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Valleria Darkmoon
Heretic Army Heretic Initiative
202
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Posted - 2014.03.01 05:25:00 -
[31] - Quote
Flyinghotpocket wrote:Tetsuo Tsukaya wrote:Flyinghotpocket wrote:use vengeances and retributions. Pretty much this. I don't know what fit AVNG used but just screwing around in EFT, a buffer retribution with two True Sansha Explo Platings, 200mm Steel Plates II and two T1 trimark rigs has 49K EHP against explosive, and will be taking way less damage anyway due to sig radius bonus while MWDing. :) hey buddy since we dont use this doctrine anymore. i thought id give you all a screen shot of what we did use. mostly because our enemys would only use nova missiles. so we developed this http://i.imgur.com/UDRLqdu.jpgafter they discovered we had completely res'ed up explosive, they quickly got some thermal missiles. and we had to quickly step up again to eft, and come up with a solid setup. suffice to say its omni tanked, and its only retributions and vengeances now. will probably release this information sometime soon, as we like people to come up with excellent counter to us.
If the old setup was working then you should be able to count on it still working as long as you lose ~20% EHP or less when omni tanked as forcing the Talwars to fire anything other than Novas will cut their alpha by about 20%. If you aim to lose 20% or less EHP when tanking straight Thermal damage (assuming that the new fit doesn't make EM the lowest resist), I would say it's pretty much a lock that it would still work just fine.
Also that sig...looks like bonuses plus maybe Halos? |
Flyinghotpocket
Amarrian Vengeance Team Amarrica
291
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Posted - 2014.03.01 15:50:00 -
[32] - Quote
Valleria Darkmoon wrote:Flyinghotpocket wrote:Tetsuo Tsukaya wrote:Flyinghotpocket wrote:use vengeances and retributions. Pretty much this. I don't know what fit AVNG used but just screwing around in EFT, a buffer retribution with two True Sansha Explo Platings, 200mm Steel Plates II and two T1 trimark rigs has 49K EHP against explosive, and will be taking way less damage anyway due to sig radius bonus while MWDing. :) hey buddy since we dont use this doctrine anymore. i thought id give you all a screen shot of what we did use. mostly because our enemys would only use nova missiles. so we developed this http://i.imgur.com/UDRLqdu.jpgafter they discovered we had completely res'ed up explosive, they quickly got some thermal missiles. and we had to quickly step up again to eft, and come up with a solid setup. suffice to say its omni tanked, and its only retributions and vengeances now. will probably release this information sometime soon, as we like people to come up with excellent counter to us. If the old setup was working then you should be able to count on it still working as long as you lose ~20% EHP or less when omni tanked as forcing the Talwars to fire anything other than Novas will cut their alpha by about 20%. If you aim to lose 20% or less EHP when tanking straight Thermal damage (assuming that the new fit doesn't make EM the lowest resist), I would say it's pretty much a lock that it would still work just fine. Also that sig...looks like bonuses plus maybe Halos?
your right it still does work fine. omni tanking works great.
those ships were just boosts m8, if you plug in the halo sets they go down to 18.2 sig for the retribution and 17.7 for the inquisitor.
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Mehashi 'Kho
Idiot with a gun
116
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Posted - 2014.03.01 15:56:00 -
[33] - Quote
Talwars are awful, no idea why people keep pushing a rubbish doctrine. If they jump into you then thrashers have more deeps, if they are at range then corms have better instant damage projection and range. |
Machiavelli's Nemesis
Angry Mustellid
447
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Posted - 2014.03.01 16:32:00 -
[34] - Quote
Mehashi 'Kho wrote:Talwars are awful, no idea why people keep pushing a rubbish doctrine. If they jump into you then thrashers have more deeps, if they are at range then corms have better instant damage projection and range.
They are moderately effective and simple to fly for inexperienced pubbies. Also the combined alpha of a large group of them is better for breaking reps than thrashers.
But yeah, i'd rather have a decent group of rail corms on my side.
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Zarnak Wulf
In Exile. Imperial Outlaws.
1546
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Posted - 2014.03.01 16:34:00 -
[35] - Quote
Mehashi 'Kho wrote:Talwars are awful, no idea why people keep pushing a rubbish doctrine. If they jump into you then thrashers have more deeps, if they are at range then corms have better instant damage projection and range.
Get a Thrasher. Fit it out with 280mm arty, two T2 Gyro, and a Projectile Collision Rig. Load RF Titanium Sabot. Your alpha will be 1236. With a tracking computer you'll get ~31km optimal and 14km of falloff.
Now put one BCU II and one Warhead Calefaction rig on a Talwar. 1367 Alpha out to 62 km and you can't get under it's 'guns.' The Talwar rules those middle ranges and with it's MWD sig bonus it can run in slightly larger packs that would get any other dessy immediately blapped.
Lastly, the Talwar is faster then the Corax and it's explosive damage is preferable for T2 targets over the Corax's kinetic damage in most cases. |
Mehashi 'Kho
Idiot with a gun
116
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Posted - 2014.03.03 06:20:00 -
[36] - Quote
But it doesn't work like that. If the talwars are farting about at 60km then the thrashers just blap tackle and leave.
Then they come back in cormorants and out-range the talwars by 30km with the advantage of instantly applied damage on target switching.
Ever see a bunch of red boxes on you at 60km? Just warp out, you have a few seconds to do so.
Maybe it just plays out differently in the other warzone. *shrugs* |
Mike Whiite
Stupid Stunts The Wolfpack Nexus
342
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Posted - 2014.03.04 09:46:00 -
[37] - Quote
- E-war Damps or ECM.
- other counter is getting very fast ship, or extremely tanked ship in, warp to there or it's wreck, sacrifice one to destroy there advantage.
- if you want to do it the expensive way get a fleet of cerberusses.
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Mikokoel
Mining Industry Exile Foundation HYDRA RELOADED
24
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Posted - 2014.03.04 14:52:00 -
[38] - Quote
One solution is to just kite them, talwars have bad range when they have to burn behind you and are very slow.
If you go like 2.5k, Talwar range is reduced to 45k. So anything that can project DMG up to that range is easy win. Talos, Oracle, Tornado, Naga, Caracal+Variants, Omen Navy, Cynabal, Artyrupture, Vagabond, Railcormorant, Railharpy, and many more. Might want to think about how to point them though :)
Mikokoel | CEO of Mining Industry Exile Foundation [HYDRA] | EvE API Development Leokokim | PvP-Character |
Veratrix
Genstar Inc
5
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Posted - 2014.03.04 16:25:00 -
[39] - Quote
Zero clue how everyone else is flying or fitting rail corms that you die from talwars being able to hit you. A proper rail corm hits out 30km past talwar range with instant applied dps. It's pretty much a direct counter and was used to absurd effectiveness in the Gal/Cal war zone when all test would fly was 30-50 man talwar blobs. We would regularly hold plexs with 9 or 10 of us in rail corms, until they took to literally sacrificing fleets to run down the timer, as we couldn't be on the button while they were in the plex, reshipping quickly to another fleet and coming back to die over and over agian until the timer was run down all the way. |
Zarnak Wulf
In Exile. Imperial Outlaws.
1551
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Posted - 2014.03.04 16:26:00 -
[40] - Quote
Talwars are so 2013. Real men fly Heretic fleets. |
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Camper101
Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships.
960
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Posted - 2014.03.05 11:22:00 -
[41] - Quote
Slowcats. 2013.03.01 13:30:58 notify For participating in the General Discussion Forum Section your trustworthiness has been adjusted by -2.5000.
My name is Hans. The "L" stands for danger. |
Siobhan Synaesthesia
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2014.03.06 21:21:00 -
[42] - Quote
It has been said, but rail harpy fleets simply massacre talwars. They were used as the CFCs talwar counter for some time.
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