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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 7 post(s) |
zar dada
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
30
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Posted - 2014.10.16 17:37:27 -
[61] - Quote
comment withdrawn |
zar dada
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
30
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Posted - 2014.10.16 17:40:45 -
[62] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:So a final post, as this topic has been talked about in a few threads (one nice threadnaught) before: ....
- For those concerns for "no second monitor" or "playing fullscreen" please see overlays.
....
Overwolf overlays has never worked for me an my 3 yr old graphics card.
WTB programmer to write a better overlay?
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
4072
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Posted - 2014.10.16 18:16:02 -
[63] - Quote
A tip for people who don't know:
Fixed window mode is like the child of full screen, and windowed. In may ways, the best of both.
You get a window, with no borders, which takes up your entire screen. You can alt-tab freely, without the window minimizing, so if you have a browser window, you can have it at less than full screen, just floating on top of the eve window.
(I use it with my three eve clients, running on three different screens. So I can see them all at the same time, looking like they're full screen, but able to freely move my mouse between them.)
Woo! CSM 9!
http://fuzzwork.enterprises/
Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
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Lugh Crow-Slave
178
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Posted - 2014.10.16 19:18:35 -
[64] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:The IGB is not getting updated, once CREST is up to par the IGB will be removed.
Don't do to the IGB what you did to the juke box please |
Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
5034
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Posted - 2014.10.16 19:45:54 -
[65] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:The IGB is not getting updated, once CREST is up to par the IGB will be removed. Yaaaaay for alt tabing!
Recon makes them stronger
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zar dada
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
30
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Posted - 2014.10.16 19:59:03 -
[66] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:A tip for people who don't know:
Fixed window mode is like the child of full screen, and windowed. In may ways, the best of both.
You get a window, with no borders, which takes up your entire screen. You can alt-tab freely, without the window minimizing, so if you have a browser window, you can have it at less than full screen, just floating on top of the eve window.
(I use it with my three eve clients, running on three different screens. So I can see them all at the same time, looking like they're full screen, but able to freely move my mouse between them.)
Thanks I wasn't aware of the fixed window setting. I'll give it a try.
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Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
1133
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Posted - 2014.10.16 20:38:10 -
[67] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Fixed window mode is like the child of full screen, and windowed. In many ways, the best of both.
You get a window, with no borders, which takes up your entire screen. You can alt-tab freely, without the window minimizing, so if you have a browser window, you can have it at less than full screen, just floating on top of the eve window.
It does, in some configurations, have a drawback.
I also use up to three clients, with three monitors, but on three computers and using Input Director to share mouse/keyboard between them. (When it works, it's no difference from one seriously funky computer with three monitors).
But it sometimes shows the difference between fixed window and full screen.
- Full screen has no delay when switching between screens/computer, but a serious delay if you alt-tab. - Fixed window has no delay when alt-tab, but serious delay when switching between computers (most likely due to host computer trying to figure out what window is on top and where the mouse is supposed to be active).
But for alt-tab, fixed window is king.
CCP Greyscale: As to starbases, we agree it's pretty terrible, but we don't want to delay the entire release just for this one factor.
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Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
4347
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Posted - 2014.10.17 08:09:26 -
[68] - Quote
Am I the only one here that just uses normal windowed mode? I don't mind having a title bar and a taskbar, in fact the latter is useful for switching between programs.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.
Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
92
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Posted - 2014.10.17 08:21:24 -
[69] - Quote
window mode cause I run 2-3 clients most of the time and my 2 other screens are for more important things than eve. Its rare i find the need for eve to be full screen and in the smallest window you can fit most of the important stuff of eve on one screen. |
MsArj
The Scope Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2014.10.17 08:51:19 -
[70] - Quote
+1 for updating the ingame browser, WH mapping is NEEDED.
(and the spreadsheets from googledocs:P) |
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zar dada
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
30
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Posted - 2014.10.17 11:37:49 -
[71] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:So a final post, as this topic has been talked about in a few threads (one nice threadnaught) before:
- The IGB is not being removed anytime soon
- It's also not getting any love
- When we do remove it there will be a nice long conversation at that time
- Browsers are a very complicated thing, they receive a lot of updates and change very fast, they are also a GIANT security threat to your machine.
- There are plenty of options for once we remove the IGB still getting a browser in your client, such as the linked Overwolf overlay. Since those things just use your browser, there is no delay for getting updates.
- We could spend our time keeping the IGB, but when things such as Overwolf and other overlays exist, our time is better spent on the spaceship game.
- We wont remove the IGB until CREST can take over the gameplay functionality.
- For those concerns for "no second monitor" or "playing fullscreen" please see overlays.
This will all come up again when we actually go to remove the IGB, so until then, fly safe guys.
For sites that require IGB to function such as
http://evemaps.dotlan.net/map/radar https://eveeye.com/
And wormhole sites, like siggy or tripwire, will CREST allow these sites to work? How will CREST report your information to an external browser? Similar to how Trusting this website works in IGB.
Also FIXED WINDOW is awesome thanks CSM Steve Ronuken
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
4072
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Posted - 2014.10.17 15:36:01 -
[72] - Quote
You go to a website
You authenticate, and while doing so, approve its request to access your position information by crest.
Every so often, the server polls the TQ to find out where you are. (you can have your browser closed by this time, as it requires no further interaction. Though it could also be triggered from the client side as a refresh or similar.)
If you want something under your control, then there could be a client side application (possibly built into something like Evemon, or something else) which you can get to update a number of websites with your current position, while it's running.
I can see benefits of both (no software needed for the first, precise control for the second with less load at server level. And easier for multiple characters)
Heh. It's the kind of thing that I might write (with limited interaction options, it's not a bad idea for a first application)
Woo! CSM 9!
http://fuzzwork.enterprises/
Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
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Wolf Incaelum
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
36
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Posted - 2014.10.17 18:00:27 -
[73] - Quote
Edit: Reply removed.
The deer can get it right. What's YOUR problem?
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Mharius Skjem
Republic University Minmatar Republic
21
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Posted - 2014.10.17 19:11:12 -
[74] - Quote
Psyrelle wrote:Just had some not so fun experiences with the ingame browser causing it to crash whenever trying to use google docs.
Back and forth talk with GM's Gave me the info that the browser is not getting updated unless more people has an interest in it.
Therefore my idea is to get as many people on here interested in getting our awesome browser updated.
Here is some stuff I would love to work in the ingame browser.
Flash Java Google Docs (yay for accessing ones spreadsheets ingame instead of having to alt tab back and forth.
Anything else any of you guys would love to get implemented into the ingame browser? Any of you want the browser to stay updated?
Just my thoughts. Psyrelle.
We lost the jukebox the same way so don't pin your heart on it.
A recovering btter vet, -áwith a fresh toon and a determination to like everything that CCP does to Eve...
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Daimian Mercer
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
70
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Posted - 2014.10.17 20:53:51 -
[75] - Quote
CCP FoxFour is correct about wh-mappers still being able to function.
CREST can provide the exact same back-end functionality wh-mappers need/use. CCP FoxFour has been doing an awesome job with the API and CREST and I have full confidence in his ability to help the wh-mappers adapt for when the IGB is gone.
When I heard then IGB was getting removed I was jumping for joy. Trying to make any web app work in multiple browsers is hard enough with just the big 3 (Chrome, FF & IE), even if the IGB was updated it wouldn't take long for it to get behind again.
Just R-E-L-A-X .. CREST & Overwolf will be a great solution to the IGB. (or some other overlay system)
Creator of Tripwire mapping tool -
EVE-O thread
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Sal Landry
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
254
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Posted - 2014.10.17 21:44:56 -
[76] - Quote
Daimian Mercer wrote:CCP FoxFour is correct about wh-mappers still being able to function.
CREST can provide the exact same back-end functionality wh-mappers need/use. CCP FoxFour has been doing an awesome job with the API and CREST and I have full confidence in his ability to help the wh-mappers adapt for when the IGB is gone.
When I heard then IGB was getting removed I was jumping for joy. Trying to make any web app work in multiple browsers is hard enough with just the big 3 (Chrome, FF & IE), even if the IGB was updated it wouldn't take long for it to get behind again.
Just R-E-L-A-X .. CREST & Overwolf will be a great solution to the IGB. (or some other overlay system) Well thank God its use cases will be preserved for literally the 1% of Eve that lives in wormholes
You've got yours, **** everyone else |
Daimian Mercer
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
70
|
Posted - 2014.10.17 21:53:41 -
[77] - Quote
Sal Landry wrote:Well thank God its use cases will be preserved for literally the 1% of Eve that lives in wormholes You've got yours, **** everyone else
Last time I saw the yearly EVE analytics wormholes made up well over 10% of EVE population, just saying.
I couldn't speak for the other web apps out there obviously - but I have no doubt everything they use will be available in CREST. I have done the research and CCP probing regarding my tool's needs, maybe one of the creators of your favorite tools that your so worried about could chime in?
EVE is such a friendly place isn't it
Creator of Tripwire mapping tool -
EVE-O thread
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Lugh Crow-Slave
178
|
Posted - 2014.10.18 03:21:26 -
[78] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:You go to a website
You authenticate, and while doing so, approve its request to access your position information by crest.
Every so often, the server polls the TQ to find out where you are. (you can have your browser closed by this time, as it requires no further interaction. Though it could also be triggered from the client side as a refresh or similar.)
If you want something under your control, then there could be a client side application (possibly built into something like Evemon, or something else) which you can get to update a number of websites with your current position, while it's running.
I can see benefits of both (no software needed for the first, precise control for the second with less load at server level. And easier for multiple characters)
Heh. It's the kind of thing that I might write (with limited interaction options, it's not a bad idea for a first application)
or we can do this all from in game so i don't need to have as many applications open....
removing features that aren't detrimental is not a good idea |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
4072
|
Posted - 2014.10.18 09:50:04 -
[79] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:You go to a website
You authenticate, and while doing so, approve its request to access your position information by crest.
Every so often, the server polls the TQ to find out where you are. (you can have your browser closed by this time, as it requires no further interaction. Though it could also be triggered from the client side as a refresh or similar.)
If you want something under your control, then there could be a client side application (possibly built into something like Evemon, or something else) which you can get to update a number of websites with your current position, while it's running.
I can see benefits of both (no software needed for the first, precise control for the second with less load at server level. And easier for multiple characters)
Heh. It's the kind of thing that I might write (with limited interaction options, it's not a bad idea for a first application) or we can do this all from in game so i don't need to have as many applications open.... removing features that aren't detrimental is not a good idea
The problem is, it /can/ be detrimental. Keeping a browser updated isn't a simple job. They need to wait for an upstream vendor to update their code, then fold their own changes into it, making sure it doesn't open up any security holes.
Sure, you and I aren't foolish enough to do general browsing in the IGB, but I'm unwilling to extend that to everyone (I do IT support work. 'What do you mean, I haven't had a rich relative die in nigeria?')
Woo! CSM 9!
http://fuzzwork.enterprises/
Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
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Manssell
OmiHyperMultiNationalDrunksConglomerate Together We Solo
223
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 14:23:21 -
[80] - Quote
Amarisen Gream wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:So a final post, as this topic has been talked about in a few threads (one nice threadnaught) before:
- The IGB is not being removed anytime soon
- It's also not getting any love
- When we do remove it there will be a nice long conversation at that time
- Browsers are a very complicated thing, they receive a lot of updates and change very fast, they are also a GIANT security threat to your machine.
- There are plenty of options for once we remove the IGB still getting a browser in your client, such as the linked Overwolf overlay. Since those things just use your browser, there is no delay for getting updates.
- We could spend our time keeping the IGB, but when things such as Overwolf and other overlays exist, our time is better spent on the spaceship game.
- We wont remove the IGB until CREST can take over the gameplay functionality.
- For those concerns for "no second monitor" or "playing fullscreen" please see overlays.
This will all come up again when we actually go to remove the IGB, so until then, fly safe guys. Sounds great. Just a question? Is there an overlay that works on Mac OS X?
Nope. Just like there has never been a TS3 overlay for mac either. CCP will just point to "Overwolf and other overlays" that are PC only as proof all is cool and wash their hands of it while ignoring that once again mac users will loose functionality with the change. Then add what I'm sure will be a bit of PC master race d-baggery thrown at us on forums if we complain for good measure. |
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Swiftstrike1
Swiftstrike Incorporated
794
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 16:38:37 -
[81] - Quote
Dear CCP... the argument in favour of removing the IGB seems to be:
"why should we waste development time on our own browser when 3rd party solutions exist?"
There are 3rd party games as well. Should we play those instead of EVE? Then you wouldn't have to waste your development time on spaceships either. IF PLAYERS LIKE THE IGB, DEVS SHOULD NOT BE ACTIVELY MAKING PLANS TO REMOVE IT.
The crux of the issue as I see it is that you can interact with the IGB, and then interact with something else in the client without the IGB being covered up or disappearing. With an OGB on the other hand... as soon as I click on my overview, the client will come to the front and cover up my OGB. While OGBs have more functionality, they are missing what I consider to be the most vital functionality - integration with the EVE client.
Then there's the fact that CCP will be unable to troubleshoot compatibility issues with 3rd party software that they don't own, but expect players to use anyway. To give you an example: Overwolf doesn't work at the same time as MSI Afterburner. It just refuses to play ball.
Removing the IGB seems like a really bad idea, but then again we don't know what the alternative will look like. I look forward to a dev blog on the subject.
Targeting, Sensors and ECM Overhaul
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Alundil
Isogen 5
726
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 16:50:55 -
[82] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Am I the only one here that just uses normal windowed mode? I don't mind having a title bar and a taskbar, in fact the latter is useful for switching between programs. I do the same. 3 clients - 1 Monitor
I'm right behind you
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Alundil
Isogen 5
726
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Posted - 2014.10.22 16:54:13 -
[83] - Quote
Manssell wrote:Amarisen Gream wrote:
Is there an overlay that works on Mac OS X?
Nope. Just like there has never been a TS3 overlay for mac either. CCP will just point to "Overwolf and other overlays" that are PC only as proof all is cool and wash their hands of it while ignoring that once again mac users will loose functionality with the change. Then add what I'm sure will be a bit of PC master race d-baggery thrown at us on forums if we complain for good measure. Well, tbh, you do have it coming....
(couldn't resist)
I'm right behind you
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Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1335
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 17:00:13 -
[84] - Quote
Manssell wrote:Amarisen Gream wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:So a final post, as this topic has been talked about in a few threads (one nice threadnaught) before:
- The IGB is not being removed anytime soon
- It's also not getting any love
- When we do remove it there will be a nice long conversation at that time
- Browsers are a very complicated thing, they receive a lot of updates and change very fast, they are also a GIANT security threat to your machine.
- There are plenty of options for once we remove the IGB still getting a browser in your client, such as the linked Overwolf overlay. Since those things just use your browser, there is no delay for getting updates.
- We could spend our time keeping the IGB, but when things such as Overwolf and other overlays exist, our time is better spent on the spaceship game.
- We wont remove the IGB until CREST can take over the gameplay functionality.
- For those concerns for "no second monitor" or "playing fullscreen" please see overlays.
This will all come up again when we actually go to remove the IGB, so until then, fly safe guys. Sounds great. Just a question? Is there an overlay that works on Mac OS X? Nope. Just like there has never been a TS3 overlay for mac either. CCP will just point to "Overwolf and other overlays" that are PC only as proof all is cool and wash their hands of it while ignoring that once again mac users will loose functionality with the change. Then add what I'm sure will be a bit of PC master race d-baggery thrown at us on forums if we complain for good measure.
It's not CCP's fault if nobody did the legwork of building an overlay system for MACs like it was done for PCs... It's not a matter of PC-master race but a matter of the userbase of your chosen operating system didn't do the work other userbase decided to do. |
BadAssMcKill
ElitistOps
902
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 17:19:31 -
[85] - Quote
Overwolf is kinda terrible
Also I know I'm not the only one who has a potato computer that can't really run a browser and multiple clients without everything slowing down |
Riebee Shelan
7-MICRON The Kingdom of Heaven
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 17:36:04 -
[86] - Quote
I understand the desire to get away from the IGB, but the only overlay you have listed (Overwolf) does not support all features of EVE.
As stated on the Overwolf website:
Eve Online
Overwolf doesn't support this game when rendered in DirectX 11. Game can be set to DirectX 9 through the game launcher settings -> DirectX tab -> change to 'DirectX 9'.
And as previously stated not all users can support having a multitude of things running at once either. I personally have used one and two monitors for the game and understand both sides of this coin. The biggest problem with not having the IGB is the lack of awareness of what is happening in game when outside of the game environment (ie: another browser). I can support the removal of the IGB only if there is an alternative such as Overwolf that works with all features of EVE and on all supported systems such as windows, Mac, etc...
Just my two cents. |
Manssell
OmiHyperMultiNationalDrunksConglomerate Together We Solo
223
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 17:42:45 -
[87] - Quote
Alundil wrote:Manssell wrote:Amarisen Gream wrote:
Is there an overlay that works on Mac OS X?
Nope. Just like there has never been a TS3 overlay for mac either. CCP will just point to "Overwolf and other overlays" that are PC only as proof all is cool and wash their hands of it while ignoring that once again mac users will loose functionality with the change. Then add what I'm sure will be a bit of PC master race d-baggery thrown at us on forums if we complain for good measure. Well, tbh, you do have it coming.... (couldn't resist)
Thanks for the out loud laugh, I had a small browser window open and when I scrolled down on your comment it read as two thoughts and became "couldn't resist, I'm right behind you" |
Manssell
OmiHyperMultiNationalDrunksConglomerate Together We Solo
223
|
Posted - 2014.10.22 17:47:52 -
[88] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Manssell wrote:Amarisen Gream wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:So a final post, as this topic has been talked about in a few threads (one nice threadnaught) before:
- The IGB is not being removed anytime soon
- It's also not getting any love
- When we do remove it there will be a nice long conversation at that time
- Browsers are a very complicated thing, they receive a lot of updates and change very fast, they are also a GIANT security threat to your machine.
- There are plenty of options for once we remove the IGB still getting a browser in your client, such as the linked Overwolf overlay. Since those things just use your browser, there is no delay for getting updates.
- We could spend our time keeping the IGB, but when things such as Overwolf and other overlays exist, our time is better spent on the spaceship game.
- We wont remove the IGB until CREST can take over the gameplay functionality.
- For those concerns for "no second monitor" or "playing fullscreen" please see overlays.
This will all come up again when we actually go to remove the IGB, so until then, fly safe guys. Sounds great. Just a question? Is there an overlay that works on Mac OS X? Nope. Just like there has never been a TS3 overlay for mac either. CCP will just point to "Overwolf and other overlays" that are PC only as proof all is cool and wash their hands of it while ignoring that once again mac users will loose functionality with the change. Then add what I'm sure will be a bit of PC master race d-baggery thrown at us on forums if we complain for good measure. It's not CCP's fault if nobody did the legwork of building an overlay system for MACs like it was done for PCs... It's not a matter of PC-master race but a matter of the userbase of your chosen operating system didn't do the work other userbase decided to do.
No I get it, and I'm not blaming CCP either. I understand why they would want to stop development on the browser. I'm just a bit annoyed at the attitude CCP is showing that the problem is already solved/will soon will be (or even ever) for a large chunk of their player base who are on macs. |
Jack Tronic
borkedLabs
215
|
Posted - 2014.10.23 02:50:29 -
[89] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:The IGB is not getting updated, once CREST is up to par the IGB will be removed.
I hope CREST can handle many requests a second from a single source :D And when that fails I am more than happy to offload that to multiple IPs :D
Here's just one server's load that uses IGB data: http://i.imgur.com/6ovj7KX.png (requests/sec) http://i.imgur.com/8c7dWs0.png (connections)
Each request/second would require an request/second match to CREST, same for # of connections that would have to be maintained.
In other news, is anyone interested in a dropin replacement for EVE's IGB backend? It's it's not that hard to replace/replicate an API. I do it all the time for proprietary software. |
Necharo Rackham
The Red Circle Inc. Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
44
|
Posted - 2014.10.23 21:10:54 -
[90] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:You go to a website
You authenticate, and while doing so, approve its request to access your position information by crest.
.. okay, so how will it handle tracking multiple characters simultaneously (i.e the browser being logged in as multiple characters simultaneously) |
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