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Dark Phox
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.02.19 00:36:00 -
[1] - Quote
I was thinking it would be nice if we could use a plex to train skills directly.
For instance... I've been out of the game for about 2 years, and if I could apply a plex and get the equivalent of 30 days worth of skills trained instantly , it would help me catch up for lost time.
I know some people would say that would be pay to win, so make it where, the age of your character has an estimated skill point level added to it, and you can use plex's to catch up to that point, but not go beyond.
In this way there would not be 1 day old characters in Titans or whatever, but allow people who have been out of the game to catch up to friends, that may not have left the game, etc... |
Batelle
Komm susser Tod
1813
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Posted - 2014.02.19 00:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
lolno
Also, character bazaar. "CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"
Never forget. |
Dark Phox
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.02.19 00:47:00 -
[3] - Quote
How about add useful feedback instead of the ******** "LoLno" kind of statements?
Also, how about we refine it some more, and say, oh, allow you to add a plex for direct learning maybe, oh, twice a year max. catching up to 2 months of training for an entire year is not enough to unbalance the game. |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
381
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Posted - 2014.02.19 00:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
so I run a main for 6 months -1 year, wake up alt account at one of those times and plex with the skill set that walks right into whatever was made "fotm" in summer or next winters patch?
You cut off the 1 day super heroes...still have the longer played players getting a nice hookup though. Not a stretch for some to have older alts laying about. On a prolonged empire break. So I have the empire alt and a cyno alt account on ice. If the new fotm worth it I could tweak them mild to wild. |
Anhenka
Hard Knocks Inc.
160
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Posted - 2014.02.19 01:04:00 -
[5] - Quote
No, hell no, not a chance, not going to happen, inadvisable.
There are so many reasons that this is a bad idea, but I'll skip to the most important one.
The day you can pay to magically gain skills that never took time to train is the day EVE loses a good 20-30% of the old guard, long term, multiple account reoccurring subscription players that make up the base of the game.
Eve lost a huge number of accounts when CCP added overly expensive vanity items. It would be orders of magnitude worse if CCP ever attempted to let people exchange money for the SP, the second most important currency in the game be hind experience.
Even monoclegate was bad enough that the lead developer on the project had to release a very public Mea Culpa letter taking accepting responsibility, that CCP had dun ****** up, and that they would be very careful that nothing of the sort happened again. |
TehCloud
Mastercard.
209
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Posted - 2014.02.19 01:04:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dark Phox wrote:How about add useful feedback instead of the ******** "LoLno" kind of statements?
Also, how about we refine it some more, and say, oh, allow you to add a plex for direct learning maybe, oh, twice a year max. catching up to 2 months of training for an entire year is not enough to unbalance the game.
How about you use the search function. How about you try to think of the greater picture. If you wanna have Instant rewarding, go play wow.
In all those other threads, you can read in all detail why it is a horribly bad idea. My Condor costs less than that module! |
Mu-Shi Ai
Ai Capital
218
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Posted - 2014.02.19 01:06:00 -
[7] - Quote
I think this notion of "catching up" is antithetical to the aim of the game, though. There's a reason why "experience" is time-based and not grinding-based. All your suggestion does is turn the accumulation of skill points into another grind (either for the ISK, or for the real-life currency, to acquire PLEX).
The bottom line is that all those people with tens of millions of skill points don't even require all of those skill points, or bring all of them to bear, in a given situation. People aren't nearly as far "behind" those players as they often believe themselves to be. And in any case, EVE was designed not to be a standard level-based game. There are roles for players of all skill point levels. It's not one of these things where you're "locked out" unless you're level 90 or something like that. Of course, I think many people come into EVE with the level-based mindset, and psych themselves out because of it. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
4903
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Posted - 2014.02.19 02:14:00 -
[8] - Quote
Has been suggested before.
Still not supporting. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Gigan Amilupar
No Code of Conduct Fluffeh Bunneh Murder Squad
172
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Posted - 2014.02.19 02:17:00 -
[9] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:Has been suggested before.
Still not supporting.
This. |
Yolo
Yolo Corp xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
135
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Posted - 2014.02.19 04:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
No, no, no and NO.
Imagin situation Skill char to 2003 levels (over 200m SP), transfer char to another account. Rinse repeate.
THIS => PAY TO WIN
And it would destroy the game in a very short amount of time. - since 2003, bitches |
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Alundil
Sky Fighters
404
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Posted - 2014.02.19 05:19:00 -
[11] - Quote
Nope. Clone mechanics enchancements Deep Space Probe Revival |
Dark Phox
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.02.19 05:43:00 -
[12] - Quote
None of you touched the topic I offered after the first No answer of doing it maybe once or twice a year as a gate to the being over powered thing. You read my first post and just answered that.
What would be the negatives of letting someone pay for 1 month of training once a year?
To the one guy, what is wow? is it like eve? The only other games I play is World of tanks, which is what i thought you were referring to, and Dota2. |
Yolo
Yolo Corp xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
135
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Posted - 2014.02.19 05:49:00 -
[13] - Quote
Dark Phox wrote:None of you touched the topic I offered after the first No answer of doing it maybe once or twice a year as a gate to the being over powered thing. You read my first post and just answered that.
What would be the negatives of letting someone pay for 1 month of training once a year?
To the one guy, what is wow? is it like eve? The only other games I play is World of tanks, which is what i thought you were referring to, and Dota2. Maybe edit your initial post instead of trying to clarify yourself in a post people will read after they have already replied to your initial post. Either way, buying SP once a year would make it so that you have to do that to compete.
As it was with Learning skills. As it is with Implants.
As shall it be with buying SP.
Even so, have you thought a second about what this would do to the PLEX market? Everyone, their alt and grand mother will want to level up a month worth of SP. A months worth of sp based on what stats btw? Do you need to buy +5 implants to make best use of this upgrade?
Prices would skyrocket, leaving many players dependant on PLEX without subscriptions, so first the prices would shoot in the sky, to eventually crash and burn before the next years plex for SP event. Meanwhile some richie riches will make a fortune off plexes, plex dependant players will quit and all just because you wanted to by a months worth of SP.
GO HOME YOU ARE DRUNK - since 2003, bitches |
Chad Wylder
Bogus Brothers Corporation Illusion of Solitude
18
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Posted - 2014.02.19 05:49:00 -
[14] - Quote
Yolo wrote:No, no, no and NO.
Imagin situation Skill char to 2003 levels (over 200m SP), transfer char to another account. Rinse repeate.
THIS => PAY TO WIN
And it would destroy the game in a very short amount of time. The above situation doesn't really apply to the OP's proposal. There's a cap to the amount of skill points that can be gained based on how old the character is.
So the only way to skill a character to 2003 levels this way would be to have a character from 2003.
It sounds like this would be for people that take breaks from the game and can then pay their missing subscriptions in order to catch back up. Personally I think it's an interesting take on paying for skillpoints. |
Anhenka
Hard Knocks Inc.
160
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Posted - 2014.02.19 05:50:00 -
[15] - Quote
Dark Phox wrote:None of you touched the topic I offered after the first No answer of doing it maybe once or twice a year as a gate to the being over powered thing. You read my first post and just answered that.
What would be the negatives of letting someone pay for 1 month of training once a year?
To the one guy, what is wow? is it like eve? The only other games I play is World of tanks, which is what i thought you were referring to, and Dota2.
You are none too bright are you.
The entire eve skill system is based on the idea that skills train in real time, that each skill on each and every character took its due time to finish. Long term players have played this game for years or over a decade in some cases, and we have fought every single attempt to turn this game into Pay 2 Win.
There will be no Gold Ammo, there will be no pay for buffs, no super premium bonuses for players who pay extra, and most certainly, there will never, ever, in any way, shape or form be a way to use PLEX to accelerate the training of a character, or add SP to it.
If Eve ever does try that ****, I for one will unsub all accounts, as will a very large number of the older players, aka the players with the greatest retention and return rate, who have multiple characters. Eve will lose probably close to a third of the playerbase in a damn hurry.
Notice the people above you all of whom responded along the lines of "**** that"? That's not some opinion of a few people. That's basically the opinion of every pod pilot in eve who has played for more than a month.
Thankfully, CCP learned enough from MonocleGate that the idea of the backlash from introducing game changing micro-transactions rightfully scares them shitless. |
Linkxsc162534
Traps 'R' Us Bask of Fail
50
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Posted - 2014.02.19 05:54:00 -
[16] - Quote
Dark Phox wrote:None of you touched the topic I offered after the first No answer of doing it maybe once or twice a year as a gate to the being over powered thing. You read my first post and just answered that.
What would be the negatives of letting someone pay for 1 month of training once a year?
To the one guy, what is wow? is it like eve? The only other games I play is World of tanks, which is what i thought you were referring to, and Dota2.
The fact that older players never had the option to do so. And because its a pay to win mechanic that has no place in a game. And then if you pull some "well older guys can do it several times the first year to make up for the last few years" well then... you've still accomplished nothing. Everyone will just need to spam their plex for SP every year, and that will become the new status quo.
Also since you play WOT. Idk how long you've played. But P2W doesn't work in WOT either, sicne most of the people you see buying gold tanks, end up being garbage until 500-1000 matches when they finally... i dunno learn2play.
Do we really need MORE people going and dumping $60 on PLEX in eve, spending it all on a BS that they don't know how to fly yet, getting blapped, and quitting the game? Vowing to forever whine about the game to all of their friends and further shunt the progress of the game. |
Vizvig
Savage Blizzard Bright Side of Death
149
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Posted - 2014.02.19 05:55:00 -
[17] - Quote
Where they see p2w ?
PLEX can be bought for isk. |
Linkxsc162534
Traps 'R' Us Bask of Fail
50
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Posted - 2014.02.19 06:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
Vizvig wrote:Where they see p2w ?
PLEX can be bought for isk.
They were bought with real money, so somewhere along the lines they're paying to win.
Its not so much P2W when you buy a ship or mods in eve because they can and WILL be taken from you by gankers or other players at some point. But SPs are forever. |
Vizvig
Savage Blizzard Bright Side of Death
149
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Posted - 2014.02.19 06:24:00 -
[19] - Quote
Linkxsc162534 wrote:
They were bought with real money, so somewhere along the lines they're paying to win.
Its not so much P2W when you buy a ship or mods in eve because they can and WILL be taken from you by gankers or other players at some point. But SPs are forever.
Titan bought "for plex" often live forever (If i lie number of titans in eve should be same, but titan pop has stable growth ) Alt also is give no superiority, thats obvious.
If buyng mobile jump portal bridge is not P2W, CCP should allow direct SP injection. |
Linkxsc162534
Traps 'R' Us Bask of Fail
50
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Posted - 2014.02.19 06:45:00 -
[20] - Quote
Vizvig wrote:Linkxsc162534 wrote:
They were bought with real money, so somewhere along the lines they're paying to win.
Its not so much P2W when you buy a ship or mods in eve because they can and WILL be taken from you by gankers or other players at some point. But SPs are forever.
Titan bought "for plex" often live forever (If i lie number of titans in eve should be same, but titan pop has stable growth ) Alt also is give no superiority, thats obvious. If buying mobile jump portal bridge is not P2W, CCP should allow direct SP injection.
Umm if anyone could get the numbers... how many titans were bought with PLEX? I'm pretty sure none, since last I checked, they still cost a few $1000 more than my car. And if you're buying a dread (They should only equate to $100 or so when fully fit) you can be almost certain that the thing is going to die soon. And even then, those AREN'T P2W. Why?
Well I did spend a few bucks on some PLEX to buy them. But before that, someone had to mine the ore, refine them to minerals, market for some time to buy a BP, then spend some time building my ship.
P2W is paying money for something to magically appear in a game just for you. In Eve, the PLEX is just a trade commodity that has no value other than allowing a player to isk their way to more game time, aside from the PLEX itself nothing was added to the game. Plexing your way to more SPs however is magically getting something that had no work going into it.
Also... the heck was your second sentence. I have no idea what you were trying to say? |
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Rykoszet
SixSixOne Crew
16
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Posted - 2014.02.19 07:14:00 -
[21] - Quote
WORST IDEA EVER! What about implants, cybernetis skills, jump clones and all the rest closely related to skill points? |
Mu-Shi Ai
Ai Capital
218
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Posted - 2014.02.19 07:50:00 -
[22] - Quote
Dark Phox wrote:What would be the negatives of letting someone pay for 1 month of training once a year?
Well, first you implied that this is something you should be able to do in an unlimited fashion. Then you bargained it down to twice a year. Now you're saying once a year.
I understand that you're just trying to get your foot in the door by mitigating against the "pay to win" counter-argument, but once you get beyond a certain point, the whole thing becomes moot. I mean, one month of training will get you, like just level 5 of Tycoon or a similar-ranked skill.
It seems like you're trapped between it either being clearly ill-advised due to pay-to-win concerns, or so negligible as to not even be worth implementing in the first place. Assuming you stick to one month a year (though you seem to be open to sliding that around in ways that are convenient to your argument), for not a whole lot of player benefit CCP ends up opening a huge can of worms that would certainly lead to massive unrest among a core group of players.
The question I'd pose to you is--setting aside our individual beliefs about whether this is good/bad/neutral for the game--why do you think CCP should do this? What do they gain from it, and how is that gain more beneficial to them than what they'd risk losing? |
Mu-Shi Ai
Ai Capital
218
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Posted - 2014.02.19 07:55:00 -
[23] - Quote
Chad Wylder wrote:So the only way to skill a character to 2003 levels this way would be to have a character from 2003.
Who cares? Seriously. There's only a finite amount of skillpoints that can be brought to bear when you're flying, say, a T1 battleship. And I'll tell you, it's not all 150+ million skillpoints that some old player has acquired over the years. If you've got perfect skills for that ship--but only just--and they've got perfect skills, plus tens of millions in other areas that don't matter, you are on equal ground with them in terms of raw mechanical potential. Those other skill points they've got don't matter for what both of you are flying. |
Xequecal
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
160
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Posted - 2014.02.19 08:47:00 -
[24] - Quote
You can already buy SP, since character selling is legal and there are plenty of high-SP characters available to buy.
I'm wondering if people are so opposed to this because they don't like the idea of CCP getting money for this, or simply the idea itself. Here's a suggestion: let people gift SPs to others. Make the module that does it cost isk, and limit it to characters with >10m sp. CCP doesn't profit from pay to win, extra SP are never generated from nothing, and we get a badly needed isk sink. 10m SP limit prevent people from making accounts just to farm SPs to transfer, since at 10m SP you could just make an "xxx ship pilot" char and sell that instead. |
Mu-Shi Ai
Ai Capital
218
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Posted - 2014.02.19 08:51:00 -
[25] - Quote
Xequecal wrote:You can already buy SP, since character selling is legal and there are plenty of high-SP characters available to buy.
The key difference is that you have to take a purchased character as you get it. You don't get to pick and choose, or drop the SP into whatever skill you like. Considering that character sales are legal, I think this is a fair limitation to impose. |
Seliah
0mega.
19
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Posted - 2014.02.19 10:29:00 -
[26] - Quote
This.
Why is this thread even still running ? SP for PLEX has been suggested 10000 times and the answer's always been no, for very good reasons. People should stop trying to find workarounds and fake good ideas to get this implemented because they can't be bothered to train their skills up like everybody else did. The skill system is one of the pillars of EVE, and if people don't like it they shouldn't be playing. This game is all about patience and long term planning. |
Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
343
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Posted - 2014.02.19 10:44:00 -
[27] - Quote
Dark Phox wrote:I was thinking
No you weren't, not one little bit.
As other so succinctly put LOLNo.
Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene V - Moon 4 - Duvolle Labs Factory. Hybrid charges, Projectile ammo, Missiles, Drones, Ships, Need'em? We have'em, at affordable prices. Pop in at our Ammo Shop in sunny Alentene. |
suid0
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
118
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Posted - 2014.02.19 10:45:00 -
[28] - Quote
Dark Phox wrote:How about add useful feedback instead of the ******** "LoLno" kind of statements?
If you don't want to lose training time... don't unsub
If you want a break but don't want to lose training time, do what loads of others do and play skill training online and stay subbed. the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones -á--áCommander Ted |
shimiku
Black VooDoo Asassins Cult of War
5
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Posted - 2014.02.19 11:46:00 -
[29] - Quote
now we are here why dont we just have a option where you pay 10plex and you can get a max lvl toon asap so you can pick your name and what not |
TehCloud
Mastercard.
213
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Posted - 2014.02.19 12:41:00 -
[30] - Quote
CCP should make a deal where you like buy 24plex and get one maxlevel WoW Character. My Condor costs less than that module! |
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