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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 15 post(s) |
Fix Lag
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
585
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Posted - 2013.10.23 02:22:00 -
[1291] - Quote
IT'S SPELLED "SIPHON" YOU BLITHERING IDIOT |
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
477
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 02:22:00 -
[1292] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Lessons learned
Shooting at stationary structures is boring
Waking up every morning and having to clean up the mess made while you were asleep is boring
See: station ping-pong pre-sov, repairing station services. Having to do something tedious every day before you can actually play the game is not cool
Making something tedious will not stop players doing it if it's very clearly the best option. They'll do it, and they'll hate it
See: everything involving starbases. You've got to remember that these are just simple miners. These are people of the land. The common clay of New Eden. You know... morons. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4918
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 03:26:00 -
[1293] - Quote
Falin Whalen wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote:Lessons learned
Shooting at stationary structures is boring
Waking up every morning and having to clean up the mess made while you were asleep is boring
See: station ping-pong pre-sov, repairing station services. Having to do something tedious every day before you can actually play the game is not cool
Making something tedious will not stop players doing it if it's very clearly the best option. They'll do it, and they'll hate it
See: everything involving starbases. The CFC likes to fight on the principle of no fun allowed.
This is great There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
6
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 05:49:00 -
[1294] - Quote
Orakkus wrote:Kenneth Feld wrote:To ANYONE upset about these siphon units
Medium and Heavy units are next
They will target advanced components from complex reactions as well as fullerines
You might as well save some tears for that... Was this info given out at Eve Vegas, or is there some other place we could confirm?
yes, but if you read the original dev blog it was right there. I have quoted it for you in case you missed it:
This hopefully gives you a good overview of how siphon units will function. WeGÇÖre looking into more versions of siphon units to add later (like in Rubicon 1.1). Larger variations would steal more, but take more room and potentially cost fuel to run. Other variations could steal additional types of materials, such as complex reactions or polymer reactions. |
GetSirrus
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
55
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 05:58:00 -
[1295] - Quote
why should the siphon bother with a limited amount of theft in moon goo. why not just emulate the behavior of POCO? a siphon is just a tax for the non vigilant? or can we make poco tax in minerals instead of isk, with a limited hopper - after all its all the same thing, right? |
Andrea Griffin
732
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Posted - 2013.10.23 13:11:00 -
[1296] - Quote
CCP, if you're making Goonswarm this angry, you must be doing something right. Please continue.
These Siphons should encourage people who run moon mining operations to be active in their space. I hope to see more capabilities against passive income streams in the future. Will I be able to deploy a hacker module and steal researching BPOs next? CCP Sreegs is my favorite developer. |
Sgt Ocker
State War Academy Caldari State
26
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 13:55:00 -
[1297] - Quote
Fix Lag wrote:IT'S SPELLED "SIPHON" YOU BLITHERING IDIOT I'm not a yank and choose to spell it the way it is spelt in English
Syphon Definition Maybe you need to learn how to use a dictionary to check facts before name calling
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Sgt Ocker
State War Academy Caldari State
26
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Posted - 2013.10.23 14:12:00 -
[1298] - Quote
Andrea Griffin wrote:CCP, if you're making Goonswarm this angry, you must be doing something right. Please continue.
These Siphons should encourage people who run moon mining operations to be active in their space. I hope to see more capabilities against passive income streams in the future. Will I be able to deploy a hacker module and steal researching BPOs next? Sorry but where do you get the idea moon mining is passive? Basically what your asking for is ways to increase your ability for making passive income.
To all those who believe moon mining is easy isk and passive.. Go set up a few pos's and try it for a month, be prepared to not be able to do much of anything else though
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Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
1451
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 14:34:00 -
[1299] - Quote
Sgt Ocker wrote:Fix Lag wrote:IT'S SPELLED "SIPHON" YOU BLITHERING IDIOT I'm not a yank and choose to spell it the way it is spelt in English Syphon DefinitionMaybe you need to learn how to use a dictionary to check facts before name calling The in-game structure will be called "Siphon". However other words with a similar meaning are spelled in whatever language is irrelevant. Calling it a "syphon" is just as incorrect as "sif+¦n" or "-ü-+-ä-+-+". |
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
477
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 15:20:00 -
[1300] - Quote
Andrea Griffin wrote:CCP, if you're making Goonswarm this angry, you must be doing something right. Please continue.
These Siphons should encourage people who run moon mining operations to be active in their space. I hope to see more capabilities against passive income streams in the future. Will I be able to deploy a hacker module and steal researching BPOs next? If by "angry," you mean fabulously wealthy, then yes, please continue with this. You do realize that by making 10-20% of moongoo go poof, you raise the price of moongoo. If we hold the majority of good moons, where does the majority of the money go to buy the moongoo? That is right, right into our pockets. What do we care that a few pennies are stolen, here and there, from our money vault, by those that will actually get to steal some moongoo from us.
Please continue to bleat, "Goon Tears," as you continue to shove money into our pockets You've got to remember that these are just simple miners. These are people of the land. The common clay of New Eden. You know... morons. |
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Zakhin Desver
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
10
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 15:34:00 -
[1301] - Quote
Falin Whalen wrote:Andrea Griffin wrote:CCP, if you're making Goonswarm this angry, you must be doing something right. Please continue.
These Siphons should encourage people who run moon mining operations to be active in their space. I hope to see more capabilities against passive income streams in the future. Will I be able to deploy a hacker module and steal researching BPOs next? If by "angry," you mean fabulously wealthy, then yes, please continue with this. You do realize that by making 10-20% of moongoo go poof, you raise the price of moongoo. If we hold the majority of good moons, where does the majority of the money go to buy the moongoo? That is right, right into our pockets. What do we care that a few pennies are stolen, here and there, from our money vault, by those that will actually get to steal some moongoo from us. Please continue to bleat, "Goon Tears," as you continue to shove money into our pockets
That's correct if we assume you will be the only ones not being affected by the theft of resources. To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo.
The term is "overstretching", you can't attack and defend everything at the same time. |
Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
1479
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 15:39:00 -
[1302] - Quote
Zakhin Desver wrote:That's correct if we assume you will be the only ones not being affected by the theft of resources. To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo.
The term is "overstretching", you can't attack and defend everything at the same time.
Tell us more about nullsec warfare, bro.
Official Representative of The Nullsec Zealot Cabal |
Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
1452
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 15:44:00 -
[1303] - Quote
Zakhin Desver wrote:To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo. Confirming trial alts logged out at POSes reduces the number of people to peeveepee.
There is a clear optimal solution to having your towers siphoned, and it doesn't involve real people wasting their time flying from POS to POS to POS. |
Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
1479
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 15:47:00 -
[1304] - Quote
Abdiel Kavash wrote:Zakhin Desver wrote:To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo. Confirming trial alts logged out at POSes reduces the number of people to peeveepee. There is a clear optimal solution to having your towers siphoned, and it doesn't involve real people wasting their time flying from POS to POS to POS. It is also probably the worst example of pointless timewaster mechanic CCP has implemented so far.
Nailed it.
Official Representative of The Nullsec Zealot Cabal |
Orakkus
Wraithguard. Dirt Nap Squad.
219
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 15:48:00 -
[1305] - Quote
Zakhin Desver wrote: That's correct if we assume you will be the only ones not being affected by the theft of resources. To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo.
The term is "overstretching", you can't attack and defend everything at the same time.
A lot of wishful thinking here. We HOPE that this is how it will play out. With the change to how many a particular pilot can drop (and I hope CCP also does not allow trial accounts to place them either, which may already be the case depending on the skillset required), that has improved the chances that it will be just that.
The big problem is with Goonswarm's moon operations being so large, along with the amount of actual space they cover with their coalition friends, that it will be harder to "hurt" Goonswarm. Remember, the sweet underside of Goonswarm is going to be deeper into null-sec and will require more time and effort to maintain a presence that could hurt them. To be fair, Goonswarm probably has more to worry about from blues than it will ever have to fear from opponents in the long term.
Now, that being said, I am not saying it isn't possible that this could be the bane of Goonswarm. It is just that Goonswarm has a lot of advantages that are above and beyond a typical alliance. In addition, what Falin wrote is also very correct. Any disturbance that causes market prices to increase will benefit Goonswarm, at least in the short term. Potentially, Goonswarm could be hurt by long term concerted efforts to KEEP siphoning Goonswarm moons.. but that would require a significant level of organization. Though, it is doable. He's not just famous, he's "IN" famous. - Ned Nederlander
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Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
479
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 15:56:00 -
[1306] - Quote
Zakhin Desver wrote:Falin Whalen wrote:Andrea Griffin wrote:CCP, if you're making Goonswarm this angry, you must be doing something right. Please continue.
These Siphons should encourage people who run moon mining operations to be active in their space. I hope to see more capabilities against passive income streams in the future. Will I be able to deploy a hacker module and steal researching BPOs next? If by "angry," you mean fabulously wealthy, then yes, please continue with this. You do realize that by making 10-20% of moongoo go poof, you raise the price of moongoo. If we hold the majority of good moons, where does the majority of the money go to buy the moongoo? That is right, right into our pockets. What do we care that a few pennies are stolen, here and there, from our money vault, by those that will actually get to steal some moongoo from us. Please continue to bleat, "Goon Tears," as you continue to shove money into our pockets That's correct if we assume you will be the only ones not being affected by the theft of resources. To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo. The term is "overstretching", you can't attack and defend everything at the same time. Let's just say that we are in a better position to do just that, than everyone else. You've got to remember that these are just simple miners. These are people of the land. The common clay of New Eden. You know... morons. |
Zakhin Desver
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
10
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 16:00:00 -
[1307] - Quote
Abdiel Kavash wrote:Zakhin Desver wrote:To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo. Confirming trial alts logged out at POSes reduce the number of people to peeveepee. There is a clear optimal solution to having your towers siphoned, and it doesn't involve real people wasting their time flying from POS to POS to POS. It is also probably the worst example of pointless timewaster mechanic CCP has implemented so far.
Nice, because the waste of time and the inability to do PVP was one of your reasons to nerf the syphons. I love you guys. After 20 more pages the syphons probably will be boosted thanks to your posts. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4922
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 16:57:00 -
[1308] - Quote
Varius Xeral wrote:Abdiel Kavash wrote:Zakhin Desver wrote:To achieve such thing, you should have patrols at all times, which reduces the number of effectives to do real PVP, therefore other alliances can take advantage of your greed for moongoo. Confirming trial alts logged out at POSes reduces the number of people to peeveepee. There is a clear optimal solution to having your towers siphoned, and it doesn't involve real people wasting their time flying from POS to POS to POS. It is also probably the worst example of pointless timewaster mechanic CCP has implemented so far. Nailed it. There's some chaps who love timewaster mechanics.
Structure shoots
Reinforcement timers
Blueballing There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
481
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 17:04:00 -
[1309] - Quote
Please CCP, don't throw us in that there briar patch. You've got to remember that these are just simple miners. These are people of the land. The common clay of New Eden. You know... morons. |
Icesail
Applied Agoraphobia Sinewave Alliance
4
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 18:58:00 -
[1310] - Quote
With all this bitching and moaning on both ends of the stick, this initial addition of siphoning to the game will have little effect to garnering more interaction via pvp.. It does however give those with moons an opportunity to over inflate the price. Given that we currently don't know what current stockpile that the majority moon holders have. The prices could already be over inflated because they're sitting on it. Even if someone drops a siphon on a pos, it takes only from the harvesting array. Not the silo (which would be A LOT more interesting which would justify the complaining in this forum). If any group that will take advantage of this first iteration of moon goo siphoning, it will be the large alliances that have the resources to flood the eve world with the siphons on their enemies.. I won't benefit from siphons this time but I hope CCP moves it in a direction going forward to actually benefit the small groups. I know that I was excited to first hear of guerrilla warfare and siphoning but it certainly isn't as grandiose as they would like you to believe.. CCP's idea of guerrilla warfare is weak as well.. |
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Orakkus
Wraithguard. Dirt Nap Squad.
220
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 19:09:00 -
[1311] - Quote
Icesail wrote:I won't benefit from siphons this time but I hope CCP moves it in a direction going forward to actually benefit the small groups. I know that I was excited to first hear of guerrilla warfare and siphoning but it certainly isn't as grandiose as they would like you to believe.. CCP's idea of guerrilla warfare is weak as well..
The threadnaught on this is pretty big, so you can easily miss the part where CCP indicates that it does not classify this mobile unit as part of any "guerilla warfare". They mostly were referring to the warp accerlation and speed changes as well as the mobile cyno jammer unit. He's not just famous, he's "IN" famous. - Ned Nederlander
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Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
352
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 19:29:00 -
[1312] - Quote
Abdiel Kavash wrote:Sgt Ocker wrote:Fix Lag wrote:IT'S SPELLED "SIPHON" YOU BLITHERING IDIOT I'm not a yank and choose to spell it the way it is spelt in English Syphon DefinitionMaybe you need to learn how to use a dictionary to check facts before name calling The in-game structure will be called "Siphon". However other words with a similar meaning are spelled in whatever language is irrelevant. Calling it a "syphon" is just as incorrect as " sif+¦n" or " -ü-+-ä-+-+".
Did you take lessons in being a moron or is it just a natural talent? |
Icesail
Applied Agoraphobia Sinewave Alliance
4
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 19:53:00 -
[1313] - Quote
Orakkus wrote:Icesail wrote:I won't benefit from siphons this time but I hope CCP moves it in a direction going forward to actually benefit the small groups. I know that I was excited to first hear of guerrilla warfare and siphoning but it certainly isn't as grandiose as they would like you to believe.. CCP's idea of guerrilla warfare is weak as well.. The threadnaught on this is pretty big, so you can easily miss the part where CCP indicates that it does not classify this mobile unit as part of any "guerilla warfare". They mostly were referring to the warp accerlation and speed changes as well as the mobile cyno jammer unit.
I caught it in the post from CCP. I was pointing out that I as well as others thought it was going to be part of guerrilla warfare when it was first announced. I was disappointed when they said otherwise. Ultimately the first iteration of the siphoning is a minor nuisance to some and a waste of time for making isk. One can only hope that CCP does better on the progression of this potentially game changing addition.
The 2 additions for guerrilla warfare are weak. CCP, shake it up instead of the little girls fart you're currently giving us! |
Orakkus
Wraithguard. Dirt Nap Squad.
221
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 19:58:00 -
[1314] - Quote
Icesail wrote: I caught it in the post from CCP. I was pointing out that I as well as others thought it was going to be part of guerrilla warfare when it was first announced. I was disappointed when they said otherwise. Ultimately the first iteration of the siphoning is a minor nuisance to some and a waste of time for making isk. One can only hope that CCP does better on the progression of this potentially game changing addition.
The 2 additions for guerrilla warfare are weak. CCP, shake it up instead of the little girls fart you're currently giving us!
Yeah, I was of that same opinion as well, and was also likewise disappointed when CCP stated it too. However, I would disagree with you on the Warp Acceleration/Speed being a weak change. By what I've read and what I've tested, that is going to be a huge change. But that is getting off the Syphon topic, which I agree still could use some work.. and some clarification with the larger versions. He's not just famous, he's "IN" famous. - Ned Nederlander
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Catherine Plume
Reisende des Schwarzschild Grenze
0
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 20:44:00 -
[1315] - Quote
Finally ! 6 years after I and others submited the idea of ninja moon mining, it is going to be implemented !
Love you CCP !
Link to old forums post #106 |
PotatoOverdose
SONS of LEGION RISE of LEGION
427
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 22:45:00 -
[1316] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Varius Xeral wrote:Abdiel Kavash wrote: Confirming trial alts logged out at POSes reduces the number of people to peeveepee.
There is a clear optimal solution to having your towers siphoned, and it doesn't involve real people wasting their time flying from POS to POS to POS. It is also probably the worst example of pointless timewaster mechanic CCP has implemented so far.
Nailed it. There's some chaps who love timewaster mechanics. Structure shoots Reinforcement timers Blueballing Cognitive dissonance is an amazing thing. Anytime changes to mechanics are suggested, you throw a fit if that suggestion doesn't include timers.
And here, on the one hand you say that Siphons will be ineffectual because they'll be easily countered by an army of alts. On the other hand, you say the same ineffectual siphons will cut into moon goo supply making you wealthier. Lol.
Grasping at straws much? |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4923
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 22:47:00 -
[1317] - Quote
PotatoOverdose wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Varius Xeral wrote:Abdiel Kavash wrote: Confirming trial alts logged out at POSes reduces the number of people to peeveepee.
There is a clear optimal solution to having your towers siphoned, and it doesn't involve real people wasting their time flying from POS to POS to POS. It is also probably the worst example of pointless timewaster mechanic CCP has implemented so far.
Nailed it. There's some chaps who love timewaster mechanics. Structure shoots Reinforcement timers Blueballing Cognitive dissonance is an amazing thing. Anytime changes to mechanics are suggested, you throw a fit if that suggestion doesn't include timers. And here, on the one hand you say that Siphons will be ineffectual because they'll be easily countered by an army of alts. On the other hand, you say the same ineffectual siphons will cut into moon goo supply making you wealthier. Lol. Grasping at straws much? Trolling. Or doublethink. Whichever makes you feel most comfortable ignoring whatever is posted by a goon There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |
PotatoOverdose
SONS of LEGION RISE of LEGION
427
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 22:51:00 -
[1318] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote: Trolling. Or doublethink. Whichever makes you feel most comfortable ignoring whatever is posted by a goon
I do hope the larger siphons can be stronted. This expansion will be so much fun. Winter is coming. |
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
487
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 23:25:00 -
[1319] - Quote
I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them. As always I let some edge cases stay. Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil!
The rules: 2. Be respectful toward others at all times.
The purpose of the EVE Online forums is to provide a platform for exchange of ideas, and a venue for the discussion of EVE Online. Occasionally there will be conflicts that arise when people voice opinions. Forum users are expected to be courteous when disagreeing with others.
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.
Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated.
5. Trolling is prohibited.
Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote. ISD Ezwal Lt. Commander Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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Herr Esiq
Dirt Nap Squad
76
|
Posted - 2013.10.24 10:47:00 -
[1320] - Quote
If moonming is so damned unprofitable after the patch, why not pull down the POS and deal with it?
Or raise the prices, like thats never been tried/done before.
Just sayin'.. |
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