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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Souxie Alduin
Anarchy in the Eve
140
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Posted - 2014.10.21 21:51:39 -
[151] - Quote
Grimpak wrote:Souxie Alduin wrote:A quick question for the Gamergate supporters: If this is all about ethics in journalism, why are you going after female developers and critics, and not the journalists?
The only logical answer I can come up with is that you really just don't want women talking about games. a question from the third side: will this argument will finally stop or will you people will build hate upon hate on each other for an eternity? seeing people screaming "MISOGYNY!" at people screaming "MISANDRY!" and vice-versa for the last 2+ months is akin to beating a dead horse. also, it stopped being funny long ago.
It was never funny in the first place. "I'm coming to your house to **** you with a K-bar" is not funny.
Also, from your argument you seem to think that misogyny and misandry are equal. They're not. There is a LOT more misogyny in gaming (and everywhere else) than misandry. Being threatened for pointing that out is not cool (see: Saarkesian).
And finally, if by "third side" you mean "people who don't care", why are you here commenting? |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7094
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Posted - 2014.10.21 22:49:50 -
[152] - Quote
Souxie Alduin wrote:There's never a Dude in Distress.
I disagree as I recall Han Solo was a dude in distress.
Souxie Alduin wrote:So many women in gaming have received horrible death and **** threats lately I get them mixed up.
Again, I am of the mindset that gender is irrelevant when a person receives a a death threat and no, I don't think it is much much worse if it is a girl that is being threatened. I make no distinction between genders when it comes to the sheer amount of stupidity going on. Threats directed at someone, regardless of their gender, is just as condemnable.
Souxie Alduin wrote:And what about professional ethics? Examples?
Ars Technica Kotaku Polygon Gamastura RPS etc.
I call it a lapse of professional ethics when journalists are influenced by their personal opinion on something that has devolved into little more than raging for the sake of raging. Adding to that, there is no reporting to speak of because as far as I know, no one seems interested in even talking about this subject like civilized people and addressing it like civilized people.
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Grimpak
Shifting Sands Trader Cartel Bleak Horizon Alliance.
2431
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Posted - 2014.10.22 04:52:10 -
[153] - Quote
Souxie Alduin wrote:Grimpak wrote:Souxie Alduin wrote:A quick question for the Gamergate supporters: If this is all about ethics in journalism, why are you going after female developers and critics, and not the journalists?
The only logical answer I can come up with is that you really just don't want women talking about games. a question from the third side: will this argument will finally stop or will you people will build hate upon hate on each other for an eternity? seeing people screaming "MISOGYNY!" at people screaming "MISANDRY!" and vice-versa for the last 2+ months is akin to beating a dead horse. also, it stopped being funny long ago. It was never funny in the first place. "I'm coming to your house to **** you with a K-bar" is not funny. Also, from your argument you seem to think that misogyny and misandry are equal. They're not. There is a LOT more misogyny in gaming (and everywhere else) than misandry. Being threatened for pointing that out is not cool (see: Saarkesian). And finally, if by "third side" you mean "people who don't care", why are you here commenting?
it was funny at the beginning, seeing people from both sides running like headless chickens trying to make a "holier than thou" argument. it stopped being funny when people started to spew death threats, that is true.
also, it doesn't matter who has more than the other or who is more than the other. In this case, it's like people trying to show off who's being more bullied. The discussion has stopped being relevant long ago since all there's now is bile in each word being said, with both sides screaming death and murder to any voice of reason that tries to break out this cycle.
and while the "third side" doesn't care that much, they can still have opinions in the matter.
[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote]
ain't that right
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Malaclypse Muscaria
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
167
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Posted - 2014.10.23 14:46:37 -
[154] - Quote
So what would it be like if you had a feminist analyze "sexism and misogyny" in videgame culture, as Anita Sarkeesian tried, but observing the following points:
- Having a PhD instead of some random humanities degree
- Properly citing peer-reviewed academic studies to support your points
- Properly handling "facts" and their subtleties, instead of distorting, cherry-picking, or simply making sh*t up to support your pre-conceived narrative
- Properly use reason and perspective to construct your points, instead of cheaply appealing to emotion and basing your entire narrative around victimizing women (and yourself)
- Not swindling your supporters out of $160.000 to make your video
Well, here it is, the video that should put this whole Anita Sarkeesian / "Gamers are dead" nonsensical scam to rest: "Are videogames sexist?", by Christina Sommers. |
Ria Nieyli
21913
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Posted - 2014.10.23 15:22:52 -
[155] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:I might be inclined to care more if I had ever, at any point, in my life gave a crud about game reviews. This girl behaved badly. That alone I can empathize with. Turning it into a massive spectacle for attention, I can not. Men are pretty much ruled by their schlongs. At least indirectly . Louis C.K said once that humans **** up and across. They never **** down. Unless they are lid to and somehow get convinced they are ******* up.
Damn that's nasty.
Mirrored eyes
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Souxie Alduin
Anarchy in the Eve
140
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Posted - 2014.10.23 19:20:00 -
[156] - Quote
Chris Kluwe has harsh words for Gamergaters (And yes, I agree completely with what he says, minus some of the hyperbole):
https://medium.com/the-cauldron/why-gamergaters-****-me-the-f-off-a7e4c7f6d8a6 Edit: replace **** with p i s s, or the link won't work.
Felicia Day was doxxed literally minutes after talking about gamergate for the first time:
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/oct/23/felicia-days-public-details-online-gamergate
Still haven't seen any examples of bad professional ethics. A list of websites doesn't count unless you can point to specific things they said that were wrong/bad. The only thing those websites have in common is being critical of gamergate, and you all react by trying to boycott them and get advertisers to pull out. You're trying to censor opinions you don't like.
And finally - I've been gaming for 34 years. For the first time in my life I'm truly ashamed to call myself a gamer, and that's because of gamergate. You're dragging us all through the mud and destroying the small amount of goodwill and mainstream acceptance we were finally getting. You seriously need to change your M.O. |
Ria Nieyli
21915
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Posted - 2014.10.23 19:58:46 -
[157] - Quote
Souxie Alduin wrote:Chris Kluwe has harsh words for Gamergaters (And yes, I agree completely with what he says, minus some of the hyperbole): https://medium.com/the-cauldron/why-gamergaters-****-me-the-f-off-a7e4c7f6d8a6 Edit: replace **** with p i s s, or the link won't work.
Felicia Day was doxxed literally minutes after talking about gamergate for the first time: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/oct/23/felicia-days-public-details-online-gamergate Still haven't seen any examples of bad professional ethics. A list of websites doesn't count unless you can point to specific things they said that were wrong/bad. The only thing those websites have in common is being critical of gamergate, and you all react by trying to boycott them and get advertisers to pull out. You're trying to censor opinions you don't like. And finally - I've been gaming for 34 years. For the first time in my life I'm truly ashamed to call myself a gamer, and that's because of gamergate. You're dragging us all through the mud and destroying the small amount of goodwill and mainstream acceptance we were finally getting. You seriously need to change your M.O. Extra Edit: No one doxxed Chris Kluwe after his hit-piece. Felicia Day was doxxed simply for mentioning gamergate. I suspect a trend...
So I don't actually follow gamergate, but reading Kluwe's article did manage to catch me up pretty quick. I have to say, my local gaming circles were pretty tame, so I wasn't really exposed to a lot of what he's talking about. Once I had dwelled in a few online gaming communities for a while, the unfortunate reality of what Kluwe is conveying became readily apparent. Gaming has come a long way in the past ten years, but it certainly does not feel that way.
As for not doxxing him: He's a 193cm 98kg duder. They don't have the balls to show up at his door.
Mirrored eyes
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Grimpak
Shifting Sands Trader Cartel Bleak Horizon Alliance.
2431
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Posted - 2014.10.23 21:26:47 -
[158] - Quote
Souxie Alduin wrote:And finally - I've been gaming for 34 years. For the first time in my life I'm truly ashamed to call myself a gamer, and that's because of gamergate. You're dragging us all through the mud and destroying the small amount of goodwill and mainstream acceptance we were finally getting. You seriously need to change your M.O.
I'm not, because I don't even identify myself with either side. I'm a gamer. I play games, and I couldn't care less about some internet discussion about who has a ****, who hasn't, and who's better off with/without one.
why am I posting tho? well, I also like to state my opinion.
[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote]
ain't that right
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Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7110
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Posted - 2014.10.23 21:31:36 -
[159] - Quote
As he seems utterly incapable of delivering a statement without the hyperbole or insults, his words becomes less and less valid as he goes on. This statement of his will largely fall on deaf ears because he *chooses* to attack people rather than to address them like fellow human beings.
How is this any worse from any other famous person having their info leaked online, it being a actor, singer or whatever? Because she speaks up against gamergate?
But speaking of crazies, people critical of gamergate threatens gamersgate.com (https://imgur.com/Cn9UT9i) and proves once more that people just as batsh*t crazy on your side.
Souxie Alduin wrote: Still haven't seen any examples of bad professional ethics. A list of websites doesn't count unless you can point to specific things they said that were wrong/bad. The only thing those websites have in common is being critical of gamergate, and you all react by trying to boycott them and get advertisers to pull out. You're trying to censor opinions you don't like.
See this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEMdf8D0lfw
I am actually quite surprised that you haven't done much research yourself on why gamergate exist, all you seem to think of gamergate is that it is nothing but misogyny.
Souxie Alduin wrote: And finally - I've been gaming for 34 years. For the first time in my life I'm truly ashamed to call myself a gamer, and that's because of gamergate. You're dragging us all through the mud and destroying the small amount of goodwill and mainstream acceptance we were finally getting. You seriously need to change your M.O.
I don't feel ashamed for being a gamer or calling myself a gamer for playing games and enjoying them at the same time. And nor should you.
Repeat after me: "I am a gamer. I demand transparency in the gaming press. I want the industry to hire people with the right skill set, regardless of their gender, skin color or beliefs. I do not agree with nor will I support misogyny, bigotry and racism."
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Souxie Alduin
Anarchy in the Eve
140
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Posted - 2014.10.24 17:52:16 -
[160] - Quote
I'm just going to copy-paste a comment from Ars Technica which pretty much sums it up:
I oppose GamerGate because it started with a misogynist lie (the Zoe Quinn conspiracy theory), because professionals with a private list-serve is NOT corruption, because games reviewers choosing to discuss social themes of a game as well as its gameplay is NOT corruption, because being a feminist is NOT corruption, because publishing a story about how video games are so popular now that the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of pasty social outcasts is outdated and dead is NOT corruption, and most of all, because I'm sick of how everyone who both is targeted by GG as "corrupt" and simultaneously is female gets **** and death threats mixed in with their run-of-the-mill GG hatemail (or hate tweets, as it were). |
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Anslo
Scope Works
19605
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Posted - 2014.10.24 17:56:55 -
[161] - Quote
Bad Nerds gonna Bad vOv
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Souxie Alduin
Anarchy in the Eve
140
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Posted - 2014.10.24 18:02:09 -
[162] - Quote
And one more thing - Let's not forget that Vivian James is a r a p e joke. Not posting a link (very NSFW), google it. |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7132
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Posted - 2014.10.24 18:25:49 -
[163] - Quote
Souxie Alduin wrote:I'm just going to copy-paste a comment from Ars Technica which pretty much sums it up:
I oppose GamerGate because it started with a misogynist lie (the Zoe Quinn conspiracy theory), because professionals with a private list-serve is NOT corruption, because games reviewers choosing to discuss social themes of a game as well as its gameplay is NOT corruption, because being a feminist is NOT corruption, because publishing a story about how video games are so popular now that the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of pasty social outcasts is outdated and dead is NOT corruption, and most of all, because I'm sick of how everyone who both is targeted by GG as "corrupt" and simultaneously is female gets **** and death threats mixed in with their run-of-the-mill GG hatemail (or hate tweets, as it were).
Yet, when individuals who is critical of Gamergate doxxes and threatens someone (there are women too) who is pro-Gamergate, it is just dandy? Why doesn't media report on that?
The cognitive dissonance is mind-boggling.
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Anslo
Scope Works
19613
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Posted - 2014.10.24 18:54:42 -
[164] - Quote
Sorry but what does it mean to be pro-gamergate and anti-gamergate? I don't think I'm getting the context correctly here.
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7135
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Posted - 2014.10.24 19:44:05 -
[165] - Quote
Anslo wrote:Sorry but what does it mean to be pro-gamergate and anti-gamergate? I don't think I'm getting the context correctly here.
That depends who you ask really, because everyone has their own opinion on what Gamergate is.
One might say that pro-Gamergate are people who are okay with women in the tech/games industry being doxxed (having private info leaked). being threatened with **** and murder to silence her.
Another one would be that pro-Gamergate is about consumer advocacy, calling an end to the corruption (the rosy relationship between games journalists and game developers). That games websites like Kotaku is rapidly becoming a thing of the past in the age of youtube personalities like TotalBiscuit, which they are fully aware of and they have chosen to fight back. Using whatever methods that are available to them.
As someone that has remained as an quiet observer to this debacle since it started, I have looked at both sides and all I can say is that there are more rabid people on a soapbox with a twisted agenda, that picks apart everything that is being said, than there are sane people.
Like in all wars, there are no winners here.
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Anslo
Scope Works
19619
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Posted - 2014.10.24 19:52:19 -
[166] - Quote
So basically my thinking was right and this is now turning into a blob of No you, no you, grrr topic here by people with an agenda, versus any actual debate of substance. Welp.
Thanks for the info!
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Grimpak
Shifting Sands Trader Cartel Bleak Horizon Alliance.
2432
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Posted - 2014.10.24 20:03:07 -
[167] - Quote
Anslo wrote:So basically my thinking was right and this is now turning into a blob of No you, no you, grrr topic here by people with an agenda, versus any actual debate of substance. Welp.
Thanks for the info! remember those aliens from sesame street? those that went "YIP YIP YIP!" and "NOP NOP NOP!"?
yeah, add a "GRR TRAITOR TO THE CAUSE!" when someone decides to go rational.
[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote]
ain't that right
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Anslo
Scope Works
19621
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Posted - 2014.10.24 20:05:54 -
[168] - Quote
Figured as much. Kinda sad.
[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
10239
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Posted - 2014.10.25 01:17:01 -
[169] - Quote
Alpheias wrote: Like in all wars, there are no winners here.
Tell that to Kotaku and Gamasutra. They've each lost a quarter or more of their advertising revenue since they chose the wrong side.
When Intel themselves tells you to **** off, you've done screwed the pooch.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7147
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Posted - 2014.10.25 01:52:35 -
[170] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Alpheias wrote: Like in all wars, there are no winners here.
Tell that to Kotaku and Gamasutra. They've each lost a quarter or more of their advertising revenue since they chose the wrong side. When Intel themselves tells you to **** off, you've done screwed the pooch.
Wrong side? There is no right or wrong side in what has become a pathetic drama that Grimpak nicely summarized.
I vehemently disagree with you and I condemn actions that affects people's livelihood because it is harassment, plain and simple. It is no different from doxxing someone for speaking out in support of one thing or another and subsequently threatening the person with all kinds of nasty things, in order to silence them.
Have you no shame?
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
10245
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Posted - 2014.10.25 13:01:47 -
[171] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Alpheias wrote: Like in all wars, there are no winners here.
Tell that to Kotaku and Gamasutra. They've each lost a quarter or more of their advertising revenue since they chose the wrong side. When Intel themselves tells you to **** off, you've done screwed the pooch. Wrong side? There is no right or wrong side in what has become a pathetic drama that Grimpak nicely summarized. I vehemently disagree with you and I condemn actions that affects people's livelihood because it is harassment, plain and simple. It is no different from doxxing someone for speaking out in support of one thing or another and subsequently threatening the person with all kinds of nasty things, in order to silence them. Have you no shame?
I strongly disagree with the "affects people's livelihood" part.
If they suck at their job, or if they manage to **** off the core constituency of their magazine, or blatantly denounce their largest advertising partner, that's a pretty fair reason for someone to lose their job. (since that's the guy I'm talking about, by the way, the one who managed to **** off Intel until they pulled their ads from his site. And since you're so concerned about "doxxing" someone who writes with their real name, I shan't say it here either)
People are allowed to fail, you realize. Moreso if they set out to make people mad at them. Turns out? You got what you were looking for, just not how you thought it would go.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Malaclypse Muscaria
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
167
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Posted - 2014.10.25 15:32:20 -
[172] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:See this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEMdf8D0lfw I am actually quite surprised that you haven't done much research yourself on why gamergate exist, all you seem to think of gamergate is that it is nothing but misogyny.
I remember that incident with Geoff Keighley (as well as his spat with Angry Joe), those dead eyes as he sits between the Doritos and Mountain Dew are unforgettable. That whole episode was painful to watch:
"Before you go, do you have any advice for an aspiring games journalist?"
"Yeah! ... I mean, my advice is the same I tell everyone. It's, ah... you know, you buy Mountain Dew, you buy Doritos, you get a code... you go to dew-xp.com, enter that code, link it to your gamer tag, and then you're gonna get some experience in the gaming news"
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Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7161
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Posted - 2014.10.25 19:35:07 -
[173] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I strongly disagree with the "affects people's livelihood" part.
If they suck at their job, or if they manage to **** off the core constituency of their magazine, or blatantly denounce their largest advertising partner, that's a pretty fair reason for someone to lose their job. (since that's the guy I'm talking about, by the way, the one who managed to **** off Intel until they pulled their ads from his site. And since you're so concerned about "doxxing" someone who writes with their real name, I shan't say it here either)
People are allowed to fail, you realize. Moreso if they set out to make people mad at them. Turns out? You got what you were looking for, just not how you thought it would go.
I must thank you for confirming what I have suspected since this all started. Both sides ran out of arguments a long time ago and the only means left to get to each other is now to attempt making people lose their jobs regardless if they screw up or not (news flash: people screw up all the time).
Sounds incredibly petty and childish to me.
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
10256
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Posted - 2014.10.25 20:45:39 -
[174] - Quote
Alpheias wrote: Sounds incredibly petty and childish to me.
Well, you said it. I for one have no clue what you're talking about, since it seems to me that you're just pulling things out of thin air.
To me, this is confronting about fraud and abuse, and people who would defend it. All should face consequences for their actions. Some already have. That's fine with me, and then some.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7162
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Posted - 2014.10.25 21:51:16 -
[175] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Alpheias wrote: Sounds incredibly petty and childish to me.
Well, you said it. I for one have no clue what you're talking about, since it seems to me that you're just pulling things out of thin air.
What the actual ****? You are the one that said and I quote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Like in all wars, there are no winners here.
Tell that to Kotaku and Gamasutra. They've each lost a quarter or more of their advertising revenue since they chose the wrong side.
When Intel themselves tells you to **** off, you've done screwed the pooch. [/quote]
I don't think I am taking things out of thin air, you colossal ******* idiot.
Kaarous Aldurald wrote: To me, this is confronting about fraud and abuse, and people who would defend it. All should face consequences for their actions. Some already have. That's fine with me, and then some.
It is all an eye for an eye with you isn't it?
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Souxie Alduin
Anarchy in the Eve
141
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Posted - 2014.10.28 00:16:40 -
[176] - Quote
74,140 reasons that #GamerGate isn't about the ethics of journalism
http://www.vox.com/xpress/2014/10/27/7070983/why-gamergate-isnt-about-the-ethics-of-journalism-in-35188-tweets |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7246
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Posted - 2014.10.28 05:28:15 -
[177] - Quote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RVlCvBd21w
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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Souxie Alduin
Anarchy in the Eve
141
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Posted - 2014.11.02 17:33:18 -
[178] - Quote
I'll see your American Enterprise Institute and raise you one Boingboing.net:
http://boingboing.net/2014/10/20/vultures-circle-gamergate.html |
Khergit Deserters
Crom's Angels
3624
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Posted - 2014.11.02 23:58:25 -
[179] - Quote
[Didn't read the posts in this thread, but] Power to you GamerGate movement. Get out, little arsewipe male gaming bullies! You are not wanted here!
Why would these guys want to be mean to the few women in our tribe? If they can't get along with the creative and imaginative women in our circle, they out to get out their energies to the clubs, gyms, Starbucks, whatever. They might come back with a new appreciation of gamer/goth/cosplay/manga/anime/whatever chicks a hell of a lot more. But of course those cool women still will not need those losers.
Sucks to be a mean loser.
"Were [sic] not your monkey and so what?"-á -The Sex Pistols (2006)
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Alpheias
Euphoria Released Triumvirate.
7332
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Posted - 2014.11.03 03:34:24 -
[180] - Quote
You ask me to take a blogger seriously? Might as well take Kotaku serious next.
Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on.
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