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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.11.06 15:13:42 -
[1] - Quote
I'd like to know your opinions about finding viable equilibrium between DPS and falloff range in case of Machariel. I read Machariel was nerfed both directly (pirate BS rebalance) and indirectly (Tracking Enhancer nerf) lately so now I am not sure what damage at what range this battleship should deal to be efficient Level 4 mission runner. Any hints? |
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
826
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Posted - 2014.11.06 15:26:57 -
[2] - Quote
The Machariel I used to run for highsec missions a long time ago now has an optimal + falloff of 3.8 + 61. So that would mean at optimal + 50% falloff it does 80% of its DPS or 864 DPS @ 34.3 km.
[Machariel, Missions] Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II
EM Ward Field II Thermic Dissipation Field II Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script Gist C-Type Large Shield Booster 100MN Microwarpdrive II
800mm Repeating Cannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Cannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Cannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Cannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Cannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Cannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Cannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L Drone Link Augmentor II
Large Projectile Ambit Extension II Large Projectile Ambit Extension II Large Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
It's been a long time so I may be incorrect but that is what I remember.
Not today spaghetti.
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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.11.06 15:33:23 -
[3] - Quote
I am not sure what you mean so I ask you to clarify your statement: Do you think that Machariel's maximum effective fighting range is now about 35 km form enemy ships in L4 missions? |
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
826
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Posted - 2014.11.06 15:42:59 -
[4] - Quote
Altair Taurus wrote:I am not sure what you mean so I ask you to clarify your statement: Do you think that Machariel's maximum effective fighting range is now about 35 km from enemy ships in L4 missions?
It depends on your definition of effective.
Not today spaghetti.
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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.11.06 15:45:23 -
[5] - Quote
Simply I do not know how close I should get to the enemy ships in Machariel. |
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
826
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Posted - 2014.11.06 15:54:58 -
[6] - Quote
Altair Taurus wrote:Simply I do not know how close I should get to enemy ships in Machariel. You know, there are sentry snipers like Dominix capable of striking enemies at more than 100 km range and on the other hand blaster Vindicator fighting at below 20 km distance. I simply do not understand where Machariel belongs...
Oh I understand what you are asking now.
For me personally anything further than 40 km is too far away and anything smaller than a battlecruiser is too close inside of 8-10 km.
Not today spaghetti.
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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.11.06 16:03:31 -
[7] - Quote
That is exactly what I wanted to know! Simply Machariel is rather close range brawler but of course he can stay away from enemies further than blaster Vindicator thanks to its auto-cannon falloff bonus. Thus I can now adjust Machariel's DPS and tracking speed in 10-40 km range interval. |
Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.11.06 22:17:04 -
[8] - Quote
BTW, are Energy Vampires now a viable option in PvE? |
elitatwo
Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team
430
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Posted - 2014.11.06 23:06:56 -
[9] - Quote
Altair Taurus wrote:BTW, are Energy Vampires now a viable option in PvE?
No
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GordonO
Brave Newbies Inc.
77
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Posted - 2014.11.07 01:28:17 -
[10] - Quote
Frigs will die round 15-20km with standard ammo, anything bigger will do the same. I can pop frigs at 60km with the fit above. 15km to 30km is where you want to keep your targets for optimal destruction.. imo anyway. I run a 100mn fit that is cap stable with the AB on so I can easily dictate range.
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Gorn Arming
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
386
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Posted - 2014.11.07 03:17:49 -
[11] - Quote
The Mach is now substantially better than any other BS for running most--maybe all--L4s. The warp speed bonus is killer, especially if you drop a warp speed rig or two on top of that.
The TE nerf is irrelevant for PvE; it just means you fit an active armor tank and TCs instead of a shield tank and TEs. Scripted TCs still give you that critical +30% falloff. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
743
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Posted - 2014.11.07 03:23:45 -
[12] - Quote
my mach setup is a little different than the one posted earlier, but I do 1k dps out to around 30km, so I prefer to keep targets inside of that. my general rule of thumb is 12km as someone said that on the forums and well, it has pretty much worked just fine for me. my fit does 1200 dps there, and using keep at range you can keep transversial low. BCs and Cruisers I tend to just shoot at while on the move as their HP is low.
Generally I kill NPC frigs first, and well generally where ever they spawn I do enough damage I will shoot them as soon as I can lock them. and of course I don't like to waste time and just not shoot, but at say 60km I don't want to waste ammo either.
I'm sure it could be more optimized, but meh. I usually tend to only fly the mach on missions with fairly short ranged targets.
I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me!
In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod
- Mara Rinn
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Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
403
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Posted - 2014.11.07 03:29:04 -
[13] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:Altair Taurus wrote:BTW, are Energy Vampires now a viable option in PvE? No
Yes!
RS utility slot as long as the RS uses drone range rigs. The single Nos can power XL shield booster to make Omni tanking effective without giving up extra mids. It's for MWD version only not the MJD version.
Outside of that it has no use in L4's. |
Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.11.07 12:23:17 -
[14] - Quote
OK, I will stay with shield tanked Machariel because my tanking skills are located mainly in shield department. Yes, Machariel can deal insane close range DPS but this needs T2 autocannons with Hail-L ammo which has deplorable falloff. So you use T1 or faction ammo instead? |
stoicfaux
5390
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Posted - 2014.11.07 13:00:37 -
[15] - Quote
Altair Taurus wrote:OK, I will stay with shield tanked Machariel because my tanking skills are located mainly in shield department. Yes, Machariel can deal insane close range DPS but this needs T2 autocannons with Hail-L ammo which has deplorable falloff. So you use T1 or faction ammo instead? T1. Mainly because it's not worth the time to make the one jump to a market hub and buy more faction ammo.
And, IIRC, because I have a spreadsheet somewhere that didn't show a lot of difference between T1 and faction ammo in terms of efficiency.
WASABI: Warp Acceleration System Ancillary Boost Injected(Gäó)
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Gefen Orion
Orion Star Ltd.
29
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Posted - 2014.11.08 09:58:31 -
[16] - Quote
Gorn Arming wrote:The Mach is now substantially better than any other BS for running most--maybe all--L4s in Minmatar space. The warp speed bonus is killer, especially if you drop a warp speed rig or two on top of that.
The TE nerf is irrelevant for PvE; it just means you fit an active armor tank and TCs instead of a shield tank and TEs. Scripted TCs still give you that critical +30% falloff.
Correct it for you.
But seriously, if you want to run L4 missions (in any space) effectively, get a marauder. EWAR immunity will save you alot of time. Fighting serpentis damps, guristas ecm, blood raiders tracking disruption and cap drain with simply a mach is, nowadays, not optimum. If you live in Minmatar space, then the Mach is still King there. Due to the fact that Angel target paint does not matter at all. |
Dato Koppla
Elite Guards
709
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Posted - 2014.11.08 13:33:00 -
[17] - Quote
Gefen Orion wrote:Gorn Arming wrote:The Mach is now substantially better than any other BS for running most--maybe all--L4s in Minmatar space. The warp speed bonus is killer, especially if you drop a warp speed rig or two on top of that.
The TE nerf is irrelevant for PvE; it just means you fit an active armor tank and TCs instead of a shield tank and TEs. Scripted TCs still give you that critical +30% falloff. Correct it for you. But seriously, if you want to run L4 missions (in any space) effectively, get a marauder. EWAR immunity will save you alot of time. Fighting serpentis damps, guristas ecm, blood raiders tracking disruption and cap drain with simply a mach is, nowadays, not optimum. If you live in Minmatar space, then the Mach is still King there. Due to the fact that Angel target paint does not matter at all.
That's why Lanngisi is so awesome, do missions for SoE which gives the best lp/isk and you'll get mostly Angel + Serpentis missions which are both not a problem for a Mach since as you mentioned painters are a joke and damps don't hurt the Mach as much since it gets in nice and close anyway. |
Gefen Orion
Orion Star Ltd.
29
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Posted - 2014.11.08 15:31:17 -
[18] - Quote
Dato Koppla wrote:Gefen Orion wrote:Gorn Arming wrote:The Mach is now substantially better than any other BS for running most--maybe all--L4s in Minmatar space. The warp speed bonus is killer, especially if you drop a warp speed rig or two on top of that.
The TE nerf is irrelevant for PvE; it just means you fit an active armor tank and TCs instead of a shield tank and TEs. Scripted TCs still give you that critical +30% falloff. Correct it for you. But seriously, if you want to run L4 missions (in any space) effectively, get a marauder. EWAR immunity will save you alot of time. Fighting serpentis damps, guristas ecm, blood raiders tracking disruption and cap drain with simply a mach is, nowadays, not optimum. If you live in Minmatar space, then the Mach is still King there. Due to the fact that Angel target paint does not matter at all. That's why Lanngisi is so awesome, do missions for SoE which gives the best lp/isk and you'll get mostly Angel + Serpentis missions which are both not a problem for a Mach since as you mentioned painters are a joke and damps don't hurt the Mach as much since it gets in nice and close anyway.
Yeah, that's a nice L4 SOE mission system. But still, I'll take the vargur over the mach any day of the week. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
469
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Posted - 2014.11.08 18:25:45 -
[19] - Quote
Vargur does better with faction ammo too due to using nearly half as much so it's more economical. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
13792
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Posted - 2014.11.09 01:09:02 -
[20] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote:Altair Taurus wrote:OK, I will stay with shield tanked Machariel because my tanking skills are located mainly in shield department. Yes, Machariel can deal insane close range DPS but this needs T2 autocannons with Hail-L ammo which has deplorable falloff. So you use T1 or faction ammo instead? T1. Mainly because it's not worth the time to make the one jump to a market hub and buy more faction ammo. And, IIRC, because I have a spreadsheet somewhere that didn't show a lot of difference between T1 and faction ammo in terms of efficiency.
Been testing that with my own mach. Honestly, the expense on faction ammo isn't worth the time you save.
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Yaro
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.10 22:50:20 -
[21] - Quote
Guys, is it worth armor tanking machariel for LVL4 ? |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
13839
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Posted - 2014.11.11 06:52:29 -
[22] - Quote
Yaro wrote:Guys, is it worth armor tanking machariel for LVL4 ?
I do.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
1863
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Posted - 2014.11.11 10:25:49 -
[23] - Quote
Altair Taurus wrote:Simply I do not know how close I should get to enemy ships in Machariel. You know, there are sentry snipers like Dominix capable of striking enemies at more than 100 km range and on the other hand blaster Vindicator fighting at below 20 km distance. I simply do not understand where Machariel belongs...
Sorry but if you cannot figure that by yourself on the fly WHILE fighting then you should not be using a machariel.
At least TRY , and FEEL the things.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
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Altair Taurus
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.11.14 21:45:41 -
[24] - Quote
Yes, Machariel is a bit tricky during combat. That's why I sold it and now I discover rail Vindicator as an anti-Gurista's equivalent of Nightmare. |
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