| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Carka Gerschen
Ubiquitous Hurt
17
   |
Posted - 2013.12.09 08:56:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hello all,
I have been thinking about making a post like this for a while now and finally decided to go ahead and do it.
It seems to me CCP's main plan to promote streaming is to make the Twitch integration for Eve Online. While this may ofcourse make it easier for more people to stream, it is also a way to get a dozen small streams up at any time, that have nothing interesting to watch. I am not saying small streams are not interesting! I am just afraid that the only thing we will get is people streaming that don't even look at their twitch chat. Don't interact with their viewers etc. Or we will get a dozen intel cams as our main streams, which can be handy, but doesn't do much for the streaming community I think.
I just want to invite everybody to take a look at the current streamers to get an idea for what you like to see in streams and what you don't find interesting. I am always surprised when new streamers never watched any of the other Eve streams to see how you can run an eve stream.
I would love it if CCP would do something more to promote streaming, like having a featured stream up in game, or on the launcher, or on the website somewhere. Perhaps they can endorse streamers that do a good job with a "CCP likes this stream"-rating. They could run a highlight competition, Keep track of how often people stream and give them a T-Shirt for that. Have an interview with current streamers to ask them for the "secrets" to a good stream and building a viewer community. I don't care what they do, as long as something is done.
I hope everybody who will be streaming once the new twitch integration is released, will watch other great eve streams like:
http://www.twitch.tv/sirsqueebles
http://www.twitch.tv/loloforloki
http://www.twitch.tv/rushlock
http://www.twitch.tv/malik_fett
http://www.twitch.tv/fintarue
Or you can even watch me. I am sure I forgot a lot of streams here, but all these people are very active streamers and have a lot of interaction with the twitch chat. Which for me is what makes a stream interesting. I hope everybody who wants to stream can figure out what they find interesting and incorporate that in their stream, so we can get a good streamining community going.
By the way, downloading and setting up OBS should only take about 5 minutes, so nothing is holding you back to try making a stream before we get the Twitch integration.
Have fun and hopefully see you on Twitch,
Carka
|
Ramona McCandless
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1324
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:03:00 -
[2] - Quote
I guess the navigation, camp camp watch and fleet roam streams are useless for intel huh
Best bin it now then
High Priestess of The Temple of the Holy Amarr Suicide Cult of Haimeh
"You are, quite literally, the best person ever." --áDomanique Altares,-áRifterlings
"Send Ramona your ISK, and biomass." --áJarod Garamonde,-áSardaukar Merc Guild |
Carka Gerschen
Ubiquitous Hurt
17
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:07:00 -
[3] - Quote
Quote: Or we will get a dozen intel cams as our main streams, which can be handy, but doesn't do much for the streaming community I think.
This is what I wrote. So I am not saying Intel streams are not useful, they just don't build a community. They are just tools, not entertainment in my opinion.
Regards,
Carka |
Roime
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Samurai Pizza Cats
3762
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:08:00 -
[4] - Quote
Watching someone else play a video game is so ********, that the only thing more ******** is believing that someone wants to watch you streaming yourself playing a video game.
Notify-á-á You cannot do that while warping. |
Carka Gerschen
Ubiquitous Hurt
17
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:11:00 -
[5] - Quote
Thanks for your opinion Roime. If you feel like that, just don't watch! And preferably don't make troll posts like this as well.
Regards,
Carka |
Ramona McCandless
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1324
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
Carka Gerschen wrote:Quote: Or we will get a dozen intel cams as our main streams, which can be handy, but doesn't do much for the streaming community I think. This is what I wrote. So I am not saying Intel streams are not useful, they just don't build a community. They are just tools, not entertainment in my opinion. Regards, Carka
Yes, thats why I editted my comment and apologised.
Though I don't see the benefit in building a community or being entertained within an entertainment medium, I do not resist your right to do so.
High Priestess of The Temple of the Holy Amarr Suicide Cult of Haimeh
"You are, quite literally, the best person ever." --áDomanique Altares,-áRifterlings
"Send Ramona your ISK, and biomass." --áJarod Garamonde,-áSardaukar Merc Guild |
Angelica Dreamstar
Desperate Desire Inc.
3
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Whats the issue? Its like TV. Then they add it to CQ. A Nobrainer. |
Xercodo
Xovoni Astronautical Manufacturing and Engineering
3038
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:20:00 -
[8] - Quote
While the initial overload in bad streams is inevitable after this happens I'm sure the cream will rise like always.
I had just recently moved which put a big 3-4 month chunk into streaming, which I was doing semi regularly. I'm starting to get back into the swing of things and wanna try doing education EVE streams again :D
The Drake is a Lie |
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
552
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:20:00 -
[9] - Quote
Twitch integration is cancer. Even when forced to use the likes of XSplit/OBS, many streams are trash, and lowering the barrier to entry certainly isn't going to help matters. I had a look at the streams being generated by the PS4's integration and it made me want to kill myself (possibly slight hyperbole there, but you get the idea).
BTW OP, it's http://www.twitch.tv/lokoforloki (you dun typo'd), and I too highly recommend his stream.
Roime wrote:Watching someone else play a video game is so ********, that the only thing more ******** is believing that someone wants to watch you streaming yourself playing a video game. Reading a forum for a video game is so ********, the only thing more ******** is believing that someone wants to read what you have to say about a videogame.
[img]http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sig.php?r=*rnd*[/img]
Desusigs can be seen on the terribad new forums using bbcode enabling script (scroll down to my post for sig rotation) |
Carka Gerschen
Ubiquitous Hurt
17
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 09:36:00 -
[10] - Quote
Thanks Crumplecorn, changed the url in my post. |
Bel Tika
Dirty Rotten Scoundrel's
37
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 10:32:00 -
[11] - Quote
Sorry i dont see anything but pro's to this, ppl can use it to promote there corp an at same time promote eve, yes there will be rubbish streams so what?, what is necessarily interesting to you or me might not be to the next person and what you consider to be rubbish stream might be what that 1 hesitant new customer to eve needs to see to tip them over to joining.
Again i say what you consider to be a good stream others will not and what you consider to be a crap stream others could an possibly will enjoy
|
Carka Gerschen
Ubiquitous Hurt
18
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 10:45:00 -
[12] - Quote
@Bel Tika
Of course and that is exactly why I propose that people watch streams to see what they like and what they don't like before starting a stream themselves.
So I agree with you 100% and eventhough I got my own preferences, I don't think my original post tells anybody to like the same things I like.
Regards.
Carka |
Ramona McCandless
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1326
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 10:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
Still no closer to knowing what the problem is that integration isnt the solution to.
Is it lack of content?
High Priestess of The Temple of the Holy Amarr Suicide Cult of Haimeh
"You are, quite literally, the best person ever." --áDomanique Altares,-áRifterlings
"Send Ramona your ISK, and biomass." --áJarod Garamonde,-áSardaukar Merc Guild |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation
Goonswarm Federation
6766
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 10:58:00 -
[14] - Quote
I for one don't want bloat streaming **** in my EVE client, thanks.
Latest video - Pandemic Legion titan and supers killed |
Bel Tika
Dirty Rotten Scoundrel's
37
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 11:01:00 -
[15] - Quote
Carka Gerschen wrote:@Bel Tika
Of course and that is exactly why I propose that people watch streams to see what they like and what they don't like before starting a stream themselves.
So I agree with you 100% and even though I got my own preferences, I don't think my original post tells anybody to like the same things I like.
Regards.
Carka
Where as i say give it a go tweak to your own tastes and stream to your own liking, dont just go watch someone else stream an copy/paste what there doing, hopefully with the integration ppl will find twitch hell of a lot more accessible and easy to navigate if they never already and hopefully we see alot more diverse and interesting aspects of eve life being portrait.
|
GreenSeed
776
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 11:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
Twich integration is a bigger problem that most people think, it cements a monopoly. that cant be good for gaming at all, or any industry for that matter. if the game had an Open local API for outputting a stream, fine, that stream can be directed to any streaming relay service, but "twich integration"? **** that.
as far as "omg dev time is being wasted", no it isn't, almost all the tools are being provided by twich. the whole thing is as close as you can get to "Plug&Play" when it comes to software. still, considering the small presence the game has on streaming, even on youtube one has to wonder whats the real reason behind it. the game looks good and is interesting enough to draw a crowd, but any activity that might draw one is also one that can be severely harmed by streaming.
if i do a pick up fleet and go do sites in lowsec with a few noobs in t1 cruisers that can be fun to watch, and the eventual pvp will be great to show off how eve pve is the best there's is, so long as you don't do it in highsec... but guess what, if its streamed you will get ganked, regardless of delay, thanks to the free intel the map statistics give, local, locator agents, etc, etc.
that's the real reason you don't see much streaming of eve roams. in fact you don't see any, unless its a few dudes sitting next to a titan in nullbearland, waiting for a cyno to rolfstomp some renters.
you only see boring slugfests with no coms... i mean how can anyone think waiting 2 minutes for a cycle to finish be fun if you don't hear the randomness comms? most people who see one of those 2fps fights must walk away thinking "wtf that game is horrible".
the only good content ive seen lately being streamed was Monk's gank4good stream, and it was so because they didn't give a crap if people saw where they were ganking. |
Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
5724
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 11:13:00 -
[17] - Quote
I can't see any negatives in CCP making streaming easy. Having a larger pool of people streaming means you have a larger pool to draw the talent from and create more variety in the types of streams, which in turn will get more people interested in watching. People will naturally gravitate towards the good and already popular streams like they do in all services of this kind. It also doesn't matter if the first weeks of a new streamer are just bad quality boring drivel. One of two things will happen, either they'll improve themselves or be forgotten and ignored. There is no need for CCP to manage things, although there is no harm in highlighting the good stuff either. The natural behavior of the community will act as a self correcting mechanism. |
Carka Gerschen
Ubiquitous Hurt
18
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 11:30:00 -
[18] - Quote
@Ramona
CCP is getting the Twitch integration, because they want to promote streaming Eve. This can give them a lot of free publicity and with CCP people watching the streams and talking in the twitch chat, it also provides a way to get more in touch with the players. And I am sure there are even more reasons.
My concern is that just getting the Twitch integration is not the solution to what they want to accomplish. In my opinion they have to combine it with promoting streams, so we get more people checking out the eve streams.
Also everybody is talking about making it so much easier, but it really only takes 5 minutes to set up a stream, using OBS and Twitch at the moment, so it is not that hard to do without it.
Regards,
Carka |
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
47
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 11:58:00 -
[19] - Quote
If a stream has terrible content no one will watch or they will stop watching it fairly quickly, it's simply a form of supply vs demand. Good quality streams will survive, bad ones will be forgotten. We don't need regulation or policing. |
Ramona McCandless
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1327
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 12:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
Carka Gerschen wrote:@Ramona
CCP is getting the Twitch integration, because they want to promote streaming Eve. This can give them a lot of free publicity and with CCP people watching the streams and talking in the twitch chat, it also provides a way to get more in touch with the players. And I am sure there are even more reasons.
Ah I see why I don't really get the issue.
I don't really understand why they want to do any of that, much in the same way I utterly fail to understand why a company would ever want a Twitter stream either.
Niche market products often do not benefit from larger market awareness, in fact in some cases its viewed as detrimental to growth.
Speaking as someone who works in public relations, a certain amount of contact with your customer base is good, too much is simply awful and should really be avoided.
But as I said, I don't really understand the benefits, so I don't really think my objections would really add anything to the discussion.
But thanks for clearing that up for me all the same.
High Priestess of The Temple of the Holy Amarr Suicide Cult of Haimeh
"You are, quite literally, the best person ever." --áDomanique Altares,-áRifterlings
"Send Ramona your ISK, and biomass." --áJarod Garamonde,-áSardaukar Merc Guild |
Cypherous
Liberty Rogues
Aprilon Dynasty
27
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 12:22:00 -
[21] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:I for one don't want bloat streaming **** in my EVE client, thanks.
You wont even notice the 100mb or so HDD space it will use so stop complaining, its not like its going to impact system resource use unless you're actually using it, the same as CQ which is far less useful bloat that still has to eat space on my HDD :P
That being said i use OBS because most "integrated" options are pretty crappy by comparison |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation
Goonswarm Federation
6767
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 12:24:00 -
[22] - Quote
I'm sorry, but we are talking about CCP here, are we not?
Latest video - Pandemic Legion titan and supers killed |
Dextrome Thorphan
RvB - RED Federation
35
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 12:48:00 -
[23] - Quote
I never got why somebody would watch somebody else playing while they could be playing themselves...
Unless it's some big interesting alliance fight or alliance tournaments or something of course. |
Yomin Dranoel
Viziam
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 13:04:00 -
[24] - Quote
< Rushlock btw, thank you Carka for the mention o7
I believe the OP's main point (and certainly correct me if this is inaccurate) is that Twitch integration alone will accomplish little to nothing best case, and worst case lead to negative first impressions of EVE to first time viewers. Not that there is anything at all inherently bad about the integration itself, merely looking ahead to possible outcomes.
There is merit in many of the perspectives put forward in this thread, with the exception of "The sky is falling" reactions posted by a few. Personally I am more in the camp of, "the cream will rise to the top", but that does certainly mean some number of potential new EVE players will be missed out on until things settle. Short term this is very unfortunate, but in the long term it may work out.
As far as requesting or expecting CCP to take an active hand in promoting currently or even future existing casts, I think this is a tricky matter. Understandably, anything said in favor of CCP support seems self-serving, though with no CCP interaction at all, it is up to the players and current community itself to promote the broadcasts they want to see prosper and grow. This seems more inline with how CCP has handled most matters in the past, let the players sort it out, they'll police when needed. Yes, being more proactive is in CCP's financial interests, but the perceived risk may out weigh the perceived gain.
We may also be avoiding an elephant in the room. It has been mentioned in this thread that intel and station cam channels, while serving purposes as tools, are not exactly ideal for community building or impression making for new players/viewers. Yet this is only type of channel to receive a large push from CCP (For transparency sake, CCP was kind enough to Tweet/FB post, and use several other media outlets to promote my broadcast once, and it is greatly appreciated). Is this indicative of their interests, or an explanation for their hesitancy to promote any particular channel again? Personally I view it as the latter, and see no easy solution.
PS - Suggestion for OP, would there be any value in putting short descriptions of the channels you mentioned in the OP? For instance I'm sure the majority that read this thread are veteran players, and would be bored silly with my new-player oriented broadcast, but may find Zao/Squeeb/Fin to be great :) (I think Malik is stepping away for awhile?) |
Voi Lutois
The gaping maw
42
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 13:05:00 -
[25] - Quote
Gregor Parud wrote:If a stream has terrible content no one will watch or they will stop watching it fairly quickly, it's simply a form of supply vs demand. Good quality streams will survive, bad ones will be forgotten. We don't need regulation or policing.
yes. |
SpaceSaft
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
29
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 13:25:00 -
[26] - Quote
Not the solution to what exactly? Better streams? More viewers? A better game?
I don't watch streams so I basically don't care but I am curious what you were thinking it promised.
Besides that I also hold the opinion that CCP should make a PC version for Dust 514. |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
4880
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 16:12:00 -
[27] - Quote
I think integrated twitch will be as useful as the integrated voice comms that Eve has. Serious streamers, like serious voice comms users, will use 2nd part software with more features.
I also don't think it will be a bad thing though. Having thousands of bad blogs in the "push buttan, start blog" universe hasn't killed the blogging community. Having "bad" streams available to watch won't damage the streaming community.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17689
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 16:33:00 -
[28] - Quote
SoGǪ having not worked with Twitch, will this record the stream for future viewing automatically, or is that some kind of additional service you have to activate?
Because if it's built in, I can easily see this having a huge benefit for bug hunters: when you come up with a tricky heisenbug, they don't have to come back and ask for pages upon pages of reproduction steps and screen shots and so on. Instead, it'll be GÇ£record it and send me the URL so I can see it in actionGÇ¥.
Sure, you can do that already with fraps and uploading to youtube, but having it built into the client just removes so many steps.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Liu Ellens
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
103
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 18:20:00 -
[29] - Quote
Tippia wrote:SoGǪ having not worked with Twitch, will this record the stream for future viewing automatically, or is that some kind of additional service you have to activate?
It must be activated manually, once in your account settings. They, twitch, deactivated this automatic archiving most likely due to the huge data they generate.
I started streaming only a few days ago, it's an interesting way to get in contact with new people. Too bad though that some FCs want a 10+ minute delay. All this paranoia ends up with streams plastered with various black-outs (chat, system name, modules, locked targets, ...)
This integration is an entry-level tool, free advertising by new players that are unspoiled from all the meta and politics.
eve-kino - create machinimas with EVE assets in the browser
eve-upro - an online browser application to support navigation in New Eden and beyond. |
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
White Mountain Coalition
657
|
Posted - 2013.12.09 18:59:00 -
[30] - Quote
Carka Gerschen wrote:Quote: Or we will get a dozen intel cams as our main streams, which can be handy, but doesn't do much for the streaming community I think. This is what I wrote. So I am not saying Intel streams are not useful, they just don't build a community. They are just tools, not entertainment in my opinion. Regards, Carka
that twitch logo in the twitch control ui of the neocom is really immersion breaking it should be in the settings window so you can set it up then click a button to begin streaming in the game. The intel possibilities are interesting, though scouts will now play the game via remote control with their fc barking orders like pan left, warp to x show me dscan etc, might as well be a camera drone.
I don't mind streaming but I am concerned that ccp is damaging immersion. Plus does anyone know if the aforementioned fc would have to watch an advert every now and again, or is that only for paid accounts. I honestly don't know how twitch works, but it does make me ask if ccp are getting any money from their partnership with twitch.tv I am not accusing ccp of anything untoward I just don't know how it works and am musing aloud so to speak.
Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction... |
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |