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Quebber
Edge of Midnight
2
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Posted - 2011.10.30 14:12:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi all, I am the ceo of a small corp based out of hisec, mostly new people in the corp with a couple of 0.0 veterans, myself being old school I was taught to pvp in t1 ships, if you want to fly a falcon first learn how to fly a blackbird, if you want assault ships start with frigates etc, I am becoming very jaded with 0.0/lowsec pvp, rare is the good fight, the balanced encounter. skills seems secondary to quantity.
Some of the most fun I had was in RVB, so called civilized combat, a fleet goes out from either side, equal numbers you meet up blow things apart and even talk tactics afterwards.
I crave that kind of fun again pvp for the pure fun of a good fight, win or loose it is all fun.
So this is what I am asking. Is there and small to medium hisec corp/corps who would like to have a mutual wardec with us, a few simple rules that may seem out of place but can lead to alot of fights and long term fun. 1)We do not want your asteroid humpers, basically we will not engage your miners or your members while they are doing money making activities. 2)We do not need neut RR, simply put we fight each other without external help. 3)Balanced fleets and fun, be it a 1v1 or 5v5 try to balance it so that we do not bring 5 and you bring 10 4)joint channel, setup a joint channel to setup fight locations and or discuss tactics etc afterwards.
The spirit of this is having fun in a game learning and practicing skills for the pure fun of blowing each other up on a common battlefield.
What if someone breaks the rules ? Well for one fight where you may win via numbers or underhanded tactics we drop the WD and go on our way, you loose months of fun dogfights and pvp, time spent basically learning and enjoying this side of eve without all the blobfest and trash that has started to fill eve pvp.
Myself, (Quebber formerly Rho Legate) I have never broken my word and the same goes for my corp.
So am I crazy or would anyone be interested in this ?
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subtle turtle
Wolfsbrigade
1
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Posted - 2011.10.30 15:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
I would think that you would likely have better luck just joining RVB with all your friends. You can still fly fleets together, and there is a ready supply of targets to be had, in the opposing corp and from third party purple decs. The big advantage to this is that you already have an established community with established pilots and rules. No point trying to reinvent the wheel. Just create a private channel for you and your friends to remain in close contact. Or you can put your corp in Faction Warfare. You aren't guaranteed "even" fights, but that's the case in pretty much all of new eden. And if you already have a group of active pilots willing to PVP and fly in organized fleets, you are well ahead of most FW corps out there.
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Quebber
Edge of Midnight
4
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Posted - 2011.10.30 16:03:00 -
[3] - Quote
Our corp eom is an ideal and a home most of us do not want to join another corp to do this sadly.
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Hamish Grayson
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve The Fourth District
15
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Posted - 2011.10.30 17:52:00 -
[4] - Quote
I know a corp that might be interested. |
Quebber
Edge of Midnight
4
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Posted - 2011.10.30 19:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
Hamish Grayson wrote:I know a corp that might be interested.
If they are please ask them to evemail me :) |
Meridith Akesia
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
53
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Posted - 2011.10.31 02:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
Highsec wardecs, Civilized pvp? lol. |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
18
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Posted - 2011.10.31 03:05:00 -
[7] - Quote
The problem with this idea is that you don't fight at your fullest ability if you don't think of the other guy as a true enemy.
If you're just doing it for training purposes, that's fine. But getting accustomed to even fights is bad in the long term. You will only become "better" by both being subjected to unfair tactics, and using them against others. |
Vricrolatious
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
40
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Posted - 2011.10.31 03:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
Destiny Corrupted wrote:The problem with this idea is that you don't fight at your fullest ability if you don't think of the other guy as a true enemy.
If you're just doing it for training purposes, that's fine. But getting accustomed to even fights is bad in the long term. You will only become "better" by both being subjected to unfair tactics, and using them against others.
This sums it up best, mate. If you're looking for even numbers, EVE isn't really the best place for you when it comes to PvP. I haven't clicked on your corp info, so I don't know how big you guys are, but if you want some fun PvP... find a corp that's bigger than you (two or three times bigger than you) and War Dec them (if you're still looking for fair, make sure it's a corp that does PvP) and then you guys form up in small gangs and try to cause as much as damage as you can.
You may also want to wander lowsec a bit in search of things to shoot at, there are plenty of small corps (and large ones too) that live in lowsec that really just want to things to shoot at. Go find them or let them find you, blow things (or explode) and have some laughs with your mates.
If you're worried about sec status, don't pod kill people and you can get a fair amount of kills (or attempted kills) before you even have to worry about bringing the status back up if you want / need highsec access. WIDot, Best Dot, Even Sans Dot! -Vric |
Quebber
Edge of Midnight
5
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Posted - 2011.10.31 06:38:00 -
[9] - Quote
Every fight be it 1v1 or FCing a large fleet I have always fought to my fullest ideas and ability, hell even when I fight my own corp mates I hold nothing back.
I have this crazy idea that using neutral RR or outblobing a foe does not make you a good pvper, I am sad to say that 90% of the people in 0.0 these days are just basic training grunts, yes they have the char skills to fly ships but most do not even know how to make an undock or tacticals and deep safes, I used to get into quite heated verbal wars with my alliance FC because the tactics he used in battle assumed the lowest common denominator of intelligence but am beginning to understand why.
Personally I was taught by Agony Unleashed and those lessons still stay with me, that and alot of crashing my ship into fun things.
After that I joined RVB (old char I sold) and it was so damn refreshing not only that 1v1's were honored but that entire fleet fights could be setup and afterwards fits exchanged and tactics discussed, so much was learnt that the next three 0.0 pvp corps I joined I topped there kill boards it in no way detracted from my ability to use underhand tactics and or psyops in combat.
It is also kind of sad to say that maybe pvp in eve is not for me seen as I have been pvping in eve for over 3 years been involved in everything from solo fun to huge fights and wars in pnq and o2o.
After leaving 0.0 becoming jaded and annoyed with most of the leadership of the big alliances *grins* (my apology for being such a pain in the ass) I decided the only way forward was to form my own corp and trust being the issue it was I dragged people from real life that I had known for 10 years plus into eve.
I have taught them alot of what I know and the amazement when actually leading a fleet and your members actually listen and follow orders lol and they respond better in combat than alot of people I knew in 0.0.
I have tried to take my members, small groups from 3-7 into 0.0 and all you seem to see is blob, no skill just numbers, maybe it is a training idea :)
But if anyone can mail me some places a smallish fleet of frigs/cruisers/bc's can have fun I am happy to try (sadly most of us do not want to get low standings).
We fly mostly T1 ships not because we have to but because I am of the believe that learning in t1 is a damn good idea, our corp has a complete ship replacement policy for any ship lost be it t1-3 and capitals, by complete I mean ship/modules/ammo .
I guess I am looking for fun fights and while a merlin vs a legion+sabre+rifter+blackbird+teranis may seem fun to some that particular type of engagement does not leave me feeling GF GF!!! or a group of t1 cruisers facing of against T2's with 2 falcons and macharial backup is not really that much fun either. |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
18
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Posted - 2011.10.31 07:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
Quebber wrote:Every fight be it 1v1 or FCing a large fleet I have always fought to my fullest ideas and ability, hell even when I fight my own corp mates I hold nothing back.
It's subconscious. You'd have to be a sociopath to not hold back when battling friends/family/allies, which bring me to...
Quebber wrote:I have this crazy idea that using neutral RR or outblobing a foe does not make you a good pvper...
This ideology stands in stark contrast with sociopathic tendencies.
Also, I disagree. The difference between people who are fighting for sport and fighting to win is that the latter will write the history books. Good pvpers win fights. Being a good warrior isn't synonymous with being honorable. Don't expect to get far if you're not willing to fight dirty, unless you're being square only for the sake of adding an extra challenge for yourself, which brings me to...
Quebber wrote:I guess I am looking for fun fights and while a merlin vs a legion+sabre+rifter+blackbird+teranis may seem fun to some that particular type of engagement does not leave me feeling GF GF!!! or a group of t1 cruisers facing of against T2's with 2 falcons and macharial backup is not really that much fun either.
You're taking up the wrong attitude here. Unless killboard stats are important to you (for example, if you need to show competence as a mercenary), then picking fights with stronger opponents is exactly what you should be doing. Now, you obviously shouldn't be stupid about it, i.e. picking a fight with a group of station-huggers in a hub (those Guardians aren't afk).
I'm not saying that you can never have what you want in the OP; I'm sure you can find another corporation that would be willing to take you up on this idea. I'm simply saying that you won't be playing this game the way it was meant to be played, as cliche as that sounds.
Besides, if RvB already fully meets your criteria, you can always take your friends and join up again, if you don't find what you're looking for this way. |
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Quebber
Edge of Midnight
5
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Posted - 2011.10.31 08:40:00 -
[11] - Quote
While I agree with most of what you say, a well thought out post the one part I can not agree with is "how the game is mean to be played" This is still somewhat a sandbox and thus there is many ways to "play" this game by choice and intent.
And just because I am looking for the purity of a fight 10v10 or 1v1, does not make me in any way less, I do not mind loosing ships but do prefer if it is a good fight.
Now a "good" fight can be very subjective, the first time I flew my moros and shot a tcu that to me was a good fight (something to do with turning sound up to 10 all effects on and watching the amazing lighshow punctuated by the firing of blasters and some infected mushroom Artillery going on in the background), yesterday I fought the winner of that nights eve-radio competition, I travelled 13 jumps twice after hearing I needed to refit to pure t1 and that 1v1 was awesome :).
I have been in o2o with 150 maelstroms fighting forces and local passes 1800, even with the lag, even with the time between locking and firing, it was a "good" fight.
The day a test alliance rapier pilot decided to engage me and two other members of my corp in t1 frigates and we schooled his ass :) yep that was a good fight.
When I saw a neutral being attacked by pirates in local and engaged on his side, fun as hell!
Maybe I am just jaded but I would take the above moments over station games with carrier support or neut rr in hisec.
In the past I used every trick both inside and outside of the book, from spying to logofsky when in certain alliances, winning at any cost..destroying corps or people, annihilating oposition, the congratulations and kudos for playing my part always felt hollow, I was ranked 5600 on battleclinic when I said goodbye to that kind of pvp, If I had continued I would probably have hit top 1000 atleast..
So I know that side of it, I just was looking for something more, I guess it is a kind of burn out, I still love eve and I live for those few moments of the kill, the fight overloading weapons judging everything, manually orbiting an enemy kudos and respect always given even if not returned.
Although I do need to find something soon hehe our sparing matching in corp have evolved from low armor to killmail. |
Potato IQ
Hedion University Amarr Empire
8
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Posted - 2011.10.31 08:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
Quebber wrote:But if anyone can mail me some places a smallish fleet of frigs/cruisers/bc's can have fun I am happy to try (sadly most of us do not want to get low standings)
Wormholes
This will not be pew handed to you. WH diving takes time and effort, but the number of WHGÇÖs to be found from HS means you will always find targets, albeit not always a fight
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Quebber
Edge of Midnight
5
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Posted - 2011.10.31 09:13:00 -
[13] - Quote
Yes WH's can be fun but I do not think people are "getting" where I am coming from, unless I am at war and I mean a proper war I do not kill industrials, yes I know people are idiots and blowing up an autopiloting badger or freighter (lets not talk about the charon :) ) punishes there stupidity, yes I agree a hulk should be aligned and watching local or in a WH D-scanning but its not really "fun" killing a target that can not fight back.
Okay so if no one takes us up on this offer, hope they do even if for training purposes it could be bloody good fun, I am just going to get the corp to fit out all 160 ships in the hangars and we roam every day till they are all gone, by that point skyrim should be out and a couple of weeks of that may do us all good lol.
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Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery
225
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Posted - 2011.10.31 10:30:00 -
[14] - Quote
You could actually contact RvB and perhaps get a mutual wardec with one or both teams. They're about the best option for you.
You seem to want a gentlemans duel, and Eve is not about that.
Did two armies ever meet, anywhere, ever, in history, and have one side keep half their men at home, to make it fair?
Nope. - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |
Soldarius
Peek-A-Boo Bombers
52
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Posted - 2011.10.31 12:36:00 -
[15] - Quote
Quebber wrote:Yes WH's can be fun but I do not think people are "getting" where I am coming from, unless I am at war and I mean a proper war I do not kill industrials, yes I know people are idiots and blowing up an autopiloting badger or freighter (lets not talk about the charon :) ) punishes there stupidity, yes I agree a hulk should be aligned and watching local or in a WH D-scanning but its not really "fun" killing a target that can not fight back.
Okay so if no one takes us up on this offer, hope they do even if for training purposes it could be bloody good fun, I am just going to get the corp to fit out all 160 ships in the hangars and we roam every day till they are all gone, by that point skyrim should be out and a couple of weeks of that may do us all good lol.
Dude, I know exactly where you are coming from and how you feel. "I was there" in o20. Was a good fight. But after that, nulsec PvP has been in a downward deathspiral. I nearly quit eve because it seemed like such a waste of time.
Mate, there's plenty of good PvP in w-space. All you need to be effective is a covert cloak, a core probe launcher, and a good dose of patience. While we often take the freebies of unguarded industrial kills, we also attack any gangs we think we have a chance of defeating. Heck, just the other day, Chessur and I took it upon ourselves to let a corp know that they had let their POS run out of fuel by generating some attack notifications and kill mails on their corp assets. We even cleaned up the mess afterwards by hauling away the loot trash.
Honestly, I've found w-space hunting to be very refreshing. "How do you kill that which has no life?" |
Lucinda Hamu
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.31 12:45:00 -
[16] - Quote
I can understand the OP's thoughts.
PvP is meant to be fun but a lot of it is just 1 sided ganking. That in my opinion is not fun.
The OP is looking for the 'fair fight' which he isn't going to find against hostile targets but I do think there will be plenty of other corps who would like a 'friendly' war.
I wish him luck. |
Joshke
Epsilon Inc STORM.
1
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Posted - 2011.10.31 13:19:00 -
[17] - Quote
Great idea for myself - I'll ask people in our corp. |
Officer Nyota Uhura
35
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Posted - 2011.10.31 13:57:00 -
[18] - Quote
"Civilized PvP" .... "hi-sec PvP" ... *chuckles* |
shal ri
Zanzibar Land
0
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Posted - 2011.10.31 14:53:00 -
[19] - Quote
whats more fun then being outnumbered and killin the fleet ur fighting really makes for a good challenge and great fights. 1v2 2v3 2v4 3v5 they make for the best fights. |
Borun Tal
Space Pods Inc
1
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Posted - 2011.10.31 16:36:00 -
[20] - Quote
OP: join FW. Problem solved. :) |
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Tora Oni
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
34
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Posted - 2011.10.31 17:07:00 -
[21] - Quote
Ok, you lost me after a few lines and I didn't even read the rest of the replies...... War isn't about rules and fun and whatever you can think of. It about being the last one alive at ANY cost! |
Quebber
Edge of Midnight
5
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Posted - 2011.10.31 21:31:00 -
[22] - Quote
Joshke wrote:Great idea for myself - I'll ask people in our corp.
Look forward to hearing from you.
I did actually contact RvB proposed we WD them but would stick to there normal rules of combat no pod killing etc.
Even though I was willing to follow all there rules the reply was simply no.
From my heated discussions with pvpers in eve it is clear that there are many ways to pvp in eve, alot of us come up from different places, different teachings just as anyone what there favourite ship is or best tactic.
I can understand both sides of this discussion, having been on the "win at any cost" side just about the only two things I would love to see disapear is neut RR and station games or atleast make it more risky to engage on a station or RR someone in hisec..
I have many "I was there" moments, times that were far more than just statistics, battles that left my hands shaking and stories I still share with friends like campfire stories of old..
Another side of me is seeking the rarity of 1v1, 5v5 of good natured combat where equal foes test there metal and discuss the battle afterwards over a quafe. where a hidden command ship or neut rr or overwhelming numbers does not decide the battle but the purity of a martial arts match but with ships.
It is not about right or wrong, I am just hopping that some people out there get this idea and we can get together and watch ships go boom :)
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Tinu Moorhsum
Aliastra Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2011.11.01 12:38:00 -
[23] - Quote
Quebber wrote:Hi all, I am the ceo of a small corp based out of hisec, mostly new people in the corp with a couple of 0.0 veterans, myself being old school I was taught to pvp in t1 ships, if you want to fly a falcon first learn how to fly a blackbird, if you want assault ships start with frigates etc, I am becoming very jaded with 0.0/lowsec pvp, rare is the good fight, the balanced encounter. skills seems secondary to quantity.
Some of the most fun I had was in RVB, so called civilized combat, a fleet goes out from either side, equal numbers you meet up blow things apart and even talk tactics afterwards.
I crave that kind of fun again pvp for the pure fun of a good fight, win or loose it is all fun.
So this is what I am asking. Is there and small to medium hisec corp/corps who would like to have a mutual wardec with us, a few simple rules that may seem out of place but can lead to alot of fights and long term fun. 1)We do not want your asteroid humpers, basically we will not engage your miners or your members while they are doing money making activities. 2)We do not need neut RR, simply put we fight each other without external help. 3)Balanced fleets and fun, be it a 1v1 or 5v5 try to balance it so that we do not bring 5 and you bring 10 4)joint channel, setup a joint channel to setup fight locations and or discuss tactics etc afterwards.
The spirit of this is having fun in a game learning and practicing skills for the pure fun of blowing each other up on a common battlefield.
What if someone breaks the rules ? Well for one fight where you may win via numbers or underhanded tactics we drop the WD and go on our way, you loose months of fun dogfights and pvp, time spent basically learning and enjoying this side of eve without all the blobfest and trash that has started to fill eve pvp.
Myself, (Quebber formerly Rho Legate) I have never broken my word and the same goes for my corp.
So am I crazy or would anyone be interested in this ?
If you want balanced fleets then run tournaments. These can be a lot of fun and lead to building relations with former neutrals and enemies. Certainly, if you're living in low-sec such events can open doors.
However, If you want to play eve-online in a more general sense then ship up, buckle up and learn how to get kills even when the odds are against you. Me and my friends started life living 3 jumps from Rancer and lost a LOT of fights while we sharpened our teeth on them and learned in teh field what works and what doesn't work.... these days most of us are experienced PVP pilots and/or even corp leads and FC's in nullsec alliances and look at Bl3H as hopeless noobs who haven't improved in any way at ALL in the last 5 years.
... and that's what will happen to you if you insist on fighting only "balanced" fights..... you'll end up stagnant and nobody who counts in this game will take you seriously.
Eve online isn't fair.... You have ambition and a drive to make your corp better.... so do that.... make a name for yourself but FFS let go of the "everything needs to be balanced" paradigm. If you can do that and learn the ropes, lean how to FC when the odds are against you and in no time at all your corp will be interesting to the biggest and best in EVE
T-
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Princess Nexxala
Quantum Cats Syndicate
5
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Posted - 2011.11.01 15:31:00 -
[24] - Quote
LOL @ high sec PvP Is sexy time? |
Quebber
Edge of Midnight
6
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Posted - 2011.11.02 22:38:00 -
[25] - Quote
Okay so a question to those that detract from this idea, give me some ideas of places to take a 2-6 man gang who prefer not to screw up there standings in lowsec or wormholes.
Where you can get some interesting fights without being blobbed or totally outgunned in every engagement. |
Borun Tal
One More Corp
4
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Posted - 2011.11.02 23:23:00 -
[26] - Quote
Quebber wrote:Okay so a question to those that detract from this idea, give me some ideas of places to take a 2-6 man gang who prefer not to screw up there standings in lowsec or wormholes.
Where you can get some interesting fights without being blobbed or totally outgunned in every engagement.
War dec a high sec industrial corp if you arne't willing to take the negative risks... |
ImmutableDark
We Hit Women
0
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Posted - 2011.11.03 04:00:00 -
[27] - Quote
This is the dumbest idea ever. Where is the fun in "civilised pvp" the fun is coming up with tactics to beat idiots and smack talking. I was in umokka and a smack talking battled ensued between two corps one the wardeccing corp and the other the decced corp. The decced corp was winning because it had more neutral rr than the other corp. I thought this was the funniest crap ever you guys are missing out. |
Desudes
The Scope Gallente Federation
10
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Posted - 2011.11.03 04:05:00 -
[28] - Quote
Destiny Corrupted wrote:The problem with this idea is that you don't fight at your fullest ability if you don't think of the other guy as a true enemy.
If this is actually a problem for people... stop being pussies. It's a game, relax, shoot lasers. Excuse me, but what the f*ck are you desu? |
Quebber
Edge of Midnight
6
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Posted - 2011.11.03 06:57:00 -
[29] - Quote
To sumarise we have four types of answers to this thread.
A)People who understand what I am trying to accomplish and some even going to talk to there corp about it, realising this is for fun and learning on both sides, an outlet for corps too small or just do not want to go low/null pvp.
B)The "your doing it wrong" brigade who just do not understand or see any type of pvp but there own "OMG we gotta win at any cost no matter if we have 500% more ships/neuts/members/machaerials" PVP!!! Elite!, sorry I do not subscribe to your idea of "win" and for some wierd reason I see no challenge or fun in the 5 to 1 10 to 1 or 50 to 3 pvp battle.
C)People who do not agree but actually offering advice on other options for a small corp to pvp without ****.
D)WTH ??? I like chicken soup too
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