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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17704
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:03:00 -
[31] - Quote
Kitty Bear wrote:if your point is 180m/hr as an income, I have some news for you LP is ISK transferal, not injection LP when converted into faction items function as an ISK sink No ISK is ever transferred through LP. It's a pure sink, through and through. Its nature doesn't affect the 180M ISK/h in the slightest, though. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Miasmos
Aliastra Gallente Federation
23
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:14:00 -
[32] - Quote
The situation is not very bad. 180M/h is quite low for LP blitzing, and it's only dropping as people flock on to it. The nullsec reward is a third better iirc? If anything it is interesting that people get together.
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Illaren Zinfandel
Die Schar des Schwarzen Herzogs
0
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:16:00 -
[33] - Quote
180 mil an hour is not possible ...
best you can get in an unralistic szenario is:
~~ 150 mil / h
(3 x dread pilot scarlet in a row; 1100 dps looting + salvaging while flying the mission; killing Scaarlet in 3rd pocket for implant and therefore blitzing the mission)
3 x 17,5 mil bounty 26 mil loot + salvage + implants 24k lp a 3100 isk
this scenario is absolutly unrealistic .... and even in this case you cant get to the named 180 mil / h 80 - 90 mil /h is what you normaly get for running soe missions
fixed 0.0 income for the same ship:
3 x 25 mil bounty 60 mil loot + salvage
=> 135 mil / h without factionspawns or expeditions ....
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17704
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:25:00 -
[34] - Quote
Illaren Zinfandel wrote:(3 x dread pilot scarlet in a row; 1100 dps looting + salvaging while flying the mission; killing Scaarlet in 3rd pocket for implant and therefore blitzing the mission)
3 x 17,5 mil bounty 26 mil loot + salvage + implants 24k lp a 3100 isk That's not really blitzing it. If you blitz it, you get no loot, no salvage, and the 5M bounty (iirc) Scarlet herself is worth.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Stabdealer Tichim
Hedion University Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:28:00 -
[35] - Quote
Just feel interesting that so many nerds don't know how to push their income higher:
Recon 1 part of 3: done with vigil in 4 minutes, 4m+25m from lp, reject 2 part of 3 Pirate invasion, kill all key rats and then clear battleships, 15 minutes, 4M+8m bounty+23m from lp Armarr tower shooting mission, done in a tengu, kite the tower in 8 minutes, 4m+20m lp
I'm not writing a mission guide, just some examples.
180m/hour is a quite conservative count, at peak I have made 210m in a hour
The core problem is that many people assume their awkward mission tactic universal. (killing unnecessary frigates, salvaging frigates, salvaging mission with few battleship rats) |
Illaren Zinfandel
Die Schar des Schwarzen Herzogs
0
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:28:00 -
[36] - Quote
may i see your calculation for blitzing it your style? ;) |
Good Posting
Posting with my Mind
64
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:38:00 -
[37] - Quote
grrrrr hi sec |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
909
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:41:00 -
[38] - Quote
Stabdealer Tichim wrote:180m isk per hour, and in high-sec?Checked the lp ratio of Stratios, which has been stabled at 3100:1, three times higher than major faction navy. According to the effectiveness people doing lv4 mission , we can estimate that in a Machariel it's possible to earn ~180m isk per hour (50% from LP) on average, which is even higher than most people killing anomalies in nullsec. (Calculated using LP payout at Lanngisi 0.5 and Apanake 0.5 and 3100:1 lp ratio for Stratios BPC) With the future of Nestor, the lp ratio for SOE may even increase or at least stable at current state In a high-end mission ship(like Machariel, rattlesnake or marauder) with cheap factional/T2 mods(so you're never profitable to gank) 0.0/Low Alternative?
Even though ccp claimed that they want to make null/low sec competitive, there is only agent of The Sanctuary in X-70 that can be easily harassed, and practically it does not bring any alternative or competition to the high sec 0.5 hubs. Apparently it is not well balanced. With the infinite potential to hold people in a single solar system, there are little reasons to compete with other missioners. Some people mentioned war or suicide gank, but they are rather ineffective and only harassed a few people that are extreme minority comparing to the whole population who's doing SOE lv4s. And if people can play with some care, using insta undock bookmark and alt scout, the risk of ganking is then handed over to real newbies. A problem?The real problem is EVE's mission system. Missions from an agent is infinite and a high-sec system can theoretically live an infinite population. Low-sec and null has its nature disadvantage that when a local has more than certain amount of people (say 30), there will be problem to see coming hostile, not to mention gate camps. Is this a problem or we can just wait the "free market" to fix it by bring 1000 people to Lanngisi and Apanake local?
Dont be stupid. Its only that high because people are willign to pay absurd prices to the SOE ships. Only that.
As soon as the hype ends, and that shall take another 3-4 months, the price of the LP will halve.
"If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
909
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:43:00 -
[39] - Quote
Stabdealer Tichim wrote:Just feel interesting that so many nerds don't know how to push their income higher:
Recon 1 part of 3: done with vigil in 4 minutes, 4m+25m from lp, reject 2 part of 3 Pirate invasion, kill all key rats and then clear battleships, 15 minutes, 4M+8m bounty+23m from lp Armarr tower shooting mission, done in a tengu, kite the tower in 8 minutes, 4m+20m lp
I'm not writing a mission guide, just some examples.
180m/hour is a quite conservative count, at peak I have made 210m in a hour
The core problem is that many people assume their awkward mission tactic universal. (not rejecting **** missions, killing unnecessary frigates, salvaging frigates, salvaging mission with few battleship rats)
Why reject 2 of 3? Warp in with battleship.. MJD to the gate.. complete in 1 minute. same with the part 3 of 3. Save the reject for a way worse mission "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Stabdealer Tichim
Hedion University Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.12.12 09:47:00 -
[40] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Stabdealer Tichim wrote:Just feel interesting that so many nerds don't know how to push their income higher:
Recon 1 part of 3: done with vigil in 4 minutes, 4m+25m from lp, reject 2 part of 3 Pirate invasion, kill all key rats and then clear battleships, 15 minutes, 4M+8m bounty+23m from lp Armarr tower shooting mission, done in a tengu, kite the tower in 8 minutes, 4m+20m lp
I'm not writing a mission guide, just some examples.
180m/hour is a quite conservative count, at peak I have made 210m in a hour
The core problem is that many people assume their awkward mission tactic universal. (not rejecting **** missions, killing unnecessary frigates, salvaging frigates, salvaging mission with few battleship rats) Why reject 2 of 3? Warp in with battleship.. MJD to the gate.. complete in 1 minute. same with the part 3 of 3. Save the reject for a way worse mission
My mistake, I usually mwd to biz it in a cruiser |
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Maru Sha
The Department of Justice
32
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Posted - 2013.12.12 10:23:00 -
[41] - Quote
I can confirm that you can get a 3100:1 lp or better with SoE. Yet, I can also confirm that other high sec NPC corporation can offer the same ratio (or way better) for LPs for selected items.
These are nuggets, people like to find nuggets. When the gold rush is in full speed, the profit will be washed away.
I don't see a problem there.
The only thing that made me wonder is the serious difference in production costs between a fully built ship and a blueprint from the LP store. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Fatal Ascension
676
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Posted - 2013.12.12 12:15:00 -
[42] - Quote
Xuixien wrote:Once the market stabilizes it won't be so lucrative.
SOE LP has always been high value.
All of those sisters launchers and probes? Where do you think they come from. |
Rhivre
TarNec Invisible Exchequer
650
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Posted - 2013.12.12 14:13:00 -
[43] - Quote
I have heard rumours that there are certain other high sec corps which give an even better conversion rate :) Fluffy Bunny Pic! |
Aivo Dresden
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
149
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Posted - 2013.12.12 14:26:00 -
[44] - Quote
Those ISK/H calculations aren't even CLOSE to accurate. It pretty much invalidates your whole topic.
MAYBE in a very rare situation where the missions align perfectly, you will get a nice payout. What you're also not listing is the fact that multiple characters are used. 180 mill an hour is a bit of a poor pay-out running missions with multiple chars. You could get 300 an hour running incursions with 2 chars.
I've always said it and I'll say it again. You need to look at isk per hour PER CHARACTER. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3623
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Posted - 2013.12.12 14:41:00 -
[45] - Quote
Aivo Dresden wrote:Those ISK/H calculations aren't even CLOSE to accurate. It pretty much invalidates your whole topic.
MAYBE in a very rare situation where the missions align perfectly, you will get a nice payout. What you're also not listing is the fact that multiple characters are used. 180 mill an hour is a bit of a poor pay-out running missions with multiple chars. You could get 300 an hour running incursions with 2 chars.
I've always said it and I'll say it again. You need to look at isk per hour PER CHARACTER. '
This is incorrect. The OP stated "A machariel".
That's what i use (sometimes I use a fleet phoon though) and as i said, 165 an hour is the best I've had. SOE agents tend to give a LOT of the good blitizable missions, I was shocked at the number of really good mission the Lannigisi agent spews. I've only had a crap mission like "Duo of Death" like once or twice with that agent
It takes being in a shiny incursion fleet to make that kind of isk with one ship. The up side is that in incursions you don't need to be a shooter (I fly a Basi or Scimitar in incursions).
The problem is that we shouldn't be able to make that amount of isk with one ship of any kind doing combat PVE in high sec. A player should have to take a lot more risk (ie go to low, null or WH space) to make that kind of scratch. Sister's missions, incursions and a few other activities (like cosmos farming) totally destroy the idea of risk v reward in EVE PVE.
Ditto FW farming with cheap alts and FW lvl4 missions with stealth bombers that pay better than low sec lvl 5s and null sec lvl 4s. CCP really needs to take a look at PVE isk making balance. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Fatal Ascension
676
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Posted - 2013.12.12 15:01:00 -
[46] - Quote
Aivo Dresden wrote:Those ISK/H calculations aren't even CLOSE to accurate. It pretty much invalidates your whole topic.
MAYBE in a very rare situation where the missions align perfectly, you will get a nice payout. What you're also not listing is the fact that multiple characters are used. 180 mill an hour is a bit of a poor pay-out running missions with multiple chars. You could get 300 an hour running incursions with 2 chars.
I've always said it and I'll say it again. You need to look at isk per hour PER CHARACTER.
Counting LP at 2000:1 180 is still pretty low.
18,000 LP in an hour is all of two missions, and that is easy to accomplish if you know your blitzing. Some of the bigger missions yield 9200 LP a shot. Then you have things like serpentis assualt that you can blow through in like 5 minutes, you only have to kill three BSs and two cruisers.
I had one the other day where I got cargo delivery, recon, assault, recon, assault, assault, recon, cargo and then a shipyard. ...inside an hour I had complete everything except the yard, and THAT gave me a siege mindlink, that is like 75-80k LP and I did everything but the assaults and shipyard in a cruiser in and out. That was in highsec.
If I wasn't busy else where getting a tengu to X-7could be ...erm lucrative, since the LP conversion skyrockets with the discount, not to mention another 20-40% increase in payout for being in null |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
3796
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Posted - 2013.12.12 15:59:00 -
[47] - Quote
Maru Sha wrote:I can confirm that you can get a 3100:1 lp or better with SoE. Yet, I can also confirm that other high sec NPC corporation can offer the same ratio (or way better) for LPs for selected items.
These are nuggets, people like to find nuggets. When the gold rush is in full speed, the profit will be washed away.
I don't see a problem there.
The only thing that made me wonder is the serious difference in production costs between a fully built ship and a blueprint from the LP store.
I have minimal skills and built my ships with the stuff I reprocessed running the missions. Much less LP indeed. |
Notorious Fellon
Republic University Minmatar Republic
50
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Posted - 2013.12.12 16:02:00 -
[48] - Quote
We should NERF everything that is either:
A: Enjoyable B: Profitable C: Lacking Tears
That will create just the kind of game everyone wants to play. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3623
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Posted - 2013.12.12 16:06:00 -
[49] - Quote
Notorious Fellon wrote:We should NERF everything that is either:
A: Enjoyable B: Profitable C: Lacking Tears
That will create just the kind of game everyone wants to play.
I swear I saw this exact same post right before CCP nerfed incursions the 1st time.....
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Batelle
Komm susser Tod
598
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Posted - 2013.12.12 16:10:00 -
[50] - Quote
SOE have several stations in pure blind, IMO just give them more level 4 agents.
As for the hisec agents currently having great isk/lp, that isn't really a big deal. All the mechanisms are in place for this to resolve itself naturally. "CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"
Never forget. |
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Lady Oremond
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
5
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Posted - 2013.12.12 16:28:00 -
[51] - Quote
Quote:The only thing that made me wonder is the serious difference in production costs between a fully built ship and a blueprint from the LP store.
It costs less than 10 mil in minerals to build a Stratios so the blueprint is much more lucrative.
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Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Fatal Ascension
678
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Posted - 2013.12.12 16:30:00 -
[52] - Quote
Lady Oremond wrote:Quote:The only thing that made me wonder is the serious difference in production costs between a fully built ship and a blueprint from the LP store. It costs less than 10 mil in minerals to build a Stratios so the blueprint is much more lucrative.
This.
You basically can't math if you think buying a complete hull is in any way desirable. |
Stabdealer Tichim
Hedion University Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.12.12 19:44:00 -
[53] - Quote
Batelle wrote:SOE have several stations in pure blind, IMO just give them more level 4 agents.
As for the hisec agents currently having great isk/lp, that isn't really a big deal. All the mechanisms are in place for this to resolve itself naturally.
Maybe there are serveral stations, but only one The Sanctuary lv4 agent.
Mechanisms are in place but distribution of resource is manually defined, which can bring a fundamental difference. |
Mr Pragmatic
794
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Posted - 2013.12.12 20:28:00 -
[54] - Quote
People would be more inclined to mission in low and null if it wasn't full of people who just gank and murder for KB horring.
Or make it more lucrative or easy for other players to defend those who would mission in low sec with a BS.
As it stands right now this is the best choice if things, and if you don't like it. Too bad. Super cali hella yolo swaga dopeness. -á-Yoloswaggins, in the fellowship of the bling. |
Dracnys
52
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:49:00 -
[55] - Quote
Just let the market sort this out. Opening this thread sure helps! The LP to ISK ratio will normalize once the novelty factor of the SOE ships has worn off or enough mission runners are running SOE missions. No need to change anything. |
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
37
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Posted - 2013.12.12 23:04:00 -
[56] - Quote
lolz
" We love EVE it is this awesome sandbox where everything is based on player content and a player market ...
... ooh WAIT the player market is paying so much for SOE ships those highsec carebears are making too much money ...
... stuff the sandbox and player market CCP nerf those ships now or move those juicy missions to lowsec "
nullbears are funny :D |
Stabdealer Tichim
Hedion University Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.12.14 20:22:00 -
[57] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote:lolz
" We love EVE it is this awesome sandbox where everything is based on player content and a player market ...
... ooh WAIT the player market is paying so much for SOE ships those highsec carebears are making too much money ...
... stuff the sandbox and player market CCP nerf those ships now or move those juicy missions to lowsec "
nullbears are funny :D
The sandbox myth says "we just supply tools and player use the tools to create the world", In practice the players can not create NPC station, can not create NPC agents, which are manually defined as governmental restriction on the LP supply.
If your definition on "sandbox" includes "total freemarket", then EVE is not a sandbox game, |
Laserak
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
189
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Posted - 2013.12.14 20:29:00 -
[58] - Quote
I recently dropped corp on my machariel guy so I can run dem sweet highsec L4's in the complete safety of an NPC corp. Dont nerf my income bro. |
Dont UseYourAlt OnTheForums
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
15
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Posted - 2013.12.14 20:41:00 -
[59] - Quote
What? A place where people make lots of money and I dont?
NERF PLS, OBVIOUSLY ITS AN EXPLOIT |
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
127
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Posted - 2013.12.15 02:25:00 -
[60] - Quote
Rhivre wrote:I have heard rumours that there are certain other high sec corps which give an even better conversion rate :)
shush you!
Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown |
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