Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .. 23 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Orion Hellscream Chanlin
Reverberation Inc
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 16:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
War is a necessary part of Eve - without wars and general pvp the market will become saturated and would threaten the financial infrastructure that is finely balanced.
But now I see some corps wardec 8 or 10 others at a time - they can afford to pay this as they will catch miners in T2 ore ships and the loot will pay for a prolonged campaign. However many of the wardecced corps will merely suffer the inconvenience of war, having to switch to alts, or temporarily leave their corp to continue playing their game normally.
That is when they are out-matched and unlikely to combat this wardec from a hostile corp.
I have heard of many people leaving Eve, rather than do any of the alternatives mentioned. After several wardecs they have grown tired of the losses, inconvenience, and the ease at which a hostile corp can wardec so many others with a relatively minimal initial outlay.
In truth, wardeccing should be expensive. It should be a final resort, not a casual affair done by pvp-corps to pass the time. There should be a limit to the number of corps they can 'dec at any time. I would put that at 3.
The price should escalate over weeks, doubling every week.
As we see in real life, war is not declared cheaply and is done rarely.
I am concerned that the wardeccers will drive away the others who wish to enjoy the rest of the elements Eve has to offer. While they serve a purpose they may harm the enjoyment of the majority of capsuleers. |
Solstice Project
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
4318
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 16:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
If they leave because of a basic game mechanic, then it's no loss.
Edit: War is declared rarely in real life? Ever heard of the USA?
Edit2: Have you considered the incoming wardecs because of this thread? |
Jythier Smith
WATERSHIP HOLDINGS Harmonic Convergence
22
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 16:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
The best part of this game is starting a corporation, getting going with making a name for it, and as soon as you do anything that even remotely bothers anyone, you're wardec'd and going to lose everything. |
Orion Hellscream Chanlin
Reverberation Inc
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 16:50:00 -
[4] - Quote
If the ISK is increased for wardecs then its been a worthwhile effort IMO.
I don't think CCP would like to see a mechanic that drives people to play another game, at least they won't want that to be an easy option in their game.
But like I said, war IS a necessary part of Eve and those who play accept that. Just it must be made harder to dec so many at any given time. |
March rabbit
True Horde
858
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 16:53:00 -
[5] - Quote
Jythier Smith wrote:The best part of this game is starting a corporation, getting going with making a name for it, and as soon as you do anything that even remotely bothers anyone, you're wardec'd and going to lose everything. wardec doesn't mean "lose everything". it only means someone will have rights to engage you.
As person from FW i can assure you - this is not as big problem as you think. |
Cyborg 497
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:04:00 -
[6] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:If they leave because of a basic game mechanic, then it's no loss.
Edit: War is declared rarely in real life? Ever heard of the USA?
Edit2: Have you considered the incoming wardecs because of this thread?
I think you just proved his point about wars being too easy and too trivially declared. I agree they should up-the-ante and make it more costly to the aggressor - it should never be a money-making exercise, and it does harm the main game mechanic.
So go ahead, dec me! |
Velicitia
Emergent Avionics
1776
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:08:00 -
[7] - Quote
Wars are fine. The problem is the people who believe (wrongly) that they should be allowed to mine (or whatever) in complete peace and without any outside interaction (ganking, wars, whatever). |
Malcolm Shinhwa
Bad Touches
609
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:17:00 -
[8] - Quote
For most hisec corps or players a wardec is trivial to avoid. So if you are quitting because of them you probably aren't cut out for the rest of the nasty Eve has to offer. |
Anslo
The Scope Gallente Federation
3047
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
I thought wars DID get more expensive the longer they lasted....if they don't, then yeaaaah that should be fixed. |
Baaldor
In Igne Morim Easily Excited
161
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
Orion Hellscream Chanlin wrote:If the ISK is increased for wardecs then its been a worthwhile effort IMO.
I don't think CCP would like to see a mechanic that drives people to play another game, at least they won't want that to be an easy option in their game.
But like I said, war IS a necessary part of Eve and those who play accept that. Just it must be made harder to dec so many at any given time.
The WAR dec thing has already been Nerfed. Pitboss and the Privateers got a red hot poker in the ass because they were good at it.
And the whine about war decs has been around for a very long time and the whine is the same as it is today, "Players will leave, Eve will die!!"
Are we dead yet? |
|
Khergit Deserters
Crom's Angels
1860
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
If you're in a newbie corp and get wardecced, you just have to be patient. The wardec will go away someday. Sure, being almost powerless against more experienced, shinier-shipped wardeccers is kind of frustrating and humiliating. But on the other hand, the challenge is really interesting. I can remember some excellent war room strategy discussions among my newb corp members. Much more interesting than discussing ship fits, L4 missions tactics, etc. In the end dealing with the wardec made the corp leadership smarter and made us tighter overall as a team. And the guys who were just in it for themselves left the corp. That was an added bonus. |
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
586
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:22:00 -
[12] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:Wars are fine. The problem is the people who believe (wrongly) that they should be allowed to mine (or whatever) in complete peace and without any outside interaction (ganking, wars, whatever).
Blaming customers for their expectations, and losing them as a result, is bad for business.
If I was CCP, I would attempt to protect those players a bit more effectively than they currently are. |
Baaldor
In Igne Morim Easily Excited
161
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:Velicitia wrote:Wars are fine. The problem is the people who believe (wrongly) that they should be allowed to mine (or whatever) in complete peace and without any outside interaction (ganking, wars, whatever). Blaming customers for their expectations, and losing them as a result, is bad for business. If I was CCP, I would attempt to protect those players a bit more effectively than they currently are.
Yes, lets dumb down this even more, and hold everyone's cackerybone. |
Danalee
EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective
207
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:28:00 -
[14] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:Velicitia wrote:Wars are fine. The problem is the people who believe (wrongly) that they should be allowed to mine (or whatever) in complete peace and without any outside interaction (ganking, wars, whatever). Blaming customers for their expectations, and losing them as a result, is bad for business. If I was CCP, I would attempt to protect those players a bit more effectively than they currently are.
The only thing EVE and CCP with it have going for them compared to any other lalaland MMOG is just the fact it's not dumbed down and sugercoated cotton candy land... yet Please don't take our EVE away.
D.
|
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
68042
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
Orion Hellscream Chanlin wrote:
But now I see some corps wardec 8 or 10 others at a time - they can afford to pay this as they will catch miners in T2 ore ships and the loot will pay for a prolonged campaign.
Thanks for the Comic GD Ridicu-Quote of the Day. I don't even sometimes................... |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
68042
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:34:00 -
[16] - Quote
Orion Hellscream Chanlin wrote:
I am concerned that the wardeccers will drive away the others who wish to enjoy the rest of the elements Eve has to offer. While they serve a purpose they may harm the enjoyment of the majority of capsuleers.
You sure expended a lot of "worry" for the past almost 11 years this has been going on without negative effect. Yup. 11 years, dude. |
Velicitia
Emergent Avionics
1777
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:35:00 -
[17] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:Velicitia wrote:Wars are fine. The problem is the people who believe (wrongly) that they should be allowed to mine (or whatever) in complete peace and without any outside interaction (ganking, wars, whatever). Blaming customers for their expectations, and losing them as a result, is bad for business. If I was CCP, I would attempt to protect those players a bit more effectively than they currently are.
CCP has always touted EVE as a dystopian universe ... nowhere in any of the ads or trailers (or news articles about "bad things" happening to people) have they even hinted at the possibility of being safe anywhere.
If someone can read/watch all of that and come to the conclusion that you can play EVE without forced (violent) interactions with other players, then their expectations were wrong in the first place. They should never have been a customer in the first place, much less a "lost" customer.
It's the same bogus argument that the *IAA uses -- "anyone who downloads [movie|song] represents a lost sale of that [movie|song]". |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
68060
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:39:00 -
[18] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:
It's the same bogus argument that the *IAA uses -- "anyone who downloads [movie|song] represents a lost sale of that [movie|song]".
This is actually a patently true statement. Such a process involves absolutely no sale or further monetary compensation towards the artist, and, sorry, that point cannot even be argued.
Great de-railer though, and most indeed. |
Khergit Deserters
Crom's Angels
1861
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
There's also the long-standing option of hiring mercs and the newer option of recruiting allies. Plus the old option of forming a "holding" corp and having everybody move into it until the wardec is over. There are some strategic options available. Real, unexpected challenges + variety of strategic and tactical options to consider = basic risk management-optimization of benefits that all living creatures have to do = interesting gameplay. |
Darth Khasei
Wavestar Business Ventures Inc.
133
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:50:00 -
[20] - Quote
Respect.
I mainly trade in EVE and have been known as the Merchant of Death. Clearly, war is needed in EVE for the enjoyment of some many other parties than the losing party that it cannot be ignored as integral to the survival of the game.
Those that leave over wars as called casualties and right now we have a more than acceptable casualty level in EVE.
Carry on... |
|
Laserak
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
140
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 17:53:00 -
[21] - Quote
Leave? No. War makes me log in. If theres no war I play other games. |
Velicitia
Emergent Avionics
1777
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:32:00 -
[22] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Velicitia wrote:
It's the same bogus argument that the *IAA uses -- "anyone who downloads [movie|song] represents a lost sale of that [movie|song]".
This is actually a patently true statement. Such a process involves absolutely no sale or further monetary compensation towards the artist, and, sorry, that point cannot even be argued. Great de-railer though, and most indeed.
There is no guarantee that a person downloading a song would have ever bought it in the first place, thus they cannot (by definition) be considered a "lost sale" (unless you're counting every single time someone walks past your item on the shelf as a "lost sale" ... in which case, everyone is guilty of causing serious economic harm to the *IAA and the artists they represent).
|
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
250
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:47:00 -
[23] - Quote
CCP has already done nerfs to wardecs, from increasing dec costs to allowing unlimited free allies to the defender.
Personally, the more CCP nerfs my chosen career around wars the more I am inclined to make the lives of carebears increased hell...
If you prick us, do we not bleed? If you wrong us, do we not revenge?
|
Dudley Schwartz
Magic Hamsters
109
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:52:00 -
[24] - Quote
Random idea: would it be a good idea to change the war mechanics, so that PVP corps/alliances can only war dec each other? When you create a corp you choose to register your corp either as a combat corp ( actively looking for PVP ) or industrial corp.
I don't think industrialists should be immune to being attacked ( at least they can still be ganked etc ). It is unfair for genuine industrial corps who choose not to PVP and are not interested in the PVP side if eve to be subject to prolonged grief, by PVP'ers who are searching for that easy kill.
Every player should have the option to choose how they want to play the game. Some players log in and want to PVP/PVE; some choose to mine ( each to their own is a good philosophy ).
A more direct answer to your question "does war make players leave eve?" In the case of high sec industrial corps being subject to prolonged grief by PVP'ers, then yes.
What is your opinion?
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
484
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:55:00 -
[25] - Quote
About the only issue with war decs is the fact that the cost is based on the defending corps size, not the attacking corps size. Which provides protection for the mega corps, as smaller entities struggle to pay that kind of money on a regular basis.
While if it was based on the attacking corps size, it would be easy for a swarm of piranha corps to circle a large corp/alliance with war decs, providing a check on growth for the super alliances. And make it more expensive for a large corp to grief a small corp with war decs & extortion.
Flipping that around wouldn't change most war decs though and would make a lot of the pure high sec ones cheaper (which isn't a super bad thing) |
ElQuirko
Jester Syndicate WHY so Seri0Us
2377
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:56:00 -
[26] - Quote
Darth Khasei wrote:I mainly trade in EVE and have been known as the Merchant of Death. By who? Your mother? |
Katsumoto Moliko
Salient Logistics Inc. The Explicit Alliance
15
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:57:00 -
[27] - Quote
Orion Hellscream Chanlin wrote:War is a necessary part of Eve - without wars and general pvp the market will become saturated and would threaten the financial infrastructure that is finely balanced.
But now I see some corps wardec 8 or 10 others at a time - they can afford to pay this as they will catch miners in T2 ore ships and the loot will pay for a prolonged campaign. However many of the wardecced corps will merely suffer the inconvenience of war, having to switch to alts, or temporarily leave their corp to continue playing their game normally.
That is when they are out-matched and unlikely to combat this wardec from a hostile corp.
I have heard of many people leaving Eve, rather than do any of the alternatives mentioned. After several wardecs they have grown tired of the losses, inconvenience, and the ease at which a hostile corp can wardec so many others with a relatively minimal initial outlay.
In truth, wardeccing should be expensive. It should be a final resort, not a casual affair done by pvp-corps to pass the time. There should be a limit to the number of corps they can 'dec at any time. I would put that at 3.
The price should escalate over weeks, doubling every week.
As we see in real life, war is not declared cheaply and is done rarely.
I am concerned that the wardeccers will drive away the others who wish to enjoy the rest of the elements Eve has to offer. While they serve a purpose they may harm the enjoyment of the majority of capsuleers.
In short, no. War does not cause players to leave the game.
Let me dispel the ambiguity between war and wardeccing for you; actual war does not need a permission slip from an NPC faction to shoot at a specific group of players who are unable or otherwise unwilling to fight back. |
Jarod Garamonde
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
597
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:57:00 -
[28] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:If they leave because of a basic game mechanic, then it's no loss.
Edit: War is declared rarely in real life? Ever heard of the USA?
Edit2: Have you considered the incoming wardecs because of this thread?
USA? Actually, our last declared war was Korea. Granted, the ONLY reason we haven't declared war since then is because there was never an armistice signed. We are actually STILL officially at war with North Korea, and NATO won't let us officially declare any other wars until we officially end that one..... which will likely never happen.
(so, yes.... that DOES mean North Korea is the victim of the worst perma-dec, in history... and we are the highsec griefers) |
Ifly Uwalk
Empire Tax Collection Agency
1037
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 18:58:00 -
[29] - Quote
Dudley Schwartz wrote:Random idea: would it be a good idea to change the war mechanics, so that PVP corps/alliances can only war dec each other? When you create a corp you choose to register your corp either as a combat corp ( actively looking for PVP ) or industrial corp.
I don't think industrialists should be immune to being attacked ( at least they can still be ganked etc ). It is unfair for genuine industrial corps who choose not to PVP and are not interested in the PVP side if eve to be subject to prolonged grief, by PVP'ers who are searching for that easy kill.
Every player should have the option to choose how they want to play the game. Some players log in and want to PVP/PVE; some choose to mine ( each to their own is a good philosophy ).
A more direct answer to your question "does war make players leave eve?" In the case of high sec industrial corps being subject to prolonged grief by PVP'ers, then yes.
What is your opinion? I've seen some bad posts in my time here (duh, it's GD) but this one takes the cake. |
Dudley Schwartz
Magic Hamsters
109
|
Posted - 2013.11.05 19:07:00 -
[30] - Quote
Ifly Uwalk wrote:Dudley Schwartz wrote:Random idea: would it be a good idea to change the war mechanics, so that PVP corps/alliances can only war dec each other? When you create a corp you choose to register your corp either as a combat corp ( actively looking for PVP ) or industrial corp.
I don't think industrialists should be immune to being attacked ( at least they can still be ganked etc ). It is unfair for genuine industrial corps who choose not to PVP and are not interested in the PVP side if eve to be subject to prolonged grief, by PVP'ers who are searching for that easy kill.
Every player should have the option to choose how they want to play the game. Some players log in and want to PVP/PVE; some choose to mine ( each to their own is a good philosophy ).
A more direct answer to your question "does war make players leave eve?" In the case of high sec industrial corps being subject to prolonged grief by PVP'ers, then yes.
What is your opinion? I've seen some bad posts in my time here (duh, it's GD) but this one takes the cake.
Bad post? maybe to you. I'm sure nearly all high sec industrialists in eve would agree that being griefed by PVP corps is game breaking for them (to some extent). Not got anything good to say on this topic? don't post at all =) |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .. 23 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |