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Lothras Andastar
Associated North American Lovers of Dolphins
47
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Posted - 2014.08.05 23:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
Simple really. They were a joke in 2003 and they are a joke now. Because the Legacy Code has too much Psssssssssssssssh, nothing will ever get fixed until CCP stop wasting money on failed sparkle MMOs and instead rewrite the entire backend of EvE from scratch. |
Jessica Danikov
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
372
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Posted - 2014.08.05 23:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
You trained what to V?! |
Mario Putzo
Welping and Dunking.
946
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Posted - 2014.08.06 00:01:00 -
[3] - Quote
Did not train. |
Bullet Therapist
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
116
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Posted - 2014.08.06 00:23:00 -
[4] - Quote
I agree that defender missiles have never been good. I'm never a fan of removing skills or refunding skill-points, however, so I'd rather CCP find a role for defender missiles. I've done a few forum searches in the past and a few people have had some interesting ideas relating to them.
A few people have suggested an outright buff, which to me sounds like they're looking for a kind of equivalent to tracking disruptors. Others have suggest a sort of chaff-like active protection system. I'm not really sure that either idea would fit the game well, but they're interesting possibilities.
It's such a small backburner issue that I don't think it will draw the developers attention for some time, if ever. |
Spurty
V0LTA Triumvirate.
1373
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Posted - 2014.08.06 01:37:00 -
[5] - Quote
Make them also target drones and do tripple damage to sentries.
Two birds one stone [cup] *signature is not allowed on the EVE Online forums* |
Lothras Andastar
Associated North American Lovers of Dolphins
47
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Posted - 2014.08.06 02:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
Or just make them medium slot modules or not take a launcher slot, so they fit into the role of Tracking Distributors, but for missiles. Because the Legacy Code has too much Psssssssssssssssh, nothing will ever get fixed until CCP stop wasting money on failed sparkle MMOs and instead rewrite the entire backend of EvE from scratch. |
Meandering Milieu
House Aratus Fatal Ascension
79
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Posted - 2014.08.06 02:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Buff defender missile range, make them auto-target bombs and drones. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
8467
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Posted - 2014.08.06 02:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
Or, rather than removing it, replace it with an "electronic chaff" system that actually does something.
Would be pretty cool for droneboats to have a highslot option that isn't just neuts and drone range mods. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Clean Up Local 2014.-á |
HankMurphy
SniggWaffe WAFFLES.
26
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Posted - 2014.08.06 05:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Or, rather than removing it, replace it with an "electronic chaff" system that actually does something.
Would be pretty cool for droneboats to have a highslot option that isn't just neuts and drone range mods.
Just 'chaff launcher'
high slot, launcher reduces all incoming damage by 5%
skill adds .5%
New baitship dynamic. And for one week, the people who trained that skill to V will be the ones who are laughing.
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Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
657
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Posted - 2014.08.06 07:36:00 -
[10] - Quote
Making them useful as an EWAR module (read: mid slot module) against Drones and Missiles/Bombs would make a lot more sense and actually give more counters to popular fleet doctrines.
More diverse fleet compositions: some ships with Damps, some with Target Painters, some with Tracking Disruptors, some with Defenders, some with Remote Sensor Boosters, some with long-range Webs, some with long-range Points; using the entire range of EVE's Ewar capabilities to counter your enemies. |
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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
345
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Posted - 2014.08.06 07:58:00 -
[11] - Quote
Bullet Therapist wrote:I agree that defender missiles have never been good. I'm never a fan of removing skills or refunding skill-points, however, so I'd rather CCP find a role for defender missiles. I've done a few forum searches in the past and a few people have had some interesting ideas relating to them.
A few people have suggested an outright buff, which to me sounds like they're looking for a kind of equivalent to tracking disruptors. Others have suggest a sort of chaff-like active protection system. I'm not really sure that either idea would fit the game well, but they're interesting possibilities.
It's such a small backburner issue that I don't think it will draw the developers attention for some time, if ever.
Turrets don't get speed tanked.
You want to buff defenders aka nerf missiles then you need to buff missiles especially heavies first. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=348015 T3 OHing subsystem review and rebalance https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=290346 LP faction weapon store costs rebalancing
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Xuixien
The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People
1372
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Posted - 2014.08.06 09:21:00 -
[12] - Quote
Flak idea is kinda cool. Flak damages closely orbiting drones and incoming missiles. Like something we already have: Smartbombs.
Just remove the skill and refund the SP. Make defender missiles go off the skill for the same sized missile, ie a rocket defender that no one will use, a light missile, a heavy, etcetc. Epic Space Cat |
Xuixien
The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People
1372
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Posted - 2014.08.06 09:21:00 -
[13] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:
Turrets don't get speed tanked.
What.
Epic Space Cat |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
3586
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Posted - 2014.08.06 09:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Xuixien wrote:Caleb Seremshur wrote:
Turrets don't get speed tanked.
What. seconded. What?! =][= |
Linkxsc162534
Traps 'R' Us
90
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Posted - 2014.08.07 01:53:00 -
[15] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote: Turrets don't get speed tanked.
I don't wanna get techincal at you, but I'm gonna get technical at you. https://wiki.eveonline.com/wikiEN/images/thumb/a/aa/ChanceToHitv2.png/775px-ChanceToHitv2.png
Do me a favor and take a look at that page, don't worry its just the turret damage formula. You see that part there that says Traveral Speed. Thats the speed of what your shooting at, as it rotates around your ship (could also be called "Tangental Speed") Ships going too fast for the tracking/range variables, and forcing that fraction to get larger, get hit less often and thus take less damage. If a ship is flying above a certain threshold orbiting a target it can take literally 0 damage. This can be mitigated by using TPs, Webs, and other things to modify teh variables, but yes turrets are speedtanked all the time.
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Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1175
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Posted - 2014.08.07 04:13:00 -
[16] - Quote
Linkxsc162534 wrote:Caleb Seremshur wrote: Turrets don't get speed tanked.
I don't wanna get techincal at you, but I'm gonna get technical at you. https://wiki.eveonline.com/wikiEN/images/thumb/a/aa/ChanceToHitv2.png/775px-ChanceToHitv2.pngDo me a favor and take a look at that page, don't worry its just the turret damage formula. You see that part there that says Traveral Speed. Thats the speed of what your shooting at, as it rotates around your ship (could also be called "Tangental Speed") Ships going too fast for the tracking/range variables, and forcing that fraction to get larger, get hit less often and thus take less damage. If a ship is flying above a certain threshold orbiting a target it can take literally 0 damage. This can be mitigated by using TPs, Webs, and other things to modify teh variables, but yes turrets are speedtanked all the time.
He probably meant how speed in any direction can "tank" missiles while turret you also have to direct your ship in a direction that makes sense. You can literally fly in a straight line in front of a missile ship and it help your tank. Doing the same thing to a torret boat ensure his tracking requirement will be rather low. |
Bullet Therapist
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
121
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Posted - 2014.08.07 04:38:00 -
[17] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Bullet Therapist wrote:I agree that defender missiles have never been good. I'm never a fan of removing skills or refunding skill-points, however, so I'd rather CCP find a role for defender missiles. I've done a few forum searches in the past and a few people have had some interesting ideas relating to them.
A few people have suggested an outright buff, which to me sounds like they're looking for a kind of equivalent to tracking disruptors. Others have suggest a sort of chaff-like active protection system. I'm not really sure that either idea would fit the game well, but they're interesting possibilities.
It's such a small backburner issue that I don't think it will draw the developers attention for some time, if ever. Turrets don't get speed tanked. You want to buff defenders aka nerf missiles then you need to buff missiles especially heavies first.
I did not indicate a that I wanted a buff to defender missiles, I was merely relating suggestions I've read regarding defender missiles over the years. Moreover a buff to defender missiles is not synonymous with a nerf to missiles. It depends on how they're changed, if they ever are.
Also, turrets do get speed tanked. Maintaining transversal against a target with worse tracking than your own weapons is a concept critical to being effective in PVP and very often PVE. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
5213
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Posted - 2014.08.07 04:47:00 -
[18] - Quote
Spurty wrote:Make them also target drones and do tripple damage to sentries.
Two birds one stone [cup] hmmmm
I trained defenders to 5. :-|
I wish that for turret only ships they could have one of those gatling guns like the kind that navy ships use to shoot down missiles. Bring back DEEEEP Space! |
Bullet Therapist
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
121
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Posted - 2014.08.07 05:19:00 -
[19] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:Spurty wrote:Make them also target drones and do tripple damage to sentries.
Two birds one stone [cup] hmmmm I trained defenders to 5. :-| I wish that for turret only ships they could have one of those gatling guns like the kind that navy ships use to shoot down missiles.
Someone mentioned it earlier in the thread, but I've also thought for a while that it would be interesting to have a module (maybe a high-slot) that has a chance of causing a negative effect against your ship to miss. My thought on this is that rather than have the incoming damage reduce my some fixed percentage, the module instead causes any effect against your ship to have a chance to miss. This includes e-war, attacks, basically anything.
The rationale behind it is that it then becomes an interesting item for offense and defense. The chance to avoid a jam might allow you to kill that logistics ship, or it might allow you to run your MWD a little longer to get in range. Otherwise, you might avoid a crushing hit, allowing you to rep back out of structure and win the fight, or even get away. It adds an element of randomness to things that are right now quite absolute.
I was thinking that there would be three sizes, with the chance to avoid a detrimental effect going up in accordance with ship size. The thinking here is with smaller ships avoiding an effect is going to have a bigger chance to influence the fight, as fights in smaller ships are typically faster and don't as often involve as many players landing webs/scrams etc. The chances for it to deflect an effect might be something like 5%, 10% and 20% or 5-8-10 depending on how strong it's deemed to be, in order of small, medium and large.
It would probably have to be active and probably require ammunition or charges and be limited to a single module per ship.
Maybe, it's an interesting thought and it if ever happened it might be a lot of fun. |
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