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Would u still play EVE if there was no pirates?

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Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:35:00 - [1] Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:52 Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:09 Like the topic says this situation is soon to come about in EVE csuse of the recent nerfs to piracy which have resulted in a number of corps and well known pirates either changign their ways or becoming mostly inactive. Although it is ofc possible that new players will rise to replace them given the extreme hardship now faced by a career pirate it seems unlikely many will succeed. So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
xStormwingx	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:38:00 - [2] Edited by: xStormwingx on 13/01/2006 01:40:33 EDIT: well...pirates don't -have- to be -10. BUt if there were no piracy period, then my account would be gone in a few minutes.... But after I try pirating myself, if there were none left :) --- :O
Malka Badi'a	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:40:00 - [3] The corps that died from the changes are the corps that refused to adapt. --------------
Siigari Kitawa	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:41:00 - [4] Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 13/01/2006 01:41:19 This topic has been posted a billion times, but turning EVE into a PVE game would take away almost ALL the exhiliration of the game. edit: ^^^ what changes _________ roflfest 2006 - be there
Elenath	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:42:00 - [5] I continue to play even though grammatical abortions such as this are presented for public consumption. A pirate pales in comparison. I'd prefer (if you must post) that you at least go back to amusing the entire EVE community by talking about how incredibly awesome you are in your own little world. That thread was truly hilarious.
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:43:00 - [6] I'm in a Ginger Magician thread -- Proud member of the [23]. The Tachikomas are DEAD! Click sig for video.
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:46:00 - [7] Originally by: Dark Shikari I'm in a Ginger Magician thread Your in every bloody thread that ever was "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Anglyson	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:47:00 - [8] post is short on details isn't it what has killed piracy? seems to be thriving to me and most of the recent changes i have experienced since last february have favored pirates but to answer your question - oh yeah, and more happily one more thing piracy does not equal pvp
McCade	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:48:00 - [9] There are pirates?
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:52:00 - [10] Originally by: Malka Badi'a The corps that died from the changes are the corps that refused to adapt. And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? Oh yes, use an alt to do all your industry work. How stupid of me. ___ forum whoring -

Wong Wei	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:54:00 - [11] Should I consider this as meaning you're thinking of quitting? If so, can I have your stuff?
Kylania	Posted - 2006.01.13 01:56:00 - [12] Originally by: Nero Scuro And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? Did you typo that? Should it have been "see" instead of "kill"? Because it sounds like "I should be able to kill everybody but they shouldn't be able to kill me." Either way it seems you're angry about having to deal with a fair fight. :) -- Lil Miner
GigaIndy	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:09:00 - [13] The pirate changes dont bother me, i still kill plenty of people. As for quiting, if pirates disapeared i'd quit. If random gankers sitting 200k off of a gate killing 4 week old noobs in badgers. I wouldn't quit, i'd rejoice.
Tommy TenKreds	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:26:00 - [14] There will still be PVP even with less career pirates. Opportunists and sheer psychos will continue to haunt the space lanes, harassing the unsuspecting and the less prepared. But I would very much miss the potential threat of well-organized and experienced bad guys. Tommy TenKreds Signature Contest -- 120 million ISK giveaway.
Blind Fear	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:30:00 - [15] 'Recent' nerfs to piracy? There hasnt been a major nerf to pirates in months. The profession has already been basically exterminated. Hasnt been a need to squeeze more blood from this stone. ------------------------------------------------ Derailing threads with logic since 1992
DaveW	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:31:00 - [16] Pirates have no effect on anything I do in EVE so I wouldn't know if they were there or not.
Saeris Tal'Urduar	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:34:00 - [17] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Malka Badi'a The corps that died from the changes are the corps that refused to adapt. *And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill?* Oh yes, use an alt to do all your industry work. How stupid of me. Kill rights dont last forever does it??? I've yet to try it out since RmR..but you cant be implying that carebears should be able to attack you back, are you?
My grandfather	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:36:00 - [18] Ok, I don't pvp, and I don't pirate hunt. But I can honestly say eve wouldn't be half as interesting if there were no pirates. It just gived the extra thrill of going through low-sec, dodging gatecamps, watching wars ... Without pirates eve would be a pretty dull place. Originally by: Imaran *cli.. .... nahhhh.
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:42:00 - [19] Originally by: Kylania Originally by: Nero Scuro And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? Did you typo that? Should it have been "see" instead of "kill"? Because it sounds like "I should be able to kill everybody but they shouldn't be able to kill me." Either way it seems you're angry about having to deal with a fair fight. :) I had a big rant in here, but decided I could better sum it up with "I was refering to eye-for-an-eye, I like fair fights." ___ forum whoring -
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 02:53:00 - [20] Edited by: Nero Scuro on 13/01/2006 02:53:50 Originally by: Saeris Tal'Urduar Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Malka Badi'a The corps that died from the changes are the corps that refused to adapt. *And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill?* Oh yes, use an alt to do all your industry work. How stupid of me. Kill rights dont last forever does it??? I've yet to try it out since RmR..but you cant be implying that carebears should be able to attack you back, are you? It lasts a month, which is so long it's practically forever. I can't remember what I did last month, anyway, but that's opium for you... And carebears fighting back is fine, it's that piracy is a profession - only griefers do it (solely) for fun, and this change only makes sense if you assume all pirates are griefers (And by griefers, I mean people who find it fun to pop defenceless and only defenceless ships). Imagine PvErs who could, when least suspecting it, get ganked by that spawn they chained last night - while in the middle of empire, hauling. The same thing has happened to piracy. You can't make money from a profession that, on top of eventually restricting you from empire, also makes sure that you potentially lose a ship to every single profit you make. Sure, it's a laugh-riot for the people who only pirate using alts, for whom consequence is just a big word. They can log into their mains and go haul in empire in peace. This is just another messed up addition that punishes legit pirates while barely bothering the real problem. ___ forum whoring -

Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:07:00 - [21] Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 03:08:50 I dont care about people killing me, outlawed anyways be nice if they a) removed local or b)let us use interdiction spheres in low sec or c) cut the aggression timer to 5 mins, so you dont have 15mins before kills in your inty be so great to be able to ransom at gates and stations, i dont want crappy loot what matters to the carebears and the pirates is the ship ^^ Edit: maybe delay local in low sec, say 5 mins so you got to get in and get a kill within 5 mins I was reading over EON today and im dissapointed...theres never anything for pirates. All this factional warfare etc is rubbish :/ Give us piracy tool dammit
Kaaii	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:15:00 - [22] Pirates are such a small percentage of EVE. As the corps grow in size, and expand, they contest with other corps which creates pvp. Thats where the combat will occur, in distant 0.0 reachs of space as people fight it out for control. Not tanking gate sentries with 8 stabs, ganking newbes.. "..Id rather fall beside 10 lions, than stand with One thousand sheep.."
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:23:00 - [23] Originally by: Velsharoon Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 03:08:50 I dont care about people killing me, outlawed anyways be nice if they a) removed local or b)let us use interdiction spheres in low sec or c) cut the aggression timer to 5 mins, so you dont have 15mins before kills in your inty be so great to be able to ransom at gates and stations, i dont want crappy loot what matters to the carebears and the pirates is the ship ^^ Edit: maybe delay local in low sec, say 5 mins so you got to get in and get a kill within 5 mins I was reading over EON today and im dissapointed...theres never anything for pirates. All this factional warfare etc is rubbish :/ Give us piracy tool dammit Yeah, the problem is that CCP started listening to the wrong 'bears, but don't realise that these 'bears will always whine. To some players, the fact that another player can impose themselves aggressively on them is appaling. The fact that they're playing a MMORPG doesn't matter to these guys, they're faaar too stupid to realise the basic premise of a MMO. They want their own little world that they have perfect control over. A little wonderland of sunshine and happiness where the only interaction between players is hugs and kisses - thus the term carebear. Nerfing piracy won't satisfy these people until piracy is banned completely. Piracy hasn't gotten a single boost in... um, ever? That can't be right, but I'm trying to think of one, and nothing comes to mind... :/ ___ forum whoring -
Vendrin	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:26:00 - [24] Not a pirate and never will play one, but I think the nerfs piracy has recieved are idiotic. Need help in Caldari Space? Join channel CCDF to give or recieve it.
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:26:00 - [25] Originally by: Kaaii Pirates are such a small percentage of EVE. As the corps grow in size, and expand, they contest with other corps which creates pvp. Thats where the combat will occur, in distant 0.0 reachs of space as people fight it out for control. Not tanking gate sentries with 8 stabs, ganking newbes.. So u would be happy if 0.4 to 0.1 space was totally safe because lets be clear that is the space that pirates operate in not 0.0.If there r no pirates there would be no combat of any kind in 0.1 to 0.4 because alliance and opportunistic pvpers will not take the security hits for it as well as the new eye for an eye consequences of unlawful combat. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
WolfGang H	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:31:00 - [26] To answer your question, I would quit if there were no pirates in EVE. Why? Because a game where this type of behaviour can't exist is a stupid game. --- Have what it takes to join the Guardians of Basgerin?
Berilac	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:32:00 - [27] if there where no pirates than i wouldn't be, so i couldn't play. Your question answers itself.
Calderio	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:33:00 - [28] there will always be someone with a lil captain in em. but yes i would and i would grief kill people daily and say yarr to make up for the lack of piracy in eve. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ RIP Kevin Wessel, Age 20, Departed April 19 2005, Baghdad
Duncan Storne	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:47:00 - [29] Yes, I'd continue to play if there were no pirates. Although I do look forward to hunting pirates at some point, if they all leave the game I won't really be dissapointed. It looks like what you are complaining about is the possibility of retaliation when you are not prepared for it. I guess you missed the irony? So, you attacking other people when they are not prepared for it is fun, but when the roles are reversed, all of a sudden the game isn't fair anymore and you want to quit?
Dakath	Posted - 2006.01.13 03:53:00 - [30] Ginger, griefers had things all their own way for a very long time. That is over now. Adapt or give me all your stuff before you quit. LAG!Ö

Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.13 04:00:00 - [31] This thread is not about me or my exploits in EVE.It is a general discussion and exploration of the fall in pirate numbers in the game and the nerfs that have caused that fall.Please keep on topic with your posts. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 04:06:00 - [32] Originally by: Duncan Storne Yes, I'd continue to play if there were no pirates. Although I do look forward to hunting pirates at some point, if they all leave the game I won't really be dissapointed. It looks like what you are complaining about is the possibility of retaliation when you are not prepared for it. I guess you missed the irony? So, you attacking other people when they are not prepared for it is fun, but when the roles are reversed, all of a sudden the game isn't fair anymore and you want to quit? And there, you just answered your own question. Somebody who does it solely for fun is a griefer - they get kicks out of killing defenceless ships. But piracy - real piracy - is a profession. It can be fun (although anybody who's done any amount of gate-camping may disagree) but a pirate is doing it for the cash. And at the minute that's impossible, thus the numerous 'piracy is dead' replys. ___ forum whoring -
Zeke Novak	Posted - 2006.01.13 04:54:00 - [33] I'd continue to play, and probably enjoy it more without having to worry about gate-camping scum. It'd be a shame for the honorable pirates to go, but if the griefing trash go with them then I'd love to see such a change.
Biosman	Posted - 2006.01.13 05:06:00 - [34] it just wouldnt be the same,eve is an alternative universe where you "almost" have a real life mechanism which what makes it great. irl you walk down the street and a gang of dodgy geezers are walking towards you,you cross the road.if they get you its tuff s***,only next time you take your mates. eve is a bit like this,you have to use brain cells. theres a guy sometimes logs in "he's pretty dangerous so he's in my buddy list" and you can open the map and see a 0.4 system being systematically cleared out,what does that tell you,apart from 8 ships destroyed in the last hour?to me it means stay clear till he's gone.hehe the game would be crap without people like this,they contribute an equal amount,as do miners,haulers,carebears whatever you choose to role play,hell i salute him.
Iorya Dragon	Posted - 2006.01.13 05:42:00 - [35] Well i got ganked a lot of time by lamer pirates that dont know to real pvp alone, but i got mad at that time. Pirates got to exists, scammers, real pvpers, the more diversity and danger, more intersting the game it is. If u need to be safe a while, to train skills, and prepare stay in empire for a while. YOu gota understand the role of every, profesion, faction in the game, and with what contributes to the game, even if u ar e a 100% carebear.
mogwai	Posted - 2006.01.13 05:44:00 - [36] I dont like pirates... and from that standpoint i would play more if the profession died out. But from another standpoint, piracy in eve is essential for keeping alliances in 0.0 sec on thier toes. on a slighty different note tho, with the macro's causing so much hassle in higher sec systems, i personally had to move to 0.3 just to find some decent belts and now find myself running missions as an alt due to 'griefers' with nothing better to do than camp stations all night. ............................................ It isnt a bug, it's a new feature
TheNecromancer	Posted - 2006.01.13 05:58:00 - [37] yes
Anglyson	Posted - 2006.01.13 06:45:00 - [38] Originally by: Duncan Storne It looks like what you are complaining about is the possibility of retaliation when you are not prepared for it. I guess you missed the irony? So, you attacking other people when they are not prepared for it is fun, but when the roles are reversed, all of a sudden the game isn't fair anymore and you want to quit? how beautifully and simply stated QFT
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.01.13 06:49:00 - [39] Probably not. I live in 0.0. If there was no risk of piracy, it wouldn't be special to be able live out there. Anyone and their dog could.
Megadon	Posted - 2006.01.13 07:02:00 - [40] Kind of a silly question don't you think? It pre-supposes that pirating may come to an end, or it puts forth the idea that pirating is in jeopardy and it isn't. All that's changed, as usual, are the tactics and methods required to carry out whatever profession you choose. In RMR this happened with manufacturers, mission runners, gate campers and ore thieves to name a few. Some people change their strategy, some don't, that's all it adds up to. Those who do flourish, those who don't find new professions or end up adapting anyway. So what else is new? More directly, those who want to easy targets will move out to 0 space to do their hunting which is a better place for it anyway and gives everyone more stuff to shoot at which = more fun. "The Battleships is and should be a solo pwnmobile." - Oveur

Kuolematon	Posted - 2006.01.13 07:09:00 - [41] yes Azuriel Talloth: If it ain't broke, change it so it mildly annoys the playerbase
Jakk Graiseach	Posted - 2006.01.13 08:45:00 - [42] I really don't see a problem with the new eye-for-an-eye legislation in game. It seems a logical way forward to allow players the opportunity to exact vengeance for their losses. I think the unrealistic view would be that of expecting to destroy someone's ship and then be able to fly past them waving sarcastically in empire, protected by Concord - which is how it used to be. As to other 'nerfs' to piracy, what might they be? You can use warp bubbles for gate camps, interdictors when you want to catch someone without a bubble, they can't insta-log off once they've been in combat with you any more, etc. Seems to me that CCP is aiming for a balance and that the only 'pirates' who will be upset by the changes are the ones who want an 'I WIN' button and like to throw their toys out of the pram every time something is added to give their victims a miniscule chance to fight back. -- There are some men that things should not come to know
Hohenheim OfLight	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:02:00 - [43] This has top be really a stupid question you can answer it your self in two seconds, all yo have to do is look at the map see th 70% of people in empire avoding pierates at all costs, never leaving empire. Now ask your self would these people still play if they could go to low sec and mine safe in the knowledge that the only thing likley to kill them is a belt rat, hell yes they would. Pierats are the problem not the soulttion. PVP will contuine in war decs, with out griffer pierat scum. And thats what most pierats are, a group who i wont name here recentley, delbrtley spent all the time going after my ceo over and over and over again untill he quit eve (dont ask me why he did just no got back to high sec). I say good ridens to bad rubish. ------------------------------------------------- Contribute to the buy Hohenheim a carrier fund in game now!
Joshua Deakin	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:05:00 - [44] I'd rather see the pirates/gankers to disappear totally from EVE, what they do is that they limit my enjoyment of the game. There's plenty fighting to do between corp wars, alliance wars, trade wars and so on. As I don't belong to any corp yet because I want to explore Eve a little bit more on my own, my 4mil widely distributed skill points in 100 or so skills will not last long in low sec. And as my earnings are too small to refit and re-insure ships which have even a small fighting chance the piretes limit the game I'm able to experience. Getting ganked in an unfamiliar territory is still too easy as you can't plot your own routes across Eve.
Tar om	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:13:00 - [45] The whole basis of EVE is that you can do what you want but you have to live with the consequences of your actions. If you can't handle being hunted, then don't hunt. Simple. -- We are the Octavian Vanguard www.octavianvanguard.net "The belief in the possibility of a short decisive war appears to be one of the most ancient and dangerous of human illusions."
Kaiowas	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:17:00 - [46] Edited by: Kaiowas on 13/01/2006 09:25:57 Originally by: Ginger Magician So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? What's the value added by killing industrial or noob ship in 0.4 ? Originally by: Siigari Kitawa turning EVE into a PVE game would take away almost ALL the exhiliration of the game. I think many of you are wrong. For you, easy kill is pvp but that's not true. The pvp don't comme with 150km sniper at a gate. With or without you, some pilot are still fighting or at war somewere in eve. Eve don't need piracy to provide pvp activity.
Pesadel0	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:17:00 - [47] Well i'am thinking of forming a 5 corp pirat corp and i will be ganking for the fun of it,i mean are only guys that ransom pirats?If i remember correctly in the eve box it says you can be everithing ,so ,i will RP a murdering pirate with my RL friends. P.S: It will be with my main...
Tar om	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:29:00 - [48] Originally by: Nyphur Probably not. I live in 0.0. If there was no risk of piracy, it wouldn't be special to be able live out there. Anyone and their dog could. Interesting viewpoint. ISS is neutral to just about everyone so you only have to worry about pirates. Infact pirates are the least threat, its enemy alliances that cause the most problems if you try and get into their space. Infact didn't ISS have to move out of a region because they fell out with BoB? - I can't see ISS leaving due to pirates. Pirates inhabit the border regions that no alliances are bothered with, they live off slim pickings. Once you get into alliance space you'll find that you're safer than in empire, as long as its a well run alliance and you're a member :) -- We are the Octavian Vanguard www.octavianvanguard.net "The belief in the possibility of a short decisive war appears to be one of the most ancient and dangerous of human illusions."
Jaketh Ivanes	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:36:00 - [49] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Duncan Storne Yes, I'd continue to play if there were no pirates. Although I do look forward to hunting pirates at some point, if they all leave the game I won't really be dissapointed. It looks like what you are complaining about is the possibility of retaliation when you are not prepared for it. I guess you missed the irony? So, you attacking other people when they are not prepared for it is fun, but when the roles are reversed, all of a sudden the game isn't fair anymore and you want to quit? And there, you just answered your own question. Somebody who does it solely for fun is a griefer - they get kicks out of killing defenceless ships. But piracy - real piracy - is a profession. It can be fun (although anybody who's done any amount of gate-camping may disagree) but a pirate is doing it for the cash. And at the minute that's impossible, thus the numerous 'piracy is dead' replys. Let me just get this right. Your whining because, if you pod someone, they get the rights to go and hunt you? If your after cash, you have absolutely no need to pod people.. just blow up their ship and steal their loot... Podding someone gives you what excatly? I see no nerf to pirates at all anywhere. You can still go around in 1.0 and steal loot/mining can's. Oh yes, your not protected by concord anymore, but thats just fair.
Gariuys	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:41:00 - [50] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Malka Badi'a The corps that died from the changes are the corps that refused to adapt. And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? Oh yes, use an alt to do all your industry work. How stupid of me. This has got the be the funniest thing I've ever seen anybody post.... ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool

Ishquar Teh'Sainte	Posted - 2006.01.13 09:56:00 - [51] british pirates in the caribean which hunted spanish galeons full of gold ... they didn't move to the spanish headquarters in the regions - they had their own hideouts and their own infrastructure - or they would be ganked to death by the spanish navy ... and that's the same with piracy in eve - you killed someone ... well, traveling to empire could be a risky business ... if you don't like this - prolly you can get someone to move the needed stuff to your homebase ... if you are an outlaw (at least for concorde) don't whine about the fact that you will be hunt down - eve is a game about interaction and consequences - deal with it __________________________ nerf puppies!!!!!!!!!!!!!! kittens 4 TEH WIN!!!!!!!!! __________________________
Aodha Khan	Posted - 2006.01.13 10:09:00 - [52] Edited by: Aodha Khan on 13/01/2006 10:10:29 I can't see any nerf to pirates? Can someone explain please. I was a pirate for a bit. Was quite profitable if you choose the right targets. Couldn't understand what everyone was complaining about. If there were no pirate in Eve the game would have lost one of its most interesting options imo. Not just for the pirate but for the targets too. So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
tyrol	Posted - 2006.01.13 10:24:00 - [53] personally, i think pirates add a bit of spice to a game, but only when done properly. If a pirate, or pirate gang found me in a belt in low sec space and either took me out or ransomed me, id take my hat off to them, theyve put the work into looking for me, thats good piracy. Now as for all those who sit 150km off a gate shooting all the nubs who fly past with very little risk to themselves, if they left the game i would be a happy man. And if your complainging about people having the right to kill you after you have blown up there ship and stolen all their goods, then your in the wrong profession, piracy in history was never a risk free business
Testy Mctest	Posted - 2006.01.13 10:28:00 - [54] Originally by: Ginger Magician Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:52 Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:09 Like the topic says this situation is soon to come about in EVE csuse of the recent nerfs to piracy which have resulted in a number of corps and well known pirates either changign their ways or becoming mostly inactive. Although it is ofc possible that new players will rise to replace them given the extreme hardship now faced by a career pirate it seems unlikely many will succeed. So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? Yes, because no piracy does not mean no PvP, it just means less blobcamping gates and popping haulers and barges. Thanks muchly to Harlequin D'Earth for my sig :)
Reite	Posted - 2006.01.13 10:36:00 - [55] Ahh, i so like your sig Testy
Time Killer	Posted - 2006.01.13 10:43:00 - [56] Sure I'd still play. PvP != pirating. There'd still be plenty of PvP that didn't revolve around getting gateblobbed in 0.4s - wars and stuff. It'd **** off newer players less too, not getting randomly ganked by the hordes of griefers using the 'but I'm a pirate too' excuse.
sonofollo	Posted - 2006.01.13 10:47:00 - [57] nah kiling or being a pirate is half th fun of the game gotta give u some reason to keep replacing ships or hunting em down Im a happy little camper now - CCP 4tw.
Rod Blaine	Posted - 2006.01.13 10:49:00 - [58] Originally by: GigaIndy As for quiting, if pirates disapeared i'd quit. If random gankers sitting 200k off of a gate killing 4 week old noobs in badgers. I wouldn't quit, i'd rejoice. Have to agree with this guy for a change. _______________________________________________ Power to the players !
Marcus Tedric	Posted - 2006.01.13 11:01:00 - [59] I think I got about halfway through this thread before I 'think' I got it... Let me get this right - this thread is about 'eye for an eye' and 'Kill Rights' yes? So how have PiRats been nerfed? I don't understand. Is this whole thread about the fact that someone who kills in 0.4 and below is then taking a risk by flying into empire from just the person he/she killed? For if it is, then OMG, a player has to live with the consequences of his actions!!! Wow, what a novel idea..... Sorry, I don't get it. I always do a little bit of RP in my games and am always rather 'Paladin'ish', so any form of piracy is 'bad' to me. Honest, trustworthy and loyal - it's just the way I play.... But I can think outside the box and think of applying what I am doing in game.... Once you become a PiRat you have decided to live 'outside the law' - ergo you choose to move out and live in 0.4 space or below - and you stay there. If you need stuff from empire, get someone to deliver it out to you! I don't like alts or multi-accounts, but they are options. But why not engage an independant trader to do dealings with? Someone who operates in Empire, but will come out to Low sec. Now me, I'd relish the opportunity to come trade in low sec, especially knowing that there's people who want me to come and would be there to both protect me and buy my wares. I may not be the one to support naughty PiRats - but I'm sure there are many who would dabble in the stolen goods brokerage game!
Chade Malloy	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:24:00 - [60] It happened to me just yestarday that i lost both a hauler full of supplies + the BS that flew escort to a well executed trap in 0.0 on the way to empire. The guy had a sec rating of +5.3, and was in npc corp, but nevertheless i was pulled out of warp by a bubble a few jumps b4 empire border. the guy cam at me from behind, seemed to have a bookmark to be right in firing range and owned the hauler + the BS with a short range blaster-nos-thron. I really didn¦t like that, but boy the adrenaline rush that flooded my body when i suddenly hit the bubble...there is no other game currently in existence that can cause these intense reactions in me, and i wouldnt want it any other way. Be careful in g-aoth DEVs break things by looking at them.

Darkdashing	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:32:00 - [61] Originally by: Ginger Magician Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:52 Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:09 Like the topic says this situation is soon to come about in EVE csuse of the recent nerfs to piracy which have resulted in a number of corps and well known pirates either changign their ways or becoming mostly inactive. Although it is ofc possible that new players will rise to replace them given the extreme hardship now faced by a career pirate it seems unlikely many will succeed. So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? I just joined the game right after RMR was released, can anyone briefly tell me what happened to nerf piracy or the fun of it? thanks There is beauty in tension....
Sarina Talglit	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:32:00 - [62] Ginger Magician is not a pirate. He is a ganker, usually hitting noobs in frigates. Happened to me, too. But yes, we all are worried about the ganker activities and the disappearance of the real pirates.
Einheriar Ulrich	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:33:00 - [63] Originally by: Rod Blaine Originally by: GigaIndy As for quiting, if pirates disapeared i'd quit. If random gankers sitting 200k off of a gate killing 4 week old noobs in badgers. I wouldn't quit, i'd rejoice. Have to agree with this guy for a change. yes rod, me to....Ginger stop sniping from 5 billlions km's away, and start active pirating
Skogen Gump	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:34:00 - [64] Edited by: Skogen Gump on 13/01/2006 13:37:12 Originally by: Nyphur Probably not. I live in 0.0. If there was no risk of piracy, it wouldn't be special to be able live out there. Anyone and their dog could. There's no such thing as Piracy in 0.0 However, I would love to know what the Op thinks that the nerf to piracy is ? Did they nerf Warp-core stabs or something ? EVE is like a box of chocolates
Galk	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:37:00 - [65] Ginger was local to us the other night moaning about sniping being a dead art now. I guess this is what this is all about. ______ 862 buses later, galks back on the road again:)
Rhodry Amarrian	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:47:00 - [66] I have only ever come across 1 "pirate", i.e. someone who would lock you down and ransom and a fair few griefers. TBH once you move out to 0.0 pirates are a total irrelevancy aside from a few opportunistic gankers using alt spies/cov ops/cloaked HACs and other such tactics to get the odd kill at zero risk. I cant see how removing such people from the game would hae any kind of a negative impact on anyones game play.
Butter Dog	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:47:00 - [67] I'd like to see more pirates. They make life in EVE fun, and silly players who don't take sensible precautions in lowsec/0.0 soon learn from their mistakes. As I'm an anti-pirate, they also give me something to do.
Velvet Ce'Nedra	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:57:00 - [68] I dont post here often, but wanted to answer this one... Yes, I would still play the game, and happily so, if pirates were history.
Verizana	Posted - 2006.01.13 13:59:00 - [69] Yo Ginger. Good ol' times eh :D heard you blew the large armor rep II BPO. Nice bang but bad for us though :) Pinja Pineapple!
Gariuys	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:01:00 - [70] Originally by: Einheriar Ulrich Originally by: Rod Blaine Originally by: GigaIndy As for quiting, if pirates disapeared i'd quit. If random gankers sitting 200k off of a gate killing 4 week old noobs in badgers. I wouldn't quit, i'd rejoice. Have to agree with this guy for a change. yes rod, me to....Ginger stop sniping from 5 billlions km's away, and start active pirating More fun for you, and lots more fun for the victims too. ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool

Brolly	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:12:00 - [71] Things would probably be the same, in low sec space you still have your ganking and pvp so not much would change really. It's only near empire in the low sec space you get rats and i'm rarely their these days so they don't really have an effect on my gameplay.
Pytria Le'Danness	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:14:00 - [72] Originally by: Duncan Storne It looks like what you are complaining about is the possibility of retaliation when you are not prepared for it. I guess you missed the irony? So, you attacking other people when they are not prepared for it is fun, but when the roles are reversed, all of a sudden the game isn't fair anymore and you want to quit? Echo that. I like the new kill rights. Two of my ships got blown up, once by two guys in HACs and once by three BS, with three of the five people being not outlaws. In RL I could call the police and they'd at least have a hard time with some questions. In EVE before kill rights, I had a few minutes to retaliate, most of which would be needed to get a ship capable of doing that. Now I have a month, and that means I can even get the skills needed to match them a bit. I actually like the added interaction this could bring. No longer is it "I just podded a n00b, k3wl, now I have to wait 15 mins before I return to empire and buy more ammo", now you actually have to worry that someone will return the favor if you go near him again. So if you are unwilling to risk that, you need to pay another player to fetch the stuff for you (though, knowing EVE, most will simply use a lame alt). I play a pirate hunter at the moment, so without them I would need to change plans a bit, but EVE is so large that there is always something you can try.
Secretary	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:25:00 - [73] History as i recall. (probably all lies and propaganda) In 'the good old days' it was possible to destroy sentry guns by gates and many a jolly roger would kill the sentries and then scramble innocent folk as they passed through demanding ransom for release. CCP made sentries indestructable. Not sure if folk took to sensor damping or target jamming the sentries at this point but the jolly rogers continued to ply their trade extorting money from honest traders through threats of violence. The pirates weren't happy, they did whine about those oppressive sentry guns but most adapted. CCP made the sentries unjammable, undampable and indestructable. Much wailing and wringing of hands (and hooks) followed. Gate camping gankers switched to tanking against the sentry damage and killing everything that passed. operating solo or in groups the jolly rogers would use ultra damage / instalock sniper ships to kill everything. Not sure what the point was, they were hoping people would add to the bounty or something. May have been at this point that zombie corp demonstrated a slight flaw in the mechanics of gang assist modules in yulai. I was mostly operating in 0.0 space at this point so blockade running was my only contact with the jolly rogers. I took a break from eve so didn't really care what terrible injustices were befalling pirates. far as i know during the cold war map changes the fastest routes between empires were low sec systems... which is sort of an invitation for pirates to operate on fat trade routes. Not sure what the pirates whined about relating to that but i'm sure there was something just not right for them. RMR brought about the kill rights or 'i'm gonna shoot you for what you did to my predecessor' . much wailing and wringing of hooks. So now people who choose to ply their trade of mass indescrimintae slaughter for profit have to watch their backs all the time. big deal. To answer the original question... I'll play eve as long as it holds my interest. The existence of 'career pirates' makes no difference to my game experience. Lots of people want to kill me, some call themselves soldiers, some agents of vengeance for a long dead grudge, others call themselves mercenaries some may even consider themselves pirates but whatever they call themselves they're just enemies and i doubt the lack of health and dental that goes with their self proclaimed job title will stop them being my enemies.
Rogue Roy	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:33:00 - [74] I would continue to play EVE but it would be a very different kind of game. The presence of pilot piracy does give you a thrill and in low-sec you should watch your back in any case. Apart from 0.0, EVE without pirates would be mostly an economy simulation. However, I have not noticed any reduction in the number of pirates around. Which is fine by me
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:34:00 - [75] Well some interesting reponses. It seems a small majority are not concerned that piracy is dying out and will continue to play EVE regardless.A number of you have asked what nerfs - if your not a pirate u wont really understand these nerfs so i wont bore u with techical details but the fact is rmr was the biggest nerf to piracy there has ever been hence the dying out of the profession. As it stands however u can rest assured that the continual nerfs to piracy and the lack of any postive encouragement whatsoever will mean there will be almost no pirates in 0.1 to 0.4 within a few months.Whether that actually matters or not remains to be seen. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Skogen Gump	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:40:00 - [76] I agree that losing Pirates all together would be a sad sad loss to the vibrant and dynamic universe that is EVE Online. However, I wil celebrate the day that the combined nerfs drive the Gankers, Griefers and Cowards away. EVE is like a box of chocolates
Chrizto	Posted - 2006.01.13 14:50:00 - [77] Yes, i don't come across them often except for chokepoints where they are a real pain in the ass sometimes. ----
Jamius	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:00:00 - [78] I have been a pirate for a few months. I belt hunt and now and then sit at a gate and see if I get lucky with a juicy hauler coming through. I see it that I do something sh!tty to others so my life in Eve should hence be difficult. Fair enough I suppose. I can still be a pirate quite happily and tbh it's about the only way I can have fun in Eve without it feeling like a 2nd job. Everything you want to do in Eve requires far too much effort for too little reward and too much risk. Piracy is about as close as I could find to a happy medium. I am genuinely sorry when my actions p!ss off other people as I am a friendly guy but blame the people that designed this game we love, not me. My hand was forced, quit or be a pirate. I have actually quit but until my account expires I am a pirate. From what I have historically heard it's the pirates fault for all the nerfs to piracy and theirs alone anyway. They took advantage of the way Eve worked and forced the changes. It was like they were stress testers of the game mechanics. "Look what I can do" they said, aren't I clever. CCP did look, probably agreed they are clever then realised they had to change the game to keep it as what they envisioned. To put it bluntly pirates took the p!ss and payed for it. Serves them right. Piracy will not disappear anyway. Maybe for those that remember the "good ol days" where they could exploit the game mechanics massively to their own needs piracy is dead. For me it's the best fun I can extract from Eve and I'll continue doing it until my accounts expire.
Snake Jankins	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:05:00 - [79] Edited by: Snake Jankins on 13/01/2006 15:05:10 I don't know how it is now, but imho low sec. space is meant to be inhabited by pirates. That's how I understand it since I read that there is are different security levels on my first eve day and that eve has non-consensual pvp. But I'd like to see more close-range action and less sniping. If EVE doesn't allow that in low sec at the moment, then the system is broken imho. ___________ 'Only ships can be assembled, this is a Frigate.'
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:20:00 - [80] Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 15:22:00 Originally by: Hohenheim OfLight This has top be really a stupid question you can answer it your self in two seconds, all yo have to do is look at the map see th 70% of people in empire avoding pierates at all costs, never leaving empire. Now ask your self would these people still play if they could go to low sec and mine safe in the knowledge that the only thing likley to kill them is a belt rat, hell yes they would. Pierats are the problem not the soulttion. PVP will contuine in war decs, with out griffer pierat scum. And thats what most pierats are, a group who i wont name here recentley, delbrtley spent all the time going after my ceo over and over and over again untill he quit eve (dont ask me why he did just no got back to high sec). I say good ridens to bad rubish. Is this us! If this is us then boohoo, seriously we do not go out looking to grief people, if he was caught multiple times its because he knowingly took the risk or else was to stupid to learn. Check out the ATUF Kb, we take risks to get kills and die to, all our losses are there. Pirates are not gods... Piracy is supposed to be a profession, unfortunately the tools arent there. Im refering to low sec piracy hence the outlaw thing. I know pirates are a minority and all but we pay are subs to, be nice to be given some tools for piracy even if nothing else was changed. A ransoming tool for eg: What people want is their ships kept safe, we dont want miner2s we want the ships worth i.e. insurance and ofc pod. Be nice if there was a strike colours option were if your caught you use it, we cant kill you but your ships disabled and your given the options i,e, we will say 50m in a wee box, you can accept or reject. Accept then you can go on your merry way. I dont know whether you should be invulnerable or else eve being the sandbox it is you can be shot at and killed and then the "pirate" would be flagged as not upholding ransoms in his bio or something. I say "pirate" as thats obviously a griefer.... Those that dont like piracy could set it so that all ransom demands are rejected, hell even a wee message could pop up in the log "Arr a good captain goes down with his ship" But yeah i guess that cos its not a big enough profession it will get ignored like bounty hunting... To get anything in this game you have to be a carebear or in an alliance. Blehs were did I put my basic miners...

Ayla Vanir	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:24:00 - [81] Quote: Would you still play EVE if there were no pirates? Yes. I personally am more interested in seeing things develop from Cold War, to Red Moon Rising, to "KALI" - where players' primary objectives shift towards an actual war. Pirating in EVE is some kind of Jekyll-Hyde monstrosity, where it seems one side's idea of pirating is simply to lay in wait for passersby, and another side's idea is something a bit more immersive. Personally, I'd like to see a bit more 'privateering', inline with content/storyline changes that are supposed to bring us to some kind of factional war in the coming months/year. For example, I'd just love, for once, to see organized Caldari go raid Gallente trade routes in some sort of unofficially sanctioned privateering effort designed to weaken/disturb the enemies of The Caldari State. Escrow Market Revamp
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:29:00 - [82] Originally by: Jakk Graiseach I really don't see a problem with the new eye-for-an-eye legislation in game. It seems a logical way forward to allow players the opportunity to exact vengeance for their losses. I think the unrealistic view would be that of expecting to destroy someone's ship and then be able to fly past them waving sarcastically in empire, protected by Concord - which is how it used to be. As to other 'nerfs' to piracy, what might they be? You can use warp bubbles for gate camps, interdictors when you want to catch someone without a bubble, they can't insta-log off once they've been in combat with you any more, etc. Seems to me that CCP is aiming for a balance and that the only 'pirates' who will be upset by the changes are the ones who want an 'I WIN' button and like to throw their toys out of the pram every time something is added to give their victims a miniscule chance to fight back. Because it isn't giving them a chance to fight back. Eye for an eye lets them get revenge, which while good, makes piracy laughably unprofitable as a profession. Thus only the griefers are left. Sec hits don't let you fight back, they just punish you. Sentry guns don't let you fight back, they protect you. Inability to raise sec status doesn't let you fight back, it just punishes the pirate more. Etc. Etc. Oh, and BTW, warp bubbles and interdictors only work in 0.0. You can't pirate in 0.0; you can't be an outlaw where there are no laws. But yes, I guess we got the logout timer. Whoop-ti-***ing-do. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...*
Hysenthlay	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:31:00 - [83] Originally by: Duncan Storne Yes, I'd continue to play if there were no pirates. Although I do look forward to hunting pirates at some point, if they all leave the game I won't really be dissapointed. It looks like what you are complaining about is the possibility of retaliation when you are not prepared for it. I guess you missed the irony? So, you attacking other people when they are not prepared for it is fun, but when the roles are reversed, all of a sudden the game isn't fair anymore and you want to quit? what he said... 's are fun but when the tables turned they cry? Roughneck Mining at its best...
Kaaii	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:33:00 - [84] "You keep using that word, I don't think it means what you think it means...." --Inegio Montoya "..Id rather fall beside 10 lions, than stand with One thousand sheep.."
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:35:00 - [85] Originally by: Kuolematon QTF, seriously. Piwates (Let's not call 'em pirates because pirates, those who hunts alone for prey in belts in low sec are those who can stay) can just vanish. If your doing your CAREBEAR playstyle where you sit 200km from gate and gank people with low to NONE risk, please quit this game. They're not piwates, they're gankers. As you said, piracy in belts is good, and when you explain to me how all the recent nerfs don't affect belt piracy and only gankers, I'll happily shut up. The problem is, the recent nerfs should be affecting the asshats who blow **** up indescriminately for a laugh, not the belt pirates. But these nerfs seem to be doing exactly the opposite. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Fooball	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:39:00 - [86] I have been only in the receiving side so far.. But it has been funnier moving in dangerous places thanks to those pierats trying to hunt me down It would be bad if the lower sec wasn't dangerous anymore. Imho we'd need more honest professional pierats. Also I think the sniping the gates is mostly like masturbating and should lead into a lightning bolt striking the snipers. It's utterly lame stuff to do.
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:40:00 - [87] Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Duncan Storne Yes, I'd continue to play if there were no pirates. Although I do look forward to hunting pirates at some point, if they all leave the game I won't really be dissapointed. It looks like what you are complaining about is the possibility of retaliation when you are not prepared for it. I guess you missed the irony? So, you attacking other people when they are not prepared for it is fun, but when the roles are reversed, all of a sudden the game isn't fair anymore and you want to quit? And there, you just answered your own question. Somebody who does it solely for fun is a griefer - they get kicks out of killing defenceless ships. But piracy - real piracy - is a profession. It can be fun (although anybody who's done any amount of gate-camping may disagree) but a pirate is doing it for the cash. And at the minute that's impossible, thus the numerous 'piracy is dead' replys. Let me just get this right. Your whining because, if you pod someone, they get the rights to go and hunt you? If your after cash, you have absolutely no need to pod people.. just blow up their ship and steal their loot... Podding someone gives you what excatly? I see no nerf to pirates at all anywhere. You can still go around in 1.0 and steal loot/mining can's. Oh yes, your not protected by concord anymore, but thats just fair. I could leave it at that, but; a) Eye for an eye works for any kills - not just pods. b) I don't ore thief. I don't even know what orifice you pulled that one out of... ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Filan	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:41:00 - [88] heh i lost a cruiser to a belt prat, sadly i dunno if he was gank or prat. but atleast in the belts i knew it was my fault for not being prepaired to pvp(still got his ass to 50% structure, not bad for heavy missles vs an intercepter). im only against gate gankers, if im in the belts i should be watching local, sensors and have my warp drive ready or be ready fight. upside is after learning the hard way i now keep a webber and painter on my Caracal. dunno if i should fit a scram as well or not.
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:42:00 - [89] Originally by: Ishquar Teh'Sainte british pirates in the caribean which hunted spanish galeons full of gold ... they didn't move to the spanish headquarters in the regions - they had their own hideouts and their own infrastructure - or they would be ganked to death by the spanish navy ... and that's the same with piracy in eve - you killed someone ... well, traveling to empire could be a risky business ... if you don't like this - prolly you can get someone to move the needed stuff to your homebase ... if you are an outlaw (at least for concorde) don't whine about the fact that you will be hunt down - eve is a game about interaction and consequences - deal with it Yup, that's certainly what sec hits do. Sec hits that have been in the game since day one. Sec hits which cleary aren't relevant here. We're talking about new nerfs, try to keep up. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:46:00 - [90] your saying that snipers and gate gankers arent pirates but they are: its just an industrial method of making isk I havent done it in months but it is more profitable than belts, and certainly if we are enroute to a somewere and we see a BS we can get we will agress it but yeah belt piracy should be were its at...so i guess the option would be to delay local or else remove the timer or both Thing is why do we have the timer in the 1st place...to let people fight back...but thats rubbish as all pirates safespot or hunt in the belts anyways...

Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:47:00 - [91] Originally by: Chinsor Well i don't see the eye for an eye thing as being a nerf to pirating, it will just filter out those not so good pirates, the better pirates adapt, meaning that in the long run piracy in eve is likely to become a more honourable and skilled profession, the time of angry teenagers going into belts and blowing people away without consequence is over. And don't you think that there's just a slight outside chance that instead, people will just use alts to pirate with and to hell with consequences? ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Gariuys	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:59:00 - [92] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Chinsor Well i don't see the eye for an eye thing as being a nerf to pirating, it will just filter out those not so good pirates, the better pirates adapt, meaning that in the long run piracy in eve is likely to become a more honourable and skilled profession, the time of angry teenagers going into belts and blowing people away without consequence is over. And don't you think that there's just a slight outside chance that instead, people will just use alts to pirate with and to hell with consequences? You mean that alt that can't fly anything over a standard t1 frig, and as such really isn't much of a threat. Or that 20mil alt, which by all means is just another main. Don't care which char people pirate with, most anyone will have another account. And whether pirate with the first or the 2nd is completely irrelevant. ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 15:59:00 - [93] Originally by: Snake Jankins Edited by: Snake Jankins on 13/01/2006 15:09:40 Edited by: Snake Jankins on 13/01/2006 15:05:10 I don't know how it is now, but imho low sec. space is meant to be inhabited by pirates. That's how I understand it since I read that there is are different security levels on my first eve day and that eve has non-consensual pvp. But I'd like to see more close-range action and less sniping. If EVE doesn't allow that in low sec at the moment, then the system is broken imho. edit: One problem is that people expect to be able to go anywhere with an unsecured indi on their own at lowest risk, even in low sec. Some would like to see that even for 0.0. In the beginning CCP created high sec and low sec. Lo, high sec had CONCORD and low sec didn't. CCP saw this, and it was good. But the 'bears whined. And thus CCP said let there be sentries; and they nerfed the gate-ransoming by forcing all pirates to either snipe outside sentry range or kill before sentries wore them down. And CCP saw that this was not good, but they were 'tards, and didn't change it. The end. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 16:01:00 - [94] Originally by: Gariuys Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Chinsor Well i don't see the eye for an eye thing as being a nerf to pirating, it will just filter out those not so good pirates, the better pirates adapt, meaning that in the long run piracy in eve is likely to become a more honourable and skilled profession, the time of angry teenagers going into belts and blowing people away without consequence is over. And don't you think that there's just a slight outside chance that instead, people will just use alts to pirate with and to hell with consequences? You mean that alt that can't fly anything over a standard t1 frig, and as such really isn't much of a threat. Or that 20mil alt, which by all means is just another main. Don't care which char people pirate with, most anyone will have another account. And whether pirate with the first or the 2nd is completely irrelevant. So you don't see anything wrong with a nerf that forces all pirates to pirate on a second account? Personally, I only have one account, one character. Are you saying I have to pay for a second account all of a sudden because of changes to the game? ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
FireFoxx80	Posted - 2006.01.13 16:11:00 - [95] The problem is that 99% of players know not to hang around alone in 0.1-0.4 near belts or planets. I believe the exception to this rule is organised mining ops, and NPC hunters with decent setups. Solo piracy in 0.1-0.4 has effectively lowered itself to sniper shots, smartbombs, and general ganking. However, I hear good things about TUNDRAGON, whom I would suspect shield boost and sensor boost one another to avoid sentry guns. 23? # Missile Tool # ex: P-TMC : USAC
Lt Hole	Posted - 2006.01.13 16:35:00 - [96] Originally by: Ginger Magician So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? So it's hard now and people can fight back? Bummer. Man, I feel for you. Someone should call CCP and explain the problem. Ginger can't get easy kills. This needs to be fixed right away.
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.13 16:37:00 - [97] Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 16:37:18 Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Ginger Magician So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? So it's hard now and people can fight back? Bummer. Man, I feel for you. Someone should call CCP and explain the problem. Ginger can't get easy kills. This needs to be fixed right away. Nice flame but I believe hes saying that if there were no pirates to kill
Lt Hole	Posted - 2006.01.13 16:56:00 - [98] Originally by: Velsharoon Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 16:37:18 Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Ginger Magician So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? So it's hard now and people can fight back? Bummer. Man, I feel for you. Someone should call CCP and explain the problem. Ginger can't get easy kills. This needs to be fixed right away. Nice flame but I believe hes saying that if there were no pirates to kill Uh, no. He's saying he can't get easy kills with an "I WIN!" button now. But maybe those words I set in bold type confused you a bit and you just didn't get it. Sorry about that.
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:02:00 - [99] Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Velsharoon Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 16:37:18 Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Ginger Magician So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? So it's hard now and people can fight back? Bummer. Man, I feel for you. Someone should call CCP and explain the problem. Ginger can't get easy kills. This needs to be fixed right away. Nice flame but I believe hes saying that if there were no pirates to kill Uh, no. He's saying he can't get easy kills with an "I WIN!" button now. I fail to see how eye-for-an-eye would remove any supposed "I-WIN" buttons he has. But hey, don't let stupid things like logic or facts stop you from posting - it hasn't so far! Quote: But maybe those words I set in bold type confused you a bit and you just didn't get it. Sorry about that. You could also try posting in caps with lots of exclamation marks, it'd suit you. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:14:00 - [100] I'm fairly new to this game, but from what I've read here and in game, there seems to be some fundamental flaws with piracy. I like PvP, but I believe that ganking should never be a part of any game. I think the player should always have either the chance to fight back or escape. From what I'm reading of piracy, it's quite lacking. It falls into two categories, neither of which I think is right. Either "gank and pick up the pieces" or "scramble and ransom". I have an idea that I believe would be more interesting. I suggest tieing a ship's speed and it's current weight, including cargo. An Indy or whatever should, in fact, be a speed demon when its cargo hold is empty. After all, thrust is thrust. The idea of piracy should be to force the transport to dump his cargo. The Indy pilot, upon seeing pirates, should have to think to himself "Do I dump the cargo and run?" Independence War 2's piracy system worked like that. You shoot the hauler a few times and the pilot says something like "No cargo is worth my life", jettisoning their cargo for you to pick up. The pirate gets their loot and the hauler leaves with their ship intact. Maybe that's a "carebear" approach to pirating, I don't know. I do know that I don't like the grief that ganking generally creates. Frustration is not something that should be engendered in a game to be played for recreation. I find the more even battles to be far more fun. Two fleets going at it over territory or whatnot is a great thing. Camping a gate is not. Another thing missing seems to be missing is NPC haulers. I've seen a few sitting around stations, but I think it would be much cooler if they really transported things from station to station, giving pirates more targets.

Lt Hole	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:24:00 - [101] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Velsharoon Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 16:37:18 Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Ginger Magician So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? So it's hard now and people can fight back? Bummer. Man, I feel for you. Someone should call CCP and explain the problem. Ginger can't get easy kills. This needs to be fixed right away. Nice flame but I believe hes saying that if there were no pirates to kill Uh, no. He's saying he can't get easy kills with an "I WIN!" button now. I fail to see how eye-for-an-eye would remove any supposed "I-WIN" buttons he has. But hey, don't let stupid things like logic or facts stop you from posting - it hasn't so far! Quote: But maybe those words I set in bold type confused you a bit and you just didn't get it. Sorry about that. You could also try posting in caps with lots of exclamation marks, it'd suit you. If that would help you understand what this post is really about you have my permission to retype it and change all the letters to capitals. I'd go light on the exclamation marks though. People that bring exclamation marks into the conversation generally look silly.
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:30:00 - [102] Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 17:30:32 Well having read his post again he is actually saying what will everyone do when theres no pirates to kill. So I understand just well thanks.
Butter Dog	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:30:00 - [103] Originally by: Snake Jankins Edited by: Snake Jankins on 13/01/2006 15:09:40 Edited by: Snake Jankins on 13/01/2006 15:05:10 I don't know how it is now, but imho low sec. space is meant to be inhabited by pirates. That's how I understand it since I read that there is are different security levels on my first eve day and that eve has non-consensual pvp. But I'd like to see more close-range action and less sniping. If EVE doesn't allow that in low sec at the moment, then the system is broken imho. edit: One problem is that people expect to be able to go anywhere with an unsecured indi on their own at lowest risk, even in low sec. Some would like to see that even for 0.0. Nothing is 'meant' to be in EVE. We have been given a blank canvass - it is what we make it. There is the opportunity to pirate in lowsec, that is true - but there is also the opportunity to anti-pirate and counter that threat. Thats where the PVP comes in. Piracy isnt dying out, its just that most pirates have problems with anything other than a defenceless barge, and gimp their setups with WCS and avoid a fight. Adapt and survive, but I guess thats beyond the comprehension of most low-level pirates. Some pirates are good at what they do, and I respect them. Most are just terrible.
Butter Dog	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:33:00 - [104] Originally by: David Sinclair I'm fairly new to this game, but from what I've read here and in game, there seems to be some fundamental flaws with piracy. I like PvP, but I believe that ganking should never be a part of any game. I think the player should always have either the chance to fight back or escape. ... Another thing missing seems to be missing is NPC haulers. I've seen a few sitting around stations, but I think it would be much cooler if they really transported things from station to station, giving pirates more targets. You always have a chance to fight or escape - though sometimes pirates will deprive you of that chance if they are good enough. Its also easy to avoid being pirated in the first place but most players are too lazy to bother with simple precautions. Regarding the second point - this already happens.
Kalixa Hihro	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:53:00 - [105] Originally by: Ginger Magician recent nerfs to piracy which have resulted in a number of corps and well known pirates either changign their ways or becoming mostly inactive. So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? First you need to define pirate. The term is often mis-used to mean any player that pvp's or shoots at people in low sec space or is "bad". Some people call ore theives pirates. In the truest sense of the word, a pirate is one who steals your cargo and ransoms you, often with death and ship loss resulting if you fail to comply with their demands. People that go around looking for a fight or killing everyone they see are not pirates, they just want pvp action. Then once you define pirate, you need to tell me what got nerfed LOL. I still see snipers, gate camps etc, so I am not aware of any nerf per se. If anything, it's getting easier with the new interdiction ships... They can just **** warp bubbles out. No teardown and setup time as far as I know. I saw a sniper tempest yesterday 204km away solo. If he can hit me from that far away, there is nothing broke. I think some pirates are changing their ways simply because of the number of people hunting them, people are learning how to outsmart them, and the fact that it's not all that profitable. Have you ever done a gate camp? it's boring and dangerous if you are in the wrong place when an alliance is moving freighters. There will always be pirates.... yarr -Kal
Kyoto Luyi	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:57:00 - [106] There is no chance there will ever be an EVE without pirates. Certain styles of gameplay may be restricted, but piracy only needs open PvP areas and a lack of major Concord interference. I don't see 0,0 or lowsec suddenly becoming ultrasafe. Bit like UO - they added 'empire' (Trammel) but Fel was always there for anyone who wanted a real fight instead of *****ing around in 'empire' pretending to be a real PK.
Lt Hole	Posted - 2006.01.13 17:58:00 - [107] Originally by: Velsharoon Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 17:30:32 Well having read his post again he is actually saying what will everyone do when theres no pirates to kill. So I understand just well thanks. No you don't. That's the smokescreen to cover the whine. Dig deeper. Exercise those brain cells. Here, maybe this will help. Pirates aren't going anywhere and they're in no danger of being nerfed out of existence. What has happened is that CCP made it hard for Ginger to wack helpless targets. Ginger is upset. He liked his old methods for ganking without being in danger. Now he's trying to pretend something bad is wrong and pirates are in danger of being removed from the game unless they are un-nerfed. Rubbish. Pirates can still pirate. You can still kill people in Empire and get away with it. But now the game is a little fairer and the pirates have to be a little more cunning. Ginger doesn't want to be more cunning. He wants easy and without danger. He even said it in his original post. You know, the one I quoted and set key words in bold. So really, do you think this post is about playing without pirates or is it a Ginger whine about a game change that he doesn't want to adapt too?
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:00:00 - [108] Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 18:00:13 Originally by: Kalixa Hihro Edited by: Kalixa Hihro on 13/01/2006 17:57:28 Originally by: Ginger Magician recent nerfs to piracy which have resulted in a number of corps and well known pirates either changign their ways or becoming mostly inactive. So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? First you need to define pirate. The term is often mis-used to mean any player that pvp's or shoots at people in low sec space or is "bad". Some people call ore theives pirates. In the truest sense of the word, a pirate is one who steals your cargo and ransoms you, often with death and ship loss resulting if you fail to comply with their demands. People that go around looking for a fight or killing everyone they see are not pirates, they just want pvp action. Then once you define pirate, you need to tell me what got nerfed LOL. I still see snipers, gate camps etc, so I am not aware of any nerf per se. If anything, it's getting easier with the new interdiction ships... They can just **** warp bubbles out. No teardown and setup time as far as I know. I saw a sniper tempest yesterday 204km away from a gate solo. If he can hit me from that far away, there is nothing broke. I think some pirates are changing their ways simply because of the number of people hunting them, people are learning how to outsmart them, and the fact that it's not all that profitable. Have you ever done a gate camp? it's boring and dangerous if you are in the wrong place when an alliance is moving freighters. There will always be pirates.... yarr -Kal Sorry to say but that is most ignorant post in the whole of this thread.If u know nothing about a subject its normally better u keep your mouth closed "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
ParMizaN	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:00:00 - [109] There have not been many "real" pirates for a long time.. only gate gakers (meh) and snipers (i want them all to die slowly and painfully) Game mechanics ruined people being in belts so it effectively ruined pirac in its original form Phenomena of ironies, cast the litany aside How intelligible, blessed be the forgetful
Lt Hole	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:02:00 - [110] Originally by: Ginger Magician If u know nothing about a subject its normally better u keep your mouth closed Good words of advice that you don't seem to be able to follow.

Sirkill	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:06:00 - [111] Surely E4E would help pirates, I mean if your a full time pirate you get locked out of high security pretty fast, all E4E really does is provide you with a stream of any carebears in their most expensive ship comming out into low sec to kill you, since most of these angry carebears have never pvp'd in their life they should die pretty quick if you have any pvp set up, which being a pirate you should have.
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:06:00 - [112] Originally by: Kyoto Luyi There is no chance there will ever be an EVE without pirates. Certain styles of gameplay may be restricted, but piracy only needs open PvP areas and a lack of major Concord interference. I don't see 0,0 or lowsec suddenly becoming ultrasafe. Bit like UO - they added 'empire' (Trammel) but Fel was always there for anyone who wanted a real fight instead of *****ing around in 'empire' pretending to be a real PK. U misunderstand the premise of my thread.I have never said that there will be no more PVP especially in 0.0 which is totally unaffected by these changes.And of course empire wars will continue.What we are discussing in piracy in 0.1 to 0.4 space.That is what has changed and is changing right now on TQ. If there r no pirates in 0.1 to 0.4 will u still play EVE - that is the question or conversely assuming 0.1 to 0.4 has no pirates is this really a change for the better in the running of EVE - discuss "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:12:00 - [113] Originally by: Sirkill Surely E4E would help pirates, I mean if your a full time pirate you get locked out of high security pretty fast, all E4E really does is provide you with a stream of any carebears in their most expensive ship comming out into low sec to kill you, since most of these angry carebears have never pvp'd in their life they should die pretty quick if you have any pvp set up, which being a pirate you should have. Eye for an eye is complete rubbish as if your any sort of pirate you are outlawed, total waste of programing
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:18:00 - [114] Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 18:20:10 Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Velsharoon Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 17:30:32 Well having read his post again he is actually saying what will everyone do when theres no pirates to kill. So I understand just well thanks. No you don't. That's the smokescreen to cover the whine. Dig deeper. Exercise those brain cells. Here, maybe this will help. Pirates aren't going anywhere and they're in no danger of being nerfed out of existence. What has happened is that CCP made it hard for Ginger to wack helpless targets. Ginger is upset. He liked his old methods for ganking without being in danger. Now he's trying to pretend something bad is wrong and pirates are in danger of being removed from the game unless they are un-nerfed. Rubbish. Pirates can still pirate. You can still kill people in Empire and get away with it. But now the game is a little fairer and the pirates have to be a little more cunning. Ginger doesn't want to be more cunning. He wants easy and without danger. He even said it in his original post. You know, the one I quoted and set key words in bold. So really, do you think this post is about playing without pirates or is it a Ginger whine about a game change that he doesn't want to adapt too? My brain cells are fine thanks, believe me I have no love for ginger as hes an obnoxious ***** he demands attention for his 1337ness. However hes asking what you would do if there wasnt any -10 people quite clearly, so stop bolding stuff and trying to criticise an argument which isnt there. I know we arent going anywere, im happily pirating away thank you very much ^^. What I dont like is the lack of support ccp has given us. The game isnt any fairer at all, its just getting worse for the 'bears imho. As usual little fixes and boosts are having un intended affects (like hp boost, who does it help more an indy which still is one volied by a BS or the pirate who can tank that lil bit longer) Your just criticising him cos its him :/ Edit: I do see your point I really do but this is about piracy as a profession...
Hanan Lazaar	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:40:00 - [115] I would not miss anything without pirates, but they also don't bother me much. But, if you decide to become a pirate, you should also accept to be outlawed. As in former times when you have been a pirate and your business was to bring down ships and steel the goods, than everybody was allowed to kill you at any time at any place. I think there shouldn't be a safe place for pirates.
Kaylana Syi	Posted - 2006.01.13 18:58:00 - [116] The rift is that it is harder to be a pirate than it is to be a carebear from the beginning. Such has it been throughout history. I think the whining has shifted. Without carebears there would be no piracy. Without pirates there would ... wait there were never many real pirates in this game. Their have been and always will be decietful, underhanded, oportunistic griefers that live and die for PvP. So I think its a loaded question. Their are tools for piracy its just more tedious than being a corporate fleet pilot or carebear quadzillionare. Originally by: "Oveur" I don't react to threats any better than you do
Amaii Templ	Posted - 2006.01.14 07:37:00 - [117] Edited by: Amaii Templ on 14/01/2006 07:37:20 What would I do with no more pirates? I would laugh. I would scream. I would raise calamatous joy from the EvE gate to the Jovian Empire. I would dance naked in Jita (An act which would surely drive more players away from EvE than the quitting of the pirates ever did.) Here's the 'carebear' perspective. You want to know why 70% of the population is in Empire? Ginger is why. We can't afford to lose our ** in a random ganking. We can't afford to lose our crap because some jerkwad was bored and nailed the stuffing out of us while we were warping into a gate. We can't afford it, so we do what comes naturally - we don't put ourselves in that danger. Those who want to kill me, though I've done nothing to them, cry about this. Buhu, take away CONCORD... @#^@ you! My money's as green as yours (assuming your money, like mine, is USD.) I'm paying for MY fun, not your fun. When you pay for my account, then you can gank me. I don't think CCP went far enough. Eye for an Eye is nice, but it requires I have the ability to take my own eye. I don't. Eye for an Eye should be enforced by CONCORD. You kill my ship in Lowsec? CONCORD kills you the moment you pop on their radar. You pop my pod? May whatever diety you revere have mercy on you, because CONCORD is fryin' up a big ole' pirate omlette when they see you. There's a reason that they used to hang pirates on the river Thames, and above the harbor of every British colony. If you choose to pirate, you are taking your life into your own hands. If the authorities catch you, they will have no mercy on your butt. Let's just call a spade a spade, shall we? Piracy isen't about killing and fragging and popping pods. Those things are unprofitable - especially popping pods. Those are the activity of the griefer. Piracy is about making money. The post about dropping your cargo and running like a speed demon is exactly right. That** is what a real pirate wants. He dosen't want to spill your blood, to clash swords or lasers with you. He dosen't want or need it. He wants your cargo, and that's it. Anything else is griefing. So be a real pirate. Get your profit and let me go. Or be a griefer, but either way the result is the same. You better not ever come back to Empire. That's how I'd do it. Oh, and because Pirates like the 'thrill', let's give them a thrill. Random CONCORD pirate-hunting convoys that go through lowsec every now and then, scan the system, then warp in to give you a CONCORD-DOKEN. To be fair, this shoulden't be your 1.0-level CONCORD-Wins button, but it should be death for most pirates who fail to run away in time. That's what happened if His Majesty's Navy caught you, after all. :)
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.14 08:18:00 - [118] Yeah baby your right 1.All pirates r greifer scumbags 2.Concord should be able to kill u in low sec and pop your pod 3.make sentry gun ranges unlimited 4.increase sentry damge so u die in one pop in a titan. etc,etc,etc On a more realistic note it would be nice to get a dev reply to this thead.There has been a lot of interest in it and given that piracy has no had a single word from devs in like a year would be interesting to hear what they think is the future of piracy IMO its very bleak indeed right now. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Syme	Posted - 2006.01.14 09:09:00 - [119] Ginger As one of your recent victims I can only concur that the removal of rates would ruin the game. It was an absolute pleasure to be blown up by you. I can see that rating in low sec space will become a less attractive career option but that is because more players are moving into it rather than because of a nerf in mechanics. If the Eve population makes rating less practical through its actions then perhaps we are seeing the natural development of a society seeking more security for itself.
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.14 09:33:00 - [120] adice to pirate affected by E4E in high sec 1)add the people you killed to your address book, 2)keep an eye in local..if you see some on who can kill you in local go to ss or dock 3) if needing to haul work in a group have a some of your friends come with you or haul for you this is a MMO after all and not a "happy happy joy joy" place where you can fly about with impunity as a single player all the time..that is what coprs are for 4)make sure you always have a set up ready to fight 5) adapt or die a bit simillar to the adivce pirates always gave carebears when going to low sec..they do say you always become the thing you hate..seems their right after all Now as to the death of pirace been the death of all excitment and pvp in eve..get real Piracy is only responsible for a small part of PVP...PVP will live on as strong as always with or without piracy. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept

Lo3d3R	Posted - 2006.01.14 09:39:00 - [121] pirates entertain people, no more pirates sure your hauler get threw everytime safe and sound, no more excitement no more adrenaline no more victory feeling when you kill the said pirate or escape from its attack, no more chasing around, becarefull what you wish for...
Ukucia	Posted - 2006.01.14 09:47:00 - [122] Originally by: Amaii Templ Let's just call a spade a spade, shall we? Piracy isen't about killing and fragging and popping pods. Those things are unprofitable - especially popping pods. Those are the activity of the griefer. Piracy is about making money. While the rest of the rant is a tad extreme, I gotta agree with this point. As soon as you shoot the pod, you're no longer a pirate.
Zirator	Posted - 2006.01.14 10:00:00 - [123] First of all I would like to say that I'm happy that there are pirates in this game. Makes the game fun and exciting in my opinion. But I read people here complaining about the fact that the eye for an eye system is in place now after RMR. And that they worry about not being able to haul their stuff into Empire anymore because they might get ganked by a victim of them. Well gues what welcome in the world of the non-pirates. We constantly run the risk of getting ganked in low sec. And now the pirate is facing the same danger. Oh noes If your complaining that you can't move into high sec anymore you aren't even allowed to call yourself a pirate. At least true outlaws pirate and pod people but they can at least handle the consequences. People who like to pirate but keep their sec rating up by hunting beltrats are the true griefers here cause they want to PK people but can't handle the downside of it. Sounds to me that we've spotted a new group of carebears.
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.14 10:35:00 - [124] Being -5 or more has always been extremely difficult and now its even more so.Thats why u c a lot of people in the game who have tried pirating and gone to -5 or more but have now got their ss back up again.TBH even myself without a carebear alt who can travel anywhere in EVE would be unable to continue in the piracy career. There r only a very few hardcore pvpers/pirates who can continue to play with any enjoyment while more than -5.Unfortunately this is what CCP wants and they r getting it.Like i posted before the consequences of this remain to be seen but have no doubt about it its happening and its here right now. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
dailyhazard	Posted - 2006.01.14 11:17:00 - [125] well, there arent many "real" pirates left i know, the people that try to fight etc. Been hunting pirates yesterday everyone seemed to have at least 3 stabs sucked. But it seems that its more new players that are becoming pirates, its probably that some forms of piracy require little skills, like taking on something like a 1 month old cruiser with a bad fitting. Ofc i was -10 for a while but it gets boring, so im not surprised some of the vets have decided to get there sec status up and mess around in empire again. ------------------------------------------------ need a sig tbfh
Daac Iomen	Posted - 2006.01.14 11:35:00 - [126] They should let the victim choose whether they want kill rights, or the attacker gets a security hit. It's unrealistic to say that the cops encourage vigilantism, but if CCP wants to include it so badly then they should allow the victims who have no intention to hunt down their attacker to "press charges" with the security hit...OR...If the victim is so ****ed that they want to hunt the guy down, then they get that chance to have the police "turn a blind eye" to the whole incident, including the reprisal. Essentially, to the police, the attack never happened so there is no security hit in that case.
Asane	Posted - 2006.01.14 12:19:00 - [127] Edited by: Asane on 14/01/2006 12:20:33 You know, I started playing this game because I wanted to ***** around the market and make big bucks on others effort. And that's what I do. However I quit the other games where I could do the same because of the promise of doing it in a world where people could do what they wanted, and if done right, could get away with it too... I'm not a pirate. I don't like pirates. And I sure as hell want to see them dead! BUT if CCP takes care of the pirates, not only do they kill the pirate profession.. They also kill bounty hunters and bodyguards. And umm.. ya.. what are the current issues?
eLLioTT wave	Posted - 2006.01.14 13:27:00 - [128] no
Pehova Mindtriq	Posted - 2006.01.14 13:36:00 - [129] Originally by: Ginger Magician Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:52 Edited by: Ginger Magician on 13/01/2006 01:38:09 Like the topic says this situation is soon to come about in EVE csuse of the recent nerfs to piracy which have resulted in a number of corps and well known pirates either changign their ways or becoming mostly inactive. Although it is ofc possible that new players will rise to replace them given the extreme hardship now faced by a career pirate it seems unlikely many will succeed. So the question for all the pirate hunters and pvp lovers out there is - if there is no easy pirate targets at -10 who can be hunted and killed without consequence will u still play eve? yes pirates have little or no impact on me, but maybe its because i live in 0.0.
Plutoinum	Posted - 2006.01.14 13:42:00 - [130] Edited by: Plutoinum on 14/01/2006 13:44:23 Originally by: Amaii Templ @#^@ you! My money's as green as yours (assuming your money, like mine, is USD.) I'm paying for MY fun, not your fun. When you pay for my account, then you can gank me. The standard non-argument. EVE is known for non-consensual pvp and pirating since the beginning. You knew that and if not, then it's your fault. You decided to subscribe ! Your subscription gives you the right to play the game, not to to demand another game like that another player never kills you, if you don't want it. I really hate the 'I decided to pay, now make it carebear !' argument.

Zell	Posted - 2006.01.14 13:51:00 - [131] "Ginger Magician is just a nublet. I've met more people ingame that have laughed about him, than anyone else in Eve." "A coward dies a thousand times, the brave die just once.."
Thomas Torquemada	Posted - 2006.01.14 14:01:00 - [132] Edited by: Thomas Torquemada on 14/01/2006 14:03:00 Originally by: Iorya Dragon Well i got ganked a lot of time by lamer pirates that dont know to real pvp alone, but i got mad at that time. Pirates got to exists, scammers, real pvpers, the more diversity and danger, more intersting the game it is. If u need to be safe a while, to train skills, and prepare stay in empire for a while. YOu gota understand the role of every, profesion, faction in the game, and with what contributes to the game, even if u ar e a 100% carebear. In my experience, the type of pirate you refer to arent lame scared to fight for real types, personally when i go looking for a fight on my own, a nice uip close and personal fight, i find i always tackle more numbers than me, and they never attack me first, they always, and i do mean always, want me to fire first so they get help from sentry guns. Until people like that grow a brass set, ill continue to snipe people to bits at gates/stations, it has nothing to do with griefing or being a git, its simply all thats left to do to make some cash and get some kills, unless i want to twiddle my thumbs in a station all day. And yer, im -10. UPC - PVP'ers Good and Bad, How Do You Want Peace? Through Talk Or In A Casket? We Decide! Peace My Brothers...
Zyper	Posted - 2006.01.14 14:18:00 - [133] Ransom them = no kill rights on you :D
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.14 14:45:00 - [134] Originally by: Zyper Ransom them = no kill rights on you :D Instant local and the nerfing of damage mod stacking has meant that ransoming ships became almost impossible.Anyone who knows why damagemod stacking penalty made it harder to ransom wins a btw:P The best pirates are also the most well known and infamous through the EVE galaxy.In my case it is rare whne i enter local that someone does not speak to me within 30 seconds "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Kira Natel	Posted - 2006.01.14 15:16:00 - [135] I play the game to enjoy myself, not to worry about whether some other player is a pirate or not. I think most people would continue to play but probably the Beta and non-adaptable types would move on. I'm not promoting that there be no piracy but it really wouldn't matter to me either way.
Abvrasious	Posted - 2006.01.14 15:46:00 - [136] Probably I would end my account. Its weird, because I don't WANT to get killed by that nasty Pirate in his nasty Raven, but it would be no fine low-sec mining without any risk of someone killing me before I blink. Got to have Pirates, since in the future, Abvra will be a Pirate Hunter, and I won't have a career without Pirates. ------------- http://img452.imageshack.us/img452/3186/eveforumsignature9di.jpg Signature Image too large - please lower filesize to 24,000 bytes or less - Teblin
Dakath	Posted - 2006.01.14 17:02:00 - [137] Ginger, so sorry for going off-topic. Back on topic. Yes, I would still play if there were no pirates/griefers. Pirates/Griefers are an annoyance at best. They contribute nothing to my gameing experience. NPC pirates/greifers are better than player pirates/greifers in that they don't brag about their kills and don't smaktalk. LAG!Ö
Amaii Templ	Posted - 2006.01.14 17:48:00 - [138] Originally by: Plutoinum Edited by: Plutoinum on 14/01/2006 13:44:23 Originally by: Amaii Templ @#^@ you! My money's as green as yours (assuming your money, like mine, is USD.) I'm paying for MY fun, not your fun. When you pay for my account, then you can gank me. The standard non-argument. EVE is known for non-consensual pvp and pirating since the beginning. You knew that and if not, then it's your fault. You decided to subscribe ! Your subscription gives you the right to play the game, not to to demand another game like that another player never kills you, if you don't want it. I really hate the 'I decided to pay, now make it carebear !' argument. First rule of sales, mate. "The customer is always right." I imagine if CCP tallied up the number of people who would quit if they removed the threat of instaganking in lowsec, the number of people who woulden't care, and the number of people who want a space MMO like EvE but are too afraid/smart to throw their money at CCP because they don't want to wind up frustrated and bored, they'd be doing themselves a massive financial favor to give the jolly rodgers a jolly up the rodger. Then maybe they could afford some truely fly servers. Simply put, I'm not playing EvE because it's what I want. I'm playing EvE because it's the most similar to what I want. There's a difference. I don't want to randomly loose my shiny new ship to some jerk who can't possibly get anything from it except the purile thrill of ruining my day. We call those people "Griefers", plain and simple. If I risk my ass against real pirates (hint: Real pirates are guys like Sanshas and Guristas and others who act like them,) and get wasted, that's one thing. If I get into a corp war and get my aft kicked, that's one thing. If I'm just trying to travel from point A to point B, and die for no reason, that's another thing, and what it's called is "griefing".
Megadon	Posted - 2006.01.14 17:49:00 - [139] Originally by: Ginger Magician U misunderstand the premise of my thread.I have never said that there will be no more PVP especially in 0.0 which is totally unaffected by these changes.And of course empire wars will continue.What we are discussing in piracy in 0.1 to 0.4 space.That is what has changed and is changing right now on TQ. If there r no pirates in 0.1 to 0.4 will u still play EVE - that is the question or conversely assuming 0.1 to 0.4 has no pirates is this really a change for the better in the running of EVE - discuss Ginger, Why won't there be pirates in 0.1 - 0.4 space? It's not my profession so I'm not up to speed on exactly how kill rights effect this but could you share your viewpoint on this? I'm not getting it. thanks. "The Battleships is and should be a solo pwnmobile." - Oveur
Cerridwehn Odessa	Posted - 2006.01.14 17:51:00 - [140] Pirates are a small percentage of the population. Doesnt matter if they are here or not. And yes, there is a difference between a pirate corp and a corp that you are just hostile with. Not everyone that's -10 to you is a "pirate"

Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.14 18:28:00 - [141] Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Ginger Magician U misunderstand the premise of my thread.I have never said that there will be no more PVP especially in 0.0 which is totally unaffected by these changes.And of course empire wars will continue.What we are discussing in piracy in 0.1 to 0.4 space.That is what has changed and is changing right now on TQ. If there r no pirates in 0.1 to 0.4 will u still play EVE - that is the question or conversely assuming 0.1 to 0.4 has no pirates is this really a change for the better in the running of EVE - discuss Ginger, Why won't there be pirates in 0.1 - 0.4 space? It's not my profession so I'm not up to speed on exactly how kill rights effect this but could you share your viewpoint on this? I'm not getting it. thanks. There has been massive nerfs to piracy for some time now and RMR introdued the biggest ever nerfs to piracy seen in the game since its inception.If your are not a pirate u woulndt really understand the technicalities of it but u can rest assured that this is the case and the fall in pirate numbers and activity since rmr confirms it anyway. This iussue affects all players of EVE even carebears.If no ships r destroyed in low empire space by players then demand for ships is going to fall drastically and from that there is fall in demand for tech 2 equipment pos materials etc etc - its all one long chain.Unfortunately CCP has listened to all the whiners and declared amongst themselves that piracy is bad for the game and taken the decesion to make empire piracy so difficult and unprofitable that basically the profession is in danger of dying out. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Megadon	Posted - 2006.01.14 18:43:00 - [142] Edited by: Megadon on 14/01/2006 18:45:04 Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Ginger Magician U misunderstand the premise of my thread.I have never said that there will be no more PVP especially in 0.0 which is totally unaffected by these changes.And of course empire wars will continue.What we are discussing in piracy in 0.1 to 0.4 space.That is what has changed and is changing right now on TQ. If there r no pirates in 0.1 to 0.4 will u still play EVE - that is the question or conversely assuming 0.1 to 0.4 has no pirates is this really a change for the better in the running of EVE - discuss Ginger, Why won't there be pirates in 0.1 - 0.4 space? It's not my profession so I'm not up to speed on exactly how kill rights effect this but could you share your viewpoint on this? I'm not getting it. thanks. There has been massive nerfs to piracy for some time now and RMR introdued the biggest ever nerfs to piracy seen in the game since its inception.If your are not a pirate u woulndt really understand the technicalities of it but u can rest assured that this is the case and the fall in pirate numbers and activity since rmr confirms it anyway. This iussue affects all players of EVE even carebears.If no ships r destroyed in low empire space by players then demand for ships is going to fall drastically and from that there is fall in demand for tech 2 equipment pos materials etc etc - its all one long chain.Unfortunately CCP has listened to all the whiners and declared amongst themselves that piracy is bad for the game and taken the decesion to make empire piracy so difficult and unprofitable that basically the profession is in danger of dying out. Well I would hope that there are always pirates in low sec empire space. I mean I thought that was the whole point of low sec empire space, that there were some highways within empire that would be more risky, more dangerous than others. If pirates aren't there, whats the point? I know we had the mod stacking nerf which hurt alpha strike so that kinda put a damper on sniping a bit. We've got the eye for an eye thing now, which changes things quite a bit. We also have the ability for POS's in low sec space which really changes things. I think the last hope for pirates is the local channel. Hopefully, they won't do away with that. edit: i guess this really depends on how you use it though... hmmmm I think what we may end up seeing then is maybe actually MORE gank squads instead of solo guys like yourself. I'm not really sure if this is a GOOD thing. POS's in low sec space could really change the game dynamic in ways that aren't so good. I guess we'll see... I do however think that solo pirates are a good thing in the game even though I really don't like you. hehe "The Battleships is and should be a solo pwnmobile." - Oveur
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.14 18:49:00 - [143] Quote: .If your are not a pirate u woulndt really understand the technicalities of it but u can rest assured that this is the case and the fall in pirate numbers and activity since rmr confirms it anyway try explainig..i usualy find its a cop out for those with no decent argument to come up with the "u wont understand" line. i could come on the forums and say "CCP should give me an industructible ship and me only..but you wont understand the reasoning..so i wont explain it, but you can rest assured it is vital for the game that i recive this ship". so try explaining why...and we will make our own mind up if we can understand or not. i for one cant see the big deal, as most professional pirates will be -5 or less so who cares if a caerbare can kill you in high sec..cause concord will do it first...but please list yuor reasoning..and people will see if they agree or not. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
Wanoah	Posted - 2006.01.14 19:08:00 - [144] I have never pirated, but I see it as an important part of the game. Some of Eve's best corps and most entertaining characters have been pirates. A lot of those people have moved on to other things or have quit the game entirely now. Trouble is, there have been a succession of changes over many months that have made it hard to be a successful pirate. Piracy has pretty much been reduced to the lamest common denominator. Sniping in a battleship, fitted with WCS, aligned to warp, and running as soon as anything more threatening than an indy shows up in the system. It's not exactly the pinnacle of gameplay, is it? What I want to see is pirates that are able to sit at a gate and attack in a variety of ships like the NPC rats are able to. They should be able to ransom people at the gate. Equally, people should be able to fight them at the gate. Thus, we can have some fun PvP stuff at the gates. Sentries stop any of this happening. Sentries mean battleships only and sniping. Sentries mean that the anti-pirate people have to bring a sledgehammer to ***** a nut with tacklers and covert ops etc. Sentries mean that anti-pirate people cannot engage first unless the pirate is still flagged or is less than -5. Sentries mean that aggrieved victims struggle to get their revenge. Sentries make it too easy for instajumpng indies to travel without any scouts or escorts. Sentries steal our killmails. Sentries steal our fun. Sentries need to go. Barriers - An Eve Novel
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.14 19:45:00 - [145] I will try and outline some of the nerfs introduced in RMR and from before. Most pirates are highly skilled pvpers and prefer to work solo or in small groups. The increase in hps of ships and their increased tanking ability i.e reduction in cap booster charge size etc has meant that even highly skilled pirates are unable to solo battleship targets at gates apart from the odd noob fitted with medium mods. Secondly gank setups no longer work - it takes far longer to kill targets regardless of your setup as the old dps u had in cold war is no longer possible.Ships that take longer to kill have more time to escape and there is only so much time u have before a pirate must warp out - if under fire from sentries or your target will reach the gate. Sniping has been badly affected by the stack mod penalties and is now only successful in large groups.The severe penalties affecting remote sensor boosters mean that lock times have increased and hence more targets can escape. Eye for an eye while not affecting me or any pirate more than -5 has reduced the combat of those players who tend to keep around -2 or so so they can sort of part time pirate.Personally i have little sympathy for these part time pirates but now they can be killed by their victims in even 1.0 for up to a month afterwards means this option to part time piracy has obviously become a lot less attractive. Other nerfs which have come in in the last year include the smartbomb/pod nerf the 15 min timer and various nerfs related to gangs and the map. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Kage Getsu	Posted - 2006.01.14 19:48:00 - [146] As a pirate, I guess I would not be playing!
DJTheBaron	Posted - 2006.01.14 19:51:00 - [147] no __________________________________________________ Scum, your all scum.
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.14 20:11:00 - [148] Quote: I will try and outline some of the nerfs introduced in RMR and from before. Most pirates are highly skilled pvpers and prefer to work solo or in small groups. not in all cases..but generaly a fair statment Quote: The increase in hps of ships and their increased tanking ability i.e reduction in cap booster charge size etc has meant that even highly skilled pirates are unable to solo battleship targets at gates apart from the odd noob fitted with medium mods. these changes were made for a variety of reasons: 1) to make combat last longer..therefore more enjoyable 2) to reduce the effectivness of solo gate sniping at 120KM (which in my opinion is not piracy but lazines) Quote: Secondly gank setups no longer work - it takes far longer to kill targets regardless of your setup as the old dps u had in cold war is no longer which for eve as a whole is a good thing..my advice to you..dont sit at a gate waiting for noobs..try searching blets (ive been both a caerbear who solo mined in 0.4 and ive had a pirate char who also hunted in belts..so i know from personaly expirience that it is possible to find targets it just takes a bit of work) Quote: possible.Ships that take longer to kill have more time to escape and there is only so much time u have before a pirate must warp out - if under fire from sentries or your target will reach the gate. work in a group..this is a multiplayer game you know. try doing some other form of piracy instead of sitting at a gate snipping..if people like snigg can do it no reason such a "legend" as you cant Quote: Sniping has been badly affected by the stack mod penalties and is now only successful in large groups.The severe penalties affecting remote sensor boosters mean that lock times have increased and hence more targets can escape. which was sort of the idea...the sniping culture was destroying eve as a whole. Quote: Eye for an eye while not affecting me or any pirate more than -5 has reduced the combat of those players who tend to keep around -2 or so so they can sort of part time pirate.Personally i have little sympathy for these part time pirates but now they can be killed by their victims in even 1.0 for up to a month afterwards means this option to part time piracy has obviously become a lot less attractive. OMG you mean pirates now have to be caerful in high sec like their targets do in low???? how disipicable. all the changes listed above improve the eve expirience for the majotrity of people..the only ones that it has a bad affect on are what some refer to as caerbear pirates who will sit at 120km shooting anything which poeses no threat and runs when in dangeor then come and whine like every other caerbear about things they dont like. to be honest this whole thread sounds like a twisted version of the atypical caerbaew whine. so ill give the typical "pker/griefer" responces 1)adapt or die 2) can i have ur stuff (NB any comment made with "" is sarcasm) _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.14 21:03:00 - [149] Quote: but still let gankers snipe. They gave long term consequences - which affect the pirates, but not the -10 alt-account gankers. thats going more into the relms of alt abuse rather than direct piracy nerfing..people using alts in this manner hits every aspect of eve not just piracy. i do agree that ccp is pandering to the bears a bit to much and piracy needs a bit of a buff..but i dont agree that the changes in RMR are that much of a disaster..its..as much as i dont like to say i...sentry guns at gates ( i feel that these guns are necessary to have a drastic difference between low sec and 0.0)..its the sentry guns which have created the gank mentality..but i feel now this mentality is here..removign sentry guns wont change it, but will only make it easier...so its to late to fix it that way..one good suggestion would be to make scramblers/webbers non aggression in low sec alone...enabling people to ransom at gates instead of ganking. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.14 23:33:00 - [150] Inferno you r just a ******* alliance carebear.You know nothing about piracy or pvp. Your security status is 5.0 and u been in stain alliance for more than 1 year. Go PVE and keep out of threads on which u can offer no valid opinions. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."

Kaylana Syi	Posted - 2006.01.15 01:00:00 - [151] Originally by: Ginger Magician Yeah baby your right 1.All pirates r greifer scumbags 2.Concord should be able to kill u in low sec and pop your pod 3.make sentry gun ranges unlimited 4.increase sentry damge so u die in one pop in a titan. etc,etc,etc On a more realistic note it would be nice to get a dev reply to this thead.There has been a lot of interest in it and given that piracy has no had a single word from devs in like a year would be interesting to hear what they think is the future of piracy IMO its very bleak indeed right now. The fact is there aren't very many pirates in EVE. Their have been some very popular ones. However, most PvPers are Griefers. I don't load that word with contempt... that is just the fact of it. Griefers make this game interesting... but they aren't pirates. If you wanna call that a pirate then I could call a carebear an upstanding citizen of the empire... which is less than accurate. Fact is that it is tedious to be a pirate but it is absolutely without a doubt a functional part of eve's game mechanics. The devs have not made this game less attractive to pirates or griefers or fleet yanks. They are simply trying to balance the funfactor for all of these people and the carebears that suport the economy. Originally by: "Oveur" I don't react to threats any better than you do
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.15 08:25:00 - [152] Quote: Inferno you r just a ******* alliance carebear.You know nothing about piracy or pvp. Your security status is 5.0 and u been in stain alliance for more than 1 year. Go PVE and keep out of threads on which u can offer no valid opinions you just shown ur an idiot...i have a sec status of 5.0 becvause i dont feel the need to sit sniping gates to bolster my ego..and after a year of shooting npc's to by my combat gear....i would have a high sec status...but as for alliance caerbear..im sure any one from stain (especialy the early days of SA) will be able to tell you im one of the most antii alliance caerbears there is..my rants against them both in alliance chat and alliance forums were numerous. my char atm has been living in querious and catch fighting fix for almost a month non stop, before that i had a 3 weeks money making period, before that i was fighting G/IRON/SE, then before that i was fighting the empire war against FE/NBSI/SE/ i could go on and on. next time before you make half assed assumption over things you know nothing about..try find out about a person..while i know all i need to know about you...you know nothign about me. but then again i truly partake in PVP against people who shoot back not sitting in low sec snipping noob ships then proclaiming how much of a giant i am in eve. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
Jaketh Ivanes	Posted - 2006.01.15 10:30:00 - [153] Edited by: Jaketh Ivanes on 15/01/2006 10:32:46 Originally by: Ginger Magician Eye for an eye while not affecting me or any pirate more than -5 has reduced the combat of those players who tend to keep around -2 or so so they can sort of part time pirate.Personally i have little sympathy for these part time pirates but now they can be killed by their victims in even 1.0 for up to a month afterwards means this option to part time piracy has obviously become a lot less attractive. Lets look at it from the victims view. A part time pirate ganks a hauler going through low sec. What options does the victim have now? The part time pirate just enters empire and move across the galaxy to avoid retaliation. Now the victim of the part time pirate, has an option to excert revenge, meaning the part time pirate, or piwate, can't carebear anymore and now has a risk to his profession. That said, he should still be able to fight back agenst those that have kill rights. Just like ore thiefs. EDIT: Oh, and btw, I would keep playing even if all pirates/piwates had left the game, as it contributes nothing to my game experience. I prefer those that stand ground and fight. Those that take a risk. Those that truly PvP.
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.15 11:19:00 - [154] Originally by: Syme Ginger As one of your recent victims I can only concur that the removal of rates would ruin the game. It was an absolute pleasure to be blown up by you. Thank you.It was a pleasure to pop u too lol. Its a great shame that this sort of attitude is not more prevalent in the game.This guy lost well over 30mill when i popped his iteron 5 yet he still has the balls to say well done as he appreciated the superior skills that enabled me to kill him where others had failed. But unfortunatley the prevalent attitude is either that us pirates are all greifer scumbags and you carebears are all noobs/non skilled players. Neither statement is correct. We all know that balancing the game is difficult - but the way it is now pirates have become an endangered species and without some help in future patches they may well become extinct in the not too distant future. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Timothia	Posted - 2006.01.15 11:34:00 - [155] My god ginger. It doesn't exactly take that much superior skills to blow up an industrial now does it
Defender ofCHAOS	Posted - 2006.01.15 11:36:00 - [156] Quote -We all know that balancing the game is difficult - but the way it is now pirates have become an endangered species and without some help in future patches they may well become extinct in the not too distant future. -- would be funn to see them extinct, ganking in low sec is for pvp carebears, real pvpers goes to 0.0 or yust wardecs there enemie, yust ganking noobs or people in haulers at low sec is pathetic. but geus some people need to fill there killsite with something
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.15 11:40:00 - [157] Originally by: Timothia My god ginger. It doesn't exactly take that much superior skills to blow up an industrial now does it NO.But when u have blown up 2500 u do tend to get a bit of a reputation "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.15 12:03:00 - [158] Quote: NO.But when u have blown up 2500 u do tend to get a bit of a reputation and that ladies and gentelmen (or not so gentle..what ever the case may be) tells you all you need to know about ginger magician. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
Gonada	Posted - 2006.01.15 13:06:00 - [159] what? that ginger likes the game, plays the game as ginger wants to? seriously you should stfu , eve is an openended game, you can be a pirate a griefer a miner a labrat amisson runner, whatever you want. thats the beuty of it. too bad that apperantly you can also be an anal whiner too. -I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.-
Mordas	Posted - 2006.01.15 13:25:00 - [160] alright cant read all the way to the end this thread is to daft..find a trader to run for you/spend a couple of days and make a hauler alt...you can babble all you want about pirates slimming up but my mates and i have been getting gate camped silly by collector of souls...rmr doesnt look to of affected them much or anything else pirate releated..just leveld out the field a bit..pirates are needed to keep macro mining a holes and carebares out of my nice low sec mining fields as its the only place to find ore these days../end (oh and cry more noobies)

Za Po	Posted - 2006.01.15 13:55:00 - [161] I don't think so. And I'm a carebear. A game without PvP eventually becomes boring. -------------------- This solution to BM-related server resource usage can reduce lag with the same interface.
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:14:00 - [162] Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: Dark Shikari I'm in a Ginger Magician thread Your in every bloody thread that ever was me too!
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:22:00 - [163] i lost a kestrel to ginger in my first week. no, if pirates disappeared, i wouldn't quit. but i don't think i'd have as much fun. but i can't see the problem particularly that pirates might disappear now, unless i have misunderstood killrights. the way i understand it: killrights allow someone to wipe out anyone who has unlawfully podded them for upto a month after the kill pirates who don't pod people are usually lawful (more than -5) and therefore aren't hit with the killrights in highsec (because they don't pod) pirates who do podkill people are usually outlaws (less than -5), and therefore the killrights make no difference (they are viable targets wherever and whenever whatever) pirates who Podkill take a huge sec hit, and therefore won't be greater than -5 for very long. and it makes RP sense that they would become free game for committing first degree murder. pirates who are just out to make a profit don't need to podkill for anything but e-peen enlargement (drops no loot) so, IMO, if thats how killrights work, they won't cripple the pirate profession at all
moghiden	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:24:00 - [164] Quote: what? that ginger likes the game, plays the game as ginger wants to? seriously you should stfu , eve is an openended game, you can be a pirate a griefer a miner a labrat amisson runner, whatever you want. thats the beuty of it. too bad that apperantly you can also be an anal whiner too.[/
moghiden	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:24:00 - [165] Quote: what? that ginger likes the game, plays the game as ginger wants to? seriously you should stfu , eve is an openended game, you can be a pirate a griefer a miner a labrat amisson runner, whatever you want. thats the beuty of it. too bad that apperantly you can also be an anal whiner too.[/
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:29:00 - [166] moghiden is me btw...i hate it when i forget to chance my char _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
Defender ofCHAOS	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:37:00 - [167] Originally by: moghiden Edited by: moghiden on 15/01/2006 14:28:39 Quote: what? that ginger likes the game, plays the game as ginger wants to? nope it tells us hes an egomaniac who needs to measure his e-pen by killing noobs/defensless ships..to the point he keeps count of how much haulers he has killed..then brags claiming it makes him a legend..like BE his braging on forums and other places...just makes him a joke Quote: seriously you should stfu , eve is an openended game, you can be a pirate a griefer a miner a labrat amisson runner, whatever you want.+ yes it is wonderful that you can be what you want..at this time i have 3 accounts 1 of which holds my main char (or original char is more accurate) who is an alliance PVP char, the second holds my industiral support char while the thrid holds both a research char and a pirate char which i spend 3 months with and got bored of him. Quote: thats the beuty of it. indeed it is, this is why i have tried to sample all aspects of eve. Quote: that apperantly you can also be an anal whiner too. all to true, the amount of whinning threads such as this one and the millions of others on this forum is sickening...but its funny at the same time. QFT aslong the real pvpers stay the funn wil be in eve, pirates are no funn anyway, its easy to do and no funn to hunt them while they runn to a pos or station when combat ships apear instat of a hauler or noobship
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:38:00 - [168] K ginger well dome , but insulting inferno you destroyed what little credibility this thread has And how do you know you succeeded when others had failed when killing syme. Fact is your not godlike, your skills are possessed by all pirates: You are nothing special. All that is unique is people laugh at you. Do you see people laughing at nero? No because he makes sensible arguments. If your gonna make an argument then make it properly instead of insulting peoples intelligence by saying they wouldnt understand. Yes your a pirate, but no one respects you for it. Doesnt that tell you something?
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:39:00 - [169] And defender of chaos, not all pirates run from combat ships. Your just letting the poor reputation of the few get in the way of the real pirates.
Gloomash	Posted - 2006.01.15 14:48:00 - [170] Originally by: HippoKing Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: Dark Shikari I'm in a Ginger Magician thread Your in every bloody thread that ever was me too! You two sirs are forum *****s!

Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.15 16:05:00 - [171] Originally by: Velsharoon K ginger well dome , but insulting inferno you destroyed what little credibility this thread has And how do you know you succeeded when others had failed when killing syme. Fact is your not godlike, your skills are possessed by all pirates: You are nothing special. All that is unique is people laugh at you. Do you see people laughing at nero? No because he makes sensible arguments. If your gonna make an argument then make it properly instead of insulting peoples intelligence by saying they wouldnt understand. Yes your a pirate, but no one respects you for it. Doesnt that tell you something? Maybe but then ex-carebear gank squad pussies opinions dont really count actually.What i said about inferno was the simple truth thats why he got so upset about it.And syme told me he had escaped in his iteron 5 several times from pirate attacks which why i said that. The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.15 16:25:00 - [172] Originally by: HippoKing killrights allow someone to wipe out anyone who has unlawfully podded them for upto a month after the kill Originally by: Kali Features Page eye for an eye You are allowed to revenge an unlawful destruction of your ship Ship. Not pod. If it was pod, I'd completely agree with you, but it's ship. It's not even what the nerfs do, it's that they're constant, steady and show no signs of letting up. It's become progressively harder and less profitable to pirate - the people screaming 'adapt or die' are going to have to let up soon, whether they like it or not. The simple fact is that CCP seem to think piracy is worthy of absolutely no boosts, ever, at all, should be all the warning you need. But it hardly surprises me. CCP seem to have sold out on their principles in general. Ingame rewards for out of game efforts, counterstrike-style rebirth spawning, multiple shards, heavy emphasis on NPC-based gameplay and dependance, wussing out on changes (cough insta nerf) because of player whining, etc. If you still want to complain that piracy is alive and kicking then go ahead, but you won't be able to deny it soon. Piracy has been dying for the last 2 and a half years, since that very first carebear whined that they were going to quit their sub because they got ganked and CCP's ears perked up... ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.15 16:34:00 - [173] Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: Velsharoon K ginger well dome , but insulting inferno you destroyed what little credibility this thread has And how do you know you succeeded when others had failed when killing syme. Fact is your not godlike, your skills are possessed by all pirates: You are nothing special. All that is unique is people laugh at you. Do you see people laughing at nero? No because he makes sensible arguments. If your gonna make an argument then make it properly instead of insulting peoples intelligence by saying they wouldnt understand. Yes your a pirate, but no one respects you for it. Doesnt that tell you something? Maybe but then ex-carebear gank squad pussies opinions dont really count actually.What i said about inferno was the simple truth thats why he got so upset about it.And syme told me he had escaped in his iteron 5 several times from pirate attacks which why i said that. The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. Why dont they count. Fair enough about Syme. What sort of fact is this? You had a poll done? Your opinion counts insomuch as all our opinions do. However maybe people will listen to us and not you as we have credibility.
Fester Addams	Posted - 2006.01.15 16:43:00 - [174] This very much depends on what you meen by pirates. If the PK gankers would get removed I would keep playing. If the griefers were removed I would keep playing. If the life of a lowsec pirate was made so chalenging that there were alot more non pirates in lowsec then pirates I would keep playing. If cPvP was curbed so hard it was not possible anywhere in empire then I would probably keep playing but I would vocally complain about it. If all cPvP was removed from the entire game I dont think I would have to worry as the game would get closed down by CCP as that is not what they intended to create.
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.15 16:46:00 - [175] Quote: Maybe but then ex-carebear gank squad pussies opinions dont really count actually. sorry to dissapoint you but ive never been a caerbear (well apart from a 3 day period in my first month..but i think temporary insanity covers that). My first PVP expirience was in my 3rd week of the game, from then i had my first war a week after...then i had a relitive time of peace only having brief encoutners in corridor (usualy traveling around in a destroyer looking for suitable targets), but since the xetic war ive not gone more than 3 weeks without fighting. (anyhow i dont see why im bothering to justify myself to a fool like you..any one who has meet me in the past year will know my..lust for destroying other ships...i just prefere targets what fight back..ive always enjoyed a challenge) but even if i was a caerbear it would not mean my opinion is worth any less than yours..just because you are notorious as the games clown..does not realy mean that your opinion is any more/less valid than some one who is unkown..its the content of the post what matter not who makes it..and tbh your posts are either whinning or beating your own chest so they are quite worthless. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.15 16:50:00 - [176] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: HippoKing killrights allow someone to wipe out anyone who has unlawfully podded them for upto a month after the kill Originally by: Kali Features Page eye for an eye You are allowed to revenge an unlawful destruction of your ship Ship. Not pod. If it was pod, I'd completely agree with you, but it's ship. ah, thanks for clearing that up. it SHOULD be pod
DukDodgerz	Posted - 2006.01.15 16:58:00 - [177] Originally by: Ginger Magician Inferno you r just a ******* alliance carebear.You know nothing about piracy or pvp. Your security status is 5.0 and u been in stain alliance for more than 1 year. Go PVE and keep out of threads on which u can offer no valid opinions. words of ignorence from a known griefer... My main has +5 and kills trolls like you all the time in 0.0 where he wont get a sec hit...so little troll, what other words of ignorence do you have to entertain us with?
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.15 17:08:00 - [178] and just for the record: i have no problems with pirates or piracy. on the other hand, i do have a problem with obnoxious pompous ****s, and unfortunately that group includes gingermagician. you've posted a thread. is it possible for people to disagree with you without getting flamed or called a carebear?
Fester Addams	Posted - 2006.01.15 17:32:00 - [179] Originally by: Ginger Magician The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. I beg to differ, Im not a very high profile player but I have read alot of posts on the forum and have been an active player from this chars birth till now and I dont have the foggiest idea who you are apart from what I have read in this thread. I do know of alot of people ingame, imfamous or famous, The Reverend, Viceroy, Tzadkiel, Winterblink so on and so forth. Your name however has made no impression whatsoever on me good or bad. If youy are as bad as you seem to think then a player like me should have your name in my head with a pathetic warning next to it like I have for the name TankCEO but no. As for your opinions counting, naturally they do but only as much as my opinions do or your average random players opinion does. As for the destruction of 2500 industrials giving you a reputation... yes it does, for keeping track of that many industrial kills you get the reputation pathetic in my mind and thus you slide into the same category as TankCEO. And on the issue of TankCEO, I never have been able to get over his very amusing claim that you should not be able to simply gank people for no reason that he made while playing the Lineage2 beta :)
Vole Tanzar	Posted - 2006.01.15 18:40:00 - [180] No. Without pirates Eve would be like every other MMPORPG - watching a set of numbers get bigger. Non-consential PvP adds the risk that makes it into a game.

eLLioTT wave	Posted - 2006.01.15 19:22:00 - [181] speaking of pirates (not being one) all other professions in eve have steps that start with pve. eg mining ect then moving to low sec. Pirating does not. What i propose is more npc convoys traveling through low sec. They could have varying degrees of escorts depending on their cargo. This would make pirating a lot more intresting for newer pirates i would imagine. Comments?
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.15 23:22:00 - [182] Originally by: Fester Addams Originally by: Ginger Magician The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. I beg to differ, Im not a very high profile player but I have read alot of posts on the forum and have been an active player from this chars birth till now and I dont have the foggiest idea who you are apart from what I have read in this thread. I do know of alot of people ingame, imfamous or famous, The Reverend, Viceroy, Tzadkiel, Winterblink so on and so forth. Your name however has made no impression whatsoever on me good or bad. If youy are as bad as you seem to think then a player like me should have your name in my head with a pathetic warning next to it like I have for the name TankCEO but no. As for your opinions counting, naturally they do but only as much as my opinions do or your average random players opinion does. As for the destruction of 2500 industrials giving you a reputation... yes it does, for keeping track of that many industrial kills you get the reputation pathetic in my mind and thus you slide into the same category as TankCEO. And on the issue of TankCEO, I never have been able to get over his very amusing claim that you should not be able to simply gank people for no reason that he made while playing the Lineage2 beta :) Why lie so badly Fester.If i havent killed u i am sure i have at least fired on you. Its impossible that u dont know who I am.Jealousy is bad mm...kay/\ "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Laythun	Posted - 2006.01.15 23:30:00 - [183] Pirates = people who trouble you when your a noob, and become a merely a an annoying occurence swiftly delt with once you've settle in. See Me! http://195.225.8.195:7090/listen.[/url]
sallyr	Posted - 2006.01.16 00:05:00 - [184] well im a ibble pirate when i want to be and i havent really seen any problems with being all anoying recently the whole point in pirating for me is that i get to chose my pvp against some1 i ether know i can win or some1 who i recon i can outclass in someway it beats all other kind of pvp because you get to chose. unlike fleet battle where you get to shoot for a while untill everyone locks you and you go poof all at once. i say piracy is the one true pvp in the game! as wars are just docking blobing laggy afairs compaired to the cool collected FAST PVP as in 1 p vers 1 p not p 1 vs 30 p frankly yarr 4tw (\_/) (O.o) (> <)
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.01.16 00:13:00 - [185] Originally by: Ginger Magician The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. you really, really aren't. tank CEO gets most famous pirate, followed by lord zap. outside of eve, i'd say istvaan and jade constantine seem to get most recognition. but, if i hadn't been killed by you, i wouldn't have heard your name for a long while - it was many months before i heard of you being any kind of famous, by which time i'd heard of all the interesting people - to me you were, and always be, just a arrogant ****wad who blasted my first frigate.
Galaxion	Posted - 2006.01.16 00:16:00 - [186] Originally by: Ginger Magician The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. Well this just gets a big fat LOL. The hell you are. You really just look like from this thread alone like quite an immature egocentric... idiot, really. -----------------------------------------
Zell	Posted - 2006.01.16 00:30:00 - [187] Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: Fester Addams Originally by: Ginger Magician The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. If youy are as bad as you seem to think then a player like me should have your name in my head with a pathetic warning next to it like I have for the name TankCEO but no. As for your opinions counting, naturally they do but only as much as my opinions do or your average random players opinion does. Its impossible that u dont know who I am... me, me, me, I, I, I, whaw, whaw, whaw. See a pattern develping here Scully?? "Ginger Magician is just a nublet. I've met more people ingame that have laughed about him, than anyone else in Eve." "A coward dies a thousand times, the brave die just once.."
Jared VonBargen	Posted - 2006.01.16 00:37:00 - [188] Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: Fester Addams Originally by: Ginger Magician The fact is i am the best known player in the game - and my opinions count whether u like it or not. I beg to differ, Im not a very high profile player but I have read alot of posts on the forum and have been an active player from this chars birth till now and I dont have the foggiest idea who you are apart from what I have read in this thread. I do know of alot of people ingame, imfamous or famous, The Reverend, Viceroy, Tzadkiel, Winterblink so on and so forth. Your name however has made no impression whatsoever on me good or bad. If youy are as bad as you seem to think then a player like me should have your name in my head with a pathetic warning next to it like I have for the name TankCEO but no. As for your opinions counting, naturally they do but only as much as my opinions do or your average random players opinion does. As for the destruction of 2500 industrials giving you a reputation... yes it does, for keeping track of that many industrial kills you get the reputation pathetic in my mind and thus you slide into the same category as TankCEO. And on the issue of TankCEO, I never have been able to get over his very amusing claim that you should not be able to simply gank people for no reason that he made while playing the Lineage2 beta :) Why lie so badly Fester.If i havent killed u i am sure i have at least fired on you. Its impossible that u dont know who I am.Jealousy is bad mm...kay/\ i dont know you..... and you seem pretty self absorbed.... plan on graduating high school soon?
Zell	Posted - 2006.01.16 00:41:00 - [189] I think this Gingerspice thread has run its course. We all agreed that pirates are not going anywhere. We also all agree that gingey boy should.. "Ginger Magician is just a nublet. I've met more people ingame that have laughed about him, than anyone else in Eve." "A coward dies a thousand times, the brave die just once.."
Ukucia	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:08:00 - [190] Originally by: HippoKing you've posted a thread. is it possible for people to disagree with you without getting flamed or called a carebear? shakes "Magic 8-ball" My sources say no.

Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:12:00 - [191] Edited by: Ginger Magician on 16/01/2006 01:14:17 Edited by: Ginger Magician on 16/01/2006 01:12:50 Originally by: Zell I think this Gingerspice thread has run its course. We all agreed that pirates are not going anywhere. We also all agree that gingey boy should.. This thread has 5000 views and 200 posts or soemthing like that.The last one u made had about 10 i think.I wonder why that is dont u? "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Darlan Flame	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:17:00 - [192] The idea that pirates are complaining about eye for an eye is the biggest load of crap I've ever read on the internet. Go cry in WoW you freaking babies.
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:23:00 - [193] Originally by: Darlan Flame The idea that pirates are complaining about eye for an eye is the biggest load of crap I've ever read on the internet. Go cry in WoW you freaking babies. True pirates r not complaining about it as i said before.However it has affected the gameplay of those who prefer to keep their ss to a level where they can still enter empire freely. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Ukucia	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:23:00 - [194] Originally by: Ginger Magician Edited by: Ginger Magician on 16/01/2006 01:14:17 Edited by: Ginger Magician on 16/01/2006 01:12:50 Originally by: Zell I think this Gingerspice thread has run its course. We all agreed that pirates are not going anywhere. We also all agree that gingey boy should.. This thread has 5000 views and 200 posts or soemthing like that.The last one u made had about 10 i think.I wonder why that is dont u? Because when Ginger talks, people listen. ...or at least, they would if they'd ever heard of the guy except for this thread.
Gericault m0id	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:24:00 - [195] Edited by: Gericault m0id on 16/01/2006 01:24:36 I'm fairly sure it's already been mentioned. But I can't help but to feel sorry for Ginger Magician, no matter how ebil pirate he might be, for that 'I'm a virgin' navy raven loss. So Ginger, when I see you in local I don't think about what evil piratey things you could do to me, but rather of that glorious time I first sat down to hear you sing a Madonna song. I dislike pirates, but their existence makes the game worth playing.
Lord Obsidian	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:26:00 - [196] I am only new but pirates do add a great aspect to the game. As long as they are pirates and not gate camping 200kms away snipeing griefers. Blockade a gate fine, but be in range for a fight, not so far the person would take 5 minutes just to engage you. Thats just my opinion. Ultima Online had a good system, if you were a murderer you went 'red' and were freely attackable by anyone in any area, guarded or not. Yes it made it so players could not use the town banks or stores (like not being able to haul to stations here) risk free, but that was the life of a murderer (or pirate here). Here though only the person you killed can kill you, so its easier here for pirates/players killers. I have yet to venture into low sec space, but I would for the better NPC rats to kill, if I was not so cautious due to gate campers. I wouldnt mind engaging or trying to flee a player pirate as long as they were a real pirate not a gate camping sniper.
Wanoah	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:32:00 - [197] Right, this thread just isn't going to work. People need to stop sniping at each other, and actually discuss the issue at hand: piracy in low sec is rubbish, and gets worse with every patch. People can snipe at the OP because he's Ginger, or bury their heads in the sand, or violently deny that there's a problem because they want a fluffy safe world to mine and haul in. The point is that most piracy has been reduced to some pretty crappy gameplay for everyone and Ginger Magician himself represents the nadir of piracy. So, discuss the issue. Express an opinion with some basis in fact. Construct an argument and back it up with supporting evidence. That's how it's supposed to work, and if you can't undertsnad that, then you you have no business posting on a forum. Carry on. Barriers - An Eve Novel
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:38:00 - [198] Response ([GM]Rendo) - 01/05/2006 05:34 PM Hi Robert, What you experienced is not a bug. If you attack and kill another player then he receives kill rights on you. He can then attack you anywhere in empire space without Concord intervention. If you retaliate then Concord will intervene if you are in a empire system. According to the devs then this is how it was designed and it's not a bug. If you need further assistance, please don't hesitate to contact us again. We'll do all we can to help. Best regards, The EVE Online Customer Support Team This is what kill rights means. What are peoples opinions of this and do u think that u would be tempted to commit unlawful pvp in low security space knowing that for a month afterwards your victim can kill u anywhere in empire and all u could do was run away? "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."
Acheron Cyc	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:38:00 - [199] And here I was, thinking that the carebears were the only ones who whinned. Yet, we have to remember that back in the day, the pirates where to ones who whinned for MWD nerfing because they were unable to gank indys. ------------------------------------------ "It is better to be feared than loved, if you cannot be both." Niccolo Machiavelli
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:41:00 - [200] Originally by: Gericault m0id Edited by: Gericault m0id on 16/01/2006 01:24:36 I'm fairly sure it's already been mentioned. But I can't help but to feel sorry for Ginger Magician, no matter how ebil pirate he might be, for that 'I'm a virgin' navy raven loss. So Ginger, when I see you in local I don't think about what evil piratey things you could do to me, but rather of that glorious time I first sat down to hear you sing a Madonna song. I dislike pirates, but their existence makes the game worth playing. I dont fly faction ships or use faction mods plus i'm no singer.would u care to explain your post plz. "May you die by the hand of a low life in real life for ruining the gaming experiance of others.Your scum and will never be anything better than the coward you are."

Gericault m0id	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:44:00 - [201] Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: Gericault m0id Edited by: Gericault m0id on 16/01/2006 01:24:36 I'm fairly sure it's already been mentioned. But I can't help but to feel sorry for Ginger Magician, no matter how ebil pirate he might be, for that 'I'm a virgin' navy raven loss. So Ginger, when I see you in local I don't think about what evil piratey things you could do to me, but rather of that glorious time I first sat down to hear you sing a Madonna song. I dislike pirates, but their existence makes the game worth playing. I dont fly faction ships or use faction mods plus i'm no singer.would u care to explain your post plz. Maybe I got that completely wrong. Maybe it wasn't you in that video. Maybe I'm imagining things... I still think about Madonna when I see you in local though My bad.
Gericault m0id	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:46:00 - [202] Edited by: Gericault m0id on 16/01/2006 01:46:44 lol, that was firstname lastname I'm confusing you with. Nevermind. Damn, I gotta get Madonna out of my head. Get it here!
Gericault m0id	Posted - 2006.01.16 01:54:00 - [203] Originally by: Gericault m0id Edited by: Gericault m0id on 16/01/2006 01:46:44 lol, that was firstname lastname I'm confusing you with. Nevermind. Damn, I gotta get Madonna out of my head. Get it here! btw ^ is one of the nastiest videos I've ever seen. And it's the kind of mentality I associate with most pirates, hence I dislike pirates.
Tribunal	Posted - 2006.01.16 02:00:00 - [204] Yes
ezzle	Posted - 2006.01.16 03:02:00 - [205] No, im a pirate...
Fester Addams	Posted - 2006.01.16 03:02:00 - [206] Originally by: Ginger Magician Why lie so badly Fester.If i havent killed u i am sure i have at least fired on you. Its impossible that u dont know who I am.Jealousy is bad mm...kay/\ Laf, aparently Ginger does not take himself as seriously as it originally sounded. As far as you fiering upon me, you may very well have, I cant be bothered keeping track of everyone that takes potshots at me when I go where I go, I am after all constantly moving in and out of lowsec and at times 0.0 space. I am however very sure you have not shot down my ship or pod, I have only ever lost 4 ships to piracy and you were not behind the gun in any of those situations.
Neon Genesis	Posted - 2006.01.16 03:26:00 - [207] Edited by: Neon Genesis on 16/01/2006 03:29:56 Originally by: Lt Hole Originally by: Velsharoon Edited by: Velsharoon on 13/01/2006 17:30:32 Well having read his post again he is actually saying what will everyone do when theres no pirates to kill. So I understand just well thanks. No you don't. That's the smokescreen to cover the whine. Dig deeper. Exercise those brain cells. Here, maybe this will help. Pirates aren't going anywhere and they're in no danger of being nerfed out of existence. What has happened is that CCP made it hard for Ginger to wack helpless targets. Ginger is upset. He liked his old methods for ganking without being in danger. Now he's trying to pretend something bad is wrong and pirates are in danger of being removed from the game unless they are un-nerfed. Rubbish. Pirates can still pirate. You can still kill people in Empire and get away with it. But now the game is a little fairer and the pirates have to be a little more cunning. Ginger doesn't want to be more cunning. He wants easy and without danger. He even said it in his original post. You know, the one I quoted and set key words in bold. So really, do you think this post is about playing without pirates or is it a Ginger whine about a game change that he doesn't want to adapt too? If you're going to call sentry guns making it more fair, you MUST consider the fact that they have retardedly good tracking, making it pointblank impossible to use anything small at the gate for piracy. How about the sentry guns go with the times and get tracking? IMO piracy was nerfed into oblivion a long time ago compared to what it was. Added to that everyone and his dog uses lots of stabs now. And if you're a clever little bunny in low sec u fit a cloak and simply warp out the second u see a pirate in local, which is remarkably easy to do given that you're announced in local wayyyy before you can even start searching. Piracy in it's original form is damn near dead, and the agression timer? It can only be aimed at one thing, making piracy 15 minutes more boring, since anyone with half a brain can afford trouble from the locals for 15 minutes. EDIT: Oh, and it's a little beyond refusng to adapt when a playstyle has been made as hard as 'traditional' piracy has. Could go on forever about things that made piracy harder, but its about 3:30 am lol. There, i just contributed nothing to your thread
Acheron Cyc	Posted - 2006.01.16 03:50:00 - [208] Interesting to note in this thread that some "pirates" whine as much as some carebears. The nerfing to make "pirate life" harder()is probably due to the frequency that gate camping happens so you can probably thank them(unless you are one). ------------------------------------------ "It is better to be feared than loved, if you cannot be both." Niccolo Machiavelli
Ukucia	Posted - 2006.01.16 04:21:00 - [209] Originally by: Ginger Magician What are peoples opinions of this and do u think that u would be tempted to commit unlawful pvp in low security space knowing that for a month afterwards your victim can kill u anywhere in empire and all u could do was run away? It sounds to me like a "turnabout is fair play" situation. People whining about pirates or gatecamps on the boards are usually told to just run away, often with tips on how to run better. I fail to see why having to run from a fight is acceptable for a non-pirate, but unacceptable for a pirate.
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.16 07:33:00 - [210] Quote: This thread has 5000 views and 200 posts or soemthing like that.The last one u made had about 10 i think.I wonder why that is dont u? because the majorioty of the posts are here to laugh at you...and your not that well known took me 7 months to hear about you while i had heard fo the real well known people in my first 2 weeks. the only thing about you which is legendry is the size of your ego and how small your intelect is..they must be mutualy exclusive..as one get bigger the other shrinks. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept

Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.16 10:20:00 - [211] TO DEVS Doesnt this thread deserve a response? It has got more interest than many of the stickys.What is the future of piracy? Do u even care if it doesnt exist in future? Please give us some reponse. "you a ***** will remember you when i learn how to play game,you are the lowest scum i have ever encountered,small time punks like you have no concept of honour or the appliance of fair play"
Scalor Valentis	Posted - 2006.01.16 10:38:00 - [212] Dear ginger magican, you might feel that piracy is dead (and i got no idea why you feel that way). But that may be beacuse you are to short sighted to explore all the forms of it. (not stupid, just need someone to cure your myopia ) If you call piracy sitting in Battleship at gate and trying to kill indy or two, i pitty you. Never the less, as long you can activate a offensive module on player anywhere in space, no matter how nerffed and what consequenses, there will be piracy. You shuld talk to Viceroy, Siddy or Vex seraphim abaut new forms of piracy/anti piracy. or join Chanel: Team Dirkastan PW:Jihad where we can talk abaut present state of piracy, wich isint dead by long shot. Or go to Channel: D-C and amuse everyone with your sparkling personality btw, like my sig?
Asnar	Posted - 2006.01.16 10:47:00 - [213] Originally by: Ginger Magician This thread has 5000 views and 200 posts or soemthing like that.The last one u made had about 10 i think.I wonder why that is dont u? I've got this funny idea it's cause every single post you make is humorous enough to brighten ones day. Atleast that's why I come back to this thread. Poor Poor ginger the wannabee pirate boy. And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? -Nero Scuro
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.16 13:37:00 - [214] Originally by: Scalor Valentis Dear ginger magican, you might feel that piracy is dead (and i got no idea why you feel that way). But that may be beacuse you are to short sighted to explore all the forms of it. (not stupid, just need someone to cure your myopia ) If you call piracy sitting in Battleship at gate and trying to kill indy or two, i pitty you. Never the less, as long you can activate a offensive module on player anywhere in space, no matter how nerffed and what consequenses, there will be piracy. You shuld talk to Viceroy, Siddy or Vex seraphim abaut new forms of piracy/anti piracy. or join Chanel: Team Dirkastan PW:Jihad where we can talk abaut present state of piracy, wich isint dead by long shot. Or go to Channel: D-C and amuse everyone with your sparkling personality btw, like my sig? This post is so funny.Lets get to dissecting it anyway: Viceroy = currently a member of caldari provisions for 2 months with ss of -1.8 Siddy = member of evolution bob allaince ss 0.8 Vex seraphim = currently member of allasta ss -1.1 These players 2 of which r in noob corps while they might have been pirates previously have not been proper -10 pirates for a very long time.We are discussing todays state of affairs on TQ not past glories on this thread. Secondly u refer me to channel D-C : I know this channel well.If u go to it u will be very hard pressed to find any player -5 or more.Most of the discussions tend to centre on the size of females boobies and which are the best agents to run missions for to get snake implants or some other crap.Its hardly cutting edge or piracy. Thirdly how u have the cheek to even post on this thread is remarkable.Do u think i have forgotten u? You were the worst pirate in the history of metropolis region and after i poded u 3 times in a row and u had no ships or assets left in the game u ran off crying to play wow or some other crap and that was more than a year ago.Your mate Siddy is also residing in my morgue.I keep u side by side btw And that gentlemen is that "you a ***** will remember you when i learn how to play game,you are the lowest scum i have ever encountered,small time punks like you have no concept of honour or the appliance of fair play"
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.16 13:39:00 - [215] Originally by: Asnar And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? -Nero Scuro Ok Asnar, I'm going to put this into big simple words for you with lots of analogys so you can understand. Here we go, I hope you're taking notes. Piracy is a profession. A profession is when you do work for a profit. Now, it's hard to make a profit when for every piece of ISK you make you potentially have your ship blown out from under you. I would've thought this was obvious enough, but there you go. Now, imagine a producer who, every time he makes an item, he'll get a killright from a random person in EVE. And this producer makes tens or even hundreds of items a day. Now how the hell does he make a profit, with potentially every item he makes resulting in a ship death for him? Yes, he uses an alt to produce! Yay, alt spammage 4tw! I'm fine with sentries. I'm fine with eye for an eye. I'm fine with sec status and eventual bans from empire. What I'm not fine with is getting all of these and more all lumped on piracy because a bunch of miners couldn't be bothered to use the numerous devices available to them to either run or fight back. If you think pirates are being hypocrites, whining about carebears whining, then you're missing the essential difference. Carebears whined to have the game changed, pirates are whining to have the game changed back. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Bakkus	Posted - 2006.01.16 14:00:00 - [216] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Asnar And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? -Nero Scuro Ok Asnar, I'm going to put this into big simple words for you with lots of analogys so you can understand. Here we go, I hope you're taking notes. Piracy is a profession. A profession is when you do work for a profit. Now, it's hard to make a profit when for every piece of ISK you make you potentially have your ship blown out from under you. I would've thought this was obvious enough, but there you go. Now, imagine a producer who, every time he makes an item, he'll get a killright from a random person in EVE. And this producer makes tens or even hundreds of items a day. Now how the hell does he make a profit, with potentially every item he makes resulting in a ship death for him? Yes, he uses an alt to produce! Yay, alt spammage 4tw! . Your first comment made me giggle, but now im p*****g myself laughing id get someone to help you with your analogies next time When I was a child I had an imaginary friend who I would talk to whenever I had a problem, then I grew up and stopped going to church. ooo mind me nuts....
Cabadrin	Posted - 2006.01.16 14:24:00 - [217] I think we all know that this is what Ginger really needs. Originally by: Ginger Magician Mercenary Coalition are one the worst examples of cowardly gank squad lovers that i have seen in my in eve career.Not one of them could hold a candle to me in solo combat
Talos Darkhart	Posted - 2006.01.16 14:40:00 - [218] So basicly after spending a hard day shooting defenseless haulers and noob ships. You are worried that you may run into 1 of your victims in a combat ship and actually have to try real PvP. Because that is the impression I am getting from your whin ahemm complaining not that it matters since your so leet you can kill afew carebears right.
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.16 14:57:00 - [219] Originally by: Talos Darkhart So basicly after spending a hard day shooting defenseless haulers and noob ships. You are worried that you may run into 1 of your victims in a combat ship and actually have to try real PvP. Because that is the impression I am getting from your whin ahemm complaining not that it matters since your so leet you can kill afew carebears right. Real PvP would assume I was also in a PvP ship, right? Tell me, seriously, who is in a PvP ship 23/7? And it's not a matter of "well you get what you give" - this is a profession which you use to make a profit! This change just forces more pirates to use alt accounts so they don't have to deal with the consequences of their actions. Seriously, I'd have thought carebears would hate this change too - it doesn't give them more chances for revenge, it gives them less, because more pirates are now secure behind alt accounts thanks to this nerf. If I was pessimistic by nature I'd have thought the CCP did this on purpose just to get more accounts and money. On no, wait. I am pessimistic. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.16 15:04:00 - [220] Ok ok, so here's a list of piracy nerfs and what they mean, just for those not following so far; 1. Sec status hits - this means all pirates will have to work (killing NPCs) to enter empire, right? Wrong, they'll just use second accounts to bring them stuff from empire, etc. The 750k rat 'fix' also falls under this. 2. Sentry guns - to give victims a chance of fighting back. Except now all pirates snipe at gates, giving victims even less chance to fight back. 3. Eye for an eye - Same as sec hits, really. More alt account spammage. Wow, good job there CCP. You managed to do almost exactly the opposite of what you were supposedly aiming to do. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...

Talos Darkhart	Posted - 2006.01.16 15:12:00 - [221] Fair enough but it is not CCP's fault ppl use alt's to abuse the system in theory it works fine. Tbh i think it was brought in to reduce casual pirates and gankers as true hardcore pirates cannot go into empire anyway
Kurren	Posted - 2006.01.16 15:21:00 - [222] No, I wouldn't. ************************************************* Sobakai Resources, here for you!
Leto Nyx	Posted - 2006.01.16 15:25:00 - [223] Edited by: Leto Nyx on 16/01/2006 15:27:52 I got taken out by pirates in a 0.4 system over the weekend. These 'nerfs' didn't seem to bother them much. Originally by: Chinsor Well i don't see the eye for an eye thing as being a nerf to pirating, it will just filter out those not so good pirates I agree. The better pirates will carrying on pirating, and the not very good ones will put whining posts on the forums :-) Originally by: Talos Darkhart So basicly after spending a hard day shooting defenseless haulers and noob ships. You are worried that you may run into 1 of your victims in a combat ship and actually have to try real PvP. Sure looks that way :-) If I happen to be in a combat ship next time I run into those two buggers that podded me, I may well have a pop at them. I doubt the thought of that happening has them quaking in their boots much though, or will dissuade them from podding me again if they catch me napping. Piracy should be a risky profession. In response to the original post: Yes, I would still play probably, but I wouldn't enjoy it as much. I think the risk of running into pirates now and then heightens the tension and improves the game. I think it's only fair that we ought to be able to come hunt you down afterwards if we feel like it though.
Asnar	Posted - 2006.01.16 15:26:00 - [224] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Asnar And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? -Nero Scuro Ok Asnar, I'm going to put this into big simple words for you with lots of analogys so you can understand. Here we go, I hope you're taking notes. Piracy is a profession. A profession is when you do work for a profit. Now, it's hard to make a profit when for every piece of ISK you make you potentially have your ship blown out from under you. I would've thought this was obvious enough, but there you go. Now, imagine a producer who, every time he makes an item, he'll get a killright from a random person in EVE. And this producer makes tens or even hundreds of items a day. Now how the hell does he make a profit, with potentially every item he makes resulting in a ship death for him? Yes, he uses an alt to produce! Yay, alt spammage 4tw! I'm fine with sentries. I'm fine with eye for an eye. I'm fine with sec status and eventual bans from empire. What I'm not fine with is getting all of these and more all lumped on piracy because a bunch of miners couldn't be bothered to use the numerous devices available to them to either run or fight back. If you think pirates are being hypocrites, whining about carebears whining, then you're missing the essential difference. Carebears whined to have the game changed, pirates are whining to have the game changed back. Could you translate that into something that uses short simple words, and no analogies. Cause this version doesn't ehm make any sense at all. It's so bad even, that if it was a bit shorter I'd probably add it to my sig as well, but that's got that nasty char limit these days. Oh, and I think it's quite noble of you to come out in the open and admit that you abuse the alt system to avoid the consequences of your ebil lifestyle. And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? -Nero Scuro
Tony Fats	Posted - 2006.01.16 15:29:00 - [225] If there's no pirates then what's the point of the game. Just mining and ratting, to what end? Alliances can NAP each other and just sit there sucking ore. Then what?
DoctorDanny	Posted - 2006.01.16 16:28:00 - [226] Edited by: DoctorDanny on 16/01/2006 16:32:12 Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Malka Badi'a The corps that died from the changes are the corps that refused to adapt. And how exactly do you adapt to potentially getting killed by everybody you kill? Oh yes, use an alt to do all your industry work. How stupid of me. You adapt by killing them again. The kill-rights thingy is great. People have the right to attack me, but when they do I have the right to attack them back. And since I'm better than they are they die. Again. On the topic of piracy being dead. Get real, I scourge low sec empire daily and my corp loves the occasional excursions into the Fountain region to find npc-ers. If you think there's no piracy anymore you should visit a TunDraGon Charity Collection or fly with the Exotic Dancers Club.
DoctorDanny	Posted - 2006.01.16 16:35:00 - [227] And for piracy being dead? How and where exactly? We visit low-sec Placid on a daily basis and we try to ransom/loot npc-ers in 0.0 whenever we can. TunDraGon holds regular Gate Charity Collections and a lot of us old-timers are <-5. The negative sec status is nasty, but that's what CCP invented alts for. If you dont like alts you can hire other people to fly your stuff to you in low-sec. I did this for TDG when I was a noob and it made me feel 'bad-ass' too.
Roshan longshot	Posted - 2006.01.16 17:00:00 - [228] What a thread.... Pirates in Eve? Not to my knowledge. Have not been any true pirates in a couple of years. Carebears whinning. No its the Gankers and PK'ers that do most of the crying on the forums. Would I still play? Yes I gave up trying to be a true pirate several months ago. Just know way of doing it short of gate camping..... Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter *pirate* or mixture of them all. [i]As read from the original box.
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.16 17:43:00 - [229] Originally by: Asnar Could you translate that into something that uses short simple words, and no analogies. Cause this version doesn't ehm make any sense at all. It's so bad even, that if it was a bit shorter I'd probably add it to my sig as well, but that's got that nasty char limit these days. Oh, and I think it's quite noble of you to come out in the open and admit that you abuse the alt system to avoid the consequences of your ebil lifestyle. Your inability to read a simple few paragraphs isn't my fault. And I don't use alts. Which is sorta my point, I want to be able to continue belt piracy (which is what I do, I've never tanked or sniped from a low sec gate, because I prefer to pirate in cruisers) without being forced to buy another account. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.16 18:10:00 - [230] Edited by: dantes inferno on 16/01/2006 18:12:13 yes there are problems with piracy..the sentry guns been the main one...they have created the gank/snipping mentality which is the curse of eve today...the problem is even if we remove sentry it will not stop the gankers/snipers there will always be the egotists such as magician here who will do it..so we cant remove the guns...so another solution must be found. eye for an eye does not mean you will be instantly killed...eve is big place..if you use the same caution in high sec you use in low and 0.0 you should be ok...instas/local/scouts (and as a member of an alliance im in a empire war most of the time so i do speak from expirience...at one point i had to watch out for a good 3000 people in highsec..so it is possible) ..its an annoyance but there are simple and effective ways around it..just step back for a second and utilise the advice all pirates give the whinning caerebars about entering low sec. sec status hits are a bit harsh and a bit to hard to get back...but this is just another example of ccp slowly pandering more and more to the caerbears at this rate in another 5 years eve will be the mining sim we all fear it will become. yes piracy is difficult...but i feel the changes made in RMR are the least of the proffesions problems..and if you can overcome the rest...there is no need for this caerebar style whinnige..though i know how you feel my chosen carrer has had a even bigger stealth nerf known as Uber lag..where any stly of 0.0 combat which is larger than 20 v 20 is now unplayable.... _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept

Velsharoon	Posted - 2006.01.16 18:32:00 - [231] Piracy isnt dead, not by a long shot. Check ATUF Killboard ^^ We adapt. Everyone else has to so we cant be exempt. However what is needed is some method to make it more profitable for carebears and pirates. A ransoming system would help, or the ability to use small ships at gates. Piracy shouldnt just be a frame of mind with regards to pvp, it should have game mechanics for the act of piracy such as cargo and mod scanners (lol).
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.16 19:19:00 - [232] Well if piracy isnt dead then im happy.However this afternoons experience for me was very depressing. I have 40mill sps and i have killed maybe 3000 or more ships. Today i could not kill several thoraxes due to their incredible new overtanking capacity 6-7 volleys of tech 2 cruise missiles would not kill these ships A wolf survived 8 volleys of tech 2 precesion cruise - in fact he tanked it quite easily and that was with a heavy nosferatu and medium neutralizer on his ship - I almost lost my bs to gate guns during this encounter as he constantly approached me and threw me out of warp several times - i finally manged to warp with 50% armor and im a shield tanker right now.his armor was still more than 50%. Its just a joke for the solo pirate now.At best u can kill a few noob tech 1 frigs and indies while under fire from guns - the rest will tank u or reach the gate before u can destroy them.Prior to RMR the only ships i could not kill at gates were heavy tanked bs.I have even soloed hac at gates - all now quite impossible I dont want to whine but what exactly are pirates supposed to do? Unless your in one the very few remaining large pirate corps and have 5 mates online u might as well log off/ Snip, Signatures should be Respectful and EVE Related. -Capsicum
Scalor Valentis	Posted - 2006.01.16 19:21:00 - [233] Originally by: Ginger Magician Your mate Siddy is also residing in my morgue.I keep u side by side btw And that gentlemen is that Siddy sed: you are a liar, and a bad one too but lets keep this flame free. I just give you a hint: You are not pirat, you are an "Outlaw"... How doi back my statement? i Never ever seen you "pirate anyone", you just shoot them down. And if its as big as you are? You dont shoot it. Lets face it ginger, you are LAST person in EVE that shuld talk abaut piracy
Gariuys	Posted - 2006.01.16 21:06:00 - [234] Originally by: Nero Scuro Originally by: Asnar Could you translate that into something that uses short simple words, and no analogies. Cause this version doesn't ehm make any sense at all. It's so bad even, that if it was a bit shorter I'd probably add it to my sig as well, but that's got that nasty char limit these days. Oh, and I think it's quite noble of you to come out in the open and admit that you abuse the alt system to avoid the consequences of your ebil lifestyle. Your inability to read a simple few paragraphs isn't my fault. And I don't use alts. Which is sorta my point, I want to be able to continue belt piracy (which is what I do, I've never tanked or sniped from a low sec gate, because I prefer to pirate in cruisers) without being forced to buy another account. Which is great, and I mean that. But then you've got to live with the consequences too. And I didn't decide those, CCP in their infite wisdom did. And I happen to agree with them. Murder victims get to shot at you, so you can kill them again, this time in their combat ready ship, which just means better loot. Right? I mean if you're such a great pirate you shouldn't have any problems killing off a lone carebear looking for revenge, right? ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.16 21:24:00 - [235] If you count alt-account pirates flying around in BShip gank squads indescriminately killing everything they see, then no, piracy is not dead. But then, I don't consider that piracy, I consider it a poorly disguised excuse to be an ******. It's not about how many kills you got. Go pat yourself on the back for that, but it doesn't pay the bills. Simply put; one account + no wish to snipe (or just generally be cheesy, ie. WCS spamming, all slots simply damage mods, sensor boosters and big guns, etc) = no piracy. If you do use multiple accounts or snipe or whatever, then yes, you probably don't think piracy is dead, because none of the recent changes really affect you. But could you at least try* and see where I'm coming from here? ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
babyblue	Posted - 2006.01.16 23:45:00 - [236] Originally by: Tony Fats If there's no pirates then what's the point of the game. Just mining and ratting, to what end? Alliances can NAP each other and just sit there sucking ore. Then what? But they don't just NAP and mine. They invent pretexts to attack each other. Sure they might be quiet for 2 or 3 months at a time, but they are just building for the next big move. It's like a board game to the meta-players. Offensive content. - Laqum
EMMIE	Posted - 2006.01.17 01:16:00 - [237] Yes, i think i would still be playing. Still like the game.
Brolly	Posted - 2006.01.17 02:03:00 - [238] So many words about the problems of piracy, or should it be challeges?. I'm not a pirate but I can still think of a myriad of ways of doing the job if I wanted. With the amount of mods, ships now available you should be laughing, not whinging. Maybe gankers should finally step out of their bs's, say goodbye to their spot by the gates they onve loved and embrace something more challenging or differant at least.
Jared VonBargen	Posted - 2006.01.17 03:17:00 - [239] Originally by: Ginger Magician This post is so funny.Lets get to dissecting it anyway: Viceroy = currently a member of caldari provisions for 2 months with ss of -1.8 Siddy = member of evolution bob allaince ss 0.8 Vex seraphim = currently member of allasta ss -1.1 These players 2 of which r in noob corps while they might have been pirates previously have not been proper -10 pirates for a very long time.We are discussing todays state of affairs on TQ not past glories on this thread. Secondly u refer me to channel D-C : I know this channel well.If u go to it u will be very hard pressed to find any player -5 or more.Most of the discussions tend to centre on the size of females boobies and which are the best agents to run missions for to get snake implants or some other crap.Its hardly cutting edge or piracy. because security status is the only measure of a pirate...maybe they dont want to get corded to go into high sec once in a while....it does indeed suck to have 1/2 the game off limits or face immediate death does it not?
BillyBong2	Posted - 2006.01.17 03:40:00 - [240] Nope, I like the risk of going into low sector space. I also like to fight back Siggy by Esturary

Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.17 09:33:00 - [241] Originally by: BillyBong2 Nope, I like the risk of going into low sector space. I also like to fight back I think the vaSt majority of EVE players feel this way.But the fact is low security is becoming less and less dangerous.If ur just travelling gate to gate and then station your risk of being attacked is now substantially less than before.If u got half a clue and u know how to tank your ship or fit wcs then low security is not really more risky than high. It just doesnt pay to kill ships at gates - belt piracy is next to impossible because of the wcs/no ransom methods .The only thing left for pirates is 0.0 low security is finished as far as piracy goes now. Snip, Signatures should be Respectful and EVE Related. -Capsicum
Sanaen Eydanwadh	Posted - 2006.01.17 10:50:00 - [242] I don't really know about piracy (this kill-rights thing sounds completely idiotic though?), but I'd agree that PvP in EVE has become more and more consensual. Which is a bad thing, if anyone cares about my opinion. And as far as I know, low-sec "dangerousness" has become a joke for a long time.
ImmortaL ZoorZ	Posted - 2006.01.17 13:16:00 - [243] Ginger Magician ransomed and killed my hauler in the first 3 weeks of my old characters life. I had just traveled 43 jumps to get to my new corp and he just poped me after I told him I had no money. Anyway that was one of the most exciting moments in my eve life out of all my char's his name...was Shatpank
Moneyspinner	Posted - 2006.01.17 14:01:00 - [244] Ginger Magician seems to like attacking newbies venturing into 0.4 space Is this the new fun for advanced pirates ? I had no chance in my literon earlier today. cheers
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.17 14:10:00 - [245] This thread has even surprised me 250 post and 6000 views.Thx to all those who have contributed to it so far. Maybe if we get to 100000 views we might get a dev reponse on the future of piracy Snip, Signatures should be Respectful and EVE Related. -Capsicum
Tsual	Posted - 2006.01.17 14:18:00 - [246] Mom let me add what someone said to a high sec miner in a different thread: Quote: Multiplayer games are all about interaction, you have to interact with others to solve a problem. -------------------------------------- Haanem ulwei, utnazhiram Hal'sha'roh mahiraam Hor'thul. The Universe is everything, the creation Hal'shah and the destruction Hor'thul.
Moneyspinner	Posted - 2006.01.17 14:31:00 - [247] Quote: it does indeed suck to have 1/2 the game off limits or face immediate death does it not? Very, very True! After today, I will not go below 0.5 space. I thought I would be safe just minding my own business docking into a station in 0.4 space.
Celestal	Posted - 2006.01.17 14:56:00 - [248] This is terrible the demise of the pirate is killing the game . Look at the results of the recent `nerfs` to piracy As they get more and more nerfed , people are leaving the game. subscriptions are falling on line numbers are falling . ccp are having to lay off staff due to reduced revenue Istvaan had to take a job at mcdunalds to pay his rent server is totally lag free due to low numbers of players Honestly I really dont see vast numbers of people leaving the game if low sec becomes a bit safer . Sitting 200km from the gate popping noobs , indies etc is hardly pirating let alone PvP . This thread should be renamed to something like `if ginger cant get easy kills popping noobs from 200km will you leave the game?` or alternatly `who is ginger and why is he such a whinger ?`
Quanteeri	Posted - 2006.01.17 14:59:00 - [249] Quote: This thread should be renamed to something like `if ginger cant get easy kills popping noobs from 200km will you leave the game?` or alternatly `who is ginger and why is he such a whinger ?` Now that there's funny, I don't care who ya are.
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.17 15:45:00 - [250] Can we all, at least, agree that this would be a better game without the gate camp gankers sniping people into oblivion as they appear from god knows how far away? It's not even really piracy...

Lifewire	Posted - 2006.01.17 15:57:00 - [251] Quote: Can we all, at least, agree that this would be a better game without the gate camp gankers sniping people into oblivion as they appear from god knows how far away? It's not even really piracy... Why this? I want to make ISK while pirating. We usually combine stationairy snipers with close range tankers to increase our efficiency. Why should the game be better without sniping??? EVE would just loose 1 option and piracy would be reduced to tanking sentrys or belt piracy. How do you want to know what is good piracy and what is bad piracy??? Did you ever try piracy? I did everything, belt piracy, 0.0 piracy, sentry tanking, trick killing, sniping, smartbombing, war declarations. For all those tactics there were topics about how lame it is to declare war or how lame it is to tank the sentrys or how lame smartbombing is and here how lame sniping is. It¦s allways the same: pirates are good at killing people - by default! And carebears want to change the game because they got killed too often. Forum:http://www.tundragon.com/forum/ Movies:http://www.tundragon.com/pub/eveclips Killboard:http://www.tundragon.com/
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.17 17:25:00 - [252] Originally by: Lifewire Why this? I want to make ISK while pirating. We usually combine stationairy snipers with close range tankers to increase our efficiency. Why should the game be better without sniping??? EVE would just loose 1 option and piracy would be reduced to tanking sentrys or belt piracy. How do you want to know what is good piracy and what is bad piracy??? Did you ever try piracy? I did everything, belt piracy, 0.0 piracy, sentry tanking, trick killing, sniping, smartbombing, war declarations. For all those tactics there were topics about how lame it is to declare war or how lame it is to tank the sentrys or how lame smartbombing is and here how lame sniping is. It¦s allways the same: pirates are good at killing people - by default! And carebears want to change the game because they got killed too often. Honestly, I don't care what is "good" piracy and what is "bad" piracy. I think it's lame that I warp in and get blown up in seconds by a couple of 13 year olds in battleships that get their rocks off blowing people up that have no chance of fighting back. It's annoying and makes the game less fun. I probably won't last long in this game, and gate gankers are a large reason behind it...
Alain Josviar	Posted - 2006.01.17 18:09:00 - [253] As the saying goes, "If you can't stand the heat then don't play in the fire." 'Piwates' crying about being ganked. Priceless.
Lifewire	Posted - 2006.01.17 19:37:00 - [254] Quote: Honestly, I don't care what is "good" piracy and what is "bad" piracy. I think it's lame that I warp in and get blown up in seconds by a couple of 13 year olds in battleships that get their rocks off blowing people up that have no chance of fighting back. It's annoying and makes the game less fun. I probably won't last long in this game, and gate gankers are a large reason behind it... Don¦t tell me you want to fight back 5 BS in your frigate. You made several mistakes if a sniper killed you. If you avoid doing these mistakes a sniper has NO CHANCE to kill you. So it¦s basically your fault if you get shot down by snipers. Learn what mistakes you did. Think about: - tracking of large guns - why some people warp to gate to 0km and you to 15km - why there is a map with "shipkills last hours" - why there is a warining when you enter 0.4. Once you find your mistakes you did your first steps into the correct direction! Posting on forums that a standard-tactic has to be nerfed is not the right way. Forum:http://www.tundragon.com/forum/ Movies:http://www.tundragon.com/pub/eveclips Killboard:http://www.tundragon.com/
Svetlana Scarlet	Posted - 2006.01.17 21:15:00 - [255] Originally by: Lifewire Don¦t tell me you want to fight back 5 BS in your frigate. You made several mistakes if a sniper killed you. If you avoid doing these mistakes a sniper has NO CHANCE to kill you. So it¦s basically your fault if you get shot down by snipers. Learn what mistakes you did. Think about: - tracking of large guns - why some people warp to gate to 0km and you to 15km - why there is a map with "shipkills last hours" - why there is a warining when you enter 0.4. Once you find your mistakes you did your first steps into the correct direction! Posting on forums that a standard-tactic has to be nerfed is not the right way. What I like are posts like these where people say if you don't like getting ganked just don't go where the gankers are (essentially -- or "cheat" and use instas), and then you see the same people two threads later calling "carebears" cowards for not flying into low sec space. Uh....one or the other guys. Personally, I wish combat a) took longer, so there would be time for reinforcements to arrive and b) was harder to extricate yourself from, so that you couldn't just run at the first sign of a fight, and c) everyone and their mother didn't have a battleship or three. Unfortunately, that would require a major overhaul of the entire game, so I don't think that is going to happen anytime soon. In the meantime, it would be nice if "pirates" had to do more than press the SMITE button on their keyboards to pop ships coming through a gate. Now, it's relatively easy to get through a blockade even without instas in a really fast frig, but doing it with something actually capable of fighting or carrying cargo is a bit more of a trick. -- QUARANTINED AND UNDER CURFEW FOR YOUR OWN SAFETY, PLEASE REMAIN IN YOUR HOMES wraithwerks.net
minnmirman	Posted - 2006.01.17 21:37:00 - [256] Damn Everyone should stop whining alltogether! Pirates are outlaws, thus things should continually be difficult for them, thus they have to find different ways to stay afloat, thus gate camping and such....THATS FINE, quit whining when carebears dont want to jumprope into your grasp Non pirates abide by laws, but that doesnt mean they dont have to be careful. Use the game mechanics to stay alive. Im a month old player and i can avoid gate camps....not to hard. Laziness deserves death....quit whining
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.17 21:46:00 - [257] Originally by: Lifewire Don¦t tell me you want to fight back 5 BS in your frigate. You made several mistakes if a sniper killed you. If you avoid doing these mistakes a sniper has NO CHANCE to kill you. So it¦s basically your fault if you get shot down by snipers. Learn what mistakes you did. Think about: Obviously, I'm not going to fight off five BS in a Frigate. But then, shouldn't a frigate be able to outrun and escape? I thought that was the whole point of smaller ships, they can't take down your big ship, but they're small and quick and can outrun you. Then again, much in this game seems rather backwords, so I could be wrong. Moreover, the gate gankers blast you in seconds, because they're completely set up for assault as you jump into the system, you're dead before you can align for warp. Quote: - tracking of large guns Meaningless for someone over 100 km away. Quote: - why some people warp to gate to 0km and you to 15km I'm warping into the system, so that's irrelevant. Quote: - why there is a map with "shipkills last hours" And they can set up a new camp at a new gate in a matter of minutes. Doesn't help the first dozen people caught. Quote: - why there is a warining when you enter 0.4. I'll put it to you this way: Would you be comfortable if the programmers decided that 0.4 and below Jump Gates were unstable and had a 5% chance of immediately causing your ship to blow up whenever you used them. You get a warning, so it's a fair deal, right? Quote: Once you find your mistakes you did your first steps into the correct direction! Posting on forums that a standard-tactic has to be nerfed is not the right way. For one thing, I did not post to the forums first, I merely replied to an already long thread, voicing my opinion. I didn't say "OMG! You blew up my ship!". The discussions was piracy and many here have mentioned gate camps. But let's turn this around: What's the benefit to the game of gate camps? How does a random chance of you getting ganked at each gate a benefit? It's not piracy. I'm not being forced to turn over my cargo or ransomed. It is simply malice from the lowest slime who get their jollies ruining someone else's day. This is supposed to be a game for recreation, creating situations whose only benefit is making people's lives more frustrating is simply wrongheaded.
minnmirman	Posted - 2006.01.17 22:01:00 - [258] sinclair, maybe you wouldnt mind if all pirates left, bu than you'd probably be playing a one player game.... Just cause you're bitter about losing a ship (who wouldnt be) gives you no right to **** and moan all the time. Also no right to not be careful. That said even when you're careful, sometimes that's not enough. Thats how life goes. Vow to someday kill the jerks and move on with your life
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.17 22:42:00 - [259] Edited by: David Sinclair on 17/01/2006 22:43:15 Originally by: minnmirman sinclair, maybe you wouldnt mind if all pirates left, bu than you'd probably be playing a one player game.... Just cause you're bitter about losing a ship (who wouldnt be) gives you no right to ** and moan all the time. Also no right to not be careful It may seem that I'm bitter over it, but I'm really not. Actually, I'm rather surprised how laconic I am about it. I don't even know who did it, and frankly don't care. I could look up the kill mail, but why bother? It's not like I can go back and kill them. Not only do I not have the power, but they can warp out long before I could get in range if I did. I'm not someone who seethes with hatred as so many do. So what's the point? This is a discussion of game theory, and so I'm writing my opinion. I simply don't believe that any system that involves ganking is a good thing. (By ganking, I mean ambushing people who have no chance of fighting back or escaping and virtually no risk of your own.) Your suggestion that if gate ganking was eliminated, somehow this would become a single player game is simply absurd. If you are going to enter this debate, at least have the courage to be honest. I don't believe that gate ganking adds anything to the game. If you do, let's hear it. What's the advantage? The disadvantage to allowing gate ganking is obvious: It increases the level of frustration, annoyance, and ill will; Three things you generally want to avoid in a recreational activity. Quote:** That said even when you're careful, sometimes that's not enough. Thats how life goes. Vow to someday kill the jerks and move on with your life What about my suggestion above to make all gates in 0.4 and below space unstable so that you have a 5% chance of having your ship blown up? I don't see the difference between that and gate ganking. I think the reason you immediately jump to "You're just whining!" is that we see the game from different perspectives. I view the game as recreation, something to do to have a bit of fun, not the center of my day. Many others view Eve as a lifestyle. Someone who views the game as a lifestyle is far more likely to take being ganked personally. I don't take it personally, it simply turns me off. I'll shut off Eve and play something else. The more it happens, the less time I'll spend playing Eve, and that leads to terminating the account in short order. Not the bitter "I hate you all, I'm quitting!", but from the simple lack of desire... getting gate ganked takes the fun out of your day, and the threat of it happening again drains the will to play more...
Crepiscule	Posted - 2006.01.17 22:48:00 - [260] Originally by: Aodha Khan Edited by: Aodha Khan on 13/01/2006 10:10:29 I can't see any nerf to pirates? Can someone explain please. I was a pirate for a bit. Was quite profitable if you choose the right targets. Couldn't understand what everyone was complaining about. If there were no pirate in Eve the game would have lost one of its most interesting options imo. Not just for the pirate but for the targets too. Your words remind me of another Khan from a log time ago. Fasil Khan. You wouldn't by chance be a relation of sorts?

Vang Vorkain	Posted - 2006.01.17 23:30:00 - [261] yes i would still play EvE.....dont miss seeing the player rats, glade there more backed down now! they allways say there needs to be risk Vs rewards! well they got what they wanted! now they have to risk poding some one now! GOOD FOR CCP!
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.17 23:39:00 - [262] Edited by: dantes inferno on 17/01/2006 23:40:39 Quote: but I'd agree that PvP in EVE has become more and more consensual. elaborate that please? ive seen nothing which makes pvp more consential or discourages it..on the contrary the latest changes encourages more pvp ...can flagging...encourages pvp in high sec as does kill rights...if you had said "pvp is now becoming that i can no longer choose when i want to do it alone but the victims can now choose to engage me when they feel like it as well" then i would agree.. but as it is you can still shoot people in low sec, the difference is they can get revenge..which increases the amount of non consensial pvp...and make show a caerbear or 2 the delights of pvp..which is always for the good _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.18 15:18:00 - [263] Originally by: David Sinclair But let's turn this around: What's the benefit to the game of gate camps? How does a random chance of you getting ganked at each gate a benefit? It's not piracy. I'm not being forced to turn over my cargo or ransomed. It is simply malice from the lowest slime who get their jollies ruining someone else's day. This is supposed to be a game for recreation, creating situations whose only benefit is making people's lives more frustrating is simply wrongheaded. The classic carebear attitude exemplified in this statement.However he makes an interesting point - what is the benefit of gate camps? The answer to this question is what makes the game tick.If there were no gate camps there would be far fewer ships destroyed in the game.Far fewer ships destroyed means far less demand for ships less demand for modules less demand for minerals less demand for ore less demand for moon materials etc etc etc. Unfortunately CCP have not realised this simple fact.Already the market for low end minerals and ore in the game has collapsed trit is now selling at around 1.50 as opposed to 2.00 a few weeks ago.Similar price drops have been seen in the market for other low end minerals.If there r no pirates in low security space we are going to see vast increases in the number of barge mining ops belt stripping ore in 0.4 and below as now goes on in higher security space. This is the inevitable result of the carebearing of low space - oversupply of all ships and modules prices dropping and dropping and ultimately its all the carebear miners and manufacturers who are going to suffer from this foolishness.Pirates will simply move to 0.0 space and continue their business there making 0.0 even more dangerous for inexperienced players than it is already surely the complete opposite of what CCP desire. Just watch this space. Snip, Signatures should be Respectful and EVE Related. -Capsicum
Chinsor	Posted - 2006.01.18 16:02:00 - [264] nicely summed up, and ultimately, its the pvpers that hold the power in this game. ---------------------------------------------
Minnky	Posted - 2006.01.18 16:21:00 - [265] Originally by: Kaaii Pirates are such a small percentage of EVE. As the corps grow in size, and expand, they contest with other corps which creates pvp. Eve has such a good RL twist. Just like in the Real World, Piracy has died out (nearly). YOu don't get highway man, you don't get Long John Silver anymore. As the 'civilised' and organised world creeps into every corner, and the 'eye's of the world cover more and more land the vast opens spaces that are unguarded become guarded. There is no less combat in the real world today than there has ever been, such is the same with EVE. Instead of pirates roaming the lo-sec's, it's corps now moving out in greater numbers and they are rubbing shoulders and fighting over territory, casting the light which then pushes out the lone pirates. Pirates fitghing as corps, aren't really 'pirates' at all imo. They're just agreesively defending whatever space they're in. True pirates can't really be in a corp or alliance - it goes against the definitiion or idea of pirating.
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.18 17:30:00 - [266] Originally by: Ginger Magician The classic carebear attitude exemplified in this statement. I love how people like to twist people into camps. "You don't like gate gankers, so you must be a carebear!" The opposite is true. I'm all for PvP. I love massive engagements. I love taking people on in a good fight. However, ganking turns this on its head. There's no skill involved. No bravery. No risk. Quote: However he makes an interesting point - what is the benefit of gate camps? The answer to this question is what makes the game tick.If there were no gate camps there would be far fewer ships destroyed in the game.Far fewer ships destroyed means far less demand for ships less demand for modules less demand for minerals less demand for ore less demand for moon materials etc etc etc. If that's your reasoning, answer my query above: What's the difference between gate gankers and having unstable gates in lowsec that have a 5% chance of blowing up your ship whenever you use them? Quote: Unfortunately CCP have not realised this simple fact.Already the market for low end minerals and ore in the game has collapsed trit is now selling at around 1.50 as opposed to 2.00 a few weeks ago.Similar price drops have been seen in the market for other low end minerals.If there r no pirates in low security space we are going to see vast increases in the number of barge mining ops belt stripping ore in 0.4 and below as now goes on in higher security space. This is the inevitable result of the carebearing of low space - oversupply of all ships and modules prices dropping and dropping and ultimately its all the carebear miners and manufacturers who are going to suffer from this foolishness.Pirates will simply move to 0.0 space and continue their business there making 0.0 even more dangerous for inexperienced players than it is already surely the complete opposite of what CCP desire. Just watch this space. I can turn this argument around, too. More mining operations in low sec means more belt piracy. Pirates could set up belt camps, where instead of just ganking anyone that comes in, charge them a tax to mine. Sort of like the Mafia protection rackets. "You pay a fee to mine my belt, and I'll keep your ship safe.... of course, if you don't pay me, the chances of your barge having an accident is pretty high..." Jump gate camping encourages ganking, rather than trying to negotiate or whatnot. People are just interested in passing through, not getting anything specific out of the gate, and the time window is pretty short. Easier just to gank and be done with it. However, by guarding a juicy belt that miners want to actually spend time at, the "protection racket" becomes more lucrative. It also means a better transition from high sec to low sec to 0.0. Consider this: "High sec == Safe" "Low Sec == Safe Gates, dangerous elsewhere" "0.0 == UnSafe" This gives a better transition to 0.0. Piracy in 0.0 is more easily dealt with via PvP, since no one has to worry about taking sec hits or kill rights. You also are suggesting that cheaper ships and equipment is a bad thing. I disagree wholeheartedly. Cheaper ships/equipment means more of the real PvP action, since the cost of losing a ship is far less, it will encourage peopel to PvP.
Lt Hole	Posted - 2006.01.18 17:36:00 - [267] Pirates are not dead. They are still ganking people in empire. There's people squealing every day on the forums about pirates, gankers, griefers, etc. CCP doesn't need to fix anything. Ginger Magician needs to stop being a one trick pony and adapt.
Cylynex	Posted - 2006.01.18 18:47:00 - [268] Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: BillyBong2 Nope, I like the risk of going into low sector space. I also like to fight back I think the vaSt majority of EVE players feel this way. Really? Check your map for number of active pilots and number of pilots in space, any hour of any day. I think you'll find that no, most people don't like that risk. Most players are in 0.5-1.0 empire space. I am usually in low security because I need to be to run my operations. While I see the advantages some pvp brings to the game, a lot of it is senseless attacks and ganking that most people don't want to be bothered with. Alliance wars and spats? Hells yeah, that's fun. Random ganking of anyone who comes along? zzzzzzzz. It's part of the reason WHY most people don't want to go to 0.0. There will never be infrastructure or real player empires, because at the end of the day, anyone can shoot anyone. There is no law, which can also be seen as very cool if you like that playstyle. However, again going by the facts, most players do not. There really is no way to counter that fact, because anyone can look themselves and see that. But please, don't take my word for it. Look at the map, it doesn't lie.
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.18 19:57:00 - [269] Originally by: Cylynex Originally by: Ginger Magician Originally by: BillyBong2 Nope, I like the risk of going into low sector space. I also like to fight back I think the vaSt majority of EVE players feel this way. Really? Check your map for number of active pilots and number of pilots in space, any hour of any day. I think you'll find that no, most people don't like that risk. Most players are in 0.5-1.0 empire space. I am usually in low security because I need to be to run my operations. While I see the advantages some pvp brings to the game, a lot of it is senseless attacks and ganking that most people don't want to be bothered with. Alliance wars and spats? Hells yeah, that's fun. Random ganking of anyone who comes along? zzzzzzzz. It's part of the reason WHY most people don't want to go to 0.0. There will never be infrastructure or real player empires, because at the end of the day, anyone can shoot anyone. There is no law, which can also be seen as very cool if you like that playstyle. However, again going by the facts, most players do not. There really is no way to counter that fact, because anyone can look themselves and see that. But please, don't take my word for it. Look at the map, it doesn't lie. Everybody enters low sec. Just many people don't stay for long, certainly not AFK for hours like in empire. And if you removed non-con PvP from low-sec space, then it just becomes empire. So all you want is empire and 0.0? Or do you not even want 0.0...? ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...
Wanoah	Posted - 2006.01.18 20:17:00 - [270] Quote: Pirates are not dead. They are still ganking people in empire. There's people squealing every day on the forums about pirates, gankers, griefers, etc. It's not the fact that piracy is dead that is the problem. It's the fact that it's been reduced to dull gameplay for the most part by successive changes. Ultimately, we want fun, challenges, risks and rewards. Sniper @ 150km offers precious little of these for anyone. Barriers - An Eve Novel

Kalixa Hihro	Posted - 2006.01.18 20:22:00 - [271] Is this a trick question?
Wanoah	Posted - 2006.01.18 20:26:00 - [272] Quote: There is no law, which can also be seen as very cool if you like that playstyle. However, again going by the facts, most players do not. There really is no way to counter that fact, because anyone can look themselves and see that. That's pretty much something that is at the heart of Eve. CCP say, "Here's some tools." We say, "Thanks devs! We can work together and make our own laws." A lot of those people huddled fearfully in high sec are often people that have been grossly misinformed about the dangers of low sec and 0.0. Some guy lost a ship once and he tells everyone he knows that you get instaganked the second you jump into a 0.4. In actual fact, if you have an ounce of intelligence, you can live quite happily in low sec with very few problems. There is some risk, sure, but it's more than compensated for. Live in 0.0, and it's actually safer than in Empire a lot of the time. Barriers - An Eve Novel
Tribunal	Posted - 2006.01.18 20:57:00 - [273] Originally by: Wanoah A lot of those people huddled fearfully in high sec are often people that have been grossly misinformed about the dangers of low sec and 0.0. Some guy lost a ship once and he tells everyone he knows that you get instaganked the second you jump into a 0.4. In actual fact, if you have an ounce of intelligence, you can live quite happily in low sec with very few problems. There is some risk, sure, but it's more than compensated for. Live in 0.0, and it's actually safer than in Empire a lot of the time. 0.4 - 0.1 is an absolute hell-hole atm. If you do not have instas then you are doomed to be ganked at a gate by a pirate gang, and if you get caught on the other side of a gate with anything larger then a cruiser then you can kiss your butt gooodbye. This is the life I live in Eve by working out of a 0.2 system. Personally I would not recomend anyone in Empire trying to live out in 0.4 - 0.1 as it simply requires too much a risk to your isk investments. I have yet to see where pirates are adding anything to the game besides headaches. The only people who enjoy conflicts with pirates are the ones who can easily risk ships because thier wallet is very fat. 0.0 safer then Empire? You are either in an alliance or you are lying, because 0.0 is NOT safe for small corps or freelancers. I have to use a fast, fast frig to get past the choke points, work out a deal for a BS when I finally get past the choke points, work out an area to store my goods, and then I can actually attempt to make isk. When I am finally making isk I am a hunted man. 0.0 safe.. yeah.. preach on sister, because I know what's in the book and it's not what I am hearing from you.
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.18 21:37:00 - [274] Quote: I have to use a fast, fast frig to get past the choke points, work out a deal for a BS when I finally get past the choke points, work out an area to store my goods, and then I can actually attempt to make isk. then your not doing it right, ive got to get my bs through HED-GP which is camped 90% of the time by people who realyl dont like my alliance much, then i got the nice trip through corridor, which means i pass through space infested with gate camps, by the same people..made worse with the war we got atm..its very easy to survive in low sec and 0.0 if you use your brain..i moved into 0.1 at 2-3 weeks old,and rarley spend more that 2 days in high sec...if you keep your eyes open and think about it...its all to easy to avoid caerbear pirates. _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept
Tribunal	Posted - 2006.01.18 22:58:00 - [275] Originally by: dantes inferno Quote: I have to use a fast, fast frig to get past the choke points, work out a deal for a BS when I finally get past the choke points, work out an area to store my goods, and then I can actually attempt to make isk. then your not doing it right, ive got to get my bs through HED-GP which is camped 90% of the time by people who realyl dont like my alliance much, then i got the nice trip through corridor, which means i pass through space infested with gate camps, by the same people..made worse with the war we got atm..its very easy to survive in low sec and 0.0 if you use your brain..i moved into 0.1 at 2-3 weeks old,and rarley spend more that 2 days in high sec...if you keep your eyes open and think about it...its all to easy to avoid caerbear pirates. Um, what am I not doing right? The only differences in our two post is that you have a 0.0 alliance (so working in your alliance space is not a logisitcal nightmare) and the fact that you risk getting a BS past choke points instead of a fast frig. My goal in going to 0.0 is to make isk. Losing a BS at a choke point = minus isk.
Wanoah	Posted - 2006.01.18 23:24:00 - [276] Originally by: Tribunal Originally by: Wanoah A lot of those people huddled fearfully in high sec are often people that have been grossly misinformed about the dangers of low sec and 0.0. Some guy lost a ship once and he tells everyone he knows that you get instaganked the second you jump into a 0.4. In actual fact, if you have an ounce of intelligence, you can live quite happily in low sec with very few problems. There is some risk, sure, but it's more than compensated for. Live in 0.0, and it's actually safer than in Empire a lot of the time. 0.4 - 0.1 is an absolute hell-hole atm. If you do not have instas then you are doomed to be ganked at a gate by a pirate gang, and if you get caught on the other side of a gate with anything larger then a cruiser then you can kiss your butt gooodbye. This is the life I live in Eve by working out of a 0.2 system. Personally I would not recomend anyone in Empire trying to live out in 0.4 - 0.1 as it simply requires too much a risk to your isk investments. I have yet to see where pirates are adding anything to the game besides headaches. The only people who enjoy conflicts with pirates are the ones who can easily risk ships because thier wallet is very fat. 0.0 safer then Empire? You are either in an alliance or you are lying, because 0.0 is NOT safe for small corps or freelancers. I have to use a fast, fast frig to get past the choke points, work out a deal for a BS when I finally get past the choke points, work out an area to store my goods, and then I can actually attempt to make isk. When I am finally making isk I am a hunted man. 0.0 safe.. yeah.. preach on sister, because I know what's in the book and it's not what I am hearing from you. I spent the best part of 2005 living in either low sec or 0.0. The picture you paint bears little relation to the reality I see. Barriers - An Eve Novel
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.19 15:24:00 - [277] Originally by: Wanoah That's pretty much something that is at the heart of Eve. CCP say, "Here's some tools." We say, "Thanks devs! We can work together and make our own laws." A lot of those people huddled fearfully in high sec are often people that have been grossly misinformed about the dangers of low sec and 0.0. Some guy lost a ship once and he tells everyone he knows that you get instaganked the second you jump into a 0.4. In actual fact, if you have an ounce of intelligence, you can live quite happily in low sec with very few problems. There is some risk, sure, but it's more than compensated for. Live in 0.0, and it's actually safer than in Empire a lot of the time. At first, I took the advice of people like you and did not fear 0.1-0.5 so much. I always checked the "recent kills" map, but didn't worry so much... I got my Indy blasted out from under me by a newly set up gate ganker squad. There was no way I could know they were there. I jumped into the system, so no insta. No thanks, it's not worth it. The margins are slightly smaller in high-sec, but not worth losing a few million in cargo by a couple of thirteen year olds who get off sniping people from 150k away. From what I can tell, the transition from 1.0-0.5 -> 0.4-0.1 -> 0.0 is out of whack. 0.4->0.1 is the haven for pointless gate-gankers.
Matthias DuBastyra	Posted - 2006.01.19 15:42:00 - [278] Yes Yes Yes! I would certainly continue to play! Shut them down! Shut them all down! I would love a universe of all 1.0 space. Make everything Veldspar and Scordite! Tritanium for everyone and Pyerite for just a select few so we can all build and sell stuff and keep our property safe so we can charge rent! And let the rats shoot only snowballs and Concord just assign penalties for being at the wrong place at the wrong time. hmmm....Kinda sounds like a computerized version of Monopoly. Nah, I like PVP better even with RMR revisions. I don't PVP but I did get podded recently and now knowing I can go after the fool that did it just spurs me on to excel in this game. Matthias DuBastyra Imperiadux Quote: "He Who Controls the Spice, Controls the Universe" Baron Harkonen
Sanaen Eydanwadh	Posted - 2006.01.19 15:43:00 - [279] Originally by: Wanoah Originally by: Tribunal [low-sec is a hell you get ganked whatevr you do by roaming sharks all around] I spent the best part of 2005 living in either low sec or 0.0. The picture you paint bears little relation to the reality I see. yup, I second that, I always wonder where is this super-dangerous low-sec people are talking about in these forums. I've spent all my life in EVE in low-sec or 0.0, and very rarely encountered troubles. Yes I'm part of an alliance - but anyway I don't remember ever having to ask for help to alliance because of such troubles. But indeed you may "need" (?) friends to survive more efficiently - well, is that a bad thing? oops off-topic already. sorry, but was just amazed. :x
Nero Scuro	Posted - 2006.01.19 15:49:00 - [280] Originally by: David Sinclair At first, I took the advice of people like you and did not fear 0.1-0.5 so much. I always checked the "recent kills" map, but didn't worry so much... I got my Indy blasted out from under me by a newly set up gate ganker squad. There was no way I could know they were there. I jumped into the system, so no insta. So fit your lows with nanos so you warp out instantly? Iteron V + lows full of nanos = warps out v. fast. Originally by: David Sinclair No thanks, it's not worth it. The margins are slightly smaller in high-sec, but not worth losing a few million in cargo by a couple of thirteen year olds who get off sniping people from 150k away. Wow, possessing the obvious psychic ability you have to tell somebodies age from across the internet, I don't now how those gate gankers caught you unawares. Originally by: David Sinclair From what I can tell, the transition from 1.0-0.5 -> 0.4-0.1 -> 0.0 is out of whack. 0.4->0.1 is the haven for pointless gate-gankers. You can thank the carebears for that, for introducing sentry guns with either force you to; a. tank, which leaves you vunerable to retribution. There is no tank so solid it can easily ignore sentry gun fire - even a single T1 frig can push a tanker's setup over the edge and get themselves WTFpwned by sentry fire, especially if the frig webs and scrambles them and leaves the helpless to the sentries. b. snipe, which ignores sentries and leaves the pirate free from retribution. Whap sentry range up to 250km and reduce dammage a bit (or introduce tracking!) and you'd see an end to the irritating snipers. ___ The world isn't going to end; we're not that lucky...

Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.20 11:27:00 - [281] The effects of these nerfs r starting to be felt on the market. Tritanium price has dropped dramatically and i have noticed a number of complaints from miners that low end ore is not worth mining anymore.This drop in price of trit has undoubtedly been caused by fall in demand for ships since rmr came out as less are being blown up.It must be extremely rare that a bs is destroyed in 0.1 to 0.4 space now and those are of course the biggest users of trit. I wonder if there is any way to check the stats of ships destroyed pre and after rmr. Snip, Signatures should be Respectful and EVE Related. -Capsicum
Madswede	Posted - 2006.01.20 13:14:00 - [282] Originally by: David Sinclair If that's your reasoning, answer my query above: What's the difference between gate gankers and having unstable gates in lowsec that have a 5% chance of blowing up your ship whenever you use them? Big difference. Gate gankers can be avoided by skill, fittings, scouting and brains, oh and by killing them if you have the power. All this is fun and can give rise to interesting situations. Getting killed 1 in 20 times just by jumping through a gate? Not fun. ----------------------------------------------
Zolofine	Posted - 2006.01.20 13:16:00 - [283] Most of the complaining seems to be done by people who are trying to brave low sec or 0.0 on their own. This is a stupid idea! EVE is and always has been an MP game. Some things in EVE simply cannot be done by yourself. Get some friends together and make a corp, join a corp, join an alliance... whatever. Just stop complaining when you cannot do everything in the game by yourself! I mean what's the end goal here? To have your own personal, private titan? Wtf are you going to do with it?! O_o Look it's pretty simple. If you are in this game to mine and fly around in indies and nothing else... Then stay in high sec, acknowledge that everyone with the same play-style does the same thing and realize that it translates to stiff competition and less money for you. Feel like cutting out a bit more profit? Then go to low sec, and realize that it means defending yourself. This means you will prolly have to cancel exhumers lvl 5 and train stuff like gunnery lvl 2. Gankers are easy, get some buddies together, unfit your mining lasers and put in guns and kill them. Then you move your cargo through the gate = easy. How do you know where gankers are? Easy, you get a buddy to fly ahead in a shuttle or a frig and keep him talking. This is essentially the same as if you would operate in 0.0. However it's still very sandbox modeish because you can't have a huge fleet come over to camp you in for a couple days. You won't be in the cross-hairs of huge wars, merely small skirmishes. The harassment of aggressors will always be mild to non existent in low sec space. That doesn't mean it's not there at all. It means that you always have to be prepared. You don't afk mine and fly through space, you need to be ready to defend yourself. The way to win in EVE is through cooperation, coordination and solid teamwork. You can't do this by yourself, and you can't do this is you are careless and oblivious to your surrounding. Surviving in low sec space is sooooo easy! The only rules are: DON'T be asleep and DON'T be by yourself. And those rules aren't even written in stone because some people are the exception to them. I'm not making this up! Try it and see for yourself! There are so many benefit to low sec empire compared to 0.0 or high sec. You have stations in the same system as your base of operations. You have the advantage of concord governed space! Only a few jumps from a central trade hub where you can sell ALL your goodies. LOADS of ore to mine, rats to hunt etc etc. And really all, the only damn thing, you need to really do is just not be asleep, have a gun ready and have some friends to work together with. Now if you cannot even accomplish these very simple things, then take a look at the situation and realize that maybe you don't deserve making the extra isk and having the extra fun. I mean, if all you're going to do is the same amount of effort and planning as in the sandbox then how do you ever expect to gain an advantage?! That's like a bumb in peru begging for coins on the street and dreaming about how much better the US would be to go beg coins... You want EVE in sandbox mode, then don't leave the sandbox! You want to step up your game and be that type of person to work his way up? Then step up! OR.. shut up ;-)
Mog Datix	Posted - 2006.01.20 15:30:00 - [284] Originally by: Ginger Magician The effects of these nerfs r starting to be felt on the market. Tritanium price has dropped dramatically and i have noticed a number of complaints from miners that low end ore is not worth mining anymore.This drop in price of trit has undoubtedly been caused by fall in demand for ships since rmr came out as less are being blown up.It must be extremely rare that a bs is destroyed in 0.1 to 0.4 space now and those are of course the biggest users of trit. I wonder if there is any way to check the stats of ships destroyed pre and after rmr. Nope, read the macro miner sticky - belts are being stripped way more than ever nowadays, hence the market is flooded with low end minerals. As for the initial question, yes, I'd still play.
David Sinclair	Posted - 2006.01.20 15:33:00 - [285] Originally by: Madswede Big difference. Gate gankers can be avoided by skill, fittings, scouting and brains, oh and by killing them if you have the power. All this is fun and can give rise to interesting situations. Getting killed 1 in 20 times just by jumping through a gate? Not fun. How so? I jump in to a newly set up gate gank camp. (No way to spot them on the map) They've got a pair of battleships and virtually instalock on me. Sure, if I had a battleship of my own, maybe I could tank it out. But I don't have the cash or SP for that. So, for all intents and purposes, low-sec space is a 5% chance of warp core explosion every time I use the gate. Sure, someone playing for 2 years with a major alliance behind them and all the tech and SP they could want finds Gate Gankers really amusing. For those of us who haven't, it's simply a random chance of losing your ship. Low-sec simply isn't worth it. It's maybe 10% more profitable, but one gank will set you back much further. Sure, your ship can be insured, but not the three mil in cargo you were shipping. If you're hauling, for instance, you make money on the margins. The higher margins aren't enough to justify the losses. Sure, you could lower the risks a little by fitting all nano's, but that cuts into your cargohold, lowering the margins. In high-sec, I can load cargo expanders and slow-boat massive loads with no worries. If you're mining, you're a sitting duck. In order to make it worth grouping with someone else, the profit would have to be more than double. It isn't. If you're running combat missions or complexes, it isn't as bad, since you'll often be staying in one system, and you'll be in a combat ship. From what I can tell, the gate gankers are after easy kills. You come through in a BS or HAC and they'd probably just leave you alone. In order to make it worthwhile, low-sec has to either be safer at the gates or far more lucrative to justify the inevitable losses.
Ginger Magician	Posted - 2006.01.20 17:13:00 - [286] Originally by: Mog Datix Originally by: Ginger Magician The effects of these nerfs r starting to be felt on the market. Tritanium price has dropped dramatically and i have noticed a number of complaints from miners that low end ore is not worth mining anymore.This drop in price of trit has undoubtedly been caused by fall in demand for ships since rmr came out as less are being blown up.It must be extremely rare that a bs is destroyed in 0.1 to 0.4 space now and those are of course the biggest users of trit. I wonder if there is any way to check the stats of ships destroyed pre and after rmr. Nope, read the macro miner sticky - belts are being stripped way more than ever nowadays, hence the market is flooded with low end minerals. As for the initial question, yes, I'd still play. Not true.Macros were with us long before RMR.But the sharp fall in price of low mins only occured after RMR.Explain that. Snip, Signatures should be Respectful and EVE Related. -Capsicum
dantes inferno	Posted - 2006.01.20 17:20:00 - [287] Edited by: dantes inferno on 20/01/2006 17:25:00 Edited by: dantes inferno on 20/01/2006 17:21:58 Quote: Not true.Macros were with us long before RMR.But the sharp fall in price of low mins only occured after RMR.Explain that. 1)the massive increase of macrominers 2) and the mineral price drop was before rmr, as i could buy trit for less than 2 isk each, pyrite for roughly 5 isk each. while before the macor invasion i would buy trit for 3 isk and pyrite for 7 3) the minerals are still dropping at roughly the same rate as before rmr, if not at a slower rate since rmr....twisting the facts to suit your argument will not really fool the countles people who buy minerals to build their ships...or those who sell them and tbh plenty of ships get blown up without pirates, alliajce and corp wars wil account for more ship losses than any pirate group...take SA vs FIX well over a 1000 ships have been lost in a month..the majority of which are BS. then you have 5 vs pa/nbsi V vs RA..so there are still enough deaths to pvp even if you gate gankers have stoped (which i doubt that many have only the caerbear pirates would of..even if they have) _____ "When mothers warned their children that the monster would get them, that monster was me. I was the nightmare that kept


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