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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
1
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Posted - 2013.12.12 20:41:00 -
[1] - Quote
So using the EVE api I downloaded the star system list and their connections and ran several network and visualization analysis on the data. I found some interesting results and posted a complete visual which is searchable on my blog for all to see EVE Universe Map Using Network Analysis
One of the interesting things I found is that the CCP Devs used clustering in naming the regions and sectors within EVE based on the number of jumps between groups of systems--a high number of jumps (algorithmically) creates a region. There's a bunch of other subtle stuff like this which I'll write up in a blog post sometime.
Here's a little of the meaty parts of the analysis:
Systems with high levels of the BC score are great for gate-camping because of the low likelihood of concord or other corp or alliances being able to respond. They also cross over regions (they are the big(er) circles on the searchable visual) which means that escape for those who choose to battle on behalf of their alliances is more likely because there are multiple escape routes.
Systems with high levels of EVC are great for trade. they are (probability-wise) are more likely to have items bough from, plus because high EVC systems are clustered together, they form clusters of trade hubs ******(if you search for Jita or Rens, you'll see that they are neither, which means that they are unnatural trade hubs--all marketing and word of mouth--if the forums didn't exist Jita and Rens WOULD NOT be trade hubs) *********
There are other factors involved in making war, trade, and flying decisions of course, but I think a common alliance vs. alliance war problem is that they don't have a good grasp of the lay of land so to speak. My maps can help them make better decisions, and I'm willing to trade!
Enjoy
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Vidua Arte Album
State War Academy Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2013.12.12 20:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
Before jita, there was yulai. Looking forward to your blog post. Thank you for creating an interesting thread! |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
765
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Posted - 2013.12.12 20:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
You have all graph vertices as in and out degrees, however, that is not how the Eve unvierse is, you are plotting one edge as two.
I fail to trust your intrepertation of the data as it seems incorrect. Eve universe is not a Di-graph. |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
2
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:02:00 -
[4] - Quote
Miilla wrote:You have all graph vertices as in and out degrees as the same, however, that is not how the Eve unvierse is, you are plotting one edge as two.
I fail to trust your intrepertation of the data as it seems incorrect. Eve is not a Di-graph.
The vertices didnt print out properly in this particular graph, but the analysis is correct. The Sigma.js was a little rough in exporting.
Jumps in the eve universe are not directional which means that in and out degree centralization (by definition) are equal. That's not a mistake! Please review Introduction to SNA book, page 2. :)
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Garric Blackk
Omega Encounter The Volition Cult
1
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:03:00 -
[5] - Quote
This is cool, thank you! |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
765
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:03:00 -
[6] - Quote
Joe Themachine wrote:Miilla wrote:You have all graph vertices as in and out degrees as the same, however, that is not how the Eve unvierse is, you are plotting one edge as two.
I fail to trust your intrepertation of the data as it seems incorrect. Eve is not a Di-graph. The vertices didnt print out properly in this particular graph, but the analysis is correct. The Sigma.js was a little rough in exporting. Jumps in the eve universe are not directional which means that in and out degree centralization (by definition) are equal. That's not a mistake! Please review Introduction to SNA book, page 2. :)
From what you presented, the analysis is incorrect, you even stated it yourself. Come back when you get it right.
When you want to make a proof, all it takes is one failed case then it has to be revised or thrown out. |
Dashady
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
0
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:08:00 -
[7] - Quote
Uh oh am I sensing an epic nerd battle about to kick off? |
Jandice Ymladris
Aurora Arcology
367
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:09:00 -
[8] - Quote
Nice to see a deeper analysis of Eve and it's regions! Looking forward to your blogposts! The dark humor of capsuleers Latest Top Newsfeed: The State needs YOU! |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
765
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:09:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jandice Ymladris wrote:Nice to see a deeper analysis of Eve and it's regions! Looking forward to your blogposts!
Deeper definately yes, now Eve universe has TWICE the jump connections. |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
3
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:10:00 -
[10] - Quote
Dashady wrote:Uh oh am I sensing an epic nerd battle about to kick off?
meh! lol..
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SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
369
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:12:00 -
[11] - Quote
Joe Themachine wrote:******(if you search for Jita or Rens, you'll see that they are neither, which means that they are unnatural trade hubs--all marketing and word of mouth--if the forums didn't exist Jita and Rens WOULD NOT be trade hubs) *********
Model does not mesh with reality -> reality is wrong. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
765
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:12:00 -
[12] - Quote
Joe Themachine wrote:Dashady wrote:Uh oh am I sensing an epic nerd battle about to kick off? meh! lol..
Let me typeset my reply.
\documentclass[10pt,a4paper,draft,twoside,twocolumn]{article} \usepackage[utf8]{inputenc} \usepackage{amsmath} \usepackage{amsfonts} \usepackage{amssymb} \begin{document} \section{Conclusion} You failed. \end{document}
Eve universe is NOT a di-graph, stop modelling it as such. |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
3
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote:Joe Themachine wrote:******(if you search for Jita or Rens, you'll see that they are neither, which means that they are unnatural trade hubs--all marketing and word of mouth--if the forums didn't exist Jita and Rens WOULD NOT be trade hubs) *********
Model does not mesh with reality -> reality is wrong.
Well, simply explaining the "natural" order was the goal. Considering one factor among many! |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
765
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Joe Themachine wrote:SurrenderMonkey wrote:Joe Themachine wrote:******(if you search for Jita or Rens, you'll see that they are neither, which means that they are unnatural trade hubs--all marketing and word of mouth--if the forums didn't exist Jita and Rens WOULD NOT be trade hubs) *********
Model does not mesh with reality -> reality is wrong. Well, simply explaining the "natural" order was the goal. Considering one factor among many!
Your underlaying model is incorrect, Eve universe is NOT a di-graph.
With such a flawed model, how do you expect us to take your findings seriously when your method is incorrect fundamentally? |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
4
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:39:00 -
[15] - Quote
I did forget to mention that if you click on any particular system it will show the stats on the right hand side.
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Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
767
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:39:00 -
[16] - Quote
Joe Themachine wrote:I did forget to mention that if you click on any particular system it will show the stats on the right hand side.
Yes we can figure that out for ourselves, however it's incorrect. |
Galadriel Vasquez
Corp 54 Curatores Veritatis Alliance
177
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:41:00 -
[17] - Quote
Looks like Star Map with the jumps in last hour tab... I have tin foil hat trained to 5. |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
4
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:41:00 -
[18] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Joe Themachine wrote:I did forget to mention that if you click on any particular system it will show the stats on the right hand side.
Yes we can figure that out for ourselves, however it's incorrect.
I love you dude! |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
767
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:42:00 -
[19] - Quote
Galadriel Vasquez wrote:Looks like Star Map with the jumps in last hour tab...
However, his newly reinvented wheel is square. |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
4
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:42:00 -
[20] - Quote
Galadriel Vasquez wrote:Looks like Star Map with the jumps in last hour tab...
yeah except it's completely structural... no traffic data at all.. its only based on which systems connect to which..
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Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
768
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:44:00 -
[21] - Quote
Joe Themachine wrote:Galadriel Vasquez wrote:Looks like Star Map with the jumps in last hour tab... yeah except it's completely structural... no traffic data at all.. its only based on which systems connect to which..
Your structure is still incorrect, Eve universe structure is NOT a directed graph. |
Galadriel Vasquez
Corp 54 Curatores Veritatis Alliance
177
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:46:00 -
[22] - Quote
I misunderstood, I thought it was a traffic jam flow chart. I have tin foil hat trained to 5. |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
768
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:46:00 -
[23] - Quote
Galadriel Vasquez wrote:I misunderstood, I thought it was a traffic jam flow chart.
Yes directed graphs can cause that confusion they would indicate some kind of directional transition. |
Galadriel Vasquez
Corp 54 Curatores Veritatis Alliance
177
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:48:00 -
[24] - Quote
I have tin foil hat trained to 5. |
Pew Terror
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
38
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:50:00 -
[25] - Quote
Running specialized metrics for specific use cases (in your case network analysis) on generic graphs is as non scientific as it gets. You need to demonstrate what analysis the tool you used does and then present a case why the asssumptions of the model concerning its nodes and edges holds in this specific case. You can't just go "Im a gonna force this data through this tool i just learned existed because pretty color, look at me!". |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
768
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:52:00 -
[26] - Quote
Pew Terror wrote:Running specialized metrics for specific use cases (in your case network analysis) on generic graphs is as non scientific as it gets. You need to demonstrate what analysis the tool you used does and then present a case why the asssumptions of the model concerning its nodes and edges holds in this specific case. You can't just go "Im a gonna force this data through this tool i just learned existed because pretty color, look at me!".
Exectly I could have pushed the data through InfoVis as a Force Directed graph but no because it gives no real meaning
In this case, the meaning is meaningless as the underlaying model is INCORRECT for the subject domain and data sample.
We can clearly see the structure of the Eve Universe in .. Eve Universe.
Why would I want to ... open your INCORRECT modelled digraph in Javascript? |
Joe Themachine
Eystur Trade Corporation
4
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:55:00 -
[27] - Quote
Pew Terror wrote:Running specialized metrics for specific use cases (in your case network analysis) on generic graphs is as non scientific as it gets. You need to demonstrate what analysis the tool you used does and then present a case why the asssumptions of the model concerning its nodes and edges holds in this specific case. You can't just go "Im a gonna force this data through this tool i just learned existed because pretty color, look at me!".
Who said anything about scientific? It was mostly fun, and I was testing my code...:) you don't see any tests of significance do you? thanks for your insight..
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Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
768
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:56:00 -
[28] - Quote
Joe Themachine wrote:Pew Terror wrote:Running specialized metrics for specific use cases (in your case network analysis) on generic graphs is as non scientific as it gets. You need to demonstrate what analysis the tool you used does and then present a case why the asssumptions of the model concerning its nodes and edges holds in this specific case. You can't just go "Im a gonna force this data through this tool i just learned existed because pretty color, look at me!". Who said anything about scientific? It was mostly fun, and I was testing my code...:) you don't see any tests of significance do you? thanks for your insight..
Your test code failed, we pointed it out and you still won't accept the fail. |
Pew Terror
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
38
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:57:00 -
[29] - Quote
Miilla wrote:Pew Terror wrote:Running specialized metrics for specific use cases (in your case network analysis) on generic graphs is as non scientific as it gets. You need to demonstrate what analysis the tool you used does and then present a case why the asssumptions of the model concerning its nodes and edges holds in this specific case. You can't just go "Im a gonna force this data through this tool i just learned existed because pretty color, look at me!". Exectly I could have pushed the data through InfoVis as a Force Directed graph but no because it gives no real meaning In this case, the meaning is meaningless as the underlaying model is INCORRECT for the subject domain and data sample. We can clearly see the structure of the Eve Universe in .. Eve Universe. Why would I want to ... open your INCORRECT modelled digraph in Javascript?
I wouldn't really say incorrect, but it looks like the metric used here is level of connectedness to other nodes (im guessing as nothing about the methods was ever mentioned), which in case of eve is about as useful as measuring innovation in airplane manfucaturing by weight (to quote someone famous). |
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
768
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Posted - 2013.12.12 21:59:00 -
[30] - Quote
Pew Terror wrote:Miilla wrote:Pew Terror wrote:Running specialized metrics for specific use cases (in your case network analysis) on generic graphs is as non scientific as it gets. You need to demonstrate what analysis the tool you used does and then present a case why the asssumptions of the model concerning its nodes and edges holds in this specific case. You can't just go "Im a gonna force this data through this tool i just learned existed because pretty color, look at me!". Exectly I could have pushed the data through InfoVis as a Force Directed graph but no because it gives no real meaning In this case, the meaning is meaningless as the underlaying model is INCORRECT for the subject domain and data sample. We can clearly see the structure of the Eve Universe in .. Eve Universe. Why would I want to ... open your INCORRECT modelled digraph in Javascript? I wouldn't really say incorrect, but it looks like the metric used here is level of connectedness to other nodes (im guessing as nothing about the methods was ever mentioned), which in case of eve is about as useful as measuring innovation in airplane manfucaturing by weight (to quote someone famous).
He said himself it was incorrect, he said he was modelling the Structure of the Eve universe, however, the model he is presenting of the structure is indeed incorrect. Eve universe is NOT a digraph, thus the underlaying STRUCTURE is INCORRECT. |
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