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Elpeo Puru
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.20 23:53:36 -
[1] - Quote
Hello, I've watched many videos of this trick. But I still couldn't do it successfully.
My ship is Mammoth, after jumping and in gate cloak, I choose my next gate, align, cloak, mwd, wait for mwd to almost finish a cycle, spam the jump icon with mouse, de-cloak.
Are the steps correct? But my mammoth always doesn't have enough speed to inst warp after de-cloak, it builds up speed again slowly, until 75%
Does that mean it has not enough acceleration to get the required speed in the 10 sec mwd cycle?
Thanks in advance |
Ormand Audel
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:16:25 -
[2] - Quote
Yep. Are you using a 1mn mwd? It's always worked for me. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
754
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:17:40 -
[3] - Quote
sounds about right. although I think if you hit the jump button while still cloaked then nothing will happen. I'd decloak then hit warp. although with hotkeys and the mouse you should probably be doing both at about the same time anyways.
if you aren't at 75% speed when you decloak then it won't work. with a mamoth I think this requires a 10mn mwd and an improved cloak.
I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me!
In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod
- Mara Rinn
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Elpeo Puru
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:17:42 -
[4] - Quote
yea, 1mn mwd, but have no luck getting it works |
Elpeo Puru
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:20:03 -
[5] - Quote
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:if you aren't at 75% speed when you decloak then it won't work. with a mamoth I think this requires a 10mn mwd and an improved cloak.
Okay I'll try a 10mn. Also do skills help? like Acceleration control, evasive maneuver etc? |
Ormand Audel
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:30:04 -
[6] - Quote
Elpeo Puru wrote:yea, 1mn mwd, but have no luck getting it works Yep. That's the problem. Industrials are Cruiser (medium) sized ships, so you want a 10mn mwd. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
4353
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:40:08 -
[7] - Quote
Works with any MWD, but not a T1 cloak. If using an undersized MWD, you may have to overheat it.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1802714#post1802714 |
Ormand Audel
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:43:29 -
[8] - Quote
I've pulled it off with T1. |
Elpeo Puru
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.21 00:58:33 -
[9] - Quote
Hm... 10mn mwd need 150 power, my mammoth only has 96 now... trying in EFT but can't seem to make it to fit...
Any idea? |
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Spaceship Bebop
2150
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Posted - 2014.11.21 01:18:52 -
[10] - Quote
I used a 10 mn in my iteron back in my pre-expensive hauling toys days.... :) And used several fitting rigs and modules to fit it.
Try ancillary current router rigs and/or reactor control mods for powergird.
And you absolutely need an improved cloak.
Anything that boosts agility will help: inertia stabs, evasive maneuvers and spaceship command skills.
Overheating will help.
If there are no nasty people around, aligning, waiting a second, hitting mwd first, waiting a second, then cloaking will help - but yeah that's pointless since it's supposed to be an anti-nasties tactic!
I'll check on eft for you when i'm at my pc.
Make space glamorous!
Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
6587
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Posted - 2014.11.21 01:19:57 -
[11] - Quote
Okay, a few things...
What you need:
- a Tech 2 cloak (not the Covert-Ops one). - a 10MN Microwarpdrive
What you do:
- after jumping through a gate hold your cloak (see: don't turn on anything or move anywhere) - select your desired destination (either a gate or a station) - ALIGN to your destination - hit the cloak and MWD at the SAME time (make sure you double clicked the MWD so that it is glowing red). - wait until the MWD cycle is about to end - decloak and hit warp
How it works:
The MWD-pulse trick increases the max speed of a ship, however the agility (acceleration) of certain ships are so low that they will never reach even close to max MWD speed within one MWD cycle.
This is where the cloak comes in. In addition to providing a layer of safety so that you are not "pointed" (warp disrupted/scrambed) it reduces the max speed with the MWD to something closer to the normal speed without the MWD.
This way, when you exit cloak and the MWD cycle ends, the speed is at, or near, max warp speed for your ship.
How you can potentially screw up.
- you try to activate the MWD well after the cloak has been turned on. There is about a second or two after the cloak has been activated where you can turn on other mod... but no more. You have to be quick.
- you try to use a Tech 1 cloak or an "undersized" MWD (1MN rather than a 10MN). Both alter the speed manipulation in different ways... which can cause the trick to fail.
- your skills are not up to par. Be sure you have Spaceship Command and other ship agility skills trained up to a minimum of level 4. They too affect the speed of your ship.
- you try to warp before the cloak is down. Only Covert-Op capable ships can warp cloaked. For Industrial ships, this is the Blockade Runner.
- you get too close to something when perform the trick. The cloak will fail if you are within 2000m of anything. This include jetcans, drones, and other players. Be sure to select a route that does not have these things in the way.
Elpeo Puru wrote:Hm... 10mn mwd need 150 power, my mammoth only has 96 now... trying in EFT but can't seem to make it to fit...
Any idea?
[Mammoth, 10mn-Cloak]
[empty low slot] Power Diagnostic System II Reactor Control Unit II Reactor Control Unit II Reactor Control Unit II
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I [empty med slot] [empty med slot] [empty med slot]
Improved Cloaking Device II [empty high slot]
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?"
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Oraac Ensor
583
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Posted - 2014.11.21 01:24:11 -
[12] - Quote
Elpeo Puru wrote:Hm... 10mn mwd need 150 power, my mammoth only has 96 now... trying in EFT but can't seem to make it to fit...
Any idea? Reactor Control Units in your low slots. The 'Compact' version is the easiest to fit and you will probably need at least four. |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
2977
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Posted - 2014.11.21 01:43:50 -
[13] - Quote
you will need a 10mn MWD for a hauler. If you fly very slow haulers like deep space transports intertia stabs will be probably required to bring you up to speed in time. (skill dependent etc etc)
eve style bounties (done)
dust boarding parties
imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW
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Elpeo Puru
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.21 01:51:20 -
[14] - Quote
Thanks to all of you Still need to train some skills to fit all, but in EFT is like this:
[Mammoth, Mammoth LS] Compact Reactor Control Unit Compact Reactor Control Unit Compact Reactor Control Unit 200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I 200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
10MN Microwarpdrive I Small Shield Extender II Small Shield Extender II Small Shield Extender II
Improved Cloaking Device II [empty high slot]
Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Ancillary Current Router I
179 Power 1715 Shield 1898 Armor
Effective HP is like 6.3k, is it good enough in LS? |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
6588
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Posted - 2014.11.21 01:57:10 -
[15] - Quote
Don't fit the small shield extenders or the plates. They are practically useless because they add so little HP.
You are better served by fitting shield hardeners like Adaptive Invulnerability Fields and a Damage Control.
However, if you are caught in low-sec they will not be much good either. The most they will do is slightly dissuade suicide gankers in high-sec.
Your first and only tank is to not be caught in the first place.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?"
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Elpeo Puru
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.21 02:07:39 -
[16] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:However, if you are caught in low-sec they will not be much good either. The most they will do is slightly dissuade suicide gankers in high-sec.
How do suiciders usually attack, to kill fast enough b4 Concord attack?
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
6588
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Posted - 2014.11.21 02:30:06 -
[17] - Quote
Gankers generally have three teams.
The first team is tasked with hauling ganking ships to the setup location... usually a 0.5 or 0.6 system where CONCORD response is slowest (about 12 to 15 seconds) and with scooping up whatever loot is available from any successful ganks.
The second team (or person) is tasked with finding a suitable target. They will use cargo and ship scanners to estimate what you have in your ship and the value of it... and they will follow you for a few jumps to know where you are roughly going.
The third team is the one that perform the actual act. They usually prefer Destroyers (Catalysts and Thrashers), Vexors, and/or Attack Battlecruisers (Talos or Tornados)... all of which (including the number of people performing the act) depends on the tank and value of the gank itself.
Ganking ships in general are fit completely for damage and damage application. Cheaply too. And because CONCORD effectively ignores any tank present, suicide ships have no tank to speak of.
Example:
[Catalyst, Suicide Ganker]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer I Magnetic Field Stabilizer I Magnetic Field Stabilizer I
[empty med slot] [empty med slot]
Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S Light Neutron Blaster I, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Small Hybrid Burst Aerator I Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I [empty rig slot]
- The fit itself costs about 2 million ISK. - With high skills it can deal about ~360 -400 damage per second... that is 5,400 to 6,000 damage over 15 seconds assuming that conditions are perfect (in range, no tracking difficulties, etc).
The trick for haulers is to either... - make their tank so beefy that the value of the number of ships needed to kill it within 15 seconds exceeds the cargo value - make their cargo value so low that the value of the number of ships needed to kill it within 15 seconds exceeds it - some combination of the above two - not be in the position where they might be ganked in the first place ---- take a route that doesn't see too many ganks (can be viewed on the statistics of the world map) ---- have a scout to check one jump ahead if there is any suspicious activity ---- use a friend to web your ship so that it basically instawarps (uses the same principle as the MWD-cloak trick... apply 2x webs to manipulate max speed so that it matches the current speed... resulting in an insta-warp). ---- outsource hauling duty to someone more qualified (see: Red Frog Freighting Services)
There are other tricks that can be used too (like adding in one over every useless item in the game to confuse the cargo scanners)... but the gist of it is to be as creative as you can.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?"
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Elpeo Puru
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2014.11.21 02:48:11 -
[18] - Quote
That is very detailed information, thank you!
Aren't they losing security status in this way? And eventually drop below -5.0 and not welcome in HS? |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
6590
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Posted - 2014.11.21 02:56:22 -
[19] - Quote
People who habitually suicide gank do lose security status, yes.
Once you pass below -5.0 you become "kill on sight" to all other players in the game... anywhere, anytime, by anything. And if they suicide gank they become "criminals" for 15 minutes and cannot fly any ship in high-sec except for a pod.
NPCs will also engage as well... but there is a delay of a few seconds. This allows "outlaws" to move through high-sec in fast ships (anything smaller than a cruiser). However, the NPCs will not respond if the "outlaw" is only in a pod.
This is what the "First team" in my last post is for. They are generally law-abiding characters. They simply drop off ships at a pre-arranged spot in space the "outlaws" also have bookmarked.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?"
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McChicken Combo HalfMayo
The Happy Meal
70
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Posted - 2014.11.21 03:28:30 -
[20] - Quote
I'd ditch the Mammoth altogether. It's not worth it if you are doing Cloak-MWD maneuver because you can't spare lowslots to expand cargo capacity. Mammoth, Tayra, Itty V and Bestower are only worth using when you want to maximize cargohold at the cost of everything else and do not have skills to fly the Deep Space Transport.
Quote:[Nereus, Cloak MWD]
Improved Cloaking Device II
Large Shield Extender II Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I 3x Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Damage Control II 3x Expanded Cargohold II Beta Reactor Control: Reaction Control I
3x Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
100m3 more cargo than the Mammoth and 31,000 EHP and quicker align time.
~ Bookmarks in overview
~ Fleet improvements
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Trey Kutoi
Nyarlthotep Holdings Ltd.
34
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Posted - 2014.11.21 13:49:26 -
[21] - Quote
Ormand Audel wrote:I've pulled it off with T1.
when you do it with a T1 cloak, any instalocker will catch and kill you, as the speed reduction is too high to truely instawarp |
Mehrune Khan
Viziam Amarr Empire
14
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Posted - 2014.11.21 21:45:35 -
[22] - Quote
It's hard to make it work on a Mammoth because it doesn't have a lot of powergrid. But you can easily fit a 10mn mwd and an improved cloaking device II on a Wreathe. You will have less cargo space, but it works.
I fly a Wreathe with:
High Improved Cloaking Device II
Mid 10mn Microwarpdrive II EM Ward Amplifier II Thermic Dissipation Amplifier II Kinetic Deflection Amplifier II Explosive Deflection Amplifier II
Low Expanded Cargohold II (x5)
Rigs Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I (x3)
It aligns fast and I have a cargohold with over 11,000 m3 of space. I don't know if that would suit your needs, though. Actually I picked the Wreathe because it has the fastest base align time of all the industrials. With good navigation skills and the nozzle joint rigs it aligns almost as fast as a frigate.
Check out my idea for the Malabar mining barge
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Steppa Musana
Republic University Minmatar Republic
11
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Posted - 2014.11.23 01:31:45 -
[23] - Quote
The Wreathe is great! I'd go with that if you can fit Nomad implants as you'll warp fast enough to avoid cargo scans. |
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