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McScruff
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Posted - 2006.07.07 10:06:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Soyemia
We need EW that stops enemy
The best way to stop an enemy is to blow him up.
Best way to blow him up is to hit hard and fast.
There is nothing in the game that will help you do that better than a Web and Target painter combo. ______________________________________
Warning: May contain traces of sarcasm |
Pesadel0
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Posted - 2006.07.07 10:29:00 -
[62]
Get rid of the missile bonus ,transform them in super artie platforms :)
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Forsch
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Posted - 2006.07.07 10:31:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Tachy With those few Amarrians defending the power of the Minmatar Recon cruisers, why don't their corps and alliances buy them in bulk?
The market pretty clearly shows that they don't.
Hehe, don't get me started on the market. Ever looked at the numbers of Mallers sold vs. Ruptures (or Thoraxes for that matter)? Or maybe the Omen vs. Stabber? How about the Vengeance vs. Jaguar or Ishkur? It's Amarr that need fixing, not the Minmatar recon cruisers. Just because one time the Amarrian ships of a class beat the Minmatar ones in solo pvp doesn't mean it's broken. They are awesome in groups. Use your other ships for solo pvp and be glad you have killer gang support with your recons.
Forsch Defender of the empire
More love for side factions! |
Tachy
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Posted - 2006.07.07 10:42:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Forsch
Originally by: Tachy [...]
Hehe, don't get me started on the market. Ever looked at the numbers of Mallers sold vs. Ruptures (or Thoraxes for that matter)? Or maybe the Omen vs. Stabber? How about the Vengeance vs. Jaguar or Ishkur? It's Amarr that need fixing, not the Minmatar recon cruisers. Just because one time the Amarrian ships of a class beat the Minmatar ones in solo pvp doesn't mean it's broken. They are awesome in groups. Use your other ships for solo pvp and be glad you have killer gang support with your recons.
Well, true. My Mallers don't sell as good as my Ruptures. But Molden Heath isn't a classic market for Mallers with Angels and no Sansha or Blood Raiders around. Well, maybe it might be based on the number of pilots with the needed skills too. Jaguar trade numbers only started moving a bit with the recent changes.
What are you doing in this thread if you're not interested in the Minmatar Recon cruiser getting fixed?
Again: If they're so good in groups, why are is the amount of Minmatar Recon cruisers being traded so low? Maybe because the other Recon Cruisers get the job done much better? --*=*=*--
Even with nougat, you can have a perfect moment. |
McScruff
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Posted - 2006.07.07 10:45:00 -
[65]
Simple.
People see they are no good solo and whine.
The people who actualy care if they are good in a group only hear the whining and assume it is grounded on a sound bassis so they look elsewhere. ______________________________________
Warning: May contain traces of sarcasm |
Soyemia
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Posted - 2006.07.07 15:39:00 -
[66]
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
You are comparing tec 1 and tech 2 ships?
you are right, amarr need some boosting.
But WHAT OTHER t2 ship has price near its constructing price? Ares yes, no others. If they are so great in gangs they would be around 60-70m, now you get one for 35m. Other recons cost around 80m, so there 10m for em to be able to solo. They suck, you know it.
Proud member of fix. Hated on finnish channel. |
Imhotep Khem
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Posted - 2006.07.07 15:39:00 -
[67]
Why shouldn't Minmatar Recons be just as multi-purpose as other Recons? Why should we be happy with a single purpose ship?
Screw that!
TP needs some serious fixing. ____ "If your not dyin' your not tryin'." "Are you prepared to go all the way, Alexi?" DuGalle |
Still Hart
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Posted - 2006.07.07 15:55:00 -
[68]
I agree with what someone else said. If there is one thing that should be "fixed" on the Huggin/Rapier it's that we could use an extra mid. I don't see 5 as enough, personally. I'll make do when I get mine, but another mid would allow me to actually fit a TP. _____________________
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Shidhe
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Posted - 2006.07.07 16:06:00 -
[69]
Just outfitted my first Huginn - nice ship. Haven't used the painter bonus, because everything else seemed more useful... Now a scrambler range bonus would be nice (even a small one). How about that for an interesting ship bonus? :)
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Imhotep Khem
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Posted - 2006.07.07 17:50:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Imhotep Khem on 07/07/2006 17:51:19 Maxed out Target Painter signature bonus: TP II Bonus 30% Signature focusing Skill (T2 skill) 5% / lvl Rapier Signature skill 7.5% / lvl
Total TP effect = 30 * 1.25 * 1.375 = 51.5625%
Stasis Webbifier I = 75% speed reduction.
So where turret tracking is concerned a negligible skill 'stasis webbifier I' is better than a maxed skill T2 Target painter.
I contend TP bonus should be equal to Stasis webbifier bonus. In that case effect on turret tracking would be the same but with TP the ship could still escape. Anything less makes the TP a laughing stock. Especially on Minmatar Recon ships. ____ "If your not dyin' your not tryin'." "Are you prepared to go all the way, Alexi?" DuGalle |
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Zac Dai
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Posted - 2006.07.07 18:01:00 -
[71]
For gang use i think it fails due to the small number of torp/cruise using ships in this game.
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Famine Aligher'ri
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Posted - 2006.07.07 18:08:00 -
[72]
Let me put it to you like this. I'm my Claw pushing 4000+ m/s with a MWD with some implants to reduce signature radius, heavy missiles tech I from a cerb did 2.2 damage to me. I flipped around and dropped to 800-1000m/s. Missiles did 285+ damage to my claw. Which was pretty much a instant pop with 80% armor (200m Tund plate fitted) on my claw.
Now obviously my signature being big and the speed reduction played a heavy role in damages going from 2.2 to 285+. Now imagine if I got webbed to lower M/S then painted by the listed skills above with my MWD on. How easy it would to hit me, how good of tracking hits you would get on my Inty and how quickly I would die. All from 30+km away none the less.
All of which is very useful skills and tactics in combat due the various usage of smaller ships (Frigs, Cruisers, Elite Frigs, Elite Cruisers and ECT).
--------------- Vile - Recruiting 0.0 Pirates --------------- |
Gai Servos
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Posted - 2006.07.07 19:28:00 -
[73]
But with with amarr ships you would have never gotten shot to any1 in gang, no you have tackled enemys gang (amarr nos / u cant scram)
Gallente would have forced you to come at normal web range
Caldari would have jammed you.
So all of these ships are at even with matari or maybe better.
Huginn/Rapier can do even with those in only three situations: With dread (and this is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO rare) or thta situation you said, or in bubble camp where ONE or TWO hostiles jump in, and there 2 inties could do same :'(. You need boost em, face it.
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Knoppaz
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Posted - 2006.07.07 20:03:00 -
[74]
Imho on the Matari ship the Nos-bonus would make most sense..
Amarr are their main enemy and they get tracking disruptor bonus to keep the Minmatar calm. Minmatar on the other side would need something to go against Amarr's strenght which is Cap.
..just some thoughts.
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Imhotep Khem
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Posted - 2006.07.07 20:18:00 -
[75]
Famine Aligher'ri makes an excellent point that further enhances the superiority of a plain vanilla Stasis webbifier I over a skilled up Target Painter II.
If the enemy uses an MWD, the webbifier will give you the full 75% trackability increase. In this case though it will make a significant difference to missiles as well. T2 TP still stuck at ~50%
Target Painter is a freaking joke. ____ "If your not dyin' your not tryin'." "Are you prepared to go all the way, Alexi?" DuGalle |
fkingfurious
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Posted - 2006.07.07 20:18:00 -
[76]
Hugin and Lachesis side by side.
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, pwnage.
Webbed and scramlebd at 40km, and sensor damped down to a 10km lock range.
So much fun.
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voidvim
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Posted - 2006.07.07 21:12:00 -
[77]
link to new HUGINN model
new model
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Stamm
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Posted - 2006.07.07 21:14:00 -
[78]
Originally by: voidvim link to new HUGINN model
new model
Veto. It needs flappy ears.
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Sebroth
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Posted - 2006.07.08 08:04:00 -
[79]
Edited by: Sebroth on 08/07/2006 08:05:59 I like my minmatar recon ships. I know they are not as good solo ship as the amarr ones and tbh you get better result in a gang with a caldari one.
But I like the fact that when in bigger gang/fleet battles I will very likely still be around helping my friends long after rooks and others are long gone.
But one small thing that I think they should change and that is to give the minmatar recons one more mid slot since both of the EW bonuses given to minmatar recons are mid slot based and every time I fitt my recon ship for its roll I find that it have too few mid slots. Removing a low slot and give it a mid slot and it would be a perfect ship, still not the uber solo ship but it will fulfil its duty.
rapier - general setup 3 x 720mm 1 x cloak 2 x TP 2 x webs 1 x sensor booster 1 x "tank" 4 slots for nanofiber, gyrostabs, tracking enhanchers
I only get one slot for its tank unless I try a armor tank I think that is just something that this ship was not made for tbh. Dont come and say I should only use one TP or one web becouse without 2 of both the bonus is not worth it and since its primarly a anti tackler ship you need that sensor booster. IMH the huginn is best used in small gangs that alredy has a scout so you take the huginn over the rapier becouse of the dmg output. In any other situation I take the rapier as it serves as a backup scout for a fleet with more advance EW abilitys or as the main scout for smaller gangs.
In some way I still feel that the only ship class in eve that is balanced in a good way atm is the recon ships.
Recon ships are EW platforms so its the mid slots that acually counts.... Lachesis: 7 mids; dampner and warp jammer; both are mid slot based Mid: 2 damps 2 warp jammers 3 misc and armor tanker?
Rapier: 6 mids; webs and target paineters; both are mid slot based Mid: 2 webs 2 TP 2 misc and shield tanker
Falcon: 7 mids; ecm all the way; mid slot based Mid: 4 ecm 3 misc and shield tanker
Pilgrim: 5 mids; tracking disruptor and NOS; one is hi slot and one mid slot based Mid: 2 tracking disruptor 3 misc and armor tanker
yeah I know my english is not the best :P -----
Never knock on Death's door; ring the doorbell and run (he hates that) |
Soyemia
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.07.15 15:18:00 -
[80]
YOu just ned to + 2x slots or make decent bonuses...
Proud member of fix. Hated on finnish channel. |
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