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Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
1139
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 13:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
I was going to write a snarky comment asking if the EAF's were going to see some love "soon" in normal human time, or geological terms.
But I won't.
I recognize that Kil2 and Raivi are working hard overhauling ship classes. I may vehemently disagree with the direction they are are taking some, but I can't argue the fact that they are working on re-working the ship classes at a steady pace.
So my question is this:
Can you at least give us the order of ship classes you plan on tackling? I am not looking for timelines, just the order in which they will be addressed. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
baltec1
Bat Country
7533
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 13:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
T2 battleships and pirate faction cruisers are next on the list. |
Bischopt
Arbitrary Repossession
140
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 13:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Hopefully they'll do interceptors (combat ones mainly) and e-war frigs in the next year or so. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
1434
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
I predict it'll first be t1 frigates, then T1 cruisers, then BC's and BS's. After that it's anyone's guess but again I'll predict T2's. After that......I just don't know. HTFU!...for the children! |
bloodknight2
Talledega Knights PLEASE NOT VIOLENCE OUR BOATS
139
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
I swear i WILL kill a child and burn him in the name of Satan if CCP nerf my lovely nightmare! |
CompleteFailure
Polaris Rising Gentlemen's Agreement
90
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
bloodknight2 wrote:I swear i WILL kill a child and burn him in the name of Satan if CCP nerf my lovely nightmare!
Totally a normal reaction to nothing whatsoever having been announced yet... |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
2972
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
No one loves EAFs enough. They won't get buffed. Ever. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
3190
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:03:00 -
[8] - Quote
bloodknight2 wrote:I swear i WILL kill a child and burn him in the name of Satan if CCP nerf my lovely nightmare! Did you know that saying these things, even in jest, can actually get you imprisoned these days? |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
1907
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:15:00 -
[9] - Quote
pirate frigs need some love. cruor, succu and worm for example eve style bounties (done) dust boarding parties imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW |
bloodknight2
Talledega Knights PLEASE NOT VIOLENCE OUR BOATS
141
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:47:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jake Warbird wrote:bloodknight2 wrote:I swear i WILL kill a child and burn him in the name of Satan if CCP nerf my lovely nightmare! Did you know that saying these things, even in jest, can actually get you imprisoned these days?
I'm in Canada. We do not put people in jail for no reason unlike some other place...like Texas. |
|
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
3190
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 17:15:00 -
[11] - Quote
bloodknight2 wrote:Jake Warbird wrote:bloodknight2 wrote:I swear i WILL kill a child and burn him in the name of Satan if CCP nerf my lovely nightmare! Did you know that saying these things, even in jest, can actually get you imprisoned these days? I'm in Canada. We do not put people in jail for no reason unlike some other place...like Texas. Fair enough, mate. I thought it was pretty messed up too. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
4472
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 17:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
Jake Warbird wrote:bloodknight2 wrote:Jake Warbird wrote:bloodknight2 wrote:I swear i WILL kill a child and burn him in the name of Satan if CCP nerf my lovely nightmare! Did you know that saying these things, even in jest, can actually get you imprisoned these days? I'm in Canada. We do not put people in jail for no reason unlike some other place...like Texas. Fair enough, mate. I thought it was pretty messed up too. Well, they usually have a reason when they throw someone in jail even in Texas.
It's just in Texas that reason usually involves your cousin wife, rustling cattle, or asking questions prior to shooting someone. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
|
CCP Ytterbium
C C P C C P Alliance
2246
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:04:00 -
[13] - Quote
Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is.
We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence.
"Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247.
Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime. |
|
Hoarr
Asgard. Exodus.
146
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:10:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ytterbium's posts are my favorite posts. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
2576
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:13:00 -
[15] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime.
Dictionary.com says the word "Ytterbium" is ancient Aramaic for "he who trolls yo ass I mean donkey". Is that rue?
|
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
10
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:22:00 -
[16] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote: So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh). Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant \o/
Any chance of a Maurauders idea/feedback/other stuff thread or will that come after the initial pass is done?
Any chance of rounding out the pirate faction skill crosses?
It's sort of my own little slice of bitter-vet that arguably the best Hybrds boat in the game requires not Caldari/Gallente (what I have trained) but Gallente/Minmattar and that you also get two of the best ship sets in the game by training those two ship skills. I'm sure the balance of those pirate lines will get a look during pirate faction balancing but are we going to see any new ships? :)
*is hoping for a Mordu's Legion Rokh hull* |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
2547
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:24:00 -
[17] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime.
Empty quoting, just because this whole post was full of win.
(Except the singular form of dice is die, but only a real grammar-**** would point that out.)
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all. |
Obunagawe
210
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:26:00 -
[18] - Quote
TFW I started training T2 hulls to 5 in order from Frigates to Battleships, and CCP decides to do the rebalance in completely random order :( |
mynnna
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1469
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 18:28:00 -
[19] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime.
The Nullsec RMT Cartels approve of this order of balancing.
You know, since it's Dinsdale asking and all. Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal |
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
1449
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:13:00 -
[20] - Quote
Please, for the EAS, to give a reason to train years of skills to fly a frigate with ECM instead of a cruiser of a battleship.
Just take that into account , that's the question the player should be asking. I hope you guys can give the EASs a real edge, especially over tech 3 cruisers. At least in terms of versatility , or direct range or strength Have you thought about expanding the grid and give them long range E-war as their advantage? http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg |
|
Azami Nevinyrall
Carbon Circle Tactical Narcotics Team
1110
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:20:00 -
[21] - Quote
mynnna wrote:CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime. The Nullsec RMT Cartels approve of this order of balancing. You know, since it's Dinsdale asking and all. Hey, at least they're starting to admit it now! I'm currently taking bets on the following: - CCP Games becomes EA Games' property. - EVE Online will have Microtranctions everywhere. |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
343
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:35:00 -
[22] - Quote
Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance. |
Drone 16
Law Dogz
25
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 19:49:00 -
[23] - Quote
TrouserDeagle wrote:Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance.
Given the fact that both Fozzie and Rise are pvp-centric devs, I would bet that in the update they make Marauders have an increased role in PvP. I could be wrong but I just can't see them passing up the chance.
There is no rule that says that Marauders need to remain in the PVE domain. Cross your fingers, walk around your chair three times and sacrifice a Twinkie in the name of the Dev Duo of Balance and hopefully we will see a PvP/PvE monster that makes all sides happy. |
Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
433
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 20:44:00 -
[24] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:Please, for the EAS, to give a reason to train years of skills to fly a frigate with ECM instead of a cruiser of a battleship.
Just take that into account , that's the question the player should be asking. I hope you guys can give the EASs a real edge, especially over tech 3 cruisers. At least in terms of versatility , or direct range or strength Have you thought about expanding the grid and give them long range E-war as their advantage? Fozzie has previously stated that an idea he was thinking about for EAFs was to give them the power to use their ewar on ships that are normally immune to ewar (like Supers). So yes, if this happens, you'll see fleets of disposable Kitsunes out jamming out Supers. The "super" tears, as they'd be, would be delicious. Pun absolutely intended. :P
Step onto the battlefield, and you're already dead, born again at the end of the battle to live on and fight another day. |
Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
433
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 20:49:00 -
[25] - Quote
Drone 16 wrote:TrouserDeagle wrote:Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance. Given the fact that both Fozzie and Rise are pvp-centric devs, I would bet that in the update they make Marauders have an increased role in PvP. I could be wrong but I just can't see them passing up the chance. There is no rule that says that Marauders need to remain in the PVE domain. Cross your fingers, walk around your chair three times and sacrifice a Twinkie in the name of the Dev Duo of Balance and hopefully we will see a PvP/PvE monster that makes all sides happy. Incidentally, Marauders can be used in pvp. Their small sensor strengths can be compensated for by ECCM, and they make pretty nasty ships, considering they have strong tank/gank and a host of utility highs. I'm not saying there may be some additional buffs to them to make them more viable in pvp; I just wouldn't necessarily expect it or even argue for it. Marauders are for sustained damage over the long(ish) time of a PVE mission environment. Pvp typically is about burst damage, so the two objectives are somewhat opposed.
Further, I expect some changes in the Blops field, possibly the introduction of new Blops BSs, so that each race could have one utility/brider and one combat-centric/ewar one. Obviously, the problem with that is the bridging BSs would just be ornaments to bridge and not much else, so I think this would be the concern in making dual roles. Is there room for dual roles? Absolutely. Look at how some Blops BSs are better with damage dealing than others. Is it necessary? Maybe not. Time will tell.
Step onto the battlefield, and you're already dead, born again at the end of the battle to live on and fight another day. |
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
1449
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 20:50:00 -
[26] - Quote
Maximus Andendare wrote:MotherMoon wrote:Please, for the EAS, to give a reason to train years of skills to fly a frigate with ECM instead of a cruiser of a battleship.
Just take that into account , that's the question the player should be asking. I hope you guys can give the EASs a real edge, especially over tech 3 cruisers. At least in terms of versatility , or direct range or strength Have you thought about expanding the grid and give them long range E-war as their advantage? Fozzie has previously stated that an idea he was thinking about for EAFs was to give them the power to use their ewar on ships that are normally immune to ewar (like Supers). So yes, if this happens, you'll see fleets of disposable Kitsunes out jamming out Supers. The "super" tears, as they'd be, would be delicious. Pun absolutely intended. :P
That sounds amazing
I wish they could get 100km range, to make hunting them down difficult , they are paper thin and super expensive. http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1323
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 20:58:00 -
[27] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime.
Are you making Marauders interesting or will they continue being completely irrelevant outside of doing terrible lvl 4 missions?
Paladin is way to pretty to not have a pvp role
BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
1140
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 21:07:00 -
[28] - Quote
Garviel Tarrant wrote:CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime. Are you making Marauders interesting or will they continue being completely irrelevant outside of doing terrible lvl 4 missions? Paladin is way to pretty to not have a pvp role
While we don't see the Paladin in the AT, we do see a lot in the better armour incursion groups, and trust me, on a weekend, that IS PvP, as only the best groups get paid.
And yes, it is a beautiful ship. As an aside, I truly wish CCP took the minnie shuttle model and gave it to some bitchin' combat frigate class. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Louis Robichaud
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
3
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 00:36:00 -
[29] - Quote
Sweet double-rainbow moose baby! CCP Ytterbium is clearly overpowered compared to any other posters and is need of a massive nerf. We can't hope to post like that!
A bit more seriously, I think the Assault frigates are in need of a bit of a buff. That being said, doing the marauders and blackops next seems to make a lot of sense. |
Bob Blunts
48
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 00:40:00 -
[30] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime.
This is a fine example right here of why CCP are the best dev's in the business. Love you guys.
|
|
Novah Soul
22
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 01:01:00 -
[31] - Quote
TrouserDeagle wrote:Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance. Count me among one of those whom care about Marauders. I use PvE as my primary income source and have been holding off on training/buying a marauder until the balance pass (I didn't wanna just finish getting one to have the expected performance possibly tweaked into a direction I didn't expect).
So, I am a tentatively happy lil Carebear right now. =P |
Oxide Ammar
Equilibrium Tech Labs
13
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 09:38:00 -
[32] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Our balancing plan is based on numerous design discussions, intense brainstormings and has to go through the strictest review processes to be validated. But here it is. We grab a 6-faced dice, then use the table below to act in consequence. "Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When we picked a class, we then take a 8-faced dice to decide how many high-slots we want. Repeat with mid and low slots. For values that go above the number of fingers on our two hands, we just roll our face on the digit part of the keyboard - that's why many of the hitpoint or mineral values have weird formatting like 135469213247. Alright, more seriously, what's next on the menu?
- Tech1 hulls are mostly done, even if that doesn't prevent us from iterating on them if need be. Except for capitals and supercapitals. Those will come late in the balancing plan as they play a part in Sovereignty warfare.
- So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
- Things start to become blurry from here - but in all probability we will have a look at Pirate Ships next. Depending on circumstances some may come above the other Tech2 hulls. Can't say for sure, Fozzie and Rise are machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Connor: they tend to stay in front of their computer all the time, even when I sleep or have a tasty croissant.
- Once Tech1, 2 and Pirate / Navy hulls are in an acceptable state, we will need to dive in the Abyss(Gäó) and look at Tech3s and our dear friends the (super)capitals. I'll make sure to be sick when that happens so that "honor" falls on the two freaks mentioned above
Here you go, hope that helps. Remember all of this is subject to change, anywhere, anytime.
Where is the stealth bombers in this ? they have PG/CPU issues when you try to fit tech II torps and I was always this is bad design regarding this issue, rest are fine.
|
Harvey James
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
442
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 12:51:00 -
[33] - Quote
I don't imagine Marauders becoming well used no matter how much you improve them for pvp they are just too expensive and T2 prices are increasing.
EAF's would be nice if they had more slots and survivability as a nice low SP/price version of recons .. on recons well the T2 manufacturers will play a key role here as a curse should be a missile boat not drones as its khanid , gallente need sorting out probably drones based and minnie would suit missiles T2 bellicose.. and then the falcon ... it would be nice if it had some offensive ability maybe missiles would work better than rails here.
Inties and AF's again T2 manufacturers as half of them make no sense looking at enyo here ... AF's have too many slots compared to navy frigs.... i would just like some consistency on slot allocations to navy/T2 it just seems random now.
It's a shame T3 are being left until last when they are the most urgent in need of rebalance... please reconsider bumping them up the list please.. as other ships will still be obsolete until these are done ( looking at underwhelming HAC's mainly).
P.S. prices of ships also need to be looked at HAC's are too expensive and they lack any cohesive focus really they are all a bit random .. from snipers to brawlers to a solitary attack ship (Vaga). T3's will need a massive price drop after nerf.. logi's could do with a look at T1 logi is too strong also and ABC's need to be nerfed and preferably made T2 as they are OP and a specialisation much like logi using oversized highs.
Pirates .. serpentis are mainly falloff but vindi is tracking weird... webs are too strong and need a nerf along with reducing the web strength bonus on these ships... lasers need to be buffed also ... will help the 2 races using them sansha/Blood raiders Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name AB's need a buff-á like a big mass reduction ... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please. |
Jamagh
Grand Violations
63
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 12:58:00 -
[34] - Quote
Jake Warbird wrote:bloodknight2 wrote:I swear i WILL kill a child and burn him in the name of Satan if CCP nerf my lovely nightmare! Did you know that saying these things, even in jest, can actually get you imprisoned these days?
It could be that it is part of his religion.... Not sure if the human sacrifice part would be allowed under thefreedom of religion thing... but who knows.
Not defending the guy, just saying... some laws are really... grey in some areas. "Please stop reopening silly rumor threads."-á CCP Navigator. |
Edward Olmops
Sirius Fleet
87
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 13:16:00 -
[35] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote: So now we are focusing on Tech2 hulls, as you noticed. We've started with HACs and Command Ships. Next on the line are Marauders (we have started looking at them). EAS and Black Ops are high in priority as well and will most likely come after that, depending on bandwidth. Once that's done, we'll look at other Tech2 hulls if need be. But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh).
While we are at reworking T2: What do you think about a ship/role bonus that improves Overheating? I think Fozzie (?) wanted to create a Rig that improves the heat bonus, but got a problem with stacking. Then he mentioned something about "heat related Gang Links" last week. Overheating is a cool mechanism and adds more depth to battles, so I like the idea of emphasizing that. However, the place where you already tried that (T3 cruisers and their heat subsystem)... no one uses it. Maybe a T2-bonus would be worth another try. It would just affect one ship class, not so big stacking issues and then the implications could be observed. I think of an otherwise "average" combat hull that can become exceptional for a short while in whatever you fitted. Probably I am a bit late with this, maybe it would have been good for HACs, but anyway. What do you think? |
El 1974
Green Visstick High Green Rhino
91
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 13:22:00 -
[36] - Quote
Deep Space Transports didn't make the shortlist? |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
1140
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 13:43:00 -
[37] - Quote
Azami Nevinyrall wrote:mynnna The Nullsec RMT Cartels approve of this order of balancing.
You know, since it's Dinsdale asking and all. [;) wrote: Hey, at least they're starting to admit it now!
When they are that smug about it, you know that their sense of power is very secure. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1327
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 15:28:00 -
[38] - Quote
Harvey James wrote:I don't imagine Marauders becoming well used no matter how much you improve them for pvp they are just too expensive and T2 prices are increasing.
Yes.. you never see fleets with more faction BS's than t1..... ^^
(Sarcasm btw)
And to someone above, incursions are not PVP. Its grinding easy as balls sites four hours and hours.
Again, like lvl 4 missions they are not an interesting role for marauders because those sites are already really really easy. BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
343
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 17:43:00 -
[39] - Quote
El 1974 wrote:Deep Space Transports didn't make the shortlist?
Apparently neither did AFs, interceptors, covops, bombers, interdictors, recon ships, heavy interdictors, blockade runners or jump freighters, even though they all need loads of changes. |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
11
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 18:57:00 -
[40] - Quote
Harvey James wrote:I don't imagine Marauders becoming well used no matter how much you improve them for pvp they are just too expensive and T2 prices are increasing. Navy Megathron Fleets, what? Also T2 prices are going up because the war between Test and Goons is mucking with the flow of T2 components, when that dies down we'll see a dip in prices.
Harvey James wrote:Inties and AF's again T2 manufacturers as half of them make no sense looking at enyo here ... AF's have too many slots compared to navy frigs.... i would just like some consistency on slot allocations to navy/T2 it just seems random now. AFs and Navy frigs are probably never going to be exactly comparable, they will likely get swept up in the big pirate balance pass though (the Navy frigs anyway).
Harvey James wrote:It's a shame T3 are being left until last when they are the most urgent in need of rebalance... please reconsider bumping them up the list please.. as other ships will still be obsolete until these are done ( looking at underwhelming HAC's mainly). If anything this is a reason to leave them for last, so you have good feedback on where the other ships are sitting and can rebalance based on that. Doing T3s without that would likely mean having to do them twice because they have several rolls that overlap with nearly everything else on that list in some way.
Harvey James wrote:P.S. prices of ships also need to be looked at HAC's are too expensive and they lack any cohesive focus really they are all a bit random .. from snipers to brawlers to a solitary attack ship (Vaga). T3's will need a massive price drop after nerf.. logi's could do with a look at T1 logi is too strong also and ABC's need to be nerfed and preferably made T2 as they are OP and a specialisation much like logi using oversized highs. Pirates .. serpentis are mainly falloff but vindi is tracking weird... webs are too strong and need a nerf along with reducing the web strength bonus on these ships... lasers need to be buffed also ... will help the 2 races using them sansha/Blood raiders This is a rather long list of "please nerf this". I wouldn't hold your breath, especially on stuff they've already balanced like T1 logi, or the cost of HACs which is set more or less by the player-base, not CCP.
El 1974 wrote:Deep Space Transports didn't make the shortlist? Probably going to depend heavily on data from the hauler changes, hence it's not on the list at the moment. |
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Xercodo
Xovoni Astronautical Manufacturing and Engineering
2534
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 18:58:00 -
[41] - Quote
I wanna see 2 marauders for each faction showcasing different weapon systems
Amarr - lasers and missiles Caldari missiles and rails Gallente rails and drones Minmatar Proj and Missiles (or dones to balance it) The Drake is a Lie |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
11
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 19:02:00 -
[42] - Quote
Xercodo wrote:I wanna see 2 marauders for each faction showcasing different weapon systems
Amarr - lasers and missiles Caldari missiles and rails Gallente rails and drones Minmatar Proj and Missiles (or dones to balance it)
Like, except that the way things are going Amarr should get the drone-boat. They're kind of in a weird place with the whole missiles and drones and lasers, oh-my! thing going on. Blame the Khanid =P |
Novah Soul
23
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 20:51:00 -
[43] - Quote
Xercodo wrote:I wanna see 2 marauders for each faction showcasing different weapon systems
Amarr - lasers and missiles Caldari missiles and rails Gallente rails and drones Minmatar Proj and Missiles (or dones to balance it)
OMG This plz ^^ |
Xercodo
Xovoni Astronautical Manufacturing and Engineering
2535
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 21:01:00 -
[44] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Xercodo wrote:I wanna see 2 marauders for each faction showcasing different weapon systems
Amarr - lasers and missiles Caldari missiles and rails Gallente rails and drones Minmatar Proj and Missiles (or dones to balance it) Like, except that the way things are going Amarr should get the drone-boat. They're kind of in a weird place with the whole missiles and drones and lasers, oh-my! thing going on. Blame the Khanid =P
YOU'RE NOT DENYING ME MY TORPEDO ABBADON!
The Drake is a Lie |
Grog Barrel
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
46
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 21:17:00 -
[45] - Quote
Xercodo wrote:Cade Windstalker wrote:Xercodo wrote:I wanna see 2 marauders for each faction showcasing different weapon systems
Amarr - lasers and missiles Caldari missiles and rails Gallente rails and drones Minmatar Proj and Missiles (or dones to balance it) Like, except that the way things are going Amarr should get the drone-boat. They're kind of in a weird place with the whole missiles and drones and lasers, oh-my! thing going on. Blame the Khanid =P YOU'RE NOT DENYING ME MY TORPEDO ABBADON!
Khanid Baddon... WOAAAAAAAAAAAAAH * . * |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
11
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 21:27:00 -
[46] - Quote
Xercodo wrote:Cade Windstalker wrote:Xercodo wrote:I wanna see 2 marauders for each faction showcasing different weapon systems
Amarr - lasers and missiles Caldari missiles and rails Gallente rails and drones Minmatar Proj and Missiles (or dones to balance it) Like, except that the way things are going Amarr should get the drone-boat. They're kind of in a weird place with the whole missiles and drones and lasers, oh-my! thing going on. Blame the Khanid =P YOU'RE NOT DENYING ME MY TORPEDO ABBADON!
Of course not, that would be CCP's job =P |
Xercodo
Xovoni Astronautical Manufacturing and Engineering
2535
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 21:27:00 -
[47] - Quote
Also -CreoDron Hyperion -Thukker Maelstrom -Ishkone Rokh The Drake is a Lie |
Sal Landry
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
77
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 21:55:00 -
[48] - Quote
TrouserDeagle wrote:Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance. Maybe someone would care about them if they were made not ****. |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
11
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 00:00:00 -
[49] - Quote
Sal Landry wrote:TrouserDeagle wrote:Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance. Maybe someone would care about them if they were made not ****.
I for one care about them a great deal. I love the idea of the Kronus, but hate that it's always going to be referred to as the Vindicator's younger brother the way things are right now. It's arguably better for missions thanks to the resists profile, needing to fit fewer guns, and the local-repair bonus but the Vindicator still does a good bit more damage and has better sensor strength and lock time, plus the same web bonus.
It's kind of a testament to the state of Marauders that half the time I bring up a Kronus for armor incursions I have to inform someone that it has the same web-bonus as the Vindi. |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
1141
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 03:39:00 -
[50] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Sal Landry wrote:TrouserDeagle wrote:Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance. Maybe someone would care about them if they were made not ****. I for one care about them a great deal. I love the idea of the Kronus, but hate that it's always going to be referred to as the Vindicator's younger brother the way things are right now. It's arguably better for missions thanks to the resists profile, needing to fit fewer guns, and the local-repair bonus but the Vindicator still does a good bit more damage and has better sensor strength and lock time, plus the same web bonus. It's kind of a testament to the state of Marauders that half the time I bring up a Kronus for armor incursions I have to inform someone that it has the same web-bonus as the Vindi.
Many people in Incursions have not
a: Done their research with EFT or pytfa, or actually used either ship. b. Just mouth bad information they see in the basic channels.
Bottom line, if CCP is reading this, the Marauders need a better scan res, possibly better tracking (actually varies ship by ship), and maybe about 5% more raw shield or armour, whatever their base protection is.
I realize the ship was designed, or has been expected to operate at least for the last few years, as a solo mission runner. But it has certainly has found a different niche, and I am not talking about the AT. Any subcap that has a base cost of 900 M to a billion better have one heluva set of bonuses to be involved in heavy PvP, and the Marauder does not, not likely will not, have that role in the future. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
|
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
11
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 11:03:00 -
[51] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Many people in Incursions have not
a: Done their research with EFT or pytfa, or actually used either ship. b. Just mouth bad information they see in the basic channels.
Bottom line, if CCP is reading this, the Marauders need a better scan res, possibly better tracking (actually varies ship by ship), and maybe about 5% more raw shield or armour, whatever their base protection is.
I realize the ship was designed, or has been expected to operate at least for the last few years, as a solo mission runner. But it has certainly has found a different niche, and I am not talking about the AT. Any subcap that has a base cost of 900 M to a billion better have one heluva set of bonuses to be involved in heavy PvP, and the Marauder does not, not likely will not, have that role in the future.
There's certainly no shortage of people who haven't done their homework, but I've actually worked up the fits and at least for incursions the Kronus is about 12-20% worse than the Vindi depending on site.
In terms of missions the Kronus is probably better in some due to better capacitor management thanks to fewer guns but the Vindi puts out more damage so for a high end mission fit the Vindi will cost about the same but perform better due to higher damage.
As for PvP, we've seen time and again that if you make something good enough someone will field a fleet of them. We've started to see various Navy ships used in Null, never mind the early T3 fleets when each ship was half a billion each plus fitting and the SP loss when it blew up.
Black-ops gangs have been a thing for a while now too.
I'm not saying I want Maurauders to be OMG amazing in PvP, I'd just like them to be top of the heap somewhere even if they're not terribly cost effective. |
VanKenMar
Beach Boys Cartel.
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 11:24:00 -
[52] - Quote
Sal Landry wrote:TrouserDeagle wrote:Who actually cares about marauders? Stuff should be done in order of importance. Maybe someone would care about them if they were made not ****.
Same with PHANTASM.. Dev`s dont care about this ship..nobodys flys this ship..answer is up there! I am starting to think that Devs cares only of Big Alliances and fleet ships, forgets of true warriors who have all my respect, to fight everywhere, against everyone. Null is full of great Pilots, not a "F1" give them some love and ships to fight, do not lock them into the "Cynabal Box", make Null more diversified. We dont want to be all the same like Mega Alliances!
Would the Huron make his Algonquin brothers foolish with brandy and steal his lands to sell them for gold to the white man? Would the Huron have greed for more land than a man can use? Like Francais Black Robes do? Would Huron kill tribes with disease? Would the Huron fool Seneca into taking all the animals in the forest for beads & brandy? But sell the fur to the white man for gold? ... (to Sachem) Those are the ways of Yengeese and Les Francais masters. Are they the ways of Huron men who hunt & work the land? Or of dogs? ... Magua's heart is twisted. He would make himself into what twisted him. A Dog, become Master of Dogs. But are Hurons dogs? ... Magua's way is false. It is like the white sickness. Magua's way will bring only sadness and shame. Is there another way? I don't know. (pauses) I am Nathaniel of the Yengeese; Hawkeye, adopted son of Chingachgook, of the Mohican people ... Let the children of the dead Munro go free ... I speak the truth.
from http://sfy.ru/?script=last_of_the_mohicans |
Tahna Rouspel
Big Johnson's PLEASE NOT VIOLENCE OUR BOATS
105
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 10:35:00 -
[53] - Quote
What about the Deep Space Transport? Don't forget those! |
KuroVolt
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
507
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 10:43:00 -
[54] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote: But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards.
*Starts humping your leg uncontrollably* |
Carrelle Rouppon
Air Initiative Mercenaries
101
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 11:43:00 -
[55] - Quote
Marauders in their current state are ignorable, you can get better stats from Navy ships.
I approve of the balancing order! Without operations like mine it would be impossible for certain Alliances to conduct a respectable war. There are three basic types of arms deal: white, being legal, black, being illegal, and my personal favorite, gray. |
Freelancer117
So you want to be a Hero
71
|
Posted - 2013.08.14 14:52:00 -
[56] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:"Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When you rebalance the tech 3 ships can you please ask the art department to help along, tech3 could be more then just tech 1 or tech 2 if it gets moving ship parts for visual effects.
Like the Tengu Propulsion - Intercalated Nanofibers can maybe extends its engine pylons when warping. And look a lot like a Starship Trooper spaceship Eve rule no.1: The players will make a better version of the game, then CCP initially plans.
http://eve-radio.com//images/photos/3419/223/34afa0d7998f0a9a86f737d6.jpg http://bit.ly/13cGuW0 |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
13
|
Posted - 2013.08.15 05:24:00 -
[57] - Quote
Freelancer117 wrote:CCP Ytterbium wrote:"Which ship should we look at next?"
- Marauders
- Black Ops
- Nerf bloodknight2's Nightmare (only his, no one else).
- Pirate ships
- New ships
- Tech3 cruisers
- EAFs
When you rebalance the tech 3 ships can you please ask the art department to help along, tech3 could be more then just tech 1 or tech 2 if it gets moving ship parts for visual effects. Like the Tengu Propulsion - Intercalated Nanofibers can maybe extends its engine pylons when warping. And look a lot more like the back of a Starship Trooper spaceship
This has nothing to do with balancing, that's up to the art department but given that T3 ships are already pretty unique and were done only a short while ago I kind of doubt they're first on the list for an art update. |
Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
444
|
Posted - 2013.08.15 05:32:00 -
[58] - Quote
KuroVolt wrote:CCP Ytterbium wrote: But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards. *Starts humping your leg uncontrollably* As long as he converts the Nemesis to Roden since, COME ON! IT IS A MISSILE SHIP FFS!--you can do whatever you like to him.....as long as Nemesis wears beautiful Roden colors....
Step onto the battlefield, and you're already dead, born again at the end of the battle to live on and fight another day. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
16068
|
Posted - 2013.08.15 05:53:00 -
[59] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh). *cough* GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3964
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Posted - 2013.08.15 06:02:00 -
[60] - Quote
Tippia wrote:CCP Ytterbium wrote:But we also want to fix some of the Tech2 manufacturers, like Roden Shipyards, which aren't great at all (mix of hybrids and missiles, bleargh). * cough*
How is that different to a drake or prophecy? Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
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Soporo
35
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Posted - 2013.08.15 11:05:00 -
[61] - Quote
Nice to hear the lolEagle and lolCerb are soon getting looked at. Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. - H.L. Mencken |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
375
|
Posted - 2013.08.15 11:12:00 -
[62] - Quote
Hoarr wrote:Ytterbium's posts are my favorite posts. This.
Remove insurance. |
blair Vyvorant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.15 11:15:00 -
[63] - Quote
wonder if the next expansion will be abyss... |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11243
|
Posted - 2013.08.15 11:47:00 -
[64] - Quote
Soporo wrote:Nice to hear the lolEagle and lolCerb are soon getting looked at.
The Eagle is still pretty lol, but the new Cerb is looking really nice
1 Kings 12:11
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Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
1142
|
Posted - 2013.08.16 00:27:00 -
[65] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Soporo wrote:Nice to hear the lolEagle and lolCerb are soon getting looked at. The Eagle is still pretty lol, but the new Cerb is looking really nice
I suppose that the forums are the only place, outside of the CSM / dev forums, you can post your views on the changes.
That being said, I still find it galling that someone who knew about these changes weeks, even months, ago, makes a comment like it is all new to them, and act like they are on equal footing with the rest of we plebians.
If you accept a position on the CSM, which gives you foreknowledge of the changes at worst, and the ability to create the changes at best, you should not come here and start posting like they are a revelation to you. Most people viewed Orwell's writings as a warning. The harper regime and the goons treat them as a guidebook. |
Raneru
Euphoria Released Verge of Collapse
60
|
Posted - 2013.08.16 00:55:00 -
[66] - Quote
I'm probably the only person that cares, but any chance of tweaking the Crusader's stats? Its pitiful compared to the Taranis, but for the love of god don't do anything to the Taranis! |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
14
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Posted - 2013.08.16 06:34:00 -
[67] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Malcanis wrote:Soporo wrote:Nice to hear the lolEagle and lolCerb are soon getting looked at. The Eagle is still pretty lol, but the new Cerb is looking really nice I suppose that the forums are the only place, outside of the CSM / dev forums, you can post your views on the changes. That being said, I still find it galling that someone who knew about these changes weeks, even months, ago, makes a comment like it is all new to them, and act like they are on equal footing with the rest of we plebians. If you accept a position on the CSM, which gives you foreknowledge of the changes at worst, and the ability to create the changes at best, you should not come here and start posting like they are a revelation to you.
This isn't how the CSM works.
Also, I'm rather fond of the new Eagle. Yay 6 mid-slots! |
Soporo
36
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Posted - 2013.08.20 22:46:00 -
[68] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Malcanis wrote:Soporo wrote:Nice to hear the lolEagle and lolCerb are soon getting looked at. The Eagle is still pretty lol, but the new Cerb is looking really nice I suppose that the forums are the only place, outside of the CSM / dev forums, you can post your views on the changes. That being said, I still find it galling that someone who knew about these changes weeks, even months, ago, makes a comment like it is all new to them, and act like they are on equal footing with the rest of we plebians. If you accept a position on the CSM, which gives you foreknowledge of the changes at worst, and the ability to create the changes at best, you should not come here and start posting like they are a revelation to you. This isn't how the CSM works. Also, I'm rather fond of the new Eagle. Yay 6 mid-slots!
6 mids? Still no damage bonus? I'm guessing they nerfed the grid, the speed or something else critical to rationalize it. Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. - H.L. Mencken |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
18
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Posted - 2013.08.20 23:55:00 -
[69] - Quote
Soporo wrote:Cade Windstalker wrote:
Also, I'm rather fond of the new Eagle. Yay 6 mid-slots!
6 mids? Still no damage bonus? I'm guessing they nerfed the grid, the speed or something else critical to rationalize it.
Nope, swapped a high for a mid.
Also the Eagle does have a damage bonus. Also 2 range bonuses and a resists bonus.
CCP Rise wrote: EAGLE
Role Bonus: 50% reduction in MicroWarpdrive signature radius penalty
Caldari Cruiser Bonuses: 10% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret optimal range 4% bonus to shield resistances
Heavy Assault Cruiser Bonuses: 10% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret optimal range 5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret damage
Slot layout: 5H(-1), 6M(+1), 4L; 5 turrets, 2 launchers Fittings: 990 PWG(+115), 440 CPU(+2) Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 2500(+391) / 1250(-16) / 1550(+3) Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap/s) : 1350(-25) / 255s (-80s) / 5.29/s (+1.2) Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 180(+16) / .576 / 11720000 / 9.36s Drones (bandwidth / bay): 0 / 0 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 90km(+20km) / 252 / 8 Sensor strength: 25 Gravimetric(+7) Signature radius: 140(-10)
As you can see the only things it loses are its utility high (which it didn't use much anyway), a grand total of 16 armor HP, and 25 max capacitor. However it gains a good chunk of shield HP, more lock range, more cap recharge, more PG and CPU, sensor strength, speed, and drops 10 sig radius.
Overall it's looking like a pretty solid fleet boat. |
Harvey James
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
457
|
Posted - 2013.08.22 17:02:00 -
[70] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Soporo wrote:Cade Windstalker wrote:
Also, I'm rather fond of the new Eagle. Yay 6 mid-slots!
6 mids? Still no damage bonus? I'm guessing they nerfed the grid, the speed or something else critical to rationalize it. Nope, swapped a high for a mid. Also the Eagle does have a damage bonus. Also 2 range bonuses and a resists bonus. CCP Rise wrote: EAGLE
Role Bonus: 50% reduction in MicroWarpdrive signature radius penalty
Caldari Cruiser Bonuses: 10% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret optimal range 4% bonus to shield resistances
Heavy Assault Cruiser Bonuses: 10% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret optimal range 5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret damage
Slot layout: 5H(-1), 6M(+1), 4L; 5 turrets, 2 launchers Fittings: 990 PWG(+115), 440 CPU(+2) Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 2500(+391) / 1250(-16) / 1550(+3) Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap/s) : 1350(-25) / 255s (-80s) / 5.29/s (+1.2) Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 180(+16) / .576 / 11720000 / 9.36s Drones (bandwidth / bay): 0 / 0 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 90km(+20km) / 252 / 8 Sensor strength: 25 Gravimetric(+7) Signature radius: 140(-10)
As you can see the only things it loses are its utility high (which it didn't use much anyway), a grand total of 16 armor HP, and 25 max capacitor. However it gains a good chunk of shield HP, more lock range, more cap recharge, more PG and CPU, sensor strength, speed, and drops 10 sig radius. Overall it's looking like a pretty solid fleet boat.
well its speed is still lower than a blackbird so overall it is a speed nerf
Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name AB's need a buff-á like a big mass reduction ... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please. |
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Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
31
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Posted - 2013.08.22 17:42:00 -
[71] - Quote
Harvey James wrote: well its speed is still lower than a blackbird so overall it is a speed nerf
Except that the old Eagle's speed was even lower and it still has a double range bonus and a shield tank, meaning it needs that base speed less. Overall it's a pretty minor complaint. Would I like it to be higher? Sure, it's the slowest HAC right now, but it also has the highest effective range of any HAC and therefore can probably get away with being a little slow.
(Also I'm assuming you meant Moa, not Blackbird) |
Xavier Perez
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.08.22 17:46:00 -
[72] - Quote
I want my skillpoints refunded in indy ships if they're going to change the indy ships around. I spent a month training for the iteron 5 because it was the best. I'm sure other folks feel the same about the ship classes they fly a lot too. |
Harvey James
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
457
|
Posted - 2013.08.22 18:07:00 -
[73] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Harvey James wrote: well its speed is still lower than a blackbird so overall it is a speed nerf
Except that the old Eagle's speed was even lower and it still has a double range bonus and a shield tank, meaning it needs that base speed less. Overall it's a pretty minor complaint. Would I like it to be higher? Sure, it's the slowest HAC right now, but it also has the highest effective range of any HAC and therefore can probably get away with being a little slow. (Also I'm assuming you meant Moa, not Blackbird)
No blackbird has 190 m/s and its an e-war ship yet it has higher speed than a HAC ...
But my point being is that yes it got a buff but every other ship has gotten a much larger buff making the eagle look like its effectively getting a nerf Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name AB's need a buff-á like a big mass reduction ... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11336
|
Posted - 2013.08.22 19:07:00 -
[74] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Malcanis wrote:Soporo wrote:Nice to hear the lolEagle and lolCerb are soon getting looked at. The Eagle is still pretty lol, but the new Cerb is looking really nice I suppose that the forums are the only place, outside of the CSM / dev forums, you can post your views on the changes. That being said, I still find it galling that someone who knew about these changes weeks, even months, ago, makes a comment like it is all new to them, and act like they are on equal footing with the rest of we plebians. If you accept a position on the CSM, which gives you foreknowledge of the changes at worst, and the ability to create the changes at best, you should not come here and start posting like they are a revelation to you.
What? What's a revelation to me now? I just said that I thought the new Cerb is looking really nice.
I argued as strongly as I could for a different role for the Eagle, but the decisions was made otherwise.
1 Kings 12:11
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11336
|
Posted - 2013.08.22 19:07:00 -
[75] - Quote
(Obviously I failed on purpose because grrr hisec)
1 Kings 12:11
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Harvey James
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
457
|
Posted - 2013.08.22 19:11:00 -
[76] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:(Obviously I failed on purpose because grrr hisec)
poor eagle ... so much potential just wasted by CCP but thanks for trying anyway.. Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name AB's need a buff-á like a big mass reduction ... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please. |
Harvey James
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
457
|
Posted - 2013.08.22 19:21:00 -
[77] - Quote
The most surprising thing about the eagle is that is unused in its current configuration .. so why would it be used more just because of a slight buff to Rails?
I just look at its competitors - Talos great blasterboat kiter - Naga strong sniper - Deimos now strong active tanker / shield rail kiter - Moa - strong brawler - Ferox - strong brawler or decent sniper -Thorax - versatile - Brutix - strong brawler active tank or shield gank fit
And i can't see how the eagle will be used over any of them especially considering the cost and SP required to use it.. Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name AB's need a buff-á like a big mass reduction ... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please. |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
31
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Posted - 2013.08.22 20:20:00 -
[78] - Quote
Harvey James wrote:The most surprising thing about the eagle is that is unused in its current configuration .. so why would it be used more just because of a slight buff to Rails?
I just look at its competitors - Talos great blasterboat kiter - Naga strong sniper - Deimos now strong active tanker / shield rail kiter - Moa - strong brawler - Ferox - strong brawler or decent sniper -Thorax - versatile - Brutix - strong brawler active tank or shield gank fit
And i can't see how the eagle will be used over any of them especially considering the cost and SP required to use it..
Of your examples the Talos and Naga use over-sized guns and don't tank or move as well as the Eagle. The Deimos is better for solo or small-gang work with no Logi on-grid, the MOA doesn't have the damage projection of the Eagle while doing the same damage, the Ferox has the tank but not the range or damage, the Thorax... well I'm not sure why it's on this list. It has the same damage but a tracking bonus instead meaning it's filling a completely different role, and the Brutix which loses slightly in damage unless it trades its tank bonus and has no damage projection bonus.
For the Eagle you can go for a short range DPS fit that gets hilarious optimal on Medium Blasters or a Rail fit that doesn't have to fit any range mods to hit out to 150 with T2 range ammo, and still hits to 40+ with medium Anti-Matter.
I really think this represents a very potent mix of Tank, DPS, and Damage Projection, especially for small to medium sized gangs with Logi support. Between the buffs to Rails, the extra mid-slot, and the tracking bonus on Javelin ammo it might be interesting to see what a "short-range" Rail fit Eagle fleet could do with Logi and web support from either T3 cruisers or Huginns. You certainly couldn't pull range on them very effectively since even without a Sebo or boosts the Eagle should be able to lock and shoot to ~110 easily for ~250 DPS. That's certainly no Naga but it also shouldn't explode hilariously if bombed or looked at funny. |
Galdrak
Interplanetary Trade Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.24 15:54:00 -
[79] - Quote
I'm not saying I want Maurauders to be OMG amazing in PvP, I'd just like them to be top of the heap somewhere even if they're not terribly cost effective.[/quote]
+1
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
4541
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Posted - 2013.08.26 21:32:00 -
[80] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Harvey James wrote:The most surprising thing about the eagle is that is unused in its current configuration .. so why would it be used more just because of a slight buff to Rails?
I just look at its competitors - Talos great blasterboat kiter - Naga strong sniper - Deimos now strong active tanker / shield rail kiter - Moa - strong brawler - Ferox - strong brawler or decent sniper -Thorax - versatile - Brutix - strong brawler active tank or shield gank fit
And i can't see how the eagle will be used over any of them especially considering the cost and SP required to use it.. Of your examples the Talos and Naga use over-sized guns and don't tank or move as well as the Eagle. The Deimos is better for solo or small-gang work with no Logi on-grid, the MOA doesn't have the damage projection of the Eagle while doing the same damage, the Ferox has the tank but not the range or damage, the Thorax... well I'm not sure why it's on this list. It has the same damage but a tracking bonus instead meaning it's filling a completely different role, and the Brutix which loses slightly in damage unless it trades its tank bonus and has no damage projection bonus. For the Eagle you can go for a short range DPS fit that gets hilarious optimal on Medium Blasters or a Rail fit that doesn't have to fit any range mods to hit out to 150 with T2 range ammo, and still hits to 40+ with medium Anti-Matter. I really think this represents a very potent mix of Tank, DPS, and Damage Projection, especially for small to medium sized gangs with Logi support. Between the buffs to Rails, the extra mid-slot, and the tracking bonus on Javelin ammo it might be interesting to see what a "short-range" Rail fit Eagle fleet could do with Logi and web support from either T3 cruisers or Huginns. You certainly couldn't pull range on them very effectively since even without a Sebo or boosts the Eagle should be able to lock and shoot to ~110 easily for ~250 DPS. That's certainly no Naga but it also shouldn't explode hilariously if bombed or looked at funny. I think a ROF bonus instead of a damage bonus might actually fit well with it though. In fact I think long range and high ROF should be a rail gun thing in general when discussing ships bonused for Rails specifically.. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
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