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Keyser Kahn
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Posted - 2006.07.09 16:23:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Keyser Kahn on 09/07/2006 16:23:00 Sorry for the question but i have been looking at station containers over the past few days as a means to track corporation hangar traffic.
Recently my corporation was robbed, i was ok with this as CCP have said this is a valid part of the game, a 'role-play' aspect. Ok thats fine with me. However what concerned me was the issue of the lack of means to actually view logs of what is taken and removed from the corporate hangar.
Now obvious our precious assets and so are let in the hangars that directors can only access and as such are left unprotected. However my corporation likes to provide ships, modules and so on to members.
This was what was stolen, and while it was only approximatley 150mil - nothing prevents the theif from repeating the act when the hangar is replenished. That is until someone mentioned station containers.
I looked at them and they do indeed provide a log, a log of almost everything... APART FROM WHAT IS BEING TAKEN OUT OF ONE.
Today i assembled one, placed it in the hangar, it logged me assembling it, it logged me configuring it, it even logged me placing an item into it. It did not however log me taking the item back out. The very thing its supposed to be useful for.
Am i doing something wrong? Am i missing the point? Or is CCP making my life a living nightmare trying to prevent corp theifs?
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Deacon Hasp
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Posted - 2006.07.09 17:41:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Deacon Hasp on 09/07/2006 17:41:57
Originally by: Keyser Kahn Or is CCP making my life a living nightmare trying to prevent corp theifs?
yes
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franny
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Posted - 2006.07.09 21:06:00 -
[3]
*hint* station containers log people UNLOCKING items
leave everything in the cans locked, then it logs who unlocked them, 1 + 1 = probable cause
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HatePeace LoveWar
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Posted - 2006.07.09 22:59:00 -
[4]
Edited by: HatePeace LoveWar on 09/07/2006 22:59:56
Originally by: franny *hint* station containers log people UNLOCKING items
leave everything in the cans locked, then it logs who unlocked them, 1 + 1 = probable cause
Think he just means why cant ccp log people taking out of the container like they do people putting things in.
Carrier & Fighter Sales |
franny
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Posted - 2006.07.09 23:32:00 -
[5]
and i'm just pointing out it logs stuff in, it logs stuff being unlocked, if it's put in, and not there, look who and when it was unlocked
start doing basic math
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Victor Valka
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Posted - 2006.07.10 08:15:00 -
[6]
It's called "design oversight", I believe.
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Keyser Kahn
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Posted - 2006.07.10 15:02:00 -
[7]
Ok another issue - what if they take the entire station container ?
Where's the log for that? Check their hangars? Oh no they've traded it to an alt.
/me waits for some patronising git to come along and say 'well don't give them access to take the cans'.
Then they cannot take anything out of the hangars. Which defies the entire point of what we want to achieve.
I'm just trying to prevent someone comming along and emptying our entire hangars, to fight against a valid tactic that ccp has endorsed but has been unable to develop a counter to.
I would really like an answer ccp i will be sending in a petition regarding this and really hope i get a decent explanation.
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mamolian
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Posted - 2006.07.10 16:27:00 -
[8]
Keyser, Implement a system where anything over a certain value is never in reach of 1 day old corp members..
There is no 100% sure way to give the kind of access in a secure way like you require, in game currently.
Have a director structure of people you trust to help you run your corp, and from there down the chain have lower and lower access until you reach the new recruits to your corp.
Ive seen it in my alliance, but *never* in my corp's Corp hangers, because we're extreamly careful, and paranoid.. Its like setting up a POS, and allowing people access to the pos shield, while having people eject from their ships inside the POS shield, freely availible to anyone with the password, or in corp or alliance..
Your bound to have some thieves in a game like this.. So anyone you consider 'ficle' or likely to corp jump at a moments notice, Then Id have a system where anything, even ammo, would be handed out in small amounts by a director.
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Celexus
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Posted - 2006.07.10 17:59:00 -
[9]
We experienced a similar problem not too long ago. What you do is tell people that if they unlock a stack of items, they need to remove the entire stack then seperate what they need from the stack then put the remainder back in. With a little bit of backreading, you can figure out how many of which item a person took.
Public Relations and Recruiting Officer, RESA Join RESA now! No really, I mean now. |
Alaria Phrozen
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Posted - 2006.07.12 23:00:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Alaria Phrozen on 12/07/2006 23:04:26 We of course had a similar problem; I think everyone does at some point. Please evaluate my response and maybe we can work out a pretty good solution together.
If you want to keep absolutely everything logged:
Give your members the following: Hangar Query Access (so they can see inside the hangar) Hangar Take Access (so they can view inside containers and take items) -Set all your cans to default lock. DO NOT GIVE YOUR MEMBERS: Container Access (this is what allows them to remove cans from the corp hangar)
My solution has been: -4 divisional hangars that every member has access to only one. Each division hangar is locked up tight as above. If anybody steals, I at least know who it was. These contain the items that everyone needs to play their desired role. -1 "Library" hangar that only the CEO/leadership has access to. This hangar holds the majority of corp assets and is used to restock the divisional hangars. Depends entirely on who you trust. At this point I trust no one. -1 Production hangar that holds all our BPOs and minerals. Again, only trusted members. As we complete research these are locked down. -1 Membership Drop Box, locked down like the divisional hangars but each box has the name of a member, and the unlock password is in control of the owner. It's basically a way for us to transfer items easily to eachother.
I really don't like this method because I feel more disconnected from my membership. I've appointed divisional leaders to keep an eye on the hangars and to place "orders" to restock certain items. This is actually kinda nice because I know the approximate demand of modules and ammo.
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Sillark
League of Gentlemen Galaxia Union
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Posted - 2006.07.15 14:16:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Sillark on 15/07/2006 14:17:06 There's an even easier solution. Just leave access to non directors to the most basic storage area (slot 1, and ammo) and if everyone puts all rat droppings in there, the hanger will fill very quickly with a huge variaty of items and ammo, and as none of it is really expensive or awesome items, so nobody will feel the compulsion to take a lot at once, but if someone loses a ship, they can outfit the one their insurance replaces for them enough to be able to get back out there to mine or mish run very quickly, and get the isk needed to put back on thoes better items.
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Alaria Phrozen
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Posted - 2006.07.16 02:36:00 -
[12]
This isn't an easy solution. This is the very thing we're trying to protect. That's exactly how it was setup Sillark until somebody cleared it out.
To figure out who did it, you need boxes at the very least. Boxes are annoying.
Are there any other suggestions out there?
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Rebasa
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Posted - 2006.07.21 15:46:00 -
[13]
I use station containers in my frequent stations purely for oganization. I change their names to the type of mods inside of them. For example, I have ones called 'Unsorted', 'Ammo', 'Guns', Minerals/Mining', 'Cap/CPU/Grid', etc. I dump all of my rat droppings and other unused mods in these by their type and when I am in a hurry I just dump everything into Unsorted and worry about it later. You could try this and pass it off as an organization effort that has the side effect of logging, even though it is difficult logging. Then inform everyone in your corp of what is going on and that everything is being logged. Use the methods above to also help reduce the risk. If they are just someone who is sneaking mods in bulk and not a professional thief, usually just the mentioning of logging is enough to stop them. The pros would know better and you will need to weed them out some how.
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