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Perihelion Olenard
207
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Posted - 2014.05.22 19:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'm thinking about the next ship I want to train for in PvP, and the Astarte and Eos came to mind. However, after a little research, I'm really struggling to justify wasting sixty days of training time with the leadership skills. I won't be using links.
Concerning the blaster Astarte, the Proteus can put out just as much DPS and tank just as well, if not better. The Proteus also has the warp scramble range bonus. The Astarte doesn't actively tank any better than the Deimos, although it does do more DPS. With some low grade slaves, a plated Astarte comes out ahead of a dual repairer setup for HP (up until until the MAAR is empty) with the same number of slots used. I don't see any reason to train for this Astarte when I can already use the Proteus. There is also the navy Brutix, although it comes out behind the Astarte and Proteus in terms of tank and DPS.
Concerning the Eos, again the Proteus can put nearly the same DPS out and tank just as well, if not better. Close range vs close range, the Eos can come out ahead of the Proteus with drone DPS. With the ship bonus of the Eos for drone speed and the incoming drone MWD speed buff for medium and heavy drones, The Eos will have a decent engagement range with rails in the highs. However, the active tank on it is just as weak as the one on the Astarte for the same reasons. It offers nothing more in terms of tank over the Deimos except for the base HP. And again, a plated Eos with a few low-grade slaves comes out ahead in terms of HP over the amount of time you have charges for the MAAR in a dual repairer setup with the same number of slow slots used. The engagement range of the Eos for the amount of damage it can put out would be the only reason I'd use it over the drone Proteus. What does the Eos offer for damage over an Ishtar? While it does not have a bonus to drone cargo hold or sentry drones, the Eos can fit larger rails in the highs and fit a much stronger tank. It also has one more low slot and two additional utility high slots. What does the Eos offer over a Dominix? A little smaller signature, a little faster MWD speed, faster lock speed, and faster drones with their MWD on. It's certainly no justification for the skill training.
Overall, I don't find much of a reason to fly the Astarte or Eos over what I can already fly quite well. Sure, they have some damage, but so do other ships. Sure, they have some tank, but so do other ships. Others with much less skill training required, and those skills affect the performance of the ship. The Eos and Astarte are still neutral alt boosting ships, IMO. I wear my sunglasses at night. |
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
551
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Posted - 2014.05.22 21:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
The main reasons would be that they are cheaper than the Proteus and for the utility highslots. However yeah, the skills take along time to get up now especially if you don't want links, thankfully I injected the CS skill way before they made those changes =P |
Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
274
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Posted - 2014.05.23 07:34:00 -
[3] - Quote
Command Ships are not "better cruisers" any more. Their job is to provide a strong link platform rather than to outdo any of the other cruiser weight platforms for damage. If you intend to stick with medium hybrids then the Proteus (as you've already discovered) is the way to go. |
Ruaro
Space monitoring
7
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Posted - 2014.05.23 09:27:00 -
[4] - Quote
Astarte will outdps Proteus or will have more utility - 2 utility highs for small neuts, RLMLs vs frigate sized targets are a bonus, price is lower too and one more thing - T3's still do not get a balance pass - who knows how they will be affected.
Proteus has smaller sig and faster
And if training time is a ... long one it may give benefits in the future |
Maeltstome
Twisted Insanity. The Kadeshi
437
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Posted - 2014.05.23 12:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Leadership bonuses provide your gang with bonuses even without links fitted. Don't underestimate this.
And a command ship is cheaper than a T3 and will have significantly higher DPS output while maintaining a good tank. T3's do multiple things well at the same time, but they take a huge hit when trying to min-max any particular stat.
They are due a good balance pass though - i think the basic changes they had where only the start, similar to HAC's. |
Shpenat
Galactic Exploration and Mining Corporation The Obsidian Front
69
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Posted - 2014.05.23 19:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
Astarte in particular is bit weak compared to deimos or proteus.
The main problem is imho in the bonuses + slot layout.
Astarte and deimos has same number of med and low slots giving them same tanking configuration. However deimos has much higher base capacitor recharge (it can permarun MAR II + guns) and smaller sig. As a result it comes ahead in tanking ability.
Astarte has bonus to rate of fire leading to pretty severe cap drain. It really struggles with cap. Some of it can be redone by those two utility high slots.
Compared to proteus the main advantage is the full flight of medium drones and two utility high |
Shpenat
Galactic Exploration and Mining Corporation The Obsidian Front
69
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Posted - 2014.05.23 19:52:00 -
[7] - Quote
Comparing Eos to Deimos or Proteus is bit complicated. It is better to compare Eos to Myrmidon. Here the eos really lacks the medium slot for secondary cap booster. It can partially regain it with those two utility high slots, but that is quite situational. |
Futune Circinus
Merchants Trade Consortium The Last Chancers.
20
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Posted - 2014.05.25 11:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
I fly a combat Astarte in all serious engagements. The Proteus will not be able to match your dps, Astarte is king there, but the Proteus will easily have 50% higher EHP than you. If remote reps are involved, this is not such a big problem as you have the same resists. If your logi is lacking the Proteus is a straight up better brawling ship.
Don't discount a single armor link, you can easily fit one on the standard issue combat Astarte, and it is very helpful for wormhole engagements outside of your home system, when you may not be able to deploy offgrid links in advance. Your corporation will appreciate it.
Main advantages of Astarte: Higher dps, typically 1100+ Carries a single link module on combat fits Half price compared to Proteus No skill loss on death, fly reckless
Main advantages of Proteus: Higher buffer tank Shorter training time Gives cruiser 5 "for free", which unlocks Ishtar, another amazing ship Warps and aligns way faster than any bc hull can hope to Point range bonus Faster speed
Another competitor is the Megathron, but its mass makes it unsuitable for wormhole use, so I cannot comment. |
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