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Yancey Sigmus
Yancey and Bruns Incorporated
0
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Posted - 2013.09.12 01:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
Totally new to PvPing and was wondering where to learn the ropes. Tried doing some faction warfare with my friend today but we couldn't find anything close to a fair fight.
Where is the best place to find 1v1s? Doesn't seem like I'll learn anything about PvP except how to run away from blobs in FW.
Also, in one of the fights we were blobbed we decided to go down fighting... Problem is we couldn't even hit the opposition, even at 8.5k km (the optimal for my gatling pulse lasers with scorch ammo). If I can't even hit them from that far away I must be doing something wrong. My motion prediction skill is at level 4 and shapshooter is at 3. Should I just be trying to keep range instead of orbiting?
Thanks for the help! |
Rioghal Morgan
Pixel Navigators
46
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Posted - 2013.09.12 02:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
You're going to get blobbed sometimes no matter where you go. The key is getting to the point where you know who the players are in your area, their engagement policies, how many they're likely to bring to a fight, so on and so forth. Also, grow to love your d-scan. It's bar-none the most important tool any pilot has in PvP.
As to where to learn, FW really is great for learning to fight. It just takes a while to find out who'll fight you fairly and who won't. i will say that the Gal-Cal warzone is more suited for small-gang and solo work but that doesnt mean the mar-Tar warzone is completely dead in that regard. My corp does quite well with small-gang stuff out that way for instance.
As to what went wrong in that particular fight, it's hard to say without knowing what you were in and what they were flying but it sounds like you simply were hit with your counter. sounds like you took a brawler up against a kiter and he gained range on you. Key to fights like that is getting scram and hopefully webs on him and applying your superior damage.
Lastly, I don't know what your corp situation is now but you'd be well advised to find a good one for yourself to help show you the ropes. It's insanely invaluable. |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1395
|
Posted - 2013.09.12 02:23:00 -
[3] - Quote
FW low sec.
Getting a fight is a skill, so is setting up a fight.
Its arguably a bigger part of your success as an eve player than what happens after you start fighting. FW low sec does not lack fights, last time i went out i got five fights in 25 minutes.
Keep at it, be a bit more daring. you will figure it out soon enough. BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
Hormone1971
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
3
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Posted - 2013.09.12 02:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
Come join us in RVB. Great place to learn hi-sec PVP and very noob friendly. http://rvbeve.com |
Bad Messenger
Nasranite Watch OLD MAN GANG
557
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Posted - 2013.09.12 08:20:00 -
[5] - Quote
If you want fair fight you should know the hood and people who live there, know what they usually do and who gives fair fight etc...
So if you start from scratch you will get blobbed etc...
Knowledge is power so join some corp who can provide local intel about people living there and you will get more fair pvp.
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Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1395
|
Posted - 2013.09.12 11:18:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ohh yea join a good corp.
Also stop going around looking for 1v1's. It limits your fights WAY to much. If you see two guys together where you know you can take them on one at a time. Try to split them up.
Be ballsy, i've done 3v1's that start at zero where i've come on top even though i really shouldn't have. Especially in frigs going for it is very often worth it. BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
Yancey Sigmus
Yancey and Bruns Incorporated
0
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Posted - 2013.09.12 13:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
Thanks for the advice guys. Took some of the advice and was able to get a few good battles in. I didn't win any but felt like I made some progress. |
Lychton Kondur
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
2
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Posted - 2013.09.13 19:26:00 -
[8] - Quote
So I took a look at your corp and noticed that it's your own personal entity that you've created. I don't meant to come across harsh or dismissive, but I think you'd be better served disbanding and joining an established FW or PVP Corp.
The primary reason is for the wealth of information you'll be given access to. If you are new to PVP and FW, I believe it would make more sense being in an active corp with experienced pilots to answer your questions. This game is daunting enough without having resources available to teach you things you don't even know that you don't know.
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Devon Weeks
Deadspace Defense Initiative
43
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Posted - 2013.09.19 10:07:00 -
[9] - Quote
What little advice I can offer...
1. Don't be afraid to lose. Just go try things.
2. Utilize the test server. Don't expect to win here. Most of the people there are flying stupid fits with links and expensive slaves. Don't do what they do. Use standard fits, the kind you're likely to go out and lose. If you can start becoming a challenge there, you're on the right track.
3. Learn to D-scan, and I don't just mean the wide angle kind. D-scan can pinpoint target locations much faster than probes if you know how to do it. If you do a wide scan and see a Dominix wtih Wardens out and no other ships in scan range, you can almost bet he's running a PvE site. You should check your anom list and do a narrow d-scan in the direction of each one. When you hit him and his Wardens, you'll warp in to that spot and find him 90% of the time.
4. Stop being hunted. Be a hunter. This isn't just a way of thinking. It's a way of acting. Your ship, the way you fly it, it all has a "posture" if you will. You should look aggressive, antagonizing, never apprehensive. Apprehension means you're weak. There's a time to run, don't get me wrong. But, most of the time, you should be like that pirate jerk lording his "leetness" over a bunch of scrubs. You'll start to feel emboldened and will often catch more than you think you will.
5. Bring the right ship. If you spend a few days in a FW area and see nothing but Enyos and Thoraxes, well, you know what to do. Their tactics almost always involve getting up close and doing a ton of Kinetic and Thermal damage. You want a cruiser than can fight close and tank a lot of Thermal and Kinetic damage. You can also bet they won't have neuts, so an active tank might not be bad, either. You'll want a weapon system that can track at close range. Once you've got this ship fitted up, you hunt. You don't hunt for a kiting Navy Omen. That'd be stupid. You came to hunt Enyos and Thoraxes and other things that do the same thing as Enyos and Thoraxes. So, hunt Enyos and Thoraxes. We call this your "engagement profile". You should know it well.
6. Check the pilots in local. If you see some guy named "Ima Doosh" in local and his employment history indicates he's a few weeks old, he could be a pretty vulnerable target. If you warp to a FW complex and scan the direction of the gate and see "Ima Doosh's Purifier" on D-scan, well, you have something there. It's likely this guy is extremely new not just to the character but to Eve in general. Find him. Pop him. Didn't we pop you when you were that young? We all went through it. Ima Doosh must as well. If he puts up a good fight or has a good attitude about the experience, send him some isk or some advice to help get him back in the game.
7. Know... the... ships. Seriously. Know what each one does. You don't have to know every single common fitting for every ship. That will come with time. But, you should at least know that a Drake will be slow with missiles or that a Curse will neut you to death while hitting you with drones. Know the basic idea and purpose of each hull. This helps you build and understand your engagement profile and is key to sizing up a fight before it begins. As was already said, setting up a fight is a huge part of winning, but you'll fail every time if you don't know how to evaluate your situation.
8. How do I say this? Ahem. Hear goes. DON'T TRAIN USELESS CRAP!!!!!!! Sorry... had to get that out. I can't stress this enough. Look, it's this simple. A player with 5 years of skill points is just as effective as a 1 year old character if they are both flying a Hound. Why? Because only certain skills even apply to the Hound. The gunnery skills themselves are probably the biggest part of the training, and they aren't too long, maybe 3 or 4 months for all of them to 5? The tank is not long either, 45 days for compensations and another 30 or so for the other stuff. The navigation skills are all fairly short. Perfect capacitor skills is all of a month if not just under it. Tech 2 rigs? Not long at all. Webs and scram? Again, no time. Once all of this stuff is trained and the mods are on the hull, it doesn't matter that he has 50 million skill points to your 10 million. You both have the same number of skills in a Hound, and that's what you're flying. At that stage, tactics win, not skill points. Don't get sidetracked. Pick a ship and make yourself the highest skilled pilot you can possibly be in that ship. Don't waiver. You'll find your effectiveness increasing rapidly if you do. If you take time off your training to go queue up "Gallente Industrial V", I'll find you pod, pop it, mount your corpse on the front of a Daredevil, and bump every Iteron I see in protest of your bad choices. If you want to be good, train to be good, not haul, not trade, not mine, not PI, not boost, not probe, not salvage...
9. Learn how to utilize your utility slots in your fittings. Can you squeeze a nos on your ship? Then, why aren't you? Do you have a spare mid slot? How about ECM or a tracking disruptor? Need a cap booster?
10. Don't underestimate the value of drones. Even the webbing drones. I've caught some people off guard before using those webbing drones. If someone is kiting me and is just a hundred meters faster than I am, those webbing drones can have me right on top of them before they know what happened. It's kind of funny, too, since local always says the same thing afterwards. "wtf?" Remember the Alliance Tournament when everyone freaked out about that one logi ship getting swarmed with energy neutralizing drones? Drones provide a lot of utility and damage projection/type options. Use them. |
Plato Forko
Radical Astronauts Plundering Eve
25
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Posted - 2013.09.19 18:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
I see you've been tooling around the bleak lands. There are a few good small-gang corps in the area happy to help turn your fortune around *hint hint, nudge nudge* with that said, 1v1 is mostly about getting the experience. there are so many different mechanics to keep track of in a fight that a lot of the stuff has to become instinctual before you can really focus on the granular details like managing heat or reducing incoming damage. pyfa/eft-ing fits is a good way to get a feel for the capabilities of all the hulls you might encounter. in your fight versus that rifter, for example, it would have helped you to know that the rifter is a fast ship that can apply dps at the edge of scram range where it will avoid nos and neut modules. that's a pretty important detail when your ship's tank and guns rely on that nos because you don't have the mid slots to fit a cap booster let alone a proper brawler layout (AB, scram, web). anyway, lots of things to keep track of. |
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Ginger Barbarella
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1499
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Posted - 2013.09.19 20:06:00 -
[11] - Quote
FW for unrestrained fights (just be sure you pick your fights), Red v Blue for constrained fights (lots of rules), Brave Newbies for gudfights. "Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac |
Cara Forelli
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
26
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Posted - 2013.09.20 16:05:00 -
[12] - Quote
Ginger Barbarella wrote:Red v Blue for constrained fights (lots of rules)
I wouldn't say lots of rules. No podding, no ECM. Sometimes you will have more structured fleet fights with a few more rules, but you can do quite a bit of solo work in RvB these days.
www.ensignyooch.wordpress.com |
Ginger Barbarella
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1499
|
Posted - 2013.09.21 16:10:00 -
[13] - Quote
By the way, I'd also add that Agony Unleashed has a fantastic set of training courses to learn basics, fleet behavior, etc. Really good stuff... Agony Unleashed "Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac |
Alaric Faelen
Sabotage Incorporated Executive Outcomes
151
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Posted - 2013.09.22 21:07:00 -
[14] - Quote
Q- Best place to learn PvP A- A fleet
Very simple.
1v1 duel is not PvP in Eve unless it happens randomly somewhere out in space. Arranging it completely negates it as useful for how real PvP happens in New Eden. That is not how a fight happens out in hostile space. "Real PvP" for lack of a better term, is done for a reason like sov war, disrupting a trade lane, or shooting up a POCO. So wins and losses have scope. The Dictor pilot that dies bubbling an enemy fleet hasn't simply 'lost' the way a duelist does.
When you solo, you are taking on ALL fleet roles yourself- alone as a newb. You must be the FC, DPS, Logi, EWAR, and Tackle all in one ship and one toon. Why any newb thinks this is an recipe for success is unfathomable. If you aren't ready to FC a small gang, with dedicated roles, ships, and other player's experience backing you up, why would anyone expect to survive solo PvP?
The people that do cool video streams of solo work didn't START there. They are people that have tons of fleet experience and have taken their game to the next level. Solo isn't the ground level.
So, while you are looking for a PvP corp to join, which I'm sure you are......do your homework. -Fly around high sec using the D-Scan to find which belts miners are in. Obviously you can't shoot them, but the D-Scan is LIFE outside of high sec and you absolutely must know how to use it. -Sit at a high sec station or gate and use the D-Scan to predict incoming traffic and predict it's route. -Learn every filter and function of the map. -Memorize the various timers Eve uses, not just the ones with a display on screen. -pay attention to dev blogs and patch notes.
All stuff to do that is safely done in high sec. Deep in low sec, double webbed and scrammed is no time to be 'learning' how PvP works.......... |
Sean Parisi
Fugutive Task Force A T O N E M E N T
341
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Posted - 2013.09.23 07:42:00 -
[15] - Quote
The best way to Player Verse Player is to out diplomacy the enemy and hug it out. "Friendship" - I have never mastered this, for I have no friends. |
Mycael
Self-Service Camping
31
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Posted - 2013.09.25 07:27:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jita undock duels, obviously. |
Othran
Route One
591
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Posted - 2013.09.25 16:39:00 -
[17] - Quote
Agony Unleashed do PvP classes.
If you are too poor to afford the fee then somer.blink has already paid it for you so you can do it for free.
While some may go "meh its a blob" (and class can be), its a very effective way of turning carebears into people who want the pod as well as the ship Its also a good way to discover nullsec for the first time.
Worked for me years ago, may work for you.
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Tandros Kreel
Scurvy Sucks Monkeys with Guns.
6
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Posted - 2013.09.25 18:41:00 -
[18] - Quote
Bad Messenger wrote:If you want fair fight you should know the hood and people who live there, know what they usually do and who gives fair fight etc...
So if you start from scratch you will get blobbed etc...
Knowledge is power so join some corp who can provide local intel about people living there and you will get more fair pvp.
As much as I hate to agree with a Squid, he is correct.
The Gal-Cal warzone always has good fights. I lose ships on a regular basis. =P
Hence my corp title: "Exalted Ship Loser" |
Maximus Decimal
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
14
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Posted - 2013.09.25 20:48:00 -
[19] - Quote
I think that where to dip your toes into PvP does not rely solely on a point on the map or a certain type of warfare/pvp. If you really want to 'learn' to PvP its about who you fly with, not where you do it. I have seen newcomers fail miserably at RvB, Pirating, FW, nullsec and WH space. But there is the flip side of that. Some of the best pilots/FCs I know can do one of them like a baw5 but he would be lost in a different type of space. So think more about who you will have showing you the ropes than which ropes they will be showing you.
You can read as many tips and tricks as you like from the internet and watch all them kil2 vids, but nothing comes close to getting stuck in and learning from your mistakes. There may be some limitations on different types of pvp you can fly depending on your skill points. To learn from the best in this game, you have to be pretty good already. A RnK vouch is a pretty big deal.
Poke me in game if you have an idea of what you want to do, I might be able to help you out looking for some guys to pew with. |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1429
|
Posted - 2013.09.26 01:00:00 -
[20] - Quote
Maximus Decimal wrote: I think that where to dip your toes into PvP does not rely solely on a point on the map or a certain type of warfare/pvp. If you really want to 'learn' to PvP its about who you fly with, not where you do it. I have seen newcomers fail miserably at RvB, Pirating, FW, nullsec and WH space. But there is the flip side of that. Some of the best pilots/FCs I know can do one of them like a baw5 but he would be lost in a different type of space. So think more about who you will have showing you the ropes than which ropes they will be showing you.
You can read as many tips and tricks as you like from the internet and watch all them kil2 vids, but nothing comes close to getting stuck in and learning from your mistakes. There may be some limitations on different types of pvp you can fly depending on your skill points. To learn from the best in this game, you have to be pretty good already. A RnK vouch is a pretty big deal.
Poke me in game if you have an idea of what you want to do, I might be able to help you out looking for some guys to pew with.
Pretty sure most good pvpers could learn the ins and outs of different spaces if they wanted to.
But you are right at least for me.
I really don't speak WH. BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
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Cpt Smasher
Rafzakael Enterprises
0
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Posted - 2013.09.27 20:02:00 -
[21] - Quote
Garviel Tarrant wrote:FW low sec.
Getting a fight is a skill, so is setting up a fight.
Its arguably a bigger part of your success as an eve player than what happens after you start fighting. FW low sec does not lack fights, last time i went out i got five fights in 25 minutes.
Keep at it, be a bit more daring. you will figure it out soon enough.
This is golden advice.
Additionally, find some friends to go with you, or at least hang out with that you can talk and bounce ideas off of. If you want a channel invite, i can bring you into a pretty friendly channel with PvPers. We are recruiting! PvP in NPC 0.0, and Gallente low sec! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=281323 |
Luwc
Easy Co. Fatal Ascension
10
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Posted - 2013.10.02 09:06:00 -
[22] - Quote
Try different styles and corps and try to find your PVP Style. There is nothing wrong with hopping around as a newbie.
I recommend :
RvB Goons/CFC Gallente FW
a.o. some high sec mercs that take newbies. |
Cage Man
269
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Posted - 2013.10.03 23:02:00 -
[23] - Quote
Join a decent corp and learn from them. Trying it solo or with inexperienced pilots isn't going to work. There are also tons of good blogs and vids out there. RvB is also very blobby.. but they do a system dedicated to 1v1 fights, and most times the guys who blow you up will help you out. The thick plottens... CCP, When can my crane get its black paint job back?? |
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
265
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Posted - 2013.10.04 14:15:00 -
[24] - Quote
Yancey Sigmus wrote:we couldn't even hit the opposition, even at 8.5k km (the optimal for my gatling pulse lasers with scorch ammo). If I can't even hit them from that far away I must be doing something wrong. My motion prediction skill is at level 4 and shapshooter is at 3. Should I just be trying to keep range instead of orbiting? Only orbit your target if your tracking is superior to theirs (or you do not care about dealing damage).
Also, Scorch harms your tracking.
It's a good idea to hook up with some experienced PvPers that can share their knowledge with you. Just try to avoid the "experienced" PvPers that have nothing but ignorance to share. |
Jamwara DelCalicoe Ashley
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
33
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Posted - 2013.10.23 16:32:00 -
[25] - Quote
Garviel Tarrant wrote:Ohh yea join a good corp.
Also stop going around looking for 1v1's. It limits your fights WAY to much. If you see two guys together where you know you can take them on one at a time. Try to split them up.
Be ballsy, i've done 3v1's that start at zero where i've come on top even though i really shouldn't have. Especially in frigs going for it is very often worth it.
I recently took on two Myrmidons in my newly acquired Ishkur [recently switched to PvP] and ... heart pounding ... amazeballs.
Melted drones, 1 wreck and 1 Myrmidon headed for a jumpgate :D
Ishkur of Fantastic, activated. |
Zimmy Zeta
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
34356
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Posted - 2013.10.23 16:42:00 -
[26] - Quote
Luwc wrote:Try different styles and corps and try to find your PVP Style. There is nothing wrong with hopping around as a newbie.
I recommend :
RvB Goons/CFC Gallente FW
a.o. some high sec mercs that take newbies.
RvB is the best advice here- they even have a dedicated 1v1 system (Nomaa, I believe) and some of their solo pilots are among the best EVE has to offer, so you could learn a lot from them.
Gallente FW sounds like a poor choice imho since you wanted to stay away from the mindless blobs- and I happen to know that for unknown reasons FW in those systems somehow got "blobby" over the last week.
Just think of how bad an average post by me is, and then realize half of them are even worse |
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