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Zadren Radek
This Way Up Happy Cartel
0
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Posted - 2013.08.19 11:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi peeps,
So I bought my 1st Myrmidon, and applied what appears to be the standard pvp cookie-cutter fit of this:
[Myrmidon, Solo fit 1] Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400 Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400 10MN Microwarpdrive II Stasis Webifier II Warp Scrambler II
Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I
Ogre II x2 Hammerhead II x2 Hobgoblin II x1
It was suggested afterwards, that I might want to replace one of the MARII's with an ancillary repper. The peak rep amount increases for as long as the AAR has nanites loaded, after which, the rep amount drops to below what 2 x MARII's would give.
So, I'm in a bit of a quandary as to whether to stick with the 'steady' 2 x MAR, or go with the more short-lived AAR fit?
Also, rather than fitting 3 x EANM, is it worth swapping one out for a reactive armour hardener, with my armour resistance phasing skill at 4?
Any other comments on the fit gratefully received, too. Thanks |
Marc Callan
Interstellar Steel Templis Dragonaors
270
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Posted - 2013.08.19 11:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
The 2x Ogre, 2x Hammer, 1x Hob drone flight is probably an artifact of the pre-rebalance Myrmidon, which had only 75mb bandwidth. If you're going to use Ogres at all with the updated Myrm, you might try a 3x Ogre, 2x Hammer flight, and carry some light drones as backup.
For PVP situations, the AAR is probably the way to go; and the third EANM will be probably be hit harder by stacking penalties than the RAH (which stacks with the DC, not the EANMs). "Nevertheless a prince ought to inspire fear in such a way that, if he does not win love, he avoids hatred..." - Niccolo Machiavelli-á |
Critical Issue
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.08.19 12:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
i would eanm out , dcII in ... 1 cap booster out, tracking disruptor in ... 1 mar out, 1 maar in ... edit the drones ... would you fit ions then maybe ? |
Whitehound
1864
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Posted - 2013.08.19 12:43:00 -
[4] - Quote
Zadren Radek wrote:Any other comments on the fit gratefully received, too. Thanks Try using the T1 Meta 4 version of web, scram and MWD. These are a bit better than the T2.
Drop the third EANM II and fit a Reactive Armor Hardener. In the worst case will it be about as good as a third EANM II, but otherwise add greatly to the resistances of the tank.
All in all is it a very strong tank, which is good, because it will buy you enough time to make decisions and to jokey your drones. If you ever think you do not really need that much tank then you should drop another EANM II and fit a drone damage mod. Killing faster is always better than lots of tanking.
The rigs seem odd, meaning, there is no clear direction visible. PYFA shows that it results in the best sustained rep rate if you were to run everything for the full duration and not do anything else. This is however just a theoretical number and not really practical. Triple Nanobot Accelerators will rep faster and thereby more than any other rig combination. Triple Auxiliary Nano Pumps is what you should use for the Ancillary Armor Repairer if you decide you want it or if you only want tank without using extra cap.
The Electron Blasters are not all that useful. At least not for low-sec. They have a very short range and require you to get very close to your target. Anything that wants to stay at range will not have much of a problem since a BC is not very fast, and what wants to come close will also very likely pack a good punch, meaning, it will be a brawler and you rather want to avoid receiving extra damage. The bit of extra DPS you get from the blasters does not make it a good trade or a good strategy. Nor are guns receiving any bonuses. At BC hull sizes should one start thinking about adding a smartbomb against drones. Energy neutralisers and vampires are also an option. These allow to draw cap from one target and use it to neutralise the cap on a second one. You should expect to fight multiple targets simultaneously. Therefore is using only blasters in the high-slots questionable. If it is for a high-sec 1v1 then it seems fine.
The reason why one fits dual cap boosters is because of the dual reppers and MWD needing a lot of cap. It is not really a good thing, but a necessity to make it all work, because all it does is to buy you time to run everything longer. Dual-cap boosters need charges and you will run out of them quickly using two boosters. Using the cargo space only for cap charges is somewhat desperate. You do want to carry a couple of spare drones with you and want to have the space to loot a few wrecks, too. This is where the Ancillary Armor Repairer comes in, because it provides its boost without needing extra cap. A single armor plate like a 1600mm Tungsten also buys a lot of time without needing any cap. It can be repaired after a fight. I am not saying you should change the tank, but if you ever get tired of running out of cap charges or not having enough cargo space then you should look into increasing the eHP. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Roime
Ten Thousand Years Shinjiketo
3283
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 13:02:00 -
[5] - Quote
Whitehound,
AAR uses cap and nanite paste.
Dual cap boosters don't use more cap boosters than single one (they don't increase cap consumption), they just offer you better cap management under neuting. Which is a situational benefit, if your opponent has no neuts, a TD or Omnidir would be better use for the slot.
With the upcoming +15% rep amount buff to the rep modules, dropping one EANM for a DDA makes sense. Currently I opt for more tank.
2xAux Nano Pump 1x Nanobot Accel is a solid rig combo that doesn't train the cap too much, like triple Accels.
I agree about Electrons, use some fitting hardwires to squeeze Ions on it, or go for autocannons. You do need the (heated) turret dps to be competitive in a lowsec Myrmidon. Myrm is definitely a brawler, if you can't land scram and web on the target, you are not going to win the fight, so blasters work well on it.
Often a Myrm dies only after it runs out of cap charges, so fitting a cargo can in your cargo to give a few more charges is common.
Ten Thousand Years is recruiting pioneer spirits to Solitude. |
Whitehound
1864
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 13:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
Roime wrote:Whitehound,
AAR uses cap and nanite paste.
Dual cap boosters don't use more cap boosters than single one (they don't increase cap consumption), they just offer you better cap management under neuting. Which is a situational benefit, if your opponent has no neuts, a TD or Omnidir would be better use for the slot.
With the upcoming +15% rep amount buff to the rep modules, dropping one EANM for a DDA makes sense. Currently I opt for more tank.
2xAux Nano Pump 1x Nanobot Accel is a solid rig combo that doesn't train the cap too much, like triple Accels.
I agree about Electrons, use some fitting hardwires to squeeze Ions on it, or go for autocannons. You do need the (heated) turret dps to be competitive in a lowsec Myrmidon. Myrm is definitely a brawler, if you can't land scram and web on the target, you are not going to win the fight, so blasters work well on it.
Often a Myrm dies only after it runs out of cap charges, so fitting a cargo can in your cargo to give a few more charges is common.
I said the AAR does not need extra cap to provide its boost. And two cap boosters certainly go through charges faster than a single one can. The whole point here is that the cargo bay can be used for more than cap charges. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Roime
Ten Thousand Years Shinjiketo
3284
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 13:25:00 -
[7] - Quote
Neither does a normal repper? What's this extra cap you speak of?
No, you don't need to run both cap boosters at the same time. The second one is just there so you can stagger them under neuts.
I'd really recommend filling up the cargo hold to the brink with cap charges, since you die after they run out and in a low dps ship like Myrm, the strategy is endurance- you need to outlast your opponent.
Ten Thousand Years is recruiting pioneer spirits to Solitude. |
Cable Udan
The Tuskers
243
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 13:40:00 -
[8] - Quote
[Myrmidon, 1115 dps Dual Web Gank]
Damage Control II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Large Shield Extender II Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Void M
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Ogre II x4 Ogre II x4
You don't need tank when you're doing 1115dps. http://chasingtheblueflash.blogspot.com/ My Pirate Blog |
Seraph Castillon
Justified Chaos
89
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Posted - 2013.08.19 13:47:00 -
[9] - Quote
Cable Udan wrote:You don't need tank when you're doing 1115dps
You do when a frig can run circles around you and your Ogre's all day. Same goes for a Caracal for example. |
Whitehound
1865
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 13:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
Roime wrote:Neither does a normal repper? What's this extra cap you speak of?
No, you don't need to run both cap boosters at the same time. The second one is just there so you can stagger them under neuts.
I'd really recommend filling up the cargo hold to the brink with cap charges, since you die after they run out and in a low dps ship like Myrm, the strategy is endurance- you need to outlast your opponent. This is the point. It does not need extra cap to give its boost. Like you said, it uses Nanite Paste.
You do need the second cap booster or the two reppers will run the cap down. A single cap booster can barely sustain the two reppers and it also needs to reload its charges. Then do not forget that it has an MWD and OP seems to be new to the ship. If you have ever flown a fitting like this will you know how fast up and down the cap can go, so please do not argue with me that it did not need a second cap booster just so you then can say it is needed when you are being neuted. It is misleading and we do want to help the OP, right? Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
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Roime
Ten Thousand Years Shinjiketo
3284
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Posted - 2013.08.19 14:09:00 -
[11] - Quote
Well, it doesn't need the second cap booster in fights without neuts, and you'd be better off with something else instead.
Ten Thousand Years is recruiting pioneer spirits to Solitude. |
Zadren Radek
This Way Up Happy Cartel
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 14:31:00 -
[12] - Quote
Thanks for the great input so far peeps.
If I drop one of the cap boosters I can squeeze a rack of ions on to it, but this adds a meagre 16dps and a 'meh' amount of falloff. I also thought about dropping 1 blaster and fitting a medium smarty to counter drones. Problem with that is that since I am fighting at blaster range, I'm going to end up popping my own drones along with most of my dps. I can carry a flight of warrior II's to counter enemy drones - if I can tank long enough to pop them and then get my own damage drones out.
There is some scope for fitting some dual 150mm rails instead of blasters after patch 1.1 hits, which should give me a little bit more reach 'maybe' without trashing the tank. That's a bit of an unknown at the moment though.
As suggested, I'll tweak the tank to fit an AAR and a RAH.
I probably should add that this fit is for nullsec small gangs. With MAYBE some soloing once I get confidence up. I'm such a pvp noob that I'll likely pop in 2 minutes flat anyway. |
Liam Inkuras
Justified Chaos
399
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 17:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
To be honest I find the dual rep Myrm to be very underwhelming outside of 1v1s, and trust me, most of your fights in a BC outside of highsec are not going to be 1v1s. You really need the extra tanking ability of a 3rd rep, and this is where the classic triple rep Myrm steps up and dunks the competition. The triple rep Myrm is capable of tanking small gangs as long as you have cap charges. I'd recommend carrying a standard exile booster or two with you. Keep those blasters on there, although you'll have to drop one for a light neutron blaster if you choose to fit the 3rd rep. I don't like to mix my reps when active tanking, because an AAR goes against everything the Myrm stands for. The AAR is designed for quick burst tanking, whereas the Myrm is supposed to sit and hold the field for prolonged periods of time. As soon as that AAR run dry, you are running at less than you would be with a triple rep. On single rep ships the AAR is fine, because it is your only method of tanking, therefore you want as much as possible in a short period of time. I wear my goggles at night.
Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone |
Cable Udan
The Tuskers
244
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 18:10:00 -
[14] - Quote
Seraph Castillon wrote:Cable Udan wrote:You don't need tank when you're doing 1115dps You do when a frig can run circles around you and your Ogre's all day. Same goes for a Caracal for example.
That's why you also carry a flight or three of Warriors.
Also with CNAM, blasters can track a double-webbed frig.
http://chasingtheblueflash.blogspot.com/ My Pirate Blog |
Kashmyta
Sickology
58
|
Posted - 2013.08.23 08:20:00 -
[15] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Roime wrote:Neither does a normal repper? What's this extra cap you speak of?
No, you don't need to run both cap boosters at the same time. The second one is just there so you can stagger them under neuts.
I'd really recommend filling up the cargo hold to the brink with cap charges, since you die after they run out and in a low dps ship like Myrm, the strategy is endurance- you need to outlast your opponent. This is the point. It does not need extra cap to give its boost. Like you said, it uses Nanite Paste. You do need the second cap booster or the two reppers will run the cap down. A single cap booster can barely sustain the two reppers and it also needs to reload its charges. Then do not forget that it has an MWD and OP seems to be new to the ship. If you have ever flown a fitting like this will you know how fast up and down the cap can go, so please do not argue with me that it did not need a second cap booster just so you then can say it is needed when you are being neuted. It is misleading and we do want to help the OP, right?
AAR uses paste and cap. |
Whitehound
1913
|
Posted - 2013.08.23 09:43:00 -
[16] - Quote
Kashmyta wrote:Whitehound wrote:Roime wrote:Neither does a normal repper? What's this extra cap you speak of?
No, you don't need to run both cap boosters at the same time. The second one is just there so you can stagger them under neuts.
I'd really recommend filling up the cargo hold to the brink with cap charges, since you die after they run out and in a low dps ship like Myrm, the strategy is endurance- you need to outlast your opponent. This is the point. It does not need extra cap to give its boost. Like you said, it uses Nanite Paste. You do need the second cap booster or the two reppers will run the cap down. A single cap booster can barely sustain the two reppers and it also needs to reload its charges. Then do not forget that it has an MWD and OP seems to be new to the ship. If you have ever flown a fitting like this will you know how fast up and down the cap can go, so please do not argue with me that it did not need a second cap booster just so you then can say it is needed when you are being neuted. It is misleading and we do want to help the OP, right? AAR uses paste and cap. Not exactly.
The AAR uses cap just like any other armor reparier.
To provide the 3x repair boost does it use Nanite Paste in addition to the cap, but it does not need extra cap. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Danny John-Peter
Stay Frosty.
288
|
Posted - 2013.08.23 11:05:00 -
[17] - Quote
Personally I wouldn't run a MAAR, with the Myrms relatively low DPS your looking at a sustained fight, you would be better off running the more standard triple MAR fit, like so;
[Myrmidon, Trirep] Medium Armor Repairer II Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Medium Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Medium Armor Repairer II
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800 Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800 Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma M
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I
Ogre II x2 Hammerhead II x2 Hobgoblin II x1
482 DPS before heat and a 994 DPS tank with heat and Standard exile, slow as **** but the Idea is they come to you. |
Crellion
Parental Control
43
|
Posted - 2013.08.23 12:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
As mentioned in other posts the lows could be done a lot better with a dcuII (rah wont have time to realize whats happening in most ppv situations).
Also second booster not needed anymore when on mar becomes maar. This trade off however may take new meaning with the new patch I havent tested it.
Finally with the changes in rails I would most certainly consider dual150s or 200s over blasters if flying this slow arsed vessel. Alternatively med a/cs as previously suggested but try to fit larger than dual 180s to have some barrage elbowroom.
FInally if you are considering a dual maar set up and decide to keep the injector anyway then med (heavy) pulses with scorch also work well with the other characteristics of this vessel. With the same lowslots neuting is also viable.
Have fun! |
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1156
|
Posted - 2013.08.23 12:13:00 -
[19] - Quote
Seraph Castillon wrote:Cable Udan wrote:You don't need tank when you're doing 1115dps You do when a frig can run circles around you and your Ogre's all day. Same goes for a Caracal for example.
If you can't hit that frig with your blasters AND drones after applying those 2 WEB you really need better skills. *removed inappropriate ASCII art signature* - CCP Eterne |
Seraph Castillon
Justified Chaos
95
|
Posted - 2013.08.23 12:47:00 -
[20] - Quote
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:If you can't hit that frig with your blasters AND drones after applying those 2 WEB you really need better skills.
MWD frigs out of web range ... |
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