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Sweet Trader
The Hollow Men
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 19:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
Given that CCP are looking at the Gallente boats again I would like to propose that they reconsider the incongruous nerf that the Eos was subjected to some years ago.
Gallente currently have a frigate that can control five medium drones and a cruiser that can control five large drones... whereas the Eos, which has a bonus to drone bay size but not bandwidth can carry up to 225m3 of drones but can only use 50m3 at once... what is the point of that? It also has hybrid bonuses when the Astarte is the obvious hybrid platform... making it neither fish, flesh nor foul.
I don't understand why allowing it to use five large drones or sentries was ever considered OP? I'd also like to know whether anyone is actually using this boat any more for anything other than a safespotted info-warfare fleet booster? Obviously if it is used in this fashion the drone bandwidth becomes academic... but wouldn't we like to see this ship actually fighting?
Please sign if you agree... or present a coherent argument if you do not. |
mkint
293
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Posted - 2011.11.07 19:51:00 -
[2] - Quote
People use Eos as a fleet booster?
I always thought it was weird that gallente's ganglinks are for caldari's specialty.
In other words, yes, Eos is useless. Some use > no use. |
Alundil
The Unnamed. Novum Militis ExParte
13
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Posted - 2011.11.07 19:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that the Eos has 75mb/sec bandwidth. At least according to EVEMon.
Additionally, given that Fleet Command command ships aren't as stout and can't take a punch as well as the Force Command variants, wouldn't safed up and boosting be the more tactically valuable role for this ship? |
Sweet Trader
The Hollow Men
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:08:00 -
[4] - Quote
Yes, it's 75mb/sec... it slipped my mind because frankly, 75 is the same as 50. Nobody mixes drone sizes. Launching one large and four medium is a waste of time.
I'm not disputing that it works as a safe-spotted command ship... |
Captain Alcatraz
Muppet Ninja's Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns
16
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:11:00 -
[5] - Quote
Signed, I miss the nos / drone eos. No need to make it what it was, just make it viable for combat |
Hungry Eyes
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
116
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:18:00 -
[6] - Quote
fully agree. Eos is such a useless ship. in addition, as a T2 BC, it should get some serious drone bonuses . more bandwidth, more space, more damage. that is, if youre not letting the Myrm control at least 4 heavy drones.
in reality, the gall only have 2 legit drone boats: the Ishtar, and the Domi. what's wrong with having a drone BC? |
Max Von Sydow
Droneboat Diplomacy
40
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
Sweet Trader wrote: Gallente currently have a frigate that can control five medium drones and a cruiser that can control five large drones... whereas the Eos, which has a bonus to drone bay size but not bandwidth can carry up to 225m3 of drones but can only use 50m3 at once... what is the point of that? It also has hybrid bonuses when the Astarte is the obvious hybrid platform... making it neither fish, flesh nor foul.
Which frigate is that? If you mean the ishkur it can only use 5 lights at a time since it only has 25 mb/s bandwidth. |
Sweet Trader
The Hollow Men
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:33:00 -
[8] - Quote
Confirming that I failed on the Ishkur reference. And to think that I was considering Assault Ships 5 ;)
This may invalidate my entire arguement. :P |
Sweet Trader
The Hollow Men
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:40:00 -
[9] - Quote
Captain Alcatraz wrote:Signed, I miss the nos / drone eos. No need to make it what it was, just make it viable for combat
I suppose one could argue that command boats should not be viable combat boats... because the overall effect of this in combination with gang links would be too much awesomeness from one player. However, as an inveterate Damnation pilot (because the Eos is so useless) I can confirm that other command ships are already providing stirling service.
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Cat Casidy
Percussive Diplomacy
7
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:42:00 -
[10] - Quote
Sweet Trader wrote:Confirming that I failed on the Ishkur reference. And to think that I was considering Assault Ships 5 ;)
This may invalidate my entire arguement. :P Nope, you still see claymores, damnations, and falcons flying around. After the nerf a few years ago i think I've seen one eos in like what,4 years? Would be fun to see more of them out and about. |
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Max Von Sydow
Droneboat Diplomacy
40
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Posted - 2011.11.07 20:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
Would be nice if the information warfare links were actually useful so that it would actually be useful as a fleet booster. Or just change the gallente warfare links to something else, maybe weapon related, like tracking and range. |
Karadion
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
249
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:00:00 -
[12] - Quote
Keep the Eos nerfed. |
Sweet Trader
The Hollow Men
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:01:00 -
[13] - Quote
Karadion wrote:Keep the Eos nerfed.
Thanks for the bump. Sent you a like...
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Tora Oni
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
38
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:21:00 -
[14] - Quote
I think this is the best post I have seen in years ..... |
Jack bubu
GK inc. Pandemic Legion
72
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:28:00 -
[15] - Quote
The actual reason that the eos is useless is because the gallente links are useless.
Eos/vulture/claymore/damnation arent meant for direct combat, they are FC/fleet booster vessels |
Cur
Militaris Industries Cascade Imminent
13
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:16:00 -
[16] - Quote
Alundil wrote:Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that the Eos has 75mb/sec bandwidth. At least according to EVEMon.
Additionally, given that Fleet Command command ships aren't as stout and can't take a punch as well as the Force Command variants, wouldn't safed up and boosting be the more tactically valuable role for this ship?
Because people play eve for the pure enjoyment of sitting in a safepos while their friends go out and do the killing, right?
PICCARD! I DEMAND FACEPALM NOW!
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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
2020
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:22:00 -
[17] - Quote
What is point EOS? What is point?
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
77
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:22:00 -
[18] - Quote
The Eos doesn't need more DPS, it needs useful warfare links and a HIC-style resist bonus. |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
41
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
Jack bubu wrote:The actual reason that the eos is useless is because the gallente links are useless.
Eos/vulture/claymore/damnation arent meant for direct combat, they are FC/fleet booster vessels
Really? My Claymore does about 530 DPS, no overheat, with a tank of about 120K EHP, when set with 5 autocannons, and a shield buffer, and 3 skirmish links. I was really popular in my old crew when I flew this since it more than held its own in a straight-up fight.
That kind of tank/firepower IS built for direct combat. The Damnation does minimal DPS, but has a full rack of mid's for tackle/support mods, plus an ungodly tank. The Vulture does decent DPS (not in front of EFT, but think in the 400 range), with a huge tank.
The EOS....well....the EOS needs some help.
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Sweet Trader
The Hollow Men
2
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:40:00 -
[20] - Quote
Cur wrote:Alundil wrote:Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that the Eos has 75mb/sec bandwidth. At least according to EVEMon.
Additionally, given that Fleet Command command ships aren't as stout and can't take a punch as well as the Force Command variants, wouldn't safed up and boosting be the more tactically valuable role for this ship? Because people play eve for the pure enjoyment of sitting in a safepos while their friends go out and do the killing, right? PICCARD! I DEMAND FACEPALM NOW!
QFT
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Sweet Trader
The Hollow Men
2
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Posted - 2011.11.07 23:54:00 -
[21] - Quote
I doubt anyone could convincingly argue that the EOS is somehow better than other command ships... it isn't... it's utter toilet. That aside, some of you have touched on a parallel argument here about command ships in general and - at the risk of derailing my own thread - I'd like to make a quick observation about this:
We all know that command ships are mostly chucked in a safespot because if they were actually on the field they would just be primaried and slaughtered. In PvP this clearly negates any notion that to have gang links plus a credible shooty vehicle is OP... if you have the balls to take one into a PvP fight you deserve all the bonuses that can be imagined. Meanwhile, in PvE, if the command ship can buff the fleet while also being an effective shooter this might be considered OP...
I wonder if there is a way of encouraging their direct use in PvP without increasing their PvE capability? The whole "chuck them in a SS" thing is failed. Can anyone suggest how to differentiate the bonuses between PvE and PvP? And let's not worry about the blob... any such boat will be instantly creamed by a blob anyway so bonuses are irrelevant... but they are relevant to small/medium sized PvP gangs. |
Tallianna Avenkarde
Beasts of Burden
119
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Posted - 2011.11.08 08:03:00 -
[22] - Quote
Sweet Trader wrote:Yes, it's 75mb/sec... it slipped my mind because frankly, 75 is the same as 50. Nobody mixes drone sizes. Launching one large and four medium is a waste of time.
I'm not disputing that it works as a safe-spotted command ship...
Nobody mixes drone sizes?? L2Myrmidon And a sudden plunge in the sullen swell. Ten fathoms deep on the road to hell. |
Tallianna Avenkarde
Beasts of Burden
119
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Posted - 2011.11.08 08:05:00 -
[23] - Quote
Personally i don't mind the eos. dual rep 5 blasters 2xnuets and a mix of 2X Ogre II 2Xhammy 1x hobby.. of course a full flight of Ogre II would be nice. And a sudden plunge in the sullen swell. Ten fathoms deep on the road to hell. |
Mr LaboratoryRat
Confederation of DuckTape Lovers
3
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Posted - 2011.11.08 09:52:00 -
[24] - Quote
why bother these days with command ships, we have now better bonuss-¦s giving cloaky T3-¦s |
Mr LaboratoryRat
Confederation of DuckTape Lovers
3
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Posted - 2011.11.08 09:53:00 -
[25] - Quote
Tallianna Avenkarde wrote:Personally i don't mind the eos. dual rep 5 blasters 2xnuets and a mix of 2X Ogre II 2Xhammy 1x hobby.. of course a full flight of Ogre II would be nice.
dont forget the 2 capboosters u need and the fact u can acivly pump / neut for less than a minut before u run out of cap boosters |
Nyla Skin
Pew Pew Corp Behold.
33
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Posted - 2011.11.08 10:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Cur wrote: Because people play eve for the pure enjoyment of sitting in a safepos while their friends go out and do the killing, right? PICCARD! I DEMAND FACEPALM NOW!
Nobodys forcing the command ship to sit at a pos, it just makes sense
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Milo Caman
Anshar Incorporated
9
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Posted - 2011.11.08 10:20:00 -
[27] - Quote
Infowar links need a boost more than the Eos. People might actually fly the damn thing then. That and I reckon bringing back it's chinwibble would see it undocked a lot more as well. |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
128
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Posted - 2011.11.08 14:38:00 -
[28] - Quote
Eos was nerfed because it was being better at field command role than the astarted.
granted that, while the nerf was needed, they also needed to rethink the info warfare links beforehand, so that the ship wouldn't reach the poor state that it is today.
that and the active tanking bonus coupled with a limited lowslot set.
so no, boost the eos but tanking wise, but dps of the ship shouldn't be boosted. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Arazel Chainfire
Fury Lords Apex United
11
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Posted - 2011.11.08 22:19:00 -
[29] - Quote
easy way to boost the eos - instead of the bonus to more drone bay (after all... who really needs that anyways), allow it to fit a covops cloak and use B-Ops jump bridge. Which means that you can either have 5 guns, covops cloak, and ganglink (or neut, I guess) and 5 med drones, and its dps is solidly in the range of a covops fleet. Plus, it means that you can use those nice, helpful info warfare links in a gang that actually uses them, aka, a recon gang. Oh... and boost the damn info links... they aren't really even woth tossing into the last 2 slots of the 8 link claymore...
-Arazel |
Alticus C Bear
University of Caille Gallente Federation
10
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Posted - 2011.11.08 23:49:00 -
[30] - Quote
Well it is getting a DPS boost, speed boost, agility boost, reload time boost, tracking boost and a reduction in cap to its guns as it stands.
This already on top of the fact that: -
It can omni tank 500DPS while dealing 600DPS, with full tackle and if you fit NOS instead of neuts then cap life is better.
Buffer fit it deals 600DPS while having over 100kEHP and can have two neuts and dual webs plus scram.
It is slow but then it has the drone bay to field three web drones or lots of ECM Drones
In fact the Eos is probably everything Gallente blaster boats should be
- Utility Highs
- Strong Active Tank
- Enough Drone bay for lots of utility drones
- Four mids allowing Prop mod, full tackle plus cap booster
- And rarely for a Gallente ship it, does have enough CPU power grid to T2 fit everything using Ion Blasters.
That said information warfare is rubbish so in itGÇÖs intended role it is poor and the drone bay bonus always feels disappointing.
225m3 Drone bay is useful so letGÇÖs just keep that and instead have something to increase cap or survivability like the Thorax Microwarpdrive cap bonus or the inty sig reduction bonus so we take less damage as we close.
However it is supposed to be fleet command then how about this: -
Command ship bonus 5% bonus to the effectiveness of information Warfare links and 3% bonus to the effectiveness of Armored Warfare links per level.
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