: Goberth Ludwig on 20/12/2005 16:07:24 Why reply from devs? :¦(
- Gob (also known as Admiral Goberius) |
Mowz
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Posted - 2005.12.20 16:08:00 -
[454]
Damps were obviously overpowered considering ECM, as the primary ewar race's flavor, should be the best ewar option for non-specialist ships. IMO 1 boost + 1 damp should = same targeting range unless you have bonuses.
That said, this issue is kinda insane and gimps the crap out of a couple of otherwise cool ewar ships and it's obviously unintended which sucks. Broken ships shouldn't fall off the front page until they're at least adressed by a dev, so -bumpitty-
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Kalixa Hihro
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Posted - 2005.12.20 17:42:00 -
[455]
Edited by: Kalixa Hihro on 20/12/2005 17:43:48 Didn't the stacking penalty for two boosters go away or get reduced? Then you need to consider that the RSD stacking penalty did too, for the first two RSD's, the remaining two are extremely penalized now... they do barely anything.
I believe, according to the new calc's, two boosters vs. two dampeners would probably cancel each other out or thereabouts. Discard the #3 and #4 dampeners because they aren't doing squat.
I could be wrong, but based on your charts I am in the ballpark.
This is probably one of those unintentional consequences that happen when you go messing with an extremely complex combat system.
-Kal
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Sergi
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Posted - 2005.12.20 17:44:00 -
[456]
still hoping to get the official dev responce not rumours (bump)
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Darpz
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Posted - 2005.12.20 17:54:00 -
[457]
Originally by: Kalixa Hihro
I could be wrong, but based on your charts I am in the ballpark. -Kal
you are wrong whats happening is the RSD and Sensorboosters are being thrown into the same stacking formula with the positive effect mods being calculated first. all I would need to negate and tracking or sensordampening on my ship would be to fit 3 basic tracking enhancers or sensor amp, and these basic mods which take no SP to fit will negate a fully skilled dampening or tracking disrupter pilot with millions of SP in EW
Originally by: TomB
Originally by: Darpz
Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi CCP will nerf this probably, but hey, worth a try
so your saying I should of kept my mouth shut?
Yup.
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Talon Calais
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Posted - 2005.12.20 19:38:00 -
[458]
16 pages, isn't this where TomB or Hammer come in and explain everything?
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Darpz
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Posted - 2005.12.20 19:40:00 -
[459]
Originally by: Talon Calais 16 pages, isn't this where TomB or Hammer come in and explain everything?
you would think
Originally by: TomB
Originally by: Darpz
Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi CCP will nerf this probably, but hey, worth a try
so your saying I should of kept my mouth shut?
Yup.
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Espen
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Posted - 2005.12.20 19:59:00 -
[460]
o/
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Darpz
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Posted - 2005.12.20 20:01:00 -
[461]
Originally by: Espen o/
\o
Originally by: TomB
Originally by: Darpz
Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi CCP will nerf this probably, but hey, worth a try
so your saying I should of kept my mouth shut?
Yup.
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skandalf
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Posted - 2005.12.20 20:09:00 -
[462]
nerf this, nerf that oh wait a sec we need this nerfed cos ......blah blah blah blah blah......
BORING!!!!!!
just stop asking for things to get nerfed ffs! it wrecks the whole game for everyone else you never know it might be your fave equiptment or ships getting nerfed next time, think about that u whining lamers asking for things constantly to be nerfed just to try n gain a extremely small advantage. if you dont like the game how it is why still play eve?
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Darpz
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Posted - 2005.12.20 20:39:00 -
[463]
Originally by: skandalf nerf this, nerf that oh wait a sec we need this nerfed cos ......blah blah blah blah blah......
BORING!!!!!!
just stop asking for things to get nerfed ffs! it wrecks the whole game for everyone else you never know it might be your fave equiptment or ships getting nerfed next time, think about that u whining lamers asking for things constantly to be nerfed just to try n gain a extremely small advantage. if you dont like the game how it is why still play eve?
dude STFU you making a fool of yourself.
Originally by: TomB
Originally by: Darpz
Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi CCP will nerf this probably, but hey, worth a try
so your saying I should of kept my mouth shut?
Yup.
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skandalf
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Posted - 2005.12.20 20:50:00 -
[464]
same old story as far as im concerned relating to nerfs they bugger the game up so y dont u go play on the motorway dude
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The Cosmopolite
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Posted - 2005.12.20 20:56:00 -
[465]
Originally by: skandalf same old story as far as im concerned relating to nerfs they bugger the game up so y dont u go play on the motorway dude
You appear not to have realised that this is an anti-nerf thread.
Cosmo
Jericho Fraction |
Chith
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Posted - 2005.12.20 21:13:00 -
[466]
Edited by: Chith on 20/12/2005 21:14:50 I was and still am a very, very frequent user of TDs and damps. I think the change is an improvement over what was there before, but may bear a little more examination. Those EW modules were utterly overpowered and tremendously broken. Every time a Burn Eden corpmember posts in this thread an angel gets its wings. |
Rob Boberton
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Posted - 2005.12.20 21:39:00 -
[467]
Edited by: Rob Boberton on 20/12/2005 21:40:22
Originally by: Chith Every time a Burn Eden corpmember posts in this thread an angel gets its wings.
Honestly I think you have a point. Burn eden's members did this thread a service by starting it, but it only hurts for them to post in it any further. They're kinda like the guy who uses the same cheap move over and over in a fighter game. Lack of sympathy for their one tactic could cause people to gloss over the importance of this critical bug. Of course none of them have posted in a bit so gg guys
edit: we've passed the point of dev response. Where's the beef?
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Naughty Boy
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Posted - 2005.12.20 22:02:00 -
[468]
Edited by: Naughty Boy on 20/12/2005 22:04:35 Some of you seem to totally misunderstand what is happening.
What is happening is that it is a low fixed amount of counter-modules (tracking enhancers/computers, sensor amplifiers/boosters) and not their strength (as determined by skill/ship bonuses) that is determining the outcome of the stacking. Why bother training skills/ using good mods if it is the case?
I couldn't care less about Burn Eden and their so-called cheap tactics, or whether or not dampeners/disruptors needed a nerf in the first place, as if they deserved a nerf (which by the way i believe they did) the outcome of the stacking should depend on the strength of the mods and not on a) an arbitrary sorting convention and arbitrary coding convention of positive/negative effects and b) the amount (and not the strengths) of counter modules.
In other words, quit flaming Burn Eden, it only shows your ignorance on the topic at hand and isn't constructive.
Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy. --- Spreadsheet - Damage @ range. Check for updates/known issues, feedback welcome. |
Kalixa Hihro
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Posted - 2005.12.20 23:53:00 -
[469]
Originally by: Darpz
Originally by: Kalixa Hihro
I could be wrong, but based on your charts I am in the ballpark. -Kal
you are wrong whats happening is the RSD and Sensorboosters are being thrown into the same stacking formula with the positive effect mods being calculated first. all I would need to negate and tracking or sensordampening on my ship would be to fit 3 basic tracking enhancers or sensor amp, and these basic mods which take no SP to fit will negate a fully skilled dampening or tracking disrupter pilot with millions of SP in EW
Don't get your panties in a bunch, I never said it was a good thing. I just trained up for this and was planning on flying a Celestis in fleet ops and my corp now has a RSD II bpo. I think it sucks the big one. I was just offering an observation on how the stacking changes work, and how this fits in, that it makes sense. I am definitely not a fan of this effect of the stacking changes.
In fact, in my post I said it was probably an unintended consequence. I doubt CCP intended to nerf EWAR, and definitely hope it gets fixed.
And I may have been off on the exact reason, but I am in the ballpark. RSD's have very little effect after the first two... and two sensor amps are more powerful than they used to be because of the stacking changes.
So defensive...
-Kal
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Heinky
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Posted - 2005.12.21 00:14:00 -
[470]
Originally by: Rob Boberton Edited by: Rob Boberton on 20/12/2005 21:40:22
Originally by: Chith Every time a Burn Eden corpmember posts in this thread an angel gets its wings.
Honestly I think you have a point. Burn eden's members did this thread a service by starting it, but it only hurts for them to post in it any further. They're kinda like the guy who uses the same cheap move over and over in a fighter game. Lack of sympathy for their one tactic could cause people to gloss over the importance of this critical bug. Of course none of them have posted in a bit so gg guys
edit: we've passed the point of dev response. Where's the beef?
Well, the reason for Burn eden using this tactic for such a long time is because the people we fight have used the same tactic just as long and thats blobing us, so its not a 1 way thing.
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Darpz
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Posted - 2005.12.21 01:56:00 -
[471]
Originally by: TomB
Originally by: Darpz
Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi CCP will nerf this probably, but hey, worth a try
so your saying I should of kept my mouth shut?
Yup.
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2005.12.21 05:46:00 -
[472]
Up we go. Is anybody listning?
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Espen
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Posted - 2005.12.21 11:03:00 -
[473]
bump
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Alex Harumichi
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Posted - 2005.12.21 11:21:00 -
[474]
Originally by: Naughty Boy
Some of you seem to totally misunderstand what is happening.
What is happening is that it is a low fixed amount of counter-modules (tracking enhancers/computers, sensor amplifiers/boosters) and not their strength (as determined by skill/ship bonuses) that is determining the outcome of the stacking. Why bother training skills/ using good mods if it is the case?
I couldn't care less about Burn Eden and their so-called cheap tactics, or whether or not dampeners/disruptors needed a nerf in the first place, as if they deserved a nerf (which by the way i believe they did) the outcome of the stacking should depend on the strength of the mods and not on a) an arbitrary sorting convention and arbitrary coding convention of positive/negative effects and b) the amount (and not the strengths) of counter modules.
In other words, quit flaming Burn Eden, it only shows your ignorance on the topic at hand and isn't constructive.
Sincerly Yours, The Naughty Boy.
My name is Alex and I approve of this message.
Add me to the "could not care less about BE but my specialized EW skills and ships are now useless" crowd.
The fact that my skill-boosted bonuses and EW ship bonuses mean pretty much nothing, and the strength of the "defending" sensor boosters mean pretty much nothing, with only the amount of sensor booster modules being a factor, is what makes this totally broken.
Three of the worst, basic sensor boosters offer pretty much total immunity vs. sensor damps -- much more than a single top-of-the-line tech2 sensor booster, which offers better bonuses than the 3 crappy ones do in total.
Anyone arguing that this is "ok" is, frankly, a moron.
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Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2005.12.21 12:09:00 -
[475]
Bump for this.
Ive never fought one of these much vaunted 'Burn Eden' Ravens, but they're using a mechanic in the game given to them. Whining about it wont solve your problem. I suggest that, if you're worried about a Burn Eden Raven running when you engage it, warping in with 5 Tempests will end his ship's warping away ability. There are counters for everything.
Now, while I do agree that damps (and maybe tracking disruptors) need a nerf, this kind of nerf - a nerf via stacking penalty - is not the way it should be working, as it doesnt nerfs them, it makes them useless. Whether this was intentional or not, I guess we don't know, but either way it should be fixed.
Although, as we saw with the 'sort out Minmatar's freaking gun DPS' thread, a stupidly long thread wont always get a Dev response. Though undoubtedly, they'll read it and hopefully see the issue here.
Loading sig, please wait... |
thedragoon
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Posted - 2005.12.21 13:45:00 -
[476]
OMFG STILL NO RESPONCE
BACK TO THE TOP WE GO .......
Your Warp core stabb misses HAST for 6000 dmg |
whisk
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Posted - 2005.12.21 15:24:00 -
[477]
bump
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Shindalin
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Posted - 2005.12.21 16:56:00 -
[478]
We are many and we want the dev¦s attention on this matter. PLZZZ
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DOARota
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Posted - 2005.12.21 19:12:00 -
[479]
Daily bump.
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SlasherD
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Posted - 2005.12.22 02:07:00 -
[480]
*bump*
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