Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1074
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 16:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
Please discuss issues related to this session in this thread. We look forward to your comments and suggestions. CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
95
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 16:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
Convenience MTs in Eve Online?
Never Ever without switching to Free To Play. |
Raid'En
Apprentice Innovations
124
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 17:15:00 -
[3] - Quote
did they gave you examples, or do we have to discuss what we can accept and not... again ?
also having this on the last day is a bad idea ; it will for sure be a hard disucssion, and you'll need to talk again about it another day before leaving |
Orakkus
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 17:21:00 -
[4] - Quote
No. Double No.
MT only for Vanity items... ever... if that. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
112
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 17:33:00 -
[5] - Quote
with all due respect, anyone who advocates anything beyond sparkle-ponies (i.e. vanity items) for MT should be forced to answer to a salvo of quad 3500 mm artillery...
if they survive the first salvo, repeat. |
Tubrug1
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 17:43:00 -
[6] - Quote
i want hats The jihad bomb--áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=392090&#post392090 |
Kaeda Maxwell
Black Rebel Rifter Club
7
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 17:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Anything that gets introduced that people had to previously invest time for will set of the **** storm all over again.
Don't even think about jump clones or standings for real world money CCP. Unless you enjoyed last summers thread-naughts ofc...
Just sayin. |
Drake Draconis
Shadow Cadre Shadow Confederation
121
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 17:58:00 -
[8] - Quote
In short
Microtransactions - **** no. |
Di Mulle
24
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 18:12:00 -
[9] - Quote
2/3 of the Crucible would be sold as MT...
Just no. If anything else, would be too great an incentive to leave or even intentionally create "inconvenencies , which should be properly named just bad design and coding. And CCP has way too much proven record of making inconvenient stuff. CCP is unable to implement simpliest things. Like settting to hide signatures. So they sweep it under a rug . Children do that in their pre-shool years, CCP does it being adults. Probably because it is fearless enough. |
Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow The Revenant Order
241
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 18:22:00 -
[10] - Quote
Microtransactions could actually be beneficial to the economy as we know it. However, I don't mean by the creation of an iWin button, or several items that give a defined advantage over other players. What I suggest is that MTs continue, but do away with Aurum, and make the NeX the great ISK sink that it could be utilized as. It could help stabilize the failing economy, as with current NeX prices, and the addition of Aurum has driven the price of PLEX up to alarming levels, currently affecting numerous people and their ability to continue playing EVE.
Vanity items only. "War is not measured in terms of who wins or loses, who is right or wrong.-á It is measured in terms of who survives." |
|
Vertisce Soritenshi
Varion Galactic Tragedy.
199
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 18:50:00 -
[11] - Quote
Vanity items only. This is how it should remain. Support our boobies!-áLINKY! |
Solo Player
78
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 20:08:00 -
[12] - Quote
No MT at all.
Vanity is a core gameplay mechanic in this game, as a quick look through these boards will show. So, no pay2win even for the vanity game. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
856
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 23:04:00 -
[13] - Quote
No cash store MT whatsoever for stuff in the eve online client as long as a subscription is charged.
Preferably remove NeX store and ceremonially throw the people who envisaged and championed it into the Harbour.
All ship customization, logos, exotic clothing and such should be introduced into the game by traditional means allowing players to research, develop, earn loyalty points from factions etc, and sell this stuff to other players on the market. Its an absolute no-brainer that npc corporate and faction ship skins should come from those factional loyalty stores.
Futhermore,
I'd like you to strongly remind CCP that they already got a form of MT additional income from the introduction of PLEX (which allows cash rich time poor players to spend rl currency on game advantage) and trying to impact the sandbox further is just being greedy.
Of course, you could argue that even additional accounts (which many many of us have) are another form of MT that makes gameplay easier (cyno alts anyone?)
Conclusion being.
Screw NeX!
Get that content flowing back into the sandbox by the traditional means and do not be tempted to nickel and dime subscription paying customers again in the future. The solution for CCP to increase its cash flow is to:
1. Improve the game so more people subscribe (and tell their friends to come subscribe too!) 2. Introduce expensive kit that people make ingame and sell for big isk (that some will trade plex/isk for) 3. Stop flushing money down the drain on half-assed projects that nobody really cares about.
It really isn't rocket science.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Drake Draconis
Shadow Cadre Shadow Confederation
122
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 23:10:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:No cash store MT whatsoever for stuff in the eve online client as long as a subscription is charged.
Preferably remove NeX store and ceremonially throw the people who envisaged and championed it into the Harbour.
All ship customization, logos, exotic clothing and such should be introduced into the game by traditional means allowing players to research, develop, earn loyalty points from factions etc, and sell this stuff to other players on the market. Its an absolute no-brainer that npc corporate and faction ship skins should come from those factional loyalty stores.
Futhermore,
I'd like you to strongly remind CCP that they already got a form of MT additional income from the introduction of PLEX (which allows cash rich time poor players to spend rl currency on game advantage) and trying to impact the sandbox further is just being greedy.
Of course, you could argue that even additional accounts (which many many of us have) are another form of MT that makes gameplay easier (cyno alts anyone?)
Conclusion being.
Screw NeX!
Get that content flowing back into the sandbox by the traditional means and do not be tempted to nickel and dime subscription paying customers again in the future. The solution for CCP to increase its cash flow is to:
1. Improve the game so more people subscribe (and tell their friends to come subscribe too!) 2. Introduce expensive kit that people make ingame and sell for big isk (that some will trade plex/isk for) 3. Stop flushing money down the drain on half-assed projects that nobody really cares about.
It really isn't rocket science.
QFE
Couldn't have said it better myself.
**** the Nex store and AUR crud...there's no reason or purpose to it....the economy should be unified under ISK anyway for DUST 514....why make it any harder than it is.
We can build/produce the stuff for the ground pounders anyway... we need the focus shfited back to the game...and as evidenced by recent events...its obvious that its the right thing to do. |
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 23:14:00 -
[15] - Quote
If anyone cares to read it, I have an alternate proposal where both players and CCP all benefit from micro-transactions, without effecting game balance (ie no pay to win).
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=37179 |
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
34
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 09:56:00 -
[16] - Quote
Its always puzzled me why CCP chose to sell vanity items directly in the NEX store. It would have been much more fitting to the EvE universe to sell AUR only materials and blueprints (that could then be traded for ISK) which could be used by researchers and manufacturers.
So instead of buying a dress you can buy a blueprint for the dress, research it and offer to produce for people. Or buy the materials yourself and sell the dresses on the market. Instead of buying a custom ship logo you buy a blueprint and some paint and produce a ship logo kit that other people can apply. Price it so that a 1 run BPC and the materials is the same price as the current vanity item and optionally sell a BPO for way more.
This way you can maintain the same microtransaction structure without completely removing the economic and industrial mechanics that EvE does so well. |
Eperor
Skyforger Tactical Narcotics Team
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 10:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
Cancel them complitly no microtransation in eve. Dont tuch our plexes they allready very expensive. |
Gempei
Siberian Khatru.
14
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 10:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
MT only for Vanity items ... ship skins, concord billboards, snowball launchers etc. ...be creative ccp |
Kaeda Maxwell
Black Rebel Rifter Club
7
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 11:30:00 -
[19] - Quote
Not on the topic but just to explain something;
AUR exists for a simple reason it allows CCP to monitor how much PLEX gets converted and by extension how many GTC's are purchased for the purpose of vanity items.
If it didn't exist they'd have no way to monitor the vanity & subscription revenue streams separately. So there's a valid real world reason for the secondary currency.
Regardless of what my or our opinions on micro transactions are AUR has a valid reason for existing as long as NeX Store exists. |
Smiling Menace
Star Nebulae Holdings Inc.
43
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 11:41:00 -
[20] - Quote
MT's for vanity items only.
If someone has too much cash and wants to buy monocles then that is between them and their bank manager. |
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
857
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 12:30:00 -
[21] - Quote
Smiling Menace wrote:MT's for vanity items only.
If someone has too much cash and wants to buy monocles then that is between them and their bank manager.
So let them buy PLEX and sell for ISK and use that ISK to buy expensive things in game that other players discover, harvest, manufacture and market.
Don't short-circuit the player economy in this game by allowing Cash Store NeX microtransactions to strip away content opportunity from Eve.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Samillian
Trojan Trolls Controlled Chaos
29
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 14:11:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:No cash store MT whatsoever for stuff in the eve online client as long as a subscription is charged.
Preferably remove NeX store and ceremonially throw the people who envisaged and championed it into the Harbour.
All ship customization, logos, exotic clothing and such should be introduced into the game by traditional means allowing players to research, develop, earn loyalty points from factions etc, and sell this stuff to other players on the market. Its an absolute no-brainer that npc corporate and faction ship skins should come from those factional loyalty stores.
Furthermore,
I'd like you to strongly remind CCP that they already got a form of MT additional income from the introduction of PLEX (which allows cash rich time poor players to spend rl currency on game advantage) and trying to impact the sandbox further is just being greedy.
Of course, you could argue that even additional accounts (which many many of us have) are another form of MT that makes gameplay easier (cyno alts anyone?)
Conclusion being.
Screw NeX!
Get that content flowing back into the sandbox by the traditional means and do not be tempted to nickel and dime subscription paying customers again in the future. The solution for CCP to increase its cash flow is to:
1. Improve the game so more people subscribe (and tell their friends to come subscribe too!) 2. Introduce expensive kit that people make ingame and sell for big isk (that some will trade plex/isk for) 3. Stop flushing money down the drain on half-assed projects that nobody really cares about.
It really isn't rocket science.
This.
MT has been debated to death, close the book on it once and for all.
|
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 16:36:00 -
[23] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Its always puzzled me why CCP chose to sell vanity items directly in the NEX store. It would have been much more fitting to the EvE universe to sell AUR only materials and blueprints (that could then be traded for ISK) which could be used by researchers and manufacturers.
So instead of buying a dress you can buy a blueprint for the dress, research it and offer to produce for people. Or buy the materials yourself and sell the dresses on the market. Instead of buying a custom ship logo you buy a blueprint and some paint and produce a ship logo kit that other people can apply. Price it so that a 1 run BPC and the materials is the same price as the current vanity item and optionally sell a BPO for way more.
This way you can maintain the same microtransaction structure without completely removing the economic and industrial mechanics that EvE does so well.
OMG I just agreed with someone from Goonswarm.
So, where are those riders in the sky?
That said, if CCP went about it the right way, MT *could* heavy emphasis* be a good thing, but they are not.
The thing they really NEED to do is get the players involved in the CREATION of vanity items. |
Bomberlocks
CTRL-Q
59
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 01:14:00 -
[24] - Quote
Trebor, make it clear to them that they will be risking the future of their company if they go beyond vanity items and it would be by far the best of they left that topic alone till eve has started growing again. |
Evei Shard
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
16
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 05:10:00 -
[25] - Quote
Wait. Where the **** did this word "Convenience" come from, and when?
We've gone from "vanity" related microtransactions, to "convenience microtransactions"?
Before this topic gets too far, CCP had damn well better step up and tell the players outright what they consider "convenience".
Faction ammo is "convenient" because it hits harder.
Faction modules are "convenient" because they increase damage/defense, etc.
Microtransactions are pretty damned basic for Eve: Avatar accessories only
Profit favors the prepared |
Tahna Rouspel
BWE Special Forces Rage Alliance
16
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 05:21:00 -
[26] - Quote
I don't mind the Microtransactions, as long as it remains vanity items.
I would like to see ship custom paints - these would be very popular. It would be good to see some of the old trinkets that appeared on the old character customization screen. There were hair trinkets, wires, etc... it added a lot of character to the avatar. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
858
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 11:42:00 -
[27] - Quote
Tahna Rouspel wrote:I don't mind the Microtransactions, as long as it remains vanity items.
I would like to see ship custom paints - these would be very popular. It would be good to see some of the old trinkets that appeared on the old character customization screen. There were hair trinkets, wires, etc... it added a lot of character to the avatar.
I too would like to see ship paint jobs and custom skins but I want them from exploration, from player led industry, from the faction loyalty point stores (from mission runners) and sold on the market for isk so that players can involve themselves in another service industry in the Eve online sandbox.
I do not see ANY valid reason for leeching gameplay content out to MT/NeX cash shop.
If you can see one then by all means make the argument.
But remember CCP already have a form of MT income stream through PLEX for ISK conversion and they already allow players to pay extra money for "convenience" by opening new accounts for multi boxing of everything from trade to logistics to cyno alts.
These terms "vanity/convenience" are a smokescreen for removing content from the sandbox and taking things away from player industry in Eve Online.
I want customization of spaceships, avatars, anything else you can think of. I don't want to spoil the player-led purety of the economic sandbox to get it.
And neither should you.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Tahna Rouspel
BWE Special Forces Rage Alliance
16
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 12:52:00 -
[28] - Quote
Jade,
I understand your argument and I agree with it, but the argument on CCP's side is that they need to monetize the game more. I'm not sure why or how valid this is, but that's what motivated the NEX store.
If the NEX store didn't exist, the clothes would have been added to the normal customization screen and players could have used them without charges. Custom ship paints are in between. I'm not sure where that would fit in the game.
The in game industry has always been about manufacturing ships and modules of all sort. Cosmetic items -could- be a part of industry, but it's never something I expected.
As long as CCP doesn't make utility for the NEX store or focus entirely on the NEX store and forgo the game industry, then I'm fine with it. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
858
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 14:01:00 -
[29] - Quote
Tahna Rouspel wrote:Jade,
I understand your argument and I agree with it, but the argument on CCP's side is that they need to monetize the game more. I'm not sure why or how valid this is, but that's what motivated the NEX store.
Which was a terrible mistake that led to the fiascos of this summer and contributed to the unsub crisis. The message the player base gave to CCP was that NeX (monetization) was a step we didn't want. And it doesn't answer the question I asked - why is it needed when PLEX for ISK conversion already fulfills the need for extra income from players seeking convenience for rl cash.
Quote:If the NEX store didn't exist, the clothes would have been added to the normal customization screen and players could have used them without charges. Custom ship paints are in between. I'm not sure where that would fit in the game. The in game industry has always been about manufacturing ships and modules of all sort. Cosmetic items -could- be a part of industry, but it's never something I expected.
With respect it is something you should have expected because Eve online is a Premium cost subscription game. The "hybrid" model of subs + microtransactions for "vanity/convenience" is a bogus nickel and diming insult to the intelligence of Eve gamers.
Quote:As long as CCP doesn't make utility for the NEX store or focus entirely on the NEX store and forgo the game industry, then I'm fine with it.
As long as NeX exists it represents a place where non integrated content can be injected into the game at cost to the integrity of the player-led economic sandbox.
It needs to go.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
178
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 14:03:00 -
[30] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Tahna Rouspel wrote:I don't mind the Microtransactions, as long as it remains vanity items.
I would like to see ship custom paints - these would be very popular. It would be good to see some of the old trinkets that appeared on the old character customization screen. There were hair trinkets, wires, etc... it added a lot of character to the avatar. I too would like to see ship paint jobs and custom skins but I want them from exploration, from player led industry, from the faction loyalty point stores (from mission runners) and sold on the market for isk so that players can involve themselves in another service industry in the Eve online sandbox. I do not see ANY valid reason for leeching gameplay content out to MT/NeX cash shop.
The "original plan" involved manufacturing clothes through some WiS process, and have only blueprints available for AUR. I agree that the current iteration is quite lacking in content.
I still stand by my opinion that the NEX store is not a MT shop. It's merely transfering one in-game item (PLEX) into an in-game currency (AUR) into more in-game items (accessories). The only MT in EVE is being able to buy a PLEX - which is freely available on the market. Therefore all the in-game content is available to you without having to pay anything more than the subscription fee. As long as it stays this way, I am fine with it. |
|
Pavel Bidermann
whips chains and ballgags Care Factor
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 14:56:00 -
[31] - Quote
I think the problem is that even though there are ways it could be done, CCP doesn't seem to know how to display restaint in it's exicution. To be fair, this isn't just CCP. Other games have shown poor judgement when it comes to not selling power and CCP should not be thought of as different. The fact that this is still up for discussion in EVE is a sign that they still don't understand player feedback or just how bad an idea this was. I don't see how it could be any clearer. For that reason CCP should just avoid another disaster and skip it.
They have bigger problems with game-killing supercaps and crappy Alliance/Sov mechanics. Those 2 things will kill this game if not addressed in a rdical fashion. |
Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
294
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 15:26:00 -
[32] - Quote
Remove the NeX entirely, drop microstransactions entirely according to the will of the community and make all these items part of the player-produced market like any other item.
Make all clothing and hairstyles available to all races. Andreus Anthony LeHane Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Animated Corporate Logos |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
860
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 15:32:00 -
[33] - Quote
Andreus Ixiris wrote:Remove the NeX entirely, drop microstransactions entirely according to the will of the community and make all these items part of the player-produced market like any other item. Make all clothing and hairstyles available to all races.
Yeah Trebor, please don't forget to put that Crowdsourcing thread result in front of the relevant people.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Akrasjel Lanate
Naquatech Conglomerate
197
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 17:29:00 -
[34] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Please discuss issues related to this session in this thread. We look forward to your comments and suggestions.
Editor's note: CCP's title for this topic was "Convenience Microtransactions", but we have not heard of any specific plans for such microtransactions, and the CSM is generally opposed to the idea.
Even if then only Vanity items that people can sell on market, but the PLEX->AUR exchange; i wonder how much it affects PLLEX prices.
|
Adhar Khorin
AK Sciences
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 18:59:00 -
[35] - Quote
Vanity items only, preferably by integrating vanity item production into existing market structures.
Plex->Aur->vanity bpo->market. Cash comes into ccp, products enter market for capsuleers, market competition ensues. That model provides a single entry point for vanity enabling items, but allows the entire player base to benefit.
|
David Magnus
75
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 19:00:00 -
[36] - Quote
I liked the idea of a PLEX for a remap.
A lot of people freaked out about it, but ALL the people that did the math and worked it out showed it didn't really make a huge difference. Besides, you still had to sit through the skill training either way, you just don't screw yourself for a year if you make a mistake. Even if it was limited to one per month or something like that.
I think it's important that nothing that you can get in MT for "convenience" takes the place of something a player could do for you. So no shipping things anywhere you want by interbus for an MT price or something like that.
However, MT for a race/gender/facial structure change should be ok as well - as long as the name/corp history doesn't change. http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/winterupdate http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/supercaps http://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/pandemiclegion |
Hiram Alexander
Seraphim Securities
112
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 19:10:00 -
[37] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Please discuss issues related to this session in this thread. We look forward to your comments and suggestions.
Editor's note: CCP's title for this topic was "Convenience Microtransactions", but we have not heard of any specific plans for such microtransactions, and the CSM is generally opposed to the idea. Whose decision was it, to rename this thread, incidentally...?
Just because you 'haven't heard anything' about it, doesn't mean you should try to pre-emptively run a damage control action. They've kept you in the dark before on certain issues, and might be doing the same again... :tinfoil:
So changing the name of a topic that CCP doubtless chose for good reason, could come across as a little disingenuous..
I'd personally like you to obtain proper clarification from CCP, insofar as you're able, as to whether their chosen title was actually appropriate. |
Khudin Hadashur
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 20:12:00 -
[38] - Quote
Since the topic of microtransactions is again on the agenda it is apparently again necessary to trumpet some opinions to CCP.
I would think most if not all CSM members would oppose microtransactions for non-vanity items. In fact, most EVE players probably oppose microtransactions for non-vanity items. A significant chunk even oppose microtransactions in any way, shape or form.
I for one do not mind the concept of MT for vanity. But this should be limited to vanity. Ship logos would fit that category as well and will be possible soon due to technical changes already (being) rolled out.
MT for the proverbial gold ammo or MT for convenience I can not support.
If this session is about discussing possible products that could be sold within the concept of vanity-only, by all means go nuts but keep in mind the current price levels in the NEX store are rather ridiculous, especially considering the lack of diversity it offers thusfar. |
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1077
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 22:12:00 -
[39] - Quote
Hiram Alexander wrote:Whose decision was it, to rename this thread, incidentally...?
CCP provided the initial name, and then realized that it might be misconstrued, and asked me to change the post.
Don't worry, if they suggest something we think is dumb, we'll tell them "that's dumb, and here's why" CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
Lykouleon
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
339
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 23:54:00 -
[40] - Quote
I'm all for microtransactions in the form of vanity items. But never for anything that provides "convenience" or a leg-up in any form over any other player. Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER SO I CAN HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD
WIdot Director of Quality Control and Ironically Signing My Title to Posts To Make People ~mad~ |
|
Hiram Alexander
Seraphim Securities
113
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 01:41:00 -
[41] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Hiram Alexander wrote:Whose decision was it, to rename this thread, incidentally...? CCP provided the initial name, and then realized that it might be misconstrued, and asked me to change the post. Don't worry, if they suggest something we think is dumb, we'll tell them "that's dumb, and here's why" Alright, I appreciate getting that feedback on whose decision it was.
Well, I hope their open with you... I've had a lot of my faith in them restored recently, but haven't forgotten that some of the worst moves they've made this year were the ones they didn't tell you about...
Personally, I take Jade Constantine's view on MT... I know, it's not 'ideal' for CCP's wallet, but there it is. |
SuperSpy00bob
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
15
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 02:30:00 -
[42] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:No cash store MT whatsoever for stuff in the eve online client as long as a subscription is charged.
Preferably remove NeX store and ceremonially throw the people who envisaged and championed it into the Harbour.
All ship customization, logos, exotic clothing and such should be introduced into the game by traditional means allowing players to research, develop, earn loyalty points from factions etc, and sell this stuff to other players on the market. Its an absolute no-brainer that npc corporate and faction ship skins should come from those factional loyalty stores.
Furthermore,
I'd like you to strongly remind CCP that they already got a form of MT additional income from the introduction of PLEX (which allows cash rich time poor players to spend rl currency on game advantage) and trying to impact the sandbox further is just being greedy.
Of course, you could argue that even additional accounts (which many many of us have) are another form of MT that makes gameplay easier (cyno alts anyone?)
Conclusion being.
Screw NeX!
Get that content flowing back into the sandbox by the traditional means and do not be tempted to nickel and dime subscription paying customers again in the future. The solution for CCP to increase its cash flow is to:
1. Improve the game so more people subscribe (and tell their friends to come subscribe too!) 2. Introduce expensive kit that people make ingame and sell for big isk (that some will trade plex/isk for) 3. Stop flushing money down the drain on half-assed projects that nobody really cares about.
It really isn't rocket science.
Honestly, this post needs to be on every page.
Invest in what you're good at (spaceships) and let the money flow from there. CCP has made it's success by being unique in the industry, not by copying other companies. |
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 02:11:00 -
[43] - Quote
I am up for MT for Vanity items. items that make me look the way I want to loo
I would like to see for In game items that are different but are less powerful than that can be bought in game Repairing Missiles - much like How snowballs work. Having to work though Resistances to actually rep something, on a similar ship fit the Repairing Missile boat vs a boat fit with reps the Missile boat reps at 50%
Ie Convienance mainly used for those people who have the $$ to take a short cut but pay more than triple that what a player could pay to reproduce.
Civilian Items (Meta 0) - to be bought in Null sec because some one forgot to fill the station and more than triple the cost if refined for minerals. Ability to by wood ammo - ammo worse that is can be on market, I need the ammo and I can't make any and none is on market. Let me buy a Tech 1 Ship but it happens to be minus 20% on all benefits of the ship. Missing, 2 Slots of other ships. Refining the ship would produce 1/3 of the minerals the regular ship would. Or the Tech 1 ships is permanent set and you can't change the module.
NPC courier contract items. the Price such is HIgh and time is super long. best to contact a friend to do it for you
Hire NPC alts to guard you in High sec during wardecs, even though a merc corp will do the job far much better at less of a price.
I agree with several people: CCP needs to focus most of eve's recources on FIS, but the development of WIS still needs to continue, just as a slower and more efficient pace. In eve I wish to be more than just a machine. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
863
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 03:21:00 -
[44] - Quote
Gevlin wrote:I am up for MT for Vanity items. ... Ie Convienance mainly used for those people who have the $$ to take a short cut but pay more than triple that what a player could pay to reproduce. ... Hire NPC alts to guard you in High sec during wardecs, even though a merc corp will do the job far much better at less of a price.
This is happens when you drink the Microtransaction coolaid
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jita Bloodtear
Bloodtear Labs
19
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 03:31:00 -
[45] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Gevlin wrote:I am up for MT for Vanity items. ... Ie Convienance mainly used for those people who have the $$ to take a short cut but pay more than triple that what a player could pay to reproduce. ... Hire NPC alts to guard you in High sec during wardecs, even though a merc corp will do the job far much better at less of a price.
This is happens when you drink the Microtransaction coolaid Jade's right. Don't drink the coolaid
|
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 11:37:00 -
[46] - Quote
I want to give CCP what they want but I don't want to loose what I want
it is not a case of if I win some one else has to loose
Like in faction warfare in high sec the local friendly NPC faction will help protect you.
Personally I would love the opportunity to Pay LP points to have the Faction NPC so set up camp around me during a personal wardec and guard me. Probably this option would have to be in place before the Nex store could sell this option. and the NEX store would be purchasing LP points to resell to lazy players. I agree with several people: CCP needs to focus most of eve's recources on FIS, but the development of WIS still needs to continue, just as a slower and more efficient pace. In eve I wish to be more than just a machine. |
StukaBee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
56
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 11:48:00 -
[47] - Quote
Gevlin wrote:I want to give CCP what they want but I don't want to loose what I want
it is not a case of if I win some one else has to loose
Like in faction warfare in high sec the local friendly NPC faction will help protect you.
Personally I would love the opportunity to Pay LP points to have the Faction NPC so set up camp around me during a personal wardec and guard me. Probably this option would have to be in place before the Nex store could sell this option. and the NEX store would be purchasing LP points to resell to lazy players.
GET OUT |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
864
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 12:19:00 -
[48] - Quote
Gevlin wrote:I want to give CCP what they want but I don't want to loose what I want it is not a case of if I win some one else has to loose
See I'm not convinced that the CCP we know and love actually wanted Microtransaction money-grubbing-sandbox destroying NeXCarna rubbish to spoil their dream.
I think the whole monetization/MT/Vanity/Convenience trash came from a few "industry experts" who got hired who had very little understanding of what makes Eve a uniquely successful indie-style product and simply wanted to get paid to advise Hilmar to follow the crowd and make like a WOW sparkle pony. I hope those people all got fired.
Quote:Personally I would love the opportunity to Pay LP points to have the Faction NPC so set up camp around me during a personal wardec and guard me. Probably this option would have to be in place before the Nex store could sell this option.and the NEX store would be purchasing LP points to resell to lazy players.
Is that you CCP Zinfandel?
GET OUT!*
(*in game)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 12:20:00 -
[49] - Quote
Get out!
The sound of a closed mind slaming shut.
Take the time to brain storm a solution, that will make CCP additional revenue, with out causing those who don't want to pay more the game not to have to pay more.
What vanity, or convenience. Items would not ruin your game if they got introduced.
Is there a "spin" or way you could make some P2Win Items palatable? --->Like the Nex store buying its stuff its sells off the local markets? If the Nex store did this would it also remove the RMT of those selling ships for Real Money like a Dominix can be sold from RMT side for $4.95 I would love to see the NEX store put these guys out of business especially after plex it is only worth 1.60 NEX buys a Dominix off jita for 48 Mill and then sell it for 85 Mill worth of Arrum/Isk on the NEX= $2.95
This will put the RMT companies out of business. And the Nex store earn 1.35$ for CCP and a player made his 48 mill isk for building and selling a dominix on the local market. Though another Player may earn some isk doing a NEX courier Contract from Point A to B to represent the moving of the ship from Jita to the point of purchase of the object.
Is there other Pay to win option that if done a certain way to involve the eve player base make Pay to Win Paltable.
like if I have a wardec. can I go to a Nex store and say I need protection. and the Nex store puts out a standard contract for mercs of a certain ranking to accept to complete a task for a newb?
Can players build wing man drones. NPC Ships that have a Sleeper AI and accept limited commands I can purchase off the market to do my bidding. Introducing essentially Crews. Once they become available to the general player back the NEX store can start purchasing these goods and start selling them on the NEX store. Player Built Henchment.
The Nex store turns into this "Not so Compeditive" Market bot in eve that does RMT though Plexes. - I agree with several people: CCP needs to focus most of eve's recources on FIS, but the development of WIS still needs to continue, just as a slower and more efficient pace. In eve I wish to be more than just a machine. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
864
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 12:25:00 -
[50] - Quote
Gevlin wrote:Get out! The sound of a closed mind slaming shut. Take the time to brain storm a solution, that will make CCP additional revenue, with out causing those who don't want to pay more the game not to have to pay more.
I've got it.
How about we invent this thing called PLEX. What it will do is allow poor players to trade isk for game time (isk which they have loads of because they mine while unemployed or studying for exams) and rl rich players will have the option of buying isk by trading the game time to the rl poor players! CCP will get more subscribers total and some of those will pay extra money for in-game advantage by trading in plex for isk.
Its genius right?
Think we should go with that strategy?
Quote:What vanity, or convenience. Items would not ruin your game if they got introduced. Is there a "spin" or way you could make some P2Win Items palatable? --->Like the Nex store buying its stuff its sells off the local markets? If the Nex store did this would it also remove the RMT of those selling ships for Real Money like a Dominix can be sold from RMT side for $4.95 I would love to see the NEX store put these guys out of business especially after plex it is only worth 1.60 NEX buys a Dominix off jita for 48 Mill and then sell it for 85 Mill worth of Arrum/Isk on the NEX= $2.95
This will put the RMT companies out of business. And the Nex store earn 1.35$ for CCP and a player made his 48 mill isk for building and selling a dominix on the local market. Though another Player may earn some isk doing a NEX courier Contract from Point A to B to represent the moving of the ship from Jita to the point of purchase of the object.
Is there other Pay to win option that if done a certain way to involve the eve player base make Pay to Win Paltable.
(removed all your stuff because we already have PLEX that achieves this goal without wrecking the game.)
Quote:like if I have a wardec. can I go to a Nex store and say I need protection. and the Nex store puts out a standard contract for mercs of a certain ranking to accept to complete a task for a newb?
You have stern competition from NeX quislings but I think thats probably the worst idea I've ever heard regarding Eve MT.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
|
StukaBee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
56
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 12:33:00 -
[51] - Quote
Gevlin wrote:Get out!
The sound of a closed mind slaming shut.
Take the time to brain storm a solution, that will make CCP additional revenue, with out causing those who don't want to pay more the game not to have to pay more.
What vanity, or convenience. Items would not ruin your game if they got introduced.
Is there a "spin" or way you could make some P2Win Items palatable? --->Like the Nex store buying its stuff its sells off the local markets? If the Nex store did this would it also remove the RMT of those selling ships for Real Money like a Dominix can be sold from RMT side for $4.95 I would love to see the NEX store put these guys out of business especially after plex it is only worth 1.60 NEX buys a Dominix off jita for 48 Mill and then sell it for 85 Mill worth of Arrum/Isk on the NEX= $2.95
This will put the RMT companies out of business. And the Nex store earn 1.35$ for CCP and a player made his 48 mill isk for building and selling a dominix on the local market. Though another Player may earn some isk doing a NEX courier Contract from Point A to B to represent the moving of the ship from Jita to the point of purchase of the object.
Is there other Pay to win option that if done a certain way to involve the eve player base make Pay to Win Paltable.
like if I have a wardec. can I go to a Nex store and say I need protection. and the Nex store puts out a standard contract for mercs of a certain ranking to accept to complete a task for a newb?
Can players build wing man drones. NPC Ships that have a Sleeper AI and accept limited commands I can purchase off the market to do my bidding. Introducing essentially Crews. Once they become available to the general player back the NEX store can start purchasing these goods and start selling them on the NEX store. Player Built Henchment.
The Nex store turns into this "Not so Compeditive" Market bot in eve that does RMT though Plexes. -
No, really.
Get out. |
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.29 00:23:00 -
[52] - Quote
My mistake "Pay to win" is the Purchase of items off Nex that provide a game advantage to more than anything that can be found in the game by standard means of play. I would also think it would include the items purchase from the nex store but never removed from the market which will cause a deflation on the goods that the player put on sale.
Convenience item i believe is the purchase of a service or item that another person can produce. Such as if an item is purchased off of Nex then that same item is purchased off the market by Nex. Currently a Service provided by Evegiga and Virtual items eu Through RMT - which is against the Eula. Putting RMT companies out of business would be a selling point for me, which results in in decrease CPU and More money put into the game with out these RMT Companies Leaching off the game. Though for me to say Yay to MT Convenience items: -->the Item sold on NEX has to be removed from market. --> The Nex must attempt to simulate the movement of Goods though NPC courier contracts or the like so the Logistic players don't loose their lively hood -->Nex Needs to have a large markup when selling the goods so players with out much effort can easily undercut the NEX store. -->the Security level of the system the item is purchased at should be a variable as lower the security rating the harder it is to get goods to the person. --> The price of items purchased from the Nex will go up if the NPC Contracts are not filled as time progresses and quantities are purchased. This point in necessary unlike many games eve does not have an GÇ£inventory system connect by worm holesGÇ¥ So I don't want the Nex store to be an easy work around blockades --->the high price nex users are paying for will be Instant delivery, something other RMT sites can't do.
Yes Jade Constantine GÇô we have had plex for some time. Which is fantastic which allow poor player to grind resources for rich players in exchange for game time. It has worked well in keeping many people playing and expanding the universe. But how does that retain the older player who has less and less free time because he has money but not the time to even fit his ship. If he could he would like to pay a few bucks on line buy a Prefit ship at his local station and do a couple of level 3 missions before he goes to bed. Flying 15 jumps to Jita, and then Back to your mission location takes up to 2 nights worth of you time. Especially when you are working 14 hours a day for some REALLY GOOD MONEY. And would just like to blow something up, and then go to bed. I am not really to concern with loosing my ship either.
Or how about the new player GÇô does not no all the tricks of the trades so has to learn to salvage pieces of ship items because nothing is close buy for me to build a decent ship with? And what is this thing called Jita or a trade hub. I have no Idea what that is since my newbie station is not near there. I would be willing to pay a few isk to buy a prefit kestral just to get started. If some wanker pops me no loss for 50 cents worth of Aurrum I can buy another ship.
These two play styles would viably exist providing more fund for CCP to move the game forward in new directions with out leaving other sections neglected.
The world is changing and the old subscription model is being less and less amiable received now-a-days
Diablo 3: in fact Diablo III is going to come out with a integrated RMT model. Which blizzard is able to receive a % from each transaction a play makes to another player. What would you say if Eve turned free to play and the game was funded purely by RMT though the NEX where if you wanted to make Real money off the loot you get from your complex can be sold on NEX and you get GÇ£PaidGÇ¥to play eve vs paying a subscription? Will put the Pirate RMT guys out of business.
Even though I feel Eve is the centre of my universe, I realize it is not the centre of everyone and my beloved game needs to adapt if its greatness shall continue.
I welcome Comments like Jades, it is helping me to develop my position of Convenience MT as apparent from my changing opinions though out this thread.
I agree with several people: CCP needs to focus most of eve's recources on FIS, but the development of WIS still needs to continue, just as a slower and more efficient pace. In eve I wish to be more than just a machine. |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks Petition Blizzard
362
|
Posted - 2011.11.29 01:37:00 -
[53] - Quote
I've said it before: Valve has already demonstrated how to do microtransactions right, with Team Fortress 2. Even before it went F2P, they were making good money selling vanity items AND all in-game weapons.
CCP already has a method by which you can purchase weapons: buy a PLEX, sell it for isk, buy your stuff. I see no reason to place gameplay items in the NEX. Clearly PLEX are in demand enough to motivate people to put them on the market.
What CCP needs to do is put more vanity items in the NEX. Paint jobs. Logos on space ships and t-shirts. Tattoos. Ad space on billboards and CQ screens.
Hell, I'd even support something similar to TF2's crates where you find containers which can only be unlocked at the NEX and are *guaranteed* to contain rare vanity items that can't simply be bought. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
873
|
Posted - 2011.11.30 09:35:00 -
[54] - Quote
Gevlin wrote: Yes Jade Constantine GÇô we have had plex for some time. Which is fantastic which allow poor player to grind resources for rich players in exchange for game time. It has worked well in keeping many people playing and expanding the universe. But how does that retain the older player who has less and less free time because he has money but not the time to even fit his ship. If he could he would like to pay a few bucks on line buy a Prefit ship at his local station and do a couple of level 3 missions before he goes to bed. Flying 15 jumps to Jita, and then Back to your mission location takes up to 2 nights worth of you time. Especially when you are working 14 hours a day for some REALLY GOOD MONEY. And would just like to blow something up, and then go to bed.
How about he puts up a post on the sell orders forum and says:
"want to buy, 10 prefit apocalypses with this fitting (includes fitting) this ammo (includes ammo and amounts) and these rigs (lists rigs) - items must be preconfigured and I need a can of quafe and dancing girl in the cargo hold, all ships must be named after No+½l Coward plays. All ships to be supplied complete to Hek system Minmatar space. I will by 2.5x the total Jita purchase price of all items for this service."
And guess what. Other players will take him up on that and deliver the ships being paid a premium themselves for helping out a rl cash rich/time poor player who pays for the service by tradiing those PLEX he bought by doing an extra hour's overtime at work.
This is what can happen NOW, you don't need a NeX Abortion messing up player interaction in the Eve sandbox.
Quote:Or how about the new player GÇô does not no all the tricks of the trades so has to learn to salvage pieces of ship items because nothing is close buy for me to build a decent ship with? And what is this thing called Jita or a trade hub. I have no Idea what that is since my newbie station is not near there. I would be willing to pay a few isk to buy a prefit kestral just to get started. If some wanker pops me no loss for 50 cents worth of Aurrum I can buy another ship.
What you see as a problem Eve players see as gameplay.
Quote:The world is changing and the old subscription model is being less and less amiable received now-a-days - Diablo 3: in fact Diablo III is going to come out with a integrated RMT model. Which blizzard is able to receive a % from each transaction a play makes to another player. What would you say if Eve turned free to play and the game was funded purely by RMT though the NEX where if you wanted to make Real money off the loot you get from your complex can be sold on NEX and you get GÇ£PaidGÇ¥to play eve vs paying a subscription? Will put the Pirate RMT guys out of business.
I would prefer a free-to-play Eve with microtransactions to a hybrid subscription + microtransaction model any day of the week, but both of these options are a million miles behind the continuance of the subscription model as primary income and guarentor of all the game's content for everyone. Yes gaming is changing in some ways - but its a false argument to hold up the actions of an industry giant and claim everyone needs to emulate that. By the same logic we should be removing death penalty, introducing giant intelligent pandas and dumbing down eve to be furry friendly space friends online just because the market leader is forging this agenda!
Of course the irony of your remark about Diablo3's integrated RMT deal is that CCP have something similar already in PLEX. They legitimized the use of RL currency for in-game advantage and ensured they made extra income from the PLEX sales. Done deal. And its the only form of Microtransaction Eve online needs or really accepts.
Quote:Even though I feel Eve is the centre of my universe, I realize it is not the centre of everyone and my beloved game needs to adapt if its greatness shall continue. I welcome Comments like Jades, it is helping me to develop my position of Convenience MT as apparent from my changing opinions though out this thread.
So consider this point that Eve itself (the in-space game) doesn't need Microtransactions beyond what it already has with PLEX (which enable rich players to buy convenience and advantage through plex/isk conversation) without destroying opportunity for player interaction in the sandbox.
If you want to find a place for Microtransactions through NeX then I say go out of game items - sell shirts, coffee mugs, magazines, posters, eve-themed bits and pieces out of game. But keep the game-space pure of this stuff and preserve the essence of the game that kept it alive for 8 years. And make no mistake, most games if they'd been as comprehensively abandoned as eve was for the last 2 years would probably have already died by now. Eve survived because people know there isn't anything like it elsewhere in the gaming universe and they wanted it to live (despite hating what NeXCarna had done to it.)
If CCP want more profits they need to grow the game and get it back to a positive upwards trend in subscriptions. I don't believe the rot about the subscription model being "dead" because now in this current world environment of financial woe and uncertainty gamers want suspension of disbelief and insulation from the austerity and greed politics in their day to day life. Its easy to justify $15 dollars a month (or free if fund your sub through gameplay) as the cost of your leisure hobby - but change the game to a MT model and everything becomes an unwelcome reminder of how nickel and diming is prevelent in the modern world. People play games to forget the bullshit of the real world, not to be reminded of it by CCP Monocle and CCP thousand dollar jeans. People have always joked that Eve "spreadsheets" Online seems like a second job, but turn it through MT monetization into "Eve Online - Second Bankrupcy" and you'll truly see player base erode.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
873
|
Posted - 2011.11.30 09:54:00 -
[55] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:I've said it before: Valve has already demonstrated how to do microtransactions right, with Team Fortress 2. Even before it went F2P, they were making good money selling vanity items AND all in-game weapons.
CCP already has a method by which you can purchase weapons: buy a PLEX, sell it for isk, buy your stuff. I see no reason to place gameplay items in the NEX. Clearly PLEX are in demand enough to motivate people to put them on the market.
PLEX is all they need. And now they are not paying for TWO separate game development cycles on the income raised by Eve Subscriptions the only "must have NeX/MT argument" is pretty void.
Quote:What CCP needs to do is put more vanity items in the NEX. Paint jobs. Logos on space ships and t-shirts. Tattoos. Ad space on billboards and CQ screens.
Just no. All this stuff is core content just the same as engine trails, nebulas, turret effects are content. You can't decide that a ship logo is "vanity" and an enhanced turret model (that does absolutely nothing gamewise the old one doesn't) is not vanity. Its a crazy comparison. This is a subscription MMO, subscription should get you all the graphic content that is worked on through our subscripton money.
Quote:Hell, I'd even support something similar to TF2's crates where you find containers which can only be unlocked at the NEX and are *guaranteed* to contain rare vanity items that can't simply be bought.
Now I know you're trolling.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.30 12:48:00 -
[56] - Quote
I am concern that MT items will circumvent the player who grind, for CCP to make quick buck. This is why I am suggesting that Nex begins to act at a RMT service this will not only to help disable the current RMT badies, but also make CCP money to put back into the game. So I recommend Allowing Nex to make a percentage profit on the resale of player made items means there will "never be a P2W" option. It CCP wants to bring in those items that would be desirable like, Remaps, Ship Colours, Logo, unique items etc. They will have to let the player base grind them though LP or some form of industry to be placed on the market for the Nex store to resell.
This would encourage CCP to follow the directive of everything is player made such as PI... some thing the Current NEX path is moving away from.
With the Broker of Goods brought to players conveniently approach, the Nex store can have a GÇ£Massive variety of things to sellGÇ¥
My Experience with DDO and they have convenience items, that I could take the time to sell Essence on the market to get the Plat to buy the +3 Chain a 2 day affair or I could spend the 25 or so Store Points to buy the +3 Chain and it goes into my inventory so I can get to doing adventure right away. (DDO just makes it and simple make it a no drop item which eve does not have)
DDO also had things like Seasonal Candy canes that could make anyone a healer, which made the item a P2Win item as you could not find such an item via playing the game normally.
Will Plex simple be a solution as it has allow the effect of MT to happen over the last 5 years? I worked over the previous 3 years but the last 2 years more efficient spoon fed MT has over run the industry. If eve wants to remain competitive in this market it needs to make things easy spoon fed... much like DDO or other games.
In summary Make the Current Fashion items player made or LP Items Make Future items like Ship Colouring into player made or LP items Have players place this on the market Have Nex buy these items from the market as it as it sells them as MT Have Nex Charge a Large markup to compensate for the convenience. This is where CCP makes their $$
CCP gets its MT, and Players are will never have to worry about P2Win ever becoming an issue. I have never read the reports nor know the past work of these experts on MT, so I can't say if CCP is on solid ground or if the vocal minority are unreasonably panicky. All I know I never want my hours of Mining grinding ore to have to compete with some one who is just paying for a good some item made out with out grinding. But if some one want to pay too much than any sane person wants to for my item I put on the market, even though I don't get the extra profit beyond what I ask for, I say Go a head it is not my money being wasted it.
CCP is already providing real world items for sell, but those don't bring in the potential revenue as selling instant gratification items in game. Small gratification that is conveniently put at one's feet, so you can casually just pay, pickup and play. CCP needs to find additional revenue or raise the monthly fee of the game. CCP monthly fee has not keep up with inflation.
Personally I want the Lazy, self indulging rich guy often with not much time on his hands to pay for the costs of running the game that is not covered due to inflation. The Broker to make the Purchase of items off the market convenient approach won't receive a negative selling items flat out at this is a slippery slope. --> first vanity items, like Boots or a paint job, -->then Convenience items like NPC Couriers -->then Instant re-customization like Plex for Remap, -->then P2Win like Gold Jovian Ammo.
I agree with several people: CCP needs to focus most of eve's recources on FIS, but the development of WIS still needs to continue, just as a slower and more efficient pace. In eve I wish to be more than just a machine. |
Max Kolonko
Worm Nation Ash Alliance
10
|
Posted - 2011.11.30 16:44:00 -
[57] - Quote
Orakkus wrote:No. Double No.
MT only for Vanity items... ever... if that. This |
Myxx
Atropos Group
153
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 19:40:00 -
[58] - Quote
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:Vanity items only. This is how it should remain. This and in general removal of microtransactions altogether. Heres some stuff I wrote on the matter. I personally think they ought to remove the nex store and it should be noted that if CCP starts using convinence microtransactions, they may very well face another uprising and one that is worse than it was before.
Don't you dare, CCP. |
Nestara Aldent
EVE University Ivy League
6
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 00:12:00 -
[59] - Quote
By making money shop mandatory by giving game advantage, even with seemingly innocuous things like neural remaps and clone jumps, you're asking the hell to break loose. Whoever in your management has the ridiculous idea that people will pay an arm and a leg to play a game need to sober before real damage is done. And damage will not be done to playerbase which will leave for greener pastures, be it WoW or Rift or SW:TOR, but CCP.
Paying subscription and on top of it having mandatory microtransactions is unacceptable. Most posters in the thread share my sentiment, I'm certain. And I smell the rat, now rmt is just for conveniences, just like before was only for vanity stuff. What's next, I wonder?
And by the way, get rid of aurum and make nex store stuff purchasable with plex directly, if buying it for the isk makes your management uncomfortable, though because these currencies are interchangeable, many nex items are available for isk. More than one currency feels horribly contrived. |
Aph3xus
Focused Annihilation Detrimental Imperative
1
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 09:40:00 -
[60] - Quote
SuperSpy00bob wrote: CCP has made it's success by being unique in the industry, not by copying other companies. This.
I am scared to death by CCP constantly bringing up micro-transactions. CCP used to pride itself on making a smart game that stood out. Yet every time I turn around they want to do what works for cookie cutter mmo's that don't hang around for more than a couple years. I know this thread isn't meant for CCP directly but could you guys on the CSM try extremely hard to drive home the fact that EVE is inherently not your run of the mill MMO, and thus strategies meant for run of the mill MMO's will probably not work for their product? I feel like this was something they understood at some point.
More on topic: Vanity only. Preferably none at all. |
|
Namasta
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 10:11:00 -
[61] - Quote
Gevlin wrote:
Diablo 3: in fact Diablo III is going to come out with a integrated RMT model. Which blizzard is able to receive a % from each transaction a play makes to another player. What would you say if Eve turned free to play and the game was funded purely by RMT though the NEX where if you wanted to make Real money off the loot you get from your complex can be sold on NEX and you get GÇ£PaidGÇ¥to play eve vs paying a subscription? Will put the Pirate RMT guys out of business.
Make a market where items will be selling by players for RM and CPP will have % from it is good idea better then microtransactions. But IGÇÖm afraid something like this http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/editorials/op-ed/847-Jumpgate-EVEs-Devs-and-the-Friends-They-Keep. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
894
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 13:10:00 -
[62] - Quote
Aph3xus wrote:SuperSpy00bob wrote: CCP has made it's success by being unique in the industry, not by copying other companies. This. I am scared to death by CCP constantly bringing up micro-transactions. CCP used to pride itself on making a smart game that stood out. Yet every time I turn around they want to do what works for cookie cutter mmo's that don't hang around for more than a couple years. I know this thread isn't meant for CCP directly but could you guys on the CSM try extremely hard to drive home the fact that EVE is inherently not your run of the mill MMO, and thus strategies meant for run of the mill MMO's will probably not work for their product? I feel like this was something they understood at some point. More on topic: Vanity only. Preferably none at all.
Don't let up on this. "vanity" itself is a very dodgy and entirely subjective concept. One man's vanity is another man's content and once you start imposing artificial dividers between grades of content you open a pandoras box that ruins the integrity of the sandbox. We pay a sub, we get eve online. Thats about as complicated as it needs to get. Screw NeX and microtransactions and the horse they rode in on to be honest!
And the people in this thread still arguing that CCP need extra income do need to realize that things have changed in a pretty serious way this year.
Let me explain.
CCP Games is a successful Professional father. He manages to pay the bills, and invest in the future of his only daughter "Eve". Eve is bright and original, lovely to talk to and manages to impress everyone as she's growing up.
Then a few years ago CCP Games met a mascara-wearing floozy with fake breasts and a penchant for dressing up her twin Chihuahua muts in mink waistcoats. The name of the floozy was "World of Darkness" and almost immediately she started spending CCP's money. Hard working successful CCP soon found itself pressed for cash as World of Darkness wined and dined a succession of long-haired poetic emo types and slept late after drinking all his wine.
Then even worse! World of Darkness brought her unlovable adolescent son (from her first failed marrage) Dust 514 into the house. Playing loud industrial house music and snorting crystal meth at all hours of the night Dust repeatedly broke all the furniture and invited thieves and pimps to squat on the living room floor and set up their MT/NEX rackets in the front garden.
Between them World and Darkness and Dust came close to bankrupting poor old CCP Dad while the goth harlot tapped his bank account for investments into the experimental "work" of internationally-reknowned fashion artistes "monocle and $1000 jeans" the horrible teenage son was trying to corrupt poor little Eve into turning MT tricks on the street corner for small change to fund his meth habit.
Those players who believe encouraging this situation is the right approach (by finding excuses for MT) are simply abusing poor Eve and betraying the hard working professional dad.
What happened in the autumn is that some of CCP Dad's friends (the good player base) came round and talked things over. CCP woke up and threw World of Darkness out on her skanky backside and hurled her suitcases out on the street. Dust 514 promised to clean up his act and is now on best behavior and Eve can finally come out of her room again without being paraded in cheap tarty underwear for the MT meth addicts to ogle at.
So.
The morale of this story is that the biggest challenge to CCP "Dad's" income was resolved when the slutty-sleeparound World of Darkness got booted out on the street. There is no long a need to have Eve turn MT tricks to pay the rent. Sure Dust 514 is still living with us but he turns 16 next summer and will then need to get his own job and place and sink and swim on his own.
The end.
(we don't need microtransactions in Eve.)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
330
|
Posted - 2011.12.03 15:12:00 -
[63] - Quote
What CCP needs to be doing is attacting new subscribers so that they have more money coming in from their subscription-based economic model. Fortunately this new expansion seems to be working in this regard, but we need to go further - get rid of the NeX entirely. Andreus Anthony LeHane Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Animated Corporate Logos |
Hailey Sunweaver
MAFIA PLAYGROUND UNI0N.
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.08 16:31:00 -
[64] - Quote
I think CCP needs to seriously rethink "microtransactions" . Vanity items would be fine as would some WiS items if that ever comes to be. But the pricing needs to be retooled completely 65 bucks for a fancy pixel eye patch is insane. But we shouldn't have to keep repeating this topic over and over the actions of this past summer should speak for it's self |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
354
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 00:43:00 -
[65] - Quote
Hailey Sunweaver wrote:I think CCP needs to seriously rethink "microtransactions" .
No, the EVE community has to rethink "virtual items". There are already micro transactions in EVE: convert PLEX to ISK, spend tiny amounts of real money through ISK as a proxy (e.g.: for a pile of Imperial Navy Multifrequency L crystals). The NeX is a luxury virtual goods store: nothing "micro" about those transactions at all.
Other markets have shown that halving the cost of an item approximately doubles the sales. There is no advantage to having low-value items (i.e.: traditional "micro transaction item stores"). People who want the items will find the money to buy them, regardless of cost. This is what CCP Zulu was on about with his "$1000 designer jeans" statement: for the insanely rich, price is not a consideration. For the record, there are also $100k designer jeans out there, along with Gé¼42B luxury sports cruisers made of gold.
When it comes to convenience items (or "concierge" items, as per Fearless), I am of two minds: on one hand, they are a vile, foul addition to the game that will inevitably lead to the corruption of CCP by simple greed. On the other hand they are a useful tool to allow free-to-play (i.e.: unlimited length trials) without overly impacting the rest of the game. Having more people online will lead to more people being online: that is, the more people any one player can interact with, the less likely they will be to simply log out and go play some other more interesting game. If you don't think that simply having more people online at any one time is a worthwhile goal, go talk to US players in California, or Australian/New Zealand/SE Asian players in general.
Hopefully CCP gains some useful insights from the 60 day trial experiment (which is really just an extension of the 51 day trial experiment they've already been performing). What impact will free-to-play accounts have on the rest of the game, assuming there are sufficient barriers in place to make subscribing attractive?
|
Intar Medris
REDBIRD Industrial Crew
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 06:20:00 -
[66] - Quote
Absolutely no MTs. Eliminate Nex and Aurum and allow these items to be produced by players. this Summer and the exodus that occurred should have sent that message. CCP can't keep ignoring the player base if they want EVE and Dust to succeed. |
Malcorath Sacerdos
ROC Deep Space The ROC
9
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 10:38:00 -
[67] - Quote
Microtransitions ..
NO^n
where n -> infinity |
Rixiu
North Star Networks The Kadeshi
34
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 11:23:00 -
[68] - Quote
**** no to microtransactions. Lots of people despise them as the devil (including myself) and I have a feeling that a lot of eve-players feel the same way. This is a sandbox MMO not world of tanks, if I had wanted microtransactions I would play another game. The player economy is what's awesome with eve and CCP should focus on making it more awesome instead of trying to compete with world of tanks and similar.
Implement painjobs and such not as RMT but as more gameplay for the sandbox! More content = better sandbox = more players! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
985
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 14:28:00 -
[69] - Quote
I do hope the CSM brought CCP's attention to this thread during the recent summit. I look forward to some specific notes on the issue in the upcoming minutes.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |