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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
100
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Posted - 2015.04.16 03:57:19 -
[1] - Quote
Koniforous wrote:Is it plausible that ccp is the primary entity keeping prices around 800mil?
Yes, by being bad.
Lowest Peak-concurrent-user numbers since 2007, with newborn player creation levels back to 2010, along with no increase of (new) players willing to spend real cash on the game, and ever-growing number of bittervets with 2.5 accounts average left in the game will do that for this most interesting commodity.
Elementary zupply und demand, friend.
Quote:They've said their central bank intervenes when prices increase too fast
Oooh, could you be so kind as to direct me to learning more details on this most curious facility? Thank you.
Quote:Maybe the central bank aims for a specific rate of price growth?
Entirely possible and entirely bad - Can artificially create supply and put it on the market to suppress prices, or buy out current supply to hike prices via unlimited ISK facility, subject to their data on new player creation numbers, their habits, and their interest in spending lave on a virtual currency at specific price levels/exchange rates.
You didn't hear me say that, but I'm thinking aloud.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
101
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Posted - 2015.04.16 06:32:59 -
[2] - Quote
I'm just trying to stem human interaction, that is all.
Thanks
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
102
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Posted - 2015.04.16 13:59:16 -
[3] - Quote
Ria Nieyli wrote:Four thousand PLEX is not that much, considering daily volumes though.
Speaking of volumes, it is unavailable pre-2014/07 on eve-markets. http://eve-markets.net/detail?typeid=29668#history
Fuzz works excellently for the short term charting - https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/market/marketdisplay.php?typeid=29668®ionid=10000002
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
108
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Posted - 2015.04.19 18:50:54 -
[4] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote: There is no inflation in this game. It has been said many many times with many many graphics. Eve has been deflationary for more than half a decade. Now even the Faction/DED gear is deflationary.
Really now? And the prices of Tritanium, Pyerite & other base basket minerals, which are used to calculate Eve's CPI, have been the same as they were back in 2010?
Pyerite: http://eve-markets.net/detail?typeid=35#history Mexallon: http://eve-markets.net/detail?typeid=36#history
Sold to you!
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
108
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Posted - 2015.04.19 19:24:12 -
[5] - Quote
Priest Amarr wrote: CCP doesn't lose money from high plex prices
They do, actually.
[quote]A person that buys a plex for $19.95 and sells it for 800mil won't start paying $160 if you drop plex prices to 100mil. Instead he'll think 100mil wouldn't worth his 19.95 and stop buying altogether.
A price difference of 8 times is an extreme example - yes at those exchange rates people wouldn't be interested in plex. Now, 800 vs 600 is a lot more reasonable - a 25% decrease in plex "purchasing power", but still within the threshold of providing excellent options.
Since prices topped just short of 1bn ISK, that would constitute a 40% decrease, or 1.66 plexes being needed to purchase the same basket of commodities, compared to just one back in Nov of 2014.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
109
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Posted - 2015.04.20 10:35:09 -
[6] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote: The mineral index doesn't matter one hill of beans if the total end product prices are still decreasing. It means either the build costs were reduced or the profits on manufacturing were reduced.
They are still decreasing?
So we still have tier 3 BS @ 140 mil Carriers sub 900 mln ISK Supercarriers @ 21 bn Cruisers sub 10 mil Freighters below 900 mil, most certainly. Titans at 80bn?
Decreasing he said.
Quote:CCP has released the inflation numbers and 4 of the 5 indicators are deflationary, with minerals being the only inflationary index.
Their CPI calculation is irrelevant: they take a Tengu and see a 60% decrease from the price of 1bn - whoah-hey lets put that into the index with an unknown weight attached - presto deflation!
You want to see Eve's CPI metrics, you look at Tech 1 only, which are 80% of the total ships used in New Eden.
All capital ships are Tech 1.
And do address the point of 28 trillion ISK entering & staying per month. ISK can only be "lost", or destroyed by using NPCs' products or services, everything else is just its healthy breathing through the system.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
109
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Posted - 2015.04.20 10:45:41 -
[7] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:GankYou wrote:Priest Amarr wrote: CCP doesn't lose money from high plex prices
They do, actually. No they don't. As I said above, when one of the ETC traders was interviewed they stated that the number of codes sold does not change with the price of PLEX, likely either because peopel have a set amount they want to spend or codes or the price increases attract more players buying fewer each for the same total.
Timeframe has to be taken into account, as we are experienced almost 2007 levels of player activity currently. So it is possible that the ones purchasing plex right now are the only people interested to spend any monies on this game at all.
In an expanding economy with new players taking note of plex everyday, they would lose on sales.
Quote:GankYou wrote:Since prices topped just short of 1bn ISK, that would constitute a 40% decrease, or 1.66 plexes being required to purchase the same basket of commodities, compared to just one back in Nov of 2014. Prices didn't really top just short of 1bn, at least not steadily. If you look at the PLEX graphs the price suddenly shot up rapidly just prior to the isboxer announcement. To me that was an artificial raise being pushed by someone with enough capital to get the price primed for cashing out around the time the announcement was made (which actually raises questions of who had prior knowledge of the change) as you can see here. Even without any other changes I don't think the price would have stayed there without someone holding it up as it was too sharp a rise to be the natural price increase.
"Artifical raise" "Natural price increase"
When I bought out Megacyte and Zydrine Empire-wide on March 20th that was pretty natural, and true price discovery ensued.
It is irrelevant how one views this development - market forces conspired to make it so, and the peak is for everyone to see, especially those who would be trying to retrace those levels.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
109
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Posted - 2015.04.20 11:25:27 -
[8] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote: Yeah, but when you talk about the price dropping you have to talk about a steady price, not a random peak.
Volume hasn't changed during this development. The thing you regard as "random" are actually the markings of fundamental changes, and turns in the market.
It doesn't matter how these peaks and troughs occur, because following a major change, an instrument may not see those prices again for years, even decades.
Most of the time it is characterised by panic selling, or buying.
Quote:I could go and buy out an item, quadrupling it's price n the very short term. After a week it's back to normal.
That only is possible in illiquid markets and commodities.
Quote:We wouldn't then say in a months time that the item had drastically decreased in price since a month ago, since it was never actually at that price
If the volume had stayed the same, and transactions occurred, then yes that price is indeed more than just chart noise.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
109
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Posted - 2015.04.20 13:01:50 -
[9] - Quote
A 13% rise over that time period in anticipation of significant and fundamental news is entirely healthy.
You need to account for the fact that the stockpile that had been accumulated during the movement has to be sold, in order to bank a profit. With the volume that is required to push prices of this commodity higher, one can argue that the participants only made 5-7% on average, if even that.
Still, 7% on a trillion investment is 70bn ISK.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
109
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Posted - 2015.04.20 13:12:36 -
[10] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote: As the announcement hit, the volumes then spiked as they cashed out at the inflated price.
Sell volume. Any buy orders which had not been updated in time had indeed constituted a fair share of the dump - price at that time averages around 896 mln.
As is ordained by the Almighty - some suckers need to be left holding the bag.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
109
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Posted - 2015.04.20 13:28:37 -
[11] - Quote
Never under-estimate the madness and delusions of the masses once the final ball gets rolling.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
109
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Posted - 2015.04.20 16:01:31 -
[12] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote: You assume two things rather poorly. First that most capitals are bought on the market at all and not simply built (thus not actually being counted in CPI)
That is irrelevant, as the value is being built into them from the current Trit, Pyerite, Mexallon valuations.
If they were honest, they'd calculate CPI just as they do with Mineral index, because Trit, Pyerite, Mex, Isogen, Nocx, Zyd & Mega are the irreducible necessities in our universe that one needs to merely survive & function.
Has been so, and so it remains.
Quote:CCP Takes ships and fits them with common fittings, since the price of modules has been decimated over the last years the price of the total package is still low.
Yes, they take T1-fit battleships circa 2003 @ 99mil total and compare them to T2-fit battlecruisers, and then say there is no inflation in Eve.
Prices are stable!
Quote:Also why shouldn't the drop from a 90day post release price of 1bil for a tengu that now sells for 140mil not be included?
Because that's an illiquid commodity, which also constitutes only a minuscule fraction of spaceships used.
We're talking about placing standard table wine in the same basket with a -ú12,000 bottle.
Quote:Inflation is inflation and deflation is deflation. But cherry picking one segment or a handful of ships and declaring their graphs and stats wrong is just bad form.
Yes, indeed - do not cherry pick and single out Deadspace loot, and acknowledge that they had been great inflation in the price of ship hulls.
That is the case, and following the Nullsec ore changes later this month, that is also expected and welcomed. Should probably take until the end of the Summer to properly rebalance.
Also, what of the 28 Trillion ISK per month being injected into the game?
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
111
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Posted - 2015.04.20 18:02:17 -
[13] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote:that 99mil bs you keep bringing up is worth 150mil today after 12 years then you just proved inflation a non factor.
So we went from there being no inflation in Eve, to inflation being a non-factor. Fascinating.
That example contained the Armageddon battleship, which cost 60 mil then, and 180 now - a 200% increase, or ((180/60)^(1/12) - 1) * 100 = 9.58% yearly inflation.
Quote:Unfortunately for you bs weren't 99 mil back in the day and ships in the teir 2 and 3 are actually cheaper.
Yes, they were 50-60 mil for Tier 1 like the Armageddon and 70-90mil for Tier 2 such as the Apocalypse. That is why I didn't include tiericide of either Battleships or Battlecruisers in the initial figure, as that further establishes the point.
The fully-T1 fit 99 mil example is straight from their own presentation - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ie9V2P5El0E
Again stop looking at a couple of items and look at the entire primary market together. Yes individual segments have inflated due to buffs, nerfs, game changes but the cost of staple goods and the culmination of the market is deflationary. [/quote]
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
111
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Posted - 2015.04.20 20:43:08 -
[14] - Quote
This is why I made a remark on Tier 3.
As to the whole grand purpose, I guess if one doesn't see it - there is none.
Carry on as you were.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
116
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Posted - 2015.04.21 15:21:38 -
[15] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote: Total production is around 2.5Q per year, total destruction around 0.75Q per year.
Production is not what you need to look at, if you wish to understand these inflows.
Ideally, this ISK has to be matched to resources, on a monthly basis, that are either mined or obtained otherwise through different means, such as salvaging.
I emphasise the word resources.
CONCORD here acts as a universal bank, essentially expanding credit, and when everyone gets a loan they want, we know what happens to asset prices next.
This topic will keep coming up with ever-greater intensity, as ISK accumulation grows with there being no safety measures in place, such as a Progressive tax, meaning we can end up with major disruptions even in the most liquid of commodities and resources - as can already be observed in plex.
A flat transaction/broker's fee is helpless in averting disaster.
Market McSelling Alt wrote: Did you even watch your own video?
Isn't my video, and it was posted on the topic of plex prices.
Quote:Trit might have gone up 300% since game start, but I guess you can't guess where Zyd, or Mega or the high ends sans Nox has gone?
You're telling me this?
And yet, there has been a net increase in everything Tech 1. Should I spill the beans what will happen again on April 28th?
Quote:Bet you forgot to mention how CCP deliberately changed production requirements for ships in the specific groups you are pointing out.
It doesn't matter for the end user what are the causes of the increase in price.
No one will remember these new Null ore changes six months from now, and increased cost will stay with us forever.
Quote:You cannot argue with CCP's own numbers, own stats, own graphs and then turn around and point to them for support. You didn't even watch your own video.
As much as I like the fact that they've kept this whole Colossal from collapsing catastrophically over the years, there has been great inflation in the price of minerals, and consequently all Tech 1 hulls. Mind you, certain amount of inflation is required for healthy economic growth.
If the whole of Tech 1 is a non-factor to you, then do continue doing the thing that you seem to understand best - 0.01 ISKing Deadspace loot.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
117
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Posted - 2015.04.21 18:02:50 -
[16] - Quote
ISK:plex:AUR exchange rate is about to see some changes - http://web.ccpgamescdn.com/newssystem/media/67122/1/AUR.png
Sauce: http://community.eveonline.com/news/news-channels/eve-online-news/aurum-package-changes/
The difference is 15% between direct AUR purchases and plex exchange rate.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
124
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Posted - 2015.04.22 16:12:33 -
[17] - Quote
It would seem the anticipation & deployment of the SKINs system has sparked a healthy impulsive move back to 1b ISK - http://i.imgur.com/eoJmOTj.png
Levels to watch out for: 866 mln, 897 mln and of course the prize itself.
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/ship-customization-time-to-show-some-skin/
With the SKINs system being received generally positively, with it being fully detailed and reviewed now, and previous BPC collection temporarily inaccessible on the NEX - all points the capsuleers are stocking up on plex, in order to exchange for the either personal, or entrepreneural goals in mind, on the AURUM Store come April 28th, which will see an additional 130 New Ship SKINs, together with the previous batch of around one hundred.
The Power of Two promotion also seems to be making a come back- http://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/33btmr/psa_power_of_two_seems_to_be_back_o/
Interesting, interesting times.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
165
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Posted - 2015.04.25 02:00:45 -
[18] - Quote
Curious.
There is some sort of curious formation developing in the price of PLEX... Following the fundamental change back in Nov 2014, PLEX topped short of 1bn mark, and currently the market appears to be carving out a strange right shoulder looking thingy - http://i.imgur.com/1IiUUA4.png
Outward perspective can help with things - http://i.imgur.com/GHYKQxh.png
It would be most unfortunate for everyone involved, were that to happen.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
167
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Posted - 2015.04.25 16:15:28 -
[19] - Quote
Only one assumption clouds this judgment - that the SKINs will be selling at the PLEX exchange rate.
Purchasing AURUM directly already puts the seller at an advantage by at least 15%, which is the average AUR per $ difference between these two methods. We will labour very hard indeed to undermine even the AURUM sellers, with our mountains of supply.
Current exchange rate stands at 242k vs 210k ISK per 1 AURUM.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
175
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Posted - 2015.04.26 17:34:09 -
[20] - Quote
Suur Ala wrote:Sorry to be a little off-topic, but what tool is that and how is it pulling market history from that far back? Thanks in advance!
The charting is provided by the https://element-43.com web-site using data from CREST.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
199
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Posted - 2015.04.29 04:17:27 -
[21] - Quote
The price has retraced 50% of the fall from the 952 mil top back in Nov of 2014.
There's still time and room to get your supers SKINs and sell them at 100-150% mark-up.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
200
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Posted - 2015.04.29 15:22:22 -
[22] - Quote
Thank you, captain McKie.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
202
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Posted - 2015.04.30 17:49:43 -
[23] - Quote
http://community.eveonline.com/news/news-channels/eve-online-news/10-discount-on-all-plex-sales/
Quote:We are happy to announce that over the course of the weekend, the EVE Community can enjoy a 10% discount on all PLEX sales!
Whether you're looking to pick up that sought after ship skin, activate multiple character training, or reactivate an account for yourself or a wingman, there's never been a better time to pick up a PLEX.
The right shoulder is coming along, nicely - http://i.imgur.com/GHYKQxh.png
a++ püñ Gùò_Gùò a++püñ CCP gib shorts pls
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
202
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Posted - 2015.04.30 20:01:22 -
[24] - Quote
Seven hundred mil this coming Summer, provided the expansions CCP are planning to put out are a success.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
202
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Posted - 2015.04.30 21:08:41 -
[25] - Quote
I'll take the bet at a 3:1 ratio. Average across 4 major trade hubs by August 1st.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
203
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Posted - 2015.05.01 00:41:17 -
[26] - Quote
Angelica Everstar wrote:3:1 - so I get 30 and you get 10 ?
Your 10 / 3, price averaged across 4 trade hubs as per https://element-43.com
No collateral - only the pirate's word, because I find it generates the maximum amount of drama this way.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
205
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Posted - 2015.05.01 02:17:58 -
[27] - Quote
Bagholder 170x order filled at 840 mln in Jita - We'll see where it goes from here.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
207
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Posted - 2015.05.01 09:29:09 -
[28] - Quote
Why did the date get pushed back all of a sudden?
Averages across the four major trade hubs as reported by https://element-43.com/market/29668/ is more accurate than any other method, because the website uses CREST.
No third parties - just the word, and I wouldn't want to have devalued PLEX returned to me on the termination date.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
207
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Posted - 2015.05.01 09:38:10 -
[29] - Quote
What happened to the 10 PLEX on the table? Make it 1:1 then - ten both ways.
I would only agree on data as provided by element-43.com - should you find any fault in their work, let me know as soon as possible.
Content creation - almost Page two!
Angelica Everstar wrote:GankYou wrote:Why did the date get pushed back all of a sudden? Averages across the four major trade hubs as reported by https://element-43.com/market/29668/ is more accurate than any other method, because the website uses CREST. No third parties - just the word, and I wouldn't want to have devalued PLEX returned to me on the termination date. Are you also Market McSelling ?
Yes, I like debating myself on Internet forums through alts.
Quote:Data as per client, is the source. CREST is a copy, and Element-43 is a "unknown" 3rd party "stating" it uses CREST (Likely does, but still)...
As much as I like sitting with a calculator, those CREST averages are weighted for volume to filter out the noise.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
208
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Posted - 2015.05.01 10:03:52 -
[30] - Quote
Angelica Everstar wrote:Does the avg. of PLEX go blow 750m before 1st Aug 2015?
If it does go below - You will get the 10 PLEX from me. If it does not go below - I will get the 10 PLEX from you.
Acceptable.
Quote:Data use to determine : Data from EVE market history, as seen in client. Avg. of traded PLEX of the day in Forge, Domain Heimatar, and Sinq L. weighted by traded amount.
Is not acceptable. vOv
Quote:Well - you are free to use those site to see if the PLEX has gone below (or even close), and I will likely do the same. BUT - Since the data from the client is the original source. I'm only willing to accept THOSE data, as everything else gives room for errors.
There are far larger problems at hand, when an error of 2 mil makes it or breaks it for those specified conditions.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
209
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Posted - 2015.05.01 10:12:46 -
[31] - Quote
Fuzzwork or 43-element for data. vOv
This thread could use a lively discussion again - I'd love to have the guy who's losing 1bn ISK everytime the price goes down by 5.882 mil come join us.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
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GankYou
Redshield Holding Company
288
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Posted - 2015.05.06 22:53:56 -
[32] - Quote
Koniforous, speculators, monkeys with fifty times the leverage, sphaghetti monsters - they all provide liquidity to the market. What is unhealthy, is the dropping velocity of the commodity in question, which is somewhat similar to velocity of money concept in, as could be observed in the economy beyond the Eve Gate.
...And They All Crave One Thing - ISK.
Nullsec Ore Changes - Lowend Mineral Price Tracking [2015]
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