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Isara Shiraishi
Universal Freelance CONSORTIUM UNIVERSALIS
2
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Posted - 2014.03.18 12:15:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hello,
I can't help myself but feel impaired each, and every time I play Dust 514. My main issues are; (a) I have no idea where the enemy is due to low knowledge of the game's maps, and to the radar being virtually useless. (b) I am killed from enemies that I cannot see, or know their position even after "death" (c) Whenever I try to play with a sniper (and something where I spent plenty of ISK and skill points at) I have a tough time killing an enemy as the shots need to be really precise, especially moving targets are out of the question.
So, I am wondering-- am I overlooking something? Do you have any tips or suggestions so perhaps I can stop feeling impaired?
Thank you. |
Crasniya
Strange Energy Gentlemen's Agreement
460
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Posted - 2014.03.18 16:02:00 -
[2] - Quote
A) This comes with time and experience in any shooter. Map familiarity, and understanding where enemies are likely to be heading.
B) If you get one-shot, you don't get a lot of indication where it came from. This is particularly useful for snipers.
C) Try leading the target a bit. Also, vary up your rifle choice. The charge is often great for newbies because you usually only need the one shot. The tactical rifle fires quickly, and can be great at countersniping other snipers. |
Alexander Dubbs
Aliastra Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.03.18 16:06:00 -
[3] - Quote
what is your specialty? |
Isara Shiraishi
Universal Freelance CONSORTIUM UNIVERSALIS
2
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Posted - 2014.03.18 20:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
Crasniya wrote:A) This comes with time and experience in any shooter. Map familiarity, and understanding where enemies are likely to be heading.
B) If you get one-shot, you don't get a lot of indication where it came from. This is particularly useful for snipers.
C) Try leading the target a bit. Also, vary up your rifle choice. The charge is often great for newbies because you usually only need the one shot. The tactical rifle fires quickly, and can be great at countersniping other snipers.
First of all, I understand that point (a) could refer to some basics that come with being a newbie into any shooter, but the issue is that the game doesn't tell me any information, and we aren't talking about small maps, we are talking about huge maps where enemies could be virtually everywhere.
I mean, what's the use of the radar when there's someone 500 meters close by, but I am not looking at that direction? There's none, virtually there's no use of the radar whatsoever unless at the last moment someone is a few centimeters from me the radar suddenly feels like showing something red.
It just feels like someone covered my eyes and just told me "Okay, rush in, and shoot all the clones you see." that's pointless, there's no strategy in that, there's no understanding of where I am shooting. Simply rushing to an objective is also not an effective thing as you need to organize with the team and on that matter, why aren't squads automatically made? Why is my squad always empty? Isn't this a squad-based game? Every little contribution in a team should build to victory, not just throwing a random number of mercs into the same map and hope they know and understand each other.
Following team-mates is a wholly different story, and my main issue there is that people are incapable of using vehicles most of the time being in a dropship equals to death just because the pilot either jumped out, or flipped the thing (somehow) or committed suicide in the stupidest way possible.
It's really frustrating, I feel a constant lack of direction, a constant lack of "Hey, how do I kill this person" or "Oh, of course. Their gun just three-shot me because I didn't totally think at investing at the armor first, but I put into the weapon." that already causes an arranged decimation of anyone with a new character, which leads to leaving the game altogether in the early stages.
Now, for EVE Online that can work, but for a shooter it just feels awkward. Especially for a shooter aimed for consoles. I am playing this with a gamepad, not my mouse and keyboard, and most likely people don't have a microphone, but if they do then they are not even in my squad and I have to look after myself to make squads. |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
2889
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Posted - 2014.03.19 12:23:00 -
[5] - Quote
Want to know where people are? Well, there's the active scanner for that. It'll reveal people to you, and to your squad, outside of your regular passive scan range. And make their carets show up through walls.
Steve Ronuken for CSM 9! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4236322 http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
Archibald Liberty Killmore
Toodles McGiggityGoo and Friends
8
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Posted - 2014.03.19 14:57:00 -
[6] - Quote
a) Playing Dust is like crossing the street;- you look left, then right and then left again. The only difference with Dust is you look back, then front and then back again. Follow this mantra and you should be fine except for dampened speed tanked scouts.
Learn how to back peddle. Its very usefull. Back peddling + firing while back peddling is a life saver.
b) Stay away from open areas. Cover is your friend. When running ;- run to cover, perform the steps in a) while waiting for your stamina to recharge and then move to the next area. As far as possible avoid going anywhere alone. Rule of thumb is always let the blue dot go first or ahead of you. More than likely he will be the first one getting killed.
c) Dont play the sniper. That is the worst role to play and never helps the team. If you play FW and I see you sniping, I will TK you. If you are in a pub match, I will call a LAV and push you right in front of an enemy for them to kill you. I have been one of the best snipers in dust with records of 47-0 and I will tell you that I was useless to the teams in most cases. Yeah I did get kills, but I was more of an annoyance to the enemy than anything else.
If you want to be usefull and are not a good shooter take up logistics. A rep tool on a heavy will get you a lot of points. Just by repping people and picking up fallen teammates I gain 3000+ WPs per game. You cannot get that with sniping.
Any further questions?;- Feel free to inbox me. |
Crasniya
Strange Energy Gentlemen's Agreement
460
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Posted - 2014.03.19 15:02:00 -
[7] - Quote
Archibald Liberty Killmore wrote:c) Dont play the sniper. That is the worst role to play and never helps the team. If you play FW and I see you sniping, I will TK you. If you are in a pub match, I will call a LAV and push you right in front of an enemy for them to kill you. I have been one of the best snipers in dust with records of 47-0 and I will tell you that I was useless to the teams in most cases. Yeah I did get kills, but I was more of an annoyance to the enemy than anything else.
Ignore this dude, he's wrong. Him being a bad sniper does not mean snipers are useless to teams. I've played a heck of a lot of roles, and while the benefit of snipers in Planetary Conquest is dubious at best, in most game modes, snipers can range from tentatively helpful to mission critical. It's all about how you play. Focus on objectives, relay information to your squad, and cover your guys. |
Archibald Liberty Killmore
Toodles McGiggityGoo and Friends
8
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Posted - 2014.03.19 15:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
Crasniya wrote:Archibald Liberty Killmore wrote:c) Dont play the sniper. That is the worst role to play and never helps the team. If you play FW and I see you sniping, I will TK you. If you are in a pub match, I will call a LAV and push you right in front of an enemy for them to kill you. I have been one of the best snipers in dust with records of 47-0 and I will tell you that I was useless to the teams in most cases. Yeah I did get kills, but I was more of an annoyance to the enemy than anything else. Ignore this dude, he's wrong. Him being a bad sniper does not mean snipers are useless to teams. I've played a heck of a lot of roles, and while the benefit of snipers in Planetary Conquest is dubious at best, in most game modes, snipers can range from tentatively helpful to mission critical. It's all about how you play. Focus on objectives, relay information to your squad, and cover your guys.
LOL Soraya Xel. This dude rarely plays Dust. All he does is go constantly on the forums talking about how great of a CPM he will be without having a clue what the commnunity really needs while playing his lolmeta trying to tell people he can be objective.
I have been a part of some of the best wars Dust has ever had and I can tell you this;- if you want to get noticed drop the sniper. Pick up a logi. The problem with you is as a gamer you are relatively new to the FPS mechanics. To learn control takes time and patience. I have been FPSing for over 16 years now and I can tell you every game is different. You trying sniping will kill your interest in the game faster than Soraya Xel coming out and preaching how useful he is to the Dust community. You will make more ISK being a logi and be more useful that way. Get your skill points up that way and then tryout pew pewing. |
Isara Shiraishi
Universal Freelance CONSORTIUM UNIVERSALIS
2
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Posted - 2014.03.19 16:42:00 -
[9] - Quote
Archibald Liberty Killmore wrote: PS: Think about it how can you gain knowledge of the map when you are stuck in the red line sniping?
I think sniping is a good opportunity to observe the behavior of the enemy, meanwhile it doesn't directly contribute when the sniper himself/herself is inexperienced it allows them to learn from observation and especially it teachers the player when and when not to shoot an enemy. What does it mean for a player to play the role of the sniper in that sense, do you think it's not effective for that purpose?
Steve Ronuken wrote:Want to know where people are? Well, there's the active scanner for that. It'll reveal people to you, and to your squad, outside of your regular passive scan range. And make their carets show up through walls. We both understand that there's the active scanner, but the main issue is that the radar should also provide something a little bit more useful by itself than requiring the player to study the matter before realizing that the radar without the adequate skills and without the supplies needed is virtually useless.
Isn't that too much to enable a basic function that other shooters on consoles offer right off the bat? We understand something like showing their carets through the walls and scan range are things that should exist, and the latter improved if and only when the player decides to invest into the adequate skills and purchase the supplies for their armor.
Which leads to another issue, if we pick up the game right now then I will have a dropsuit that is equipped with the scanner, but the resources that are used by the scanner which are taken from the suit could be used for something more specific to the role I want to play as, and therefore in theory and from my understanding thus far we are expected to *hope* for a fool in our team that sacrifices resources that could be given for something more relevant to their role to have a scanner for the team. |
Archibald Liberty Killmore
Toodles McGiggityGoo and Friends
8
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Posted - 2014.03.19 17:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
Isara Shiraishi wrote:I think sniping is a good opportunity to observe the behavior of the enemy, meanwhile it doesn't directly contribute when the sniper himself/herself is inexperienced it allows them to learn from observation and especially it teachers the player when and when not to shoot an enemy. What does it mean for a player to play the role of the sniper in that sense, do you think it's not effective for that purpose?
Unfortunately no. Observing players play vs actually trying to do that are 2 different things in its entirety.
For example;- You might see one heavy running faster than the other and you could probably wonder why? Or you could see a scout 1 shotting a Cal Logi and probably wonder why? Or you could see one guy standing absolutely still on the map while another guy just mows him down.
Its a lot of observation. What are you learning from it? Practically nothing.
The best way to learn is actually be in the middle of the battle and a Logi role will help you understand that. Reason being you are smack in the middle of the battle.
Isara Shiraishi wrote:
We both understand that there's the active scanner, but the main issue is that the radar should also provide something a little bit more useful by itself than requiring the player to study the matter before realizing that the radar without the adequate skills and without the supplies needed is virtually useless.
Isn't that too much to enable a basic function that other shooters on consoles offer right off the bat? Something like showing their carets through the walls and scan range are things that should exist, and the latter improved if and only when the player decides to invest into the adequate skills and purchase the supplies for their armor.
Which leads to another issue, if we pick up the game right now then we might have a dropsuit that is equipped with the scanner, but the resources that are used by the scanner which are taken from the suit could be used for something more specific to the role we want to play as, and therefore in theory and from my understanding thus far we are expected to *hope* for a fool in our team that sacrifices resources that could be given for something more relevant to their role to have a scanner for the team.
Just so you know scanning is supposed to work but there have been some observations where scanning is hosed. It works sometimes and sometimes it doesnt. I havent really found out a root cause to this. Because there are way too many active scanners in the game most people havent observed this. Once 1.8 comes in I expect to see better results.
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Isara Shiraishi
Universal Freelance CONSORTIUM UNIVERSALIS
2
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Posted - 2014.03.19 17:12:00 -
[11] - Quote
Archibald Liberty Killmore wrote: Unfortunately no. Observing players play vs actually trying to do that are 2 different things in its entirety.
For example;- You might see one heavy running faster than the other and you could probably wonder why? Or you could see a scout 1 shotting a Cal Logi and probably wonder why? Or you could see one guy standing absolutely still on the map while another guy just mows him down.
Its a lot of observation. What are you learning from it? Practically nothing.
The best way to learn is actually be in the middle of the battle and a Logi role will help you understand that. Reason being you are smack in the middle of the battle.
I think you make a valid point there, but at the same time we risk into getting into sophistry about what is the best way to learn when in reality each and every person has a different way to learn something. The truth is that sniping probably will not work best for a lot of people, meanwhile a small number of people will be able to learn that way.
The reason as to why sniping may be effective is that observation can show you the patterns that players have. Running from certain structures to another following a specific path, certain camping spots people use often, where people die often and a lot of other information that can be processed through observation rather than being in the heat of the battle.
Archibald Liberty Killmore wrote: Just so you know scanning is supposed to work but there have been some observations where scanning is hosed. It works sometimes and sometimes it doesnt. I havent really found out a root cause to this. Because there are way too many active scanners in the game most people havent observed this. Once 1.8 comes in I expect to see better results.
Oh, I see now. If 1.8 comes out and the situation doesn't improve then we might end up talking about scanning effectiveness again. |
Archibald Liberty Killmore
Toodles McGiggityGoo and Friends
8
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Posted - 2014.03.19 17:22:00 -
[12] - Quote
Isara Shiraishi wrote:I think you make a valid point there, but at the same time we risk into getting into sophistry about what is the best way to learn when in reality each and every person has a different way to learn something. The truth is that sniping probably will not work best for a lot of people, meanwhile a small number of people will be able to learn that way.
The reason as to why sniping may be effective is that observation can show you the patterns that players have. Running from certain structures to another following a specific path, certain camping spots people use often, where people die often and a lot of other information that can be processed through observation rather than being in the heat of the battle.
Trust me I feel your pain. I totally understand the new guys experience and emphatize with them. Thats why I am here to help in any way I can.
Snipers in general are the most hated in the dust community especially the new snipers. There are various resons for that stemming from the lolredlinemapdesign to the ISK vs Rewards belief that snipers make a lot of ISK with too little risk. And thats why blue dots take great pains to TK(Team Kill) snipers or just push them in the front of enemies.
With that said the only good rifle is a Thale with complex damage mods. With damage mods getting nerfed Thales will become more or less useless. Which means no more OHKing people. In addition to that people, me included will make sure people with Thales loose them as harvesting tears are precious. I have flown dropships 200 mts into enemy territory just to kill a Thale sniper. A lot of people do this.
I have been playing Dust for over 2 years now and trust me, snipers is a no no.
Isara Shiraishi wrote:Oh, I see now. I guess we might end up discussing the same issue after 1.8 comes out if the situation doesn't improve effectively.
Fingers crossed |
Isara Shiraishi
Universal Freelance CONSORTIUM UNIVERSALIS
2
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Posted - 2014.03.19 17:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
Archibald Liberty Killmore wrote: I have been playing Dust for over 2 years now and trust me, snipers is a no no.
Well, I am just offering an extra view on the subject, although as you can I see I never directly said "Snipers are the best choice" for a reason. |
Archibald Liberty Killmore
Toodles McGiggityGoo and Friends
10
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Posted - 2014.03.19 17:38:00 -
[14] - Quote
Isara Shiraishi wrote:Archibald Liberty Killmore wrote: I have been playing Dust for over 2 years now and trust me, snipers is a no no.
Well, I am just offering an extra view on the subject, although as you can I see I never directly said "Snipers are the best choice" for a reason.
Got it and agreed!
Snipers will have a place once CCP brings out AV Sniper Rifles or some high calibre Sniper rifles. I however feel thats a long way off and to be quite honest CCP doesnt care much about sniping right now. The thing that they are more excited about is faction role based gameplay and EWar. Yes;- EWar is going to be the next big thing with Dust.
However at this point in time the Dust community is literally raging at anything red line and unfortunately snipers is one of them. Once they find something else to rage about CCP may give snipers another look.
If you are still planning on being a sniper I would recommend documenting your experiences and putting it in the Request and Feedback section of Dust. CCP does read meaningful posts. But be prepared to get trolled a lot. I hate to say it but 95% of the Dust forum posters are idiots and will troll you hard. As long as you are clear and precise you should be fine.
I just dont want new players to get driven away from Dust because of frustration. I like the game a lot and I know it can be frustrating at times. That's why I am here to help.
If you are still interested inbox me and I can give you some helpful chat rooms in Dust. |
RomeStar
Empire Investments Logistics
405
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Posted - 2014.03.20 12:38:00 -
[15] - Quote
Just uninstall the turd that wont flush and clear up some memory on your extinct PS3. Signatured removed, CCP Phantom |
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ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
2927
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Posted - 2014.03.20 12:56:00 -
[16] - Quote
Removed an off topic post. ISD Dorrim Barstorlode Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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Satyriasis Gabrielle
Kittens and Co Sonic Kitties Preservation Society
0
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Posted - 2014.04.04 16:20:00 -
[17] - Quote
"I just dont want new players to get driven away from Dust because of frustration. I like the game a lot and I know it can be frustrating at times."
frustrating? downright bloody stupid... i may get abuse for this but.. well.. whats the point of playing agame when i am being killed all the time by people with far better skills and gear..
you dont want new players to get frustrated and stop playing? i don't want to stop playing as i like the EVE related elements.. but it's just pointless.. spawn die spawn die spawn die why bother?
why should i persevere at getting killed constantly by players who i'm never gonna be able to match or compete against..
for example.. day 2 of playing.. i spawn in a Dominance fight with my newbie armour and newbie fitting and newbie gun, and the first thing i run in to is some guy with a rail gun fitted tank... a tank ffs...
how is anyone ever supposed to be able to play and learn and find out whats good for them if they start playing and are constantly slaughtered by toons with far more power...
to put it into some context... you wouldn't expect a two-day old EVE char in rookie ship with rookie fitting to go up against a much older char in a fully tanked LVL 4 capable BS would you? so why is it ok for it to happen to dust people :(
i do like Dust and it is sorta fun to play.. i will admit that i get a certain amount of joy when i finally kill someone (usually by fluke or accident) but it's totally dampened by the fact that i get crushed the rest of the time
lol sorry, small moan over now
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Satyriasis Gabrielle
Kittens and Co Sonic Kitties Preservation Society
0
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Posted - 2014.04.04 16:23:00 -
[18] - Quote
the missions with clone limits are pointless for me coz i just cost the team loads of clones
i'm now off to get Maleficia Gabrielle killed some more
*not giving up YET* |
JuliaVerus Elongur
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2014.04.04 16:48:00 -
[19] - Quote
I just started playing this game and it is horrible. Im sorry but there are so many better fps out there than this game. I do like eve though. |
Satoshi Kaname
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
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Posted - 2014.04.07 13:25:00 -
[20] - Quote
JuliaVerus Elongur wrote:I just started playing this game and it is horrible. Im sorry but there are so many better fps out there than this game. I do like eve though.
And why do you think it is horrible? |
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Archibald Liberty Killmore
Toodles McGiggityGoo and Friends
11
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Posted - 2014.04.07 14:40:00 -
[21] - Quote
JuliaVerus Elongur wrote:I just started playing this game and it is horrible. Im sorry but there are so many better fps out there than this game. I do like eve though.
LOL. Let me tell you this;- other than MAG no other FPS game has had a life span of over a year.
And pray tell how many Multiplayer FPS are out there than are better than Dust? KZ Shadowfall? Titanfall? PS2?
And let me guess;- you have no squad and you joined an ambush or FW game and got stomped?
What is your skill level? How are you fitting your dropsuits? What is your core like? |
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