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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Reese Tek'al
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2011.10.28 23:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
I just rejoined the game. I got an email advertising some cheap Republic Fleet Stabbers at the Rens VI Moon 8 station. I went there, traded for them, and soon after found out I'd been scammed, buy CCP and the GMs.
The player who scammed me, Lady Pol0 - has gotten away with this because the GM's know the trade system is broken and will do nothing to fix it.
The trade system can be exploited and used to scam players, the GM's know about it and do nothing.
I am posting this in the New Players Q&A forum so that new players will see it and know that this game is broken, full of trolls, and a waste of time that is not very fun. Also the support sucks.
It seems to me the simplicity of this scam is so apparent that to not acknowledge and fix it is the same as condoning the use of it, which the GM's and CCP most certainly do.
My question is - Why do GM's and by proxy CCP in general knowingly allow systems that are key to core gameplay (ie: trade system) to be set up in a way that allows players to change the names of items before selling them, thus scamming players out of hard earned isk? |
Louis deGuerre
Malevolence. Void Alliance
54
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Posted - 2011.10.29 00:10:00 -
[2] - Quote
You just learned a hard lesson about EVE. You can either get mad or learn and possible get even.
Hopefully now you know that when it is too good to be true, it really IS too good to be true. Just like in the real world, which is why EVE is so awesome ! FIRE FRIENDSHIP TORPEDOES ! |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
88
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Posted - 2011.10.29 00:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
1. If it seems too good to be true, it is.
2. Never trade via the trade window. Always insist on a contract.
3. Read contracts very carefully before accepting them.
4. Unsolicited bargain offers and almost everything advertised in local are scams.
I've been playing EVE for going on 3 years and I've never been scammed. |
Xercodo
Xovoni Directorate Not Usually Killing Everyone.
122
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Posted - 2011.10.29 00:24:00 -
[4] - Quote
This isn't an exploit it is an intended game mechanic. You **** up all on your own. The Drake is a Lie |
Velicitia
Open Designs
32
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Posted - 2011.10.29 00:39:00 -
[5] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:I just rejoined the game.
You have played before, and weren't already aware that our little slice of dystopian heaven allows... nay encourages scamming?
I call troll.
2/10 for the bites though. |
Reese Tek'al
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2011.10.29 00:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
Okay, I totally see what you are all saying, but I still disagree.
I realize that what is or isn't considered an exploit can be controversial but in this case I'm very certain my argument is sound.
Either CCP is allowing exploitative behaviour by not fixing their trade system, or this was designed with scammers in mind.
Both are unacceptable. |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
61
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Posted - 2011.10.29 00:47:00 -
[7] - Quote
This will be dealt with!
By the way I'm running a good deal as I have acquired a lot of isk and am quitting so I'll triple any amount of isk you send to me |
Xercodo
Xovoni Directorate Not Usually Killing Everyone.
122
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 00:48:00 -
[8] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:Okay, I totally see what you are all saying, but I still disagree.
I realize that what is or isn't considered an exploit can be controversial but in this case I'm very certain my argument is sound.
Either CCP is allowing exploitative behaviour by not fixing their trade system, or this was designed with scammers in mind.
Both are unacceptable.
It is the later. If you don't like it then leave cause it's not changing any time soon =D
Though CCP have put in a change or two to stop SOME scams. The Drake is a Lie |
Reese Tek'al
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 01:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
Well, let's hope they get their act together and put an end to this one as well. I've already cancelled my account, I wonder how much more business they have lost in the past and will in the future. Some people take theft seriously, others are fooling themselves. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
32
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Posted - 2011.10.29 01:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
def a troll. Nothing to see here, move along. |
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Lykouleon
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
239
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Posted - 2011.10.29 03:43:00 -
[11] - Quote
Thats not an exploit, thats you being too lazy to right click and check info before accepting the trade. Darwinism at work. Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER SO I CAN HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD |
Mugen Dunedain
The Jazz Lounge
0
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Posted - 2011.10.29 04:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:Okay, I totally see what you are all saying, but I still disagree.
I realize that what is or isn't considered an exploit can be controversial but in this case I'm very certain my argument is sound.
Either CCP is allowing exploitative behaviour by not fixing their trade system, or this was designed with scammers in mind.
Both are unacceptable.
It is the former. The trade system was designed to be as close to the real world trade system as possible. And in that trade system, exploitative behavior is possible, so it is possible in EVE. The only difference is that in New Eden, they don't have lawsuits. They have guns. |
malaire
91
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Posted - 2011.10.29 07:33:00 -
[13] - Quote
Nowadays trades where you are offered normal ship renamed as faction ship instead of faction ship, should be easy to spot -- just check for that green faction-mark at top left corner of ship icon. If that mark is not there, it is not faction ship. |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
362
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Posted - 2011.10.29 07:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:The trade system can be exploited and used to scam players, the GM's know about it and do nothing. You mean, can be used creatively in mischievous ways to entice people to get themselves into what is essentially pretty close to a classic con ? And what exactly would you EXPECT the GMs to do ? The trade system works EXACTLY AS INTENDED. Unless you have a better idea of how the trade system SHOULD work in a different way with regards to the effects of the "margin trading" skill (and no, "removing the skill" is not a valid option) AND are prepared to defend it from an economic and game mechanics standpoint, you're barking up the completely wrong tree.
The big kicker ? The person that gets "scammed" this way CAN ACTUALLY SCAM THE SCAMMER BACK, all within the exact same system. Ask around how, I bet there's plenty of people that can explain. Yes, there's a risk in it too, some guesswork too... and you need enough additional liquid ISK, but it's quite doable. So, no, the scammer can not pull this off risk-free. There's actual risk involved. Feel free to become an anti-margin-scam activist AND become rich in the process too. Are you up for it ?
So, basically, even if the system is not perfect, the GMs should do absolutely nothing either way, because a counter to that scam exists (one that hurts wannabe scammers), and the "warning signs" for it are fairly obvious too. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Contributor_name:Akita_T#Contributions_link_collection |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
872
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 08:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:I just rejoined the game. I got an email advertising some cheap Republic Fleet Stabbers at the Rens VI Moon 8 station. I went there, traded for them, and soon after found out I'd been scammed, by CCP and the GMs.
The player who scammed me, Lady Pol0 - has gotten away with this because the GM's know the trade system is broken and will do nothing to fix it.
The trade system can be exploited and used to scam players, the GM's know about it and do nothing.
I am posting this in the New Players Q&A forum so that new players will see it and know that this game is broken, full of trolls, and a waste of time that is not very fun. Also the support sucks.
It seems to me the simplicity of this scam is so apparent that to not acknowledge and fix it is the same as condoning the use of it, which the GM's and CCP most certainly do.
My question is - Why do GM's and by proxy CCP in general knowingly allow systems that are key to core gameplay (ie: trade system) to be set up in a way that allows players to change the names of items before selling them, thus scamming players out of hard earned isk?
You got scammed because you thought you were taking advantage of another player who didn't know enough to offer a reasonable price. Given that your attempt to take advantage of someone else led to you being rooked in turn, it's difficult to understand why you think we should sympathise with you. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Reese Tek'al
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 10:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
No, I believed I was getting a good deal. Nothing like that. |
Chal0ner
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
9
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Posted - 2011.10.29 10:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:
The trade system can be exploited and used to scam players, the GM's know about it and do nothing.
This is correct. The rest of your rant - however - is not.
Working as intended.
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
872
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 10:59:00 -
[18] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:No, I believed I was getting a good deal. Nothing like that.
That's what I said.
As the man told you: if it looks too good to be true, it is. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
J'Poll
IMPERIAL LEGI0N
17
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Posted - 2011.10.29 11:20:00 -
[19] - Quote
5/10 on the troll attempt.
You were stupid enough to fall for a scam, welcome to EVE.
Advice: next time CTFSI (Click the f***ing show info) on every thing you buy through trade or contract.
J'Poll Director / Recruiter - Borealis Mining Concern Recruiter - Imperial Legi0n
As a finishing touch, God created the Dutch |
Matthew97
JADE Enterprise
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 11:33:00 -
[20] - Quote
Anything is legal in EVE, even Scamming is a valid tactic, although it won't make you many friends on your own xD
As said, if its to good to be true, it usually is. Next time check the show info windows, take your time to double check everything, even check the character selling it to be sure and NEVER station trade unless you triple check everything!! |
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Cerisia
Lone Star enterprises
261
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Posted - 2011.10.29 11:46:00 -
[21] - Quote
As everyone else here is saying , you fell to a simple game mechanic and you were so greedy that you didn't even take the time to make sure that the items you were buying were as described. These scams only work if the player allows greed to overtake common sense.
There are two things you can do at this point.
1, Dust yourself down , learn from your mistakes and carry on playing as a better more informed player.
or
2, Come to the forums and whine about your own greed and lack of common sense, followed by rage quitting.
I see you've chosen the latter route... Free Lyris Nairn, goodposter extraordinaire and Spacebook Superstar. |
KaarBaak
133
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 15:05:00 -
[22] - Quote
"Exploit"
You keep using this word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
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Asta Ddu
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 15:26:00 -
[23] - Quote
Can I haz your stuff? |
Taedrin
Kushan Industrial
134
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 18:20:00 -
[24] - Quote
Sorry OP, the trade system is not actually meant for regular business dealings and instead is only meant as a means to exchange items between friends and not between strangers.
That being said, you can easily protect yourself from this scam by several methods:
1) Faction items have a green triangle with a white diamond in the upper left corner of the icon. If you don't see this symbol, it isn't a faction item.
2) You can always "show info" on the item to double check what the item actually is.
3) NEVER use trades to do business when you can use contracts or the market.
Now, there ARE scams that are exploits which use the trade system. However, these were fixed a loooonnngg time ago, IIRC. |
Flakey Foont
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 19:07:00 -
[25] - Quote
As in RL some are perennial victims... |
Reese Tek'al
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 22:04:00 -
[26] - Quote
Yeah, so what does that say about the game in general? Welcome to EVE, where it's a crime to be a victim. As in real life the majority of users on the forums are perennial vampires, trolls, and uncaring assholes who's only purpose in life is to 'collect tears' etc. What a joke, and what a let down to all of us that this small group of people is being trained by a ****** game to be even more apathetic. |
Dhaul
Reunincapacitators Nabaal Syndicate
41
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 23:14:00 -
[27] - Quote
If it's allowed by CCP then it isn't an exploit by definition |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
64
|
Posted - 2011.10.29 23:52:00 -
[28] - Quote
Reese Tek'al wrote:Yeah, so what does that say about the game in general? Welcome to EVE, where it's a crime to be a victim. As in real life the majority of users on the forums are perennial vampires, trolls, and uncaring assholes who's only purpose in life is to 'collect tears' etc. What a joke, and what a let down to all of us that this small group of people is being trained by a ****** game to be even more apathetic.
yay! 2 out of 3 because I don't know waht perennial means |
TrollFace TrololMcFluf
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 03:10:00 -
[29] - Quote
You try and help this guy and this is the response i get for my trouble really now what a ******* he is
From: Reese Tek'al Sent: 2011.10.30 02:57 To: QQ,
If you met me IRL I'd thump that **** poor attitude right out of you little goblin.
I'm jettisoning my stuff into space ;-)
|
Justin Credulent
Perkone Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2011.10.30 03:29:00 -
[30] - Quote
Quote:The trade system can be exploited and used to scam players, the GM's know about it and do nothing.
The GMs are lazy, and they use the excuse "EVE is meant to be a harsh and unforgiving Universe" as a front for said laziness.
But just scam CCP out of some cash and you'll quickly see that they don't condone scamming after all...
Quote:Nowadays trades where you are offered normal ship renamed as faction ship instead of faction ship, should be easy to spot -- just check for that green faction-mark at top left corner of ship icon. If that mark is not there, it is not faction ship.
Something every newbie knows, since the tutorial covers it....
Quote:You try and help this guy and this is the response i get for my trouble really now what a ******* he is
From: Reese Tek'al Sent: 2011.10.30 02:57 To: QQ,
If you met me IRL I'd thump that **** poor attitude right out of you little goblin.
I'm jettisoning my stuff into space ;-)
Since the fact in EVE is this: if you've been victimized it's your fault;
then one could only conclude,
since this person is saying something mean to you -
that it is in response to some trollish or antagonistic behavior on your part.
In the future if you don't want people saying such mean things to you then the advise to you is to have a little more respect and courtesy towards other players. |
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